« first day (3043 days earlier)      last day (1916 days later) » 

1:51 AM
perhaps there's a new user trying for some voting badge? (civic duty, suffrage, or electorate)
... or vox populi
wild theory, but there's one user who's recently earned both suffrage and vox populi ; perhaps well-intentioned (simply going for fake internet trophies with high-rep users on the site) without realizing that the voting would be reversed
 
2:44 AM
@JeffSchaller Well, some of the voting. The bot that SE uses doesn't have supernatural powers, and presumably uses heuristics.
 
 
1 hour later…
4:06 AM
I guess questions make sense if you're aiming at electorate
 
 
3 hours later…
7:06 AM
$ find /d/code/dmn/tck/TestCases/ -type f | grep -e '\.xml$' | wc -l
76

$ find /d/code/dmn/tck/TestCases/ -type f | grep -e '\.dmn$' | wc -l
76

$ find /d/code/dmn/tck/TestCases/ -type f | grep -e '\.(xml|dmn)$' | wc -l
0
Hi. How to fix the above regex? ^
It should report count of files ending with xml or dmn
 
7:24 AM
@deostroll First of all, you should not pipe the output of find to grep. Instead: find /path -type f -name '*.xml' -exec echo x \; | wc -l This would output an x for each found file and wc would count the number of xes. This allows for pathnames with newlines to be counted properly. If you want to count two filename suffixes, use e.g. find /path -type f \( -name '*.xml' -o -name '*.dmn' \) -exec echo x \; | wc -l
Leave regular expressions for text, don't use it on filenames.
The alternation (|) that you are trying to use is an extended regular expression. grep does basic regular expressions by default. Use grep with -E to enable extended regular expressions, but don't use it on pathnames.
 
Yep, I did end up using grep -E
thanks
 
@deostroll ... which I said you shouldn't do.
It would just report lines ending with those two strings.
Oh well.
 
 
2 hours later…
9:30 AM
Yeah, I get it...just only wanted count of files...not anything serious
 
 
1 hour later…
10:45 AM
Ok, a really boring resolution to yesterday's PATH problem: unix.stackexchange.com/a/499255/116858
 
@Kusalananda huh, so “close: unreproducible / typo” material
 
11:05 AM
@StephenKitt I'm a bit divided about that.
It's reproducible and it wasn't strictly speaking a typo, as far as we know.
But it's highly unlikely that it would happen to anyone else on a regular basis.
Usually, if the shell startup files are in DOS format, there would be lots of other errors.
 
11:42 AM
@Kusalananda Ha! Nailed it! :P
And yeah, I closed it. The idea is that we close stuff that were really too localized to be of help to anyone else and that does seem to qualify.
 
11:55 AM
Good
 
12:07 PM
I looked at that one too, with a blank stare.
@terdon, thanks again about the tags. I hope there aren't still others left with a conflicting language, but now we at least know what the issue is. :)
 
Yeah. Weird bug :)
Also, great post-it! :)
 
12:58 PM
Had to crank up the font to 24p in my terminal now. I'm getting headaches. Will have to get new glasses soon... possibly even separate ones for work. :-/
 
@Kusalananda Investigate also exercising the eyes. No miracles, but it does help. It saved me in my 20s for using glasses for a minor problem.
@Kusalananda Basically had to go to the hospital, using special lenses and doing repetitive tasks with them...nonetheless some small exercises can be made at home.
 
@RuiFRibeiro Yes I know, and I'm trying. I'm at the age where my eyes are deciding to be problematic no matter what I'll do though.
 
Tim
1:19 PM
@RuiFRibeiro If I may ask, what exercises?
@ilkkachu your note is cute
@Kusalananda do you suffer from myopia, far-signtedness, astigmatism?
 
@Tim I'm shortsighted, but starting to have issues seeing things close up now.
 
Tim
Why is en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bates_method bashed so heavily?
 
@RuiFRibeiro Yeah, those are the ones that I've been recommended before, but thanks for linking to them here!
 
