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00:00 - 22:0022:00 - 00:00

00:41
@Shaun Markvs seems to be a well-known blank (substitute malcontent to be polite).
2
if you can't say anything nice,
                                                                         .
You are the one who educated me, leslie.
i have a phd in cyber stalking
Has Munchkin ducked today?
yes. there were no shovelers at the pond. i hope that guy we told about the shovelers didn't go today.
there was something with a long, curved, ibis-like beak that wasn't an ibis. still working on an ID for that.
00:45
Did the shovelers apply for a sabbatical?
they're only resident in our area during winter, but it seems premature for them to have left. maybe they were at an adjacent pond.
You should have sent out a search party.
hello all!
we also have a pair of hummingbirds who are perching on our holiday lights every day. we are thinking of keeping the lights up just for them.
01:03
whyyyy are people working with graduate level textbooks with less-than-undergraduate-level preparation.
subtweeting nobody.
This is not a new phenomenon. Did you find someone trying to study functional analysis without knowing what a metric space is?
there's someone who appears to be working at random through earlier chapters of an operator algebras book.
that's about every senior student in my department.
i answered one question, got a reply and follow-up indicating both an absence of understanding and a personal feeling of understanding.
and the questions just keep coming.
i'm sitting them out but a number of high rep users are joining in.
it seems fruitless.
interestingly, they pass the exams.
somehow.
01:08
There are several people posting geometry questions that I now just routinely ignore.
i really don't understand it. it would make sense if someone is just doing extremely unguided self-study.
if this is part of a degree program, i dunno what is going on.
and it probably is.
@sevdaicmis I frequently had students in my upper-division math courses who had passed basic calculus and linear algebra without having learned much of anything. I frequently complained that my colleagues' standards were woeful.
i just don't get it. these are books i regard as semi-unapproachable and i have a phd in this exact field.
someone, somewhere, has dropped the pedagogical ball.
Not even to discuss proof-writing skills ....
Well, I thought you regarded all books as semi- or utterly unapproachable, @leslie.
i hope i haven't given that impression. i do like some books.
01:11
i understand @Ted it's annoying, really.
i feel similar, as a student.
i mean, regarding the general flow of any lecture.
@sevdaicmis On the other hand, I had plenty of wonderful students, too, who were very much on the ball. And then there were the poor souls who chose to take many classes from me ...
Heading off to dinner. Y'all misbehave without me!
bon appétit!
@leslietownes words :)
try not to get any on the walls
$-{1 \over 12}$.
02:06
brb just going to compute some sums of divergent series
123
123
Hello All...
What is the difference between methods and algorithms in math, not in computer science?
deja vu all over again
123
123
How do we clearly know this is method or algorithm? There should be some clear distinction. I read on google but it does not help.
@copper.hat I have been in this place before
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02:22
Pls share any link so i can read the difference between method and algorithm in math. Thank you
higher on the street
I am watching a lecture series on macroeconomics that is well above my prereq level (it is a graduate course and my experience with macro amounts to watching a shortish YT series), mostly in order to test learning from content far above my prereq level. In the context of an applied calculus of variations problem (which I also have only the most basic exposure, but the lecturer doesn't expect any), I found this slide: i.imgur.com/PYwl3eJ.png
I recognize this formula as a Laplace Transform or Fourier Transform, but the lecturer does not seem to point this out. How should I interpret this? It seems the discount rate $\theta$ is the frequency domain variable, but a discount rate doesn't seem analogous to a frequency description.
 
