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12:00 PM
@PyGamer0 ?
 
@Fmbalbuena i made the library
 
@PyGamer0 HOW?
 
wdym how?
 
ok, how do you create the library?
 
itz ez, i made it in one day
@Fmbalbuena i used poetry to create the base and manage packages
it also handles the publishing for you
 
12:04 PM
bruh i was organising my files and found godly python notes lol
 
@lyxal Explicit is better than implicit, by Python so you don't need inplicit print.
 
oof
 
also, If the implementation is hard to explain, it's a bad idea, you must make fewer commands possible.
 
12:15 PM
python might as well borrow rust's mut
@Fmbalbuena but golflangs break all rules lol
 
but
Readability counts, Vyxal don't break rule
Simple is better than complex, @lyxal I said, remove commands
 
This is the zen of Python, not all languages :P
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing sorry
 
zen of all languages: be turing complete
 
@PyGamer0 Nah, there are some very interesting non-TC languages
 
12:29 PM
zen of all languages: do whatever you want
 
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

FmbalbuenaDouble the even indices and remove the odd indices Your task is simple, just double the even indices and remove the odd indices Example the input is Hello, World! and we get indices H e l l o , _ W o r l d ! 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 and remove the even indices Hlo ol! Double! HHlloo oo...

 
Any feedback?
 
@SandboxPosts its like double every other
 
> double the even indices and remove the odd indices
remove the even indices
???
 
@Adám done
 
12:36 PM
@Fmbalbuena Can you explain abcdef => bbddff?
 
@SandboxPosts This feels like a dupe
 
Me: gives APL the dfn `{'haha syntax error' )}`
APL: cool cool, lemme just repeat that to you all good no complains
Me: calls that dfn
APL: now just you wait a second buckaroo that has a syntax error
2
ah right, no markdown in multiline
 
@lyxal You're complaining that APL doesn't protest the "obvious" syntax error at define time?
 
lazy evaluation of syntax errors? That's some zsh-level bullshit right there
 
@Adám pretty much
 
12:38 PM
@lyxal OK, but how about {'returns this' ⋄ )}
 
that's some high level black magic frickery right there
 
@Adám 'abcdef' => '1a2b3c4d5e6f' and remove the even indices 1a3c5e and double aaccee
 
> remove the odd indices
 
even indices?
 
so i guess i wait till tmr to see how it goes?
 
12:40 PM
@Fmbalbuena Can you explain a bit more what you mean by "*1-Indexed"
 
@Adám did i fix the problem accordingly?
 
@Adám I think they meant the first element is at index 1, so the indices start at odd
 
@lyxal In fact, sometimes deliberate syntax errors are insert into code for certain effects.
@pxeger But in Hello the e is odd, so that sounds like 0-based indexing.
 
@SandboxPosts This is actually quite a good challenge, if you explain it properly
The test cases are now consistent with the example explanation, but not with the "remove odd, double even" description. You could fix this by either changing this to "remove even, double odd", or switching to 0-indexing — pxeger 1 min ago
I was taking the examples as the source of truth and assuming the description was wrong, and you were doing vice versa
 
pxeger so im assuming i js wait till tmr and see how it goes?
for the mat pritning
 
12:43 PM
Wait at least 2 or 3 days
But yeah, see if you've got any feedback by tomorrow
It won't be instant
 
k
i gtg sleep lol so ye
 
@pxeger 1 day.
@lyxal Hey, why you choose ` in Vyxal?
 
@Fmbalbuena because mainstream languages use " and ' (except Jelly because, well, it's jelly).
 
hey guys i've been thinking about a tricky challenge
 
@lyxal and frick being mainstream amiright?
 
12:45 PM
which involves 2 dimensional coords of a square/rectangle
to check whether they intersect or not
issit a good challenge?
 
@lyxal I'm not sure if you're using the right quotes.
 
it is what it is
 
That's probably a duplicate
 
lol
?
 
I'm pretty sure we already have a challenge to check if two rectangles intersect
 
12:46 PM
wat dup pxeger
oh
 
@lyxal Why using the right quotes?
 
@Fmbalbuena in a sea of languages using " and ' for strings, I wanted to stand out using `
 
@pxeger I'd close DialFrost's idea as a dupe of this
 
...
great now time to think of smh else
 
12:48 PM
@lyxal I'm not sure why you're using ` in Vyxal.
 
