English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

SmokeDetector

12:03 AM

[ SmokeDetector ] All-caps answer: What is it called when comparing two opposite people or things by user151830 on english.stackexchange.com

MετάEd

12:22 AM

@Mitch @KitZ.Fox @Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Okay I have incorporated your comments and suggestions.

user174558

@MετάEd Well done.

MετάEd

Anybody else care to take pot shots at:

6

A: Chat: etiquette?

Etiquette means the rules or norms (written or unwritten) of polite behavior within a social group. There are three significant sources of Stack Exchange chat etiquette, listed in order of highest priority. Norms formally established by Stack Exchange Inc. (the owners). Whenever there is a pote...

Leave comments on the answer if you have suggestions. Thank you!

Kit Z. Fox

rofl the balrog comment. That should go in the chat meme post whenever it makes its appearance.

MετάEd

AIEEE! A CHAT MEME HAS COME!

My work here is done.

Mitch

12:59 AM

@MετάEd Also, you have to work in 'chatiquette'

Kit Z. Fox

1:27 AM

@Mitch Language proficiency is not personal information.

imo

Mitch

@KitZ.Fox well, sorta. it tells you (usually) place of birth. But yes, it's not that specific.

Kit Z. Fox

But yeah, I don't mean to sound inflexible on that point. Languages we don't speak are OK provided that we can monitor whether a person is being abusive or not. If something gets flagged, someone who sees it will need to make a judgement call.

Mitch

my point is that you're telling people that can't say stuff about themselves.

Kit Z. Fox

@Mitch Uh. English doesn't.

@Mitch I think we have different ideas about what "personal information" means.

Mitch

inductively, we've only ever seen people who speak at least english in chat so that point is irrelevant.

Kit Z. Fox

1:30 AM

I'm talking about PII, the kind of thing people cyberstalk to get so they can call you or come to your house and holla at you.

Mitch

@KitZ.Fox you're using it two ways, one for the person and another for other people.

Kit Z. Fox

Not stuff like "I've got two boys" and "I'm a business analyst."

Mitch

@KitZ.Fox that is not clear from the term PI

searches for two boys AND business analyst AND maine

Kit Z. Fox

Personally identifiable information is a legal classification that requires specific audit and safekeeping.

Mitch

stormtroopers dispatched

Kit Z. Fox

1:32 AM

TIL that stormtroopers are equivalent to Marines.

Mitch

Marines are in the movie? Nice!

I thought it was some nazi thing.

SO there's a range of PI some of it PII and some not terribly specific.

Kit Z. Fox

@Mitch Uh no. I mean in terms of branches of service. There's Imperial Navy, Imperial Army, and Stormtrooper Corps.

Mitch

Still I have problems with telling people they cannot give out PII. They totally shouldn't, but I have trouble restricting people that way

Kit Z. Fox

@Mitch Yes.

I don't know for sure if there are legal implications to providing that information in a StackExchange chat room.

Mitch

Bit P I I you want treated the same way for a person and for other people?

Kit Z. Fox

1:35 AM

Yes, if I understand you.

We are legally obligated to not just deleted but completely expunge the user records of anyone who is under the age of 13, for example.

Mitch

then you need to specify more precisely what is PII. (I may be the only one who is confused, but that may be a sign that others have the same problem)

Kit Z. Fox

Yeah, no, I can see that.

Mitch

I feel this is leading to too much constant oversight "Hey, delete that last comment, you mentioned the year you were born"

Kit Z. Fox

What do you call "the most {something}"? It's comparative, superlative, and ... ultimate or something?

Doesn't adding "the" bump it into another category?

Mitch

@KitZ.Fox needs a full real example without variables.

Kit Z. Fox

1:40 AM

0

Q: How do I form a superlative like this?

Is "My prefecture have most rainy days in Japan" right? I mean to say that "The prefecture that I live in is almost every day rainy. There are no other prefecture such a rainy ....."

I changed the title.

I was going to edit it into shape and sent it off to ELL.

Mitch

but superlative = most which is already at the limit, you can't be more than most. what's the word for the pleonasm 'the most unique'?

Kit Z. Fox

Yeah, that's what I'm trying to remember.

Good, better, best, the best.

Mitch

but that example with rain is not...beyond superlative, it's plain old superlative.

Kit Z. Fox

Isn't it? It's "the most rainy days" not "most rainy days".

Maybe I shouldn't send it to ELL.

