A chairde - Morning all!

@ypercubeᵀᴹ A - 99.75% Minister has wide-ranging powers! B - 0.2499. C - 0.0001. D - 0%. Not too many volcanoes in that neck of the woods - from here, 'They are rare in Australia because there are no plate boundaries on this continent. However, there are two active volcanoes located 4000 kilometres south west of Perth in the Australian Antarctic Territory: Heard Island and the nearby McDonald Islands.' Where's your virtual money?

Novax lost his appeal and will be deported

9 earthquakes in Australia in the past 7 days earthquakes.ga.gov.au

17 of M2.5+ in the past 30 days

Yeah - saw that! Made my predictions before seeing the news! It's nice to be correct about undesirable swine who have no respect for anybody else's health! :-)

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW the E was put because there was a huge volcano explosion yesterday, in Tonga islands, east of Australia.

Unlikely that any clouds would arrive in Australia? A tsunami perhaps?

unlikely yes. that's what 0.0001% stands for ;)

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW It's a slightly different legal system in Australia compared with other places in the world. The judiciary are independent and make decisions on matters of law, rather than moral or political considerations. It will be interesting to read the full decision reasons when eventually published, but it surely came down to deciding the Minister exercised his discretion within the law.

funny tweet

@ypercubeᵀᴹ :-) Upvoted!

I have a little sympathy with ND since he is now barred from entering Australia for three years, and will have to explain being deported to pretty much every other country he visits in future. I presume he thought he had a valid exemption and had followed all the requirements to enter as well as those needed for the visa.

"It's a slightly different legal system in Australia compared with other places in the world." - many, many systems have the concept of the separation of powers and independence of the judiciary. It's not slightly different at all!

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW In theory, yes. In practice, not always. See recent commentary on US Supreme Court decisions for example.

I have no sympathy with Novaxx Jokevic!

Yeah we know

Society is polarized on pretty much every issue these days.

Little room for compromise, nuance, or empathy.

Indeed, theory and practice are frequently out of sync! c.f. Hungary and Poland and the hot water they're getting into in the EU!

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW I understand

> Before delivering the orders, Chief Justice Allsop explained that the case wasn't about whether the Immigration Minister made the right decision. It was about whether the decision was so irrational or unreasonable that it wasn't made lawfully. A tricky, but crucial, distinction.

Sadly it will still be widely reported as if the Court did make the former assessment.

Especially on (anti-)social media

Why should I not be able to take a stand on this particular case. IMNSHO, there is no room for "nuance, compromise or empathy" in his case!

@PaulWhite Yes, exactly. Other comments:

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW You have consistently taken that stand. No one is saying you can't. Others might disagree with you, to a greater or lesser extent. That's how it's supposed to work, I think.

@ypercubeᵀᴹ "The truth is the judges only decided on whether the minister's decision was completely irrational or unreasonable." - as I said early, "Minister has wide-ranging powers!" - he used them (correctly in my view). The court had very little leeway, even if they sympathised - which I doubt!

The opposition in Australia asked the same question I asked here a week ago

It is a very valid question to ask.

Even though I think his anti-vaxx stance is completely unjustified - that, in itself, is not the reason for my disgust. He knowingly ignored the law in Serbia and Spain and there's no reason to believe that he would be bothered his arse following it in Australia!

Anyway, if the AU system is the same as NZ, the most the Court could have done is to require the Minister to retake the decision, taking into account any legal requirements emphasised by the court.

(our legal systems are generally pretty similar and take account of precedents both ways)

I have a right to be against seat-belts or be opposed to smoking-bans in bars... but if I don't wear my belt, I'll be fined and if I smoke in enclosed spaces, I'll be fined and thrown out!

If ever ND wants to come to Ireland, I hope Irish courts will take the Aus precedent into account!

Both of which are also, of course, totally unreasonable!

The good news tonight is an official report of zero deaths on the main island of Tonga

No chance of NZ being submerged then? :-)

No, but some boats were sunk

Might be a reduction in internet noise...

Unless you live at altitude?

:-)

Huh?

I was implying that if NZ was submerged, you'd be offline and we'd have a bit of peace!...

Charming

reports @Vérace for saying he wished I would drown

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW a suggestion to you for a tv series: "Bosch", if you have Amazon Prime.

I'll start my own "Use SO instead" campaign!

Nah you're not a child

Wanna bet? :-)

Yep

Well I suppose you were banned from Meta but that's not really conclusive evidence

@ypercubeᵀᴹ Don't have it - fiancee is talking about changing/getting it! Why would it appeal to me?

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW let that be a surprise

v mysterious

I've checked it out - it's a detective series - how does it apply to me?

Guilt over wishing for the demise of NZ in general and mods in particular?

At the airport, headed for Dubai

reuters.com/lifestyle/sports/…

> The player was seen boarding an Emirates flight from Melbourne just hours after the court ruling.

Bon voyage...

And don't come back...

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW ok, I can explain I guess, as per the Heap's motto.

I'm scratching my head here...