Tim
Essentially all you listed are covered in Bates
 
1:26 PM
@Tim I think the aim is drastically different.
Also, some of his methods seems pretty dangerous, like focusing sunlight into the eyes.
 
@Kusalananda ah, presbyopia
 
I do find the sun exposure terrible advice. I have did eyes exercises in a specific program in the hospital in my middle twenties instead of being given glasses, and 2 and half decades after I still do not use glasses, so I guess something must have worked ;)
 
@StephenKitt Definitely.
 
I am really getting fed up with people using the "Kali is hard" question to close anything mentioning Kali. Grrr.
 
We should have a “first, do no harm” requirement.
 
1:29 PM
@jimmij come on. Closing this as a dupe of the Kali is hard is just a slap in the face of the OP. The problem is that the URL is bad, so we can close as too localized, it has nothing to do with Kali. — terdon ♦ 2 mins ago
 
@terdon Yeah, it's not a blanket QA for Kali questions.
 
@RuiFRibeiro please see above.
 
@terdon The question is also a slap in the face being asked here. I am not fond of overly lazy cerebral reguargitation here. .but I do understand your points. I have seen the comment.
 
@RuiFRibeiro so newbies aren’t welcome here?
 
@RuiFRibeiro Then downvote it, or ignore it, but please stop using the Kali question as a target unless it actually makes sense to do so: the OP is attempting to use Kali as a regular OS.
@StephenKitt Of course they are! Unfortunately, we have some users who seem to think this site is for experts only. I have no idea where they get that from.
 
1:35 PM
@terdon I know they are ;-)
 
I've been seeing comments from a few users lately along the lines of "if you don't know this, you shouldn't be asking here". That is a serious problem.
 
@StephenKitt I have seen well written, not lazy questions from newbies. If reputation 1 is anything to believe nowadays....
 
@RuiFRibeiro Newbies as in people who are new to *nix, not to the site.
 
@terdon Also have seen good questions from those. (might take some time to come back, writing a netbackup script. )
 
@RuiFRibeiro you can set your own bar to anything you want for questions you’ll answer; but I think the appropriate response to questions you don’t want to spend time on (helping the OP improve them, or answer them) is to ignore them, not comment on them that the user shouldn’t have dared bother you in the first place.
2
Obviously downvote and vote to close as appropriate too, when it’s appropriate.
 
1:41 PM
@StephenKitt Have been quite civil with those situations lately....after some warnings from terdon I confess.
 
@StephenKitt YESH! Thank you.
@RuiFRibeiro I admit I haven't seen anything very recently, yes. Thank you for that.
 
I think I'm on the same page; I "worry" that we'll get too many knee-jerk VTC-dupes for any/all Kali questions, based on their poor history, but I don't know that I'll be saving many Good Questions, so I'm not going to fight for them. — Jeff Schaller Oct 22 '17 at 20:45
 
@JeffSchaller has it been that long /o\
 
Yeah, that's fair. It's not like we get loads of decent Kali questions. In fact, I think I've only seen 2? 3 tops.
 
4 years
66
A: Should I stop referring Kali users to U&L from AU?

jasonwryanThey are, sadly, more appropriate here, seeing the distro is based on a Linux kernel. In order to minimise the impact on those of us who have little patience for the numbats that think that installing Kali will make them l337 haXX0r5, please—as a public service— ensure that they are all tagged k...

well, 3 & change: Aug 22 '15
 
1:44 PM
Dec 13 '17 at 20:54, by terdon
In other news, SOUND THE ALARM! We have a decent, detailed Kali question!
 
I should write a new workflow for VTC-as-Kali-dupe -- is it unclear? is it a duplicate of a question with an actual answer?
but I only have so much energy :)
 
In most cases, linking to that "Kali is hard" post is more appropriate than using it as a dupe target.
 
it doesn't help that people are trying Kali as their first Linux
 
And no, I don't have a real solution to the problem. I do completely agree that we seem to get loads of posts about Kali from people who should not be using Kali.
Maybe we should set up a different close reason. Something like "Kali is off topic here unless your question clearly shows you have the required level of experience to be using a tool like Kali". But I don't see how that would go down very well.
For one thing, nobody would agree on whether the OP is indeed experienced enough or not.
 
oh I have an idea! if they tag Kali, they have to enter their question using a browser plugin that opens the ed editor
 
1:46 PM
lol
 
ROFL
 
Jun 12 '17 at 7:59, by Stephen Kitt
I’m thinking that Kali should hide their download links behind a penetration testing capture the flag problem...
 
