12:00 AM
Hey @El'endiaStarman, can mods remove stars from chatroom messages?

Yes

@DJMcMayhem good to know. I was curious after I kept seeing starred messages disapear from the contact chatroom

@JoKing Well, it's not a lot, but it's enough to annoy me. 1) I can't find any way to do a search from a question's page; only seems to be available from the list-of-questions / list-of-search-results pages. 2) The layout is different; I keep look for things where they are in the desktop version, so it slows me down. 3) Users' reputation score is missing from the list-of-questions. 4) As stated, double-tap+drag zoom is disabled – this alone would be enough to make me avoid mobile mode.
Mostly I just don't see any point in using mobile mode when my phone can use the same exact layout I'm so used to on desktop without breaking a sweat, and all I have to do is zoom a little more.

@DJMcMayhem can stars be removed en masse?

Unfortunately no
It's manual, also extremely hard to do from mobile

12:03 AM
@DJMcMayhem so how do you remove all the stars from clues so quickly?

Clicking quickly? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

@DJMcMayhem ah. ¯\_(´• ツ •)_/¯

@El'endiaStarman Sometimes I consider running for diamond so I don't need to bother the few remaining mods around here so much. However, recent event considered, I'm frankly scared of becoming a mod.
2

@Adám Well this is awkward now

*crickets chirp*

12:11 AM
@DJMcMayhem Why?

I suppose I should add that I almost always use the phone in landscape orientation.

0

Well. I never thought I'd be writing this message. I've logged into this site nearly every day for over 5 years. I truly love this community. I've learned so many things from it, and I have made countless friends that I consider just as close as people I know in real life. Which is why it's reall...

0

Well. I never thought I'd be writing this message. I've logged into this site nearly every day for over 5 years. I truly love this community. I've learned so many things from it, and I have made countless friends that I consider just as close as people I know in real life. Which is why it's reall...

@DJMcMayhem wait hol' up
HOL' UP
Y'all resigned?

That's it then. No more mods?

12:13 AM
@DJMcMayhem (⪨╭╮⪩)

Yikes. Where is there to go? There's no other site like this... is there?!

0

Factorise a floating point number Given a target floating point number, \$T\$ and a set of \$N\$ floating point numbers \$\{x_{1},..,x_{N}\}\$ and a permissible error \$tol\$ , find a set of integer coefficients \$A\$, \$\{m_{1},..,m_{N}\}\$ such that:  A\prod\limits_{i=1}^{N}x_{i}^{m_{i}} = T...

@Adám I haven't actually been moderating for several months now.

@DJMcMayhem I know, but at least you're in TNB to grant write accesses. Doorknob is never here (and hasn't posted anything either for about a month). I'd maybe be willing to be a non-moderating mod like you…

12:23 AM
@Adám A couple Christianity.SE members have been talking about maybe running for mod if there's an election. I've made it clear that I don't recommend doing so because....[gestures at everything SE did].

We do CMCs there, at least

@Pavel I don't mean this chatroom, I mean a place to post challenges and answers to them

At some point in the future Axtell will launch

Speak of the Doorknob!

Hey Doorknob

12:25 AM
OK, I take my words back. Doorknob is here sometimes.

@Doorknob What are your thoughts on moderation? i.e. will you keep doing it?

Is there any chance of porting all of the data from CGCC to Axtell once it's up?
It'd be a shame to just discard all of it / consider it frozen

@El'endiaStarman Yeah, I'm mostly scared of the unknown. I have no idea what being a mod really entails, and what one subjects/binds oneself to by being a mod. It all seems so secret.

Axtell already can import CGCC challenges

12:26 AM
Cool.

@Adám It's not that different really. Legally all you're agreeing to is promising to not share PII on users

If one imports posts to other sites, is that content CC 3 or 4?

I'm not sure anyone knows

So how can one legally import it, when both 3 and 4 require inclusion of the correct copyright notice?

Well the site's not done yet

12:41 AM
Axtell's font is a bit big

please let the relevant people know your opinion over on the cgcc discord

12:56 AM
Well at a quick look, Axtell's treatment of languages alone is a showstopper... I would never consider it a worthy successor to CGCC if it didn't allow users to answer with whatever language they want to define

@Deadcode Well the site's not done yet

@Pavel the lesson I've learned that it's a bad idea to overcomplicate your data structures. make them as flat as possible...

