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04:00
@MετάEd That would be delicious if they would remove the almonds.
What do you win?
Just get vanilla and then add your own crèmes de menthe et de cacao when you make your milkshake.
@WendiKidd Ice cream, I suppose.
I like nuts.
@MετάEd haha
I like nuts too. Just not in ice cream or any kind of cake/muffin
They're good by themselves, and salted, and sometimes candied
But not in other desserts
The opening is good. It is dark brown with little white spots here and there. Chocolate promised.
Hot fudge sundays.
@MετάEd White chocolate isn’t.
04:01
Oh yes. Yes. Yessssssssssssss.
@tchrist That's a good idea. I could just get mint extract and mix it in vanilla ice cream.
@tchrist Yeah let's not get into what white chocolate is. I still think it's weird and creepy.
@WendiKidd And illegal in Europe.
@tchrist Really?????
Well. . . .
(is far too gullible if you're kidding)
04:02
@WendiKidd Right, that is indeed a very good question.
@WendiKidd Wait, what? Googles white chocolate
But one that there isn't a definitive answer to, alas.
@Cerberus Answer it! Assuage my guilt! /sad
Aww
Ehh I have it open in a tab!
@MετάEd It's not that bad. I just think it's kinda gross. But I'm odd about things like that.
04:03
@Tchrist It is indeed my understanding that Americans use the present perfect less than Englishmen.
It is illegal to call white chocolate chocolate in some lingo-fascist European states.
Is it?
@tchrist Ahhh I see. So as long as they call it Separated Chocolate Fat and Other Byproducts everything is fine?
I recently read about some food-name issues in America where they were stricter than here.
You never know. Although of course the EU is well known for it ridiculous name thingies.
We have liver sausages that are so called while only containing 2 % liver.
> In 2004, the Food and Drug Administration calls for the definition of white chocolate as being, at least 20% cocoa butter, 14% milk solids, and 3.5% milk fat.
04:05
Okay this is really good with cabernet.
Oklahoma tried to ban oreos a while back because they caused obesity. They also tried to not call the Founding Fathers that, because it was sexist. (There just...weren't any women. What can you possibly do about that now?) And they wanted to not call dinosaurs dinosaurs, I forget what they wanted to do, but it was something anti-evolution.
Hahaha.
This makes my day!
@Cerberus I can't imagine something that could be grosser than liver, but I imagine it must be if being 2% liver is a bad thing.
@WendiKidd Call them low-flying birds of immense proportion.
@Cerberus haha, yay!
@tchrist I'm still depressed that dinosaurs aren't reptiles and pluto isn't a planet.
04:06
@WendiKidd Wow. Sounds like they are really confused about exactly what kind of morons they are supposed to be.
@Cerberus Braunschweiger is common here.
@MετάEd haha yes, exactly
This was quite a few years ago, but sometime in the last decade.
@WendiKidd It's okay. Remember that birds are dinosaurs and everything gets better.
I'm not a big fan either, so, yes, I couldn't care less. Oh, and my friend actually likes this gulp vegetarian liver sausage that they also sell here.
Crazy people are crazy.
04:07
@Cerberus WHOA? Really?
@Cerberus vegetarian liver?
that.....makes no sense on so many levels
@tchrist *of proportions great and small
What’s next, vegetarian foie gras?
vegetarian caviar. though wait, vegetarians can eat fish sometimes right?
or rather, some of them can?
No, not really.
04:08
Hey, they already had a vegetarian version of every kind of meat on the shelves, so they thought, why not liver sausage?
Mock liver. That would be interesting to try.
Because ew??
But saying you’re icky and fagous will not come out well.
Many people who call themselves vegetarians eat fish.
It makes as little sense as eating egg.
points above
04:09
@Cerberus Yeah that's what I thought. But vegans don't eat fish, and also some other things, right?
So give them a break.
@WendiKidd Pesky vegetarians can.
@Cerberus I don't see what's wrong with eating eggs, if you're a moral vegetarian. (I know some people do it for health reasons.) But if it's for moral reasons, and the eggs weren't baby chickens anyway, what harm does it do?
