English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Matt Эллен

19:04

@JSBձոգչ I don't see the benefit for desktop users.

over win7

RegDwight АΑA

Desktop users haven't been having any benefits since XP.

Matt Эллен

You seem to have a case of nostalgia

RegDwight АΑA

I never had XP.

Robusto

Win 7 is the first Microsoft OS I've really actually liked, not merely tolerated.

ΜετάEd

@JSBձոգչ You mean they finally switched to the VMS kernel?

user19161

19:06

No more paying. Everyone use Linux/LibreOffice!

ΜετάEd

LibreOffice, OpenOffice, what's the IBM one? Symphony.

Because it's not good enough to have a million word processing applications, must have a million one.

RegDwight АΑA

I wonder where John Lawler is. Last seen on Jul 31st, did check out the primaries but not the election.

Matt Эллен

clever people are clever

user19161

@RegDwightАΑA He thought there were enough JL's on ELU.

KitFox

@MattЭллен Oh pretty!

RegDwight АΑA

19:12

@MattЭллен stupid blog author lies about peanut butter, then shows empty McDoof bag instead.

And yes. Pretty. Pretty lies.

Matt Эллен

@RegDwightАΑA peanut butter is sticky.

tchrist

@RegDwightАΑA Well, he is a retired prof, and this is summer. Perhaps he’s off touring the broiling American West in a whale-on-wheels.

RegDwight АΑA

I hope so.

tchrist

Understood.

You could mail him.

RegDwight АΑA

Oh yeah.

Robusto

19:15

Maybe he's cooking meth in Albuquerque. Maybe he is actually Walter White/Heisenberg. But seriously, folks, eight days away in August is hardly cause to call the paramedics.

RegDwight АΑA

To: WhaleOnWheels. From: InternetLover69. Subject: O bro, where art thou?

user19161

Yeah, maybe he got tired of this site.

RegDwight АΑA

@Robusto I'm just making conversation because nobody else is.

Actually I was going to watch me some London 2012. Suck that up, tchrist.

user19161

@RegDwightАΑA I am.

KitFox

tch what is the damn code to set the default value on a dropdown?

punches code

punches self for not having done this in the first place

user19161

19:17

Maybe there is none, hence default.

RegDwight АΑA

@KitFox tch? As in TC Hell?

I only know HTML.

There you just say selected.

user19161

TCC is a really terrible cafe here.

user19161

Starbucks is the best, followed by coffee bean.

RegDwight АΑA

If Starbucks is the best, your place is hell.

But if you drink coffee, you deserve that.

Kind of like every country gets the government it deserves.

user19161

Well, I just like the decor of Starbucks.

RegDwight АΑA

19:19

Smokers get tobacco companies, junkies get dealers, and coffee drinkers get Starbucks.

tchrist

@RegDwightАΑA Those who do not refer to it as Moat Sursilvania–Sutsilvania.

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA Or, if you are using XHTML, selected="selected".

RegDwight АΑA

@Robusto I figured Kit would figure.

KitFox

OK, I gotta go concentrate on this for a bit. Laters!

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA Automobiles have dealers too.

tchrist

19:20

@KitFox You mean on a popup?

RegDwight АΑA

@Robusto my point. Thank you.

KitFox

@tchrist No, an ASP ddl. I probably need to do it in the code behind, but I thought I might shortcut it.

RegDwight АΑA

ASP ddl (artist's impression)

Pictured from left to right: ddl, ASP (not pictured)

user19161

@RegDwightАΑA This is very cute.

KitFox

shakes head slowly

RegDwight АΑA

19:22

@KitFox shake faster. You're a mod now. You may.

KitFox

I. Really. Must. Go.

Back later!

tchrist

Poor thing.

Cavorting with the Evil One.

RegDwight АΑA

He's very rich.

tchrist

On the blood of infants.

RegDwight АΑA

Diddl

Diddl is a cartoon character created by German artist Thomas Goletz in 1990. Diddl is a white 'Jumping Mouse', with big ears and large pink-soled feet In Austria, Diddl was a highly popular cartoon character, together with its host of characters. Diddl range Diddl has many friends and relatives, including a girlfriend called Diddlina who is also a Jumping Mouse. Their friends include Mimihopps (a fox rabbit); 'Pimboli' (a Knautschanien cuddle-teddy bear); Ackaturbo (a fire-tailed mini-raven); Bibombl (a bobbletail setter); Milimits (a tigertail kitten); Tiplitaps (a changing-shell turtle...

