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4:00 PM
irb(main):009:0> 1e100 - 1e50
=> 1.0e+100
Oh yes I can see that one on desktop, just not on the profile
@TuxCopter Floating point issues.
@TuxCopter You'd need 50 significant figures of precision to show up the difference
irb(main):022:0> (BigDecimal("1e100") - BigDecimal("1e50")).to_s
=> "0.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999E100"
The difference being 9.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999e100.
4:02 PM
A: Encode the alphabet cipher

Mama Fun RollDASH, 28 bytes @><""(->@rstr["."@""]+4#0)#0 Example usage: (@><""(->@rstr["."@""]+4#0)#0)"helloworld" Explanation @ ( #. take input through a lambda join "" ( #. join with newlines the following: (map #. result of mapping ...

Huh that's a lot of 9
DASH is not bad for golfing apparently
@MamaFunRoll have an updoot
sure thx
Now I'm getting Failed to upload image; the format is not supported | Close
Ok, I'm confused.
4:12 PM
@TuxCopter.... i can't edit
thanks tho!
/me *is tempted to Trash the four smiley messages*
4:19 PM
@muddyfish Better
@LuisMendo perhaps here is one possible way of telling if a valid state will be reached, through repeated convolution.
(this is just speculation, there might be additional requirements that are much more complex)
@PhiNotPi Here are the three I've found so far, by the way:
Q: Make your language unusable

jimmy23013Try to write some code in your language and make it not satisfying our criteria of being a programming language any more. A language satisfies our criteria (simplified version for this challenge) of being a programming language if: It can read user input representing tuples of positive integer...

Q: Programming Languages Through The Years

Helka HombaIn this challenge, users will take turns completeing three fairly simple coding tasks in programming languages that are allowed to be progressively older. The first answer must use a programming language that was made in the year 2015. Once there is at least one answer from a 2015 language, answ...

Q: Images with all colors

Mark JeronimusSimilar to the images on allrgb.com, Make images where each pixel is a unique color (no color is used twice and no color is missing). Give a program that generates such an image, along with a screenshot or file of the output (upload as PNG). Create the image purely algorithmically. Image must ...

Notice the votes :P
Are there any low-voted/closed ones that meet your guideline?
Trying to find out right now.
I'm also trying to find good examples of ones that do not and are controversial
@LuisMendo Consider the [1 -8 20 -13] example, which needs 46 flips. After matrix multiplication, we have [1 -5 7 0]. Notice that the two ends (1 and 7) are positive. (Leading/trailing zeros are ignored). This potentially indicates that, through repeated convolution, all negative numbers will disappear, which is 1 of the 2 requirements for validity.
4:26 PM
@PhiNotPi There are some examples but a lot of them are things that are just doing an algorithm that should be code golf.
I'm not really counting those.
There's no subjectivity to them, honestly. There should be subjectivity but only in voting not validity
That's the point
I see a long list of new meta questions on the horizon...
@trichoplax :P
Similarly, consider the inverse [1 3 3 1] - [1 -5 7 0] = [0 8 -4 1]. Here, negative numbers correspond to values that are too high to be physically realizable.
In this case, notice that the two ends (8 and 1) are also both positive.
Do we agree that the above three questions are part of this category I've defined, by the way?
Just want to make sure I'm looking for the right thing
@quartata There's also the somewhat less popular:
Q: Animations with all colours

sobe86Last year, there was a very popular challenge to create an image containing every 24-bit RGB colour. My challenge is to create a smooth animation (24 frames/s say), where the colour of every pixel of every frame is unique. I will also allow duplication of colours as long as every colour appears...

4:29 PM
That one is less so because of the vague "animation" part
Here's one I think:
Q: Play a Song for Me

Beta DecayChallenge Given guitar tablature you must output the song represented by the tab. This may be to the speakers of your computer or to an audio file (.wav, .mp3, .midi, .aiff, etc.). There will also be a second input for timing. The tabs may be input via a file or straight to STDIN. The tab will ...

@quartata It defines it as a cube, similar to how all rgb is a square
The subjectivity comes from the actual sound of each note, but it's purely objective in terms of whether the output is OK
@trichoplax Sorry, I misread something.
It's still missing some things in terms of I/O specification
Anyways, notice that while the votes are varying there's no deleted "troll" answers.
Or any potential for them
The only exception is the make your language unusable - that actually isn't a fault from the rules, it was very explicit that rm -rf isn't OK
Notice there though even with bad answers they got nuked very quickly.
Whereas in something like Mona Lisa it probably would have ended up in a 2-day fistfight over whether apples are portraits
That's the difference
Here's an example of the opposite:
Q: What? No error?

