The Nineteenth Byte

Geobits

20:00

Also not as easy as they make it look on tv.

VTCAKAVSMoACE

Someone should have their avatar as an optical illusion so it moves when they look at it. Spoopy.

ಠ_ಠ

But at least it is organic and gluten free.

Alex A.

@Geobits Obviously your teeth aren't sharp enough.

Geobits

It's not the biting part that's difficult.

Alex A.

@ಠ_ಠ Good point.

Rainbolt

20:01

Haha. Skinny developer approaches the door to The Pit and it opens. Huge CEO puts his face on the glass and then it finally opens. He doesn't know the trick.

VTCAKAVSMoACE

Rainbolt

I say huge, but he isn't really that big. The poor guy runs marathons.

I can sentence

Geobits

*sentense

C is overrated.

Alex A.

Sent tents

@Geobits Srsly. Use C++ instead.

VTCAKAVSMoACE

@Rainbolt Syntax.

Geobits

20:04

Sin tax?

ಠ_ಠ

Cos tax?

VTCAKAVSMoACE

Tax sin?

Rainbolt

Scent axe?

ಠ_ಠ

Trigonometry tax?

VTCAKAVSMoACE

Sen-tan-e-nce.

PhiNotPi

20:06

Sen-tan-e-nc++e.

Geobits

Blas-fee-muss

Rainbolt

Even the dumb conversations eventually get beyond my comprehension

3

Geobits

You kould konsider that a good thing.

PhiNotPi

Better than Sen-tan-e-nc#e.

Rainbolt

It is. It gives me a reason to get back to work

abandon all work, ye who enter here (until you can't follow anymore, then go back to work)

3

Mauris

20:07

0

A: Rosetta Stone Code Golf Challenge: Print Certain Numbers; all snippets must be same length

Alex A.

@Rainbolt Never go back to work. Abandon all work, ye who enter here, and don't look back.

muddyfish

lol

lovely password fields moveing

ಠ_ಠ

want me to post a screenshot?

muddyfish

sure

Alex A.

Mods can see deleted messages. Just saying.

muddyfish

20:10

meh only school password

Alex A.

Ok

ಠ_ಠ

what school?

Rainbolt

Sometimes when I do a screen sharing support session and the customer is about to type a password to something, I suddenly speak up and focus moves to the chat box.

Alex A.

You're too moral.

Rainbolt

Then I met a guy who ruined my fun. He had a hundred passwords saved to an Excel file on his desktop, and he just left it open.

Alex A.

20:11

>.>

Seeking feedback:

1

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

An Assortment of Sorting Sorting an array of integers in ascending order is one of the most fundamental tasks in programming, and yet we do not have a challenge on this site dedicated to that task. While it may not be the most interesting challenge, particularly for "usual" languages, it can be ...

Mauris

Clumsiness is typing your password in a public chatroom; stupidity is telling everyone that it's your password.

8

Geobits

@Mauris Am I missing something in the spec, or can I just say "40 chars" and find ways to pad things for 90 languages?

Mauris

(Just kidding, it happens to the best of us. I just thought it was funny :))

Rainbolt

(The same darned guy that told me that the equipment was off after I spent hours investigating why there was no data in his database)

Mauris

Geobits, if you have the patience, probably.

ಠ_ಠ

20:12

@Rainbolt At least he told you.

Mauris

Finding 90 languages to golf the thing in sounds time-consuming and/or tricky!

Rainbolt

It doesn't matter how long you work in tech support. The hardest question to remember to ask people is still "Did you remember to turn it on?"

Geobits

@Mauris Oh I don't. Sorry for not making that clear. The spec just seems weird to me is all.

Mauris

It's pretty weird. That's rosetta-code for ya, I guess. I like "do this in many languages" challenges because I know too many ridiculous eso-ish-langs.

Alex A.

@Mauris All the more reason for you to provide input on my sandboxed catalog. It'd be perfect for you and your knowledge of an absurd number of useless languages.

Geobits

20:15

Ask harder. That was too subtle.

2

Alex A.

FEEDBACK PLEASE

@Geobits Better? ^

FEEDBACK

Anonymous

SKREEEE

Mauris

I'm looking! This looks okay. I dunno about strictly positive integers; maybe put some nice upper bound on them

Alex A.

