The h Bar - 2017-12-13 (page 1 of 5)

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12:00 AM

Hats are now live! Please try to not break the site too badly.

2

Huh, kind of weird seeing them on the new topbar

what's a hat

@ACuriousMind "This is fine" is going to cause a ton of spam in the comments...

@enumaris An article of clothing that typically covers the head

sounds bizarre

12:02 AM

@enumaris Oh, they're things you can decorate your profile pic with

why would you want to cover your head

@SirCumference Only if you misunderstand what it's awarded for :P

You have to unlock them.

You get it for deleting 10 comments from 2017, why would that cause comment spam?

@ACuriousMind Tons of people are gonna write comments and delete them like crazy

12:03 AM

...why would they not just delete any 10 comments they made during the year?

@ACuriousMind I guess this is easier if they want to keep their old comments, or not destroy old conversations

SE thought of that: Click on the hat, it says:

@enumaris See the snowflake icon in the topbar? If you click that and click the words "Winter Bash", you'll see all the different hats and how to unlock them

> delete 10 of your own comments posted in 2017 before the start of Winter Bash [emphasis mine]

what

I don't see a snowflake

12:05 AM

@enumaris On any non-chat page on SE?

oh, I see

@enumaris Yeah, click the words "winter bash" for a list

There are also secret hats that don't show up on that list. But usually they get discovered and are listed in a meta post as they are found

E.g.

4

Q: Winter Bash 2017 Hats

Well here's the traditional Winter Bash hats post. Same as last year there are two (and only two) answers: one for the secret hats, and one for the regular hats. Remember there are no hats for guessing secret hat triggers, nor one for pinging SE employees. Only edit the secret hat answer wi...

discussion winter-bash secret-hats winter-bash-2017

Actually this is the new page for secret hats. It'll get updated as people find them

12:23 AM

is there a blue hat

We don't know yet, the unearned hats are not displayed in colour

1 hour later…

1:31 AM

ahhhh

1:44 AM

my profile pic doesn't really work with a hat tho

2:14 AM

@enumaris You can change it :P

kinda lazy tho

2:38 AM

@ACuriousMind how did you get that hat

'Tis a secret (I actually have no idea :D)

you have less then 15 hours to tell me or yo-

oh

rip blue hat

@ACuriousMind what's your favourite nut butter?

...nut butter? As in peanut butter?

yes

what did you think I meant.....?

I don't think I've ever had any nut butter except for peanut, and I don't particularly like that

2:42 AM

interesting

there seems to be a lot of variation between different brands though

every kind of peanut butter i've tried tastes different

my fav is pecan50%peanut50% mix

but i like cashew too

cashew is like 30 bucks a jar though

@ooolb Should be on that meta post I linked

i already checked that

it said it's secret

so there's no single way to get it and the way listed is impossible for me

1 hour later…

4:10 AM

20'th century won out

:)

4:54 AM

wot

The fall of western civilization

out of the loop

oh wow

Seems like he actually lost in 'bama

that's pretty surprising

what the fock are you people talking about

Hence my comment

It’s the end of days

5:05 AM

is it a USA thing?

I’m gonna pass out now

truly the end of days

alright is someone gonna spill the beans or should i kms

Do that

Good night

:'(

Captain Bohemian

5:10 AM

@ooolb you are still talking about peanut butter. You even have eaten mutiple kinds of peanut butters. It's like you like peanut butters very much. I have not eaten peanut butter for long. Since I ate once in my childhood and had the impression that I don't like it, I have never eaten it again.

oh

well you need to get the real peanut butters

the oilless ones that are like cream cheese are kinda bad

Captain Bohemian

I like to eat peanut soup.

wadat

Captain Bohemian

I don't know. I found I seem to like whole grain no matter which kinds of foods are concerned. Besides the example of peanut, another example is that I like sesame in whole grain, but don't like pulverized sesame.

oh

you eat the skin on peanuts?

that's not edible i don't think

Captain Bohemian

5:19 AM

no, i remove it.

then what?

Captain Bohemian

i also prefer red bean, green bean in whole grain rather than the pulverized version of them in bread.

wait a min

why does your bread have beans in it?

Captain Bohemian

that's just one kind of flavor, otherwise just bread tastes insipid.

just like you eat rice with dishes, not just rice, which tastes insipid.

I have plain rice all the time

i like bland food personally

not a fan of flavours

Captain Bohemian

5:29 AM

i have never heard anybody that way.

I am going out to hunt for food.

I feel insipid food very intolerable. I like very spicy food.

i don't drink bland water often, either.

what's non-bland water?

5:45 AM

@ooolb There was a special election in the US state of Alabama today.

Hotly contested. Controversial.

The democrat appears to have won.