@terdon That's still the best suggestion I've heard.
 
1:47 PM
talking about this stuff, been invited for (co-?)authoring a book about linux binary analisys.
 
Part of the issue with Kali questions is that people end up reacting to them based on the fact that it’s Kali, irrespective of whether the question is Kali-related or not. Ask a question about AWK, and people will fall over themselves answering it; but ask the same AWK question with , and it will be obliterated.
 
or the stock download has a simple typo somewhere that hobbles the system, a la one of those Certification exams where they cripple the grub.cfg or mess up the root shell
I would suggest some warnings in the tag wiki, but I've despaired of people looking there, so I don't have any good ideas either.
 
@StephenKitt Yes. Kali has become a trigger for U&L regulars.
Understandably so, mind you, but it's still a problem.
 
perhaps Kali users will just have to show more persistence and a quick Stack Exchange learning curve, to edit their questions into shape for reopening. An unfair slope, but that's where it is.
@StephenKitt there is a "funny" line between people who jump in with answers (sometimes 30 lines long) versus "we're not a script-writing service"
"we'll write scripts whenever we want"
2
 
@JeffSchaller Somebody is forcing you to answer here? ;-P (sorry, could not resist)
 
1:58 PM
 
@RuiFRibeiro lol! of course he's analysed it mathematically!
 
@JeffSchaller Sometimes those "write me a script" questions give me a good idea for something I could use at work, and in those cases I usually will try to write it
 
2:13 PM
@Jesse_b awesome! I'm not against that at all -- this is a Q&A site after all -- but there's some sort of fine line / trigger about certain questions that bring out the "but you haven't tried so I'm not going to"
but there's 3000 CSV-parsing questions (for a made-up example) that also showed no effort and got 5 responses
 
@RuiFRibeiro This is how we used urinals in the military: memegenerator.net/img/instances/68973173/im-a-marine.jpg
 
I suspect it's down to the amount of interest and skill overlap -- if you're good at CSV parsing or awk or whatever, the bar's lower for you to answer; and whether the problem sounds interesting to you or not
 
Hi guys
 
@Pinky_P o/
 
@Jesse_b I hate those guys that just go near you either on coffee shops or urinals lol
 
2:17 PM
@RuiFRibeiro I don't understand why so many people are ashamed to pee near other people. We used to have 90 seconds for 70 people to pee in a 5' long trough
There were people literally standing on the shoulders of other people in order to pee
 
imagine that at your local Starbuck's :)
 
There were also no doors on the bathroom stalls so when you had to poop you were normally making eye contact with someone across from you
That takes a bit of getting used to
 
@Jesse_b LOL.... I prefer do to my things alone.
@Jesse_b at home, between me and wifey wc is game at any time whether one of us is there or not, but I do it better alone. Morning we are both working, forget about someone being alone there.
@Jesse_b (that is the price of living in the city nearby everything....small apartment)
 
Yeah the best thing about my house is two bathrooms
I still can't do anything alone though because my pets love to follow me in there
 
@Jesse_b Pets and kids stay at the other side of the door. ;-P
 
 
1 hour later…
3:30 PM
It's been such a complicated day today (work-wise) that I think I've deserved a pizza.
 
@Kusalananda Unfortunately you don't live in NY/NJ so pizza is not available to you :(
 
@Jesse_b any style of pizza is available if you make it yourself
 
A local pizza place does nice thin vegetarian pizzas that I like, and even deliver them to me.
 
@StephenKitt I don't know, I've yet to find anyone making pizza outside of NY/NJ. I've had some halfway decent cheese/tomato pies but I wouldn't quite classify them as pizza :p
 
... it's on its way!
 