2 hours later…
03:59
@user10478 i think you are being distracted by the similarity to a transform, but the interpretation is the cumulative long term discounted utility.
I mean, it's identical right?
what is identical to what?
The Laplace Transform
It has the same form as the one sided Laplace transform, but you were asking about the interpretation.
Shouldn't there be a way to conceptualize similarly two things which have an identical mathematical structure, though?
04:08
i am not sure what you hope to gain by that?
is there some computational value to having the transform of the utility?
I guess just additional associations to hook into each concept. I recently discovered that moving averages are built on the same mathematics as some audio signal filters, for example.
i imagine the author is more interested in solving a control problem.
well, the discounted utility is also a filtered version
Oh right, it's a type of weight function
@robjohn Am a bit late (it's well past morning now lol), but this here is a slightly different variation of the algorithm. You can see it's fairly linear in change from one term to the next in the exponent. Most of the cost is computing the exponent and then the necessary O(log n) time required to compute the final sum. In hardware, this would allow for arbitrary divides in O(n log n) which is optimal. The same circuit could be modified as well to compute both multiplies and divides.
See cell 32 for the algorithm in progress. desmos.com/calculator/to1i6487jo
All it's doing is extracting integers successively out of the fraction--it's an integer extraction algorithm that works for a mixed number encoding.
Presumably, one could invert this algorithm to compute products instead, but that's just how it appears.
If you want to see the largest floored quotient produced between x and $f_{lp2}(x)$, see cell 15 under "Archive II".
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05:07
What is the difference between method and algorithm in math, not in computer science? pls look at this question or share any link which clear the topic. I did not fine one.
i do not think that mathematicians have specific meanings attached to either beyond the usual English interpretation, but i also do not think the terms are interchangeable.
and I know it's my time to go
123
123
I don't understand why Euclid method called algorithm, is there any specific reason?
you have a specific time
@123 why do you care?
Calling you and the search is a mystery
05:12
moi?
Standing on my feet
I can't tell if copper is clueless or just playing dumb
123
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Because in mathematics we called these terms methods and algorithms. That's i want to know what is the difference. Is there any specific reason to be a method or algorithm.
presumably the former
suppose that you get an offer for a job that you really like but you are already employed at a company that pays you huge for the kind of job that you don't like. You wish to leave your current job soon as you have some plans. Due to the plans, you don't want to take up the new job offer also. How would you reply (declining the offer :( ) to the email for the new job offer?
05:15
still clueless.
amazing
i cycled to vollmer peak today, i'm a bit tired
And I... am now looking for how to quickly compute term coefficients for my division algorithm at 12:16 AM.
@Koro that is a bit of a riddle? why did you apply for a job when you had plans?
be honest but thoughful
I didn't apply. The owner of the company knows me and would love to see me there.
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05:17
Another algorithm is synthetic division method
@Koro why not tell them your plans?
well, maybe you should not take advice from me. i am still working and not retired...
Yeah. That would be great. I have been drafting the reply but I get stuck!
Too much delay in replying is also not good as they don't share their contact no. with anyone but shared it with me.
generally i find such things better in person, if for no other reason than Verba volant, scripta manent
don't delay, be decisive
can you meet in person?
tell them you are very interested but have plans for the immediate future. ask would it be feasible to entertain the offer in the future?
What do you call to that where, in the set of real numbers, either x=a, x<a, or x>a?
trichotomy?
that's what happens when my motivation disappears
05:22
that is what they call that
take it from someone clueful
that's the thing. I also want some things to be discussed in person.
I can't meet them as to meet them I'll have to fly to the capital. And you know the current travel scenarios.