@DialFrost it's better to know that an idea is a dupe before putting in the effort of writing and posting it
 
tru caird
 
@DialFrost you can reply to messages in chat, using the little arrow icon on the right of the message when you hover over it
or if you're on the mobile version of chat, tap the message and tap the arrow icon in the top bar that pops up
 
1:22 PM
oh okey thx
btw i use comp
 
btw i use arch
@pxeger do you use arch linux?
 
btw yes
 
does it break often?
 
yay adam said my challenge is ok
but ill wait till tmr
bai guys
 
take all the time you need to post
bye
 
1:25 PM
o/
 
@PyGamer0 I break it regularly, but it never breaks by itself
as in, it only ever breaks when I do something stupid
 
it doesnt break when you update it? (its rolling release soo)
do you even update it often?
> arch linux is unstable
 
Does oeis have an advanced search? I only have two terms of a sequence but I know that it's monotonic and I have a decent lower bound on the third term.
 
@WheatWizard maybe oeis.org/hints.html would help?
 
No it doesn't have anything to let me specify monotonicity or lower bound.
 
1:39 PM
i see. Probably downloading the sequence dump and running a script on that is the best idea then
 
so can i take an existing challenge and post it as fastest code?
 
You can. It's usually pretty boring though.
 
11
Q: Find the number of paths in a n×n grid

PyGamer0Information Given a non-negative odd integer (let's call it \$n\$), find the number of all possible paths which covers all squares and get from the start to end on a grid. The grid is of size \$n\$×\$n\$. The start of the path is the top left corner and the end is the bottom right corner. You ha...

^ i am thinking of that challenge
 
Have you checked if there are existing algorithms for the problem?
 
fastest-code usually works best when there are known fast algorithms
ninja'd
 
1:43 PM
I find that restricted complexity + code golf challenges are usually better than fastest code.
I'd say this is probably the case for that challenge.
 
high throughput fizz buzz is an interesting recent example of a successful fastest-code
 
Recent?
I wouldn't try to replicate the high throughput fizz buzz though anyway. It's an interesting concept but I don't think it can easily be copied.
 
@WheatWizard comes up in the second page of newest fastest-code, so i guess it's recent for that tag
and the most successful
 
I wouldn't put votes as the measure of sucess ...
 
I wonder if "fastest fizz-buzz verifier" would be an interesting challenge
 
1:49 PM
@WheatWizard no
 
or would it be too easy to copy ais253's answer and (figuratively) stick an equals sign on the end
 
it has 25 answers, the greatest since that is 4 which is a ripoff of the same thing with primes
 
its oeis sequence only has 9 terms
 
@pxeger Most of ais' answer has to do with output not actual processing. The bottleneck is in outputting fast enough which is what makes it an interesting challenge in the first place.
@PyGamer0 It's not labeled as "hard" though so it might just be for lack of attention.
I would at the minimum try to make a fast solver yourself and see what you can come up with.
 
@PyGamer0 looks like it will suffer the fate of the peter kagey question
 
1:51 PM
In thinking about the problem for the past 20 seconds I haven't thought of an obvious algorithm, so it definitely must be hard
6
 
If you can't meaningfully beat brute force I don't think it's a good idea for a challenge.
 
Any feedback if this question is a dupe of this?
 
But I would guess there are probably some improvements that can be made.
 
@pxeger "if it ain't on GitHub it don't exist"
 
@Razetime link!
@WheatWizard ok
 
1:56 PM
@PyGamer0 i meant "any" instead of "the"
 
@mathcat I don't think it's a dupe of that one, but it might be a dupe of some similar mountain drawing challenges, because it's basically just recursive array depth + draw mountains
actually, do we have such a recursive array depth question?
like [[],[[[],[[],[]]]]] -> 0 2 3 3
 
@mathcat it's a dupe, just remove the commas and spaces, replace [] with ()
 
are the answers on that question easily changeable to print upside-down?
 
@Razetime and replace () with /\ in the output
 
@pxeger can you give me the first few digits of the sequence? I'm going to plug it into a text generation algorithm
 
1:59 PM
 
@mathcat many of them generate array, which can be reversed at the end.
 
oh ok
 
you should try porting an answer in a familiar language
 
@user I have a question
 
@Razetime ?
 
