English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Cerberus

01:35

Ack, I messed up my phone.

MετάEd

@Cerberus The physics of that is amazing.

Cerberus

Absolutely!

MετάEd

02:06

I see Derf vomited all over chat also. Thankfully, that was just after I left.

Cerberus

02:34

Yeah.

tchrist

04:12

@Cerberus Er, no: metric is the foreign French imposition.

Cerberus

@tchrist Wasn't the Imperial system established by the Normans and their descendants?

It is of course partly based on older (and pan-European) systems, but...

tchrist

Oh, I don’t know. It seems English now, and metrique seems French. That’s why the Americans are nonplussed on it.

All our science is in SI, but our street signs are not.

Cerberus

Well, that's what he meant.

@tchrist Gosh, I had noooo idea.

Thanks for informing me.

tchrist

Honest, all scientists work only in SI here.

It’s considered the “scientific” system; it’s very like diglossia. But think of a corresponding term.

Cerberus

I had no idea. This is all new to me.

tchrist

04:17

Are you facetious?

It really is like a home-language vs a common-language.

I think you’re pulling my tail.

Cerberus

Speaking of which, in my country, instead of SI, the basic unit of distance in science is the Average Penislength.

What language is this?

Spanish?

tchrist

04:33

Yes, it is Spanish.

Pantalla is “screen”.

Cerberus

Right, I thought so.

tchrist

Average penis-length. Who counts that up?

I’m going to be bed and leaving the computer in the hands of somebody else. If he chats you up for a date, it isn’t my fault.

Cerberus

Yay!

Who is it?

MετάEd

05:26

Okay, everybody stop.

Caprica Six

HAMMERTIME!

MετάEd

wtf.

Cerberus

Very nice.

Now which answer shall I down-vote, this one or that...

Johan Larsson

07:15

@Robusto one idea for your revolution, make all politicians correspondence public. That could probably end some of the lobbyism bs. Not very realistic but very what you sow so shall you reap

O0oO0oOO0ooO

Haha

Japan sucks at English

WORST in Asia

RegDwighт

09:53

@O0oO0oOO0ooO But also in the top 5 of the most rapidly improving.

Not to mention you don't want to see the figures for how much the US sucks at Japanese.

KitFox

10:38

@JohanLarsson Lobbyists are required to report their activity. People just don't read it.

O0oO0oOO0ooO

Heh, I guess that is true but I think Japanese think their language is superior to English so they are not interested in learning English more passionately

Johan Larsson

@KitFox ok already covered then

KitFox

Well, there is something to be said for your idea.

But then they'd end up using gmail to avoid the official correspondence.

Johan Larsson

yes tchrist pretty much nailed it with 'There is no hope' I think.

Robusto

11:51

@O0oO0oOO0ooO Everybody thinks their mother tongue is superior to all others. Well, except for classical scholars and other outliers.

Mitch

12:02

@O0oO0oOO0ooO Wait ... Is that North Korea that is almost as good as South Korea?

O0oO0oOO0ooO

I think in North Korea, only selected people take those English exams, I assume it should be around 10 ~ 20 people, so their average score seems like not bad.

Robusto

Don't forget, they have amazing scores. Kim Jong Un shot a 27 for 18 holes of golf, IIRC.

O0oO0oOO0ooO

lol

Robusto

One wonders why he didn't shoot an 18.

KitFox

Then it would seem bogus.

Or not bogey-ed

O0oO0oOO0ooO

12:08

There is a rumour that Little Kim thought Denis Roddman was Barrack Obama

Robusto

So the extra 9 strokes were an effort to add authenticity?

KitFox

Yes. I imagine.

Nine extra strokes ought to get him there.

Speaking of, are you enjoying your new fridge?

RegDwighт

Fridge over troubled water.

KitFox

> The page cannot be displayed because an internal server error has occurred.

Uh, what?

RegDwighт

I think they are telling you that the page cannot be displayed because an internal server error has occurred.

KitFox

12:14

Oh. Fixed it.

I was a little overzealous with the Enabled="false".

I guess I wanted to make sure that sucker was shut off.

RegDwighт

Yes, never use Enabled="false", always use SpecialNeeds="true".

KitFox

SpEd="very"

Oh, now I feel evil and dirty.

RegDwighт

KitFox

That looks like the cover for Garbage Version 2.0. Except for the part where it says "VERY Pet Shop Boys."

