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7:00 AM
Psst, pavel
 
ye
 
RProgN2 is now TC
 
cool!
Still doesn't have a doc tho
 
ZSS is implicit, the compiler was mostly written whilst sober, lots of improvements
I write code not novels
 
Glad to hear it's better than RProgN 1 now.
 
7:02 AM
Stilll needs most of the functions added, but hey, TC is TC
 
Ah
Why'd you feel the need to start over, and not just upgrade RProgN 1?
 
I didn't want to write it in Lua
Lua is great for rapid prototyping, but it's not stable
 
Ooh, Java.
 
Yea
 
The one language I can actually do useful things in!
 
7:05 AM
trying to figure out how muddyfishes koth importing thing works
 
The tio and binary are currently out of date because I needed to panic compile, but I'll fix that at a computer
 
Are all the sub-directories in /src/actually part of RProgN or were they created by your IDE?
If it's the former, I suddenly am no longer worried that the code for Sushi is too OOP-oriented.
 
It's an actual part of it
I like OOP
Nothing wrong with individual classes for each function
 
There is tho, isn't there?
Why would you do that?
That's terrible.
 
I like it :(
 
7:11 AM
I don't know why I find this so amusing
 
You shouldn't need that many packages for a relatively simple esolang >_>
 
Need and want are two completely different things
💩
 
@Pavel at one point, I seriously considered an esolang that depends on every Perl package ever written (in order to give it a large standard library)
 
They're their own classes because I couldn't think of a method to otherwise store a unique function in Java
 
7:15 AM
Have a single class, with all of the necessary methods, and a single method called invoke with a switch/case statement inside. That, or lambda expressions.
 
Nooooo
I'm not adding a switch/case for an odd 200 functions, think of the scalability!
And java lambdas are stupid, it's a fact
 
Oh right, enums.
Forgot about those.
@ATaco They are not.
 
I'm contempt with my class system.
 
How does the parser determine which function to assign to a token?
 
See: Functions.class
 
7:21 AM
What's custom_asoc?
(What package is it in, I can't find it)
 
Functions.class
It gets values from CallableAsoc
 
I admit I can't find where it's mapping functions to tokens, it's nested to deep in all these classes >_>
I can't find a new anywhere.
 
Functions.setDefaults
 
Wait, is that all the functions currently implemented?
 
The big Ol' first function in Functions.java
Yeah, framework first
 
7:27 AM
Ok, I saw it but was confused because I expected there to be more.
 
I was bragging about it being TC, not more featureful than v1
But new functions are easy to add, make a new callable, add a setDefault.
 
So how is this better than a switch/case?
 
Well, a switch case didn't feeeeeel right
 
ಠ_ಠ
 
Maybe if I wanted a consistent function set, but the code can asoc over functions, so it just fit better
Besides, OOP
 
7:32 AM
Come to think of it, you probably could have extended Method.
 
Acting as a class also lets me treat arbitrary things as a callable.
Because Callable is an interface
And screw naming conventions
 
You can treat arbitrary things as a Method. You just extend Method.
Actually, the more I think about it, the more I see problems with extending method, least of all making your code unreadable. Which TBH would mostly be a lateral move.
O wait it's final. nvm
 
Yeah, gonna stick with the interface.
 
What's describe() for?
 
Currently, nothing.
But it's been acting as a sort of documentation.
 
If it just had call, you could use lambdas.
And stick doc comments in.
 
Nah
 
But... lambdas... they're great...
 
They aren't, I'm sorry.
 
^ I must agree
I hate it when Java starts looking like JS
 
7:41 AM
Java 9 has a section on ECMAScript 6 compliance.
I'm afraid you've lost that battle.
Still, lambdas are better than defining a class for every single function in your language.
 
Wait, are lambdas even in Java 7?
 
Why are you using Java 7 ;-;
And no.
 
I like keeping backwards compatibility
I can't install JDK 8 on my work rig, but I've got it running on my laptop and home rig.
Makes for interesting code
 
Wait, why does your work rig have JDK 7 on it >_>
 
Not my job to know.
Besides, It works?
I just conveniently have a perfect excuse to not use lambdas
 
7:46 AM
...yes
 
RProgN had lambdas though.
 
The irony.
 
