English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Robusto

3:00 PM

Kind of describes @RegDwight's courting style ...

RegDwight

UMG content.

Cerberus

@Rob: True! And yet...

RegDwight

My courting style is not available in my country.

Robusto

@RegDwight — That must be very, er, hard on you.

RegDwight

Thwack!

Cerberus

3:01 PM

@Vitaly: I am using the CD-ROM too! But that isn't quite the same: the things a woman has in her purse is a special kind of not-quite-necessary things...

Have I mentioned before that it pays off to make a Facebook account to watch Youtube videos?

It works as a proxy if you post YT links on it.

Robusto

@Cerberus — Do you even know a woman? Everything in her purse is a critical necessity. "Oh no, we have to go back. I forgot my [whatever]."

2

Cerberus

@Rob: So she will have you believe.

So gullible.

RegDwight

@Cerberus Sorry, but "making a Facebook account" and "pays off" in the same sentence just doesn't make any sense.

Vitaly

@Cerberus Ah well, the phrasing could be there from the early 20th century.

Cerberus

@Reg: Just make an anonymous account?

@Vitaly: Yes it would certainly be old fashioned, if it existed.

RegDwight

3:03 PM

@Cerberus So I get anonymous spam rather than just spam?

Cerberus

Just make a fake e-mail address, make a fake FB account, and you're done.

Use LastPass to automatically log you in, and never shall you have to give it another thought.

RegDwight

Okay, so now instead of creating a useless account I have to create two.

Cerberus

Yes. But you should already possess the first one.

Vitaly

@Cerberus I mean the phrasing of the definition in the OED. They haven't reviewed it yet for the CD-ROM version, not until the year 2020, I suppose. It makes it sound as if they are talking about oh-so-necessary things. The Webster and NOALD definitions are certainly from a later period of time.

Cerberus

@Reg: You are telling me you have survived on the internets all these years without fake e-mail accounts?

RegDwight

3:06 PM

@Cerberus No. But I have never heard of LastPass.

Cerberus

@Vitaly: Yes, true. At least we are spared the inclusion of l33tsp33k!

Robusto

@Cerberus — But if you use an email account it's not fake. It actually sends and receives email. Honest.

RegDwight

Besides, after all that complicated bending over backwards, I am still not sure how it's supposed to work. Will I have to copy-paste every YT link you post? Meh.

Cerberus

@Rob: I don't believe it, all a conspiracy. They probably have people there in cubicles who pretend they are legitimate senders and fake your messages in Gmail.

@Reg: Yes, you would have to copy paste them all.

Robusto

@Cerberus — Yes. Google does seem to go to great lengths to feed into my delusional view of the Matrix.

RegDwight

3:08 PM

@Cerberus Too much trouble for even more trouble's sake. You do realize I'm lazy, right?

Cerberus

LastPasss is a password manager, an add-on to your browser, that automatically logs you into every site you desire.

RegDwight

@Cerberus Add-on to my browser? I doubt that.

Cerberus

@Reg: I am acquainted with the phenomenon from many perspectives, notably mine own.

@Reg: A collection of sticks and stones is not a browser. Get one.

Robusto

@Cerberus — Is it really that sibilant, or do you have a chipped tooth? Or an unhealthy fixation: My precioussss!

RegDwight

@Cerberus I use like ten different browsers at different times.

Cerberus

3:11 PM

@Rob: The last!

RegDwight

Now what?

Cerberus

@Reg: Install LastPass on the viable ones, log in by hand on the remaining bunch.

Which you were doing anyway.

Robusto

@RegDwight — Oh yeah, well I use over 9000 browsers at the same time! And it's your fault, handing me all teh Internetz.

Cerberus

LastPass is really safer than typing passwords yourself, as it is impervious to keyloggers.

RegDwight

@Cerberus You know, posting "UMG content" from time to time is much faster and much more fun.

Cerberus

3:12 PM

UMG?

Who's that?

RegDwight

12 mins ago, by RegDwight

UMG content.

That took me less than a minute to type. Beat that.

Cerberus

Bows to the master.

Robusto

UMG = Undesirable Media Grope.

