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2:02 PM
Interest check: have any of you played Dominion, and would be interested in a dominion-style KoTH?
 
wow, I left the chat 40 mins to look for documentation, and there's 61 new messages Oo
 
2
Q: Generate all n-bit numbers in such an order that the number of 1s increases monotonically

LembikInput Positive integer n < 64 and a threshold k. Output All n-bit integers in such an order that the number of ones in their binary representation is non-decreasing and the number of ones is at least k. Within this restriction, the integers can be output in any order of your choosing. Example...

 
Monring @Downgoat!
 
@zyabin101 morning! evening!
 
One thing: 18:14 here.
 
2:16 PM
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

muddyfishRead a crossword Occasionally I see a completed crossword and being as I am, I can't be bothered to find out what the solutions to the clues actually were. Input: A 2D string (any format, newline separated, 2d list etc.) Blank squares will be represented with a (space character) Every other ...

 
@MartinBüttner Defeated again :(
 
Challenge writing is hard.
 
at least I make it look hard :)
 
@TimmyD And only gets harder with each new challenge (potential duplicates).
 
@Zgarb We will one day reach one point were we will have to do some crazy things if we don't want to do a duplicate
 
2:26 PM
@FryAmTheEggman thanks for editing my sandbox post, completely forgot to do that.
 
ಠ_ಠ
@GamrCorps Don't forget to delete it, too.
 
Huh, thought I did. Thanks for telling me
 
@TimmyD "no one told us about that bug, but you could try our search engine if you need help"
 
@Katenkyo We'll keep having challenges as long as the field of math continues to progress
 
Does anyone else here have troubles clicking on buttons and links sometimes on SE pages? It seems like whenever I open up PPCG and want to ask a question or post an answer it would let me click either of those buttons... I am currently using Chrome Canary and have to swap to Edge to click on these important buttons
 
2:35 PM
If I want to hit my weight goal, I think I'm going to have to give up three very important things.
 
Drop the visits, eat more Tex-Mex.
 
@Rainbolt you could just move that red dotted line up a bit and remove the numbers so you wouldn't have to change anything.
 
I can't even fathom weighing 160lbs
 
@Lembik it might help not to freak out immediately at the prospect of it potentially being a duplicate. ;)
It was a fine challenge, and wasn't even closed yet and I'm sure some people would have voted to reopen.
 
How tall are you that 160 is a healthy goal? Just asking, since I'm too tall for that to sound like a good one to me.
 
2:39 PM
5' 11"
 
@Rainbolt Or just continue as you did, even after visiting your dad, you were still below your starting point, you'll reach it one day! Keep the good work !
 
It will put my BMI squarely in the middle of the green section.
 
BMI is a horrible metric
 
It's perfectly fine if you are only doing light lifting and mostly cardio
 
But in any case, the solution shouldn't be "oh god, how do I save this challenge, let's quickly add something", because even if it does differentiate the question, it's likely not going to improve it, and then maybe it's not worth the change in the first place.
@Lembik I'd recommend it you undelete it and see what happens.
(And roll back the addition of the second parameter)
 
2:42 PM
^
 
@Geobits How tall are you? I'm curious now
 
Yay! I got the last moderation priveledge! 3,500 rep!!!
 
@Rainbolt 6'2". After looking at it more, I guess 160 is still right in the good range at that height, but I just can't see myself dropping 15 lbs. It'd have to be mostly muscle mass that got lost.
 
@GamrCorps No problem :)
 
@GamrCorps When the rep caps will go up, will you lose these priviledge?
 
2:48 PM
Yep
 
@Katenkyo Unfortunately, yes
 
@GamrCorps So you just have to hit 15k rep before it happen if you want to keep it :p
 
@Rainbolt I'm 6' even, 280lbs and 35% bodyfat. Suppose I drop 65 pounds only of fat, leaving me at 215lbs and ~15% bodyfat (which most anyone would agree is pretty healthy). I'd still be at a BMI of 29.2, which is right on the very upper end of overweight.
 