JwostyYour task is simple. Write a program that should obviously produce an error on first glance either when compiled or run, but either doesn't or produces some other unrelated error. This is a popularity contest, so be creative.

Lots of bad answers that only got self-deleted because of downvotes.
I think that's a major difference between code trolling and other pop cons. It's easy to write an awful code trolling answer, whereas some of these pop con challenges are difficult to write an answer for, so the effort required avoids poor answers. I don't think that is a good way to judge whether they are on topic though
@trichoplax But that's all that we should care about. The reason why we're upset about popcons is because of the bad answers they attract.
If we're upset about something else let me know
I think the reason there have been so many protracted conversations about pop cons is precisely because nobody can agree on what the discussion is really about
4:36 PM
This is why the original conversation about code trolling came up.
This is the reasoning I'm operating under.
But I agree, I don't think anyone has any idea why objectivity matters.
I'm just guessing that this is why, really.
(It's the only thing that makes sense)
I think there are half a dozen different questions we need to settle, but most pop con meta questions end up with discussion of everything in one place, with much confusion
I'm going to start writing up my answer.
If anyone has any other good questions for me to show let me know.
I don't want to have too many since I have to explain my thought process for each one
@quartata Answer quality and scope are two different matters. If we got a general programming question with a stellar answer, it would still be off topic.
That's very obviously off topic.
We all agree that this currently is a gray area however.
And I think we all kind of crave having fun popcons like this in our scope
Programming Languages Through The Years was awesome
If they don't cause any problems and they're very obviously part of our overall contest format then I really don't see the issue
I think objectivity is mainly useful in making it easy to remove almost all bad answers with defensible reasons and/or without significant backlash.
4:41 PM
@El'endiaStarman And that's exactly what I'm trying to pin down.
Back when Mona Lisa was sandboxed I proposed a solution that outputted an apple
Despite a massive flamewar no one could really say "this is very obviously wrong" for an objective reason
You can't say that with any of these challenges that's the case. If it outputs all the colors, great. If it doesn't, it's wrong.
I feel like arguing that an apple cannot be objectively determined to be different than the Mona Lisa is kinda like saying there's no objective difference between red and orange because you can't reasonably draw the line somewhere in between.
@muddyfish I'm not sure how it all works, but I've raised the inconsistency between desktop and mobile:
Q: Inconsistency in display of animated avatars

trichoplaxIt has been discussed previously that animated avatars are disliked because they cause a distraction from the content. However, currently animated avatars are not treated consistently. On desktop, animated avatars are displayed as a still image, both in posts and on the profile page. On mobile,...

@El'endiaStarman Well, colors can be defined objectively since it's a phyiscal property
In the case of programming we consider orange and red to be very specific wavelengths, thus cutting out the continuous nature of it
I would close a challenge that says output a shade of orange as opposed to output this shade of orange along with a picture
@trichoplax If it's not allowed, I probably shouldn't be trying to do it then
And I'm sure some sort of objective definition of "Mona Lisa" can be devised. Heck, think of it this way: if you do a reverse Google image search on some image and you get "Mona Lisa" as Google's guess, it's probably the Mona Lisa. This won't happen with an apple.
4:50 PM
Here's the humorous response to that:
Jan 12 at 18:28, by quartata
user image
@quartata Best guess for this image: mona lisa leonardo da vinci
nothing to do with apples at all
Here's the serious response: At that point it isn't an objective definition of Mona Lisa, it's an objective definition of what our shit CNNs think it is
@muddyfish It's an actual apple too. They had some other versions that they treated with formaldehyde and auctioned off
@LuisMendo further experimentation seems to show that my above idea is a necessary but not sufficient condition, which makes sense.
Compare this: https://www.google.com/search?tbs=sbi:AMhZZivjXVH_1oMAyJUqihi-Rj2yKGN03CPV9b-CMJDcyQGDCMzObV67VHOyk407uv-eiu5JdiySx5_1OyL8UWwMc-ixzFW0xdT_1HU8h0NiJTKN6n6dFUAho8Uw8XZ3O-W_1HK3IJjwzCGIWp456_1DeFuKbg75YTROFE0CVzgQXVVw1usaLFY_1y71k1xFtZ8TsJYWe77xwdzxGY3nFFSyr-C3kiFTaVojLvIJxeT1wd1ZE4OjCyOHJ6jUnjHuFzVoCgBaavP9COHKQZa0-JirqFNN4FTbCpq8L9qQ61bjopbSausZSGW5DhwFyt40F6ivYrtX4wqyB3YfwCnqnI0zEJGTRVXYsPl5Wf3oR3cCt3_1sd59WzXuGF3MQnFt8dLYU2A87R9XjBmk_1ndLeq197UOb_1Jh0HDDm4QuqypRyELYSCFCMgmyAXT11cn7XogDRbSggaMNGF7C0giwUhIt8G9czy_17J8AUAdWoUigotPfNARGA6sWTbVRKeJQlk8v_1G1m5RVyBhNNZZAtDOu3juPGfIr
1 min ago, by quartata
Here's the serious response: At that point it isn't an objective definition of Mona Lisa, it's an objective definition of what our shit CNNs think it is
Also a human would identify that as a Mona Lisa apple
While a computer would identify it as an apple, Mona Lisa, or neither
That's a weakness right there
Q: Dozens of earthworms came on my terrace and died there