Cerberus

Oh... how does that work? One is obliged to grope for undesirable media?

RegDwight

@Robusto There's a joke about cysts somewhere in there.

Cerberus

3:14 PM

Hey, do you pronounce the c as a k in cyst?

kiamlaluno

2

Q: "There do not appear to be any comments to delete."

In a CMS I am using, when a user with the right permission tries to delete a comment that is not found, the CMS outputs the following warning message: There do not appear to be any comments to delete, or your selected comment was deleted by another administrator. Is the sentence correct? Is...

Robusto

Where? In the Cystine Chapel?

Cerberus

Hah.

RegDwight

@Robusto The new adventures of the old Cystine?

Cerberus

I can never remember Dutch pronunciation. That confuses my English pronunciation as well.

Robusto

3:15 PM

Cyster Carrie by Theodore Dreiser?

kiamlaluno

I noticed that nobody explained why "there do not appear" is a correct phrase, and why the phrase is built in that way.

RegDwight

@Robusto Cyster Act III?

Vitaly

@Robusto For some reason, I liked that book as a kid.

Also, you are the first American whom I have heard mentioning that book.

RegDwight

ROFLMAO.

Cerberus

@Kiam: It is similar to this construction, and equally legitimate:

5

Q: Why do some people say "there have voted"? Is it grammatical, or maybe historical?

In a certain debating chamber, it is routinely stated ("content" means a yes vote): There have voted — [such-and-such]: content; [such-and-such]: not content." I'm not sure that this is grammatically correct. I think you can only have "been" or "not been" after "there have" at the st...

grammaticality

Robusto

3:17 PM

@Vitaly — Most Americans don't read at all. I mean at all — except tweets, chats and FB comments, phone texts. etc.

RegDwight

@Robusto And Dan Brown.

Cerberus

*most people

RegDwight

Dan Brown should be included in that list.

Cerberus

But what do we care about the rabble!

Robusto

I'm showing my age. I actually read books. Quite often.

kiamlaluno

3:17 PM

@Cerberus Yet, there is no explanation about that in the answers of that question. :-)

RegDwight

He even reads books recommended by Commie Traitors. That's an alarming sign!

Cerberus

Oh come on, everybody I know reads books. The average person has never read books.

@Kiam: True.

Robusto

@RegDwight — Well, I didn't call you a traitor. You are faithful to your Commie overlords. When you betray them, then we can talk treason.

Chacha102

Good Morning

@Cerberus I disagree. I am extremely average and have just read several books.

Cerberus

Morning!

Chacha102

3:21 PM

Why do I have a feeling that the 'English Language and Usage' chat room does not very often delve into the deep subject of English?

Cerberus

@Chacha: Your non-averageness has betrayed you! You can spell and punctuate!

RegDwight

@Chacha102 Because you're not here most of the time? (^_^)

Mar 11 at 17:07, by RegDwight

@CNSivakumar General discussion about English Language and Usage, plus some fooling around.

Chacha102

The notification circle and highlight is complete rubbish. I can hardly read it.

Cerberus

Let's delve into it, then, if you have inspiration. I have no objection; on the contrary!

Robusto

@Chacha102 — We have transcended the deep subject of English. You wouldn't understand unless you pore through the chat records for the past 6 months.

But do it quick.

Otherwise we'll have moved on to other topics.

Cerberus

3:23 PM

(Don't listen to him; I never read back chat either—I just bend it to my needs when I arrive.)

Chacha102

@Robusto As I created the longest running and oldest chatroom currently in existence, I would know very much firsthand that poring over the chat records is just something you don't want to do.

RegDwight

@Robusto Every time someone mentions Commie Traitors it reminds me of one excellent essay titled "What colour are your bits?" Can't find the original right now, perhaps it's been taken down. But here's a mirror: ansuz.sooke.bc.ca/lawpoli/colour/2004061001.php

Cerberus

Hah, is that true? How can you be sure yours is the oldest?

RegDwight

@Chacha102 You created the world?

Robusto

@Chacha102 — I'll grant you your claim, but remind you that you don't know me. Or @RegDwight, who pores through chat records as if they were the words of Lenin.