Stupid English article has no info.

tchrist

19:24

Rearing kids now, Reg?

RegDwight АΑA

Now? Kids? Reg?

But yeah, rearing.

Anyway, Ima visit London by means of booby box. BBL

tchrist

The Jesuits say to let them rear a child for seven years, and he’s theirs for life.

ΜετάEd

@tchrist I was acquainted with a Jesuit who was atheist because of his Jesuit education. Seems they taught him how to think critically.

tchrist

And walk funny.

ΜετάEd

@tchrist No, now there's the difference between teaching and learning.

Teaching is to paddling as learning is to walking funny.

user19161

19:30

Time for a burger.

tchrist

wonders whether edit-log messages ever get censored

ΜετάEd

@tchrist I suppose a person could flag one as offensive.

tchrist

Can edit-log message be themselves edited, then?

And if so, how would you log it? :)

ΜετάEd

@tchrist That's mod terroritory.

Mitch

19:54

@tchrist elocutionarily challenged as much as most people.

in other news:

So, are you saying that blacks are not suitable for working as entrepreneurs and the people see them as not equal in USA? — Derfder 47 mins ago

ΜετάEd

-1

Q: Where my employers/professionals at?

I want to use something like this in a cartoon, animated banner advertisement: Where my employers at? or Where my entrepreneurs at? Are there connotations of the phrase I should consider, for example is it too slangy or is its use too closely linked with hip hop culture to be accepta...

word-choice

RegDwight АΑA

Oh come on now.

Mitch

exactly!

ΜετάEd

This question is not constructive. It asks for opinion.

RegDwight АΑA

Paraphrasing Dexter, I should have killed it when I had the chance.

Instead Matt tried to be all nice and turn it into something useful.

Fat lot of good is it doing us.

Meanwhile elsewhere, a stab at @Rob.

0

A: Ambiguity in "free shipping of the product"

Write: "Product and shipping are free." It is redundant to say "Product and shipping are BOTH free."

How dore you write redundantly, Robusto? I'm asking you?

Off to London again. BBL

Robusto

20:01

@RegDwightАΑA Well, without that both ambiguity starts to creep back in. I was trying to put a belt and suspenders on this one. And in six words! May we all be so pithy.

user19161

@RegDwightАΑA You can travel so quickly? Give me a time machine. I want to go back to the past to change my life.

Cerberus

Was this Carlo?

KitFox

Hey @tchrist.

@tchrist: Game over! I've deleted all my comments, because it's not obvious to me they add anything to my answer. You might consider doing the same. — FumbleFingers 8 hours ago

user19161

@Cerberus No, you are late to the party.

user19161

@KitFox Erm, you are also late to the party.

KitFox

20:05

@tchrist This isn't what I wanted to happen, but do you want to delete some of your comments?

Cerberus

@JasperLoy Who, then?

user19161

@Cerberus We are all trying to divine this mystery.

Matt Эллен

zed, it's pronounced zed!

user19161

@MattЭллен Where?

Matt Эллен

in the UK

tchrist

20:08

@KitFox Why? He’s still lastwording: go look again.

Cerberus

Ah, doorbell.

Bye!

tchrist

Hi Mom!

Wait.

Matt Эллен

CU

KitFox

@tchrist Can you move the thread to a chat room if you comment again?

tchrist

Cerberi Mom rings the doorbell?

@KitFox I have no intention of commenting again.

KitFox

20:09

But I can't move the comments.

tchrist

Which allows me to say yes to your request with a clean conscience.

Wait.

Are you asking me to move them?

KitFox

I suppose I could comment spam until it gives me the option.

tchrist

I’d rather not dirty my hands again. He’s annoying.

KitFox

I understand.

I would rather move it to a chat room than delete it outright.

tchrist

There are one or two of mine that are meta, and so don’t really belong, but damn he just keeps on going. He learned nothing.

user19161

20:10

Well, FF is a nice old guy, be more tolerant.

