The Frying Pan

Jefromi

00:00

I have no idea, sorry.

rumtscho

Hmm, it looks like it might take longer than I thought

7

A: How to clean a burnt cast iron pot?

my 'nuclear option' for cast iron skillets is to put them in a basin of lye solution, and let the pan sit for a week or a month (depending on how fresh and how concentrated the lye solution is.) We keep a plastic basin out back for this. lye is bad stuff, so if you have kids or pets, do please be...

Jefromi

Whoa, months?

rumtscho

I hoped for a single night

I don't want a basin of lye lying around for that long

I have to keep it in the shower

Jefromi

Ack, yeah, that's not a good plan.

rumtscho

Hmm, my bottle of hydroxide has advice for removing paint

1:1 to 1:10 water solution

a rather wide range

Jefromi

00:04

I wonder if a single night might at least loosen it enough to get the really bad top layer off?

rumtscho

aaah I have to recalibrate my pH probe

Jefromi

(or maybe a full day between showers)

rumtscho

The buffer solution in its cap dried out

And now it shows 11.2 in tap water

No, I can shower

I will place it in a plastic basin

And I will keep it in the shower, but take it out when the shower is not in use

Jefromi

Wow, you'd better be careful drinking that water!

rumtscho

There just isn't enough floor space in the bathroom

Jefromi

00:07

I see I see!

Still, would be convenient if you could avoid doing that for a couple weeks.

rumtscho

Especially if I forget about it and just enter the shower barefoot some sleepy morning

Jefromi

nooooooo

rumtscho

argh the tester doesn't recognize the calibration solution

Cerberus

@rumtscho Are you sure you want to do this?

rumtscho

@Cerberus what else should I do with the pan?

Cerberus

00:17

Isn't your pan made of aluminium?

rumtscho

No, it is wrought iron

It is very badly seasoned

Cerberus

@rumtscho I don't know: just make sure the pan can handle it.

Hmm OK, as long as you know what you're doing.

Aaronut

@derobert Lordy, that Pets proposal is still the epic disaster it was when it was first started. It actually has "what kind of dog should I get" as one of the top-rated definition questions.

rumtscho

I don't use alu pans any more, I switched to induction

Cerberus

No weird reaction with the carbon?

Jefromi

00:18

@Aaronut That really instills a lot of faith in the area51 process...

Cerberus

@Aaronut I thought it would be "Hi! What do you think of my dog Fifi? Isn't she nice? I once lost her on the beach, but she returned. Oh, and my mom calls her Fi. Oh, and she is, like, the cutest dog in the world. And this one time, she like...."

rumtscho

There is crystalized buffer solution on the inside of my electrode holder :(

I hope I don't have to replace the electrode

Aaronut

It's sad to me because it's really, really difficult to get reliable information on pet care, information that's not cobbled together from vague anecdotes, logical fallacies, inappropriate analogies, cutesy talk, and the occasional alt-med idiocy.

Cerberus

Electrode? You're using some kind of electric tester?

rumtscho

@Cerberus yes

Aaronut

00:21

SE could really shine there and help a lot of people, but unfortunately it seems that the same idiots who post on pet forums are the ones supporting that proposal.

Cerberus

@Aaronut Hmm I suppose you have a point there; but isn't it too much like "doctor's-advice.SE"?

rumtscho

still doesn't work :(

Aaronut

@Cerberus To a degree, but pets are less complex than humans and peer-reviewed studies are not as difficult - although still somewhat difficult - to come by.

Jefromi

Maybe with a lot of loving care it could be turned into something good? I'm not sure how you can reverse 22 votes on a sample question, though. That one should really be horribly downvoted, and replaced with one about specific temperament attributes, seems like.

Aaronut

Especially when it comes to cat/dog behaviour - there's a ton of information out there, well-tested theories and techniques - and yet still people rely on bad ideas like confinement and bullcrap like flower essences to try to "correct" the problem.

@Jefromi Yes, but even then - any question requesting a list of dog/cat breeds for any purpose, for any criteria, should be off-topic. That's no different from a recipe request here.

Cerberus

00:25

@Aaronut Possibly...but then only answers backed up with scientific references could be allowed, or anecdotes would cause some pet law suits for SE...

Aaronut

@Cerberus Behaviour doesn't necessarily need to come with scientific references, but health should, yes.

Jefromi

@Aaronut Yeah, I know, that's what I was aiming for - turn the currently "good" one into horribly bad, and replace it with the actual question they meant to ask.

Mien

Oh I forgot to leave.

Cerberus

@Aaronut I suppose not; but then a flood of anecdotes could ensue...

@Mien No, no.