In fact, all functions are anonymous until asoc'd.
Do as I say not as I do
 
Java 7 added almost nothing as far as new features go, now that I think about it.
 
wat
8:45 AM
what about java 9
 
8:56 AM
isnt that wip
 
wat
hi can someone link me to sandbox
 

Sandbox

Where you can play with chat features (except flagging) and ch...
here
 
Have 16666 rep. I need more 6's though
 
9:13 AM
Get an unupvoted question, and ta-da, 16661 rep
 
I had that for a while but got an unaccept and an answer upvote
 
Wait isn't unaccept -2 rep
 
@betseg no, unaccept is -15
as accept is +15
 
Ah true its 2 rep for the asker
 
Yay I modded my Monokai highlighter to work better with Clojure :)
 
Ven
10:00 AM
Aw, Pyth doesn't have a divisible by operator :(
 
@Ven do !%
 
Ven
@muddyfish means I can't use a pfn :/
 
@muddyfish You make Pyke with quartata, right?
 
10:32 AM
I'm curious
If I accept my answer, do I get 17 reps?
 
Ven
no
 
ok then
 
I'm just wondering, in what encoding are we supposed to count bytes?
 
In an encoding your interpreter understands.
 
Fair enough
Thanks!
 
10:42 AM
Do we need a cat tag
 
Ven
have this one.
 
11:07 AM
@Dennis yeah the colors on that graph were horrible. I didn't make them. It was just a snippet from the webpage
 
I have an angina :(
Anyway hi
 
@TuxCopter owch
ANd hi!
 
Wait no I have a pharyngitis (It's called "angine" in French ._.)
 
1
Q: Hack into a Lottery

ConnorLSWYou've recently made an account on a dodgy gambling site, where for a fee of 25 dollars, they will pay you back a random amount between 0 and 50 dollars. After getting around 5 dollars twice, you decide to prove the site is a scam. After accessing their external firewall with the default password...

 
11:26 AM
@TuxCopter that is a lot better
but still bad
 
Wait, in BF you only need < and not >
Cuz even with infinity memory you can still go back go zero
 
Infinity - 1 = Infinity
 
Leo
@wat I just outgolfed Martin back ;)
 
@TuxCopter Infinity - Infinity = 0
So with infinity < you can do it
Idk why you would
But you could
With > tho you have to scroll for ever
 
11:37 AM
@ChristopherPeart Nah, Infinity - Infinity = f*ck this piece of shit
 
Infinity + Infinity = Infinity
 
No, Infinity - Infinity = NaN
 
You dont know what the actual value infinity is, hence the answer is infinity
 
> Infinity - Infinity
NaN
 
@TuxCopter The world is not JS
 
11:39 AM
irb(main):005:0> Float::INFINITY - Float::INFINITY
=> NaN
Ruby confirms too
 
>>> float('inf') - float('inf')
nan
Python confirms it too.
 
Ven
11:57 AM
@KritixiLithos yeah but math does say Infinity - Infinity = impossible :)
(however it's true Infinity + Infinity = Infinity)
 
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

ConnorLSWStarry Starry Night This challenge needs a lot of work in my opinion, especially refining rules on input-output, I want to leave it as open as possible, while excluding unfair methods such as pre-drawn graphs etc. some parts of this are currently extremely vague, please ask any questions you be...

 
OK, since we're getting more on the maths side, infinity isn't a number, but a mathematical concept.
 
12:27 PM
Infinity - Infinity = fck this piece of sht, noone ever defined infinity - infinity
 
Anyone here bored enough to willingly manipulate patterns of symbols?
 
Huh?
 
Depends your infinities.
 
huh
idk what you mean
wait
 
12:33 PM
@MatthewRoh It's a challenge, try and write it with less quantifiers/operators ;)
 
12:51 PM
That reminded me of principia mathematica
CEHBAEFC(Chat Extremely Hard But Also Equally Fun Challenge): Pong Clock
 
1:03 PM
Literature SE has the short name (the text in the favicon) of "LIT" :O
 
Chat mini challenge, simplify this logical expression: a ∧ a
 
Is that the logical expression in principia mathematica
 
bonus round ¬(a ∧ a) it's an emoticon
 
lmao
 
@PhiNotPi a
 
1:14 PM
10/10. Also I just want to clarify in case people missed the context, which was LegionMammal's chat challenge.
 
@EriktheOutgolfer your name looks like Erik the PPCG favicon. legitmately.
@PhiNotPi and that one is ~a?
 
yes
 
@MatthewRoh The PPCG favicon shows my (apparent) dedication to the site. My name is Erik the|Outgolfer, cut at | because it doesn't fit.
 
I know lel
 
Isn't the caret supposed to mean exponentiation?
Oh wait, it's logical, so it means XOR or something
 
1:24 PM
Its the thing from principia mathematica
 
I didn't read the book
 
Huh, the when I was younger I was some older kid with a similar proof showing 1+1=2
 
when I was younger I was some older kid with a proof showing 1+1 is not 2 lmao
 
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Martin EnderAssociativity Conversion code-golfsyntaxbalanced-string Operators that aren't associative usually come with some implicit associativity which let you omit parentheses in some expressions for readability. E.g. for a left-associative operator $, the following parentheses are assumed: a $ b $ c $...