@Katenkyo yep
 
BMI kind of messes up when you have mostly muscle
 
2:52 PM
It also doesn't account for frame size.
I would be an absolute stick figure, given my frame, at 200lbs. Let alone 160.
 
@Roujo It's because muscles are heavy compared to fat
 
@Katenkyo Pretty much. My brother was 5' or so, and a gymnast. His BMI wasn't quite indicative of how healthy he was. =P
 
Also, it doesn't take your body shape and morphology into account: some people just are skinny just because they can't gain fat, the opposite is true with people that naturally gain fat/muscle easily
They'll be healthy on different weight
 
I don't think anyone is arguing that BMI is perfect. It's a somewhat useful metric for average height/body type people, though. If you're training for something or are very into fitness, sure, you'd be better off using something else.
 
@Roujo Wow, I thought I was short, but there's a lot shorter Oo
 
2:57 PM
I'm super skinny, but I don't deserve to be
 
@Geobits I think you'd be better not following any metrics or tool at all
 
@Katenkyo That was during his teenage years - he literally grew out of it ^^
 
@Katenkyo Personally, I don't. Metrics and tools help people set targets/goals, though, so it is useful to use something to measure.
 
@Geobits I hate BMI because it's a flawed metric that reinforces and influences a lot of bad behavior and critical self-inspection in many people, myself included.
 
Actually, I'm 175cm (around 5'9" I think) for 65 kg (130lbs), and I wouldn't use any metrics to set myself goals
 
3:00 PM
@TimmyD I agree that it's overused, and often used incorrectly. That doesn't mean it's completely worthless to everyone.
 
Fair point.
 
I've once been at 74 kg (while doing sports 4x weeks), then gone down to 60kg to the re-gain up to 70kg of fat... It says a lot on how bad it would be to say that 70kg is the best for me
 
I just get extremely frustrated at this almost-worship that BMI has gotten throughout the years.
 
@TimmyD Yep. When I was in the military, they revamped their fitness tests to take BMI into account and most of the serious lifters ended up having to get waivered to stay in. IIRC, they moved to calipers shortly thereafter.
 
@TimmyD It's because society creates molds, and people loves to try to fit painfully in them, and force their surrounding to do so
 
3:02 PM
Why do you get extremely frustrated? If you have a lot of muscle, then you aren't the kind of person who needs to care about BMI.
 
@Geobits That's a pretty stupid situation where people should have think twice...
 
Pretty much every site I read about it warned that BMI isn't a perfect indicator.
 
@Rainbolt I suffer from depression, and have suffered from an eating disorder in the past. Body image is a very volatile topic for me.
 
@Rainbolt Some people are because of things like I said about the military, for one. People were literally threatened with dismissal from service because they had too much muscle :/
 
@Downgoat you beat me to it, I was also thinking of using ppcg.lol :/
 
3:05 PM
I assume it doesn't factor into most people's jobs, though.
 
0
Q: Open the browser to http://codegolf.stackexchange.com

CrazyPythonYour job is to open a browser window of the default browser to http://codegolf.stackexchange.com. This is code-golf, so the shortest answer in bytes wins.

 
@Rainbolt Please don't take this as meaning that I'm mad at you. Being frustrated like this is a good reminder to myself that I'm happier and healthier now than when I wasn't treating my body well. It just takes me a while to get my brain thoughts in correct alignment.
 
haha
 
@TimmyD I know you aren't mad at me. I'd have gone off if I thought you were mad at me. My weight target is my own and not anyone else's.
 
Groovy.
 
3:13 PM
I don't really have a lot of people to share with. It's basically you guys and the people I play Magic with on Friday nights
Black Desert MMO i̶s̶ ̶c̶o̶n̶s̶u̶m̶i̶n̶g̶ has consumed the remainder of my life
 
I'm in a similar situation. Depression has this very bad effect of isolation, but speaking here is "safe" because of the anonymity.
@Rainbolt Ooo, how is it? I saw the parkour-style and the character creator and went "This will consume my life if I get into it."
 