3:33 PM
@Kusalananda That was quick
 
Um. I've placed the order at least...
 
Quick order, did you just call and yell "PIZZA! [ADDRESS]" then hang up? :p
 
@Jesse_b thin crust pizzas (Neapolitan style) are quite common in Europe
@Jesse_b caller id means they don’t need his address
 
I don't think caller id works on cell phones
But yes, if they have his number saved he could theoretically just yell pizza
 
@Jesse_b it does in Europe
@Jesse_b at one point in the past I used to be able to do that with one of my local pizza joints
 
3:35 PM
@StephenKitt It shows an address for cell phones?
 
@Jesse_b no, you give your address the first time you order, and you don’t need to for subsequent orders
 
Yeah I've had that
 
@Jesse_b They know me.
 
@Kusalananda: Are you a vegetarian?
 
@Jesse_b Yes.
 
3:48 PM
@Jesse_b have you ever traveled to another country? Italy, perhaps?
 
@terdon Never been to Italy. I've been to Germany, Japan, and Australia
 
None of those would be known for their pizzas :)
Try Italy and south-eastern France.
 
Meh, NY/NJ is the only pizza I am interested in :p. Also taco bell makes a decent mexican pizza (joking)
 
@Jesse_b Well, if you like cheap knock-offs, I guess.
:P
 
pizza made in a proper oven it nice.....
expect dying not a nice Google search.... ;-P
 
3:52 PM
As long as proper oven == wood oven!
 
@terdon.... yeah, I used to have a great nice pizza in a south african/italian pub ran by 2 second generation Italian guys....
 
That pizza no longer exists.
 
hah
 
@Kusalananda you havent send some? lol
 
30 minutes from idea to filled tummy. That's pretty good for a pizza delivery service.
 
4:20 PM
@Kusalananda That's going to be too small for @Jesse_b. You know how they like their Pizzas to be big enough to also work as tablecloths. :P
 
@terdon :-) I hear that's the American way, yes.
No, this was a good sized one. Only ever so slightly bigger than it actually needed to be, i.e. perfect.
 
@terdon This is my favorite pizza place: tripadvisor.com/…
 
And there goes any respect I may have had for your pizza judging skills! Wow, those look horrible!
 
greasy and crispy is the only way to be
but yeah those photos don't do it any justice
 
That doesn't even look like it was wood-oven baked! Come on, man! I thought NY did have half-way decent pizza.
Was it all a lie?
 
4:32 PM
usually brick oven
but it's mostly the water that makes the difference
same with bagels and really anything involving dough
pretzels, etc
 
@terdon They may just need a better photographer.
 
@Jesse_b Ah, when it comes to bagels, I will certainly not argue with a new yorker.
Those are things of terrible beauty.
 
this is my second favorite pizza: tripadvisor.com/…
There is actually another place down the road in hoboken with far superior sauce and just higher quality ingredients in general but their crust isn't quite there
And for some reason I just prefer that gritty boardwalk style slice that has been sitting under a heat lamp for an hour
 
 
1 hour later…
6:06 PM
I learnt something new today: unix.stackexchange.com/a/499312/116858 Didn't know this utility existed as pre-installed part of my favourite OS.
 
Someone should make a movie about Stéphane
 
@Jesse_b Why? And what kind of movie?
 
What's the proper way to chain redirections under POSIX sh? I'm certain I've done this before: tar -tf "${FILE}" 1>&2 2>/dev/null Where I redirect stdoutto stderr, then stderr to /dev/null, but that's not working properly.
When I say under POSIX, the shebang is #!/bin/sh, but we know for certain that bash will be on the target system.
I'd not prefer a bash-specific way of doing this though.
 
tar -tf "${FILE}" >/dev/null 2>&1
 
Oh, shit
 
6:18 PM
@FaheemMitha I picture something like this: imdb.com/title/tt4682788 but about unix
 
because the redirection happens right away, so stderr was still going to screen under my example, so stdout ended up on screen, THEN stderr was redirected to /dev/null?
I'm a big doofus
 
@Jesse_b At first glance this appears to have little relation to Unix. At second glance too.
 
