The Nineteenth Byte

Phoenix

22:00

Also ^

Christopher

But so simple

Mr. Xcoder

@Phoenix I use Jetbrains PyCharm CE

Zizouz212

Although I'm too lazy to try getting PyCharm or anything, so I keep letting myself get stuck with it -_-

Christopher

XD

Phoenix

@Mr.Xcoder That is the correct choice.

Christopher

22:00

I run Visual Studio Enterprise

Zizouz212

What the

Phoenix

Why do you have VS Enterprise in the first place

Mr. Xcoder

I don't really prefer Ruby over Python

Phoenix

What did Community not have that you needed.

Zizouz212

Okay I'm so done with python

Christopher

22:01

@Phoenix Because I can

(for free also :P)

Phoenix

Ah

Zizouz212

lol whoever starred my message completely read it out of context :P

Phoenix

Unless it's for C#, you shouldn't be using VS, ever.

Mr. Xcoder

@Zizouz212 ssh

Christopher

I can't C# without glasses

Phoenix

22:01

Everytime I use it I discover a new way in which is horribly broken.

4

Christopher

(I actually can but puns :P)

Zizouz212

I'm trying to figure out python-requests and why ssl is suddenly working -_-

Phoenix

Hopefully JetBrains Rider comes out soon so we C# people can ascend from the VS darkness.

Christopher

JetBrains < Visual Studio

Zizouz212

\o/

JetBrains > almost everything

Christopher

22:02

JetBrains = NoBrains

Mr. Xcoder

@Phoenix Hopefully

Phoenix

@Christopher Absolutely not

Mr. Xcoder

@Christopher strongly disagree

Phoenix

@Mr.Xcoder Well we don't know when it comes out

Christopher

I don't even know wth jetbrains is besides a IDE

Zizouz212

22:03

-_- ಠ_ಠ

Phoenix

ಠ_ಠ

@Christopher It's a company that makes the best IDEs for every language, as well as the language Kotlin.

Mr. Xcoder

Zizouz212

Umm... folks watch the flags. Really?

Christopher

@Phoenix For C#?

Phoenix

> ¯\_(ಠ_ಠ)_/¯

@Christopher JetBrains Rider is an Early Access

jetbrains.com/rider

It breaks occasinally, which is unfortunate, but so does VS

Mr. Xcoder

22:05

@Phoenix The IDE for Swift is crappy. It's far worse than Xcode, it's literally horrible. Apart from that one, the others are ok

Christopher

Do you really have to buy another IDE for different languages?

Phoenix

@Mr.Xcoder Oh, well, I don't have a Mac so I wouldn't know.

Mr. Xcoder

Please stop

heather

someone just flagged "JetBrains < Visual Studio" - really? That's not offensive in any way.

Zizouz212

Hold on a second

Phoenix

22:06

@Christopher You don't need another IDE for each language. IDEA can function as an IDE for every language, it's just not as convenient.

Zizouz212

JetBrains has a whole bunch of stuff for students, right?

Christopher

@Phoenix Ahh makes sense

Zizouz212

@Phoenix Notepad can work as an IDE XD

Christopher

You just pay for the smarter versions for you language

Phoenix

IDEA has plugins for e.g. Python that make it equivalent to e.g. PyCharm.

Christopher

22:06

@Zizouz212 Notepad ++ works just fine

Mr. Xcoder

@Zizouz212 No, it's a company that makes IDE

Zizouz212

@Christopher No, without the ++

Phoenix

@Zizouz212 Yep, almost everything, including all IDEs, are free for students.

Christopher

@Phoenix Wait rly? Oh heck yes

Mr. Xcoder

Ok, gtg now

Zizouz212

22:07

@Mr.Xcoder What I meant is that they'll offer upgraded versions of their products for students right? Mind you though, the last time I ever cruised around that territory was three years ago

Phoenix

o/

Mr. Xcoder

Bye

Christopher

@Phoenix How does one apply?

Phoenix

@Zizouz212 For IDEA and PyCharm, which have community editions, you can get professional versions, the paid ones you can get for free.

Zizouz212

Yep

jetbrains.com/pycharm/buy/#edition=discounts

Christopher

22:08

nvm found it

Phoenix

@Christopher jetbrains.com/student

Zizouz212

And this is perfect cause I've got a Carleton account :)

Christopher

@Phoenix Hmm lets see if they let my go by with a HS student XD I may have to work a bit of magic

Zizouz212

They have it for hs students

If they don't, you can just request it

Christopher

Planning to do that

I would like to have a smart IDE

Zizouz212

22:11

I'm done with using idle

and having it crash when I'm praying it to not

Ooh... That reminds me. I need to get an actual computer.