@TimmyD You can hop fences, but that's about the only parkour involved. They encourage afk fishing and afk running around and afk crafting. I saw my first guild wars yesterday, and after it was over my chat was full of "That was fun guys!" and "Nice strategy!", so I assume the pvp is fun. The PvE is somewhat grindy, but I get about 30% of a level each day just by afk fishing.
 
That's ... interesting.
 
I see a lot of people saying they have spent their entire last two weeks of play time just afk breeding horses.
My friend has like 8 workers running around the map for him, and he spends most of his time brewing beer to keep them happy. He's trying to craft a boat so that we can afk fish in the middle of the ocean.
There's even a video guide on the best way to afk Black Desert.
 
I'm suddenly a lot less interested in it.
 
3:28 PM
I think the idea is that you waste tons of power in your home so that your electricity bill runs up, and then you come home to actually play, you can focus on PvE and PvP.
Am I selling this well?
 
I used to play World of Warcraft years ago, and then people predicted that future MMOs will basically play themselves while the player is away. It seems they were right, in a sense.
 
Maybe someday players will become the NPCs when they are logged off.
They used to have a system like that in Perfect World, where you set up a shop wherever you felt like it and people would buy items from you while you afk.
 
@Rainbolt I've already got two servers, two switches, and a router running 24x7, plus 3 consoles that only enter "low power" mode rather than fully switching off. I don't need to leave my gaming machine on, too.
 
Anonymous
Black Desert looks interesting but I can't find a play/download button and Path of Exile is already devouring my free time
 
^ Cadiro is just so generous.
 
3:33 PM
It's pay to play, so you have to buy it first
 
@NathanMerrill One possible plan is to have a more crystals than bots, and end the game once X crystals have been picked up.
Although having a base is certainly possible.
 
They have some cash shop items that, at first, would appear to make the game pay to win as well. But then you realize that all of the cash shop items can also be crafted.
 
@PhiNotPi then its basically a crystal race?
@Rainbolt that's dangerously close to pay to win.
 
Anonymous
@FryAmTheEggman Cadiro has been nothing but a jerk to me. One 5L unique chest, and a bunch of worthless two-stone rings.
 
If I have bases, then crystals will be replenishing, and the game ends once X crystals are returned to base.
 
Anonymous
3:36 PM
I just finished my first stack of 1k coins right before finishing cruel last night
 
@Mego Ledge goldrim in a HC league is about the best thing to ever happen for me :)
 
@CoolestVeto I just got +50 rep on my MC ACSII Art text answer in the past 3 hours. Little odd, but its over 500 rep now :P
 
@PhiNotPi you could also make the turns a fixed number, and make it a game of "keep the crystal"
I think I like the shipping one more, because it'll have more variety of strategy options
you have shippers, pirates, protectors
 
Fixed turn number is probably best anyways.
 
Anonymous
@FryAmTheEggman This is literally my first character, so I went PSC :P
 
3:39 PM
I think shipping has more depth, anyways.
 
@Mego Yeah, standard leagues are the way to go until you get the hang of the game. You picked a great time to start though :)
 
This is quite impressive, and I really appreciated the explanation.
 
Oh yeah, I meant to post that the other day.
 
@Doorknob Holy smokes Mechanize is amazing
@El'endiaStarman Have you seen the SMB1 version?
They did it for AGDQ 15 I think
 
3:53 PM
@quartata There's a good chance I have, but I'm not sure.
I think I did see the Pong and Snake one that was more recent.
 
I'm impressed as this was human-input, not TAS.
 
Wait, it was human input? That's not possible (at least with the traditional trick)
 
Anonymous
@quartata In AGDQ 2016 they did a human-input credits warp race
 
Anonymous
It's not the same 0-exit trick as the TAS one though
 
3:57 PM
@quartata You can watch the archived Twitch stream.
 
Anonymous
I don't remember if someone did the real 0-exit trick human input or not, but I know it's console verified
 
Anonymous
@TimmyD Of course it would be seth
 
Yeah. He's ... fanatic, shall we say.
 