@copper.hat Thank you. I thought that was trilemma. Thanks again
koro i have nothing to offer here. everything job related is super awkward.
trilemma would also be reasonable, it means three things in Greek
they also said -if I don't want to take up the job, they'll be pleased to know about my plans as they would be glad to help in any way possible for them.
05:24
Let teh hyperredundancy ensue: monolemma for a single lemma.
@Koro some of these things are cultural, but i think a letter is a bit formal for something where you want to express interest
meaning you should write a letter, but perhaps a phone call as well?
they shared their contact no. but asked only to message and not call so phone call would be weird. :(
when i need to write such things, i write down the 2-3 things i want to say and they figure out an appropriate way of saying them.
@copper.hat that would be nice, I think.
@Koro you should respect their wishes, of course
05:29
yeah, thanks a lot copper.
good luck
When copper plays hide and seek, I imagine he catches them dead.
Before replying to such things, one should discuss the reply with people like I did here. :)
thanks again.
@AMDG i am truly in the dark regarding your comments...
Well because, y'know, a copper never catches anybody alive...
05:31
getting darker...
And the ambiguity makes both interpretations funny, the first being that he's so bad at hide and seek that they die before he finds them, and the second as a reference to "you'll never catch me alive, copper!"
is this related to an English policeman?
Yes, the one known as copper.
Often gets a cameo in films
well, i have been incarcerated.
and i have been in prison.
but the latter on alcatraz
the former in brunei
"So what're you in for?"
"$-\frac{1}{12}$..."
"..."
05:36
i was in for sum things bad
I'm stumped by a simple problem which is likely too trivial for a post. Sadly, Google turns up nothing... Given a vector, and a plane defined by three points, how can one determine the reflection of the vector in the plane (context: math.stackexchange.com/a/4348433/822508 ...which is what I would call a reflection "about" the plane)
Can't have no miscreants assigning meaningful values to divergent sums. 'S illegal.
determine the normal $n$ to the plane and figure out $\lambda$ such that $v+\lambda n$ lies in the plane. then the answer is $x+2 \lambda n$.
Next thing you know, they'll start thinking for themselves and questioning the government-instituted mathematics.
well, i am a bill gates base station now
05:44
A decreasing sequence bounded below but without upper bound is convergent right?
strictly decreasing
Every decreasing sequence bounded from below is convergent.
any term in a decreasing sequence is essentially an upper bound.
And every convergent sequence has either the maximum or the minimum term in it.
that is why it converges really
@copper.hat This
Thanks
That is what was confusing me
so I have the sequence $x_n = \left ( 1+\dfrac{1}{n} \right)^n$ and $y_n = \left ( 1+\dfrac{1}{n} \right)^{n+1}$, since $y_n$ is decreasing a bounded below (by 0) and since $x_n = y_n \cdot (1+1/n)^{-1} = y_n \dfrac{n}{n+1} < y_n $ then $y_n$ is an upper bound for $x_n$ and hence $x_n$ has an upper bound and its increasing since convergent
God my brain went off for a minute.
I meant "hence $x_n$ has an upper bound and its increasing hence convergent"
That's correct for the convergence of $x_n$ right?
05:52
@Odestheory12: I think that you are trying to show that $\lim x_n$ exists.
Yeah, I am trying to show that $x_n$ is convergent
since $x_n$ is an increasing sequence and since $x_n<y_n$ for all $n$ then $x_n$ is convergent
What i am trying to mean is that every $y_n$ is an upper bound of $x_n$
And hence its convergent
OK. So the sequence $(y_n)$ is decreasing and is bounded below by $0$. Hence $y_n$ is convergent that is $\lim y_n$ exists. Now $(1+\frac 1n)\to 1$. So by algebra: $x_n=\frac {y_n}{1+\frac 1n}$. Using limit rules (if $z_n=x_n/{y_n}$ and if $\lim x_n$ exists and $\lim y_n$ also exists but is non zero then $\lim z_n$ exists and equals $\frac{\lim x_n}{\lim y_n}$), it follows that $\lim x_n=\frac {\lim y_n}{\lim(1+\frac 1n)}$
I dont want to use the result "convergent to 0 times bounded implies convergent" since the notes I was following didn't prove that yet
Okay.
Using the AM-GM inequality
06:01
Note that $(1+{1 \over n})^n = \sum_{k=0}^n \binom{n}{k} {1 \over n^k} = \sum_{k=0}^n {n \cdots (n-k+1) \over n^k} {1 \over k!} \le \sum_{k=0}^\infty {1 \over k!} = e$.
Yeah, the beautiful result is that $x_n<e<y_n$
(the first time I studied calculus $e$ appeared magically)
well, combine that with $x_n$ increasing and you have your result.