Phoenix

@Christopher They let me

@Christopher What you can do, and what I know Medeleev did, is attach a copy of your transcript.

Christopher

@Phoenix Did you use a school ID?

Phoenix

My school has a .edu address.

So I used my email.

Zizouz212

It's a school email, transcript, or isic card

Jim

Does someone know Pyth here? How to perform an inner zip()?

Like innerzip([(a, b), (c, d)], [(e, f), (g, h)], F) -> [(F(a, e), F(b, f)), (F(c, g), F(d, h))]

Zizouz212

22:15

You apply a function to zipped arguments?

Jim

(The distinction between tuples and lists isn't relevant here)

Phoenix

@Zizouz212 IDK what isic means tho so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Zizouz212

International Student Identity Card

Phoenix

ah

Zizouz212

@Jim You should just be able to do map(zip(args), func)

Jim

22:17

@Zizouz212 Okay, trying that

Phoenix

I wonder if I should apply for an ISIC card.

Zizouz212

I don't think it's worth it

Phoenix

It's 20 bucks

Christopher

I need a transcript

Zizouz212

It's really only useful if you travel alot

Christopher

22:18

Do you need one?

Phoenix

@Christopher You should have one, given that the school year recently ended.

Zizouz212

If you basically just stay at home, you can use your school's own student card

Christopher

@Phoenix I tossed that out :/

Phoenix

Welp

Zizouz212

sigh -_-

Phoenix

22:18

Is there an online gradebook you could print from?

Christopher

I have last years student ID card and a school email

@Phoenix Yeah

Zizouz212

You have a school email?

Phoenix

Needs to be a .edu email

Christopher

Yes

Then no

I have a .us email

XD

Phoenix

Which highschools tend not to go for, for some reason.

Zizouz212

22:19

Doesn't have to be .edu

It just needs to be from an educational institution

Phoenix

It does to apply via email, the form will reject it otherwise.

Zizouz212

All my school emails are .ca

programmer5000

Phoenix

@programmer5000 Seems about right

Christopher

Just realized I was giving you people my school name so you can find me XD

Zizouz212

22:20

lol

Look in this repository: github.com/JetBrains/swot

If you're school is there, good.

Otherwise, you can contact them to add your school in there.

I just checked, and my university is in there, and I saw a few secondary school boards in there as well

Christopher

You think that would work?

Minus the censorship

Zizouz212

Probably not.

You said you have a student id card, right?

Christopher

Yeah from last year

Zizouz212

Scan it and send it.

They accept that as a document.

Christopher

Annnd sent

Ty for removing my image XD don't rly want everyone knowing that much about me

Zizouz212

22:27

Purged the history so people can find anything too

programmer5000

Can I get feedback on this before I post to main?

Christopher

@Zizouz212 You're the best :D

totallyhuman

@programmer5000 IDK can you?

New Main Posts

2

Q: Make a base64 Quine!

Your challenge is to output a Base64-encoded version of your source code, and optionally a line break. You must output the correct padding, if any. Standard quine rules apply, shortest answer wins. It must be a valid RFC 4648 encoded base64 string, with no linebreaks (except optionally a trailin...

Zizouz212

lol

New Main Posts

22:45

0

Q: Net neutrality: Is my internet being throttled?

From the wikipedia: Net neutrality is the principle that Internet service providers and governments regulating the Internet should treat all data on the Internet the same, not discriminating or charging differentially by user, content, website, platform, application, type of attached equipmen...

code-golf internet networking

totallyhuman

star spam again?

Zizouz212

Star spam?

Jonah

@Dennis Another theoretical question about Jelly. Last time we chatted you mentioned that, being built on top of python, it was neither particularly fast nor intended to be. At the same -- as evidenced by its performance in code golf contests -- I think a strong argument could be made that it's even more expressive and powerful than J, which I know was one of Jelly's inspirations and whose expressive power is often lauded in its own right.

My question is: does this expressive power come at a cost? That is, would it impossible to optimize Jelly in the same way J is optimized for speed? Does Jelly's power contain within it way more complexity?

Challenger5

I think it's like J but with more syntax shortcuts, shorter and more built-ins, etc.

Also, you can run arbitrary Python code, so that would be hard to optimize.

But that's not very commonly used (I think)

Jonah

@Challenger5, re: your first point, are you saying i could think of Jelly like J + an extensive library of utility functions?