Mitch

@KitZ.Fox no, it's ELL. it should be 'My town has the most rainy days of any town in Japan'. 'the most'

it's ap plain old superlative

a plain

Kit Z. Fox

1:46 AM

OK. I'm just trying to clean it up a bit.

Mitch

in contrast to the (non-existent) beyond superlative of 'most unique'

'unique' is a .... something' term. 'noncomparable'? Nope. I'm searching ELU (because I distinctly remember the discussion of exactly that concpt and the term for it)

so are we supposed to be jumping on people al the time for these transgressions?

Kit Z. Fox

I don't understand what you are asking.

Mitch

sorry, context switch back to chat behavior

Kit Z. Fox

+1 Very nicely explained, JSBangs. If I could, I'd give you a bonus upvote for "Some dog gone bit that there kitty, and he don't take that from nobody." Well, sh*t, don't that beat all. — Kit Z. Fox ♦ May 20 '11 at 16:54

I'm finding some fun stuff back in the way back of the attic.

What does "breaking my duck" mean?

Mitch

OK so an uncomfortable discussion in biosphere. But I hesitate to validate the flags.

@KitZ.Fox how dare you!

Kit Z. Fox

2:02 AM

@Mitch It's not even a live discussion.

@senderle With a baby on my hip, no less. Who's master of the English language now? :) — Kit Z. Fox ♦ May 24 '11 at 19:32

Ha. Back when I had sass.

Before I got my diamond.

stares out the curtains wistfully

tchrist

I have minions now. I miss the days when I didn't have to be so careful.

It's more work to look out for other people than not to. But they're good minions, so they look after me often enough. I'm retired for the night after 5 16-hour workdays in a row.

Night.

Kit Z. Fox

I know, right? Everyone wanting to tell you how to be a janitor, how not to be a janitor, and damn, you know this locker is full of stuff I can't show you, right?

@tchrist Good night!

Mitch

@KitZ.Fox 'gradable' vs 'absolute' adjectives?

12

Q: Does English have half-graded antonyms?

In a recent question about comparatives, a dispute arose in the comments about gradable antonyms like useful/useless where English speakers strongly prefer to use comparative forms only for half of the pair. I proposed that this is simply an example of marked word pairs, a kind of asymmetry whe...

antonyms comparative

Kit Z. Fox

2:19 AM

Yes, that sounds familiar.

Mitch

(unique is absolute, red is gradable)

cornbread ninja 麵包忍者

3:29 AM

Hats!

oed.com/view/Entry/275894

Kit Z. Fox

Hi!

cornbread ninja 麵包忍者

Hi!

Kit Z. Fox

I don't see hats on your profile.

cornbread ninja 麵包忍者

I just got here.

Kit Z. Fox

You mean, since the beginning of Winter Bash?

cornbread ninja 麵包忍者

3:33 AM

Yeah.

When did it start?

Kit Z. Fox

Um. Three days ago? Two?

But...shouldn't you have the Everybody gets a hat! hat?

cornbread ninja 麵包忍者

:(

Kit Z. Fox

Maybe you need a hat to get that hat...

cornbread ninja 麵包忍者

It'll show up.

user174558

7:10 AM

...

user174558

10:05 AM

Hi @matt.

Matt E. Эллен

hi

user174558

If someone cannot see your point after several comments, I think it is best to give up, right?

user174558

I am referring to SE posts, of course.

Matt E. Эллен

yes

user174558

After all, we are not paid to teach them.

Matt E. Эллен

10:07 AM

true. even if we were, there's only so far one can go

user174558

deadrat is a good contributor to this site, earning over 20k in 6 months, but on that mathy post on ELU, he is wrong.

user174558

english.stackexchange.com/questions/294251/… specifically, but not much point talking too much math on ELU.

user174558

english.stackexchange.com/questions/294485/words-choice-and-use belongs on ELL.

Matt E. Эллен

does it?

user174558

Well, then where does it belong?

Matt E. Эллен

10:14 AM

I mean, it certainly not suitable for here, but... I can't make head or tail of it

OK. I edited and sent it away

user174558

People have this bad habit of writing half the question in the title and half in the body.

user174558

Did they learn this in school?

user174558

Geezis.

Anonymous

10:37 AM

This question got closed on ELL, so I flagged it for migration, and the ELL mods brought it over to EL&U:

Anonymous

4

Q: Night rain vs Night train, gemination?