KitFox

He's crotchety.

tchrist

But not an old nice guy.

Unfortunately.

user19161

Well, he has his eccentricities of course, as do all of us.

KitFox

Let me read through them again.

tchrist

Frontal lobe shrinkage occurs in the human male as he ages. Makes them ornery. Does not seem to afflict females.

There are some that I can remove. But most of my points are sound.

I’ll pluck some superfluous cherries from the tree.

user19161

20:12

@tchrist Well well whether it shrinks or not I do not know, but hey mind over matter.

Robusto

@tchrist I hate people who say shit like that! Get off my frickin' lawn. Now, youngster!

user19161

Since I have no lawn, I will say...
Get off my laundry!

KitFox

@tchrist I deleted a few of the more personal and obvious type. I stopped short of removing all of the superfluous commentary, so long as it wasn't heated.

tchrist

I was working on it.

KitFox

I left some of the spicier stuff that had relevance.

tchrist

20:19

That is the problem.

KitFox

No offense.

user19161

@KitFox Hehe.

tchrist

I can't edit a comment to remove the offtopic bits, nor do I wish to lose the ontopic bits.

user19161

We all like some spice don't we?

KitFox

@tchrist I think I can. Would you like me to try?

tchrist

20:20

Questioning the validity of the anvilling n-gram seems worth keeping.

Yes, you may.

And can.

Right now he’s just in kvetch mode because of all his many downvotes on that question.

I’m half-surprised he doesn’t just delete the answer.

ΜετάEd

Which question.

tchrist

Or fix it.

-2

A: How can I use “fête” as a verb in active voice?

My advice is to stick with the passive voice. As this NGram shows, that's what most people do... And here are just half-a-dozen instances of "I feted him" in the entire corpus of Google Books. You can get away with passive voice, or non-specific subject (they, the people, etc.), but in general...

Robusto

@tchrist He doesn't give up on an answer just because it's horrible.

tchrist

I’ve got tons of counter-examples to his position taken from the pages of the Economist from the last 3 years only.

I just don’t feel like dealing with him. He will never change his mind, and he will never concede he was wrong. And he will never relent.

Robusto

@tchrist Check out the dudgeon he brought to my Python question:

49

Q: Is Python a snake or a programming language? If the latter, why is it choking my dog?

We've been getting a rash of questions asking, essentially, what a programmer should name methods or properties. One such was a request for a word that meant both "add" and "remove" because the programmer wanted to have a method that could add or remove an element. Does this really fall under E...

discussion on-topic-off-topic appropriate-questions

tchrist

20:23

Why why why do I have a million thunks when nothing every changes?

RegDwight АΑA

Give up the re for lent.

KitFox

@tchrist Because I'm pinging you?

tchrist

Oh!

RegDwight АΑA

@KitFox no, I am pinging you.

Robusto

@KitFox Sorry, read that as pimping. I think my interpretation is better.

tchrist

20:24

I missed it.

Just a sec.

KitFox

@RegDwightАΑA Oh. Am I being naughty?

RegDwight АΑA

Dunno, r u?

ΜετάEd

@tchrist Oh, Christ.

Robusto

I do think she is pimping tchrist. He is a naughty, naughty boy. I just hope he's a good earner for Kit.

tchrist

@Robusto That’s obscene.

RegDwight АΑA

20:26

That's the best scene.

Robusto

It's where I first gave up on trying to have the last word with him.

RegDwight АΑA

May 23 '11 at 13:56, by Robusto

That's another "czar" tactic: declare victory and pull out.

Try that one.

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA I win! Thanks, you've been great. CU later!

Hey, it worked.

But I'm still here.

So clearly you failed.

RegDwight АΑA

No it didn't. No you aren't. No I didn't.

I can post an Ngram.

Or an Npound for our imperial overlords.

Robusto

Post an NMetricTonne for all I care.

user19161

20:31

@Robusto I always remember this question. I hope your dog is OK if it is a real dog.

user19161

I also hope the python is OK.

Robusto

@JasperLoy I only feed my snakes fake dogs. What kind of a monster do you think I am?

RegDwight АΑA

A fake monster.

tchrist

Python unsettles me as well.