@WendiKidd That's right, vegans normally don't eat anything related to animals.
/honestly curious
04:09
waits for someone to use ichthyophagous in a sentence
@tchrist googles that
aha
Ichthyophagous is a thing.
Hence the icky fagous problem.
/done
Vegetarians do not consume the flesh of any animal.
Answer that question and I shall come up with a suitable ichthyophagous sentence for you.
04:11
Just their egg-fruits, sometimes.
@WendiKidd Vegans aren't really about diet. They are about not exploiting animals. There is actually a controversy among vegans about honey, and whether it amounts to exploiting bees.
@WendiKidd You forget the important issue here: etymology! Vegetarian really means "eating vegetables"!
Morality, pah!
Or as someone said, I'm not a vegetarian because I love animals. I'm a vegetarian because I hate plants.
@MετάEd I worked with a guy who went vegan because he wanted to be healthy. He runs marathons and does triathalons and stuff. He said eventually he stopped missing all the other foods. He didn't really care about the morality I don't think, he just thought it was the healthiest way to live for his lifestyle.
@MετάEd LOL!!!!
@Cerberus true!
@WendiKidd That doesn't sound vegan. Did he stop wearing leather shoes?
04:13
@tchrist It is not for you to establish this definition...
@WendiKidd Yes, you eventually do.
@MετάEd No clue. He went on a vegan diet then, I should say.
@Cerberus Sure it is.
@WendiKidd Sure.
Which I think can be done without actually being vegan.
04:13
@MετάEd Umm veganism not being about diet?
@WendiKidd Yes. I think that makes the distinction clear.
@tchrist People telling other people what a vegetarian really "is" make me...tired.
It’s weird that we steal a crab’s claw and throw him back in to regrow it next season.
All righty, loathe as I am to leave when some of my favorite people are hanging out, I must go. I'm tired and it's bedtime. Night!
@Cerberus Right. It is way more than diet. It's about not exploiting animals. So it's don't eat them, but also don't skin them and don't keep them as pets and all sorts of other things. It's not a dietary thing at all, strictly speaking.
04:14
@Cerberus Then you should go to bed.
@WendiKidd Night!
Anybody who feeds animal flesh to a vegetarian deserves to be smacked.
@WendiKidd G'nite.
@MετάEd Wait. Okay now I'm here for a few more minutes
It’s highly offensive.
04:15
What's wrong with pets?
@MετάEd I don't know; one always hears them talk about diet, but never about pets.
At least not here.
@WendiKidd Depends on whether you eat them, I guess.
@tchrist I shall do so presently.
@tchrist Nuuu! But no seriously, as long as you take care of the pets what's the problem?
The claws grow back, so they must be vegetables.
04:16
It's not like setting your dog or fish free would be good for them. They'd probably die
@WendiKidd From the vegan perspective it's wrong to keep pets because you basically imprison them.
Your skin can grow back too. Doesn't make it a vegetable.
@tchrist starrrrr.
@MετάEd What's the alternative to domesticated animals that can't survive on their own?
(just curious)
@Cerberus annnd another
:)
It’s like how for medieval Catholics during Lent, ducks were fish because they swam.
I really should just go to bed. I'm getting star-happy
04:17
@WendiKidd Cats.
@WendiKidd That's problematic.
@tchrist So people are fish?
@MετάEd yar
@WendiKidd good night
@WendiKidd Only half of them.
@tchrist haha
04:17
@WendiKidd Even non-pets are problematic. Consider the domesticated turkey. It can't survive on its own.
okay, night for real this time. See you guys later!
@MετάEd People keep turkeys in their homes?
@WendiKidd G'nite again!
What’s next, house-pigs?
That’s like having watch-geese.
04:18
@tchrist are you talking about Asians again?
@tchrist I suppose somebody does. It's a big world.
@TemporaryNickName Your what hurts?
@MετάEd This doesn't say anything about pets at all. I have also never heard any vegans talk about pets.