Yeah, I think I wasnt clear with my question. What I tried to ask implicitely is, if $x_n<y_n$ for all $n$, and if $y_n$ is convergent, does $x_n$ has an upper bound?
@Odestheory12 I think that you shouldn't conclude directly from here. The problem is that $x_1<y_1, x_2<y_2$ etc. but what about $x_1<y_5$ for example. So you should show that for any m and n, $x_n\leq y_m$
06:06
of course. if $y_n$ is convergent it is bounded and hence $x_n$ has an upper bound.
and that can be shown considering convergence of $y_n$.
@koro I already did that
Here: $x_n = y_n \cdot (1+1/n)^{-1} = y_n \dfrac{n}{n+1} < y_n$
Thanks Leslie and copper :)
No. This shows that $x_1<y_1,x_2<y_2$ etc. but what about say $x_{100}$ and $y_{50}$?
and Koro
@Koro i am interesting in finding an upper bound for $x_n$ for any $n$
so given $n$, i can find $y_n$ such that $x_n<y_n$
06:11
yes, and what you did above doesn't show that directly. You have to show that for every $n$, $x_n<M$ for some M>0.
Ah, that's implicit in $y_n$ being convergent
See my last message also. You are comparing same indices of $x_n$ and $y_n$ and that doesn't mean that every $y_n$ is an upper bound for $x_n$.
if $y_n\to y$ then for all $n\ge m$ we have that $|(y_n-y)+y| \le |y_n-y| + |y| < |y|+\epsilon$
@Odestheory12 All I'm saying is that's what was missing in your message (s) above.
:)
Ah, right
I had to add "since $y_n$ is convergent, $y_n$ is bounded."
06:15
i think you understood what i was complaining about. :)
Yeah, I didn't notice that tbh, thanks.
Are there any explicit formulas for recurrence relations of the form $a(n+1) = x a(n)\bmod y$?
Each and every coefficient for every term in my division algorithm is computed recursively and is described by this form.
Oh wait... it might converge anyways with all coefficients set to 1...
Nope, only converges to certain values other than a quotient of $\frac{x}{y}$.
07:19
why does two's complement algorithm work?
i shouldn't had asked it like this
in above like is w 1 always
i know why algorithm works
but was curious if it can represent
ah forget it i will do it myself
it can be done by same algorithm sorry i was being stupid
for ex in $0001$ and using algorithm $1111$ adding together gives $0000$ if we exclude msb of their two sum
07:42
Yeah, it just becomes a simple matter of modular arithmetic.
08:14
Huh, y'know I feel kind of dumb now. Solving recurrence relations mod n is actually quite easy.
Just solve as though there weren't a recurrence relation, then apply modulus. This works assuming valid modular arithmetic identities since $x \equiv x \pmod{y}$.
Formally, if $a(n)$ is a recurrence relation which maps to a field, then it is true that $a(n) = a(n) \pmod{y}$.
err $a(n) \equiv a(n) \pmod{y}$
so, we can therefore say that $a(n + 1) \equiv a(n + 1) \pmod{y}$ given $a(0) = 2^{\lfloor\log_2(x)\rfloor + 1} - x$ and $a(n + 1) = 2^{f(x)} a(n)$ and $f(x) = \text{let it suffice to say that it's faster to write that it's a power of two of integer inputs and a given that the domain maps to a field LOL}$.
(An integer field specifically)
According to wolfram alpha, the explicit formula for this particular recurrence equation adjusted to be mod y is $a(n) = 2^{n f(x)} \left(2^{\lfloor\log_2(x)\rfloor + 1} - x\right) \pmod{x}$ for an integer $x$.
If this is correct, then the coefficient for any given term in my division algorithm is described by this formula.
In other words, we can now efficiently compute quotients to arbitrary precision. Only thing I will have to work out when I write an arbitrary precision math module is how many terms I need to achieve any given precision. Otherwise, we can determine this experimentally for 64-bit inputs and just compute that every time.
@robjohn Anything to say? (Is there any error per chance in my reasoning about recurrence relations mod y?)
09:02
Ok, so this $a(n)$ I've computed is actually the value of the numerator in the fractional part at the nth term in the division algorithm.
Or rather the coefficient in the numerator.
Computing the term coefficient we'll call it is then a matter of elementary fraction arithmetic.
As-is, this computes $\frac{2^x}{y}$ (which I mistakenly listed previously as $\lfloor\frac{2^x}{y}\rfloor$). We can easily convert it to a function of $\frac{x}{y}$ by substituting $x$ with $\log_2(x)$ and simplifying.
I will write down the expression as an infinite sum when I get the chance.
Now that I've solved my division problems, I'm going to look for that closed form definition for the Gamma function for complex arguments.
Me want fast binomial coefficients and real-time Mie scattering
09:59
1
Q: Q regarding finding sum of first 2002 terms

