The Nineteenth Byte

Redwolf Programs

12:46

I'll do some work on the chat bots.

yesterday, by Redwolf Programs

Next CMP: New Sandboxed Posts, Sandboxed Posts, or Sandbox Posts?

I'd prefer one of the Sandbox(ed)? Posts ones, but I'm not sure which sounds better

pxeger

New Sandbox Posts

Redwolf Programs

The thing is, I want to be able to reuse this bot for the Guild of Reviewers too

Plus y'all already decided it'd be better to merge the NMPs into one New Posts bot, so it'd be fine to change this one's name too

lyxal

ed

Use the ed

Redwolf Programs

Use the ed Luke

lyxal

Sandboxed

Redwolf Programs

12:50

Plus on smaller screens, it'd be better to have Sandboxed show up instead of New

That makes it easier to differentiate between N(M)P and (N)SP

pxeger

personally I think "sandboxed" is not a word and sounds clunky

EnderShadow8

if sandbox is a verb, the sandboxed is probably a word.

Redwolf Programs

I think Sandbox Posts looks better, Sandboxed sounds better to me but that's probably just because of familiarity

EnderShadow8

Less syllables is better imo

Wheat Wizard

If you are going to use Sandboxed than you should new "Newly Sandboxed Posts", since "new" is an adjective.

EnderShadow8

12:54

but ofc sandboxed is also fine

Redwolf Programs

I think I'll go with Sandbox Posts

EnderShadow8

@WheatWizard "sandboxed posts" is a noun clause, so an adjective does make sense

new (sandboxed posts)

Wheat Wizard

It's not ungrammatical.

EnderShadow8

less syllables is better

Wheat Wizard

It just makes more sense for new to modify sandboxed, than posts.

pxeger

12:55

@EnderShadow8 fewer*

@WheatWizard disagree. Newly sandboxed posts implies they were somewhere else before they were put in the sandbox

which they weren't

EnderShadow8

english.stackexchange.com is leaking

pxeger

I maintain my stance, however, that sandbox is not a verb

Wheat Wizard

@pxeger Proof?

Every English word is a verb.

English lets you verb words.

EnderShadow8

@pxeger You could argue that Google isn't a verb either

@WheatWizard Newspeak?

pxeger

@WheatWizard ok, they were in the creator's head first if you insist

Wheat Wizard

12:57

What? Have you even read 1984?

EnderShadow8

?

pxeger

I didn't bother with the appendix so I'm afraid I can't comment on the validity of that as newspeak

EnderShadow8

I read the appendix before the book, don't kill me pls

pxeger

On second thought, actually, sandbox is a verb (to isolate a program). But I don't think it's appropriate here.

Wheat Wizard

I don't really see why fewer syllables is prefereable.

lyxal

12:59

Because this is code golf

Short is good

Redwolf Programs

I'm considering using the current NMetaP profile picture for Sandbox Posts. I think that'd look nicer, and also the current NSP profile picture has "New" at the bottom which doesn't really fit with the name anymore

pxeger

It's not syllable golf though

Wheat Wizard

Should just call it p.

caird coinheringaahing

@hyper-neutrino I generally accept winning answers to non-code-golf (or more specifically, winning criteria that are entirely separate from the byte count of the answers), as there is a genuine and fair winner with those (as opposed to the code golf principle of "inter-language competition")

pxeger

Make a new language with only two words: "9" meaning "99 bottles of beer on the wall, 99 bottles of beer [...]" and "P" meaning "New Sandboxed Posts"

caird coinheringaahing

13:01

@hyper-neutrino Also, the challenge kinda "died" (+6, 2 answers), so I figured I'd at least get one last +2 out of it :P

EnderShadow8

@pxeger I don't think the name HQ9-- is taken yet

pxeger

Is kolmogorov-complexity applicable for infinite output questions?

EnderShadow8

I think so

Wheat Wizard

Probably depends a little bit.

Redwolf Programs

Could a mod change the name of this bot to New Posts?

caird coinheringaahing

13:06

@RedwolfPrograms Slight bug with OSP, could you change if choose == 'active': return [post_ids[0] + ['22181', '22209']] to if choose == 'active': return [post_ids[0]]? I'll update the GitHub when I've got access to a computer

Redwolf Programs

Sure, will do

caird coinheringaahing

Should be on line 53, in the get_posts function :)

For anyone wondering, that's why OSP has included the same 2 posts in its messages for the past 3 days: chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/120733/2021/5/8/1-2

Redwolf Programs

I'm going to unpin the current message and make a new one

Razetime

3 hours ago, by Razetime

I'd love to talk to some jellyfish programmers if they exist in this chatroom

Redwolf Programs

Introducing Monthly Mini Golf!