@FaheemMitha Yeah well that's a movie about a Columbian drug lord, but the proposed movie would be about a French unix lord
 
@Jesse_b And the journalist that falls in love with him?
 
If necessary to spice things up for hollywood
 
6:24 PM
@Jesse_b Well, one could always try to get Hollywood to see the joys of shell.
 
@FaheemMitha Well, his name turned up in articles about the bash bug. Even with his face in them.
 
@Kusalananda Is that relevant?
 
@FaheemMitha Add a few agents of some other country to the mix, and some hackers.
 
@Kusalananda Must I?
And Tom Cruise could play the lead.
/me wonders how Cruise's French is.
 
... a big software company exploiting the bug, a female reporter with computer knowledge that uncovers stuff, and some family tensions etc.
He doesn't live in France, AFAIK.
 
6:31 PM
@Kusalananda Time to whip up a screen play.
@Kusalananda Who doesn't?
 
Mr. S
 
@FaheemMitha Stephane, I believe he lives in the UK but is from France
 
Well, ok. But he's still French, isn't he?
 
@FaheemMitha I suppose he can be, if it helps the plot. :-)
 
@Kusalananda It will probably hurt the plot. Hollywood doesn't really favor French people as heroes.
Preferably American. Sometimes British is ok.
 
6:34 PM
I think we love the British
Odd since we fought a war with them to become a country and France helped make it possible
 
@Jesse_b Who does?
 
@FaheemMitha Americans. Movies with British leads seem to do well here. We love the accent for some reason
 
@Jesse_b If you say so. I don't see why, though.
 
@Kusalananda I love the commands in the background of that lol
I always get a kick out of the stuff they run in movies when they are supposedly "hacking" things too
I saw something recently where they just executed three different ssh commands (I think two of them would have been a syntax error) in a row
 
6:40 PM
@Kusalananda That article forgot to mention Stack Exchange. An unforgivable omission.
 
Interesting tidbit from the prompt in that image: "chealer@vinci" could be one "Filipus Klutiero" or "Philippe Cloutier"
I found the prompt in some bug report from him (or them)
I wonder how that relates
He happens to be Canadian, which explains the French directory names.
Ah, a Debian dev.
 
Ok, so some film material right there.
 
Plot: Filipus Klutiero is using shellshock to rob international banks and the worlds top intelligence agencies are unable to stop him. They pull in Stephane Chazelas to help track down and stop this hacker. He has a female liaison from the CIA that can't help but fall victim to his charm. Halfway through Filipus kidnaps the CIA liaison and Stephane has to go rogue to save her.
The ending scene takes place on top of the Burj Khalifa in Dubai where Filipus is holding the CIA liaison over the edge and gets into a gunfight with Stephane. The liaison falls over the edge and Stephane has to dive off to catch her mid fall and deploy the parachute he happened to be wearing
#hollywood
 
6:56 PM
Boring. It's always the female that gets kidnapped. Can't it be Stephane? Then They smuggle in computer bits to him and he hacks his way out?
... actually using the bug as a sort of sweet revenge leverage in the hacking.
 
Needs a movie tag line after he gets out
 
Oops. Got to feed the cats... (that's not the tagline)
 
Tim
Sorry to cut in line. Does flex work internally similarly to awk?
 
Like a computer explodes sending a processor flying that cuts the arm of one of the bad guys. As he's holding his hand over the cut to stop the bleeding Stephane can say "You know you should really..._patch_ your systems"
 
Tim
0
Q: Does each call to `yylex()` generate a token or all the tokens for the input?

TimI am trying to understand how flex works step by step. In the following first example, it seems that main() calls yylex() only once, and yylex() generates all the tokens for the entire input. In the second example, it seems that main() calls yylex() once per token generated, and yylex() ge...

 
6:59 PM
@Tim Same Idea. Different implementation and problem domain (usually).
 
Speaking of lex, anyone got any recommendations for flex tutorials? I got a book on lex and yacc for my compilers class, but wanna supplement it.
 
