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11:03 AM
with that formula I can quickly do it lol
so please post it so that I can answer xdddd
@Sherlock9
 
@Sherlock9 I made a few small changes (mostly formatting), but feel free to roll back anything you don't like
looks good to me
are built-in differentiation functions allowed?
 
\o/
 
Looks good, Martin. Do you it's good enough to post now? Kenny seems really excited about it :D
 
4 mins ago, by Martin Büttner
are built-in differentiation functions allowed?
 
I essentially just derived an algorithm
@MartinBüttner This function has nothing to do with differentiation
 
11:13 AM
I'm pretty sure it can be reduced to standard differentiation via a suitable transformation
 
Well, I'm not sure what that transformation would look like
 
This has to do with number theory?
 
I'm going to implicitly allow built-ins for now and work it out later if a problem arises, Martin
 
this seems to work for inputs greater than 1:
D[1 ## & @@ (g[#][xx]^#2 & @@@ FactorInteger@n), xx] /. _'[_] -> 1 /. g[x_][_] :> x
just transform each prime p in the factorisation to a symbolic function g_p, then do standard differentiation and replace all derivatives with 1 and all undifferentiated g_p's with p
 
just use my algorithm lol
 
11:19 AM
@MartinBüttner I think that's ingenious. I'll allow it
 
a(p1....pn) = p1...pn(1/p1 + 1/p2 + ... + 1/pn)
@MartinBüttner Do you speak J?
 
I edited the Sandbox post to allow built-ins for symbolic math and differentiation
 
kk, looks good then
 
@Sherlock9 do you?
I have a hard time dealing with references in J
 
11:22 AM
And prime factorization
Since that's important, too
Alright, going live in 3... 2...
 
One...
Challenge!
C'mon, @NewMainPosts... c_c
 
ahhhh J has a builtin prime factorization :(
 
I allowed those built-ins
I'll be back in a few minutes
 
C'mon, @NewMainPosts... @_@
C'mon... ಠ_ಠ
Wai so much windows?
 
1
Q: The Arithmetic Derivative

Sherlock9The derivative of a function is a cornerstone of mathematics, engineering, physics, biology, chemistry, and a large number of other sciences as well. Today we're going to be calculating something only tangentially related: the arithmetic derivative. Definition The arithmetic derivative a(n) or ...

 
11:31 AM
Shoes counts 212 bytes because you have 7 line endings. mothereff.in counts the line endings as one byte, Shoes counts them as 2 bytes
There it is
Only took 8 minutes
 
And 1 upvote.
Good job @NewMainPosts. ಠ͜ ಠ
 
0
Q: Shortest code to secure wipe a disk

MathuSum MutAs you can tell from this question and my previous one, I am determined to kill my SSD. Let's write the shortest code to perform a simplified variant of the DoD 5220.22-M Wipe Method with only two writing passes. Any programming language accepted, but the use of disk-wiping-oriented libraries i...

 
11:55 AM
@zyabin101 Sorry dude, I was afk when you pinged me. Guess we'll raincheck that game of tetris!
 
@Polyducks I'm being driven to dad's home, so please wait.
 
@zyabin101 I'm busy today regardless. Maybe catch you again in the week?
Good drive!
 
@Polyducks I'm a passenger, I don't have a car.
@Polyducks Okay. Ping me when ready.
 
12:20 PM
0
Q: Go to opposite corner of rectangle - Harder

ericw31415This is essentially the same thing as this question, except harder. You are again to write a program that gets from the lower-left corner of a rectangle to the upper-right corner. However, this time diagonal moves are allowed. The program will accept an ordered pair (width, height), and use thes...

 
Do anyone here speak J?
 
I speak English. :)
But my native lang is Russian.
 
12:36 PM
22
Q: Tips for golfing in J

GarethGolfScript gets its own way far too often and I feel that a repository of handy hints for golfing in J might help in the fight against the evil empire. What tips do you have for making this already terse language shorter? For those wanting to learn J, the obvious place to begin is the jsoftware ...

@KennyLau I don't, but have you seen this? ^
 
12:54 PM
@trichoplax Thanks :)
 
You're welcome :)
 
 
1 hour later…
2:10 PM
chat eez ded
no big surprise
Lynn on Code Review? O_o
Lynn, Belgium
136 3
> beginner elm matrix
lol
 
@KennyLau How's your language going?
 
@Dennis Which language?
 
2:25 PM
@Dennis I'm not quite proud of my language so let's just ignore it xd
@Dennis One day I'll write a langauge that can defeat 05AB13 :)
 
Oh, OK...
If you change your mind (or make another one) ping me and I'll add it to TIO.
 