RegDwighт

You win this round of "spot the difference".

Now tell me how a dromedar is different from Radiator Springs.

MετάEd

12:22

Mornin.

RegDwighт

►

Robusto

@KitFox Just fine. Can't wait till the counters are installed so the plumber can hook up the water supply.

RegDwighт

The other week a plumber hooked up the water supply in our apartment in Moscow such that two stories below us found themselves entirely underwater.

KitFox

I guess that's how they do things in Moscow.

tchrist

Today we start paying a dime per bag at grocery stores, convenience store, department stores, etc.

RegDwighт

12:31

@KitFox Indeed, they turned the biggest cathedral into the biggest open-air swimming pool once.

tchrist

Dime bags have always been popular in Boulder, but gosh!

KitFox

@tchrist They were going to do that here too. Haven't yet though.

tchrist

@RegDwighт St Peter's is in Moscow now?

RegDwighт

Before.

After.

tchrist

Hm.

They demolished a cathedral? Really? When? Which one? What was its name? Why?

RegDwighт

12:33

Jun 14 at 11:07, by RegDwighт

tchrist

Oh.

RegDwighт

Jun 14 at 11:30, by RegDwighт

Cathedral of Christ the Saviour

The Cathedral of Christ the Saviour (, Khram Khrista Spasitelya) is a cathedral in Moscow, Russia, on the northern bank of the Moskva River, a few blocks southwest of the Kremlin. With an overall height of , it is the tallest Orthodox Christian church in the world. Design When Napoleon Bonaparte retreated from Moscow, Emperor Alexander I signed a manifest, 25 December 1812, declaring his intention to build a cathedral in honor of Christ the Saviour "to signify Our gratitude to Divine Providence for saving Russia from the doom that overshadowed Her" and as a memorial to the sacrifices ...

Jez

Hi guys, wonder if you could help me think up some terminology.

KitFox

Well, obviously they needed a pool more than God.

tchrist

That is tragic.

Jez

12:35

I'm designing a system where there will be a live authoritative DB, and a kind of satellite DB which gets updated from the live one

tchrist

But um, how could they have rebuilt it already?

Jez

however, between updates from live, the satellite DB will itself be updated

tchrist

Doesn't it take like a century or more to build a cathedral?

Jez

when the satellite DB is to be updated from live, it is first restored to the last version of live it was updated to before any changes were made

i'm wondering what to call these snapshots. my best thoughts so far are "base" and "flux"

"flux" for the version with the changes made to the satellite DB before it's restored to the latest live, and "base" for the version it's rewound to before being synchronized with the latest live

tchrist

Sounds like a daily incremental.

Jez

12:36

but i'm not sure about "flux"

tchrist

No, don't use flux.

KitFox

So you would lose all the changes in the satellite DB?

Jez

yes.

well

apart from this "flux" backup i make first

before blitzing and going back to live

KitFox

What is the satellite for?

Jez

i guess you could call it "out of sync" but that makes it sound like an error; it's by design that it goes out of sync for a while

it's a computer we take around to places and carry out assessments with, offline. we can only do periodic updates from and to the live DB

assessments can also however be taken directly on live

thru the internet

tchrist

12:38

Sagrada Família was begun in 1882 and still is not done yet.

KitFox

But you erase the information? I guess that's not important for naming.

I think "base" is suitable for the restored version.

Jez

well some of the information (that which we need) is dumped to XML before the satellite DB is restored to live

but i want to keep backups of the whole pre-restored satellite DB around just in case

KitFox

"Flux" is a nice word, but I don't think it adequately describes what it is.

Jez

i can't really think of a better word though

the directory structure would be like so:

KitFox

You want something like "branch" or "spur."

Jez

12:40

...\DBsnapshots\datetime-base.bak

...\DBsnapshots\datetime-flux.bak

KitFox

It includes the base and then some extra stuff.

Jez

yeah i thought of "branch"... sounds a bit too much like source control

KitFox

Yeah, but it gets the point across.

Jez

i spose.

KitFox

Flux sounds like it changes.

Jez

12:41

or has changed

KitFox

Or might change.

Jez

delta? hmm.

KitFox

Delta is good.

It tells you that it has changed. Sounds like it is just the changed parts though.

Jez

"the delta from the base DB that was around on this date"

KitFox

I like that. I think it would work.

> Football 101 for Women

Hahaha.

