English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Cerberus

17:50

Hello.

What are you guys doing?

> iOS and OS X users are experiencing crashes due to corrupted binaries pushed out by Apple's servers over the Fourth of July holiday, according to Instapaper developer Marco Arment. The problem appears to be linked to Apple's FairPlay DRM scheme ...

Apple, crashes, DRM...

I hope these three concepts will be fused in people's conceptual catalogues.

arstechnica.com/apple/2012/07/…

Mahnax

Hi Cerb.

Funny, I have not noticed any crashes on my devices.

Cerberus

Oops.

I didn't know your eyes would see this.

The problem appears to be with applications that were updated today.

So don't install any updates.

Mahnax

I always put off my updates anyways, I'm ashamed to say.

Cerberus

And hope that Apple will fix their DRM scheme quickly.

Ashamed?

Mahnax

They'd better.

Cerberus

17:57

Why ashamed?

Mahnax

I don't know.

I feel like it's my duty to make sure all of my applications are up to date.

Cerberus

Why?

Updates are hardly ever important...

Mahnax

I know.

I don't understand some things about myself, this is one of them.

There is no reason for this.

Cerberus

Heh.

@Mahnax What!?

Now you insult religion too?

I am appalled.

Mahnax

You shouldn't remove what I say from context and apply it elsewhere.

Cerberus

18:00

yesterday, by Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus why what? I didn't even notice it! There is no why

@Mahnax Then what did I just do?

Ack.

Mahnax

Hmm?

Cerberus

I can't link to an historical version.

You evil, you changed it!

Mahnax

Hah.

Cerberus

Too bad you missed Gigi.

I was very much looking forward to a picture of the two of you together.

Mahnax

I didn't miss her, she just didn't show…

I even took a picture of my cup from Starbucks that night just to prove that I was even there.

Cerberus

18:06

She didn't show?

You had made an appointment?

Mahnax

We were supposed to meet at a certain place, a certain time.

Cerberus

Didn't you text each other?

Mahnax

No.

I can imagine that somehow costing me a lot of money.

Cerberus

Nah.

Mahnax

Or her a lot of money.

Cerberus

18:08

Text messages are never that expensive if you only send one or two.

At any rate, why didn't she show up?

She couldn't make it?

I remember she said something.

Yesterday.

But I forgot.

Mahnax

I think she said that transportation from Edmonton to my town was more difficult than she anticipated.

Cerberus

Hmm how so?

Mahnax

Bus schedules, locations, etc.

Or so I would assume, at any rate.

21 hours ago, by Gigili

Oh hi, the one I never met!

That message?

Cerberus

No.

Google Maps says it would take 52 minutes, and you would need to take a taxi for part of the route.

Mahnax

From where?

Edmonton International Airport?

Cerberus

18:14

From E. centre to somewhere in your town.

Mahnax

Oh.

That doesn't make much sense; it's never taken me any more than 30 minutes to get somewhere in Edmonton.

Well, before the huge new road, it might've.

Cerberus

@Mahnax By bus?

Mahnax

@Cerberus Oh, no.

Cerberus

Then how?

Mahnax

Right, I forgot about the bus bit.

Driving by car.

Cerberus

18:15

Car is much faster outside many urban areas.

From the airport, it would be 1:40.

Mahnax

Ouch.

Cerberus

And who knows what it would cost.

Mahnax

We are picking up some relatives from the airport this Saturday.

@Cerberus Seven tögrög.

Cerberus

By car, it is 33 minutes.

@Mahnax That sounds familiar...

Mahnax

@Cerberus Huh, I wonder why that is…

G'day @Matt!

Cerberus

18:17

So I can understand that Gigi wouldn't want to spend 4 hours of travel and possibly € 50 (I have no idea) to have coffee with you, no offence.

Matt Эллен

ohai! I'm just leaving, hacktually :D

Cerberus

Liar!

You're just arriving!

Mahnax

@Cerberus The thing is that she asked if we could reschedule.

Cerberus

No matter how much your picture prances around the screen.

@Mahnax Huh...

Perhaps she was just time constrained?

Mahnax

It's possible.