@Dennis Would the Bubblegum source be licensed under Creative Commons because you posted it first on esolangs?
I want to make a fork of it but I can't tell if I need your permission or what
 
I thought Bubblegum was made by @Doorknob...
But it is made by Dennis?
 
@quartata Do whatever you want with it.
(I should add Bubblegum to my GitHub repo. And add licenses to all my GitHub repos.)
@zyabin101 Doorknobs rarely use Bubblegum.
 
I know of the doorknob that is proficient in Bubblegum.
 
@Dennis k
 
@zyabin101 Just because I made it doesn't mean he can't use it...
 
> proficient in Bubblegum
heh
 
2:41 PM
hmmm, it never occurred to me before that 6! = 8*9*10. Are there other factorials that can be expressed as the product of consecutive integers except the factorial itself?
 
@MartinBüttner Write a pyth code to find it out :)
(in fact in any language for that matter)
 
Which means that 7! = 7*8*9*10
 
4
A: $n! =$ the product of consecutive integers.

Rebecca J. StonesThe formula $$(n!-1)!=\frac{(n!)!}{n!}=\prod_{k=n+1}^{n!} k$$ gives an infinite family of examples.

these grow ridiculously fast though and don't include 720
 
But are they the only examples?
And why doesn't LaTeX work here :(
Note that if a! = c*(c-1)*...*(c-b+1), then a!b!=c!
 
@KennyLau ChatJax
 
2:49 PM
@KennyLau no, like I said they don't cover 720
 
in this case, 6!7!=10!
$testing$
 
@KennyLau yeah, that's in the linked question
 
no i'm just talking about how you would find those
 
9
Q: On the factorial equations $A! B! =C!$ and $A!B!C! = D!$

ArthurI was playing around with hypergeometric probabilities when I wound myself calculating the binomial coefficient $\binom{10}{3}$. I used the definition, and calculating in my head, I simplified to this expression before actually calculating anything $$ \frac {8\cdot9\cdot10}{2\cdot3} = 120 $$ An...

 
using an optimal algorithm
so it is unsolved :D
 
2:53 PM
@MartinBüttner random congrats on the bronze grid tag badge.
 
Let me reword.
 
Potatos are amazing.
 
If my program outputs things to places that are default outputs, can I choose which one is actually used for my output?
 
@Dennis Does TIO add arguments before or after the file name?
 
I mean if it outputs to stdout and to a file for example, can I say I want the file to be the output for the challenge?
 
3:03 PM
Yes.
 
@quartata By default, after. But I write an individual wrapper for each language, so that can be changed if required.
 
So it's like interpreter file args...
 
Yes, with the idea to use args as input, not for flags.
Separate support for flags is .
 
@EasterlyIrk random thanks.
 
Does anyone here speak J?
 
3:15 PM
Sort of.
 
@KennyLau I speak Russian :)
 
lol
I don't
 
But in chat I have to speak in English.
 
0
A: The Arithmetic Derivative

Kenny LauJ, 30 chars 0:`([*[:+/[:%[:q:[:%:[:*:])@.* Try it online! Sample input: 0:`([*[:+/[:%[:q:[:%:[:*:])@.* _8 _12 0:`([*[:+/[:%[:q:[:%:[:*:])@.* 0 0 0:`([*[:+/[:%[:q:[:%:[:*:])@.* 8 12 How it works: 0:`([*[:+/[:%[:q:[:%:[:*:])@.* N XX`YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY@.Z if Z then Y else X end 0: ...

@Dennis can you golf this? Too many caps "[:" :p
 
0:`([*[:+/[:%@q:@%:@*:])@.* saves three bytes already.
 
3:20 PM
What does @ and & do?
I don't really understand them
 
u@v is an atop, meaning that v is applied first, then u is applied to the result.
 
0
Q: Choosing outputs for challenges

muddyfishWhen the program you write for a challenge writes/outputs to multiple of the default outputs, are you, the answerer allowed to state which one is counted for the purposes for the challenge? For example, if my program Leaves the output on the stack Outputs to STDOUT Am I allowed to say that t...

 
u&v is compose and does more or less the same, but the rank is different.
 
well...
for example?
 
As I said, I sort of speak J. I've only used & for currying so far... Let's see if I can find an example.
 