2:00 PM
I have a question
 
@mathcat what do you generally program in
 
I did one in python
the link is too long
 
everything is the same up to the 8th which is now:
8: 27478778338807945303765092195103685118924886779262609451216568044257744131160453637679826585917561358582326590858782759152760471367644967574513774570781406144757957080966876294880394778268079443555542267853636683927873328953876142833337948676799353533015559487623754906192879284547455518782660991536649828764598288518496435862348366318862445358905241538269728863701669627232908668639082564982896991825953597650139496849015818347946015901176783125827163626957512180935952828
 
then try seeing the python solutions and checking if they are trivially modifiable
 
oh ok
 
2:02 PM
CMQ What is the difference between and ?
 
forming your own opinion is very useful
 
thanks
 
@Adám matrix is 2d list and grid is 2d list
 
@Adám IMO should be used only for questions about matrices as in linear algrebra, and the rest should be changed to
 
2:04 PM
@pxeger So for a hypothetical question that asks to transpose the input, if the input is 2D array of numbers, it is but if the input is 2D array of characters, it is ?
@Fmbalbuena I'm sorry, I don't quite get the distinction you're making.
 
@Adám hmm you've made me change my mind
maybe grid should be for more geometrical challenges
and matrix for more general 2D arrays
 
I don't see how you'd distinguish.
 
i think what pxeger means is should only be used along with
and then the rest should be
 
that's not exactly what I meant, but it's a better distinction
 
define "math"
 
2:07 PM
hmm
 
@Adám apl
 
@PyGamer0 Can you add reverse integer/float (33.3 gives 3.33) in Flax?
 
math: misspelling of maths
 
@Fmbalbuena wdym
@pxeger oh ok then APLs
 
@PyGamer0 add "Reverse" command to Flax for reverse integer and float (123.45 gives 54.321)
 
2:09 PM
CMQ: Anyone have some good things to plug into the text-generation algorithm?
 
@Fmbalbuena why not get the digits and reverse
how useful is that?
@GingerIndustries there is a room for such things
 
@PyGamer0 there is?
tell me more
 
@PyGamer0 for checking if the number is palindrome. also, checking if the float is palindrome.
 

 The Edge of Propinquity

This may or may not be a room for AI-generated text, images, a...
 
^
 
2:10 PM
@pxeger ??????????????????
 
@Fmbalbuena what
i dont see that as remotely useful
which golflangs have that command
 
i know osabie has it
 
is it useful?
 
i remember seeing it once or twice
dunno its total use. better to search kevin cruijssen answers for that
 
@Razetime osabie? 0sab1e? 05ab1e? 05AB1E? 054313?
 
2:13 PM
yeah ok i am not going to add that
 
palindrome checker for strings seems like a reasonable idea
 
@PyGamer0 why?
 
and having that work for numbers as well isn't unreasonable either
 
@PyGamer0 why not reverse strings or integers?
 
@Fmbalbuena why do i want a palindrome checker for numbers
@Fmbalbuena there is no strings in flax, there is a reverse atom
 
2:14 PM
What is reverse atom?
 
reverse atom (command, flax is just an extension / rewrite of jelly breaking backwards compatibility)
@Fmbalbuena it reverses lists
 
@PyGamer0 I will make a golflang, this is the time to ping @taRadvylfsriksushilani
 
@Fmbalbuena which paradigm are you thinking?
 
@PyGamer0 tacit
 
i know you will implement it in python
 
2:19 PM
@PyGamer0 how?
 
@Fmbalbuena oh you gotta decide which tacit system to use
@Fmbalbuena you said so
 
@PyGamer0 what is tacit system?
 
@Fmbalbuena examples: J, APL, Jelly
the way you combine builtins on the inputs
 
why are all modern tacit languages array languages?
 
@PyGamer0 what is J? (jk, AI content)
 
2:21 PM
@pxeger You mean Jelly?
 
Arguably, Husk is also a tacit lang
 
@Fmbalbuena J K Rowling
 
@Adám APL, J, K are all basically array based aren't they?
@cairdcoinheringaahing well I suppose you could argue that stack-based languages are tacit as well
 
@pxeger Yes, but they are not "tacit languages". They support tacit programming.
 
JK Rowling is an array language??!?
 