At any rate, it didn't happen, and it's too bad.

Cerberus

18:19

Well, it is none of my business.

Mahnax

And now I should take a shower and eat some lunch. Farewell, dog and namesake!

Cerberus

Every time I look at a map of your area, I am amazed at how all the streets are straight.

OK bye!

Namesake?

Mahnax

Matt!

Cerberus

Ahh.

Mahnax

When I return I will show you some curvy streets.

OK, bye for real now.

Cerberus

18:22

Bye.

@KitFox: I am looking at Portland, and it looks quite nice. Is it?

MetaEd

18:56

Portland Oregon is very nice.

If that's the one you mean.

Gigili

@Mahnax Hang on a minute, who didn't show?

Cerberus

@MetaEd I was actually looking at Maine, which is where Kit lives.

Not in Portland, though.

Gigili

@Mahnax I even? Sounds like you think you have done a very important thing.

Cerberus

But I am open to a nice picture of some cozy street in Portland, Oregon.

Gigili

Well, I'm shocked.

@Cerberus Heh, we did not text each other. I think Mahnax might want to tell you how he reacted when we were setting a time to meet up!

Cerberus

19:07

Ehh I don't want to know.

Gigili

OK then.

Cerberus

I shouldn't have stuck my nose where it doesn't belong.

MetaEd

We'll watch for details in the grocery line.

Cerberus

None of my business.

@MetaEd The grocery line? Wha?

Gigili

Don't ask so he feels forced to answer like that.

MetaEd

19:09

@Cerberus That's where all the scandal sheets are sold. In the US, while you are waiting to check out your groceries, you are encouraged to read about the latest celebrity scandals and maybe buy a copy.

Cerberus

Oh, yes, I see.

The magazine racks are often close to the exit.

Stupid supermarkets.

And ours are far worse than anything you Yankees could ever imagine.

Extremely cramped.

And they are organized to make you move around the entire shop in a zig-zag pattern on purpose even if you only need to get to the vegetables two metres away.

MetaEd

@Cerberus Supermarkets, or scandal sheets?

Ah.

Yes, I've experienced that too.

Gigili

@Vitaly Oh, I didn't know that. Great.

MetaEd

Inefficient.

Gigili

I can hardly guess the word. I have two or three words in mind but mostly none of them is the answer.

Cerberus

19:15

@MetaEd Really? I thought all your supermarkets were spacious and friendlily staffed.

From the entrance, you need to walk all the way to back first.

Gigili

@Vit: I started reading a book today which is really wonderful.

Cerberus

Through very narrow path chock full of people and trolleys and whatnot.

Gigili

Oxford word skills

Cerberus

What's so wonderful about it?

Gigili

It mentions six ways to achieve a wider vocabulary that I never tried before.

Cerberus

19:17

Such as?

The best way is probably just lots of reading.

Robusto

@Cerberus Hey, I've been reading yet another book about Old English and it makes the point that the really crude words in English crept in after the Anglo-Saxon period, and implies that these words probably came from Dutch.

Cerberus

And reading about subjects that interest you.

@Robusto Crude, like which?

Like boss and skipper?

Or curses?

Robusto

fuck, cunt, etc. Obviously not in their current forms.

Cerberus

Oh, I see.

They could come from contact between English and Dutch sailors?

But I don't think we have anything like fuck any more...

We do have kut.

Robusto

I dunno. But one of the really interesting ideas this guy talks about is how Anglo-Saxon and Danish, because of their similarities and the close contact users had with one another, rubbed all the case and gender markers off of the vocabulary of what became English.

Unlike any other European language.

Cerberus

19:21

I suppose you could say that English lost lots of inflection because it is kind of a creole language.

Robusto

@Cerberus Stop.

Cerberus

But Dutch doesn't really have any case or gender marks either.

Robusto

But Dutch isn't a real language, remember?

Gigili

Adding new meanings to familiar words, for example. Or understanding the figurative meaning of vocabulary items.

Cerberus

@Robusto It is true...Lots of Celts, lots of Angles(?), Saxons, Danes, Frenchmen...

KitFox

19:22

@Cerberus Yes, it is quite lovely.