Chacha102

3:24 PM

@Cerberus It is ID #89 on Chat.Meta. There are currently 2 chat rooms that have lower ids, but neither of them are active.

chat.meta.stackoverflow.com/rooms/89/the-tavern-general

RegDwight

@Robusto The whole point of my poring through the records is so you don't have to. Be grateful, old man!

Robusto

@RegDwight — But you're the one who brought up the Commie Traitors. Now I see why.

Cerberus

@Cha: An astounding feat!

RegDwight

@Chacha102 Okay, but how often does that one delve into the deep subject of English?

Cerberus

Nevertheless, I have heard that there are chatrooms outside SE... don't hold me to it.

Robusto

3:26 PM

@RegDwight — I am grateful. I'm too old to waste my time on things that don't involve sex, drugs, or rock 'n' roll.

RegDwight

@Robusto Absolutely. I usually leave out the Mutant part. It confuses people for some reason.

Chacha102

I would like to note that it has far more starred messages than this chatroom...

Cerberus

@Cha: In any case, if you should think of an English topic to discuss, feel free to introduce it!

RegDwight

@Chacha102 There's a special room for that.

Are you Nyuszikas alter ego?

Cerberus

Haha!

Chacha102

3:27 PM

tylercarter.org

Cerberus

I want a language topic! Now!

2

I am not accustomed to waiting.

RegDwight

Mar 3 at 15:11, by RegDwight

Actually, I think we should set up a "Flag Room". Where anyone who comes in should flag everybody else.

Chacha102

@Cerberus How about 'The Overuse of the Exclamation Point'.

Robusto

I don't waste my time with something as simple as an id. I go straight for libidio.

Cerberus

@Cha: That is an oxymoron, or a contradiction in terms, if you will!

RegDwight

3:29 PM

Feb 8 at 17:38, by JSBangs

don't worry, soon we'll get back to talking about agglutination again

Cerberus

Yay!

Robusto

@RegDwight — I think you misspelled that word, adding an "L" to it.

Cerberus

Agglutinate me!

Robusto

@Cerberus — Sorry, I don't swing that way.

RegDwight

@Robusto Hahaha.

Cerberus

3:29 PM

Fine, I'll stop.

RegDwight

@Robusto You mean a smoking room?

Cerberus

I have a topic for you: what is the difference between the following sentences:

How could you kill her!

How could you kill her?

Robusto

Yes. Smoking as in hawt! to certain persuasions.

Cerberus

How wonderful that you killed her!

How wonderful that you killed her?

RegDwight

Okay, then let me reword it.

"Actually, I think we should set up a "Fag Room". Where anyone who comes in must become a heavy smoker."

Cerberus

3:31 PM

And, more importantly, which punctuation marks are permissible, and which recommended?

Robusto

@Cerberus — The first is an exclamation of surprise, disgust, or disbelief. The second is a request for practical advice.

RegDwight

Too bad Nyuzsika ain't no longer around anymore.

Cerberus

@Rob: I am not sure.

Robusto

@RegDwight — A native speaker would say "Too bad Nyuzsika ain't around no more."

Cerberus

@Rob: Some style books, notably Fowler, recommend the question mark with "how could you kill her?" in any case.

RegDwight

3:32 PM

@Robusto Obviously, I was overdoing it on purpose.

@Cerberus We had a similar discussion a while back.

Mar 10 at 15:20, by Robusto

Hey, @Kosmonaut: Question for you, which, if you don't have a ready answer for, I may ask as a general question on the site proper:
Question tags: Do they always require a question mark? I see them both ways quite a bit, by competent writers whose prose I respect. In speech, question tags that are simply extensions of a declarative statement seem not to require a question mark. Others that really do ask for clarification, seem to require one.

Cerberus

Interesting.

Robusto

@Cerberus — I care what Fowler says about as much as I care what Bulwer-Lytton says.

Cerberus

I'd say the question mark should be the ideal, to be deviated from at whim?

RegDwight

I only care about what Lenin says. In his mausoleum, to himself.

Cerberus

In my second example, however, I'd say a question mark would be anathema: "how wonderful that you killed her?".