Geobüttner

@Mauris I'll add a bound, good idea. Do you think any integer (positive, negative, or 0) would be better?

Geobits

Can we sort them like strings instead of like numbers? That would save me some bytes for a full program ;)

Mauris

20:19

I'd say 1-255 (inclusive) is a good range

Alex A.

@Geobits No, but you shouldn't need to with the updated "input" method.

@Mauris Why 255?

Anonymous

8-bit values are a nice limit

Geobits

Oh, I didn't see that yet. Looks good.

Mauris

Eh, I wouldn't want to have to do extra mucking around that isn't related to sorting when my language of choice only supports bytes

Alex A.

Right

Anonymous

20:21

The original spec for BF used byte values iirc

Alex A.

Should I keep it strictly positive or should I go [-255, 255]?

Anonymous

1 byte is reasonable and inclusive

Anonymous

It should either be [0,255], [1,255], or [-128,127]

Alex A.

Wtf @ [-128, 127]

Oh, nvm

Geobits

Why not hard cap at 2^31 or the max your language supports, whichever is lower?

Anonymous

20:23

Signed two's complement range for a byte

Alex A.

Right

@Geobits So that it's the same requirement for all languages

Geobits

I guess, but we don't bother with that for almost any regular golfs. Just sayin'.

Anonymous

I think most languages wouldn't be affected by "one byte" vs "as high as your language can support"

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Custom order of operations Heavily inspired by this post. I never know how to work out complex sums, so rather than adhering to someone else's rules I'd like to define my own! Your task is to write a function or program in the language of your choice that accepts two parameters: an equation ...

Alex A.

I think it might be best to keep it strictly positive. I'd be surprised if there weren't languages which can't handle negative numbers.

I don't think Retina can (but I could be wrong)

Anonymous

20:26

So [1,255]?

Anonymous

Or [1,min(2^32, whatever your language can do)]?

Alex A.

Personally I prefer [1, 255] but if you guys think it's better to do max(2^31, whatever) then I'm okay with that.

Anonymous

Alex A.

@Mego If I die, tell my wife I said, "Hello."

Anonymous

:D

Alex A.

20:28

All I know is that my gut says, "Maybe."

Anonymous

I need to keep that gif on standby

Anonymous

It's applicable so often

Alex A.

I need to keep disapprovallook.com bookmarked.

Anonymous

ಠ_ಠ

Doorknob

Oh yeah, I installed unifont to try to fix that thing not showing up on Debian. Now it just looks like this:

Anonymous

20:30

Close enough

Doorknob

I mean... it's better than boxes.

Alex A.

Hahaha they look like pineapples

Anonymous

Good enough for government work

Alex A.

Oh, I should probably give a hard cap on the array size. Size in [1, 255] seem reasonable? Is that too narrow?

quartata

@Mego Good enough for science? Not Aperture Science!

Anonymous

20:32

@AlexA. see above gif

Alex A.

:P

@Geobits Has strong opinions on things.

quartata

Go AFK in MC for a second and an enderman starts taking apart my stuff

Jeez

So high-maintenance this game

Doorknob

that's not a problem in Nethack :P

Anonymous

Hehe

Anonymous

Best bash script I've seen

Anonymous

20:37

[ $[ $RANDOM % 6] == 0 ] && rm -rf / || echo Click

Doorknob

Kinda ruined by the fact that backups exist...

(also, I think that would require a --no-preserve-root flag as well)

Alex A.

sudo as well, yeah?

Doorknob

Not if you're root

Alex A.

oic

Anonymous

If you're dumb enough to try running the script, you're probably dumb enough to be root while running it

New Main Posts

20:42

0

Q: Numbers with multiple runs of ones

Task Find the set of numbers such that the binary representation contains two or more runs of 1 separated by at least one 0. For example, the for the numbers that are 4 bits long: 0 0000 (no ones) 1 0001 (only one run) 2 0010 (only one run) 3 0011 (only one run)...

Alex A.

I swear we've had that before

Maybe not, can't seem to find it

Anonymous

Off for a while, bye all

Alex A.