2:22 PM
But so does Haskell.
 
But I mean why aren't there any languages which support the same manner of tacit programming as APL, other than the array languages
 
@PyGamer0 That ... explains everything
 
@pxeger i think APL tacit is different from J and K tacit
 
code_page = "|¬°!1\"2#3$4%5&6/7(8)9=0?'\\¿¡\tq@wertyuiopasdfghjklñzxcvbnmQWERTYUIOPASDFGHJKLÑZXCVBNM¨´+*~{}^`[],.-_:;<>éýúíóáÉÝÚÍÓÁèùìòàÈÙÌÒÀêûî"
code_page += "ôâÊÛÎÔÂ\nëÿüöïäËÜÖÏÄᐍᐎᐓᐗᎾᚁᚂᚃᚄᚅᚆᚇᚈᚉᚊᚋᚌᚍᚎᚏᏔᏕᏖᏗᏘᏙᏚᏛᏜᏝᏞᏟᏠᏡᏢᏣᏤᏥᏦᏧᏨᏩᏪᏫᏬᏭᏮᏯᏰᏱᏲᏳᏴᏵᏸᏹᏺᏻᏼᏽᎳᎴᎵᎶᎷᎸᎹᎺᎻᎼᎽᎿᏀᏁᏂᏃᏄᏅᏆᏇᏈᏉᏊᏋᏌᏍᏎᏏᏐᏑᏒᏓ×ĀāĂ㥹ĆćĈĉĊċČčĎaĐ"
i=""
for w in code_page:
    i += w if w not in i else print(end="")
print(len(i))
with open(__import__("sys").argv[1], 'rb') as file:
    code = file.read()
    code = "".join(code_page[i] for i in code)
    print(code)
 
@pxeger Arrays + numbers have always seemed like they work best with the tacit model
 
2:23 PM
@PyGamer0 But they're still fairly similar when compared to the type of tacit programming that Haskell uses, for example
 
I'd love to make a pun here but I can't think of one so instead enjoy this list of other names for Wheat Wizard
Magister of Maize
Overlord of Oatmeal
Ruler of Rice
Controller of Corn
 
@mathcat Harry Potter loves arrays
 
@pxeger K is quite far, and APL's one was derived from J.
 
For example, regex or string langs don't work well with the 1 and 2 argument basis of tacit langs
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing or 3 :p
 
2:25 PM
@GingerIndustries Banisher of Beans
 
@GingerIndustries WW used to go by Einkorn Enchanter :P
 
@mathcat Sultan of Soy
 
Is there already a challenge to turn a list into a representation like this: [[][[][]]
 
was there one between the current cereal-based series and "Ad Hoc Garf Hunter"?
I feel like there was
 
CMC: implement Jelly
 
2:27 PM
@pxeger It requires infix operators.
 
I saw it as more crop based than cereal based
 
@user cereal as in the food family, not cereal as in breakfast cereal
 
Ah
Til that is a thing
 
i did it a while back, not fun
 
@pxeger 🤬
 
2:28 PM
lol
 
@PyGamer0 man it's a good thing i can recognize rickroll links
 
dang, didn't know they were on the 33439th version of python
 
@PyGamer0 a round of applause to Pygamer0
well done
 
todo: make a browser plugin that highlights all links to rickroll videos
 
Redwolf has done that iirc
 
2:29 PM
haha @emanresuA's website go brrr
 
hehe time to create at0.pxeger.com which links to a rickroll
 
But redirects and ifeames are hard to detect
 
@user well now i'mma do it better
 
@user ifeames lol
 
2:30 PM
Never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down,
Never gonna run around and desert you.
Never gonna make you cry, never gonna say goodbye.
Never gonna tell a lie and hurt you.
 
wait is it "i'mma" or "im'ma"
 
imma
 
@GingerIndustries imm'a
 
apostrophes are for hard working people
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing i'mm'a'm'y'st'd'ff've
 
2:31 PM
I’m going to -> I’m gonna -> I’mma
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing Do you make a golflang?
 
@GingerIndustries wut
 
@GingerIndustries relevant xkcd
 
nope
 
Bruh
 
2:32 PM
@Fmbalbuena Yeah, I've made a few
 
@PyGamer0 according to my analysis that's a rickroll
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing which?
 
