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user228700
7:00 AM
Yes. Alright, I understand :-) I read some very weird definitions of this just now and screwed up the definition that my mind had properly managed to understand before.
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@S007 @heather that's an interesting suggestion. The physics overflow was set up by people who left the Physics SE because they thought we were allowing too many beginners questions. In general relations between the two sites aren't especially friendly.
 
user228700
I will keep this in mind. OK, let me get this straight, for a given metal, this saturation current will remain constant no matter what intensity of light we shine on it?
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
But if they're willing to host a Physics Problems site then I would say we should give it a try.
@Kaumudi No, saturation current increases with intensity. Shall I explain why not or do you want to try and work it out.
 
user228700
@JohnRennie Knowing the answer, it's easy to figure out why :-P
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@S007 but bear in mind that Dilaton does not necessarily speak on behalf of the whole site. We'd need to agree the new site with the people who actually pay for the Physics Overflow.
@Kaumudi and the reason is?
Not that I doubt you :-)
 
Anonymous
7:05 AM
@JohnRennie I sent a mail. I'll inform you on getting a reply.
 
user228700
:-P I'm super dumb, so it's probably a good thing if u doubt me.
 
Anonymous
 
Anonymous
 
Anonymous
it explains saturation current
 
user228700
@S007 Thanks, but I think I understand it now :-)
 
user228700
7:08 AM
@JohnRennie: Since the energy of the wave depends only on its frequency, increasing the intensity of the wave is not going to change that.
 
user228700
What changes is the number of photons hitting the metal, (with the same amount of energy as before).
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
> Since the energy of the wave depends only on its frequency
Energy of the photon
 
user228700
Sorry, sorry!
 
user228700
I knew it the minute I typed it that I should stop and correct it, but was lazy. Editing now.
 
user228700
Oh, crap. Can't.
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
7:10 AM
But, yes, you're correct. Number of photons per second increases so number of photoelectrons per second increases so current increases.
 
user228700
Yeah, that's ^ what I was getting at.
 
user228700
OK, Thar's it for now. (:-P)
 
user228700
No, wait.
 
user228700
So it is safe to say that area on which light falls and frequency of light being constant, intensity is a measure of the number of photons emitted per second, yeah?
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
Yes
 
user228700
7:17 AM
OK :-) Thank you!! I will post a picture of those Gulab Jamuns in about an hour when I shall have them to make u oh so jealous :-P
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
Well I can get them in the UK, I just have to pay about ten times what you pay :-)
 
user228700
Yeah :/ And as u said, it's tedious to make them from scratch.
 
user228700
With that much money, I could probably buy a cycle :-P
 
user228700
What was it that u were having with meatballs BTW? Looked like some form of bread..?
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
Bread with grilled cheese on top.
 
user228700
7:22 AM
Yum :-D The meatballs...not so much :-P
 
Ramanujan
Ramanujan
@JohnRennie did you ever ate biryani?(because you looks food fan)
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@Ramanujan I enjoy eating Indian food, but you have to remember this is food cooked in the UK and I don't know how similar it is to what is cooked in India. I do like biriyani.
 
user228700
@JohnRennie I hope u're exercising everyday, to keep that heart of urs healthy :-)
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@Kaumudi I think we eat a lot more meat than you do, especially in the south of India. The meatballs were made from turkey meat, which is quite low fat so it's reasonably healthy.
 
user228700
@JohnRennie If I ever go to the UK, I will try (in addition to all sorts of local specialities) Indian food and tell u exactly how similar it is.
 
user228700
7:26 AM
@JohnRennie Hm, yes. Loads of vegetarians hereabouts.
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
I spent some time working in Pune, but the local food was very different to what Indian restaurants sere in the UK.
 
user228700
Yes, u told :-)
 
Anonymous
@Kaumudi In UK truly speaking you don't get good Indian food :-P I tried them and was fed up....mostly foreign cooks make them
 
Anonymous
@JohnRennie I agree
 
user228700
@S007 Oh. Well, that's not surprising, then.
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
7:28 AM
We did have a formal company dinner, and that was quite similar to the sort of Indian food we're served in the UK, though in the UK the meals are much sweeter. And I was suprised the meat had the bones left in. In the UK meat is always served with the bones removed.
 
user228700
@JohnRennie I dunno anything about meat but I feel so sorry that the Indian food served there is sweeter. Yuck.
 