S.M.TQ : A sequence of integers $a_{1}+a_{2}+\cdots+a_{n}$ satisfies $a_{n+2}=a_{n+1}$ $-a_{n}$ for $n \geq 1$. Suppose the sum of first 999 terms is 1003 and the sum of the first 1003 terms is - 999. Find the sum of the first 2002 terms. My questions regarding this problem are: What will be the 1st ...

@robjohn There you go. I did it. I found fast division after 6 months. See cell 36: desmos.com/calculator/006pyyr3to
See folder "Workspace Functions" for the functions used in this sum.
Now how do I prove this thing?
There, fixed an error in the sum. Works now. desmos.com/calculator/mm0xg5fhw6
Also cleaned things up.
Seems it isn't quite complete yet. Looks like the coefficient for $f_{lp2}(x)$ isn't purely linear. Alright, cool. Lemme just find that real quick. My bad.
Yep, seems to be the case. If you look at the fractions that we get incorrect results for (excluding powers of two), then you get that they are an integer multiple of the correct result. For example, I get $\frac{1}{36} = \frac{1}{4\cdot 9}$ for $f_{div}(53, 9) 2^{-53}$ (approximated using 16 terms of the series).
 
3 hours later…
13:18
the order and degree of the ODE $\frac{\mathrm{d}^3}{\mathrm{dx^3}}(\frac{\mathrm{d}^2y}{\mathrm{dx^2}})^{-3/2}=0$?
Simplifying gives: $-\frac 52 (y'')^{-\frac 72}(y''')^2+y'''' (y'')^{-5/2}=0$
Now, continuation 1: cancelling fractional powers yields: $-\frac 52 (y''')^2+y''''y''=0$. From here: the order is $4$ and the degree is $1$.
Continuation 2: removal of the fractional powers using square: $\frac {25}4(y''')^4(y'')^{-7}=(y'''')^2 (y'')^{-5}$ and taking $(y'')^{-7}$ to RHS suggests that the ode has order 4 and the degree equal to $2$.
So which one of the two is correct?
 
2 hours later…
15:04
If $f$ is strictly convex and is a proper map (inverse image of a compact set is compact), can one show that $\lim_{|x| \to \infty} f(x) = \infty$ ?
$f$ is a smooth map on $\Bbb{R}$
 
2 hours later…
16:57
Fixed a good amount of error but it still isn't quite perfect. desmos.com/calculator/xrecqalpcj
The issue is somewhere in the coefficient function because it isn't always giving correct results.
You could in fact use this as an approximation and just compute the quotient of the remainder afterwards, but that doesn't meet my standards.
 
1 hour later…
18:00
"I'm glad to receive your email." or "I'm glad to have received your email." or "I'm in the receipt of your email."?
18:29
Argh, I replied to an email at around 12 AM at night and wrote "Good evening" as greeting.
:(
Every time I write an email, I try to be extra careful but nonetheless some mistake always occurs in the email.
if $\mathbb{Z}^3\cong G \oplus \mathbb{Z}$ then $G\cong \mathbb{Z}^2$, right?
18:52
monoidal: i think that's true, but nontrivial.
see e.g. sofia.nmsu.edu/~elbert/#publications "cancellation in direct sums of groups"
@monoidaltransform yes, using the classification of finitely generated abelian groups
(G is finitely generated because G is isomorphic to (G+Z)/Z which is Z^3/Z)
i'll never forgive my instructor for stating but not proving that result in my first algebra class
@leslietownes I don't know if this is sarcasm but I think the full proof is a bit long for a class
it's mild sarcasm :)
and I would have just stated the important theorem that this uses (i.e. smith normal form)
19:30
@SayanChattopadhyay this only depends on properness and yes. in fact, you can show that any continuous map into a LCH space is proper if and only if it preserves nets going to infinity. Here, going to infinity means eventually being in the complement of any compact subspace, which is the same thing as having norm go to infinity on euclidean spaces.
20:23
@leslie One reason I'm so fond of Artin's Algebra book is that he presents this sort of thing very concretely and clearly.
Hi all
I'm aware of the triangular billiards problem (i.e., every triangle with angles ≤ 100 has periodic orbits, but we don't know for angles > 100)
Now, I'm trying to reproduce Schwartz 2009 result (tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/…) computationally
Actually, in the case of monoidal's query, I think one doesn't need all of classification. Because of free abelianness, I think it's not hard to argue that the projection to the quotient splits.
I've created a simulation of a triangular billiard table with the ball bouncing off the wall and whatnot, but I'm not quite sure how to go about reproducing the Schwartz's result using my simulation.
If anyone has any suggestions, that would be much appreciated.
Here is an image of my simulation at work, if that inspires any ideas:
Actually, I'm not sure I'm making any sense -- are folks here familiar with the problem I'm describing, or would it help to clarify?
20:44
hello, i want to prove the existence and unicity of solution of the differential equation $y'=-x^2y^2+exp(-y^2)$ over $R=\{(x,y), 0\leq x\leq \frac12, |y|\leq 1\}$ using banach fixed point. My question is how to choose the complete normed space ?
i know that the operator is $T: E\to E$ defined by $Ty(x)=y_0+\int_{x_0}^x -s^2 y^2(s)+exp(-y^2(s)) ds $
can i choose $E=C([0,\frac12],[-1,1]),||.||_{\infty})$
If anyone can provide any insight, that would be great.
Let y defined on R be a solution to the ivp $y’(t)=1-y^2(t), y(0)=0$. How do I show that $y(t)\ne 1$ for any $t\in \mathbb R$?
@rb3652 I for one am not at all familiar with the problem, but given that you seem to have a clear goal and a functioning simulation, I think this would make for a good question to post on the main site (unless someone else here happens to be familiar).
Hi @Thorgott Thank you for the suggestion.
Would this receive a better response on the Math Stack Exchange Site or Math Overflow?
@Koro i don't understand ! 1 is clearly a solution ?
20:59
MathOverflow is moreso for questions about research mathematics, so I'd suggest the regular MathStackExchange
@Thorgott Gotcha. Thanks.
Anyone know how long the MO auto-suspension lasts? I want to say 6 months, but not sure
21:20
Hi @Thorgott, I've posted a question, as per your suggestion:
0
Q: Reproducing Schwartz's Result on Periodic Billiard Orbits using a Simulation