Jez

12:43

so delta or branch?

KitFox

I just got this in my inbox. A football appreciation class.

@Jez I think delta.

Jez

US or UK football?

KitFox

US.

Jez

ah, that's to me like cricket is to you

KitFox

It's the "for women" that's making me giggle.

Because men are expected to know it or have the decency to never admit that they don't.

Jez

12:44

i read an article online that said US football is really quite intellectual and complex. i'm not buying it

needlessly complex, maybe

KitFox

It is interesting.

Jez

and yeah i'll admit that cricket is needlessly complex

KitFox

Cricket is a total mystery to me.

Jez

it's not interesting. they have 5 seconds of play and then stand around for ages

and i'm guessing a ton of ads too on US TV

KitFox

I used to feel that way until I understood the game better.

It's really boring if you don't get what's going on.

Same thing with baseball.

Jez

12:46

cricket isn't that hard to understand. 3 ways of getting runs: run to the other crease, hit the ball beyond the boundary, and hit the ball beyond the boundary without its touching the floor

KitFox

What?

Jez

4 main ways to get out: caught, run out, bowled, or leg before wicket

what what?

KitFox

None of that means anything to me.

Jez

why not?

it's english words

tchrist

Because they aren't baseball words.

Jez

12:48

"ball" is

KitFox

I don't know what the crease, the boundary, the floor, or any of those terms mean in that context.

The crease is a hockey term.

Jez

oh come on, the floor??

KitFox

The ground?

Jez

yes

KitFox

Why the floor?

Jez

12:48

coz i should've said the ground

KitFox

Oh. Well.

Jez

the boundary is a circular area around the center, where the batters are, which is demarcated with a big white rope

KitFox

But I've never so much as seen cricket played, so all I know is that you have flat bats and a ball and a three stick wicket or something.

The batters are in the center?

Jez

that's why i find that episode of family guy funny where the commentator goes "he's hit the ball out of the stadium. is that good? we don't know but it's what we do!"

anyone who knows anything about cricket knows full well it's good :-P

yes

KitFox

I figure I'll learn about it someday.

When I move to the UK.

Jez

12:52

6 runs for hitting it beyond without touching the ground, 4 when it touches, and 1 run for a regular run (i'm guessing they called them runs at first and then figured out what to do when it went beyond the boundary later, but by that time they'd decided to call all points "runs")

Matt Эллен

maybe if you're looking for something to do on a hot afternoon in India

Jez

the thing about cricket isn't that it's hard to understand. it's just somewhat boring.

US football is both hard to understand and boring

Matt Эллен

indeed

KitFox

What's hard to understand about football?

Jez

hence (i'm guessing) the cheerleaders, and the endless snacking food

US football? everything. like why the play for 5 seconds then stop

Caprica Six

12:53

HAMMERTIME!

Jez

who is allowed to be in what position

who can pass to whom

Matt Эллен

I think bowling in cricket can be quite interesting. That's where the majority of tactics are

KitFox

You have four tries to move the ball 10 yards.

Jez

how can an intercept happen?

@MattЭллен what, pace or spin. big wow.

KitFox

You have to pass either laterally or forward, unless you are the quarterback.

Jez

12:54

@KitFox how is laterally judged?

yeah see, "unless you are the quarterback" is the kind of esoteric rule that makes it hard to understand

KitFox

@Jez By the refs.

Jez

ok, that sounds similar to rugby

Matt Эллен

@Jez there are many ways to put pace and spin on the ball. Also, each successive bowl will affect the rest, because of how you are playing to the batter

KitFox

@Jez How is that esoteric? The QB is the commander. Of course he's got special rules.

Jez

well i don't frigging know. and it's not obvious from his name. why should a "quarter back" be the commander?

why not the "main man" or something

KitFox

12:56

I dunno. If you watch the game though, it's obvious.

Matt Эллен

quite. I assumed the QB was like the scrum half. shorter

KitFox

QB receives the ball on the hike and calls the plays.

Jez

hike?

KitFox

He's in control of the offensive plays.

Jez

play?

Matt Эллен

12:57

@Jez like MacBeth and Hamlet

Jez

more terminology there than cricket, already

KitFox

Yeah. Each play starts with a hike (or a kick).

Where the somebody or other hikes (tosses) the ball from the line of scrimmage to the QB.