user228700
@S007: Imagine something like paneer butter masala/any kind of tikka being sweet :|
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
Actually I found the meals at the company banquet a bit sour. I suppose I'm used to the slightly sweet curries served in the UK.
 
user228700
I see. Well, whatever works for u :-) I'm off to have sambar and rice, if u wanna know what I have for lunch everyday :-)
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
They aren't very sweet, though rich dishes like a paneer butter masala probably would be made quite sweet. I don't like the very sweet curries.
sambar?
 
user228700
7:32 AM
> Sambar, also spelt sambhar, is a lentil-based vegetable stew or chowder based on a broth made with tamarind. It is popular in South Indian and Sri Lankan Tamil cuisines.
 
Anonymous
@Kaumudi yeah...i had that sort of experience once in 2012, however, the only problem I think is they do not use much spices like in India
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
Sounds delicious :-)
 
Anonymous
Not that the cooks are bad....they are used to a different cuisine
 
user228700
@S007 Yes, precisely :-)
 
Anonymous
@Kaumudi btw which state are you from?
 
user228700
7:52 AM
@S007 Originally from Kerala, family's been settled in Chennai for the past 17 years (a.k.a Ever since I was born). What about u?
 
Anonymous
@Kaumudi Kolkata :-)
 
Anonymous
So are you preparing for Jee or for medical entrances ?
 
user228700
I see. MAFIA is also from there :-) Hm, where is he today? Probably celebrating Diwali :-P
 
user228700
@S007 JEE. U?
 
Anonymous
me too
 
Anonymous
7:56 AM
advanced?
 
user228700
Yep. In for the same battle eh? :-P
 
Anonymous
yeah...we are enemies on the battlefield ;-)
 
Anonymous
lol
 
user228700
Yeah lol :-P
 
Ramanujan
Ramanujan
iam too in
 
Anonymous
7:57 AM
@Ramanujan which class ?
 
Ramanujan
Ramanujan
11th
 
Anonymous
oh..you are a baby still :-P
 
Ramanujan
Ramanujan
you can say me junior,not baby
 
Anonymous
hehe :-D...just joking...you still got 1 and half years :-)
 
Ramanujan
Ramanujan
@S007 is jee tough?
 
Anonymous
8:05 AM
Honestly, yes.
 
Anonymous
But it all depends on you finally :-), how you take it.
 
Sanya
Sanya
9:16 AM
@S007 maybe on Area51, the proposal should be rewritten with the criticism in mind; some of your comments are actually confusing me as well (mathematical physics e.g. - I didn't see where that comes from)
 
Anonymous
Did you read the wikipedia meaning of Mathematical Physics ?
 
Anonymous
Image result for mathematical physics
The Journal of Mathematical Physics defines the field as "the application of mathematics to problems in physics and the development of mathematical methods suitable for such applications and for the formulation of physical theories". It is a branch of applied mathematics, but deals with physical problems.
 
Anonymous
@Sanya
 
Anonymous
No point in changing anything in the proposal now. Stack exchange employees just won't allow it
 
Sanya
Sanya
@S007 Mathematics is not about calculating
 
Anonymous
9:21 AM
When did i say that ?
 
Sanya
Sanya
or about doing elementary algebraic manipulcations
 
Anonymous
you are making false assumptions
 
Anonymous
Did you read John Rennie's answer ?
 
Sanya
Sanya
well, then I'm not seeing the point of the new site
 
Anonymous
He explains it quite well
 
Sanya
Sanya
9:22 AM
the question e.g. about what kind of entity a body in continuum mechanics is (a differentiable manifold in the easiest picture) is real Mathematics and good for Physics SE
the question about e.g. "how do I solve the harmonic oscillator with an external E-field" is off-topic here
 
Anonymous
@Sanya We had a 6 hour long discussion yesterday and we decided that we need a new site. You are not seeing the point because you did'nt read the discussion on the proposal
 
Sanya
Sanya
well ok, suit yourself
I'll keep talking with heather if needed
 
Anonymous
"how do I solve the harmonic oscillator with an external E-field" is off-topic here"----we want that on topic on the new site
 
Anonymous
provided effort is shown
 
Sanya
Sanya
THAT IS THE POINT
and THAT IS NOT MATH
this is what I have been talking about >_<
 
Anonymous
9:24 AM
That is "Mathematical Physics"
 
Sanya
Sanya
... I'm done with this
this is ridiculous
 
Anonymous
Me too. Well the highest rep member of the site agreed with the proposal too, FYI. If you feel it is ridiculous, okay. We don't mind.
 