The Wikipedia article on gemination claims that gemination of /t/ is the distinguishing factor between the pronunciation of the two phrases night train and night rain. In my whole life, I've almost never heard the final /t/ in night and the initial /t/ in train articulated the same way. The init...

pronunciation phonetics phonology

user174558

I see a snailboat.

user174558

Do you see a lunatic?

Anonymous

I'm a snailboat!

Anonymous

I see a Jasper Loy.

user174558

10:39 AM

I know that snails can be used for cosmetics.

user174558

They let the snails crawl over the face.

user174558

They also let fish eat your dead skin.

user174558

One day, they might use cobra venom to cure cancer, lol.

user174558

The scariest English horror movie I watched is Carpenter's Vampires. It's the way he makes the vampires look.

user174558

The other English vampires are not scary at all.

user174558

10:44 AM

The Thai ghosts are the scariest of them all.

user174558

I will never ever watch a Thai ghost movie again.

Hugo

11:15 AM

got the tumbleweed hat!

2 days ago, by Kit Z. Fox

Also, don't forget you can see the Tumbleweeds: http://english.stackexchange.com/help/badges/21/tumbleweed

any chance of +1 for this answer? english.stackexchange.com/a/294106/9001

Hugo

11:55 AM

thanks, got the Marty McHat!

now looking for +5 on english.stackexchange.com/a/294044/9001 and english.stackexchange.com/a/293972/9001 for the next one :)

user174558

12:30 PM

Hello @kit.

Kit Z. Fox

Hello, @Jasper.

I tried three times to get the Weed Eater. I'm picking the wrong questions, I guess.

user174558

2

Q: Is it wise to specify a country name in brackets when referring to foreign city in an official document

While writing a formal document in an English language, I would like to know whether it's wise to specify a country name in brackets when referring to foreign city in an official document. For example, the one could say: Back in Barcelona (Spain) we were responsible for the comprehensive manage...

formality names letter-writing geography

user174558

I like Reg, but I don't think this kind of question should be closed.

user174558

I commented, and he commented.

Hugo

@KitZ.Fox I saw you got to several tumbleweed questions before me! I made two attempts, the first replied and said my answer wasn't general enough, but the second: bingo

Kit Z. Fox

12:43 PM

Crud. I was going for Copernicus, but before I could even get a vote, the OP changed to accept my answer.

Hugo

it was just too good!

and in a minute too

Kit Z. Fox

Oh. Crud, I don't even get that other hat for that.

user174558

I would say that the above question is about punctuation in English, so it is about English.

user174558

I am really surprised to see it got closed, but then I have not really been active on this site.

user174558

What are your thoughts on this, folks?

Kit Z. Fox

12:57 PM

I think if it is about punctuation style in a document, it should probably go to Writers.

OK. So here is another attempt at Copernicus.

Matt E. Эллен

you Americans are weird. It's clearly a tube of pringles

user174558

Luckily I am Antarctican.

Matt E. Эллен

Luckily I'm Venusian

user174558

I think I should post on meta about the closing of the question. It's fun to post on meta once in a while...

Matt E. Эллен

do it

user174558

1:05 PM

And maybe get a hat from it.

Matt E. Эллен

i thought you opted out from hats?

user174558

I just did not put on any yet.

Matt E. Эллен

ah :D

user174558

I think I am doing this post because I am bored, lol.

Matt E. Эллен

that's what the internet is for: to stop one from being bored

Kit Z. Fox

1:10 PM

Why is Oulook putting this attachment in the message instead of attaching it?

user174558

0

Q: Closure of question 294505

Why was this question closed? Is it wise to specify a country name in brackets when referring to foreign city in an official document To me, it is a question about punctuation in a document written in the English language. Therefore, it is about the English language and on topic. It does not ma...

discussion

Matt E. Эллен

@KitZ.Fox because it's being helpful!

user174558

@YviDe I see you flying in and out, any reason?

Matt E. Эллен

unexpected hats are the best

YviDe

@JasperLoy nope. Just have this on my favorites list and occasionally join to read when there are new messages. I didn't even know that's something people see :-) (I use the mobile view)

user174558

1:13 PM

@YviDe Never come to chat while on mobile. It's unhealthy!

user174558

Every year, I will put on the Mariah Hat, lol. Reg knows what the Mariah Hat is, lol.

user174558

But I have not gotten the Mariah Hat yet.

user174558

1:27 PM

Well, the Mariah Hat is basically the usual red Xmas hat that Santa wears. Mariah Carey wore it in some of her songs.

Yasashii Eirian

I have an irrelevant question but I am not sure where I have to submit it.