4:12 PM
@TimmyD It 404'd for me, why? :-P
 
Anonymous
5 more days for fanatic :D
 
@ChrisJester-Young Dunno. I copy-pasted it from a couple-month old email, but yeah, it seems to 404 now.
 
@EasterlyIrk Thanks for reminding me to set up the meta subdomain
meta.ppcg.lol should redirect to meta now as well
 
time to find a OS that doesn't have a default browser
 
4:16 PM
@Quill Also make sandbox.ppcg.lol redirect to the Sandbox.
 
and can run code
 
@zyabin101 yessir
 
Isn't s.tk/golf shorter?
 
no, 1 character more
 
9 > 8
ninja'd
 
4:17 PM
and its 9 > 8
 
Oh yeah, I forgot www.
Stupid me.
 
Surely we've had challenges which needed PPCG and somebody URL shortened it. Having trouble finding them though :/
 
@NathanMerrill MS-DOS
 
Okay, sandbox.ppcg.lol is set up
give the dns a little bit to hit ttl
 
@NathanMerrill avocadOS.
 
4:26 PM
@EasterlyIrk AvocadOS doesn't currently run JS code. It's just the bare bones + meaty skeleton now.
 
Yeah, but it has no default browser. :P
 
4:36 PM
we need a new browser named "Juic"
 
lol
 
@El'endiaStarman they posted that two days too early
i used to always say "for dev purposes linux is best but if it's not an option i'd choose mac over windows because at least you get bash" but i guess that's not the case any more
 
Seems like Microsoft is really making a huge push to get more developers for their platform(s).
 
@El'endiaStarman 0_0
This must be a prank
 
4:41 PM
@El'endiaStarman Developers! Developers! Developers! ...
 
@El'endiaStarman -1 not llama@llama
 
Anonymous
@El'endiaStarman About damn time... Cygwin works but not very well
 
0
Q: A Tiny Explorer

user52676You are an explorer, mapping an unknown world. Your ship is carried on the wind. Where it goes, who knows? Each day, in your spyglass, you see features to the north, south, east and west. You always see four such features, corresponding to the cardinal directions. Your spyglass reports ASCII sy...

 
5:04 PM
@CᴏɴᴏʀO'Bʀɪᴇɴ check the oration pull request and merge pls.
 
5:15 PM
@Downgoat my code seriously was independent. Besides, his method makes my code longer. This is the shortest way.
 
@PhiNotPi I pushed an update. Tournaments have a breaking change (PlayerType instead of Player)
 
The reason my code is identical to his first revision is because that is the shortest possible for oration.
 
Hey 6 upvotes in Showcase your Language already. At this rate, I'll overtake Martin's answer in... sigh
 
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

MegoGame Console Text Input code-golf string keyboard On modern game consoles, trying to input text is a nightmare. Trying to type with a few buttons and a joystick on a virtual keyboard is annoying, and I like to make as few movements/button presses as possible. The keyboard you will be using look...

 
5:36 PM
@Dennis Six to Eight weeks?
 
@Dennis can you move the comments here to the chatroom i posted in the comments?
 
@EasterlyIrk I can create a chat room from the comments, but I cannot copy them to an existing one.
 
Then do so. I will delete that room.
 
(Although I could create that room, then move them from that room to yours, but that probably more trouble than it's worth.)
@EasterlyIrk Will do.
 
oops.
Can you also delete the room? I can't.
 
5:42 PM
@NathanMerrill I haven't been using KOTHcomm so far in my controller.
 
@EasterlyIrk All done.
 
@PhiNotPi ok cool
 
@Dennis Thanks.
 
@zyabin101 6 to oo weeks, no doubt about it.
 
6 to object-oriented weeks
If object-oriented programming takes an infinite amount of time, does imperative programming take an imaginary amount of time?
 
5:54 PM
1
Q: Is Oration a programming language?

Easterly IrkOration is a programming language created by @ConorO'Brien, which I have helped with. My answer here has come under fire for copying somebody else's code, and being just a lengthier version of python. The python answer is here. I think it is still valid as a language (as of now, it is actually ...