Tim
I am confused in the post. I'd appreciate consideration of any of you.
 
@Tim, I can't remember much about flex, but the first snippet there doesn't have any return statements in the lexer, so it probably doesn't really return anything. Except implicitly at the end, I assume.
 
@Tim Note the lack of return statements in the first piece of lexer code.
Ah, hi ilkkachu
I actually used lex in answering a question here once. unix.stackexchange.com/a/447089/116858
Haven't doen anything serious with it though.
 
Tim
awk works like:
for each line:
for each (pattern, action):
if the line matches the pattern, then take the action on the line
end
end

What is it like for flex?
for each character:
for each (pattern, action):
if a substring started from the character matches the pattern, then takes the action on the match
end
end
?
Does "return" in an action mean to return from a call to `yylex()`?
 
7:16 PM
@Tim Yes it does.
In the first bit of code, the only thing the lexer does is to count things. It does not save the parsed tokens or do anything other than count things.
In the second bit of code, the lexer returns each token to the caller.
The lexer runs over all input, and performs an action when a pattern matches.
If it returns and is called again, it continues to parse at that point in the input.
 
Tim
In awk, if a line matches multiple patterns, the actions for **all** the matched patterns will all be taken.
In flex, if a character starts some substrings that match multiple patterns, **only** the action of longest matched pattern will be taken?
 
7:36 PM
@Tim I think the first matching pattern will be used. And then the second matching one, if the lexer did not return. I'm not 100% sure.
I actually think it's pretty much the same as in awk.
 
Tim
7:51 PM
@Kusalananda Thanks. Just by a simple test, awk executes actions for all matching patterns.
$ cat sleep.py
#! /usr/bin/python3
import time
time.sleep( 30 )
$ cat sleep.py | awk ' /imp/ {print $0}; /import/ {print $0} '
import time
import time
 
@Tim Yes. And I believe lex does too, but I'm not entirely sure.
If you can test it, please do. It's a bit too late in the evening for me to start writing parsers right now, sorry.
 
Tim
No worry. thank you. nighty
Wouldn't you wait till the pizza is well digested? :)
@Jesse_b sorry for interrupting your conversation. I am done now.
 
@Tim Soon I won't have a say in that.
@Tim It was mildly entertaining Tim. Something I'd like to look close at some other day.
 
8:12 PM
@Tim Heh I was just being obnoxious and silly anyway. I think on topic conversations should always take precedent over my incoherent rambling
 
8:30 PM
@terdon The dupe target question is fundamentally disgraceful and should be deleted itself.
It's deliberately and unnecessarily insulting
 
I mostly agree but I think it or a similar question would have it's use so long as it wasn't abused
 
Good luck with that
 
Unfortunately most of the people trying to use kali have no business using kali. Everyone I have ever met that uses kali is a windows user who's first experience into linux has been kali
They brag about it like it makes them some kind of "hacker". "Hey man guess what, I installed kali on my laptop last night!" That's great, maybe try getting familiar with a normal distribution first though?
"Got my drivers learning permit and I bought an F1 car. Need help learning how to put it in gear"
 
8:56 PM
@Jesse_b What you do not help me reading the manuals of my car? Lazy git!
 
Well I think the key part of that metaphor is that nobody should be exposed to an F1 car before first getting years of experience driving and racing lower tier cars. One will almost certainly die if their first driving experience is in an F1 car
 
and that's where the metaphor breaks down. trying out operating systems doesn't really kill anyone
 
@ilkkachu Another aspect of the metaphor would be that an F1 car is a purpose built machine that should not be used for daily driving but only in the highest level of racing
Similar to the way kali should not be used for daily use but only for penetration testing
 
 
1 hour later…
10:20 PM
@MichaelHomer I'm on the fence on that one. I think using it as a close target is indeed a disgrace, but keeping it around as something to point people to feels like it can be useful. I've considered just closing it so it can't be used as a dupe but that should be properly hashed out on meta first.
 

« first day (3043 days earlier)      last day (1916 days later) »