 
1:31 PM
Why is there only one person with research assistant in PPCG
 
Anonymous
@MatthewRoh Because we don't really have a lot of new tags being introduced regularly.
 
okay then :\
 
1:59 PM
Is there a way to figure out which tags I have created?
 
2:37 PM
@TuxCopter So if I go to France and get sore throat, people will think I have heart attack if I use google Translate ._.
@PhiNotPi no but you can see which of your questions are the only question tagged with a certain tag
 
found an example: although it was more of a group effort
 
@KritixiLithos That was my whole point with the long expression; I've been challenging myself to actually define real numbers in terms of sets. The long expression itself is simply the integer 0 defined as a set. The actual values in the set are {{{{}}}, {{{{}}}}, {{{{}, {{}}}}}, {{{{}, {{}}, {{}, {{}}}}}}, ...}
 
Which expression?
 
The one in my CkC
So yeah. 0 as a natural number is {}, 0 as an integer is that thing, 0 as a rational number is more complicated and requires weird field theory, and 0 as a real number is even more complicated
 
@Qwerp-Derp No. You're thinking of Pytek.
@wat if it helps at all, mine just logs in to the regular login page with Mechanize and retrieves the fkey. Should work with the Google login thing if you just tell it to press that button first
 
2:44 PM
Luckily, 0 C is just {{0 R}}
 
Also you don't necessrily need websockets but it's much better wth them
 
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Erik the OutgolferStart from ones(dupe?) code-golfarithmeticany tag for formatted output? Given a number N, start by printing N space-separated ones in a row, then continue as the below examples do. Example: 1 1 Example: 4 1 1 1 1 2 2 4 Example: 13 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 2 2 2 2 1 4 4 4 1 8 5 13 ...

 
3:15 PM
@Qwerp-Derp no, I did it by myself. If more people designed it then more than just me would use it :D
 
Just had an idea: To prevent myself from getting golfed before I reach a challenge, I should come up with the answers while the challenges are still in the Sandbox
 
don't be surprised if the slightest change sends your answer - and the hours spent golfing it - down the drain.
 
3:33 PM
Pretty sure this is an interesting read for those who can follow it... arxiv.org/pdf/1605.05274.pdf
 
Hmm, wasn't it recently discovered that Java's type system is actually unsound (i.e. becomes internally inconsistent, given sufficiently insane code)? That might negate that result, because it likely relies on soundness of the type system (not sure, though)
 
Yeah, you can cause a List<Integer> to contain various kinds of stuff that aren't integers, and it only throws a fun runtime exception when you try to pull them out.
 
dennis is only 1649 rep behind martin
the end times are almost here
 
\o/
 
3:48 PM
> the end times are here
> \o/
you should probably go get checked out
 
Why?
 
for having glee in the face of oncoming doom
 
Seems logical to me.
 
yeah but you're the psychotic pichu you don't count
 
doom of whom?
 
3:52 PM
everybody
 
Well, no.
 
It's a massive waste of time to wallow in self-pity in the last days of the Earth.
 
God wouldn't let everyone die. He'll stop at 99.9%.
And I'm hoping to end up in the top 0.1%
 
Yeah you can do a lot of insane things with generics
You really need to try to break things, though
 
"move fast and break things - but don't upload them to production"
 
3:58 PM
Java's generics are really weak too
 
4
Q: Smallest multiplier that reveals a factor of a semiprime

ArnauldYou're given a semiprime N. Your task is to find the smallest positive integer m such that the binary representation of one of the two factors of N can be found in the binary representation of N * m. Example Let's consider the semiprime N = 9799. We try different values of m, starting at 1: ...

 
"and probably encouraged" - I'm sorry. We don't care about the speed of our code. — Jan Dvorak 1 min ago
 
@MartinEnder As it turns out, U+00B7 (MIDDLE DOT, \[CenterDot], ·) is the only undefined infix operator in Mathematica that uses 2 bytes in UTF-8
I wrote a program to scan through all the character reference pages
 
there's also ±
the difference being that · is n-ary with n>=2, whereas ± is unary/binary
 
4:13 PM
@MartinEnder, should a mod flag be put up to delete a Sandbox post if it is a duplicate of a posted question and the Sandbox poster recognizes that?
 
yeah that's fine
 
Also, on what timescale is the "flags left" counter reset?
 
Once per day
 
Grararrghh. Jelly is hard
 
That probably means it's past its expiration date and you shouldn't put it on your sandwich.
 