 
@Dennis s/oo/∞/
 
Tell that to SymPy.
 
@Dennis: I tried to replicate your 3-byte example in the Showcase thread, but actually using squaring. Clearly, my attempt failed. Why?
 
@El'endiaStarman You forgot to save. That's my code, not yours.
 
@El'endiaStarman what you linked is doing (a+b) * (a-b)
 
5:56 PM
Whoopsie.
 
0
Q: Tic-tac-toe with only crosses as quick as possible

A and NIntroduction Everyone knows the game tic-tac-toe, but in this challenge, we are going to introduce a little twist. We are only going to use crosses. The first person who places three crosses in a row loses. An interesting fact is that the maximum amount of crosses before someone loses, is equal ...

 
@El'endiaStarman The second ² isn't applied to the second argument, but to the result of the difference. To do square left, square right, subtract, you'd need ²_²}. The } chooses the right argument.
 
Oh, so what I had was basically doing (a^2-b)^2?
 
(Can't type. Sorry 'bout the pings.)
Yes, exactly.
 
Oh, is it because ² is monadic?
 
6:00 PM
Yes, that's correct. A monadic atom is always an atop is a dyadic chain, i.e., it gets applied to the previous return value.
 
> ²_²
10/10 very epic
@Dennis really? >.<
@Dennis to 1M rep.
:P
 
@Dennis Where can I know that "ȷ" means 1000?
 
Is it documented on anywhere?
 
Only real docs are here.
 
6:11 PM
What is a language that isn't even officially documented?
 
@NathanMerrill So far, my (entirely custom-built) controller is able to carry out a single turn of the game (like bot movement and zapping).
 
What post?
 
@PhiNotPi have you tested zapping chains?
create 4 bots, put them in a square, and then have 4 sequential zaps
 
@KennyLau in development
 
I'll try that.
 
6:14 PM
^^
@KennyLau Who needs docs when you can rek people with your golfing?
2
 
@PhiNotPi also, I don't know why we never used the pushing mechanic
 
wait.... @Dennis When was jelly created?
 
Ugggh. We just had another cookoff at work and the theme this time was "Breakfast for Lunch". I had my first ever pig-in-a-bacon-blanket-in-a-croissant-blanket-coated-in-honey.
We had a build your own donut area where you can put peanut butter and chocolate and bananas on your donut.
Multiple biscuit and gravy stalls, monkey bread, some kind of breakfast casserole...
 
@KennyLau In late December. It only had a handful of features back then though, and it is still far from finished.
 
nice
 
6:20 PM
@Rainbolt And a free coupon for a quadruple bypass at a local hospital.
 
@NathanMerrill Zap-chaining seems to work.
 
@Rainbolt Dear God.
 
zap,zap,zap,zap,drop causes the original bot to perform the drop
 
@PhiNotPi try zap,zap,zap,forward
 
That also seems to work. (the first bot gets pushed by the third)
I avoid infinite loops because the zapping doesn't change the instruction being performed, just which bot is performing it.
I have an important meeting to attend, I'mma have to bail.
 
6:24 PM
v<>v
>^ <
 
Up-caret bot instructions: ZZZFZZZFH
 
@El'endiaStarman only one command at a time. That'd technically be an infinite loop, but only one loop would happen each turn
actually, no
ZZZF would occur first
then ZZF
right @PhiNotPi ?
 
indecipherable jargon
 
Incidentally, I wonder if it's possible to build a TC system using only pre-placed and pre-rotated bots and the zap and forward commands.
 
6:33 PM
@Rainbolt Be sure to update that chart you posted earlier accordingly :P
 
@mbomb007 @KennyLau Our definitive policy about answers not meeting the challenge specification suggests giving the poster time to amend his post or to delete it himself before flagging for moderator attention.
 
I'm new here. Please forgive me.
 
No worries.
 
@Dennis
 
> No worries forgiveness.
 