Sanya
Sanya
I like the proposal
I am talking about your misuse of the term "mathematical physics"
 
Anonymous
what is wrong with that ?
 
Anonymous
no physics problem/exercise can be solved without maths
 
Anonymous
9:28 AM
"the application of mathematics to problems in physics and the development of mathematical methods suitable for such applications and for the formulation of physical theories"
 
Sanya
Sanya
mathematical physics is studying the mathematical structure of physical theories
not doing stupid calculations, that has nothing to do with professional maths
 
Anonymous
Well, that is YOUR definition. Not the widely accepted definition.
 
Sanya
Sanya
real mathematical physics questions are on topic here
 
Anonymous
See the Wiki article if you want. I can't continue on a debate over definitions.
 
Anonymous
Bye
 
Sanya
Sanya
9:30 AM
@S007 see the physics SE description of the tag "mathematical physics" which is a quite better source than wikipedia
but I can see that with you, poor heather has a really strong partner :>
 
Danu
Danu
@S007 This really is not what is commonly understood by mathematical physics.
2
 
Anonymous
9:59 AM
@Danu @Sanya Well, if you say so. But name is not our main concern. At present we are trying to contact PhysicsOverflow to allow the new site
 
Anonymous
Name...we can decide later
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@S007: Sanya's point is that the phrase mathematical physics is normally taken to mean advanced theoretical physics i.e. quantum field theory and general relativity.
 
Anonymous
I get that point. I appreciate the reminder.
 
Anonymous
@JohnRennie
 
Anonymous
Anyway I don't think that will be a good name
 
Anonymous
10:03 AM
for the site anyway
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
Your original idea Physics problems seems fine to me - keeps it simple and to the point.
 
Anonymous
@JohnRennie Sure. We will keep that.
 
Anonymous
10:23 AM
@JohnRennie yaaa! I got a reply :) "thanks for the mail, we already started discussion among the PO admins and I will reply in the email thread shortly to make suggestions how to organize things. Stay tuned ;-) – Dilaton 50 secs ago"
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@S007 OK, it looks like it's actually going ahead!! Now we just have to make the site a success, which is the hard part :-)
 
Physics Guy
Physics Guy
10:37 AM
@JohnRennie I'm from the future. Your site is goig to be very successful ;)
 
Secret
Secret
10:50 AM
 
David Z
David Z
@S007 oh dear :-/
 
Anonymous
@DavidZ what ?
 
David Z
David Z
We've had our share of serious problems with some of the big names behind PO
 
Secret
Secret
Caption: I was bored and thus I decided to put my personality traits against the crackpot index. Currently on item 29 and my total crackpot score is around 45, This is not very good...
 
Anonymous
Sometimes we need to forget rivalry and other problems in order to make something big :-)...anyway I'm not asking everyone on PSE to join it if created :-)...it is voluntary
 
Anonymous
11:00 AM
@DavidZ
 
Anonymous
:33209294
 
Secret
Secret
ok I surviving everything from 30-37
The highlighted items indicates patterns of thinking that I often have and is potentially dangerous in pulling me into a crackpot
 
David Z
David Z
@S007 Yes, and if you read, you will see that I didn't imply you were. I'm just saying, when you're considering taking advice from PO people, you should be aware of their past bad intentions toward this site.
 
Anonymous
@DavidZ Well maybe. I wasn't there at that time. Anyway it will not be related to PSE in any way. I like PSE the way it is :-)
 
David Z
David Z
Sure, I understand that. But you must understand that creating your new site, if it becomes popular, will cause significant changes in PSE. I'm not saying that's a bad thing; again, it's something to be aware of.
It's possible that some of the PO admins may see this as a chance to fracture the PSE community, and perhaps even kill off this site.
I don't know their intentions, but it is a possibility that they've thought about this.
 
Anonymous
11:10 AM
I agree and honestly hope that PSE remains intact..I really want no damage to this site !
 
Secret
Secret
While I might not have the risk to become the common anti GR, anti quantum etc. type crackpot that most crackpots fell into, I do have the risk of becoming the type of crackpot that (knowingly or unknowingly misuses) equations and their physical interpretation, because of my strong tendency to think of things in the form "A interact with B step by step" and mislead myself in the process. Therefore I must keep alert not to misunderstood things
 
Mew
Mew
To join what
 
David Z
David Z
@S007 Perhaps you mean that you hope this site continues to exist. If your site takes off, it will not be intact!
 