Aaronut

@Cerberus It works well enough for Skeptics.SE, they deal with many medical claims there.

Cerberus

00:26

You forgot you had changed your mind to staying.

Aaronut

You just need the site to be strictly moderated; moderators can add a "citation needed" post notice on any site.

Jefromi

Is there any way to see a list of things that were closed in beta on area51?

Aaronut

@Jefromi No, you can view the specific proposals if they haven't been deleted but there's no list.

(Why would there be? They don't want to advertise their failures. :P)

Cerberus

@Aaronut Hmm...my only answer there was anecdotal, though it should be extremely relevant and reliable if I was to be trusted; but it was deleted because I had no verifiable references (city councillor told me something that was highly relevant to a question, and she was in the best position to know).

Jefromi

@Aaronut Yeah, that's kinda what I figured. I was just curious to see if failure-in-beta was correlated with bad proposal characteristics like this.

Mien

00:28

@Cerberus Ah, if you say so.

Aaronut

@Cerberus Are you talking about skeptics? Pretty much the whole basis of science and scientific skepticism is that anecdotal evidence is not reliable no matter who the source is.

Mien

@Aaronut Can proposals that don't get through have another try later?

Jay

Sweetness, my roommate just hooked me up with the diablo 3 beta key

Mien

@Jay Nice!

Jefromi

@Mien Yep, though they're supposed to really demonstrate that something's going to be different the next time around.

I think the Mathematica one might've died and been reincarnated, for example.

Mien

00:30

@Jefromi k.

Aaronut

@Jefromi Mostly, failure in beta correlates with ill-conceived topics as opposed to poor execution. For example: "Gadgets" and Atheism. Other proposals simply die from lack of interest (AI).

Mien

I just think some proposals just can't have a good fit.

Cerberus

@Aaronut The councillor has access to all the official reports, has talked to lots of people in the field, and probably has classified information too. She knows more about it that nearly anyone else in the world. There can be no doubt that the figures she gave me should be of considerable value to everyone, even though, of course, she too may be off.

Aaronut

@Mien Doesn't really work like that, but if they actually get deleted, I guess they could be re-proposed.

Cerberus

I mean, I can understand Skeptics' policy, but they deleted a valuable piece of information. Which I understand. But still.

Aaronut

00:32

@Cerberus That's all completely uninteresting to a skeptic. We don't know anything about you or your credibility, we don't know anything about the councilor or her credibility, and we don't know where she got her information from even if she is credible.

Science and scientific skepticism means one type and only one type of evidence is accepted into the mainstream: Controlled, peer-reviewed experiments/studies.

Cerberus

@Aaronut Again, I understand that. But I know her info is the best.

Aaronut

@Cerberus Not relevant.

Cerberus

@Aaronut Except that none such articles exist.

Jefromi

@Cerberus Two people != peer-reviewed study, whether or not you're actually right.

Cerberus

@Aaronut It is relevant to me.

Aaronut

00:34

@Cerberus The site is not for you, it's for the public.

Cerberus

@Jefromi I know that. But the fact that something isn't scientifically "proven" doesn't mean it is worthless.

@Aaronut Your point being?

Aaronut

@Cerberus It means exactly that, to a skeptic. The site is called "skeptics".

Cerberus

I have said several times that I understand their policy.

Aaronut

It's not a mere policy, it's their entire reason for existence.

Cerberus

How so?

Aaronut

00:36

Our policy against recipe requests is a policy. A skeptic's rejection of anecdotal (or second-hand, or second-hand AND anecdotal) evidence is at the center of his belief system.

Cerberus

Stackexchange is far from a scientific journal.

@Aaronut I din't think Skeptics was supposed to be a site for philosophical sceptics?

Aaronut

@Cerberus The site is called skeptics. That's basically the same as the title "no anecdotes".

@Cerberus Huh? What else would it be?

Cerberus

The general sense.

Aaronut

And what do you mean "philosophical" skeptics? Skepticism is pragmatic by nature.

Mien

I don't like sites that require real references. I know it's better, but I'm too lazy to look the stuff up.

So I won't answer at Skeptics, although I just saw a question that I could answer fairly well.

Aaronut

00:38

@Mien That's fine, you don't have to contribute to them. They don't want those contributions. That's the whole point.

I'm not sure what it is that people aren't getting here. Skeptics.SE is basically a Q&A version of Snopes, or the Straight Dope.

Mien

@Aaronut Yes I know, but it bugs me that I know the answer, but there's no point in writing it down.

Aaronut

@Mien They don't want the "answer" on Skeptics, they want the evidence.

Cerberus

Scepticism is a philosophical approach that holds that we cannot know anything at all, nor approach the truth. Being sceptical in common speech means simply that you are disinclined to believe in certain things without more convincing information.