6:34 PM
Oh, never mind, I just saw his answer.
Apparently if you have a programming language that preinitializes a variable to "10" then you win.... except not
 
Ah, yes. The PowerShell built-ins for exponents and powers-of-two ... you'd think they would come in handy more often.
 
Retina...
 
@KennyLau Welcome to the chat, by the way!
 
134
A: What is the smallest positive base 10 integer that can be printed by a program shorter (in characters) than itself?

Martin BüttnerRetina, score 1 The empty program counts the number of matches of the empty regex in the input (which is the empty string). That's exactly 1 match, so it prints 1. Try it online.

@Zgarb Thanks!
 
@KennyLau Excellent first challenge, by the way.
 
6:39 PM
@TimmyD Thanks! Have you done it?
 
I'm too inept busy at work today.
 
Why don't we expand esolangs.org/wiki/Jelly together?
 
@KennyLau If you want to contribute, the wiki i the GitHub repository is publicly editable.
 
@Dennis Do you have a quine?
 
0
A: Golf you a quine for great good!

DennisJelly, 3 bytes ”ṘṘ Try it online! Verification $ echo $LANG en_US $ xxd -g 1 quine.jelly 0000000: ff cc cc ... $ ./jelly f quine.jelly | xxd -g 1 0000000: ff cc cc ... How it works ”ṘṘ Main link. No input. ...

That's a proper quine btw.
At least as far as PPCG is concerned.
 
6:44 PM
what about CR?
 
Jelly on CR. rofl
 
@Dennis Great. Another undocumented command.
 
</rant>
 
brb, making a CR post about Jelly
 
@KennyLau is documented. is actually syntax; it begins a character literal.
 
6:46 PM
Where is it documented?
 
on CR
 
and what is CR?
 
CodeReview, our rival sister site on the network.
 
6:47 PM
@KennyLau While there is nothing wrong with talking about Jelly here, if you want to have a more focused conversation where CR probably won't be mentioned, there is a room dedicated to it.
 
@TimmyD "ninja'd"---Optimizer
 
@KennyLau I was going to say here, but I've apparently forgot to add it to the list. I'll fix that asap.
 
@KennyLau Most esolangs developed by PPCGers are not on CR.
 
@GamrCorps \o/
 
35 mins ago, by Easterly Irk
@KennyLau Who needs docs when you can rek people with your golfing?
 
6:51 PM
@Dennis They would probably bash you for parsing code with a regex.
 
I really want to post a CR question in an esolang now.
 
hahahaha
closed as
 
@Zgarb The Jelly interpreter is the result of me learning Python by looking at PPCG answers.
2
 
oh, I totally missed Music's shiny new colours
 
6:54 PM
user image
3
 
It's really interesting how so many new(er) esolangs are written in Python or JavaScript...
 
@Dennis That's really fascinating. I had pegged you as having a very extensive coding background.
 
@Dennis Well, given that Jelly programs have a bounded number of nested contexts, regex may actually be the best choice.
 
@El'endiaStarman Because they have eval
 
@KennyLau I don't think that's it.
 
6:55 PM
> GOTO 1981
 
@MartinBüttner the balancing brackets one should be your fav.
 
@Optimizer Needs more /=
 
Kinda disappointed that is missing completely.
 
@MartinBüttner Ooh, nice. Except the tabs are near unreadable until you mouse-over.
 
I am disappointed because !something.equals(somethingElse) is also missing
 
6:56 PM
Is there a retina documentation?
 
Thanks
 
There are several things that concern me about this picture, but mostly it's the graph in the background https://t.co/khvp4cckRr
 
I also noticed the other day that bicycles.SE has the coolest main/meta design pair
 
@Quill Puzzling.SE graduating is an utter embarrassment for SE. And I say this as one of the highest-rep users on that site.
3
 
6:58 PM
@xnor Elaborate.
 
@MartinBüttner wow, its really nice! someone has put some brains into it
 
@xnor in what way?
ninja'd
 
@MartinBüttner Oh yeah, that's pretty cool. Very clever.
 

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