ΜετάEd

@tchrist That is just too damned much comment.

RegDwight АΑA

20:32

Let's unsettle for brainfuck.

ΜετάEd

That's so much comment that it's uncountable.

user19161

I think humans are worse than animals. At least animals do not manipulate their own kind, mostly.

RegDwight АΑA

@ΜετάEd It's OVER 9000 comment. There, counted. And in fewer than not much time.

tchrist

@ΜετάEd It’s nothing compared with @Robusto’s metaposting disaster.

RegDwight АΑA

Per aspera ad disastra.

Robusto

20:33

@JasperLoy WTF? Are you kidding? Animals eat other animals while they're still alive, or give them parasites, or horrible diseases. What kind of namby-pamby, tree-hugging universe do you think you live in? Bambi is out there with a full set of fangs, ready to rip out your throat and shove it down your neck.

tchrist

You know, FF has a lot of buttons one can press. Maybe one of them’s a coin-release.

RegDwight АΑA

@Robusto Bambi is a cartoon, Rob.

Robusto

No. I looked.

tchrist

contemplates the plural neuterness of naughty stars

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA That's the Disney version. Check her out in the Rob Zombie version.

RegDwight АΑA

20:34

The Bridge

General Arqade Chat. We tried to leave once, but the door lock...

6

1

Go there and type "insert coin"

rsegal

what are the format tags for a strikethrough?

Matt Эллен

---strike through--- ~~strike through~~

RegDwight АΑA

@rsegal three hyphens.

user19161

Most humans are so evil that I don't think they will be humans in their next life. They will descend to the lower realms.

RegDwight АΑA

There is no next life. Most people don't even have a life in this life.

tchrist

20:35

@RegDwightАΑA Won’t that annoy the natives?

Robusto

See?

user19161

Life is a bitch and then you die.

RegDwight АΑA

@Robusto shopped.

Matt Эллен

this is who we've elected as mod?

user19161

@Robusto Geezis.

Robusto

20:36

@RegDwightАΑA No, but you can shop for the shirt. spreadshirt.com/…

RegDwight АΑA

@tchrist they are used to it. In fact, not many people still do it these days.

And it certainly will annoy them less than if you post some other shit.

@Robusto that's what I meant. Thanks for explaining the joke.

ΜετάEd

I earned Electorate.

RegDwight АΑA

Hooray.

user19161

@ΜετάEd I got that over 9000 years ago.

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA It's hard to know what you mean. Your words are like Javascript variables, weakly typed. They could mean anything.

tchrist

20:38

@Robusto I have a smashing idea for a new fumblegame: we can see how many downvotes an answer of his can get before he finally deletes it on his own. 😈

Matt Эллен

@ΜετάEd congrats

ΜετάEd

@rsegal or <strike> </strike>

rsegal

@RegDwightАΑA thanks!

Robusto

@tchrist Or just see how long a comment chain we can make with him. Longest wins, as always.

tchrist

@Robusto No, they’re like Perl typeglobs, many out of one.

Already did that.

rsegal

20:38

@ΜετάEd Thanks!

RegDwight АΑA

@Matt I has took all thanks on your behalf.

ΜετάEd

I want more gold medals than an Olympic swimmer.

Matt Эллен

@RegDwightАΑA Well, UK is still doing well in the Olympics, so I don't mind so much

RegDwight АΑA

@ΜετάEd you already have more than German Olympic swimmers.

ΜετάEd

@RegDwightАΑA ouch

user19161

20:40

@ΜετάEd They sell those at the toy store.

tchrist

@MattЭллен Home team advantage. Doesn’t count.

Matt Эллен

@tchrist ha! does too.

RegDwight АΑA

Where's Cerberus? Tried to bait him with faux Dutch, he must of fell over at the horrible sight.

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA His mother or grandmother was coming, and he had to go to the door.

tchrist

kicks the proffered behind

RegDwight АΑA

20:41

@Robusto that was three hours ago. His apartment isn't that large.

user19161

@tchrist I have a feeling you are going to be a regular in this chat.

tchrist

@RegDwightАΑA Pathhouses take a long time to traverse.

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA Maybe he fell through a portal into another dimension. That happens all the time in Amsterdam, IIRC.