Veganism () is the practice of abstaining from the use of animal products, particularly in diet, as well as an associated philosophy that rejects the commodity status of sentient animals. A follower of veganism is known as a vegan. Distinctions are sometimes made between different categories of veganism. Dietary vegans (or strict vegetarians) refrain from consuming animal products, not only meat and fish but, in contrast to ovo-lacto vegetarians, also eggs, dairy products and other animal-derived substances, such as honey. The term ethical vegan is often applied to those who not only fol...
I thought you are saying "Your what huts?"
Exploiting animals industrially is what they always seem to object against.
04:20
Some of my best friends are animals.
Cats are nice.
anyways, Yo mama so poor that when I stepped on a cigarette she said "who turned off the heat?"
You need to put more lip into that.
@Cerberus Vegans talking about pets: "the entire custom of having pet animals needs to be challenged". veganmeans.com/why_veganism/animal_reasons_pets.htm
Just google vegans pets
You can’t have a vegan cat: they’re obligate carnivores.
Well, unless you give them Red Bulls or something.
04:26
@MετάEd I'm sorry, but neither I nor Wikipedia seem to agree with this characterisation of veganism.
I really don't think that's mainstream veganism.
@Cerberus There is a very lively discussion of veganism and pets. As I say, just google the two words together.
It's simply wrong to say vegans aren't talking about it.
I didn't say that.
I think you understand my position.
@Cerberus You said you have never heard any vegans talking about pets. I take you at your word, but your experience of vegans must be quite limited.
> Braunschweiger is a 60/40 mix of grass-fed trim and grass-fed beef liver retailed in a fully cooked 1 pound package ready to slice and serve.
“Trim”? Ewwww.
I belong to a Unitarian church. I hear these kind of discussions taking place.
04:29
I don't consider it part of mainstream veganism. That doesn't contradict either your Google results or the fact that some vegans hold these opinions on pets.
How do you feed grass to a trim?
Trimming the verge.
Or vice versa.
I'm sure many vegans are also pacifists, for example.
@Cerberus What do you mean by mainstream veganism? Would you count the Vegan Society as mainstream?
The Vegan Society is a registered charity and the oldest vegan society in the world, founded on November 1, 1944, in England by Donald Watson, Elsie "Sally" Shrigley, and 23 others. Watson coined the word "vegan" to stand for "non-dairy vegetarians" who also ate no eggs. The date of the society's founding is celebrated annually as World Vegan Day. The society now defines veganism as "...a way of living that seeks to exclude, as far as possible and practicable, all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing and any other purpose." Activities * Information –...
@Cerberus Hey. Look. Mainstream vegans talking about the issue of pets.
It's not a settled issue, but it is a mainstream vegan issue.
@MετάEd I don't know how important this society still is. Either way, I see nothing about pets.
@Cerberus It was started in 1944 by Donald Watson. The one who coined the word.
04:35
@MετάEd Hey, look, an isosceles triangle with one 90° angle.
It sort of defines veganism.
@Cerberus All I am saying is that before you conclude that pets are not a mainstream vegan issue, look into it. It's a huge mainstream vegan issue. Like I said, even bees are a mainstream vegan issue. You think they are agonizing over bees, and not pets?
1. I am talking about how most modern vegans talk, not about 1944 or any particular society. 2. Watson coined the word "vegan" to stand for "non-dairy vegetarians" who also ate no eggs.
We eat the product of bees, and they are kept for that express purpose.
@Cerberus I'm done. Let's talk about something else.
@MετάEd I didn't say it couldn't be an "issue"; I said it was probably not a good idea to assume that normal vegans were against pets.
Very well.
It's way past my bed time anyway.
Just don’t eat the bees.
Without cooking them first.
04:41
@tchrist Do you suppose "verge" and "vert" are cognate?
Not at all.
@tchrist Beefeater. Confusing.
Our verge is more related to the obscene Mexican-Spanish verga.
Bee-fresser.
So a beefeater is a bee feeder-on-er.