Secret
Secret
I hope when I get to learn QFT, the weirdness of QFT will cause me to forget about this "A interact with B step by step" mindset thus helping me to do things more accurately without bias
 
Mew
Mew
Link to the new site please, I"m keen
 
Secret
Secret
11:16 AM
-3
Q: Physics Problem Solving: NOT a duplicate of physics

heatherPhysics.SE specifically discourages exercise problems that cannot be boiled down to a single conceptual doubt, check-my-work questions, and problem solving questions. The goal of Physics Problem Solving is to help students of physics with those problems, as long as they show work. I might point ...

science
and related links therin
Also, @Mew, I have some news for you. Because by chance of the way newscientist organise their quantum seminar, I do managed to met Joan in person on 22/10/2016
 
Mew
Mew
wtf ITS CLOSED
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@DavidZ I'm sure Dilaton's motives for offering to host the new site are not entirely pure. However the new site will be specifically for the type of questions being tagged as homework-and-exercises here. This makes the site orthogonal to the Physics SE.
 
Mew
Mew
awesome
what did you say to her
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@DavidZ the more malign of the influences behind PO may well want to expand the site to compete with PSE but I think the chances of that happening are very slim. Frankly, the fact the new site allows homework will repel any serious physicists.
 
David Z
David Z
@JohnRennie well, nearly orthogonal. But anyway, I'm certainly not claiming that the mere existence of a problem-solving site will destroy PSE. I'm just concerned about how the PO admins may try to use it, if they are so inclined, to suck traffic away from us.
 
Secret
Secret
11:19 AM
@Mew 1. I told her about Acuriousmind's comment about her new article, and she said this will be addressed with the sum of parts method in a future QFT article. She said the QFT version would not be very difficult, but because of the initial lack of dynamics, it will be done in hamitonian formulism instead of lagrangians. She also said that right now sum of parts is a relatively unexplored field, thus she will be able to work on it without much competition
 
David Z
David Z
I'm also concerned about what sort of moderation standards they would enforce on the new site.
 
Mew
Mew
@Secret, cool, you didn't tell her my views on the theory did you?
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@DavidZ in what way? i.e. what about the possible moderation standards would give you cause for concern?
 
David Z
David Z
Well, you know their attitudes about rudeness.
This would not affect us here at PSE directly, of course; it's more of an altruistic concern.
 
Mew
Mew
why are you guys discxussing the new site, it's been closed as off topic
or as duplicate rather
 
Anonymous
11:22 AM
@Mew We are trying to host it outside SE network
 
Mew
Mew
ah do you have a link?
I'll defs be keen
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@DavidZ I don't actually. I've had as little as possible to do with PO. But if the site descends into the sewer it'll end up as little more than a variation of the physics forum with a smaller user base. And we have little to fear from the physics forum.
 
Mew
Mew
I've always thought a site that welcomes homework problems would be desirable as many learn from worked examples
 
Anonymous
@Mew They are still discussing it...the PO admins...wait a day or two...if it is made I will write a meta post
 
Mew
Mew
We can put adds up and make a nice profit
Why do you need PO admins?
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
11:24 AM
@Mew that's exactly how many of us feel, which is the reason for trying to set up a new site. But how this is all going to work out remains to be seen.
 
David Z
David Z
@JohnRennie Oh. Their attitude toward rudeness is that it should be allowed - what we consider rudeness, they call "frank criticism". If you can't take the insults, then your recourse is to leave the site.
 
Secret
Secret
2. I also told her the full story on how I read about her paper (to which she said it went viral on reddit when it was first posted to her surprise). I also showed her the exact sequence of chat logs I have with you, (unfortunately, due to usernames not being real names, she does not seemed to recognise you, though she does mention two of her PhD student's name (one is Josh, the other I forgot but also a guy))

Because I do end up showing her the full chat log, the only thing I recall about you mention about your views about the theory is that you planned to do a QFT project based on her pa…
 
David Z
David Z
My understanding was that that was the main reason they left and set up a new site. The prevalence of homework questions here was a secondary reason.
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@DavidZ the main reason they left was elitism. They felt we were pandering to the masses.
 