3:26 PM
currying?
and what is rank lol
 
Rank means to which dimension the verb is applied. For example, for a 2D array, +/ reduces across columns (rank 0), but +/"1 reduces across rows (rank 1).
Currying makes a monadic verb from a dyadic one. (3&+) 5 gives 8.
 
+ is monadic?
 
+ is both monadic (conjugate) and dyadic (plus), but it's used as a dyad here. 3&+ sets the left argument to 3, so it gives the verb "add with 3".
 
what would happen with (3+)5?
 
That's a syntax error.
 
3:32 PM
why?
i always get domain error index error syntax error with no reason :(
 
Ask the J devs. :P
Currying is automatic in some J derivates, such as K and Jelly.
 
I see
 
@Dennis Currying is automatic in Jelly?
 
Well, it's not technically currying, but part of the chains.
 
Trying to understand this
What is the policy of internet shorthands here?
 
3:38 PM
Internet shorthands?
 
i mean internet slangs
lk dis
 
I don't think we have a policy on that.
But please don't write like this all the time. :P
 
alrit den
xd
no jk
 
All righty, I've added a lookup table mode to Cinnamon Gum. Let's see if it works...
Basically just does this: print dict([pair.split(",") for pair in o.split("/")])[input]
Oops, using print outputs it as b'...'
 
3:54 PM
hi all
 
hi part of all
 
looks like I was seconds too late to stop codegolf.stackexchange.com/questions/76937/… being put on hold
anyone with high rep like to reopen it please?
 
@Dennis Can you add this to TIO? It would be nice if you could make it take a hexdump as input
 
@xnor I found an even shorter answer using the idea you gave me
 
why was it closed? @Lembik
 
4:05 PM
@KennyLau I am not 100% sure but I think people didn't like my banning non-free languages
so I removed that restriction
 
alright
 
@quartata Sure. Give me a moment. Why the l thing? Isn't Cinnamon Gum without l just Bubblegum?
 
@Dennis It is but eventually there will be more things.
 
According to our meta consensus (which isn't really enforced), that l would count as two bytes. Couldn't you just use the first byte of the source code?
 
@Dennis Wait, why would the l count as two bytes? How is it different from a regular command line flag?
I was going to use the first byte of the source but I figured having it as a flag would be easier
 
4:14 PM
@PhiNotPi your hexaglyphs look even more fun if you compute them as usual, but then swap the roles of sides and corners of the hexagon (i.e. swap the radii of the points):
not so easy to doodle though...
 
@quartata According to meta consensus (which, again, isn't really enforced), perl -pe code is one byte more than perl -e code, but perl -p file is three bytes more than perl file. It's the edit distance in both cases.
 
Wow, TIL.
The problem is that if I change it to use the first byte of the source it'll add one byte to regular Bubblegum programs which I didn't want to do
 
Up to you.
 
@MartinBüttner There's also a bunch of other variations that can be done, like using more points but then placing restrictions on which points can connect to which.
 
I want to implement a geometry-based version as well, but it seems that splitting a line around intersections isn't easily doable in Mathematica, so it probably won't be very golfy
if I do, it should be trivial to use any number of points though
 
4:22 PM
The general process is 1) take a set of points and a restriction (if desired). 2) draw the lines between all points, obeying whatever restriction. 3) remove all lines that would have been drawn no matter what.
 
0
Q: Shortest code for key-logger

MathuSum MutOkay, I propose a shortest-key-logger challenge. As explained by the gentleman at "Are key-logger questions allowed?", strict rules have to be imposed in order to make this challenge valid for PPCG. The key-logger has to run on Windows or on Linux (any programming language is welcome). Upon exe...

 
For the hexa-glyphs, it's 6 points (no restrictions on pairing), and then the star points and outline of the outer hexagon are removed.
 
Thanks.
 
Since the star points and outer hexagon would be drawn no matter what order you decided to draw the lines.
Another example: take 16 points in the shape of an outline of a square, and require all lines to be octilinear.
 
4:30 PM
@Dennis How many extra bytes would cinnamon-gum code l i%2 be?
 
According to consensus, 6 bytes.
 
Ah, I get it now.
Blergh, that sucks.
 
32
Q: We need to take an official stance on code trolling

DoorknobHere's our to-do list for the project: Close all existing code-trolling questions (or maybe re-tag those three I mentioned). status-declined - if locked or deleted, closing might not matter, so we may or may not close them all first Lock all the more popular ones (>20 answers or >20 upvotes, ...

Why kill code-trolling?
 
have you read the answers?
 