1:12 AM
0

As of recently, we've lost 3 of our 4 moderators. This means we only have 1 moderator left. Also, several people expressing their concerns that things are dying around here. With the recent mess over on SE, the growing inactivity of past regulars, and a presumable lack of people wanting to becom...

2

1:29 AM

2:08 AM
0

The McGill Billboard Project annotates various audio features of songs from a random sample of the Billboard charts. I scraped this data to produce the following file of chord progressions: chords.txt Write the shortest code that outputs the above file (or its contents).

2:34 AM
1

Final phase You have chosen the categories and the nominees for PPCG's annual “Best of”. Now it is time to pick the winners! Each of the thirteen categories is represented by an answer to this question, and each of these answers contains all nominations by the members of our community. Voting ...

@Pavel unclear

3:22 AM
@Lyxal No worries - I normally don't mind, there just happened to be like 3 people make that mistake in the last 24 hours. I'm glad Pyth is on people's minds, to be honest.
@Adám Sounds like a question for law.SE? My (uninformed) guess is that if you list both copyright notices, and describe the situation (licenced under at least one, unclear which), you're legally in the clear.

3 hours later…
6:04 AM
Finally posted my first question: codegolf.stackexchange.com/questions/198427/…

2

The challenge is to implement a program or function (subsequently referred to as "program") that takes a nonnegative integer \$n\$ as input and returns \$n\over\sqrt{2}\$ (the input divided by the square root of two) as output, rounded to a nonnegative integer. You may take your input and output...

7:01 AM
@Lyxal Why make the only test case in your 05AB1E answer one that fails due to floating point rounding?
I can understand including some that fail in the Python answer, but it also has ones that pass
@Lyxal Also, a token by token explanation of the Keg and 05AB1E answers would be greatly appreciated :)

Hah.

Two explanations coming right up sir
Would you like fries with that?
:P

Okay then

7:08 AM
@Lyxal lol

@Deadcode Sorry, we're all out of ketchup
I've provided a reasonable alternative
But usually, it is recommended to wait ~1 week until answering your own question.
But it doesn't matter now

7:27 AM
@Lyxal I used ... for a reason.

So that the size of the regex could be appreciated at a glance.
It's more effective than just a number of bytes
And some people might be able to grok a regex in one eyeful like that. I wouldn't be surprised if @Grimmy or @H.PWiz could do that

7:51 AM
@Doorknob Can you put an end to the Rickrolling?

The main goal of everyone on PCCG was to participate enough so that the site got its design
Now that it has we have no purpose and thus everyone is leaving
/s

6 messages moved to Trashcan

@Adám That’s only in schools and for public servants working

@Lyxal I never hid the fact that posting my own answer was a big motivation for creating the question.

8:16 AM
@Adám I'm guessing a golfed 'big'⎕CY'dfns' solution to "Shift right by half a bit" would be terribly slow, right? i.e. a brute force search, like the regex.

@Deadcode big is ⌂big in Extended.

@Adám Of course. Still, my question stands?

8:41 AM
Well, looks like a Newton Raphson version like Nick Kennedy's Jelly answer could be really fast.

9:17 AM
1

Creating a golfing language can be hard. Let's help budding golfing language creators out and provide some helpful tips on how to create one. I'm looking for tips on: The design process Implementation Community engagement One tip per answer would be appreciated, and tips like "don't create...

@Deadcode Yeah, or even a binary search. You can get limits by doing a float calculation first, and maybe some math on the error.

Right. I was just wondering how to draw the line between maximum golf and having something that finishes in a reasonable amount of time.

The challenge doesn't require infinite precision, so golf-wise it has been solved already. That said, code golf tends to ignore such pesky limitations as the heat death and information capacity of the universe, as long as it works in principle. That said, it is an interesting experiment, and I think you can make it work.

In CGCC, rule of cool can override actual rules
3

10:09 AM
hi all

10:33 AM
Hello
1

Or is it finally time that we jump ship and look further ashore? If you do decide you want to move, we'd be very happy to host CGCC on TopAnswers. I'll keep a tab open in The Nineteenth Byte if anyone wants to discuss the idea…

I'd be very happy to chat with you guys if there is serious interest in moving
TopAnswers is capable of hosting full Q&A right now, and the turnaround on adding features is very quick compared to SE

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz I've been looking a bit at TopAnswers. What kind of customisation would be available? You may be aware that CGCC is quite different from most SE sites, and not actually a Q&A site per se.