Cerberus

@Robusto We are also a bit more creole-like than German or French, because we are in a border area between two branches of IE (Romance and Germanic). You can clearly see influences from both.

KitFox

And I am pretty sure that you don't know whether I live in Portland or not.

Cerberus

And we lost nearly all case and gender markings too.

@KitFox Don't I?

I think know that you don't.

But my memory...

KitFox

I am pretty sure you don't know where I actually live.

Cerberus

I thought it was a smaller town.

I don't even remember whether you ever told me which town, so I certainly don't know its name.

KitFox

19:27

I am pretty sure I didn't tell you which town, and all towns are small here. Even Portland.

But anyway.

Hello.

Robusto

Anyway, gotta motor. Cyaz.

Cerberus

@KitFox It is possible. I don't know it anyway.

Gigili

Hello, Kit.

Cerberus

Bye Rob.

And I must admit I didn't know it had only 60k inhabitants.

Gigili

Are these electronic translators, umm, useful?

KitFox

19:38

Doesn't seem terribly helpful.

Kind of a pocket dictionary.

MetaEd

@Cerberus Who told you that :-)

So we're discussing close contact between sailors?

Gigili

@KitFox Yeah, I agree. I prefer paper dictionaries.

MetaEd

Wait. We always used to pronounce "love" the way Inigo Montoya does?

We used to be sexier.

KitFox

A whole lot sexier.

MetaEd

Okay I am adopting the long "o".

Please keep that in mind when mentally reconstructing my speech.

KitFox

19:45

Roger wilco.

Mahnax

@Gigili You didn't!

Hello everyone.

Gigili

@Mahnax I thought you said you were busy.

Anyway, it doesn't matter.

Mahnax

@Gigili No, on the night we had arranged to meet, I went, and you didn't.

The rest of the week I was busy.

@Gigili OK.

Gigili

@Mahnax Yeah, because it was the day I arrived and I couldn't make it to your town.

Mahnax

@Gigili I understand.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

20:17

@KitFox! Your avatar isn't sleeping anymore

KitFox

7 hours ago, by KitFox

@JasperLoy I wanted to let Reg know how much I valued his friendship. Subtly, of course.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox heheh

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

20:29

yay, I finally have an iDevice

But it's just an iPhone 3G

still, better than nothing

Cerberus

Oh, dear.

Why did you buy that?

And may I ask a question?

Why is it called 3G?

Does that imply that earlier Iphones didn't have 3G?

I believe they did?

Now I wish to end this sequence with a non-question for symmetry.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

I didn't buy it

And you may ask

Cerberus

Thanks!!

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

And it's called 3G because it has 3G

It does imply that the earlier iPhone didn't have 3G

KitFox

Does it have the gbs?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

20:32

gbs?

Cerberus

@MrShinyandNew安宇 But! That is really weird! Are you really sure?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus fairly sure

cornbread ninja

goes to bar, pours two fingers of single-malt scotch

Cerberus

I seem to remember running Speedtest on a friend's Iphone when it was just out.

KitFox

►

Mahnax

20:33

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Congrats!

Cerberus

Oh, so there was no Iphone 2.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

IPhone

{| class="bordered infobox" style="font-size:90%; width:{}px;" cellpadding=5 ! style="background:#efefef; font-size:105%; text-align:center" | iPhone models |-) | * iPhone * iPhone 3G * iPhone 3GS * iPhone 4 * iPhone 4S |} The iPhone ( ) is a line of smartphones designed and marketed by Apple Inc. The first iPhone was unveiled by Steve Jobs, then CEO of Apple, on January 9, 2007, and released on June 29, 2007. The 5th generation iPhone, the iPhone 4S, was announced on October 4, 2011, and released 10 days later. An iPhone can function as a video camera (video recording was not a stand...

Cerberus

Wow, the first Iphone really didn't have 3G!

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

That link goes to the model comparison

Cerberus

That is...remarkable.

Why did people buy a 2G phone when many 3G phones were already on the market?

Every time Apple amazes me more.