David Z
David Z
@JohnRennie well, that too. But the rudeness was definitely part of it.
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
11:26 AM
And they are certainly an elite in the sense of a small minority :-) So I guess their experiment worked.
 
Anonymous
I think the reason they are trying to host a new site is to attract more traffic...at present they get very few questions per day...
 
Mew
Mew
@Secret, that's ok, i just didn't want her to be offended of my views on the theory
she doesn't seem to have remembered me which I think is good because I wish to remain anonymous
 
Secret
Secret
ok I see
 
David Z
David Z
@S007 the PO people? Well, every site wants to attract more traffic, but that's certainly not their only reason, and probably not even the main one.
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@DavidZ Anyway, the new site, if it goes ahead, is only going to work if it manages to get enough skilled members willing to answer questions. I suspect that's going to be a struggle even in perfect circumstances and there's a good chance the new site will lapse into senesence. If the new site isn't a nice place to be that will just make the decline faster.
 
Mew
Mew
11:31 AM
Rudeness should be not tolerated plain and simple
There is no need for rudeness
No matter how silly a quesiton is, one should respond with empathy and care
Most people visiting the site will be there to learn, and it is easy for those with knowledge to ridicule and be "frank" to those with less knowledge, but this doesn't aid the learning process
It's merely a power trip to the one with knowledge
 
Secret
Secret
Well, based on that section of chat log I have with you (which begins with me posting the link to the paper and end with your QFT plans), you don't seemed to have anything that can offend her. In fact, similar to me, we are btoh very supportative of the theory presented.

3. Finally after clarifying all my questions about that paper (which I have notes jotted somewhere), I wish her progress on the theory and I cannot wait the experiment to have the final say on it and hoping the theory holds
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@DavidZ If you look at the people interested in contributing to the new site they are all people with a proven track record of contributing positively to the SE (various sites). The new site is only going to succeed if it retains those people, which means following similar standards to the SE.
 
Mew
Mew
@Secret, ok no worries, awesome that you were lucky enough to meet her
 
Secret
Secret
yeah, I never believe I can actually follow up netizen questions and thus achieving some kind of closure. (TBC)
 
David Z
David Z
@JohnRennie Yeah, that's kind of my point. If the new site is hosted by the PO admins, I'm concerned that they may object to following SE-like standards. Or even if they don't object outright, I worry that the mods of the new site would not have the support they need from the admins when it comes to dealing with rudeness.
 
Mew
Mew
11:36 AM
So the PO users are setting up the site?
Why don't we set up our own competing site
And when the users leave the rude PO site, they will come to our friendly site
 
David Z
David Z
@Mew I don't know, but from what I heard it seems like that is an option being considered
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@DavidZ we can't know. Maybe the whole thing will descend into acrimony and maybe it won't. However I think it's worth a try.
 
Mew
Mew
I think the site should be called domyhomework.com
 
David Z
David Z
Well, my concerns are such that I would be reluctant to refer people to a site administered by the PO people.
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@Mew we tried setting up our own site on the SE and the proposal got closed.
 
Mew
Mew
11:38 AM
@JohnRennie, I"m talking about independent of SE
Our own site
We're the bosses
 
Anonymous
@mew Just understand one thing. The new site isn't meant to COMPETE. It is rather meant to answer questions beyond the scope of PSE. And it will not be a "HOMEWORK SITE"
 
Anonymous
@Mew who will host it?
 
Mew
Mew
@S007, we'll find a host, independent of SE network
 
Anonymous
Can you host a new site outside SE ?
 
Mew
Mew
yeah
 
Anonymous
11:39 AM
If you find, tell us'
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@Mew The amount of work and money needed to create and run a site like the Stack Exchange is frightening.
 
Mew
Mew
I have my own websites
really?
 
Anonymous
I don't know of any...it takes a lot of resources
 
Anonymous
@Mew what website ?
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@Mew Yes really. have a look at some of the javascript that runs the SE sites!
 
Mew
Mew
11:39 AM
@S007, one is a private website, the other is in development
 
Secret
Secret
As for myself, I get clarified about the conceptual parts of her paper, such as how in her model, we start with things localised in spacetime, and then T violation generate both forward and backward dynamics thus the flow of time. This is different form my initial understanding as I though time flowonly towards the future in her model while actually it flows both ways. She then said in such a scenario matter will be flowing one way (antimatter for the other) through time and we cannot distinguish
 
Mew
Mew
I can't share the private one as it has my personal details
But the traffic is fairly low
 
Anonymous
@mew A public website needs a lot of hardware support as well as good programmers....
 