Which is a thing that just doesn't happen since the end of the democratic dominance in the "solid south" (another search terms here is "southern strategy").

i figured that much

but why is it important

Had it gone the other way president Trump would have been in a much stronger position to push his policy agenda. With this result his position doesn't change much: he has to keep enough support from the handful of senators in his party who have refused to simply fall in line to pass much of anything.

^ That's the immediate result.

lol so...

were the comments above ironic?

In the longer term it might represent a trend—divisive in the short term I would guess—that could change the basic electorial math.

@ooolb Not sure.

user228700

@JohnR: Hi! Was just wondering where you were! :-)

5:57 AM

@Kaumudi.H morning :-)

I'm tending to stay in bed half an hour longer now it's so cold and dark in the mornings :-)

@JohnRennie just so we're clear i'm not homophobic (cf. last week)

i got banned before i could reply

@ooolb I never thought you were

well you called me out on it twice, (i felt was wholly inappropriate even considering what I said but, alright)

My problem was you were using the word homo as an insult.

ah

you're assuming it was an insult

but there was no indication it was

user228700

6:00 AM

@JohnRennie Ah, I see.

I know it was just a playground insult and not meant to be serious, but other people will take it seriously.

That's a thing that was common among boys when I was youngster, too.

And many of us didn't connect it to anything at all—it was just a word.

I meant homo as the genus lmao

you know like

Agreed, and that's why I didn't ban you - I just deleted the post.

homo sapien sapiens

i flipped it to

(you know what don't wanna get banned again)

6:01 AM

The thing is that if a mod/room owner deletes a post of yours just move on.

A rather nasty side-effect of hate so permiating a culture that there is no push-back in public.

@JohnRennie well i wasn't mad you deleted it :p

but you called it homophobic

and

You made a fuss of it, then someone flagged your fussmaking (it wasn't me) and that got you a 30 minute suspension.

that's insulting to me

Then you reacted badly to that, and that got you the 24 hour suspension.

6:02 AM

well no i just said

"i'm not homophobic idiot"

and got 30 mins

lol

and then idk who it was but

My point is, if you had said nothing, just ignored it, then nothing would have happened.

i wanted to break the ice by making a navy seal meme

but I wasn't trying to argue!

i was poking fun at my own suspension

Part of the reason I delete posts is if I think they will be flagged i.e. I'm deleting them partly to protect the person who posted them.

lol

thanks but i didn't get banned from our ordeal

i got banned because I said i'm gonna find whoever keeps flagging (also got 0celo7 banned)

it was supposed to be sarcasm but

¯_(ツ)_/¯

There are some over enthusiastic flaggers around.

6:05 AM

@JohnRennie that's fine but

i don't get why i got 24 hrs

But remember that it takes two people to confirm a flag for the 30 minute suspension to apply.

the flag gave me 30 mins, then i got 24 hours during the 30 mins

Sarchasm: the gulf between the speaker who thinks they're making a joke and the listener who thinks they're not

someone in the room gave me 24 hours for no reason

and i felt that was entirely uncalled for

it wasn't ACM so I have no idea who

The 24 hour ban was for threatening to hunt other room users down. I realise it wasn't meant seriously, but it looked serious.

6:06 AM

why is saying "i'mma find you"

@ooolb Me neither. Room owners can't issue bans (which suits me fine)

equal to "hunting someone down"

those aren't even

urggggg

and then a pinned star for "threatening to hunt down other users in real life"

@ooolb It was a mod from another room. Seemed appropriate to me.

oh, really?

can you justify it please then

curious

@ooolb if taken literally it was an aggressive and threatening statement.

6:09 AM

hey @rob i'm gonna find you.

where's my 24 hours?

You know you didn't mean it literally, but other people don't.

ya but how is that ^ above different?

if you're gonna ban me that day

ban me now then?

i guess some rando mod who has no business here just dropped by

and didn't know me and decided that i should be banned for 24 hrs

@ooolb Repeated troublemaking usually leads to progressively longer suspensions. After a day usually comes a month.

oh that's troublemaking?

I would rather talk about basically anything other than "why was I suspended yesterday"

6:12 AM

i guessed the reason in my last message

i don't care but i'm just saying lots of you seem to think it was deserved

which is bothering kind of

Let's move on to something interesting that doesn't involve slurs or threats

@ooolb I would have just deleted the message, but I can see why you got the ban.

:|

whether serious or not

It looked like you were directly threatening the person who flagged you.

6:13 AM

wait though why is finding someone irl bad?

how do you know i didn't want to find them to give them a hug?

i didn't threaten anything but alright let's move on

You're being disingenuous now.

Anonymous

@ooolb lolol XD

nah because i never meant to threaten anyone, the comment itself was a meme, from the navy seal copy pasta which i made more chat appropriate.

