English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

bevvied, bevvy, bivvy, bivvy bag, bivvy sack, bovver, bovver bird, bovver boot, bovver boy, bruvver, chavvy, chivvy, civvy, computer-savvy, Divvers, divvy, evviva, flivver, improvvisatrice, improvvisatrici, lavvy, lode-stovvan, luvvie, media-savvy, mivvy, muvver, Navvy, navvy, navvying, ooja-ka-pivvy, oojah capivvy, pavvy, revved-up, revving, savvy, sivvens, skivvy, skivvying, spivved, spivvish, steam-navvy, street savvy, techno-savvy.

RegDwighт

http://www.morewords.com/contains/vv/

tchrist is faster and better. Who'd have thunk!

2

tchrist

That list I just gave does not include obsolete words, though.

aedia λ

@RegDwighт You know, I think I've seen that, and I've just read the entire plot synopsis, and I'm still not sure I remember actually watching it. Maybe I fell asleep partway in.

tchrist

@Monica With?

RegDwighт

@aediaλ could be. It started off as an awesome movie, then tanked big time.

Monica

5:18 PM

you said it should be stopped and I said 'like here Where is my bike? It________ outside the house, but it’s not there now. (be)
was
has been

RegDwighт

Though that was mostly the last eighteen minutes. And of these, mostly the last four.

Kind of like I Am Legend, except much worse. Because I Am Legend didn't start off that awesome, to be frank.

tchrist

@Monica That one is was.

Monica

I imagined such a sitiation when I thought perfect would be right: The woman is standing at the wondow. Another woman comes and asks is it raining? The first woman says it has stopped for a while. It was raining recently so I thought present perfect would be correct.

tchrist

Ya know, today was worth a Deputy badge to anybody who doesn’t have one yet.

Monica

Yes, I mean in both cases past simple is correct.

tchrist

5:21 PM

@Monica Oh, that one is ok, yes.

It has stopped for a while sounds fine, since it is still stopped.

If it is no longer stopped, use simple past.

You know, our vandal may just have finally cooked his own goose this time around.

Andrew Leach

I doubt it.

RegDwighт

He won't stop before cooking the entire Internet.

tchrist

Se ha notado, dado lo actual.

RegDwighт

He's a dadoist, that much's for sure.

tchrist

Dead as a.

Monica

5:26 PM

and the last sentence. The police____________three people, but later they let them go. (arrest)
arrested
have arrested I used arrested

tchrist

Either is possible.

aedia λ

@RegDwighт I Am Legend... Oh, I definitely haven't seen that. I don't watch many movies full of apocalypses, plagues, zombies, or vampires. Exceptions for Romero, of course.

Monica

I see. Thank you very much :)

aedia λ

@Monica Arrested.

RegDwighт

@tchrist I could see it being Past Perfect, but Present Perfect?

aedia λ

5:28 PM

I would say "have arrested" doesn't make sense.

tchrist

@RegDwighт If it just happened. Hey, dude, I was at the rally and it was a massive clusterfuck. etc etc.

It’s like you’re a reporter on the scene.

RegDwighт

@aediaλ I am halfway through forgetting that movie because I want to read the book so bad. It was so much better and then some, I've been told time and again.

tchrist

Would either of you two please chat me up in the Other Place?

RegDwighт

There's the Other Place? I'm behind the times...

tchrist

I have a mod room.

RegDwighт

5:29 PM

Ohhhh.

Shiny.

Cerberus

What on earth for?

aedia λ

@RegDwighт Ooh, I didn't know it was a book first! And I don't even have to forget the movie :)

RegDwighт

I Am Legend (novel)

I Am Legend is a 1954 horror fiction novel by American writer Richard Matheson. It was influential in the development of the zombie genre and in popularizing the concept of a worldwide apocalypse due to disease. The novel was a success and was adapted to film as The Last Man on Earth in 1964, as The Omega Man in 1971, and as I Am Legend in 2007, along with a direct-to-video 2007 production capitalizing on that film, I Am Omega. The novel was also the inspiration behind the 1968 film Night of the Living Dead. Plot Robert Neville is the apparent sole survivor of a pandemic whose symptoms re...

Don't read the plot synopsis, obviously.