Challenger5

22:55

And different syntax (like you don't need spaces between builtins)

And a bunch of other things

I don't know

I don't Jelly.

It also has complicated rules for breaking down a chain based on how it was called (niladically, monadically, dyadically)

Jonah

Just riffing now on golfing languages in general, but it seems like the number of builtins is an impossibly confounding factor in measuring a languages power. meaning, i could take J, write a million utility functions optimized for golfing puzzles, call it a new language called "Jonah".... and then win all the contests. I'm not saying Jelly does that, but it seems that every langauge does that to some extent and so it makes comparing them difficult.

Jan Dvorak

hence our rule that the language predates the question

Challenger5

Eventually golfing languages are going to become very specialized, and they will have built-ins optimized for a specific purpose (even if they are all just Jelly dialects).

That rule has been lifted because people decided it was counterproductive
But trying to abuse the challenge is now (I think) a standard loophole

(relevant meta consensus)

New Main Posts

2

Q: Pulse Measurement of Heart Arrhythmia

In this challenge you have to make an ascii pulsing heart with rhythm problems (Heart arrhythmia) and then measure the pulse.Don't worry it's easy! Making the heart The heart alternates between these 2 states: state 1 ,d88b.d88b, 88888888888 `Y8888888Y' `Y888Y' `Y'...

code-golf ascii-art

Challenger5

WHY WAS MY BOUNCE-MODULO QUESTION ON HNQ

NOOOOO

IT DOESN'T DESERVE IT

IT'S DUMB

PhiNotPi

23:07

I see you're new here.

Zizouz212

Every question here makes it to hnq

Super annoying actually.

Challenger5

Not to mention that it's a generalization and near duplicate of triangular wave (too lazy to type real name)

PhiNotPi

(Not really, just that it's super common for "dumb" questions to get sent to the HNQ)

Challenger5

I was going to discard it but I had spent so much time on those fancy graphs...

I basically just posted it bc I realized that I was getting no rep from answers and that questions were the most efficient way to generate rep

Jonah

what is HNQ?

Challenger5

23:11

Hot network questions

ATaco

Ninja'd

Challenger5

And I don't have the patience to argue with people who say "oh rep doesn't matter". It shouldn't matter

No, we need some sort of featured tab for answers, not just challenges

ATaco

Rep matters, it shouldn't, but it does.

Challenger5

And the biweekly contest isn't enough

We need at least as many featured answers as there are HNQ questions

And we need people from HNQ to be able to see all the featured answers

And there are too many great answers out there for you to be able to reward them with the rep they deserve in the form of bounties

But an upvote isn't enough

Because a vote from HNQ displays the same as a vote from somebody who thinks an answer is truly clever

Or maybe people could only vote if they'd posted a couple positive-voted answers already

Meh, SE would never give us that

ATaco

Why can't we just codegolf for the sake of codegolf?

5

Zizouz212

23:24

You're overthinking this

Challenger5

@HyperNeutrino I'm working on one; the interpreter is in Haskell

Zizouz212

I have an answer for this but it doesn't calculate response body times... @programmer5000 Where are you?

Challenger5

@ATaco Because HNQ votes break the incentives system.

But if we didn't have votes (somehow), then people would clamor for it

brb

ATaco

23:42

Sounds boring.

Codegolf sounds more fun than codegolf politics.

Qwerp-Derp

I have a syntax for classes for my language now - does it look good?

class Seq>T
  Seq(T start, func fn)
    this.start = start
    this.fn = fn

  operator get(int n): T
    T temp = this.start

    for _ in [0->temp]
      temp = this.fn(temp)

    return temp

main(List>String args)
  Seq>int test = new Seq(0, { n: n + 1 })
  print test[5]

ATaco

Is that whitespace dependent?

PhiNotPi

@ATaco Looks like it's even more purist than Python without : to mark the starts of code blocks.

Qwerp-Derp

@ATaco Yep

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Remove duplicate equivalent expressions Suppose we wanted to generate all expressions containing at most 2 of + and −. We might have a list like this: a + b + c b + c + a a + b - c b + c - a a - b + c b - c + a a - b - c b - c - a a + c + b c + a + b a + ...

ATaco

23:48

Understandable, have a good day.

Qwerp-Derp

Does the syntax look readable?

ATaco

It seems fine.

Dennis

@Jonah I have several ideas on how to speed up Jelly (without implementing it in a faster language). A big slow-down for vectorizing dyadic operators is that the depths of the arguments have to be calculated first. With a custom class instead of Python's list, the depth could be stored and wouldn't have to be calculated for each operation.

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