>still gets banned

user228700

@JohnRennie Disingenuous is a nice word!

The point is, if anything kicks off then back away. Let it go. Move on.

6:15 AM

either way there was no threat and i'm not being disingenuous @JohnRennie because there was no threat to begin with.

@Kaumudi.H I like it :-)

@ooolb if you genuinely don't think your post was threatening then you have a problem understanding the way other humans think.

user228700

Ugh, I should probably start studying ISE, seeing as the exam is tomorrow...

drama

@JohnRennie I have autism.

@Kaumudi.H ISE?

@ooolb then you need to bear that in mind when posting.

user228700

6:16 AM

@JohnRennie Introduction to Sustainable Engineering.

Anonymous

@ooolb Dude, stop and move on, man. It's been two days since that ban.

@Blue more like a week but ya

i was making sure ppl didn't actually think I was serious lol

@Kaumudi.H Mug up stuff. You will pass easily

@ooolb thanks, I must admit I feel better now we've discussed it.

@Kaumudi.H I guess that's the sort of course no-one really wants to do but you have no option :-(

user228700

Yes :-/

user228700

6:19 AM

6 modules to learn, gosh!

@JohnRennie well, irl people know i'm being sarcastic because i smile or make some body language indication that it's sarcasm.

so it works fine

and thankfully there are no irl mods or i'd be banned from life

@ooolb in chat, you need to provide an emoticon at the end.

Anonymous

@ooolb Sure, no. But there are mods from others rooms who don't have time to read the context of your messages, if flagged. I was once banned for saying something like "I watch IPL only for the cheerleaders" in another chat room and some mod thought it was sexist and anti-feminist. :P

Even emoticons are not a reliable was of defusing posts online.

Anonymous

The flag system does have some issues, nothing to do about it.

6:21 AM

Basically, in an online forum like this think before you post.

i think I got banned for asking if someone had autism once in the chat

if that's not incredibly ironic idk what is

i was dying of laughter

@ooolb because autistic is used as an insult.

TIL i'm an insult

feels bad dood

I went through a phase in my twenties when I thought it'd be funny to harass people jokingly because they'd see what a nice guy I actually was and that I wasn't serious ... stopped when my wife asked me to explain why I had turned into such an asshole.

@ooolb The people who use it as an insult generally have no idea what it means.

6:22 AM

@Blue Feminism isn't working great these days anyway

Don't want to be misinterpreted? Then be clear

@Kaumudi.H is this the last exam?

random observation: if people don't take words like autistic, gay, or whatever as insults and don't be so sensitive to it, it will make the people who are those things feel better I believe.

it sucks to feel that what you are is an insult.

Anonymous

@ooolb That's some good point there

like you don't get banned for calling someone normal.

6:26 AM

I was called a swot (the word nerd wasn't used in the UK in the 60s) since I was at primary school.

if I say @Blue, are you depressed? that's totally fine.

And it was meant as an insult.

but if I say @Blue, are you autistic? then i'm banned

That's the way other humans are.

though both are psychological conditions.

well other humans who aren't those things themselves I feel should fock off

6:26 AM

@ooolb The Sensitivity to it is because we feel we haven't done enough for those people.

and let those people speak for themselves

@Sid heh

alright so now they need other people's help?

But other humans won't behave the way you want them to, or even the way you consider logical.

You have to deal with that.

@ooolb No. But, other people haven't been terribly nice to them in the past either.

It is a more protective stance and even if you feel it is wrong, that's how the world works

Anonymous

@ooolb I'm sure the tone matters

but for depressed it doesn't so my point still holds.

Anonymous

6:30 AM

Yeah, that's because historically "Are you depressed?" wan't used as a insult

@ooolb This seems dangerously like victim-blaming. "I just said a word, your reaction is your problem." There's a lot of interpersonal interaction missing there.

@Sid people will continue to use those words as insults because they know it triggers everyone and that people do take it as an insult. if people just accept it and don't care then it can't be used as an insult anymore.

@ooolb slowly but steadily people are coming to realise that using words like that as insults is no longer acceptable. After all, this all started because I deleted a post where it looked as if the word homo was being used as an insult.

and i'm saying that did not help anyone but we've moved on from that

Things will change, but change like that comes slowly and a bit at a time.

But if you confront people you just annoy them and harden their attitudes.

6:34 AM

@ooolb People use those words as threats: "you've been identified as some sort of outsider and you're in danger now."

@JohnRennie @ACuriousMind @DavidZ @BernardoMeurer @Kaumudi.H @0celo7 I am impressed by the second sentence of this post:

1

Q: Adding gauge fixing directly by hand is different from by Lagrange multiplier?