Assume there is a rich man who withdraw a huge amount of cash money and burn all of them.

How does this action affect the monetary?

Kit Z. Fox

Hmm.

user174558

@YasashiiEirian Try asking on Economics SE.

Hugo

K Foundation Burn a Million Quid

K Foundation Burn a Million Quid was an action on 23 August 1994 in which the K Foundation (an art duo consisting of Bill Drummond and Jimmy Cauty) burned cash in the amount of one million pounds sterling in a disused boathouse on the Ardfin Estate on the Scottish island of Jura. The money represented the bulk of the K Foundation's funds, earned by Drummond and Cauty as The KLF, one of the United Kingdom's most successful pop groups of the early 1990s. The incineration was recorded on a Hi-8 video camera by K Foundation collaborator Gimpo. In August 1995, the film — Watch the K Foundation Burn...

Yasashii Eirian

Thanks all.

user174558

1:37 PM

That would be one million dollars.

user174558

0

A: touching others’ lives or touching other lives?

They are both grammatical and in use, and they mean essentially the same thing. You touch other lives because you are a life, and you touch others' lives because you have a life.

user174558

Such a poetic answer, LOL.

user174558

I now have 2000 SE wide, yay!

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

You'd seriously recommend "It is a at ... " ? — Mr. Shiny and New 安宇 33 secs ago

Honestly I have no idea what goes through that user's head.

user174558

1:52 PM

Joe Blow added a picture to my answer today. It was a funny picture.

Matt E. Эллен

blow? I'm speculating

@JasperLoy what was it a picture of?

user174558

5

A: Duah vs. Dua? Which one is right?

It seems that you want the word duh. Neither dua nor duah appears in the dictionaries I checked.

Matt E. Эллен

I see. weird

user174558

He is in a jolly mood for Xmas, so am I, so I left the picture there.

Matt E. Эллен

fair enough

user174558

1:56 PM

I am enjoying myself on ELU, answering weird questions. It's a good way to spend time.

Matt E. Эллен

good

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Nutella refuses to write child's name on personalized jars

@Mitch

Matt E. Эллен

amazing

it's the name of a goddess for centuries and all of a sudden it's a swear word

user174558

Fuck is also a swear word, but it means something beautiful, sex.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@MattE.Эллен yeah I actually really like the name. Poor kid.

user174558

2:04 PM

Very interesting that many swear words are sex related. Humans have a problem with sex. This is the real sin, not sex itself.

Matt E. Эллен

@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Me too. It's the name of a river in Oxford.

user174558

If drugs were legalised, maybe less lives will be ruined by drugs.

Hugo

just got the New Hope hat, must already be 18th somewhere in the world

user174558

Maybe in Australia.

Hugo

yup, 1.06am there

user174558

2:07 PM

It's 10 PM here.

Mitch

2:20 PM

@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 sigh

It was that one idiot woman. People are idiots for blaming the company. The food itself is a universal symbol of well-being and joy

user174558

Not much activity on the site.

Mitch

I blame the UN

For the Nutella-ISIS conspiracy

Kit Z. Fox

@Mitch It wasn't the one woman. Read the whole article. It's company policy.

Some meme of ISIS posing with Nutella? I dunno. Sounds sketchy.

Justyna Nogala

hi folks

Kit Z. Fox

Hi

Justyna Nogala

2:23 PM

. Whether it’s a nanny uncovering clues to a murderous marital spat, or a private nurse giving everything to protect her wheelchair-bound boss, going above and beyond the call of duty is just part of the job.

Mitch

ISIS wouldnt be so bad if it weren't for the killing and torture and bombings and repression and death

Justyna Nogala

what does that "part of the job" mean in this context

?

user174558

Isis is the name of a spa here.

Mitch

@KitZ.Fox read? I don't let facts get in the way of my opinions.

Justyna Nogala

it's just how it is/goes or sth like that?

Mitch

2:25 PM

Yea something like that

Kit Z. Fox

@JustynaNogala It's expected that situations like these are part of her duties.

user174558

@JustynaNogala It means what it means. Just part of the job.

Mitch

An unspoken requirement of the job

Justyna Nogala

oh what a fool am I -_-

Mitch

Not in the official duties but considered a responsibility

Justyna Nogala

2:26 PM

thx ;D

user174558

When you don't understand something, the first step is to understand each word and put the meanings together.

Mitch

What? You knew about a murder and didn't get paid?