@GingerIndustries no lol
 
@PyGamer0 you lied
 
idea: crowdsource a giant database of rickroll links that the plugin can use
 
2:32 PM
@Fmbalbuena ?
 
None of them were great tho, I can never be bothered to fully put in the effort to complete them
 
lies can be forgiven
only if it's a rickroll
 
@GingerIndustries oh boi time to spam random links into that
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing welcome to the club
 
@PyGamer0 Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.
 
2:33 PM
@cairdcoinheringaahing which golflangs?
 
@GingerIndustries If you also want to detect redirects, you would have to ask your server to visit each and every link you see and check that for rickrolls. That sounds very hard
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing not even Add++?
 
@GingerIndustries relevant xkcd
 
@user i would essentially be making a webcrawler
 
2:34 PM
Add++ isnt much of a golfing lang
 
What if a site is first a rickroll but them becomes notmal?
 
@PyGamer0 that does not actually qualify as a rickroll
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing oh true
 
@user you cannot return from the dark side
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing I mean golfing languages, every command must be less than 3 bytes
 
2:34 PM
@user wait shit I know how I'd do it
 
@GingerIndustries oh.
 
@GingerIndustries rick astlry is hardly the dark side
 
@Fmbalbuena Most of my languages use single byte commands, but they aren't really golfing langs
 
@PyGamer0 anyone know what the countdown in the header of xkcd is for?
 
@GingerIndustries caching?
 
2:35 PM
@user when your browser accesses a page the extension checks if the page is a rickroll and if it is it warns you! like ublock does!
 
CMC: implement my language
 
@pxeger 3pm UTC Jan 31st
 
presenting: RickBlock Origin
 
@pxeger time until the world ends
@Fmbalbuena No.
 
I'd basically be making an adblocker for rickrolls
 
2:36 PM
@PyGamer0 no until pi gets replaced by tau
 
@GingerIndustries wouldn’t it be laggy if every page you visited had to firat be visited by your bot?
 
then the world will end
 
@mathcat noooooo
 
And what if tour bot is ever down?
 
NO.
 
@user no, it's a browser plugin, like an adblocker! it checks the page you're going to before your browser finishes the request and it warns you if it's a rickroll!
 
> Randall will stop making xkcd (Goodbye in the image).
Hopefully not.
Agreed, to be avoided
 
Oh so you do have to go there yourself, no server to watn you before you even click the link
 
19th bakery time
 
woooo
 
woooo
 
@user yes, exactly
woooo
 
Wooden
 
2oo?
 
2:39 PM
hello person
 
i've got a flag from there and i immediately checked it
fun.
 
the message is gone already
 
@pxeger the one that was moved to bakery?
 
we do not tolerate spam here at Pode Polf Cack Gxchange
 
yes
@PyGamer0 it's been deleted from there
 
2:41 PM
Also rickrolls will be punished by account nuking :P
2
We're a civilised room :P
2
 
rickrolls are funny when they're very subtle
 
@KamilaSzewczyk valid
now I have to figure out how to make RickBlock Origin
 
I i'll make a rickroll website
 
@GingerIndustries i know how
 
to fight against your exstension
 
2:43 PM
I'll update the chatiquette to ban rickrolls :P
6
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing no pls
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing gottverdammt
that one really got me
 
@mathcat good luck :]
@cairdcoinheringaahing no
 
Right, time to nuke my account :P
 
no
 
2:44 PM
yallve done it this time
 
@GingerIndustries wait first homework
 
(i suggest you click the link btw, it'll explain what I mean)
 
step 1: find your axe
step 2: find your router / modem
step 3: chop your router / modem
step 4: no more rickrolls!!
@cairdcoinheringaahing cgcc.surge.sh lol
 
@PyGamer0 be sure to chop the correct cable
 
@GingerIndustries you didnt get since i am on android so when it switched apps i closed youtube MUHAHAHA
 
2:47 PM
@PyGamer0 and this is why android is the best OS
 
@Adám does this mean APL's grammar is not only context-sensitive, but can actually be undecidable?
actually, could that be the case even without that "feature"?
 
I think so.
 
okay so i asked GPT-2 how to rickroll (I swear this isn't a rickroll itself)
 
try how to stop rickrolls
 
DND: Rickroll edition
 

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