Read the post.
also that was done years ago lol
 
4:35 PM
if they didn't convince you, I'm not sure anything we can say in here will
 
I just realized that / and , probably aren't very good delimiters because they'll be super common in ASCII art challenges
 
Man, I only recognize Doorknob and Martin from that post
 
@Sherlock9 I <3 <3 <3 Racket.
 
@Sherlock9 You don't recognize dmckee or squeamish?
 
@quartata I do, but obviously I'm an old hand. ;-)
 
4:38 PM
No, I see Joe Z., Jan Dvorak, Geobits, Peter Taylor, Justin, maybe dmckee and Gareth in the comments
 
dmckee was one of the first three "original" mods. He left to go be mod on Physics SE
 
@quartata For the most part, no, not really. Care to, in a way, introduce them?
Ah
 
squeamish is just this guy
 
I kind of miss code-trolling
although I never experienced it
 
@KennyLau I sure don't
 
4:40 PM
why not
 
@KennyLau Yahoo Answers would be happy to have you :P
 
lol
 
Be thankful that you've never had to experience it
 
0
Q: Read a crossword

muddyfishInspired by this question about packing into this format. Occasionally I see a completed crossword and being as I am, I can't be bothered to find out what the solutions to the clues actually were. Input: A 2D string (any format, newline separated, 2d list etc.) Blank squares will be represent...

 
Most of the code trolling posts were deleted and/or locked but suffice to say there were some really bad ones
 
4:41 PM
@ChrisJester-Young Well then, I'll look at it sometime soon. I'm still going through Learn You a Haskell as my intro to functional programming. Or can you recommend another tutorial?
 
do we have other trolling categories?
 
We have but that's been killed too.
 
No
 
@Sherlock9 In the Racket world, How to Design Programs and Realm of Racket are good resources.
 
For the most part, you can have fun in the challenge specs as long as the specs themselves are clear
But actual trolling is frowned upon
 
4:44 PM
@KennyLau May code-trolling never, ever return.
 
@quartata sort of, but I think it isn't being enforced yet
 
But you see, I'm anti-popcon too, so I see code-trolling as extreme popcon.
 
I feel like is probably a category that could be revived if someone comes up with an exceptionally good challenge. Most of the time, though, it gets reduced to gimmicks that everyone's already seen multiple times.
 
@ChrisJester-Young Well, How to Design Programs is available online like Learn You a Haskell. Not so with Realm of Racket. I'll stick with HtDP, for now
 
I'm not sure how you can formulate an underhanded challenge with a working objective validity criterion.
 
4:52 PM
g'morning m8s
 
@crayzeedude g'monring m8
 
I just noticed that it's much easier now to transpose square grids in Retina (rectangular grids are still a pain though): retina.tryitonline.net/…
this basically sorts all non-linefeed characters (stably) by their horizontal position.
 
POLL: what do you think would be the two least common characters to show up in an ascii-art/kolmogorov complexity challenge?
 
0x00 and 0x01
 
They need to be printable.
Sorry, should have mentioned that
 
4:55 PM
@quartata Ӌ and Ҕ tied 0
 
hey real quick
 
ASCII? extended ASCII?
 
Maybe stuff like ` or |
 
Unicode?
 
@MartinBüttner Printable ASCII
@PhiNotPi I'd think | would be common in ASCII art
 
4:55 PM
` and | seem quite common for ASCII art
 
can somebody with a twitch account help me out for just a minute or two?
 
` less so though (part of the reason I used it in Retina)
 
@Sherlock9 Cool. I sometimes forget that not everyone has a Safari subscription, lol.
 
Maybe Q and X?
 
For printable ASCII, I'd put my money on & and ? maybe
 
4:56 PM
@crayzeedude I had a Twitch channel before but now it's unused.
 
Oh, I was thinking more English compression. In ASCII art, maybe some random letter.
 
So no.
 
Not part of a pair, non-symmetric and nothing to do with dots
 
@NinjaBearMonkey X seems quite common
 
@crayzeedude I do have a Twitch account but I'm currently mobile-only.
 
4:56 PM
but in general, letters and digits are probably a good choice in terms of ASCII art
 
i just need somebody to head over to my channel and say something in chat
 
Alright, hang on
 
@Sp3000 Yeah, I was thinking & and ]
 
testing a thing i did with my RPi
 
@quartata Probably not ] I reckon. Anything in a pair is probably in at least 5 Calvin challenges :P
 
4:58 PM
:D
 
Maybe j?
 
hell yea it works
 
& and ; if you don't want letters and digits?
 
finally found a use for my Raspberry Pi Model B. :p
 
I'll go with & and ;
 

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