< Latin virga, rod.
Feats of derring do.
04:45
Vertical.
04:55
@tchrist It is still possible.
The supposed PIE roots may be related, although separate roots seem to have been constructed.
05:07
Verge is apparently from *wei-, "to turn, twist".
Convert is from *wer- (2), "to turn, bend".
(This is about the noun verge and the most common verb verge.)
05:30
14/15 on Religion. Turns out I don't know the First Great Awakening either.
13/13 on Science.
Electrons are smaller than atoms. True or false?
Really? Why is this one of the questions that had a lot of wrong answers?
I sort of get blowing "Which gas makes up most of the Earth's atmosphere". But electrons?
I suppose it's like Heavy Boots.
06:13
in Photography, 3 mins ago, by Johan Larsson
user image
Dishwasher^
06:30
What is the action of putting one of your legs on the other one called?
Cross your legs? guess
Maybe
06:53
hmm, (Cons 2 (Cons 3 (Cons 6 Nil))) is same as [2,3,6]
interesting
 
4 hours later…
10:55
@Meysam Yes, cross your legs.
yes! guessed right
@MετάEd Is that a uh. Um. Yeah, it is. I'm not even going to ask.
user19161
11:12
@KitFox Morning Kit!
I know the meaning of "stop short of doing something" as described here: idioms.thefreedictionary.com/stop+short+of
but what's the meaning of "short of doing sth"?
"I don't think you can do much for people who aren't interested, short of paying them extra for doing so or making it mandatory."
user19161
@Meysam It sort of means like "anything lesser than that".
user19161
"Short of deleting his account, there was no way he could keep off the site."
@JasperLoy Is this idiom different from "stop short of doing something"? I could not find it mentioned anywhere.
user19161
@Meysam Well, "stop short of doing something" has the stop in front, so it means stop before that thing.
user19161
11:25
The meaning is as in the dictionary, slightly different.
user19161
"He stopped short of deleting his account."
user19161
means he did not delete it in the end.
@JasperLoy Thank you
11:51
@JasperLoy Morning.
@MετάEd And beer. Don't forget about the yeast debate.
Hello
Morning.
Could anyone help me with a small passage?
Probably. I'll get my coffee and be right back.
12:17
Here's a question for @tchrist: Is there a term for the descender on a lower-case "g" when it forms a closed loop?
'' It was rather a misunderstanding on her part rather than 'a debate' and I never waste my energy on such petty stuff, as you say. And it's not even passion, but simple indignation.''
@Robusto It’s just called a loop. See here. I don’t think the unclosed one counts as a real loop.
> Loops are found on some lowercase “g” characters, and can be fully closed or partially closed.
Hope everything is right.
@tchrist Thanks.
@Monica You need a comma before the and.
12:21
Also, I'd 86 the first "rather" in that sentence.
Sorry, I didn't get you. What should I do with 'rather'?
He means delete it.
It was more of a misunderstanding than a debate.
Personally, I wouldn't change any of it.
ah, I see
12:23
Except the first rather bit.
Oh, the 'rather' is used twice
Yes. "more of" works fine to replace it, as tchrist suggested.
It was rather a misunderstanding on her part than 'a debate' and I never waste my energy on such petty stuff, as you say. And it's not even passion, but simple indignation.''
No, that won't work.
so rather .... than structure is wrong
12:25
Although you could say "It was rather a misunderstanding on her part, not 'a debate'"
I didn't know that 'rather' is not used with than'
@Monica It seems wrong there. They should be together "rather than" separated.
It was rather a misunderstanding on her part, not 'a debate' and, I never waste my energy on such petty stuff, as you say. And it's not even passion, but simple indignation.
You'll need another comma there, before the and.
It was rather a misunderstanding on her part, not 'a debate', and I never waste my energy on such petty stuff, as you say. And it's not even passion, but simple indignation.
12:27
Yes, I've just seen it.
So now it's correct, right?
Using "rather a misunderstanding" is a BrE way of saying it was "something of a misunderstanding" or "quite a misunderstanding"; I stand by my original point.