OddDeerWe've had a harsh weather turnaround lately in central Europe. It went from a pretty warm late summer to a pretty cold autumn in nearly one single night. As this happened, earthworms started to come out of the garden on my terrace (I also found some in the garage and even in the basement). And we...

@Dennis totally, why didn't I see it before?
@Dennis hahahahahahaha
Objectivity is hard. Humans are, by definition, subjective. Computers are objective, but stupid.
@muddyfish I'm not entirely sure if it's allowed or not. I can see the argument for not animating avatars on posts, but on the profile I don't see a problem. Hopefully this meta discussion will lead to a decision on that, then we'll know...
@trichoplax "Not sure how Stack Exchange can solve this, but this is obviously a bug, since animated profile pictures are not allowed, as the feature request Can I have an animated profile picture? has been officially declined."
5:04 PM
Ah OK. In that case, it's less a case of "I shouldn't" and more "I'll be wasting my effort since it'll be undone when the bug is fixed"...
Any Java experts around? I have no idea how to compiler JAISBal.
@Dennis What is the error?
Ah you don't know how to compile it
@Dennis ./gradlew
I tried simply running javac on JAISBal.java, but that generates 100 errors.
5:13 PM
@TuxCopter No other way? That wants to download a 50 MiB file, which I can't do.
Then you need to compile everything manually
:/ Why can't I just use the equivalent of gcc *.c, like in a sane language?
Because Java
Oh wait you can use *.java
javac **/*.java still gives 100 errors.
What errors?
5:17 PM
And the folder hierarchy looks like someone tried to turn Folders into a production language.
First one:
encode/JAISBaLCharPage.java:25: error: package com.gmail.socraticphoenix.plasma.file does not exist
import com.gmail.socraticphoenix.plasma.file.PlasmaFileUtil;
ValueError: invalid option string '—-verbose': must start with a character '-'
These are two different dashes
@mınxomaτ oh...
^^ Yep. The first one looks like an em dash (or an en dash?).
5:22 PM
dammit autocorrect
Which is immediately apparent if you use a sane font.
@mınxomaτ I could see it, but it was subtle. I was using menlo.
❯ ./dcomp
usage:  dcomp [options] file [options]

  -k, -—no-delete: don't delete archive after decompression
dcomp: error: the following arguments are required: input_file
The options require use of mixed dashes?!?
@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Well now that is even more weird
It's still two different dashes, but this time reversed.
@trichoplax I typed it in notepad (well TextEdit, but it's maxosx kind).
Maybe I should use vim next time.
5:25 PM
TextEdit is not for code.
@mınxomaτ That was hardcoded
@mınxomaτ I was feelin' "my IDE uses too much memory and takes time to boot up" and I wanted to go "raw" for a moment.
right now I have a proper ide
Is there a way to sort by oldest first in PPCG search results?
search newest, go to the last result page
> Go the the newest questions tab and click on the last page at the bottom.
5:33 PM
Q: Code Golf Christmas Edition: How to print out a Christmas tree of height N

TheSoftwareJediGiven a number N, how can I print out a Christmas tree of height N using the least number of code characters? N is assumed constrained to a minimum value of 3, and a maximum value of 30 (bounds and error checking are not necessary). N is given as the one and only command line argument to your pr...