I think there is a true syntactic difference between interrogative ponouns used to introduce questions on the one hand and exclamations on the other.

Robusto

3:36 PM

@Cerberus — All this talk of killing women is skeeving me out. I wasn't trying to provoke you when I mentioned women and their necessaries, you know.

@Cerberus What the f*ck are you talking about!

Cerberus

@Rob: Killing women leaves me cold. Why should I be interested in that!

Robusto

@Cerberus — I don't know. You keep bringing it up.

Cerberus

I was talking about the pronoun "how".

How magnificent her earlobes are!

Do you agree that a question mark would be absurd?

Robusto

@Cerberus — In that case, of course.

Cerberus

That is what I'd like to call exclamatory "how".

Just as in, "what injustice they have visited upon me!".

Robusto

3:39 PM

If you're asking a question in a normal tone of voice, use a question mark. If you're asking it at the top of your voice, use an exclamation point.

Cerberus

But consider this: "what injustice have they not visited upon me?".

Both sentences mean exactly the same; and yet I think the question mark is possible in the second, but not in the first.

Robusto

Excuse me, I'm going to go have fun now.

TTYL.

Cerberus

Aww. Sorry for scaring you off.

Bye!

RegDwight

Whoa, JohnFx is back.

JohnFx, US

1.4k 5 19

grammar vocabulary usage punctuation word-choice fun grammaticality

Cerberus

Who's he?

RegDwight

3:41 PM

@Robusto CU.

Chacha102

Chacha102, San Diego, California

17.1k 3 20 45

php mysql javascript arrays oop html jquery

Cerberus

What is all this linking to people?

RegDwight

Feb 2 at 18:26, by RegDwight

@nohat: interesting how JohnFX has gone the way of Ex-user. Oh well. I didn't want that, but it's his decision.

Chacha102

@Cerberus I like looking at myself.

RegDwight

@Cerberus Read his comment here:

english.stackexchange.com/questions/11065/…

Cerberus

3:44 PM

sigh The old pre-de feud.

RegDwight

It never gets old.

But glad to see that even he is so hooked, he can't resist.

Cerberus

It is so silly how both pres and des keep talking in their own language even when they know the other party won't be sensitive to it.

If I hadn't been doing my best to bite my tong all the time, I'd have been gone long ago as well.

RegDwight

Well, sometimes you only know the other party won't be sensitive after the fact.

There are lots of people who can be convinced.

Cerberus

As soon as you hear either pre or de lingo, that is pretty much a clue that you should adopt their lingo, whatever it is, or you're never going to convince them.

RegDwight

Well, that is all diplomacy is about. Or customer support.

Cerberus

3:48 PM

True.

RegDwight

If people insist on talking about lines and boxes instead of edges and nodes, you have to adapt.

Vitaly

Was the majority of des pres at some point earlier?

In other words, is pre the default state?

Cerberus

If you want to disprove some religious tenet, it won't work if you just say, "that is nonsense, look at science", if they will not acknowledge this particular scientific theory; your only option is trying to prove the internal inconsistency in their array of beliefs resulting from this tenet, if such exists.

RegDwight

@Vitaly You mean, worldwide?

Cerberus

@Reg: Exactly!

Vitaly

3:50 PM

Yeah @Reg

RegDwight

@Vitaly I have no idea. Depends on culture, methinks.

Cerberus

@Vit: I am not sure; de has become pretty much dominant in PC society these days.

Vitaly

PC Society? @Cerberus

RegDwight

I mean, we all have been taught the one-and-only correct version of our mother tongues in school. But that is not true of every society out there.

Cerberus

Politically correct.

Vitaly

3:51 PM

Oh, ok.

Cerberus

@Reg: That is true.

I just think it is so terribly silly that people cannot see the merits of both de and pre.

Vitaly

@Reg: that is true of the Russian schooling system, since Russian is a centrally-governed language, pretty much like in German

On the other hand, English is definitely not a language that has some system of centralized approval

RegDwight

@Cerberus Well, that might be an overgeneralization. The line is blurry.

Cerberus

@Reg: The line between de and pre?

@Vit: Don't underestimate education in England and America: pre-schoolers are still taught pretty pre rules, I think.