Topanswers/databases has some custom integration with db<>fiddle, which is an example of the kind of thing we are willing to do. See this question for an example: topanswers.xyz/databases?q=81

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz That looks promising. You'll find that a lot of answers here have links with the text "Try it online!", which is a service that can run code in a great many languages. If that could be integrated so one could "run" code blocks, it'd be a very attractive feature to this community. Posts here also tend to attract a lot of answers, so an automatic ToC would be nice. Many authors here insert runnable JS snippets in their posts for this purpose.
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Not a lot. Mostly in replacing canned text with something more appropriate. E.g. our posts are not (usually) questions, but rather challenges, and the site is competitive rather than collaborative.
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz We currently "abuse" a meta post as sandbox for developing challenges for the main site. That system isn't very good, but at least SE has allowed up to have a permanent notification asking people to use the sandbox:

@Adám an automatic ToC that looks something like the answer summaries under each post on our main question lists: topanswers.xyz/databases? Or something more specific than that?

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Yes, that's excellent, but it'd probably need to be moved from the questions' listing to the page for the actual question, since it can become very long (3 digits).

10:47 AM
@Adám yes understood — on the question list we will probably limit that list for most communities to the top 5 or so but that can be tailored for CGCC, and having it on the page for the actual question is something I can promise as it would be very easy
TIO looks great — integrating it might be quite a lot of effort, but surely useful for lots of communities, not just CGCC

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Another feature which I imagine would be fairly easy to implement, but very attractive to us, is using and serving the DejaVu Sans Mono font. This had massive support but SE turned it down.

it's a user profile choice, but each community also picks a default font
running our own TIO server looks like it might be possible, I'll have to look into that some more

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Some of our dismayed veteran users have recently continued development of an otherwise stalled project to replace this site. This can give a good image of what kind of interface is wanted by the community. You can have a look at it. However, I think it is valuable for us to be connected to a broader group of sites, like we are on SE.

@Adám thanks I will take a look at that
our current communities don't have voting on normal questions, but I'm guessing you'd want us to enable that (it's opt-in per community)

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz I'm not even sure we need that, as long as we have a way to indicate to an author that there is an issue with their post.

10:53 AM
@Adám can you explain the benefit of sandboxing?
@Adám currently that's flag+comment. You might already know that one of TopAnswers main differences from SE is the 'chat room per question' design
so discussions about improving questions can get their own space without cluttering up the actual question/answer space
it's also useful for moderation

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz It is quite difficult (especially the first few dozen times) to make a challenge right. A lot of newcomers jump into challenge writing before they answer any existing challenges, and so they don't have a good feeling for the questions that a post must answer. Sandboxing allows experienced users to guide and ask edge-condition questions so the author can get all these things straightened out before the challenge goes live.
New challenge writers also often make false assumptions about features of programming languages in general, based on the features of their favourite language(s).
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz I've noticed that, and I personally like it. However, something that could maybe make this work was that a question would be blocked from receiving answers until it had a decided-upon number of upvotes.
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Would it be possible to have voting on questions only, and not on answers?

@Adám would you want all posts to be automatically sand-boxed unless the OP has previous well-received questions?
@Adám yes we can allow that — do you not want answers sorted at all though?

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz I'd even be happy with all posts being sandboxed regardless. Experienced authors will post good answers that soon enough will become unlocked.
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz I think sorted by posting time or alphabetically would be more useful. Answer posts tend to begin with # Language name (implementation), NN bytes`

There is no technical problem with any of this — I guess there would need to be an invite-only beta during which a bunch of meta posts along these lines would be thrashed out and voted on, and some/all of the feature requests implemented. I imagine we'd need at least 3-4 people to show a strong interest to make that viable though

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz One issue with that is that it is quite common for passers-by to comment on answers, giving the author tips on how to improve their post. With 100+ answers on a single challenge, I fear that the chat would become chaotic. Can one mark one's chat messages as relating to the main post, a specific answer, or a specific chat message?
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz I think we can arrange that. A bunch of veterans are currently discussing the future on Discord.

11:06 AM
@Adám messages can be directed at the OP of an answer (even if they have not commented in the room), but there is no automatic indication that the chat message is linked to the answer so currently that would have to be mentioned explicitly. I can see various ways of adding some sort of automatic indication that might be practical though.
brb

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Ah, that'd be necessary. It is also common for an answerer to post multiple answers to the same challenge, each using a different language. It'd be essential to be able to comment on a specific answer, rather than to a specific author.