@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Damn you. That tickle on your nose this morning before you woke up?
@Robusto You don't like the BrE flavor? I thought it matched with the rest of the sentence.
The BrE flavor is fine. My point is it means something different than what appears to be intended.
12:32
But this version -It was more of a misunderstanding rather than a debate is right, isn't?
They are used together.
@Monica No. In that case, lose the second rather.
"It was more of a misunderstanding than a debate."
Or better: "It was more a misunderstanding than a debate."
So the final version:
It was rather a misunderstanding on her part, not 'a debate', and I never waste my energy on such petty stuff, as you say. And it's not even passion, but simple indignation.
@KitFox We're coming up on International Clitoris Awareness Week. No pun intended.
No missed commas, I hope.
I’m not especially endeared of that rather, myself.
I don’t know whether it means instead of a or whether it means more of a.
12:37
@MετάEd Yes, I know. I've been aware of clitorides for decades now, but it's nice that other people get a whole week to find them.
Will there be a treasure hunt?
Not for you.
pouts
user19161
@tchrist The dead has returned.
Thanks for the explanations, everyone.
12:40
@JasperLoy Wevs.
user19161
Only recently did I realise that "Kit Fox" is listed on Wikipedia!
@KitFox I think it looks like a Vorlon.
user19161
It is indeed a lovely species.
Those are supposed to be angelic, aren't they?
Ick.
I think it looks like basal ganglia.
user19161
12:43
It looks like red chillies lol.
We have a lot of symmetries like that.
The human body does, I mean.
user19161
Yes, interesting that nature has symmetry.
It's funny how distracting I'm finding Ed's picture.
user19161
I wonder if there is an explanation for nature's symmetry.
@JasperLoy Well, I don't think that is interesting.
@JasperLoy Yes. Cells divide in two.
user19161
12:44
Ah, OK.
Radial symmetry.
bilateral symmetry
:"Bilateral symmetry" redirects here. For bilateral symmetry in mathematics, see reflection symmetry. Symmetry in biology is the balanced distribution of duplicate body parts or shapes. In nature and biology, symmetry is approximate. For example, plant leaves, while considered symmetric, rarely match up exactly when folded in half. Symmetry creates a class of patterns in nature, where the near-repetition of the pattern element is by reflection or rotation. The body plans of most multicellular organisms exhibit some form of symmetry, whether radial symmetry, bilateral symmetry or "spheri...
Yes, yes, I was about to say that pentamerism, now that's interesting.
I'd like to see 'odd' symmetry, symmetric across a point, but not radial.
12:46
The even-numbered symmetries, those are boring. All based on how cells divide.
user19161
I see another person has found BF to be rude, lol.
Tetramerous symmetry.
How you get sea stars, that’s different.
@KitFox what? really? then whow come there's any -non-symmetry at all?
I want to see 7-based radial symmetry too.
@Mitch Ah ha, see. Now you're asking the right questions.
Any flowers like that?
12:47
No. Most plants are pentameric.
user19161
Also interesting that some plants eat animals.
@KitFox I love school! Except people make fun of you for liking that stuff.
Tetramerism, pentamerism, hexamerism, octamerism, metamerism.
@JasperLoy Sort of. That's just your basic digestion.
@KitFox there are a few 4-way flowers right?
12:48
Mustards.
Crucifers.
@tchrist That's radial symmetry.
@tchrist what the hell is metamerism? symmetries of symmetries? too early in the morning dude!
@tchrist oh right, like basil.
@Mitch Basil is a mint, not a mustard.
In colorimetry, metamerism is the matching of apparent color of objects with different spectral power distributions. Colors that match this way are called metamers. A spectral power distribution describes the proportion of total light emitted, transmitted, or reflected by a color sample at every visible wavelength; it precisely defines the light from any physical stimulus. However, the human eye contains only three color receptors (3 types of cone cells), which means that all colors are reduced to three sensory quantities, called the tristimulus values. Metamerism occurs because each type...