Mew
Mew
So maybe the server isn't suitable for high traffic site
 
Anonymous
If you wish to spend the money...tell us :-P
 
Mew
Mew
11:41 AM
Well depends how much it costs
 
David Z
David Z
@Mew honestly, even a simple server will do pretty well for a moderately high-traffic site. PSE could be hosted on an inexpensive server or two without much trouble.
 
Mew
Mew
NEarlyfreespeech is what my sites are on
pretty cheap there
 
heather
heather
Geesh, a lot happened while I was sleeping! Okay, read through the whole transcript...
 
Mew
Mew
@heather, we're branching out and creating our own site
domyhomework.com
 
heather
heather
@Sanya, if you have any questions I can answer them. Mathematical physics was indeed perhaps a poor language choice.
 
Mew
Mew
11:43 AM
which will have subsites in physics, maths, chem etc.
 
heather
heather
@Mew, please tell me that is not the url.
 
Mew
Mew
why not?
 
Anonymous
@mew If you can make the arrangements for a new site...well and good...first make them and then tell us
 
Anonymous
But let me tell you...creating a SE like site isn't easy.
 
Mew
Mew
@S007, if you want to be in, then we have to do it together
 
Anonymous
11:44 AM
We need a lot of good programmers too
 
heather
heather
@JohnRennie,@S007, I'm very sorry, but I think going with Physics Overflow is, um, perhaps not the best of ideas. I'm with @DavidZ on this one. However, I'm ready to consider it. I guess I just have some questions about how this will work.
 
Mew
Mew
We're all good programmers here
 
heather
heather
@Mew, or wait, are we now creating our own site?
 
Mew
Mew
Are you in heather?
 
heather
heather
Wait, just timeout, please.
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
11:45 AM
@heather: ignore Mew. His statements bear little relation to what is actually happening.
 
Anonymous
@mew I've no experience on this issue. So I don't think I can help much
 
Anonymous
@JohnRennie i agree :-P
 
Mew
Mew
@S007, we need programmers, and we need people who can bring in users
 
heather
heather
@JohnRennie, thank you. Would you mind summarizing what exactly happened over the past 12 hours? Apparently the transcript didn't quite explain everything. =P
 
Mew
Mew
Both aspects are equally important
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
11:46 AM
One of the people from PO saw the discussion here and (informally) offered to host the new site on the PO servers. That's all.
 
heather
heather
Okay, and what's all this Mew is talking about?
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
We've had no formal offer so it's all very hypothetical.
 
heather
heather
Right...
 
Mew
Mew
@heather, the PO users are rude and will scare the users away quickly
 
Anonymous
 
Mew
Mew
11:47 AM
I believe the users from our community can build a superior site
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
As for what Mew is talking about, only he knows :-)
 
heather
heather
@JohnRennie, okay, gotcha. Thank you.
 
Mew
Mew
lol, alright John, I guess it's just me who's in
keep a look out for domyhomework.com in the news
 
heather
heather
So, I guess I have several points I might bring up here.
First, I have some doubts about physics overflow.
As a physics user, I'd feel slightly like a traitor doing this, but that's not my main problem.
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@heather I share your concerns about the PO, and if it looks as if they're just looking for a way to undermine the PSE I won't have anything to do with them.
 
heather
heather
11:48 AM
My main problem/question is this: how much are the moderators there going to be involved?
Because basically, the more they are involved, the less I want to do it.
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
I think we all have a pretty clear vision of the remit for the new site, and if the PO mods start interfering with that I doubt any of us will continue to be interested.
But, as I said, this is currently purely hypothetical.
 
Mew
Mew
What server are the PO mods going to run the new site on?
 
Anonymous
@JohnRennie Dilaton made a comment on Meta...check that...I think we need to understand the procedure first
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
The decision will ultimately be made by the people at PO holding the purse strings, and they aren't the mods!
 
heather
heather
In my mind, it would be better to rally a bunch of support and show Robert that we do indeed have enough people who want to do this to really make the site great. Because his focus is on advertising, right? So if we get a bunch of people to follow it in the first couple of hours and get it to commitment stage like a day later, then maybe that will show that there's enough support for it to make it worth it.
 