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz I'd be interested to give it a try
And thanks for the answer on meta BTW
It's interesting having a third party option as a sort of backup

11:22 AM
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz I'm also in for the beta.

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz I just created an account. Count me in.
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz You have a TeX site, but do you have support for rendering TeX, or rather MathJax? Many of our posts benefit greatly from that.

@Adám yes there are plugins for both (LaTeX and MathJax) available for markdown-it.
I'm going to go ahead and set up the private community — it would be helpful to have the name for the url up front, 'topanswers.xyz/cgcc' or 'topanswers.xyz/codegolf'?

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz A lot of our users seem to mainly access the site on mobile. Any plans for a more responsive site?

@Adám lots of plans but not many users have been pushing for it yet. it's just about useable at the moment…

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Will it be possible to import content from SE?

11:32 AM
we don't have bulk import tools yet — you can import individual posts with answers

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz How does licensing work for that? I don't see an "CC3/4-status-unclear" option.

there is no easy answer I'm afraid — maybe what you are suggesting is the way to do it
ridiculous of course, what a mess :(

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz I often work with multiple windows. This is how it looks with the browser using half of my screen:
Not "useable" imho.
At least it should be possible to collapse/resize the three panes.

there is quite a lot of work to do on that page — the sync scrolling isn't nearly as good as it should be
but we started coding on Oct 14th 2019 so that give you an idea how fast features are being added :)

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz This chat room (and to a certain degree the ability to create additional chat rooms for specific topics) is pretty essential for the community. I don't see any "pure chat without post" functionality on TA. Plans for that?

11:42 AM
@Adám yes there are per-community chat rooms as well (eg 'The Tavern' on meta, "The Heap" and "Stop the Merry Go Round" on databases)
at the moment we create them manually on request (except that each community has one default room automatically)
there are gallery/private rooms too

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Ah, so the main room is the one displayed along the main post listing?

and there is a drop down in the chat footer there if there are other rooms

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz On SE, each site has an associated meta site. How does this work on TA?

@Adám meta questions are a question 'type' rather than meta being a completely separate community

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz OK, I guess that makes sense and increases discoverability. But an ability to filter by type would be nice.

11:49 AM
@Adám yes we are trying to work out how filtering should work for all sorts of things

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Cool. It would be nice to be able to participate in the chat from the transcript page/be able to isolate the chat room in its own window.

@Adám you can resize the chat pane, which is sort of a hidden feature
the seperater is draggable

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz A cool. That does the trick.
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz On SE, questions have labels and at least one is required. On this site we use that to specify the main winning criterion of the challenge (e.g. shortest code, fastest code, etc.) Any chance of custom types?

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Yes, I just noticed. I think it is spelled "code golf" though, not as one word.

11:53 AM

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Many users here have elaborate profile pages, often listing posts they are proud of or languages they have created. I can't seem to be able to click any avatar but my own…

do you want the "& Coding Challenges" in there too?
@Adám that's not implemented yet I'm afraid
not hard to do just been on the back burner…

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz I guess that should be up to the community. I personally don't like term that was voted in on this site as I find that it still sounds like we are interested in posts that ask for help with challenging code. "& programming competitions" or "& (other) competetive programming" would be better. I'd say leave it as it is for now.

@Lyxal if you create an account on TopAnswers and give your profile a recognisable name I'll add you to the private community we just set up
@Bubbler likewise ^^^^^^^

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Is it possible to change the post type "question" to "code golf"?

12:01 PM
@Adám very possibly, I'll look into it
we probably need to work out the voting rules first though…

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz And if possible, we'd need a few otherwise identical types. Just "code golf" and "tips" as a start are a good proof of concept.
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz It'd look really good on the main listing, saying "Code golf: Add two numbers in base -17.5"

@Adám can you show me where 'labels' are displayed on SE? I might be being daft but I can't see them…

@Adám oh so it is just a normal tag? How many are there, or is it just 'code golf' and 'tips'?
I'm thinking different question types might be best if there is a limited number of options
(as you seem to be suggesting I mean)

@KevinCruijssen Oops, it really is 2M^2<=N^2 in my regex, too.

12:15 PM
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz We use SE's tags for two purposes. To specify the challenge type (there are relatively few of those) and to inform about the subject (lots of those).
13

2 years ago, we discussed dropping the objective winning criterion requirement. No consensus was really reached. I'd really like to start that conversation again, as I feel like it is hindering our growth into a more comprehensive site. What advantages/disadvantages are there to having objecti...