RegDwight

@Cerberus Yes. Not everyone is a strict de or a strict pre. Arguably, no one is. People just aren't like that.

Chacha102

3:54 PM

Ah, this is the type of English language discussion I was looking for! I really needed something to get me into nap mode. :P

Vitaly

@Cerberus: pre-schoolers? :D Way to humiliate the pres, man!

Cerberus

@Reg: Absolutely true! And yet they often attack whichever side they think are not on with merciless zeal.

@Cha: You're welcome.

RegDwight

@Vitaly The funny thing is, people keep looking for just that, centralized approval. We often get questions along the lines of "this is what I've been doing my entire life, and everyone I know, but is it actually correct?" Which brings us back to your question, actually.

Cerberus

@Vit: Eh... no idea why I said that. I basically meant any child that learns to speak up to high school.

@Reg: But instead of answering "grammar is not a Ding an sich and you are prejudiced", why not interpret his question as "what would be expected of me by my peers?", which I think is basically what such question-askers are after?

RegDwight

@Cerberus But that is precisely the approach our best answers try to take.

Kosmonaut has put it best, a number of times, actually, but I'm not sure I can find it...

Cerberus

3:59 PM

@Reg: True. And yet, in those answers, I often sense great reluctance. The need to humiliate perceived naïve prescriptivism often pops up in otherwise fine answers.

RegDwight

Oh. Honestly? That would be bad. But that's not the general impression I have. I submit that our site is rather civilized.

Cerberus

Perhaps I am more sensitive to it. I see language both as an object to be described and and object d'art to be improved, which is anathema to descriptivists.

@Reg: It is very civilised, absolutely. But not perfectly so.

RegDwight

Well, art is art. But most of our questions are not about writing the next Odyssey.

Vitaly

Oh, hey. Does the native language of a person also play a role in their partiality for the descriptivist or prescriptivist approach, other than the existence of centralized approval for the language in question? I am asking that because I am still more pre than de for Russian; and when I have introduced myself to the de approach in English, it took me no longer than a couple minutes to become an English de.

RegDwight

@Vitaly Haha, that is so true of myself as well.

I am certainly more of a pre in my mother tongues.

Cerberus

4:02 PM

Saying "this expression is more aesthetically pleasing than that, and therefore I recommend it" is the kind of prescriptivist answer I was thinking of.

I am both in all languages.

RegDwight

@Cerberus I catch your drift, but that is highly subjective, innit? Not everyone likes Picasso, you know?

@Cerberus Yes, what I'm saying is that I am certainly more pre in my mother languages than in others. Vitaly might have a point there.

Cerberus

@Reg: True; but I believe it is an illusion to think that the kind of questions we get here should be objective, at least that kind of questions.

Well I think I should stop my ranting.

RegDwight

I am gradually becoming more de in Russian. But only very slowly.

Cerberus

I still think this website is excellent; that was my only complaint.

Really, becoming more de in the long run?

RegDwight

Which is not to say that I stop appreciating Chekhov or Bulgakov.

Cerberus

4:06 PM

I find that I undulate back and forth.

Vitaly

@RegDwight Word.

RegDwight

@Cerberus Hm. Or that.

Cerberus

Are Chekhov and B. purists?

RegDwight

I dunno. Takes time to find out, I guess.

Cerberus

I hate that I am forced to read Russian in translation.

RegDwight

4:07 PM

@Cerberus Just two examples of great writers, off the top of my head.

Nothing more, nothing less.

Cerberus

Oh.

You know, it is so strange that I find many Russian writers incredibly entertaining and interesting, while most of Dutch literature leaves me cold.

Dostoevsky (you may punch me for my spelling) is my hero.

RegDwight

I suppose I could have said that I don't stop appreciating Shakespeare in favor of Dan Brown. But I couldn't think of a Russian equivalent of Dan Brown, though there must be hundreds.

Cerberus

Hmm...

You just don't read them.

Fun fact: I love SF and Fantasy, and yet I have never read Harry Potter or Brown.

Vitaly

I suppose I could have said that I don't stop appreciating Chaucer in favor of Shakespeare.