5

Razetime

13:16

posting this again in case there's anybody with a good knowledge of Jellyfish

rak1507

midnight utc? :/

Redwolf Programs

It'll rotate by 8 hours every month

pxeger

oh it's 1am UTC. I thought it was 1pm UTC :(

rak1507

if it was weekly and rotated by 8 hrs each week people wouldn't potentially have to wait like 3 months to have a time that suited them

Redwolf Programs

A weekly event wouldn't be as much of a special event.

rak1507

13:20

disagree

Redwolf Programs

And I think disrupting all normal discussion for two to three hours every week wouldn't be great

pxeger

every 2 weeks? I think that's a good compromise

Redwolf Programs

Hmm, I think that'd be fine.

Biweekly Mini Golf doesn't sound as good as Monthly Mini Golf, but oh well

Razetime

@RedwolfPrograms I think it's a good way to keep the ~~blood flowing~~ activity consistent

Redwolf Programs

Maybe we should drop Biweekly from the name and just call it "Mini Golf in the Nineteenth Byte" or something

Opinions?

Wheat Wizard

13:27

I still don't get this thing at all.

Redwolf Programs

It'd be a chat event where there'd be a bunch of CMCs posted

Wheat Wizard

I guess I don't get the idea of planned CMCs.

Redwolf Programs

There'd just be a bit of unofficial planning first, to make sure they're actually interesting.

Wheat Wizard

If they are interesting then why not main challenges?

Redwolf Programs

That wouldn't be much of a chat event :p

EnderShadow8

13:31

So basically code golf but under time pressure?

Wheat Wizard

Yeah.

Redwolf Programs

Some would probably be ones that are simpler or closer to being a dupe that would typically be allowed

And no reason they can't become main posts later otherwise

Wheat Wizard

I don't know it just seems like they are less fun CMCs.

I don't really get it.

EnderShadow8

I'm not sure about how many people will join, that's the main concern

Redwolf Programs

If we do the event once and it's not fun or nobody shows up I guess we can hide all the evidence and pretend it never happened then :p

EnderShadow8

13:33

I def wouldn't join cos I like to think about problems for a long time

It's usually in the shower that the best ideas come

Wheat Wizard

Well I wouldn't be showing up anyway since it's at an absurd hour.

Redwolf Programs

Maybe we should just cancel the event, seems like half of the interested people can't show up due to time zone concerns, and the other half don't find it interesting

EnderShadow8

Just put all of your effort into main posts, and it'll be more fun

Wheat Wizard

Well I don't see any benefit from cancelling it.

EnderShadow8

unfortunate but usually new things get rejected

Wheat Wizard

13:35

If noone shows up noone shows up, no biggie.

EnderShadow8

@WheatWizard Except possibly saving a lot of effort put into planning?

Redwolf Programs

True, I guess we'll just see how it goes

EnderShadow8

It's really up to you, I mean, it's your time you waste if nobody shows up and I think you know better than I do

Wheat Wizard

If you put a lot of effort into planning than you can try and pivot to the main site. But if you are really worried about effort then just don't invest that much time.

Redwolf Programs

Wish this had been brought up on the chat event proposal post rather than after it'd all been drafted and stuff :/

pxeger

13:37

CMC: output the nursery rhyme "1 man went to mow..." infinitely. Reference implementation

hyper-neutrino

14:28

@cairdcoinheringaahing Ah, I see. and fair enough :p

caird coinheringaahing

14:49

@hyper-neutrino Well, I just noticed that thanks to an upvote and a bounty, I know have exactly 35000 rep. If I hadn't have accepted that, I'd be on 34998 :P

hyper-neutrino

15:02

lol, nice :D

caird coinheringaahing

@Neil Do you mind if I open a bug report about that? It appears that one doesn't already exist on MM

hyper-neutrino

17:04

@lyxal does Vyxal have cartesian power?

can't find it in elements.txt

I can probably just use cartesian product but it'll cost significantly more bytes