I already know too much.

Which only makes me want to read it more, but still.

chatkillah

@tchrist I thank you.

tchrist

@chatkillah You’re welcome.

chatkillah

5:39 PM

@Cerberus for dancing in go-go boots and white lipstick.

Riding Vespas, &c.

aedia λ

@RegDwighт Wow, looks like it was a huge influence on the big names in horror. I'm gonna have to read that.

Monica

tchrist, you said that present perfect wouldn't be normally used here or in a situation like this, am I right? Where is my bike? It________ outside the house, but it’s not there now. (be)
was
has been

'was' sounds more natural or?

tchrist

@Monica That needs to be was.

I’m heading back to $job. Somebody I may have to write a book about $job.

Except that Scott Adams beat me to it long ago.

aedia λ

@Monica I might say "it has been outside the house for days - I just saw it there yesterday". But without qualification like that, it has to be "was"

Monica

yes, but how to explain why?

OK

I see, aedia. Thank you.

Andrew Leach

5:42 PM

@tchrist I'm supposed to be doing $job, not fire-fighting.

tchrist

@AndrewLeach It’s cause you have a personal interest.

Andrew Leach

Too *** right.

Monica

I have to go now. Thanks once again. Bye, bye!

tchrist

I’m going off to the work-room. Ping me at need.

RegDwighт

And I must commute.

Lators.

Andrew Leach

5:47 PM

I have to too. Hopefully the mods and @TimPost will be able to keep on top of things.

simchona

@AndrewLeach Thanks for remembering the regular mod team, too...

Andrew Leach

Sorry :( Fixed.

tchrist

I’m actually reasonably impressed that we managed to do a passable stop-gap self-policing while Reg was at a meeting and none of the rest of the mod team was around yet.

simchona

@AndrewLeach Just keep flagging, and @-message the right people if you need to

tchrist

Now I know how you got Marshal.

I have 346 helpful flags now, most of which are his.

Or so it seems. Haven’t counted.

chatkillah

5:50 PM

@RegDwighт Just saw this. I thank you, too.

Andrew Leach

@simchona OK. If I can bear it I'll log on on the train. But I might just go to sleep. Off now.

simchona

@AndrewLeach For your sake, it might be better to just take a break

Cerberus

Boskoop is a town near Gouda.

Oops wrong room.

tchrist

7

A: What can we do about all the reoccurring spam?

Help prevent this spam in the first place? There's not much that can be done, honestly. Spammers will spam. IP address blacklists/bans aren't particularly useful because the IP address used by spammers are a huge range & varies a lot. This is leads to a whack-a-mole contest & you end...

> I see this a lot, where people downvote the posts but do not use the spam flag. 6 spam flags causes the post to be deleted, immediately. This needs to be propagated. Leave a comment informing users to make use of spam flag.

Tim Post

6:07 PM

@AndrewLeach I'll be here for a little while longer, Anna and Grace Note are about, @simchona can ping them if I'm out and they'll get it cleaned up quickly.

tchrist

6:18 PM

Thanks, @Tim.

Cerberus

@TimPost Hi! So what's going on here?

Apparently, I missed some big event. People wouldn't tell me.

tchrist

Spammers are posting personal information.

Andrew’s mostly, and lately mine.

Cerberus

Personal information, like what?

tchrist

I should not say spammers in the plural.

It is Norbert.

Well, Norton.

Let me look.

Cerberus

And where was this information posted?

tchrist

6:20 PM

As Questions.

Cerberus

1 min ago, by Cerberus

Personal information, like what?

chatkillah

0_0

simchona

Let's not talk the details here. He's been known to come into chat now.

Cerberus

Name?

tchrist

Yes, please delete those.

Cerberus

6:21 PM

Is your real name in your SE account?

tchrist

Of course.

Cerberus

I see.

simchona

Sorry, trying to keep this generic.

tchrist

Appreciated.

Cerberus

He may have my secondary e-mail address, if he really wants it. That's about all the secret information I have in my profile.

tchrist

6:22 PM

@Cerb, if you send me private email, I’ll be more forthcoming. I just don’t feel like doing so in a public room.

simchona

Don't bait.

