The h Bar

0ßelö7

16:13

@rob fuuuuuuuuuuuu my poster is like 25% larger than it's supposed to be

Anonymous

@0ßelö7 poster ?

John Rennie

@0ßelö7 computer doubts?

Phase

Was Einstein actually wrong about Entanglement? I see a lot of people saying that he is, but isn't Local Hidden Variables still valid?

*nonlocal

ik Local is ruled out by Bell's inequality

John Rennie

Non-locality contradicts the principle of relativity, so Albert wouldn't have liked that.

Phase

But it doesn't does it? You can't be sure you're actually measuring a non-decoherent state without information from the people with the other particle right?

also

Oh right

Nevermind

Im thinking about it in terms of the revised definition of non-locality :l

So Einstein wasn't necessarily wrong in Either of his views, but the fact that he tried to have both at the same time? I.e. Locality holds, OR There are hidden variables? Copenhagen doesn't violate locality because its non realist right?

DanielSank

16:35

Hi, everybody.

heather

hello

DanielSank

Oh hi!

What's up?

:-D

I just went for a jog on the beach :-D

Anonymous

@DanielSank Wow, you stay near the beach?

Anonymous

That's cool

DanielSank

google.com/maps/place/408+Ellwood+Beach+Dr,+Goleta,+CA+93117/…

And I can walk to work and pass a donut shop on the way.

Anonymous

16:41

The nearest beach from my place is around 100 km away :d

DanielSank

aww

I bet you have other things though.

Good food?

Anonymous

Well, food is good. I have four canteens in my campus with different types of cuisine. So there's that. :P

DanielSank

That sounds pretty good.

Anonymous

And my house is only 5 mins away from uni campus :)

0ßelö7

I just spent 45 minutes fiddling with column sizes and all it got me was one line

DanielSank

16:44

Within walking distance, I have one excellent Chinese restaurant, two average Vietnamese ones (one with very good bahn mi), and a pretty good Mexican restaurant with one dish I particularly like.

@0ßelö7 nice

Why is there greek in your username?

0ßelö7

@DanielSank I don't believe there is

DanielSank

Also, what's the deal? We can change our usernames around at will?

0ßelö7

@DanielSank Apparently

DanielSank

@0ßelö7 Oh is that a German character?

0ßelö7

@DanielSank Yes

DanielSank

16:45

β

Anonymous

His German brother hacked his account.

DanielSank

Μου αρεσει τα ελληνικα!

Anonymous

;)

0ßelö7

@Blue except in this case I am the German

Anonymous

@0ßelö7 Are you sure you didn't leave your twin back in Germany?

Mostafaııııııııııııııııııııııı

16:46

@DanielSank ß as in Carl Friedrich Gauß

0ßelö7

ok time to reduce the font size to get another line

this formatting is going to kill me

DanielSank

What are you doing and why is reducing font size allowed?

0ßelö7

@DanielSank poster

DanielSank

My procedure for making papers fit the PRL length limits:

1) Read the paper and reduce word count by making the language more concise. This improves the paper quality.

2) Make figures more compact.

3) If that's not enough, start moving stuff into the supplementary information.

0ßelö7

@DanielSank not possible

@DanielSank yeah working on it

I would like to reduce the font size anyway because it is pretty large

DanielSank

16:48

Fortunately that's pretty easy.

0ßelö7

and I have to include this baby

DanielSank

Crop that bad boy.

0ßelö7

@DanielSank This is a LaTeX poster

the formatting is actually killing me

DanielSank

facepalm

triple ugh

0ßelö7

I'm going to have to resize it during printing because when I mess with the width it refuses to center things

it's pretty awful

oh well, back to work

Jaime Gallego

16:50

@0ßelö7 Why????????

0ßelö7

@JaimeGallego because I want nice equations

never doing it again

I'm committed for this one though

Jaime Gallego

14

Q: How to export a equation as a image without background?