Wasif

@hyper-neutrino lyxal isn't around now

well vyxal documentation is not that good

hyper-neutrino

well I know but I don't need the answer urgently or anything lol

Neil

17:41

@cairdcoinheringaahing well, my profile says "Congratulations! You've earned: epic". [Track the next one] [Let us pick]

@cairdcoinheringaahing so technically I'm not tracking Epic, but I haven't stopped tracking Epic to track another badge yet either

caird coinheringaahing

That would explain it I suppose

Still SE should detect that kind of thing. Maybe just default to "Let us pick" if the user hasn't decided on either after a certain amount of time

hyper-neutrino

eh. I personally don't think it really matters that much lol, but maybe

caird coinheringaahing

Maybe a better thing would be to keep showing the "progress". 50/50 when Neil's on 60/50 is definitely a bug

hyper-neutrino

i think that'd make even less sense though, tbh

50/50 just means "okay, this person reached it, but they haven't decided on what to track next"

60/50 just looks like a bug lol

caird coinheringaahing

SE has precedence of tracking badges past their requirements (e.g. Curious and it's family)

hyper-neutrino

17:49

oh. well in that case maybe ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Neil

18:30

Epic's a special case because it's a stepping stone to Legendary?

hyper-neutrino

same for curious => inquisitive => socratic though

A username

20:50

@RedwolfPrograms Except for people who can only come 1/3 of the time

hyper-neutrino

i'd agree with a biweekly event

weekly seems a bit often. i wouldn't oppose it it just feels too frequent for me, but if people want that that's fine by me

A username

@hyper-neutrino True, that makes more sense, and some people don't have to wait three months for the next one.

Redwolf Programs

Weekly would be a bit too often, biweekly seems like a good compromise

hyper-neutrino

the point is to pull in new people to TNB + CGCC anyway; if it seems that the only people that are ever showing up are regulars I doubt it's really worth running. of course we'll have to wait to see how the turnout is.

A username

@RedwolfPrograms Ok, sounds good. Are you getting everyone to vote on this, or just updating it now?

Redwolf Programs

20:56

I'll wait until tonight, but then I'll go edit the meta post and the pinned message

Can't rename the event for now, but we can rename future ones

A username

Ok.

So the next is on Thursday 27th, 8am UTC.

I am a person

hi

Redwolf Programs

Hi!

I am a person

I'm soooo close to 500 rep

Redwolf Programs

Nice!

I am a person

21:04

Thanks!

Dead chats be like

hyper-neutrino

@Ausername they are from math.SE

I am a person

lol

A username

@hyper-neutrino Oops, didn't realize.

I am a person

Math.se is cool

hyper-neutrino

you have more rep there than me :p

rak1507

21:07

what brings you to TNB

I am a person

idk I was just stumbling across random chats

@hyper-neutrino lolllll

rak1507

fair enough

Redwolf Programs

This one's usually pretty active, although if you aren't a code golfer most of the discussion here will probably be pretty confusing :p

hyper-neutrino

@RedwolfPrograms [citation-needed]; that implies most conversation here is relating to code-golf (:P)

I am a person

what is code golf?

Redwolf Programs

21:10

Pain

But the good kind

Trying to write code to do a task in the fewest bytes possible

hyper-neutrino

it's a particular type of coding challenge where the objective is to solve it in as few bytes of code as possible

I am a person

ohhhhhh

hyper-neutrino

your message appeared after i sent mine

I am a person

Nice

hyper-neutrino

i am being scammed by my network latency

A username

21:10

Ninjad?

hyper-neutrino

ye

I am a person

at least your ping isn't like 2000

Redwolf Programs

The name comes from the scoring in normal golf, where lower scores are better

hyper-neutrino

this room's name actually comes from a reference to that too - in an 18-hole golf course, the "19th hole" is used to refer to a bar/restaurant/whatever at the end of the course, and hence the 19th byte ("The Nineteenth Byte" also has 19 bytes in it) refers to a spot where code golfers hang out :P

I am a person

I just got 2nd place in a math competition

A username

21:11

Pretty much every single message here is stared

I am a person

The results were announced right now

hyper-neutrino

Congrats! which one?

rak1507

@Iamaperson not first? smh

I am a person

lol I wasn't first cause I'm very smart yes

(sarcasm btw)

@hyper-neutrino It's called NSF (North South Foundation)

hyper-neutrino

ah, i see. well congrats :P

I am a person

21:13

thx :D

Redwolf Programs

There should be quite a few math related rooms too, although I'm not sure how active they'd be