@Dennis yuo r mathematician. wat iz your subfield?
:33213994 cache problems
shouldiblamecaching.com :P
Problem solved
Once I forked the 2048 repo, the changes I made to the website did not apply. So I had to remove cache and stuff
@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Topology I believe
@Dennis what topology things have you discovered/are working on recently? and why did you learn programming?
@TuxCopter why does SE chat display your network profile as judaism.se
'cuz I have my TuxCopter profile only on judaism se
So my chat account is linked to this site
5:39 PM
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

OliverCrack the Simple Substitution Cipher Review First, let's review the Simple Substitution Cipher. To encode a string in the Simple Substitution Cipher, replace each letter in your string with another letter. A letter may not be used to replace more than one existing letter. For example, if I ...

> BY DÄY: Âlt-Rõck Ñïnjà Côwgïrl at Verîdìãñ Dÿñâmîcs.BY ÑÎGHT: Ï wrïte cõdè âñd rìghts fòr pèñälcõdërs.èxàmplê.örg, ãñ äwêsòmë ñõñ-prôfït thàt wïll tõtâllÿ tàkë ÿòür mòñêÿ ät thât lìnk. Mÿ kîds àrë cûtèr thâñ ÿòûrs.FÔR FÙN: C+ Jôkès, Sëgwãy Ròllër Dêrbÿ, ÑYT Sãt. Crôsswörds (îñ Shârpïè!), Õstrìch Grôômïñg."Îf ÿõû sèè scârÿ thìñgs, lõõk fôr thè hëlpêrs-ÿôü'll ãlwãÿs sèè pêöplè hêlpïñg."-Frèd Rôgërs

¡ ǝןnɹ sɹǝʇʇǝן pǝsɹǝʌǝɹ
@TuxCopter it was on your a51 profile
yep :P
I just hardly messed up with the sample text
@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC I work in a rather narrow field and value my privacy, so I won't be sharing that. (sorry) Computers always were a hobby of mine. I started to learn programming long before I decided to study math.
5:49 PM
Almost done with my answer
> Cowgirl
:O I thought you were penguin not cow
6 mins ago, by TuxCopter
I just hardly messed up with the sample text
And anyway I am no penguin I am penguin copter
@Downgoat Why do you closed the custom operator PR for Cheddar?
Wait Cheddar 1.0 is coming :O
@TuxCopter It uses legacy tokenization syntax
> penguin copter
»  npm install -g cheddar

> cheddar-lang@1.0.0-beta.55 prepublish C:\Users\Elie\cheddar
> make

./node_modules/.bin/babel src/ -d dist/ --minified
'.' n’est pas reconnu en tant que commande interne
ou externe, un programme exécutable ou un fichier de commandes. ('.' is not a program)
Makefile:28: recipe for target 'default' failed
make: *** [default] Error 1
Je te plumerai la tete
5:58 PM
Dire en anglais sil vous plait
@ConorO'Brien Yep
Get Linux
@Downgoat In parentheses ._.
or should I say "fenêtres" :P
5:59 PM
windows > linux
@ConorO'Brien no plz
@Adnan ಠ_ಠ
user image
Leaked photo of @TuxCopter
Penguins should always use Linux
:O how u accesed my photos
6:00 PM
i am hacker gaot remember? :P
Since when did goats become smarter than humans? No offense
@TuxCopter no idea what this means tho
@ConorO'Brien does npm i -g cheddar-lang work for you?
@TuxCopter Plus, you always use the same password, which I won't post in plaintext because that would be really, really irresponsible.
Make can't find the 'program' .
@wizzwizz4 ಠ_ಠ
6:01 PM
@Downgoat checking
@KritixiLithos Some goats are smarter than some humans.
Point taken
(No offense TuxCopter)
Mods have access to passwords... ?
@TuxCopter By the way, have you ever heard of Information Security? You should visit it.
6:02 PM
@Downgoat il functionne bien
@TuxCopter No! No no no!
That would be... They aren't even stored in plain text!
pourqoui est-ce que nous parlons en francais?
@TuxCopter :D :D :D :D :D
Je ne sais pas
6:03 PM
@TuxCopter Should I refresh your profile?
CMC: Outgolf your first ever non-deleted PPCG code-golf answer
@HelkaHomba Sorry, I can't. My first ever PPCG code-golf answer was deleted. :-/
It was rubbish.
brb chaning avatar
@HelkaHomba can't I regularially update even my oldest post if i think new way to golf
My first ever answer was already golfed by over 50 bytes :O
6:04 PM
@Downgoat For your special case, we might be able to say "least active".
@HelkaHomba Sadly, my first answer was optimal :P
A: Palindrome Hello, World