For example, if we have a equation on a file like: \documentclass[12pt]{standalone} \usepackage{varwidth} \usepackage[utf8x]{inputenc} \usepackage[T1]{fontenc} \usepackage{amsmath, amssymb, graphics, setspace} \newcommand{\mathsym}[1]{{}} \newcommand{\unicode}[1]{{}} \newcounter{mathematicapag...

There

Now you don't have to endure endless torture

Anonymous

@JaimeGallego I am trying to use the command prompt to run a C program (the source file is saved on my desktop) without an IDE. I think the necessary compilers are already downloaded. But I'm not sure what commands to type in CMD. Could you help out?

Anonymous

Jaime Gallego

Does it recognize gcc?

Just type gcc and see what happens

Anonymous

16:55

Anonymous

Nah

Jaime Gallego

I think you need MinGW

Windows programming is not my forté

Anonymous

Running C/C++ Programs in Windows Command Prompt (Not any IDE)

►

Anonymous

Alright, I'm trying to follow this video^

Anonymous

I'll let you know if I'm stuck

Anonymous

16:57

Even they are recommending MinGW

0ßelö7

I FOOKIN DID IT

I RESIZED THE FONT

had to get into the .sty file to do it

so proud of meself

now I have to write twice as much

:(

DanielSank

@Blue I might be able to help you with this.

Whether or not you should use MinGW depends entirely on the source code.

vzn

@Phase its a long story... boiled down to soundbites over the decades but then losing the nuance. theres the conventional wisdom and a minority/ contrarian pov being actively pursued by some researchers, some very expert. do encourage you to delve deeper :) coincidentally just asked a question related to this

DanielSank

Where's the source?

Phase

Could someone please Unstar my comment lmao

It only includes my typo of Local instead of nonlocal x_x

Jaime Gallego

17:04

@DanielSank What do you mean?

vzn

0

Q: interpretation of the wavefunction in terms of classical harmonic oscillators

the following paragraph from the book The Meaning of Quantum Theory, Jim Baggott, Oxford University Press, 1992 p26 leads me to this question. consider N ("independently interacting") particles with 3N coordinates x,y,z in space. the quantum wavefunction is expressed in terms of (a superposition ...

quantum-mechanics classical-mechanics waves wavefunction specific-reference

0ßelö7

@Phase ask John Duffield

he is writing a book about Einstein

DanielSank

@JaimeGallego You either want MSVS, Cygwin, or MinGW, and which one you pick depends on various factors.

vzn

@0ßelö7 really? how do you know that?

0ßelö7

@vzn I talk to him

vzn

17:05

@0ßelö7 huh. skype? have saved a few of his chat lines myself...

DanielSank

If you write a "Widows program", or you want to simplify your life as much as possible, compile using MSVS.

If you have a program specifically written to use unix system calls, then I think you can either use MinGW or Cygwin, and they work pretty differently.

0ßelö7

@vzn He sent me an excerpt

DanielSank

MinGW compiles a binary that uses Microsoft DLL's directly.

vzn

@0ßelö7 interesting. whatd you think? a bit surprised you guys talk. does he have a blog? should get one. did he ever do youtube videos?

DanielSank

I'm pretty sure Cygwin provides it's own set of DLL's to cover the posix environment and compiles a binary that expects to use those DLL's specifically.

@JaimeGallego

Jaime Gallego

17:07

Jesus, sorcery as usual in the Windows world

DanielSank

What?

Cygwin and MinGW exist in a sense to make source code written for posix still compileable on Windows.

You don't need them unless you need them :-)

In a lot of cases, downloading MSVS and getting the code to compile with it is a pretty good idea.

Cygwin is quite popular too.

I've used MinGW a bit and it is pretty good.

0ßelö7

I can fit in that image now. Woot

DanielSank

Now all that having been said, note that Windows 10 actually has a built-in posix command line environment.

(Windows 8 might too, I'm not sure)

This is awesome because it means you can basically do Linux stuff without even installing a VM.

Oh, and @Blue, if you're trying to compile code written for Linux, another option is to just install a Linux VM using Virtualbox. It's pretty easy and makes a lot of problems go away.