And consumers.

cornbread ninja

20:36

@Cerberus wonders never cease with apple consumers.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox It is highly cus tom izzable

Cerberus

@cornbreadninja Never indeed!

cornbread ninja

back to the grindshtone. stumbles out of room

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox Ah, yes, the one with the gb's. No, this phone does not have the GBs

@Cerberus The iPhone was a pretty nice device despite its flaws. It beat the pants off of many phones in most ways that consumers cared about.

Cerberus

@MrShinyandNew安宇 But still...if only Apple had just taken a random other device and put their own software on it!

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

20:41

@Cerberus why? most other phones were total shit. At least the iPhone had a browser that actually worked

Cerberus

That is software.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

People didn't know they wanted 3G because nobody bothered using the web on their phones because the browser was so shitty

Well, it's also the screen and the touch-input

Cerberus

Well, in 2007 my current phone was widely used.

It came out in 2007 and I know it was popular.

So Apple could have just taken that hardware and put their admittedly much better OS on it.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus In North America, there were feature phones (which were considered smartphones back then, because they ran Java), and there were Blackberry phones. The MS phones were a blip in the marketplace.

Cerberus

So...

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

20:44

So Apple looked at the market and decided they could do way better, hardware-wise. And admittedly, they did. 3G didn't matter because nobody cared, and the following year they released that anyway

Gigili

@MrShinyandNew安宇 I bought one when I was in Canada but now it doesn't work here. When I turn it on, it say "insert simcard". Should I throw it out the window?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Gigili It's probably locked.

Cerberus

@MrShinyandNew安宇 I don't know why you say that Apple had better hardware, but never mind.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Also, it might not work on your cell network

@Cerberus Give me an example of a phone with better hardware at the time

Cerberus

@Gigili You bought an Iphone 3G?

@MrShinyandNew安宇 My phone is from 2007 too, and it has 3G. So 3G was very well possible.

So Apple's not having 3G is hardly "way better". It is a step back.

Gigili

20:47

@Cerberus 4S.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus aside from 3G then. Nobody cared about 3G

Cerberus

@Gigili Oh, phew.

Gigili

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Yeah, but what should I do?

Cerberus

Google "how to remove SIM lock Iphone 4s".

Gigili

Oh, I will now.

Cerberus

20:48

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Okay, this is running in circles. Let's change the subject.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Gigili Depends on why it doesn't work

Cerberus

Perhaps you need to jailbreak your phone first.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus No. I am stipulating that the 3G aspect of the hardware didn't matter, and that the iphone was better than all the other relevant phones, hardware-wise. Better screen, better touch-support, smaller, whatever.

@Gigili what is the exact model of the phone?

where did you buy it?

Cerberus

@MrShinyandNew安宇 And I already disagree about the only hardware part I know about the Iphone, which is its lack of 3G. So let's end it.

@Gigili Have you tried it in Canada? With a Canadian SIM?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus Fine, so that's a showstopper for you. But for most people, at least in north america, it was not a showstopper. Or, they didn't know it should be a showstopper, because really, most people had not used phones with worthwhile web browsers

Cerberus

20:51

Don't worry: in the end you will break the lock.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 I didn't say it was a showstopper—I just said it is not what I consider "way better hardware".

> When my sister came down to leave, I noticed her clothes were baggy, dirty, and had some holes in them. I asked what was up with her look. She told me her friend's party was a "hobo costume party" and that guests needed to dress like "hobos." I was turned off by the theme and, like a true tattle tale, called my parents to tell them the kind of party my sister wanted to attend. They were grossed out by the theme too, and they forbade her from attending.

This is silly.

I suppose the problem with homeless people is a bit different in other countries, though.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus "the problem with homeless people"?

Cerberus

Yes?

What do you find strange?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Gigili the Wikipedia page suggests that the phone will work on both GSM and CDMA networks, so it's probably just SIM-locked to a specific carrier

Cerberus

I mean that it is a problem that people are homeless. And the nature of the problem varies per country.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus right, sure, but what does that have to do with those parents and their idea that it's "gross" to have a hobo-theme party?