Jez

TBH i think what puts me off US football the most is the commercialization

ads, ads, fucking ads

KitFox

Or sometimes they run it.

Jez

forget that

KitFox

12:58

There is a lot of strategy in the game. You just need to know what you are looking at to understand it.

Jez

all sport is commercialized, but with US football they have an ad break opportunity every 5 seconds. at least with UK football, they HAVE to keep showing a solid 45 minutes :-)

RegDwighт

@KitFox I can never tell who the quarterback is.

Matt Эллен

You've got to admit that hike is more transparent than silly mid off

RegDwighт

"Obvious" and "American football" do not mix, sorry.

KitFox

@RegDwighт He's the one wearing very little padding and holding the ball.

Jez

12:59

@MattЭллен silly mid off isn't needed to fundamentally understand the game

Matt Эллен

@Jez true

KitFox

What is a silly mid off?

RegDwighт

@KitFox come on. You know that the QB is not the only one holding the ball. In fact most of the time it is not the QB who's holding the ball.

KitFox

And you don't need to know hike either.

Matt Эллен

@KitFox I do not know. Some fielding position

Jez

13:00

@KitFox the position a fielder stands very close to the batsman's off-side in order to try to catch the ball

KitFox

@RegDwighт OK, well, he's the one throwing the ball.

Jez

it's silly because the ball might slam into his face

or other parts

KitFox

What's the off-side?

tchrist

@KitFox That would be the pitcher.

Jez

i believe it's the side of the bat that's kind of.... "not forward"

RegDwighт

13:01

See. Even Americans don't get American football. And we haven't even touched on baseball yet.

tchrist

@Jez That would be the catcher.

KitFox

@Jez So behind him then?

Jez

so if you're trying to hit the ball forward and to the left, "off" is if the ball hits the side of the bat and goes to the right

KitFox

Oh right. Batter is in the middle.

Jez

can't remember whether silly mid off is behind. i've got a feeling it's in front, that's why it's silly

tchrist

13:02

That's the short stop.

Caprica Six

HAMMERTIME!

KitFox

@Caprica Chill, sweetie.

RegDwighт

Anyway. American football is boring because it's three seconds of gameplay then three minutes of commercials, and baseball is boring because it's baseball.

Jez

@RegDwighт and because there's 3 seconds of gameplay then 3 mins of commercials :-)

KitFox

Baseball isn't as bad as football for the commercial breaks.

Jez

13:03

@KitFox ooh i've got one: why it's called football.

tchrist

@RegDwighт Football has 12 games per season; baseball has 162 games per season. Which one is the real game? No contest, mate.

Jez

dictionary example: WTF are you doing kicking that football?

KitFox

Anyway, I like them both.

RegDwighт

@tchrist I wish I had a nickel for every time a die-hard American baseball fan sheepishly admitted that baseball is only fun to watch when you're drunk in a company of drunk friends.

I would literally be buying up the LEGO company now.

tchrist

@RegDwighт No, that's a strip-tease show.

Matt Эллен

13:07

@tchrist I dunno. I think it's true of all activities except reading. And even then, reading a Dan Brown book is much better with drunk friends.

KitFox

Strip-tease is more fun when high.

tchrist

@KitFox For which side?

RegDwighт

Earlier today I overheard that Dan Brown wrote Dante's Inferno.

Matt Эллен

lol

KitFox

@tchrist Both.

tchrist

13:08

@RegDwighт And did Inferno answer him?

Mitch

@tchrist notes new advertising real estate

RegDwighт

@MattЭллен no lol, he literally did that. A dumbed-down version for the masses. They will call it the prequel.

Mitch

@RegDwighт He's also buried in Grant's Tomb

RegDwighт

Inferno (Dan Brown novel)

Inferno is a 2013 mystery thriller novel by American author Dan Brown and the fourth book in his Robert Langdon series, following Angels & Demons, The Da Vinci Code and The Lost Symbol. The book was released on May 14, 2013 by Doubleday. Plot Harvard University professor Robert Langdon wakes up in a hospital with a head wound and no memory of the last few days. His last memory is walking on the Harvard campus, but he quickly realizes that he is now in Florence. Sienna Brooks, one of the doctors tending to him, tells him he suffered a concussion from being grazed by a bullet, and had st...

Jez

@KitFox in that case you just as well just get high and find someone who actually wants to fuck

RegDwighт

13:09

> he quickly realizes that he is now in Florence

Funniest sentence I read all day.