TùxCräftîñgAPL, 41 bytes 'Greetings, Planet!'⍝'!tenalP ,sgniteerG' In APL, the last value is printed and the lamp character (⍝) start a comment.

@TuxCopter you remember the mario maze thing?
6:07 PM
@TuxCopter Done.
Do you remember stealth-pinging?
@wizzwizz4 Thx
@KritixiLithos Wasn't here :/
@KritixiLithos Yes. It was fun, but HORRIBLE!
I never did it though.
@TuxCopter +100 this is beautiful avatar
I didn't know about it until the Great Chat Software Patch.
6:09 PM
@Downgoat :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D::D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:DD:D:DD:D:D
@wizzwizz4 Oh, that's sad
@KritixiLithos Sock?
@Zalgo is @TuxCopter's sock
I'll kick 'em and ban 'em and smash 'em. Zalgo no sock?
6:10 PM
Yes @TuxCopter is my sock
Zalgo isn't a sock!
I'm confused by you.
@Zalgo ಠ_ಠ
See @wizzwizz4. Life's #1 rule: Don't get fooled by Socks.
that's my tf2 username
I am not a Sock
6:12 PM
Yes you are
@ConorO'Brien You're tf2 name is Sock?
@Zalgo goodbye
No you are
@Zalgo come back
@TuxCopter y u do dis ;_;
Now it is a Sock party!
6:13 PM
@HelkaHomba Done.
A: Align lists like coreutils' `ls`

DennisBash, 48 46 bytes cd `mktemp -d` xargs -d\\n tee stty cols $1 ls Guaranteed to work like ls.

Q: What's the most popular question right now?

OliverYour task is to print the titles of the questions with the five highest scores (upvotes minus downvotes) here on CodeGolf.SE, while skipping over any closed, locked, etc. questions. Currently these are: Produce the number 2014 without any numbers in your source code Showcase your language one v...

Sock owners: can I please kick your socks? I've never kicked anything before, and sock parties belong elsewhere.
I forgot you are a diamond guy
But I have been kicked before
@Sock I will kick you now! Mwahahaha!
6:18 PM
@wizzwizz4 Is @wizzwizz2 your sock?
@TuxCopter No. wizzwizz2 is my friend.
Friends are not socks. Friends can be socks under some circumstances, but this is not one of them.
TIL /jk
Does kicking a second time make the kick longer? Let's find out!
6:20 PM
Yes, it does!
6 hours
> Goat: Yay, Im ready to release cheddar v1
> Git: haha, f*ck you
> Goat: ;_; @git y u do dis Q____Q
Yep it does
@Downgoat What happened?
a branch got reset
#git problems
6:20 PM
so now i hvae to somehow rebase feature-class, develop, feature-op, and release-1.0.0 all together
rip in peperonni cheddar
@LuisMendo some additional conditions which must be met: the totals of the vector [1 -5 7 0] = 3 and its "inverse" [1 3 3 1] - [1 -5 7 0] = [0 8 -4 1] = 5 must both be positive
@wizzwizz4 For me, the second ban was 6 hours
Then it's a global chat suspension
6:22 PM
I don't know if I am anywhere near the right track... the goal was to find a shortcut to determine whether the function maps (0,1) -> (0,1), but that might be impossible to do more efficiently than simply looking at the function.
I swear git is the definition of bork
Nope, git is a pejorative slang term
best line in cheddar source code :P
6:25 PM
Q_Q please no kick me again it will raise a mod flag
Kick @Zalgo, kick him!
@Downgoat where is it?
100% LeGit
6:30 PM
"legit" should be a "git" fork that does something special.
Damn, it exists.
That's le git
(le is the in french)
You don't say.
@TuxCopter that was the joke :P
Isn't like "le" makes up 90% of all shitty memes.

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