Cerberus

20:58

Well, I was just hypothesising: if homeless people are considered less responsible for their lack of housing, then it may be considered more immoral to mock them.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus I honestly can't follow that hypothesis

Gigili

@MrShinyandNew安宇 What do you mean?

@Cerberus Yeah and it worked.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 So? I can't use it here?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Gigili It needs to be unlocked

Gigili

OK.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

I wouldn't be surprised if the mobile carriers know how to unlock it

Cerberus

21:09

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Why not?

Gigili

They did not, one of them tried and did some weird things but it's still not working.

Cerberus

I would Google it.

Perhaps in Persian.

"SIM-unlock Iphone 4gs bought abroad", something like that.

Gigili

Yes, I'm trying to find something there. Thank you.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus I don't see how person A being less responsible makes it more or less immoral for person B to mock them

And I'm not sure "mocking homeless people" is the problem

@Cerberus 4s not 4gs, geez

@Gigili did you buy it from an apple store?

MetaEd

Hobos are a bit different from what people think of when they see "homeless people".

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

21:15

@MetaEd yes, that was going to be my next point

Gigili

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Yes.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Gigili do you remember if they asked you what your carrier was going to be?

Or did you just walk in and say "iphone 4 please" and walk out

MetaEd

Imagine fifty people a day, I say fifty people a day, walking in and saying "iPhone 4 please" and walking out.

Gigili

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Umm, something like that. I inserted the simcard I bought there and when it worked I walked out!

Cerberus

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Why not? Don't you feel it's harder to mock a poor African boy than some millionaire who gambled away his money and is now also very poor?

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Then what is it?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

21:19

@Cerberus er, what? what does mocking people have to do with anything?

@Gigili So you bought a sim card. So the phone is probably locked to that carrier.

Cerberus

You replied to my "mocking".

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus Where did you get the idea that anybody is mocking anybody?

Cerberus

2 mins ago, by Cerberus

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Then what is it?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus what is what? a hobo-themed party? Why would it be mocking? If it were a pirate-themed party, would they be mocking pirates?

Cerberus

1 min ago, by Cerberus

2 mins ago, by Cerberus

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Then what is it?

I feel like Vitaly now.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

21:22

And do you think that the parents objected on the grounds of "it's not nice to mock irresponsible people who gamble away their fortunes"?

holy shit it's almost 5:30

Sorry Cerb, no more lessons today

Cerberus

You're weird.

Gigili

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Well, yes. I guess that must be it. I am silly like that!

Vitaly

21:36

@Cerberus Really? is someone cerberiting?

Cerberus

Someone was Vitalising.

By the way, why do you read transcripts?

Vitaly

Do I?

Cerberus

Read chat when you're not chatting, then.

Vitaly

@Cerberus And you infer that how?

Cerberus

You're reading a line not addressed to you?

Vitaly

21:44

@Cerberus It pings me.

Cerberus

So you weren't pinged or participating in chat.

Does it?

Do you have some kind of script installed?

Vitaly

May 2 at 12:41, by Robusto

Let's go trolling for Witaly: "Hey, don't you think God will prevent the singularity from cutting in on his action?"

May 2 at 12:43, by Vitaly

@Robusto I already have a trigger on that misspelling.

Cerberus

So you do.

Why?

Vitaly

Why not?

Cerberus

Why?

Vitaly

21:45

Why not?

Gigili

Everybody does, except you.

Matt Эллен

Yep, I get pung when Robusto types Witaly

It seems the only logical course of action

Gigili

Cerb doesn't even read the lines which are addressed to him.

Matt Эллен

lol

Robusto

How about VVittallee?

Matt Эллен

21:49

good night

Gigili

Good night Matt.

Robusto

I guess Witaly doesn't get pung on that one. Also, to clear up a point, Witaly ain't exactly a misspelling. More like an attempt at a mo' bettah transliteration.

MetaEd

22:06

How does one go about setting up triggers?

KitFox

How does one go about getting satisfactory answers from Vitaly?

Cerberus

I have tried to for years.

KitFox

I have given up hope that I will ever be satisfied by Vitaly.

sad panda

I don't think I can finish this story without him.

histrionics

Cerberus

*historionics

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English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…