Anonymous

@DanielSank So I downloaded the gcc compiler from here. And then I followed the instructions given in this video. However, when I type gcc -o hello hello.c it doesn't recognize gcc. Not sure where I'm going wrong. The C source file is stored on my Desktop with the name hello.

Jaime Gallego

You updated the PATH?

DanielSank

17:12

^

@Blue I'm not going to watch that video. Tell us what you did.

Anonymous

What PATH?

Anonymous

How to?

DanielSank

People need to stop pretending that other users are going to red big-ass PDF documents and watch videos in order to help.

@Blue Just a second.

What did you do after you downloaded the compiler?

Anonymous

@DanielSank I installed it.

Anonymous

17:13

And the C code was already stored on my Desktop

Anonymous

with the name "hello.c"

Jaime Gallego

@Blue The PATH is the environment variable that tells cmd where the gcc executable is

So you can just type gcc instead of the full absolute path

Anonymous

@JaimeGallego Alright, how to update the PATH?

DanielSank

You need to know where you installed the compiler first!

Don't go messing with environment variables until you know where you installed the compiler.

Anonymous

It's installed in my C drive...lemme search for it

Jaime Gallego

17:15

It's also important that, to update the PATH, you must append to it.

NOT replace.

DanielSank

^

YES

Which is why I think you should not mess with your environment variables yet until you know what you're doing.

Черенки

Which programming language is the most used in physics

DanielSank

You can modify PATH locally in one command line session first to make sure it works.

Anonymous

Черенки

Particularly experimental physics

DanielSank

17:16

@Черенки Which field?

@Черенки Lots of Python, Matlab, LabVIEW.

I strongly recommend Python over the other two.

Черенки

what about c++

DanielSank

Not so much, to be honest.

It really depends what you're doing.

If you need to program a microcontroller, you'll need C.

Ok @Blue go to your command line.

heather

@DanielSank, btw, you might be interested in this initiative on the math.se site

Anonymous

@DanielSank Alright?

Anonymous

Then?

DanielSank

17:18

> C:
> cd TDM-GCC-32
> dir

Черенки

Can you recommend any resources to study python

DanielSank

What's in there?

Jaime Gallego

@DanielSank Agree. Learning something by reading has much much more throughput than tutorial videos. And it's easier to skim.

DanielSank

@Черенки I learned by being in a group that used it. For tutorials, just search the internet. I'm happy to help you get set up. I know python very, very well.

Черенки

@DanielSank Glad to hear that.

Anonymous

17:19

Jaime Gallego

Huh

DanielSank

oh hahahaha

cd ..
cd ..
cd TDM-GCC-32
dir

Anonymous

What's happening?

DanielSank

(logging into windows machine...)

Anonymous

John Rennie

17:22

@Blue: unless you enjoy pain grab a copy of Visual Studio Community Edition. It's free and you can use either the command line or the IDE as you please.

Anonymous

Done!

Anonymous

What to do next? :P

DanielSank

just a sec

John Rennie

@Blue Here's the link

Anonymous

@JohnRennie Thanks. I will check it out. :) I'm just learning how to use cmd

Черенки

17:23

@DanielSank Can you recommend a lecture series which can be supported by a book?

DanielSank

> cd bin
> dir

@Черенки Nope.

John Rennie

@Blue Visual Studio provides a batchfile that sets all the paths and environment variables for you. You just run the batch file then you can build apps from the command line.

DanielSank

I cannot. I haven't used a lecture series to learn Python.

Черенки

@DanielSank what did you used to learn python?

DanielSank

@JohnRennie Yes yes, we'll do that next. Right now he has MinGW installed and we can probably just use that.

@Черенки Other people, StackOverflow, and Google search.

That's how most people learn to program.

Черенки

17:25

@DanielSank But I don't have people. I wantz books

DanielSank

@Blue well?

Anonymous

@JohnRennie Oh. Cool. I'll use that once I learn the intricacies of cmd. :P

Anonymous

@DanielSank One sec

DanielSank

@Черенки Yes, and as I've told you in plain language, I don't know any.