Cerberus

And not even out of spite.

RegDwight

4:10 PM

I tried reading Harry Potter, the fourth book I think, I couldn't get past the first 50 pages, so boring and pointless it was.

Cerberus

Haha, really?

Vitaly

Have you tried reading Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality? @Reg

Cerberus

I sometimes wonder what great writers of the 20th century our offspring of the 22th century will remember.

RegDwight

@Vitaly What the heck is that?))

Vitaly

@Reg: This, by Eliezer наш Yudkowsky.

RegDwight

4:12 PM

@Vitaly TL;DR.

:P

Which reminds me: I should go read that LL post, Jeez.

Cerberus

Which one?

RegDwight

The one you linked to?

languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=2623

Cerberus

Oh! Haha. I never said it was that interesting.

Hey, a question:

RegDwight

I never said I was going to read it because it would be interesting.

Vitaly

Is there any Englsh equivalent for the “наш” as I have just used it, by the way?

Cerberus

4:14 PM

ш : how is it pronounced?

RegDwight

sh.

Cerberus

Ah, then I was right.

You know, a friend and I found an old postcard from when we were in highs school, sent from Petersburg;

RegDwight

Voiceless retroflex fricative

The voiceless retroflex fricative is a type of consonantal sound, used in some spoken languages. The symbol in the International Phonetic Alphabet that represents this sound is . Like all the retroflex consonants, the IPA symbol is formed by adding a rightward pointing hook extending from the bottom of the symbol used for the equivalent alveolar consonant, in this case the voiceless alveolar fricative which has the symbol s. The IPA symbol is thus a lowercase letter s with a rightward tail protruding from the lower left of the letter. Compare s and . Although a distinction can be made betw...

Cerberus

We had no idea who sent it, and it was signed in Cyrillic, but when I tried to pronounce it, it didn't make sense. It had to be some Dutch friend of ours who was on holiday there at the time; but who? Then it turns out the ш stood for th or t (phonetically) in her name, Myrthe.

RegDwight

@Vitaly Yeah, right.

Cerberus

4:16 PM

Whereas I thought it was more like sh, as you said.

Glad to know I was right (duh!).

And thank you both for the aesthetically pleasing jinx!

RegDwight

It wasn't a jinx. I posted a wrong link at first.

Cerberus

Oh?

Well it appears you defeated Vitaly anyway.

RegDwight

"The sound in Russian denoted by <ш> is commonly transcribed as a postalveolar fricative but is actually a laminal retroflex fricative."

Cerberus

Laminal... what the hell is that?

RegDwight

Laminal consonant

A laminal consonant is a phone produced by obstructing the air passage with the blade of the tongue, which is the flat top front surface just behind the tip of the tongue on the top. This contrasts with apical consonants, which are produced by creating an obstruction with the tongue apex (tongue tip) only. This distinction applies only to coronal consonants, which use the front of the tongue. Laminal vs. apical is not a very common contrast within a language. Where such a contrast occurs, it is typically phonemic with fricatives and affricates rather than stops, although some native lan...

Flat.

Cerberus

4:19 PM

Ah!

Interesting.

Can a consonant be both retroflex and laminate? You bend your tongue backwards and push its flat underside against your alveolus, if that's even a word?

Besides, I find that retroflex and apical sounds similar? Oh how complicated this stuff is.

Poor Kosmy, having to deal with all this.

RegDwight

The key is where the obstruction happens. Whether it's the tip of the tongue (apical?) or not.

Ah yes, apical.

Yeah, it might help to have @Kosmonaut on board.

Vitaly

Nature has so much current news (as opposed to Science) that it feels like a tabloid.

Cerberus

@Reg: But how can you flex your tongue backwards without having its tip be the part that touches the alveolus?

RegDwight

Ha, my very own snippet actually explains it. D'oh. I should read my own stuff.

Cerberus

Yes it did!

RegDwight

4:24 PM

@Cerberus I'm talking about myself.

Cerberus

?

RegDwight

I'm not reading my own stuff, I say.

Cerberus

I got that!

I said, "yes, it did actually explain it!".

RegDwight

That snippet from Wikipedia talks about apical, and then I try to remember that very word.