Cerberus

No, it's OK.

tchrist

It’s a honeytrap anyway. :)

Cerberus

This is enough info.

tchrist

My public phone number is actually a honeytrap.

But it hasn’t caught any flies yet this morning.

Cerberus

6:23 PM

You were going to honeytrap me with your e-mail address?

Interesting.

tchrist

No, not my email address.

That is real.

The phone number goes to a small room in the basement.

Cerberus

Of course.

Your flying-monkey stall.

And they go after the miscreants that dare call them up.

tchrist

I’ve had the same email address for more then twenty years. Going on 25, even. I shan’t be changing it now.

Nor have I any cause to.

Cerberus

Why would you?

tchrist

People think that hiding their email address somehow stops spam. Hah.

It’s like the riffraff who change cellphone numbers every few months.

They used to try to deliver like 35-65k spammages to me a day.

Well, likely still do.

Cerberus

6:28 PM

You just need to have a provider with a good spam filter, like Gmail.

tchrist

My mail server was crushed under the load till I took more aggressive measures.

I never had a “provider”. I now bounce it through someone higher up the food chain.

But you can get a lot done with a greylister integrated into your IP router.

Cerberus

Or use a service provided by someone else.

Encrypt messages that you really don't want Google to see.

Mitja

7:52 PM

Why does this sentence sound foreign: "Plants receive a heavy load of light."

Cerberus

@Mitja Hmm...

I think the problem is a clashing metaphor.

Light is neither heavy nor a load.

"Plants receive a great deal of light" would probably be better?

In addition, to receive a load of something often implies that it is some sort of imposition on you, or that it requires labour to process.

Whereas light is beneficial to plants.

I see, thanks.

OK.

8:23 PM

@RegDwighт Wow.

I don't know what to say.

aedia λ

Probably goes great with jeggings and a snuggie.

Cerberus

8:56 PM

Haha.

tchrist

@RegDwighт I can just imagine what their male-equiv version would look like. shudders

Pants with built-in packaging.

By which I mean trousers.

Mahnax

9:11 PM

@aediaλ shudders

MετάEd

9:39 PM

@aediaλ No, no, not a snuggie. You're thinking of that thing you do with your knuckles.

chatkillah

0_0

Wham! were known to stuff their trousers.

@tchrist I'm not sure that's the same thing. Men would be adding dimension where none exists, whereas women would be showing something they have anyway, but they have the support of a brassiere.

Cerberus

Well, this way you get to stuff your bra without people seeing it...

Robusto

Yay, I got my piano fixed.

The good news: The hammer went right in, no trouble. The bad news: while putting it in, the piano body, which I had precariously balanced on the back of the frame, fell to the floor, pulling out the ribbon connectors. So I had to dismantle the rest of the piano to put them back. Now that I'm finished, I'm too tired to play. sad panda

Cerberus

Oh, dear.

Well, at least you got it fixed.

Robusto

Yeah. I had an "Oh shit!" moment, though.

Cerberus

9:54 PM

No shit.

chatkillah

Now, to fix your little red wagon.

Robusto

Nah, now to make dinner. Laters.

Cerberus

Bai.

Mitch

10:22 PM

@MετάEd no no not drag them? no no not pugilate? no no not crack them?

tchrist

Great, so now we’re helping 6th graders do their homework.

0

Q: Origin of Idiom "full of hot air"

Does anyone know the origin of idiom " full of hot air". was it created by Kipling in 19th century? needed for 6th grade assignment.

idioms

She could get in hot water for that one.

-1

Q: What is the origin for the idiom "In hot water"?

Please help on what it means. Ive looked everywhere on the internet.

idioms

The Internet is a big place — but it is not the end-all and be-all of all possible research.

But I doubt they looked everywhere.

Do with those as you will. I’m not touchin’ ’em.

I was merciful to the 6th-grader, but less so to the other.

MετάEd

10:45 PM

@Mitch Oh! A noogie.

G'nite.

tchrist

@Cerberus Are you a terrorist?