When I don't understand something I flugelhorn the nobgoblin

user174558

@Mitch I told deadrat he could come to this chat to discuss the sequence question.

Mitch

Shoot autocorrect is against me!! Damn you ISIS-Nutella!!

user174558

@Mitch I saw that he changed his answer to a different definition. It's all very weird for me, don't know what he is thinking.

Mitch

2:29 PM

Two against one. He's wrong in math and english

user174558

If he is not a math student, why bring up the math?

user174558

I think maybe the lay person has no idea how difficult math is.

Mitch

Math would solve the ISIS-Nutella conflict

user174558

Someone once said to me "Is there a degree in math? What is there to study?"

user174558

I don't know why they don't say the same about physics or chemistry or biology.

Mitch

2:33 PM

Oh I know what the trouble is. There was a shipment of Nutella to Raqqa, and a pallet fell on a vat of halva and the resulting mix was packaged up and sent out and no one liked it. Understandable misunderstanding, but you know how people are.

user174558

Nutella is too thick for me.

user174558

I just have normal butter or maybe some marmalade.

Mitch

yiu have to spread it real thin.

It's overwhelming if it is at all thick

user174558

There are complaints ELU is getting too many elementary questions. I say it's OK, because it's pretty fun closing and reopening questions!

Mitch

What's up with whatsapp? I just don't get it?

user174558

2:36 PM

I don't use it at all. My phone is for calls, SMS and alarm clock.

user174558

I don't really know what whatsapp is.

Mitch

My phone is for ELU chat, if you couldn't tell already from my poor typing.

user174558

Unhealthy to chat on mobile.

Mitch

(That will be my excuse for bad spelling from now on)

@MattE.Эллен what was the spoof tweet about sending the br astronaut to ISIS

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Mitch It seemed like just the one worker bee at first, but the lady escalated her concerns and nobody else in the company was willing to help. They offered to give the girl a jar of Nutella with any nickname she likes.

>The first prequel was titled The Phantom Menace, which now seems apt: Lucas had returned like a bearded apparition and accidentally set fire to childhood nostalgia.
It was like watching an X-Wing fighter botch a strike and take out dancing Ewoks.

Kit Z. Fox

2:49 PM

We were watching the battle in the arena in Attack of the Clones yesterday, and I accidentally set it to the "Love Pledge" scene directly before. So awful.

user174558

Love Pledge sounds like porn, lol.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

I saw AotC twice in theatres. The second time it was an IMAX cut. They edit the film to fit the square screen. Know what else they edited? half the love dialogue: cut. And the scene where Owen and Beru are introduced.

The film was so much better with that simple cut.

user174558

@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 What's wrong with the love dialogue?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@JasperLoy it's horrible

Kit Z. Fox

The chemistry is so lacking anyway. And really? She's been dying inside every day since he's been back in her life? What about all the limp frolicking?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

2:54 PM

So many things in the movie don't make sense at all.

user174558

The movie sounds terrible, I am glad I have not watched it.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Of course, that's true of many movies

Kit Z. Fox

I was soooo annoyed about the "development" of the romance angle.

"Oh, right, they should probably fall in love because they have babies together."

user174558

That is true. Love before babies.

Kit Z. Fox

It's stupid.

user174558

2:55 PM

But lust before sex.

Kit Z. Fox

"Hey, look, you're all grown up. Now I'm romantically attracted to you."

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

It's annoying because GL didn't know how to write good dialogue. And he invented a universe where Jedi were celibate.

He could have just side-stepped the problem by having Anakin have a wife. If Jedi could marry and have kids, that'd be fine.

Kit Z. Fox

There was absolutely no development. There was no falling in love. We were supposed to have assumed that early teenage non-sexual Queen Amidala had fallen in love with an eight-year-old boy and harbored a crush on him for ten years or something.

user174558

@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 The Jedi must have pleased themselves.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Then there'd be no problem. The romance happens off-screen and you don't need to explain it.

She's only necessary as far as having the kids goes.

Kit Z. Fox

2:58 PM

No, he should have used it to explain all the stuff about them. Like Padme isn't into him until she sees his vulnerable side after the thing with his mother.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

The part where he kills innocent beings because he was mad?

Kit Z. Fox

And then, after she reaches out to him, she sees a hint of the coldness in him, but doesn't actually know that he slaughtered an entire community.

@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Yes!

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

So, he shouldn't have told her, then.

user174558

Om mani padme hum.

Kit Z. Fox

Because he tells her what happens from his perspective.

Transcript for

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…