RegDwight АΑA

It's Dutchland. My sock drawer is bigger than all of everything of theirs combined.

That includes all dimensions, and more.

user19161

I am surprised The Penthouse is still alive.

RegDwight АΑA

20:43

Where's Meysam BTW?

user19161

He is in this world.

RegDwight АΑA

I am waiting for the next issue.

user19161

Go to Amazon then.

ΜετάEd

@tchrist Who's proffering behind? How come none is being proffered in my direction?

RegDwight АΑA

5

Q: Origin of "do not argue with idiots"

What is the origin of the phrase do not argue with idiots? Please cite some credible references. From googling around, I found these three variations. One came from the bible but I couldn't find any credible source for the other two. Don't argue with idiots because they will drag you down to th...

etymology phrases expressions quotes proverbs

Wow this still exists.

user19161

20:45

@RegDwightАΑA Wow, she might be my neighbour.

tchrist

’Tis no mean feat for a clever man to feign being a dolt. It’s the opposite scenario that garners praise.

waits

RegDwight АΑA

Some question titles are just funny. "Is there a better word than 'colorizable'?" — Why sure — amarantine; tomorrow; Putin. To name but a few.

user19161

Do not argue with idiots is false. All men are idiots is true.

RegDwight АΑA

@JasperLoy do not extrapolate from yourself to everybody.

user19161

@RegDwightАΑA You deserve a thwack for that.

RegDwight АΑA

20:49

I do not.

tchrist

@RegDwightАΑA You forgot an a.

RegDwight АΑA

QED

Robusto

Jasper is a generalization. He's not a real person, but a collection of entities, averaged over thousands of comments.

RegDwight АΑA

@tchrist and you forgot [sic] an b.

Matt Эллен

youb

user19161

20:50

@Robusto True. The self is a collection of impermanent elements dependent on other objects in the universe.

RegDwight АΑA

Tony Youb is a great actor.

Matt Эллен

so says youb

Robusto

Gotta motor. Laterz.

user19161

I cried over dinner just now. I was thinking about the stupidity and evil of mankind.

Matt Эллен

cya Robusto

KitFox

20:51

@Robusto What's all this then?

user19161

@Robusto I hope you got six packs from yesterday's PT!

ΜετάEd

@JasperLoy Well mu effin' mu.

KitFox

OK. Later peeps.

Matt Эллен

Cya

RegDwight АΑA

0

Q: How to avoid using the subject of a sentence using more than necessary

My English grammar is rusty and I have not kept up with grammar rules. So, please bear with me, while I struggled to frame the title of my question. What I want accomplished is a paragraph that is short, sweet and one that does not confuse the reader with repetitive detail. I get the feeling that...

orthography

The title is hilarious.

Writers?

tchrist

21:05

Ever wonder what to do about sentences without subject? Trying to find a good home for them? Send them off to Writers! Can’t beat that one with a stick. Right?

The tag is hilarious.

RegDwight АΑA

I think that's auto-replacion at work.

tchrist

If you call that work.

RegDwight АΑA

It certainly ain't at leisure from where I'm looking.

tchrist

Yeah, it’s easy to miss the orthoroentgenographically tag. Happens to me all the time.

user19161

@RegDwightАΑA I don't think they want it. Anyway I am not sure what his paragraph really means.

RegDwight АΑA

21:09

@tchrist Actually that one is so huge it's really hard to miss unless you back off like a mile.

tchrist

Perhaps he’s in Europe.

RegDwight АΑA

@JasperLoy yeah I pinged some random people in their chat just because I can.

user19161

@RegDwightАΑA I actually want to answer it but I can't when I don't understand his intentions.

tchrist

I don’t make this crap up, you know: A technique for producing radiographs showing the exact sizes of organs or bones by using a narrow beam of X rays perpendicular to the plate or film. Hence orthoˈroentgenogram, a radiograph produced by orthoroentgenography; ˌorthoroentgenoˈgraphic a., (done by means) of orthoroentgenography.

RegDwight АΑA

@tchrist you had me at crap.

@JasperLoy happens. Ask for clarification. Someone will have to comment anyway.

tchrist

21:12

Well, wipe yourself when you’re done and come back to the room without paper dangling from your butt.