Matt Эллен

@RegDwighт I'd heard of Inferno. I didn't realise it was about Dante's Inferno

RegDwighт

How the heck do you go about quickly realizing that you are now in Florence? That's a honest question.

Mitch

It's a thing people can do.

KitFox

Well, you look around.

Matt Эллен

When you notice her name tag

KitFox

13:10

giggles

RegDwighт

instantrimshot.com

Mitch

It says "Gunga Din"

KitFox

Sienna Brooks. snerkle

Mitch

Is that... a pun?

Jez

Matt/Reg can you think of good names for these snapshots I'm making in my system? scroll up a bit to see the info

Matt Эллен

13:14

You beat me by 43 seconds there @RegDwighт

@Jez I like delta, too

RegDwighт

@Jez previous and current.

Jez

they wouldn't be accurate descriptions

RegDwighт

They would be for the person who is familiar with them.

And for the person who's not familiar with the system, no descriptions would be accurate.

Jez

well so would foo and bar

RegDwighт

Exactly.

Jez

13:16

some would be less perplexing than others

RegDwighт

True, and I do think that "previous" and "current" are less perplexing than "foo" and "bar".

But no matter what you call them, you will have to leave an explanatory comment.

Even if it's just for the future you.

Jez

i wanna be able to get the word in a sentence

"base is the base snapshot which is updated to the latest version of live"

RegDwighт

No objections to base or delta.

The daily WTF.

That's a former Vietcong and a former GI and medic who amputated the Vietcong's arm. 47 years later, they meet again, and the GI brings along the amputated arm as a present.

Matt Эллен

13:32

so he's had some other guy's arm (in a box?) for 47 years. Is that standard medical procedure?

oh, I see the amputee had the arm

KitFox

Is that weird?

RegDwighт

The way I read it, he just had that bag full of souvenirs from Vietnam, and he only opened it after 47 years.

Matt Эллен

it makes sense to keep your own arm

RegDwighт

@MattЭллен no, the doc had the arm. He took it with him to the US.

Which part of "brings along" was confusing?

Matt Эллен

oh

" the GI brings along the amputated arm"

that part

RegDwighт

13:34

I see. Thankfully, I added "as a present".

Matt Эллен

I assumed the GI was the amputee. So the picture has the GI who is an amputee sat on the left, and the medic on the right.

RegDwighт

Matt Эллен

but now you mean the GI is the medic

RegDwighт

@MattЭллен so it was the "former GI and medic" part.

@MattЭллен precisely, I even left out the second article for that exact reason.

"A former GI and medic" as opposed to "a former GI and a medic".

Matt Эллен

article ellipsis is a complicated thing

RegDwighт

13:36

Not if you are Russian.

Matt Эллен

"The minister was a soldier and a medic in WW1"

see, makes little difference

RegDwighт

Thankfully ministers never fight in wars. They only send others.

Matt Эллен

true

RegDwighт

Okay I has fixed sentence.

Or just read it up on Fox News.

Matt Эллен

@RegDwighт thx. I am easily confused.

@RegDwighт fox ewws? I'd rather be confused.

RegDwighт

13:40

That's the top and only link I get.

NSA hacked my Google to only return Fox News.

Matt Эллен

lol

funny because it's true

0

Q: The construction with 'need help' + verb+ing please help to define the type of construction

"I need help taking out an old hard drive" - is this a prepositional-gerundial construction?

I want to suggest how to improve this question, but I don't know how

RegDwighт

Click on "add comment", type "I want to suggest how to improve this question.", then press Enter.

Matt Эллен

such wisdom. It's no wonder you are a giraffe

RegDwighт

I am the giraffe.

Ask the Beatles.

Matt Эллен

only half of them are still alive

RegDwighт

13:45

So their answer will still be 50% correct.

Matt Эллен

OK

KitFox

> Rick Santorum called our victories a "death knell" for marriage, and Gary Bauer warned that the "the militant homosexual movement" is leading America toward a "criminalization of Christianity."

Ah, but they are losing.

Noah

Hello

Do Americans use the word "football" correctly? Because in the rest of the world, football refers to what's known "soccer" in the states.

Matt Эллен

yes! another one for our team

KitFox

Of course we use it correctly.

Matt Эллен

13:59

by that I mean: No. Americans are wrong :D

KitFox

What a silly question.

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English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…