In biology, metamerism is a linear series of body segments fundamentally similar in structure, though not all such structures are entirely alike in any single life form because some of them perform special functions. In animals, metameric segments are referred to as somites or metameres. In plants, they are referred to as metamers or, more concretely, phytomers. In animals In animals, metamery is defined as a mesodermal event resulting in serial repetition of unit subdivisions of ectoderm and mesoderm products. Endoderm is not involved in metamery. Segmentation is not the same concept as...
How do the plants 'know' how to count? Where in the (DNA) code is the constant 5?
@Mitch There are the cotyledons and the dicotyledons...let me see if I can remember. One is pentameric, the other dimeric.
12:50
You need to know the domain to know which flavor of metameres are being referred to.
@tchrist oh..like the vertebrae, sort of repeating in sequence?
@Mitch Yes.
@KitFox I'd bet that the monocots are the evens.
@KitFox The plant killers kill off all but monocots.
Somites, like how we're formed. You know any embryology?
12:51
@tchrist you mean weedkillers?
aren't most weeds grasses which are monocots?
Plant killers.
Oh, that's right. Monocots are in threes, dicots in fives.
That's one way to tell them apart.
A weed is just a plant you don’t love.
@JasperLoy nice color avatar, also welcome back, but I'm sure you'l came you're not 'back' just visiting.
I unlove invasive crabgrass in my garden.
But I’m not about to use a plant killer on it. That would be counterproductive.
12:53
And monocots have parallel veins and scattered vascularization.
Right. Orchids are monocots.
As are gladden.
So we know an apple must be...
@KitFox oh. what really? I thought...ok this is not the same but aren't there 3 needled pines and 5 needled ones too? (gymmnosperms are ...let's say 'pre-monocots')
looks for raised hands
Obvious.
Gladiolas, too.
Blue-eyed grass.
12:54
No, that's not the answer.
@KitFox cuz they're mongered by pentacostermongers?
Not mono.
Which is...
"what is a red delicious?" is the question to the answer that you're looking for?
Pavlov rings.
12:54
@Mitch I have found a centipede in my bed before. It ran off and I couldn't find it, even after stripping off all the sheets and shaking them out, and turning the matress over, etc.
@Mitch These are angiosperms, though, not gymnosperms.
@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 mice are cute when they jump from the table (when you turn on the lilght in the middle of the night).
those... things.. are not cute.
> Heteronomous metamery is the condition where metameres have grouped together to perform similar tasks. The extreme example of this is the insect head (5 metameres), thorax (3 metameres), and abdomen (11 metameres, not all discernible in all insects).
> The process that results in the grouping of metameres is called "tagmatization", and each grouping is called a tagma (plural: tagmata). In organisms with highly derived tagmata, such as the insects, much of the metamerism within a tagma may not be trivially distinguishable.
Tagma, tagmata.
@KitFox so we know an apple must be a dicot bcause it has 5-symmetry?
@tchrist Epithet of the day: "You heteronomous metamerizer!'
@Mitch Yes. Very good.
12:57
Not all pines are odd-numbered.
But frankly Where is the '5', excpet only at the bottom of red delicious apples, which frankly don't count because they don't taste good.
Pinus edulis is the two-needled piñon pine.
That's Science!
Pines are a different classification.
@Mitch If you cut an apple in half the fat way, you can see the star in the center.
@tchrist OK what's up with pine nuts? Aren't those kind of labor intensive (and painful) to harvest?
12:58
Hence the riddle: A little red house that hides a star.
@KitFox Oh...wait...are you calling me fat?
Are you an apple?
@Mitch Have you tried to find other food where the edible pines grow?
@KitFox Is that Beatrix Potter?
@KitFox Um... maybe?
I dunno.
Now. Carrots. Dicot or monocot?
12:59
@tchrist actually ... no... frankly...no not that either. Is that where the deer and the antelope play?
Pines can have 2, 3, 4, or 5 needles in each bundle. It’s one of the first things in any key for them.
No I've never really looked.

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