4:21 PM
@Dennis AdmBorkBork said jelly has gone bad
If I want to raise a number to the 56th power in jelly what is the shortest way to do that without using the number 6?
make that without '1','2','4','6' or '8'
cuz I have no idea
 
x**7**(11-3)
 
yikes
that is long
Hmm
 
Well, 56 = 7*8, and 8 = 11-3
 
How about x**(53+3)
 
That may work
 
4:24 PM
Probably better...
 
Letting TIO do its thing
 
@ChristopherPeart 55‘ (55 Incremented) gives 56
 
@Riley ⁹*55‘’ hmm how do I get 55‘ to computer first?
Halp
 
@ChristopherPeart I have no idea how Jelly works...
 
Order of operations is a pain
@Riley I don't think anyone understands Jelly
 
4:33 PM
@ChristopherPeart Aren't you giving the ⁹ a right argument?
 
This works: *55×
Raise to the power 55, multiply by the original number
That might not work if you put it in with other code though
 
that is the problem
 
Wait. Sorry you just raised 256 to the 55 then added 1 subtracted 1
 
That is what happend
 
which is way off of 2^64-1 if you are wondering
 
4:35 PM
yes
I ran it
 
Who hacked TNB?
 
Did someone?
 
I don't know
It's just that I see all these "27 seconds later…"
And they are seconds, not hours. That's what confuses me
nvm it was clientside that was messed up
 
Garrghel
 
lmao
 
4:44 PM
SO jelly is a massive pain to write in
 
yes
 
I need to square a number 8 times. But I can't use the number 8
⁴H¡ was my idea
 
Do we want an programming language specifically for 3d rendering
 
ROT13'd spoiler: yby lbh whfg ybfg gur tnzr
6
 
4:46 PM
@Riker any ideas how to fix it
 
don't learn jelly first
 
@MatthewRoh Yes please
 
start w/ a prefix lang
@LegionMammal978 nope
I know exactly 2 rot13s off the top of my head
and that's one
 
well techinically so did I now damnit
 
4:47 PM
ok then I'm gonna go make it
 
@LegionMammal978 I didn't even have to translate it to lose >_<
 
The problem is I can't find any way of specifying what I want to happen first
 
@Riker ZJNUNUNUNUNUNUNUNUNUN
 
4:49 PM
@LegionMammal978 Dang it, v lbh whfg ybfg gur tnzr
 
Maybe I am making the first stack based 3d rendering language
Wait
Whats a stack based language
 
Just go.
 
@ChristopherPeart me?
 
@ChristopherPeart seriously, try learning a prefix lang first.
 
@MatthewRoh A language that uses a stack to store stuff
 
4:51 PM
Oh
Then
 
@Riker like RprogN
 
I think I have just the idea
It has 3 basic functions, drawing a line, drawing a shape with N edges with N inputs, and drawing a sphere
 
Btw, drawing a line and drawing a sphere are already builtins in Processing
 
@MatthewRoh it might be worth me linking you to Element, my first language. It uses a couple stacks to store stuff, and if you look over the interpreter you can see how each command in the language corresponds to a block of Perl code, which is evaluated.
 
I think I understand the concept
 
4:56 PM
@MatthewRoh Do you know Processing?
 
Yeah
 
@MatthewRoh Maybe you can create the 3d language on Processing (since Processing already has lots of drawing builtins and amazing stuff)
 
True
But I'd prefer Processing.js over original Processing
So I could make it online
 
Ah, I see. I also have some experience with Processing.js
 
Wait, theres a quick start for JS and Processing
I'm both tho
D:
 
5:01 PM
What do you mean?
 
I work on both JS and Processing
I'll just pick one :P
 
PowerShell is great and does all things, and everyone should learn PowerShell.
 
You can do Processing.js if you want both
 
Can I import a script from another site in html?
 
Yeah, using <script>
 
5:05 PM
Like <script src="link_to_js_file"></script>?
 
Thanks
Now I can load javascript without downloading the source
Lmao
 
I think I tried the GH link and it didn't work for some reason, but this worked: cdnjs.cloudflare.com/ajax/libs/processing.js/1.6.4/…
I may be wrong
 
But probs the best option is to just download the source
 
Pro-tip: in order to use some Javascript you have to download it. Either you download it once, or you download it everytime.
 
5:13 PM
@MatthewRoh Or you going to work on it in GH?
 
5:32 PM
Holy shit, I have the same rep as Jimmy right now
 
5:51 PM
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

SparklePonySelf-Destruct Quine Write a quine that returns/prints itself missing 1 or more characters. The outputted program must do the same thing as the original. It must generate new programs until it generates an empty program, and at least 2 new programs must be generated. Destroying comments is not al...

 

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