@Adám if you are happy to split that, I think it makes sense to use question type for the challenge type, and tags for categories

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Absolutely. I think that'd be great. So we have a handful of challenge types and one special type with is "Tips" which is the only type of actual Q&A post here.
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz How does one use tags?

@Adám we can add all the SE tags, or you can just hand-pick some. topanswers/databases decided they wanted to cut down dramatically and just have a limited set, but it's up to you
currently adding them is a dev job though, there is no interface for user to add tags (they can add existing tags to questions of course)

12:53 PM
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz Can you enable MathJax for Code Golf?

1:50 PM
I could do a user analyzation on Code Golf.

2:04 PM
@Adám should be able to do that within a few hours, let me look into it now :)

2:42 PM
@Golf Why'd you submit a useless edit to my post?

@DJMcMayhem Because I initially downvoted it, then I changed my mind and decided to upvote it.

devious!

@DJMcMayhem Can you use your last moments as mod to permaban Zyabin aka ccgc-avatar guy for his incessant streams of consciousness, obnoxious nickname changes, confusing avatar choices?

3:00 PM
@Fatalize Now I can't change my username anymore...

I can change it back

4:00 PM
@DJMcMayhem last moments as mod Did I miss somehting? Are you going to cease being a mod?

Pity :-(( But I understand your reasons
Please be around, even if not as mod anymore

I hope to be. It's hard to imagine not lurking in chat anymore

4:56 PM
0

I am pretty new to this but I wanted to create a challenge! It would be a code-golf math challenge and the purpose is to create a program that differentiates polynomials. A polynomial, for the purposes of program input, is going to be a string representing additions and subtractions of monomials...

@NewSandboxedPosts Hey guys, reach out to me for feedback on this challenge I would like to create

5:23 PM
co
7

6:21 PM
(^ Sorry, I don't know what happened)

6:47 PM
0

Background One of the commonly meme'd aspects of javascript is its incredibly loose type coercion that allows for +!![]+[+[]] == '10' this technique can also be used to create letters as seen in the following example: [[][[]]+[]][+[]][-~[]] == 'n' [undefined+[]][+[]][-~[]] // [][[]] -> undefine...

7:28 PM
@Adám I was wondering why I suddenly got so many votes on the gauss->eisenstein challenge, turns out there is the bounty of yours :)

1 hour later…
8:44 PM
hi all

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz hey Jack, I've created an account with the name Lyxal. What he next?

@Lyxal I don't see you in the list — are you on topanswers.xyz ?
you should see something like this:

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz I am. Although I originally signed up about a week ago under the name "Jono 2906" (my old username)

oh that explains it :)
I've added you — refresh and you should see Code Golf in the community drop-down

I can see it now!
@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz nice, the question area has live markdown syntax highlighting.

9:03 PM
@Lyxal yes, expect a few rough edges but we are proud to have some features that SO haven't managed to add in 6-8 years (markdown tables cough cough)

@Jacksaystrytopanswers.xyz wait, did you say t a b l e s?

a long-term personal bugbear for me:
70

Several sites have MathJax enabled, so there is obviously some room for site-specific markdown. Therefore please can we have markdown tables here on dba.se? There is an open feature-request for this on mSO, but whereas it is hardly a key feature for a programming Q&A site, a significant percent...

^^^ that's the list of what markdown we support currently

Amazing!

1

Something unusual: a code golf question with a purpose. I occasionally find myself in scenarios resembling the following: Suppose you have two computers, A and B. Both of them have a fresh copy of Windows 10 installed. It comes with all the usual stuff, like notepad and paint and a browser, bu...

@NewMainPosts cracks knuckles

9:16 PM
CMC Write code to construct a nondeterministic finite automaton over the alphabet of pairs of bits that accepts the word (𝑎_1,𝑏_1)(𝑎_2,𝑏_2)…(𝑎_𝑛,𝑏_𝑛) iff the binary words 𝑎_1𝑎_2…𝑎_𝑛 and 𝑏_1𝑏_2…𝑏_𝑛 have Levenshtein distance up to two

> Sound from a musician echoes around the auditorium creating sound that surrounds the listener. Sound from a pigeon does not. This is because a coo sticks.

ugh ... I'm stealing that one.

1 hour later…
10:21 PM
Hey guys, are there any golfing languages based on Java?

10:45 PM
@AdmBorkBork Four stars to my co accidental message? LOL