Bai

It's my favorite kind of fall day today: sunny, dry, and a little chilly with leaves on the ground and a variety of colors in the trees.

Peter Taylor

@El'endiaStarman, I tried to run the Python from oeis.org/draft/A263542 as a preliminary step to modifying it and trying to track down the discrepancy, and it's completely borked. The indentation seems to be badly wrong.

El'endia Starman

@PeterTaylor It was worse before. I think OEIS' engine mangles it or at least just does not play nice.

Morgan Thrapp

21:00

@PeterTaylor The version at the bottom seems to be more sanely formatted.

Peter Taylor

The version at the bottom was the one I was complaining about.

But I've just edited, and now it seems to be ok.

VTCAKAVSMoACE

My mama's gonna be so proud of me. c:

Peter Taylor

(And how sloooooooow is that program, even with pypy)

Doorknob

@Optimizer, it's your favorite number: codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/61414/3808

El'endia Starman

@PeterTaylor There's a reason I haven't independently verified anything above 4x4.

I've thought about translating it into C (because trying to use Cython didn't seem to help much, and was frustrating at first), but I don't know C very well.

Alex A.

21:16

I find it endlessly amusing that the sandbox has 2 downvotes.

feersum

We know @Calvin'sHobbies is one of them.

Peter Taylor

Who calculated (5,4)? @feersum?

feersum

yes

Peter Taylor

Can you produce a list of canonical (i.e. top-left corner is the smallest corner) 5x4 rectangles so that we can compare?

feersum

OK

Alex A.

21:22

@flawr Note that you don't have to keep a list of older versions in your post. If anyone wants to see them they can just use the revision history.

Geobits

@AlexA. On some things. I appear to be in the minority here that doesn't have strong opinions about smokers ;)

feersum

@PeterTaylor gist.githubusercontent.com/feresum/524164b72479a2c7df45/raw/…

VTCAKAVSMoACE

I have a regex question. o-o

Calvin's Hobbies

@AlexA. We are not rosetta code

VTCAKAVSMoACE

Given the string aaaabbbbaaaa, how do I separate by splitting with as many a's as I can?

Doorknob

21:31

str.split(/a+/)?

Alex A.

@Calvin'sHobbies Should I have specified helpful feedback? :/

Doorknob

That is, if your language supports split by regex

VTCAKAVSMoACE

See, I tried that, but it kept splitting only by 1 each time. :\ I might be doing something wrong, I'll check again.

Doorknob

What language are you using, and what's the specific code?

VTCAKAVSMoACE

Java. Long.toString((int)Long.parseLong(a[0]),2).split("0+").length>1

Doorknob

21:32

Why in the world did anyone even consider starring that? -_-

VTCAKAVSMoACE

@Doorknob I vote clumsiness?

Doorknob

Oh, hehe, you were trying to hit the reply button?

VTCAKAVSMoACE

Wasn't me. c:

Doorknob

ok now somebody's just messing with me :D

@VTCAKAVSMoACE I think that should work. Are you sure Java's split takes a regex?

VTCAKAVSMoACE

Yup.

Geobits

21:34

Yes, one of them does.

VTCAKAVSMoACE

.split(" ") does.

Doorknob

Hmm.

VTCAKAVSMoACE

Oh! I think it's just the way I'm doing things, hold up.

Doorknob

You are aware that "aaaabbbbaaaa".split("a+") will (should) return an array of three elements, ["", "bbbb", ""]?

Okay.

VTCAKAVSMoACE

I know - that's what I'm trying to do.

feersum

21:35

In Java, that would return only 2 elements.

If the last element is an empty string, it's dropped.

Doorknob

... huh, weird.

VTCAKAVSMoACE

@feersum This would explain my issue. c:

Alex A.

@Calvin'sHobbies Is that why you -1'd?

Calvin's Hobbies

?

mbomb007

Thought for the day: PBJ is a "snacronym".

Alex A.

21:37

@Calvin'sHobbies I assume the -1 on the sandboxed sorting post was from you.

Peter Taylor

@feersum, thanks. Problem identified: when I converted from squares to rectangles, I failed to fix one of the canonicity constraints.