I am a person

I got 1st (a perfect score) last year

So I'm very mad right now

that I got 2nd

@RedwolfPrograms I know but I don't want to be in a math room with people who are too big brain for me to comprehend

rak1507

haha well there are quite a few big brained maths people in here too

I am a person

coding = (partly) mat

math

Redwolf Programs

There's a lot of non-big-brain stuff here too

Jan 29 '18 at 20:17, by Dennis

waffles

I am a person

21:15

@rak1507 lol nice

rak1507

@RedwolfPrograms lol

I am a person

waffles

Redwolf Programs

That got ten stars

I am a person

pancakes > waffles

@RedwolfPrograms how

ten stars?

wow

Redwolf Programs

There's some context I'm sure, but it's much funnier on its own IMO :p

I am a person

21:17

All of SE: waffles > pancakes

Well I better get that free 100 rep :)

Redwolf Programs

Do you know any programming? (If not I'd really recommend it, especially if you like math)

I am a person

I kinda know some programming

I'm actually building a game right now

A username

What language

I am a person

JS

A username

Js is good

Redwolf Programs

21:20

Oh nice!

JS is my favorite and second least favorite language.

I am a person

imagine

does that mean you only know 2 languages

Redwolf Programs

No, it's just simulatenously really good for some things and really stupid sometimes :p

I am a person

lol

Redwolf Programs

typeof new Number(0) // "object"

I am a person

But you said JS is your favorite and second least favorite

That means let x be the other language

Your placing (from best to worst): Java, x = Java is your favorite and your second least favorite

Hence, by proof, you only know 2 languages

@RedwolfPrograms

Redwolf Programs

21:23

JS is just in two places at once :p

I am a person

lol

by proof you only know 2 languages I still stick to that

Ok I need to go

Redwolf Programs

I would say you should check out code golf, although the JS category is super competitive :p

o/

I am a person

Bye!

@RedwolfPrograms I got that free 100 rep :)

A username

@RedwolfPrograms There's me, you, Arnauld, EnderShadow8, tsh, Neil, (Is there anyone else?)

Redwolf Programs

xnor

A username

21:26

Oh yes.

Redwolf Programs

And even if it was just Arnauld it'd still be nearly impossible to get a (competitive) answer in :p

I'm only just now starting to get moderately good at it, and I still invariably get outgolfed several times :p

A username

Arnauld manage to golf your solution for the money exchange thing to 42 bytes.

So it must've been on the right track.

Redwolf Programs

And tsh down to 41

But only being outgolfed by 6 bytes is a record for me I think :p

A username

Did not see that.

Have you ever outgolfed Arnauld?

Redwolf Programs

No, but I've written an answer that they took a trick from that saved them some bytes

A username

21:29

I managed once, but Neil helped. Then tsh golfed my one some more.

Redwolf Programs

I've gotten within a few minutes of outgolfing them, though

A username

Wdym?

Redwolf Programs

I had a shorter answer but as I was posting it I got sniped

A username

Nice!

Redwolf Programs

IMO JS is one of the more interesting languages for golfing, because the short lambda syntax and large number of options for doing something

A username

21:38

@RedwolfPrograms Agreed. That also means it's much easier to get ninja'd by Arnauld's magic numbers :P

user

This is why I golf in a language practically no one else uses here

I have no idea if I'm any good at it because there's no competition, but I can also say I'm the best active Scala golfer here :P

caird coinheringaahing

Q: This answer?

It's a good answer, and the math is very cool, but it's not golfed at all

A username

I think it should stay

rak1507

I wondered what you'd think of that :P

It should definitely stay

hyper-neutrino

I vote for it to stay. By policy, it should be removed, but it's not just someone being lazy and not golfing their solution, it's an entirely different approach / idea which I think is cool and has merit being a part of our site

caird coinheringaahing

22:13

OP's now included a golfed version, so there's basically no argument for removing it now :)

hyper-neutrino

oh. nice :D :D

rak1507

for some definition of golfed

caird coinheringaahing

It makes an effort to be short, which is enough for us :P

user

23:25

Note to self: Don't blindly copy code from the javadocs. I copied a method signature and couldn't figure out why the compiler was telling me I wasn't overriding anything until I opened it up in IntelliJ and found there was a zero width space :|

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