Cerberus

I know!

Hah.

RegDwight

4:26 PM

@Cerberus Oh God. I misread "it" as "I".

Cerberus

Hah I see.

I suspected as much...

RegDwight

Keine Getränke mehr für diesen Mann.

Cerberus

Ach so, du hast dich wieder betrunken...

Kann man das eigentlich so sagen, sich betrinken?

RegDwight

Sure.

Reflexive.

You can't betrinken anyone except yourself.

Cerberus

Ausgezeichnet.

Ich dachte, es hätte vielleicht gar keinen(?) Objekt.

RegDwight

4:29 PM

But you can abfüllen other people.

Cerberus

Das Wort kennt mein Wörterbuch leider gar nicht!

RegDwight

@Cerberus Das Objekt. Thus, kein.

Cerberus

Ach, es ist sachlich.

RegDwight

@Cerberus Fill up. Or bottle.

Cerberus

Danke.

You know, what I find most difficult in learning English and German is using constructions that are the same in Dutch.

Whenever they are the same, I always think, "wait, this is Dutch, it can't be right", as with Objekt, which is also neuter in Dutch.

RegDwight

4:33 PM

Heh. Then just skip such nouns. Learn only the interesting ones.

Cerberus

And that is even a 1:3 choice.

Hah.

RegDwight

Jan 29 at 19:42, by RegDwight

Otherwise you quickly enter a world of pain. Book is feminine in Russian, neuter in German, masculine in French, and God knows what in English.

See? Much easier to learn!

Cerberus

Hehe.

RegDwight

No confusion possible.

BTW, I have to leave in a moment, though probably not for long.

Have to call my wife.

Say hi to her!

4:34 PM

Haha nice.

I also like "beige alert".

RegDwight

Yes.

Anyhow, I'm out, I suppose.

Cerberus

Later!

RegDwight

You'll have to wake up Vitaly.

Cerberus

Nah I'll let him slumber; I'm off for a run as well.

Vitaly

4:37 PM

Bye @RegDwight

Robusto

6:16 PM

Dupe.

0

Q: Examples of "ATM Machine" silly repeats?

Swedes often say CD Skiva as in Compact disk disk. In English you sometimes say ATM machine as in Automated teller machine machine. What are other examples of such redundant endings exist, and what would you call them?

redundancy

That one's been repeated about 3 times if I recall.

RegDwight

4

Q: Why do Americans say "tuna fish"?

I mean, it's not like there is a tuna vegetable or animal that it can be confused with.

american-english

2

Q: PIN Number - why we say it?

We often say "PIN Number", this is part of everyday conversation. But why? PIN stands for Personal Identification Number, so what we're actually saying is Personal Identification Number Number. Is there a reason for this?

acronyms redundancy

1

Q: How to avoid repeating word contained in an acronym?

I was recently answering a question on Super User about RAID. In this context RAID means redundant array of independent (or inexpensive) disks. I wanted to point out to fellow user that he should make sure that computer is set to boot from the array. I used syntagma "RAID set" but I'm not sure i...

acronyms redundancy

Robusto

I linked one in my close vote.

How do these never get closed? We get one a month.

psmears

@Robusto It's only fitting that such a question should be duplicated more than once

Robusto

Redundant Redundancy Question?

psmears

Exactly.

Robusto

6:28 PM

Redundant Repetitive Asked-Again Question.

psmears

Better still!

RegDwight

6:41 PM

Argh, stoopid updates, had to reboot.

Anyhows.

The "what you call them" part is a dupe.

But the list request part is new, innit?

I mean, it could be CWed to have something like this:

82

Q: What words are commonly mispronounced by literate people who read them before they heard them?

Quite a few words are mispronounced by under-educated people, or people learning English as a second language. Some words are often mispronounced by quite educated people who read, and began reading high-level literature before they heard the vocabulary spoken. This can lead to a vocabulary diss...

pronunciation vocabulary literature list-request

RegDwight

6:55 PM

And now for something completely different:

0

Q: What is the difference between Been and Being ?

Hi, What is the difference between Been and Being ? Thanks, Deepu

tense

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English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…