Anonymous

Sending the screenshot

Черенки

17:25

@DanielSank k

heather

try codecademy @Черенки

it's got a decent introduction to python.

DanielSank

cmd has the following important commands:
cd <path> "change directory"
dir "list what's in this directory"

Jaime Gallego

I tried Codecademy once and the next week I had already forgotten the material

John Rennie

That easy.

Anonymous

DanielSank

17:27

Yes, @JohnRennie, we know.

One thing at a time, please.

Jaime Gallego

There's the exe

DanielSank

Ok @Blue you see mingw32-gcc.exe?

Anonymous

checking...

Anonymous

ya

DanielSank

That's the compiler.

Is there anything else in that directory that you haven't included in the screenshot?

Anonymous

17:28

yay...then?

Anonymous

:)

DanielSank

I bet there are some other files you're not showing us.

Anonymous

@DanielSank Wait, I'm sending the screenshot of the upper half

DanielSank

Just copy/pate the text.

That's a lot easier.

Anonymous

Jaime Gallego

17:30

Good

Anonymous

@DanielSank Alright...next time

Anonymous

What to do now?

DanielSank

Yeah ok that's trying to look like a unix install of gcc, which is good.

Jaime Gallego

Now it's time to append the current directory path.

DanielSank

Ok now let's learn a tiny bit of how to use the command shell (cmd).

Anonymous

17:31

Okay?

DanielSank

Right now you're in a directory called C:\TDM-GCC-32\bin.

0ßelö7

@JohnRennie emergency GR session pls. Do you have my Skype (just text)? Don't want this on Stack Exchange.

DanielSank

Let's go to the directory where your source file is. Do you know the directory?

Anonymous

@DanielSank Yes

DanielSank

What is it?

John Rennie

17:31

@0ßelö7 Let me dig put my laptop. I don't have a camera on the PC.

Anonymous

@DanielSank It's in the Desktop

Jaime Gallego

Prolly C:\Users\[BLUE]\Desktop

DanielSank

Yeah so do this:

0ßelö7

@JohnRennie I said just text

DanielSank

> cd \Users\[BLUE]\Desktop

Where [BLUE] is your username on the machine.

0ßelö7

17:32

I just need to confirm my severe mental retardation

Anonymous

@DanielSank I don't think I ever set an username for the pc

Jaime Gallego

?????

DanielSank

I'm sure you did.

Anonymous

How do I find it out?

Anonymous

Or perhaps I don't know what my username on the pc is

Jaime Gallego

17:34

Well, you could dir the Users directory

DanielSank

yeah, do that

> cd \Users
> dir

Anonymous

Alright...

John Rennie

@0ßelö7 OK I have Skype running and I can see the session from last time we spoke. What do I do now?

0ßelö7

@JohnRennie Hmm. Send me a message? Don't know if I added you as a contact.

Anonymous

John Rennie

17:35

@0ßelö7 If it's just text can't we just use Hangouts?

DanielSank

@Blue oh I guess you're logged in as Administrator?

0ßelö7

@JohnRennie I'm not familiar

Jaime Gallego

Do you log in as Admin or as Public?

Anonymous

@DanielSank I think so

0ßelö7

do I access it from google +?

Jaime Gallego

17:36

If there was a whoami in Windows this would be solved already

Черенки

@0ßelö7 yes

DanielSank

Yeah, Windows is terrible but that's a discussion for another day.

ok @Blue do this

John Rennie

@0ßelö7 hangouts.google.com

DanielSank

> cd Administrator\Desktop
> dir

0ßelö7

@JohnRennie lots of people with your name

Jaime Gallego

17:37

Just Admin, I think

DanielSank

It's Administrator on my machine...

Jaime Gallego

Not on his, though

DanielSank

Oh you're right, Admin on Blue's machine.

Anonymous

Done with Admin

DanielSank

17:38

yes

what's in that directory?

Please just look for your source file and don't post a screenshot.

Is your source file there?