It's not a very precise term.

Mien

I'm glad I'm not married to a real skeptic then.

Aaronut

@Cerberus Uh huh, and where does this definition come from?

Cerberus

00:40

Which one?

Philosophical skepticism

:For a general discussion of skepticism, see Skepticism. Philosophical skepticism (from Greek σκέψις - skepsis meaning "enquiry" - UK spelling, scepticism) is both a philosophical school of thought and a method that crosses disciplines and cultures. Many skeptics critically examine the meaning systems of their times, and this examination often results in a position of ambiguity or doubt. This skepticism can range from disbelief in contemporary philosophical solutions, to agnosticism, to rejecting the reality of the external world. One kind of scientific skepticism refers to the critical ...

Jay

@Mien u say that like you are currently married

Cerberus

> Philosophical skepticism is distinguished from methodological skepticism in that philosophical skepticism is an approach that denies the possibility of certainty in knowledge, whereas methodological skepticism is an approach that subjects all knowledge claims to scrutiny with the goal of sorting out true from false claims.

Aaronut

You're interpreting it as some sort of Kantian nonsense. Saying that you can't be certain of a particular thing does not mean you can't know anything.

This is just plain old science - there are no absolutes, just currently-accepted theories which can be replaced in the face of new evidence.

Cerberus

@Aaronut The latter is implied in most definitions of knowledge.

But never mind, I don't think quibbling over the definition of scepticism is productive, and, as I said, I understand their policy.

Aaronut

I'm not going to debate philosophy. This really isn't complicated. If you're going to post on a site or forum for skeptics, you post with direct evidence, policy or no policy.

People look at the Skeptics questions and go "oh, these cover a pretty wide range of topics, I know about some of this stuff" and miss the point that it's not really the subject matter that's important there, but how it's treated.

Cerberus

00:45

What do you want from me?

I understand the policy. Is that not enough?

Aaronut

Nothing in particular. Although it would be nice if you'd stop contemptuously calling it a "policy" as though it's some arbitrary rule.

Cerberus

I did not at all mean that in a contemptuous way, or I wouldn't say I understood it. By understand I mean "appreciate".

Aaronut

...but apparently do not agree with. Otherwise I'm not sure I understand why the subject came up in the first place.

Well, I apologize if I read criticism where there wasn't any. That's definitely what it looked like to me.

Cerberus

Let's forget about it.

I had no real point to make.

rumtscho

This cooked mayo is soooo fickle

I got it going on the third try

and then it split on me

also, it never was as thick as in the pics on that forum

Aaronut

00:54

@rumtscho I've never even heard of cooked mayonnaise, they probably took a picture of raw mayo.

I think with commercial mayo they pasteurize it somehow afterward, they don't use pre-pasteurized eggs.

rumtscho

@Aaronut I've heard of it before

Not pasteurized, hard-boiled

And it did indeed emulsify

Aaronut

Hard-boiled isn't pasteurized?

rumtscho

(for a while)

Cerberus

So you use hard-boiled yolk to make mayonnaise?

I had no idea that could emulsify.

rumtscho

@Aaronut Technically it is also pasteurized

But when somebody says "pasteurized egg" I imagine it still raw

Aaronut

00:56

Oh. I just meant anything heated higher than 63° C. Could be 1° higher, could be 30° higher.

I guess it's interesting that a hard-cooked yolk could emulsify at all, although I'd expect it to be a very different kind of emulsion unless you grind it into dust.

rumtscho

Yes, I ground it first

Not to dust, to a paste

Aaronut

Seems kind of like trying to make mayonnaise with mustard.

rumtscho

01:24

0

A: How to make mayonnaise with a cooked yolk?

I went ahead and tried it. I used hard-boiled yolks, as a soft and slimy one would be not really different from making the mayo in a waterbath. It turned out to be incredibly fickle. The first try, only yolk and oil, with immersion blender, split immediately and never recovered. The second try ...

@Aaronut actually, I have heard often of making mayonnaise with mustard. Not as the main emulsifying agent, but it is supposed to work much better than pure egg.

rfusca

03:24

those cinnamon rolls were freaking amazing - it was an other worldly experience

not just the best cinnamon roll I've ever made, but the best I've ever had, anywhere, ever, by a really clear margin

Jay

03:53

@rfusca freaking amazon? other wordly? I think the cinnamon buns were so good, it addled your mind silly man

rfusca

04:03

@Jay hmm?