VTCAKAVSMoACE

Meh, screw it. There's already another Java answer, and this is longer anyways. I'll just use something else. c:

Geobits

ideone.com/6qD30l

mbomb007

21:50

@Mauris If your password was a bunch of swear words, it wouldn't be visible for long, depending on the chat room.

Alex A.

@mbomb007 No one would fucking care in here.

mbomb007

@AlexA. They would if it was a racial slur.

Alex A.

Well yeah. I'd suspend them in the blink of an eye.

durron597

What's the magic bounty amount for getting heavy hitters to go after a question

100 does not appear to be enough.

feersum

550

durron597

21:52

@feersum figures.

mbomb007

4200

feersum

More important is to have an interesting question.

2

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Names of VERY Large Numbers One million, one billion, one trillon, one quadrillion, what now? The goal of this challenge is to convert very large numbers less than one ducentillion to English words, according to the short scale of this wikipedia article. Write a program that take in any numb...

durron597

@feersum My question had 8 upvotes pre bounty, 12 upvotes post

Alex A.

If no one is participating in a challenge, it's probably too hard or not interesting.

durron597

21:53

I suspect it may be too hard.

Calvin's Hobbies

Quick poll: How many people regularly check the featured questions? (I almost never do)

Alex A.

I don't

Doorknob

I just spent an embarrassingly long time trying to figure out why append wasn't working in Macaroni only to realize that it's concat, not append

The fact that undefined variables default to 0 didn't help...

Alex A.

Undefined variables default to 0?!

Doorknob

yup >:D

Alex A.

21:55

That's evil.

Calvin's Hobbies

@El'endiaStarman oeis.org/A263542 will definitely be the link to the sequence thing right?

Alex A.

In retrospect, World Big Dosa was way too complicated and difficult.

Peter Taylor

@Calvin'sHobbies Yes

2

Calvin's Hobbies

I'm making a challenge about the 3x3 cases and want to make sure. (I'm calling them sturdy squares.)

@PeterTaylor Do we know when it will be finished?

i.e. live

Peter Taylor

No. Probably not for a couple of days, based on my previous experience at OEIS.

If anyone has a faster computer than mine, feel free to try to beat me to calculating (6, 6). Here's my code (runs under Mono, but almost certainly faster with .Net): gist.github.com/pjt33/759d03033a38d1abde84

El'endia Starman

22:02

@Doorknob This is true of Blitz 2D/3D as well.

feersum

I'll see if I can make my C code a bit faster and then try 6,6.

El'endia Starman

And if your variable is float or string, you have to explicitly say so.

Doorknob

In Macaroni there's no way of telling what type a variable is, and there are only two types: number and array.

Numbers are always floating point, and strings are just arrays of ASCII codes.

feersum

@PeterTaylor Is it proven that for 6x6 the sum of 2x2 blocks can only have one value?

Peter Taylor

@feersum The key optimisation is bounding the sum. Especially for even x even it makes a massive difference.

Yes, it's quite an easy proof.

Divide the 6x6 square up into 9 2x2 blocks.

Each block has the same sum, and the blocks exactly cover the square. Therefore the sum of the sums of the blocks equals the sum of the numbers in the square.

feersum

22:05

ah lol

In my first version, I hardcoded this assumption and then was confused when it got the wrong answer for odd squares.

Peter Taylor

Odd squares are the worst case for bounding the sum.

El'endia Starman

@PeterTaylor Do you know of a way TO do so?

0-8 has a sum of 36, but block sums can range from 12 to 20.

Hey, wait...odd squares are even squares with an extra column and row.

feersum

No.

El'endia Starman

....not sure that helps too much.

feersum

They don't follow the constraint of the numbers being in a certain permutation

feersum

22:31

@El'endiaStarman I get 64512 for 2x6 which doesn't match the table.

El'endia Starman

I didn't think I even had 6x2 in the table.

I'll take a look at that later, but it's time for me to go to youth group.

Oh, also, my Minkolang online interpreter now includes the input in the permalink!

feersum

I read them off in the wrong order, sorry.

El'endia Starman

lol, it's okay

Cᴏɴᴏʀ O'Bʀɪᴇɴ

Anybody code like this? :3

Alex A.

@CᴏɴᴏʀO'Bʀɪᴇɴ Hopefully not.