Anonymous

Yes. The sourcefile is on the Desktop. Named hello.c

DanielSank

Do you see it with you do dir in the command line?

Jaime Gallego

Good, now we can test it without changing the PATH.

DanielSank

We know you see it in the graphical desktop, but we don't know which user you are, so we need to check that the file is in Admin\Desktop.

Jaime Gallego

By using the full path for gcc.exe

Anonymous

17:40

Anonymous

Yes

DanielSank

Ok now here's the thing:

Windows doesn't know what gcc means. From the point of view of Windows, gcc is just some random file at a random location and there's absolutely no reason at all for cmd to keep track of where that file is.

Suppose you had two different files called gcc. When you type gcc in the command line, how could it possible know which one to run? Obviously, it can't.

So, the dumbest thing we can do to get started, is tell cmd exactly which program you want to run, like this:

Anonymous

My mom is calling me for dinner. Could we continue this after 10 mins? I'll get back as fast as possible

DanielSank

I may not be here.

Jaime Gallego

Boy you eat fast

I can be here.

DanielSank

17:44

\TDM-GCC-32\bin\gcc.exe -o hello hello.c

@JaimeGallego MinGW is pretty interesting. It comes with another package called Msys which tries to emulate a unix environment command shell.

Jaime Gallego

Yeah, it certainly took quite a bit of work to emulate the shell, but it's still an ugly kludge.

I don't even have Windows installed on my laptop.

@Blue should take the steps to install Arch Linux and learn tons about *nix on the way :)

DanielSank

@JaimeGallego Hmm, that's quite a time investment, eh?

Maybe good to learn Linux with something that's easy to set up first?

@Mithrandir24601 Slides

Everyone: That link goes to a slide presentation I made on superconducting qubits.

Windows users are on their own.

Jaime Gallego

Lol

DanielSank

It will probably work in Windows, but no guarantees.

This experience has made me appreciate things like Google Slides, which work for everyone and don't require a build step.

Maybe I should provide a pdf...

In fact, yeah I'll do that.

Jaime Gallego

Although "Build seminar.tex" is also vague for Linux users. They may not know about latexmk or the manual build process

Mithrandir24601

17:54

@DanielSank Ooh - thanks - I'll check that it works on Friday (deadlines on Thursday...) - at that point, I'll also be able to try removing the echo from the recording (it's apparently possible)

DanielSank

@Mithrandir24601 Woah, really? How?

@JaimeGallego Oh, crap.

I just use Texmaker so honestly I don't know what's going on under the hood.

John Rennie

@Blue @JaimeGallego @DanielSank Win10 contains a fully functioning Ubuntu subsystem. If you really want to you can just open a bash shell and apt-get gcc.

Anonymous

I hope I'm not too late :)

DanielSank

I gotta say that including a Linux system is one of the nicest things MS has done in a while.

Anonymous

Reading DS's instructions.....

DanielSank

17:56

12 mins ago, by DanielSank

\TDM-GCC-32\bin\gcc.exe -o hello hello.c

Anonymous

14 mins ago, by DanielSank

Windows doesn't know what gcc means. From the point of view of Windows, gcc is just some random file at a random location and there's absolutely no reason at all for cmd to keep track of where that file is.

Anonymous

@DanielSank Ah, trying that

John Rennie

Anonymous

DanielSank

Yes, nobody doubts that it work.

Anonymous

17:58

It guess it is working

Jaime Gallego

Yes

DanielSank

Yes

Jaime Gallego

It's compiler warnings now

Mithrandir24601

@DanielSank I've been told audacity can do it, but I'm not 100% sure if it can or not. That does at least suggest it's possible...

Anonymous

#include <stdio.h>
main()
{
char ch[100];
printf("Enter a sentence");
scanf("%[^\n]s",ch);
printf("%s",ch);
}

DanielSank

17:59

Ok now let's learn a bit about Windows before fixing the compiler warning.

@Mithrandir24601 That would be absolutely fantastic.

When you type a file name, like gcc, into cmd, it does the following:

1) Looks in the current directory for something called gcc. If it finds something, it runs it.

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