If that's the frequently provided answer, I can see why. There's nothing wrong with either one. And there's no difference in meaning, either, though some people may purport to find one (rarely the same one, and never a useful one) in their own personal usage. As for possessive subjects for gerunds, they're fine, and so are objective subjects. There are two different complementizers, known in the trade as POSS-ing and ACC-ing. Respectively, his coming late and him coming late. Both just fine. The rumor that it has to be possessive was started by terrorists. — John Lawler 55 mins ago

All these answers are wrong:

2

Q: What is the longest English word that starts and ends with the same letter?

I've found "enterprise", which is 10 letters long. Does anyone know of any longer words that start and end with the same letter? That letter doesn't have to be 'e', by the way. It just means that the first and last letter of the word have to be identical.

single-word-requests word-games

The longest word in English that starts and ends with the same letter is “I”, which is tied for first place with “a”.

Cerberus

@tchrist He's crazy, I told you.

tchrist

That’s what all you terrorists say.

Cerberus

Always and always on a political rant, espousing his own particular doctrines as universal truth, using obscure terminology...

tchrist

Political?

Cerberus

10:59 PM

He is always on a mission against conventionalists.

Calls 'em terrorists.

tchrist

11:16 PM

Stick-in-the-muds.

They-of-snitted-knickers.

Cerberus

11:40 PM

It is funny how intolerant so many "progressive" people are.

Although of course many reactionaries and conservatives are also intolerant.

tchrist

Egypt's ruling Muslim Brotherhood warns that a U.N. declaration on women's rights could destroy society by allowing a woman to travel, work and use contraception without her husband's approval and letting her control family spending.

Yes, I am particularly intolerant of crap like that.

And damned proud of my intolerance, too.

I abhor slavery.

Cerberus

How intolerant?

Would you invade Egypt?

tchrist

Huh?

Cerberus

I am willing to restrict the freedom of others to restrict the freedom of others again.

But only sometimes.

tchrist

I am no invader.

Cerberus

11:48 PM

Why not invade Egypt and force them to be tolerant towards women?

tchrist

You can’t.

Cerberus

You could try...

tchrist

Tolerance, like love, can never be imposed.

Or it is not real.

Cerberus

Well, that is partly true.

But you can liberate people.

tchrist

You can no more make someone tolerate someone else than you can make that person love someone else.

Cerberus

11:48 PM

And you can slowly change society and values from the top.

tchrist

Cura te ipsum.

> Yet it is not our part to master all the tides of the world, but to do what is in us for the succour of those years wherein we are set, uprooting the evil in the fields that we know, so that those who live after may have clean earth to till.

Not my fields.

Cerberus

Yeah.

Never again shall we let desert culture conquer wide lands.

It was in a way a great tragedy.

At least the Jews were no expansionists.

tchrist

It is interesting that monotheism comes always out of the harsh desert, polytheism out of the fertile jungle.

Cerberus

At least, I am assuming monotheism has something to do with deserts.

tchrist

jinx

Cerberus

11:54 PM

Polytheism doesn't come from a jungle, it comes from everywhere.

And before that, there was animism everywhere.

tchrist

Not from the desert.

Cerberus

Sure it does.

Before monotheism, even Arabia was polytheist and animist country.

tchrist

> The Muslim Brotherhood warned the declaration would give girls sexual freedom, legalize abortion, provide teenagers with contraceptives, give equality to women in marriage and require men and women to share duties such as child care and chores.

> It said the declaration would allow "equal rights to homosexuals, and provide protection and respect for prostitutes" and "equal rights to adulterous wives and illegitimate sons resulting from adulterous relationships."

Cerberus

The chicken and the egg are also hard to separate when it comes from monotheist cultures.

tchrist

And so the sins of of the fathers are visited upon the next generation of innocents.

If you are a bastard, you have no civil rights.

I know a bastard when I see one, and the man making that pronouncement is a bastard.

Cerberus

11:57 PM

Was monotheism simply a strong factor in spreading and establishing preexisting harsh desert culture? Or did monotheism itself contribute the largest share of the detrimental cultural remains that we see today in Christianity, Judaism, and Islam?

tchrist

Maybe they just wanted to leave the desert.

The desert they had created of their own devices.

Cerberus

Of?

tchrist

The Fertile Crescent. Palm forests in the ancient hieroglyphics.

Those are two places.

Cerberus

What are you talking about?

tchrist

Mesopotamia is not a nice place to live these days.