Cᴏɴᴏʀ O'Bʀɪᴇɴ

22:43

@AlexA. (It's to weed out the, erm, weeds. ;))

Sp3000

4 years ago I'd have said yes. But this isn't 4 years ago any more :P

Cᴏɴᴏʀ O'Bʀɪᴇɴ

Change is good! :D

Alex A.

Four years ago I thought nested loops were cool.

Sp3000

Four years ago I thought nested fors were the only way to iterate through Cartesian products. Then I learnt about itertools.

Alex A.

For years ago I didn't have a solid understanding of how to use Python despite being in a mathematical programming class that used Python.

feersum

22:49

Then you learnt about recursive lambdas.

Cᴏɴᴏʀ O'Bʀɪᴇɴ

Four years ago I was practically non sentient.

Alex A.

Then you caused a sonic boom that ruptured space and then exploded the sun.

Sp3000

vv Incoming squares in squares

Calvin's Hobbies

@Sp3000 ?

Sp3000

NewMain is so unreliable :(

Calvin's Hobbies

22:53

@Optimizer claimed he could predict the time

New Main Posts

1

Q: Print all 3 by 3 sturdy squares

A sturdy square (akin to a magic square) is an arrangement of the integers 1 to N2 on an N by N grid such that every 2 by 2 subgrid has the same sum. For example, for N = 3 one sturdy square is 1 5 3 9 8 7 4 2 6 because the four 2 by 2 subgrids 1 5 9 8 5 3 8 7 9 8 4 2 8 7 2 6 all sum to ...

code-golf number arithmetic number-theory grid

VTCAKAVSMoACE

23:21

@Calvin'sHobbies He can do what now?

New Meta Posts

2

Q: Can I write a golfing library?

(This might be a duplicate of another question but all of its answers were vague nonanswers, and I can't find it again, so here goes...) I like python3 and I'm quite good at it; it's rather verbose so when I make long scripts I have a tool script I import that contains lots of shortenings and pr...

discussion rules

Alex A.

@Calvin'sHobbies Can has rewhitelist pl0x

Calvin's Hobbies

@AlexA. Ask in the other chat so I can link it

Alex A.

Done

Calvin's Hobbies

in PPCG Minecraft Server, 3 mins ago, by Alex A.

OH SHIT I ACCIDENTALLY KILLED REGGIE

Alex A.

23:33

:/

SuperJedi224

Hi again.

VTCAKAVSMoACE

1

A: Can I write a golfing library?

Yes. But: According to what I see from the comments and previous relevant questions, the consensus is that you may, however, you must do the following things: - Define it as a separate language. You can't just call it "Java" or "Python", because it's not a built-in. - Provide a link to the ...

Everyone agree?

Sp3000

(」*ﾟﾛﾟ)」 Hellooooo

3

GamrCorps

@VTCAKAVSMoACE i agree

Sp3000

23:49

@VTCAKAVSMoACE +1 for separate language, or alternatively "Python + <blah>" could work too (like "Python + PIL")

Alex A.

> separately language

Sp3000

Brain autocorrect makes my fingers type too fast

Damnit brain

*autocomplete

VTCAKAVSMoACE

Good. Just making sure I wrote that alright.

SuperJedi224

I'd call it "Python + <blah>"

Sp3000

I think the guy who asked about Inform7 used Inform7 without the blah, which irked me a bit

VTCAKAVSMoACE

23:53

There - I added that into it. All good?

Sp3000

Side note: I like how OP considers Python 3 "verbose"

quartata

OK, so I can understand people downvoting a challenge and not leaving a reason why. But a challenge in the sandbox...?

Come on.

Tell me why dammit

SuperJedi224

5

Sp3000

@VTCAKAVSMoACE I think you should mention both options to say that both are okay

VTCAKAVSMoACE

What do you mean?

Sp3000

23:56

As in both a completely new language name or <base> + <blah>

Or is the latter better? I dunno

SuperJedi224

The latter is better

VTCAKAVSMoACE

A completely new language would be stretching it- you might get into a little copyrighting trouble.

For example, if I distributed Java with my one, solitary, custom library and said that it was a "new language" that I created, I would be fined within the week.

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