rb3652In 2009, Richard Schwartz proved that any obtuse triangle whose largest angle is $≤100^{\circ}$ has a stable periodic billiard orbit. My question then, is: How can I reproduce Schwartz's result using a simulation? I've created a functioning simulation which produces paths in a triangular billia...

And now this very detailed and specific answer gets a downvote? With no comment from anyone? Seriously. (I was surprised the OP approved the other answer, since it used stuff above his pay grade, I thought. But that's fine.)
downvotes are still votes. at least people notice you.
i upvoted
21:32
Don't upvote without actually reading and appreciating! Geez.
@Vrouvrou no, 1 is not a solution. 1 doesn’t satisfy the initial value condition.
I will one day studying complex analysis, I could tell just at a glance though that it was high quality
It's actually an argument that is usually done just by "path lifting in covering spaces," but it's easy enough to make an elementary argument for an undergraduate.
LOL, @PenAndPaper, you're practicing to be a politician.
I think they should teach category theory in middle school
Not that that is possible atm, but in the advanced future it should be
@Vrouvrou: I could show that any solution y of the ivp can not attain 1. :-)
So my question is solved :).
21:37
What does it mean when we say function has minimum at x=a, does it mean the function has local minimum at x=a or the minimum value of function is obtained at x=a?
2
Q: Why are there two possible values for the degree of the ODE $\frac{\mathrm{d}^3}{\mathrm{dx^3}}(\frac{\mathrm{d}^2y}{\mathrm{dx^2}})^{-3/2}=0$?

KoroI want to find the order and degree of the ODE $\frac{\mathrm{d}^3}{\mathrm{dx^3}}(\frac{\mathrm{d}^2y}{\mathrm{dx^2}})^{-3/2}=0$? I'm getting two different values of the degree of the ODE. Simplifying gives: $-\frac 52 (y'')^{-\frac 72}(y''')^2+y'''' (y'')^{-5/2}=0$ We have two possible continua...

Can anyone please help me with this question of mine?
No. It's yuck.
I think that the degree of the ode is not defined.
I don't even remember what that means.
Order of an ode is: the highest order of the derivative that appears in the ode, whereas the degree of the ode is defined as the power of the highest order derivative.
By ode, I mean: $F(x,y,y’,y’’,…,y^{(n)})=0$.
I don’t know how to say this. But for writing degree we write the ode as powers (positive integral) of derivatives $y^{(i)}$.
That is, the degree, if exists, is a positive integer.
21:48
Why does it have to be an integer?
I think this is all sorta silly, anyhow. Who cares what the degree is? When it's not even linear, things get ridiculous.
Professor Ted, I agree with you. Why should anyone care about degree?
Order is what one should think about.
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