There is a scene where some police officers harass a driver about having "fully" stopped on an intersection and having a glass of wine earlier.

so first, a similarity on god-like powers the police in the US has.

I personally don't like it. I suppose it appeals to others.

While the main character - a detective - is seen in numerous scenes using his mobile while driving.

And not once wearing a seat belt.

There's another thing I can't do - go out, have a civilised bottle of vodka and then drive home! When does there come a point where an opinion is so at variance with all that's blatently obvious and reasonable,that's it's invalid!

There's (more than one) gombeen (look it up!) politicians (who, suprise, surprise, are rural pub owners) here who want the gardaí to take a softly-softly approach to alcohol consumption behind the wheel - and fight tooth-and-nail to block any legislation to make regulations more stringent! I see very little difference between what Djokovic did and drinking and driving!

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW not a bottle pof vodka. a glass of wine.

Now we're quibbling about amounts - not the core issue!

Let me know if you'd like doing exercises on the pavement for 30 min because a police officer thought that you "may" had a drink too much.

@ypercubeᵀᴹ Not sure what that's about? In Ireland, you're breathlysed - no subjectivity to it! No "walk along the straight line..." nonsense!

In many countries, if the officers do not have a breathalyser with them, they can tell to do silly exercises. Touch your nose with you left hand, walk on a straight line, etc

The guard's opinion doesn't count - at least not for pursuiing it further. Obviously, they have to make a decision on whom to stop - but we now have random testing checkpoints - again, fought against by these gombeens!

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW Nonsense you say? I agree 100%. I also find it very similar to what the Australian minister's arguments/actions on Novak case ;)

You're saying it's his anti-vaxxer stance that got him thown out, not anything he did?

No, the idiocy on both sides, in my opinion.

What about his visa irregularities? Tampering wtih QR codes? Wandering around Europe while positive?

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW were these in the reasoning for cancellation?

I'm not sure what the minister said? Those reasons should have been. An anti-vaxxer opinion isn't AFAIK a ground to exclude people from Australia. But, wasn't it some sort of "security" argument?

His behaviour before arriving in Aus would lead me to reasonably believe that he wasn't planning on obeying the rules in Aus either!

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW I haven't read the actual documents.

From what I read looks like the argument was "if he stays, there is increased possibility of civil unrest and rise of anti-vaxx sentiment as he is seen as some head figure".

Which is not irrational - per the judges.

Only slightly related, but this is interesting if you have 5-10 minutes theghostofinky.github.io/4orbs

My results

@ypercubeᵀᴹ I was just going to copy and paste the exact same thing from the Guardian. As far as I'm concerned now, it's still the right outcome, but for the wrong reason(s). Apparently, he's not an "active" anti-vaxxer - he just doesn't want either the vaccine (and more importantly) the rules applied to him! His flagrant disregard for the rules should have been grounds enough to exclude him from Aus!

Health, not security grounds!

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW I'll ask again because you didn't answer last week. Why was he given a visa in the first place if that's the case?

@ypercubeᵀᴹ As our Australian friends might say: "Someone stuffed up, mate!"... I've no idea - but if I were the responsible minister, I'd be changing procedures for processing applications so that this can't happen again!

This is me:

theghostofinky.github.io/4orbs/…

Although the questions are quite US oriented - and, there are many ambiguous ones!

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW Was that "8 values" or "new values"?

these are mine for "8 values" theghostofinky.github.io/4orbs/…

the previous one was "new values"

8 values also!

Will take other one..

This question: Either the state or the community should have regulations to protect the environment. - surely it should/can be both? Difficult to get what they're asking exactly?

I took that to mean either includes both

It may be that interpreting the question is part of the test

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW I guess it's whether you are in favour of regulations (either state or community) or against them, let it to the free market.

Me again,

theghostofinky.github.io/4orbs/…

Bit of a pinko, apparently! :-)

No tennis questions

Punishment for all tennis-related offences - firing squad at dawn! :-)

That might move the slider a bit yeah

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW "balled to death" ?

@ypercubeᵀᴹ You do know the meaning of the word used as a verb?...

@PaulWhite I didn't like my result

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW nope. I intended for it to look like "stoned to ..."

@ypercubeᵀᴹ Well, now you know!

I see. Well, I hope my intended meaning was understood. I'll let Merriam, Webster and Oxford add it as a 3rd meaning ;)

@McNets Come on now - cards on table!

@Vérace-getVACCINATEDNOW I'm sorry but I've closed that page 🤷‍♀️

@McNets Take it again - we'll believe you! :-)

Here it comes

I'm sure that I'm more Internationalist & progressive than that reflected in the final outcome

80 questions? Good grief, I'll burn my chickens if I spend that much time clicking about

mine: theghostofinky.github.io/4orbs/…

@ypercubeᵀᴹ From your results, I'd say you're definitely one! A pinko is somebody with left-wing(-ish) tendencies/viewpoints - the word can be used as an insult (see link) - usage dates from the 50's, so hardly PC today...

Just for clarity - I'm referring to socio-political orientation and not any other kind! :-)

In America, that appears to encompass anyone not to the right of Genghis Khan!