Anonymous
11:51 AM
@JohnRennie we do not run our own server, so we can not offer hosting as such. But hosting, for example on one.com where also PhysicsOverflow lives, dose not cost the world. What we can do is offer (at first) a basic version of our software (including LaTex, the ability to import (for example closed) questions, regain access to their imported accounts for SE users who want to join the project.
 
Anonymous
What is needed to start it is get hosting and a volunteer superadmin who is willing to install the software in accordance with the instructions of our system developper. – Dilaton 3 mins ago
 
heather
heather
I guess I just don't really trust the people at physics overflow to do what they say they are going to do. I'm still all for the project, don't get me wrong, I just am not sure that this is going to work out the way we want. Which is why I suggested further trying to persuade Robert.
 
Mew
Mew
@heather, robert is right however in that the new site doesn't belong as part of the SE network
 
David Z
David Z
@heather Advertising is not their main concern. I'm not sure they even show ads on SE sites, except for Stack Overflow.
 
heather
heather
@JohnRennie, @S007, but then, I could just be doing wishful thinking, what do you think?
@DavidZ, what is the thing they want?
 
Anonymous
11:54 AM
I think we are overthinking.
 
heather
heather
No, I think we need to consider all the possibilities here.
 
David Z
David Z
I'm not quite sure what Robert is getting at there, but I think his concern is rooted in fragmenting the existing PSE community. Normally, this is a good thing. If we get people starting up random proposals about subsets of physics, we would want those proposals to be shut down as duplicates of this site because splitting a community among two sites drains them both.
This idea that sites need to be topically oriented is new to me, though.
 
heather
heather
This is a big thing we're suggesting here ("Let's go to physics overflow") and we really need to think it through.
@DavidZ, what then could we do to persuade Robert?
 
David Z
David Z
Let me see if I can talk to him and maybe better understand what his objections are.
I can try to reach him through the mod chat.
 
heather
heather
@DavidZ, thank you. I just feel like this would help both sites, by bringing more of the homework stuff to our site, increasing traffic for us and decreasing clutter for you.
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
11:56 AM
OK so it looks as if what PO are offering is the use of their software, but we would need to set up and pay for our own separate site. So on the one hand it wouldn't be ruled by the PO mods, but on the other hand it wouldn't be free.
 
David Z
David Z
I think if he knows that the moderators and community here are in favor of this (if, indeed, we all are), it will assuage some of his objections.
 
Anonymous
@JohnRennie How much will it cost? Any idea?
 
heather
heather
@JohnRennie, and, um, I hate to say this, but a. I don't really have any money and b. I think my parents just might object to sending it for a new internet site. =P
 
David Z
David Z
@JohnRennie I thought their software was freely available elsewhere. It's not their software, it's just the software that they happen to use.
 
Mew
Mew
While I think the idea of the site is great. I think Robert is correct that having 2 physics sites would lead to confusion.
 
heather
heather
11:57 AM
@DavidZ, okay, thanks again. (I hope all physics moderators are in favor.)
 
Mew
Mew
@JohnRennie, I"ll pay for 100% ownership
 
heather
heather
@JohnRennie, and I might add that there now seems that there is a chance that Robert can be persuaded to reopen the proposal.
 
David Z
David Z
@heather I guess... though I haven't really heard from the others about it.
 
Anonymous
@mew man, first see the price tag :-P
 
John Rennie
John Rennie
@heather I'm not going to be paying for it either :-)
 
Mew
Mew
11:58 AM
lol true
 
Secret
Secret
@RobertCartaino Physics mod here - there does seem to be quite a split in our community regarding how strictly we should prevent people from seeking homework help. Some of the more influential people prefer to make problem-solving questions off topic entirely, so that the site doesn't become known as a place to cheat on homework, but there is a significant other group that thinks such questions should be on topic because of their potential usefulness as teaching tools. Splitting the site, as is proposed here, would presumably resolve that ongoing controversy. — David Z 51 mins ago
 
heather
heather
@DavidZ, is there anything I could do to persuade the various moderators?
 
Mew
Mew
but i think a site like this, with the current community involved too, will be a success
 
David Z
David Z
Anyway, depending on how things go with the new site, it would influence our ongoing discussion of the replacement for the homework-like close reason one way or the other.
@heather I don't know; actually I'm not sure that anyone needs persuading.
 
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