RegDwight АΑA

Too many orders, too few sense. I not comply.

You haven't even inserted the coin yet.

tchrist

Hm, if I had you at crap, maybe I’m the one who needs his packaging cleansed.

RegDwight АΑA

3

Q: Cleanse vs Clean

Do you know what is the difference between Cleanse and Clean? I don't have a clear idea of when to use one or the other as verbs or nouns, or if there is some key difference I'm not aware of.

differences word-usage

tchrist

déjà lu

RegDwight АΑA

Everything is déjà lu round these parts. Especially if it concerns butts.

ΜετάEd

21:15

Or buttrices.

tchrist

ponders the coin-operated sexcomp that the god Horas availed himself of in Creatures of Light and Darkness

looks for Reg’s coin-slot

awaits the Delphic pronouncements he’s just now paid for

user19161

Answered. Hope he likes it.

user19161

0

A: How to avoid using the subject of a sentence more than necessary

Use a phrase or sentence that defines the system to start building it. For example, This system models a two-dimensional heat diffusion experiment.

Matt Эллен

@RegDwightАΑA it's still general reference. blargh

user19161

@RegDwightАΑA I think there is some subtlety involved.

RegDwight АΑA

21:18

Jeez. The scifi room is illegible.

chat.stackexchange.com/rooms/198/mos-eisley

Matt Эллен

I like white on nearly white. it's futurific

RegDwight АΑA

But white on white while the rest is pitch black? I need my eyes tomorrow, thank you.

tchrist

The human mind is a contrast detector.

They’re mentally camoued.

RegDwight АΑA

More like a pattern detector.

Matt Эллен

Yes, that's the funnest bit. then you get to have cyborg eyes implanted, so that you read the screen from IR alone

tchrist

21:20

wonders how to detect patterns without contrast

RegDwight АΑA

Looking for patterns where none exist and giving sense to patterns that don't have any.

tchrist

It’s a pattern fabulator.

RegDwight АΑA

How most very fabulatorous.

ΜετάEd

@RegDwightАΑA It's Mos Eisley. That's simulated tobacco smoke. You're supposed to have trouble reading in a bar.

Matt Эллен

especially if you're drunk and being shot at

user19161

21:28

Yay, I got 25 rep!

Matt Эллен

Jul 27 '11 at 14:06, by Matt Ellen

yay!

user19161

I am cheap these days.

Matt Эллен

I'm not sure if I can succeed, but I think I'll try for 100 reps a day.

from Saturday

user19161

@MattЭллен Are you planning to get 20k this year?

Matt Эллен

nah, I just want to get to the top of the leader board for one week

user19161

21:35

0

Q: Shifter's Bay or Shifters Bay?

I am struggling with the meaning of and the difference between Shifter's Bay and Shifters Bay (don't pay attention to what a shifter is or could be). As I understand it Shifter's Bay is a bay belonging to a Shifter and Shifters Bay is a bay with, of or/and for Shifters. Is this correct? Maybe ...

meaning

user19161

LOL

Mitch

21:48

1 - it's fun
2- it's considered off topic given the meta question:

6

Q: Are "who first said"-questions on-topic?

Is it on-topic to ask on English language & Usage: Who first said [insert quote]?

discussion on-topic-off-topic

so are you encouraging closing?

RegDwight АΑA

I don't see it going anywhere. That piece of advice predates the English language, and who knows, perhaps even PIE.

Matt Эллен

but who first translated it into proto English?

tchrist

@MattЭллен Leader board?

Matt Эллен

@tchrist this one

well, not the one for this week, but for a week

Mitch

@JasperLoy what's with the tolerance? I don't think you're using that word the way tohers expect. Kvetching isn't intolerance, it's being annoyed. Intolerance is not accepting others, also being prejudicial. Nobody for whom you've thrown the 'tolerance' word at has been intolerant.

tchrist

21:58

@MattЭллен Huh. It’s like winning a sweepstake somebody else entered you in.

Matt Эллен

@tchrist so's everything

user19161

@Mitch Well, be tolerant of my alternative definition of tolerance.

Mitch

@MattЭллен Ha! I went there and was so proud I was at the top...until I noticed my # was much greater than #1.

The Bridge

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