Why is adding gauge fixing directly different from doing so by Lagrange multiplier? For simplicity, we don't use field model. Direct method Consider a system $$L(x,\dot x,y,\dot y)=\frac{\dot x^2}{2}+\dot x y+\frac{(x-y)^2}{2} \tag{1} \, .$$ This system has gauge symmetry $$\delta x=f(t),\ \de...

classical-mechanics gauge-theory constrained-dynamics

"For simplicity, we don't use the field model."

You don't get to erase that cultural history by personal fiat in a chat room

perhaps where you live

in canada it's not like that

everybody is accepting basically

if you say something like that you will be the minority

Anonymous

I need to shift to Canada, then :P

so barely anyone does

6:37 AM

@rob Ho boy, we're having that conversation?

I find @ACuriousMind's definition of "offense" rather like a breath of fresh air whenever this sort of issue comes up.

@ooolb Canada is cool. The World is not.

ya but that's the world i'm used to

so idk how y'all work

Anonymous

Are you a fair representation of Canadian people?

no

why do you ask?

@rob Victim-blaming only comes into it if there's a victim.

6:41 AM

well in some areas I could be.

So, to be clear, who's the victim in this situation?

And what are they a victim of?

nobody

that's why it's dumb

people are defending the victim that didn't* exist

That's what I'm wondering, and is why I asked Rob the question that I asked.

But see, there could be some victims. It depends on who says what and with what tone.

Suppose I call you a strawberry. Like, I just come here one day and say say "@ooolb, you are a strawberry".

ban @DanielSank

i'm a blueberry

There's no context at all. We're not having an argument. Calling someone a strawberry has zero precedence as far as either of us knows, right?

6:44 AM

@ooolb I got banned for saying that

So there are no victims.

Like a mod literally banned me for calling people normies

lmao

and I wasn't really calling anyone particular that

^ tone is essential there

6:44 AM

It was obviously a joke

"y'all are normies" or smthing like that

@DanielSank Remind me what this is.

I don't think the people really understand what an insult is

Anonymous

@BalarkaSen It's not something objective, first of all. Not necessary everyone should understand it the same way as you do. :P

As I was saying... if I come here and get into a discussion with @ooolb, and we're talking about interpretations of quantum mechanics, and I say "ooolb, you are clearly an idiot, lacking any and all intelligence, and a curse upon your children and your children's children", then I have literally partaken in offense.

Mithrandir24601

@BalarkaSen I'm insulted by that remark ;P

6:46 AM

I have made a comment which serves no logical purpose in the discussion. My comment serves only to hurt, to attack.

In this case, there is (from some point of view) a victim.

@BalarkaSen remember last week. I said (in response to the user flagging every message) "you're probably finding this incredibly funny and laughing behind your laptop right now but i'll find you"

and I got 24 hours

ooolb is the victim of my attack.

and then ACM said this

Dec 9 at 17:56, by ACuriousMind

@ooolb Yes. Threatening to hunt down other users in real life, even in jest, is unacceptable and this is not up for debate.

that is ridiculous

on every level

^ That does sound overboard.

well @rob sure felt it was deserved

6:48 AM

Some times the mods play conservatively. I don't really blame them, but some times it's too much.

I wasn't there, so I ain't saying more on that.

fair.

Now, suppose I say "@ooolb, you are a dumb as a person from Timbuktu".

What @ooolb is saying, on the other hand, is of theoretical value. If we use an insult more and more as a loose, friendly banter, we'd reduce the value of the insult. It's true we need to stop putting every other word in a higher stature. But more practically, I don't think it's a good approach to go off calling people "autistic".

Now we have two victims.

@BalarkaSen thanks man I say deep things when I'm half asleep at my laptop and have no idea what i'm really saying

6:50 AM

@ooolb I did think it was kind of over the top but you were trolling so I wasn't really sure if I really did not support it

@BalarkaSen i was in my trolling phase

lol

I am not only attacking @ooolb, but I'm also implying that people from Timbuktu are dumb.

Now, @rob, which victim were you referring to? I'm still not sure what you meant.

@Blue Yes, but what everybody should understand is "normie" is a word originating from 4chan. It literally means you're a normal person, capable of social interaction and having a girlfriend.

It's like a self-insult lmao

The mod percieved it as a derogatory word against normal people

Like, come on san

@BalarkaSen I don't recommend using 4chan language in a moderated chat...

6:53 AM

What is "4chan language"?

the closest clinical word for it would be NT.

You use memes. That comes from 4chan.

That's a ridiculous thing to say

@rob Roughly put: an offense is a motion to attack intelligence, character, etc. particularly in lieu of contributing to the logical discussion at hand.

lol i'm barely able to keep my eyes open

gnight you humans

'night

6:56 AM

@ooolb Good night you animal.

roasted

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