Jay

@rfusca dont act all innocent like you didn't make those typos... i see the edit symbol

rfusca

what? me? edit? no

It must be rumtscho sneaking in

@Jay they were so good I caught my wife scraping the pan when we got home, pratically licking it

Jay

@rfusca oh boy hahaha

now i want to try it

was it from the bba?

or was the recipe from somewhere else

rfusca

@Jay it was the rich man's brioche from bba as the dough. The filling was fresh grated cinnamon, sugar, more butter, and nutmeg. Then cinnamon on top, then maple icing on top

maple icing = powdered sugar, butter (!), milk, and maple syrup (the real stuff)

Jay

04:23

my god, thats enough calories to feed a whole third world country for a day

Jay

04:37

@rfusca, watch this video. lol so funny: youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=OelHPDBSiJg

rfusca

@Jay yes, yes it is

@Jay thats why they were small

but they were fork tender and oh so good

they were really quite unbelievable

derobert

06:17

So, I got my oven thermometer. Turns out my oven is something like 75°F hot. Explains why trying to cook bread^w thick flour sauce at 500-ish burns...

Tomorrow, I get to adjust it to bring it back to sanity.

rfusca

@derobert wow

thats way hot

derobert

yeah

so, FYI, you can season cast iron at almost 600°F :-P

rfusca

@derobert i use a tip that @SamLey mentioned the other day - I measure the stone with my IR ...I don't know why I didn't think of that

derobert

depends on if your stone reads the right temperature with the IR thermometer, wonder if mine does. Probably cooled by now—could check.

rfusca

@derobert makes me wonder if thats part of it then. Maybe yours is better seasoned because its hot...Mine runs about 25 cold...so about 100 degrees diff

@derobert some reason you think it wouldn't?

derobert

06:21

@rfusca could be, you could always bring the iron to 550 or 600 stovetop and hold it there for a while

rfusca

@derobert sides don't get done well like that

derobert

@rfusca well, different materials emit IR differently, so some don't read true temperature (you have to adjust for it, or have a more expensive IR meter where you can enter that adjustment factor)

@rfusca e.g., if you measure shiny metal, it'll read quite a bit lower than it really is

rfusca

@derobert oh right

i'm pretty sure matte stone should be fine

derobert

@rfusca honestly, I don't think you should need 600°F to season it, as long as when you took it out it was black & not at all tacky, then it should be good enough.

easy enough to figure out if the stone reads right, just measure it when its at a (known) room temperature

I think that should work

rfusca

@derobert true enough

@derobert also true

shrug

i think i figured out why razor places weren't working well for me for scoring bread. wrong kind of blade

i was using like a box cutter blade when something like a DE Feather seems more appropriate

derobert

06:27

@rfusca oh, also, oil the blades—that helps a lot

rfusca

@derobert ya, it didn't make a lick of difference. I think i'm just using too thick of ones

the tomato knife works better than the blades I was, but not as good as I want

derobert

@rfusca weird, must be your Bermuda Triangle kitchen again, even a plain ol' utility knife works when well oiled (and well sharpened)

rfusca

@derobert !@#!@$!! lol sigh

shrug

derobert

I suppose, you could just buy a lame. That should work, being the purpose-designed tool.

rfusca

@derobert well, that would be just...well...lame

derobert

06:31

Well, the sticky cast iron could be the universe getting revenge on you for the bad puns.

rfusca

@derobert most likely

the problem with a lame is I have to buy expensive blades for it

derobert

hmmm, not sure, how often would you have to replace the blade? Seems like one would last a while. But never really looked into it.

rfusca

@derobert dont' know

derobert

06:59

@rfusca King Arthur has one for $7, so do various people on Amazon. I'm tempted to pick one up someday, to see how much the curved edge helps.

rfusca

@derobert i think i'm gonna try this

derobert

@rfusca is that one you're building yourself, or a commercial one?

rfusca

@derobert thats a popsicle stick and a shaving razor

(somebody else's photo)

derobert

well, that'd definitely be cheap, I suppose. At least if you can get the razors cheaply

just don't cut your fingers off when bending that blade onto the popsickle stick

rfusca

blades are wicked cheap on amazon

or ebay

got some pain a l'ancienne chilling in the fridge

derobert

07:16

@rfusca awesome, that's a tasty formula

rfusca

@derobert yup

although I halved it and didn't pay close enough attention and its 89% hydration

that will be...fun

derobert

wow

good luck with that

isn't it supposed to be 80?

rfusca

lol ya

yup, 80

i should just go put a touch more flour in, but now i'm curious to see

derobert

heh, yeah, a sane person would add flour—or at least vital wheat gluten

see if you can get baguettes, or if you wind up with flattened baguettes instead

rfusca

@derobert its KA bread flour, so its high gluten at least

@derobert ya, we'll see what I end up with

derobert

07:30

still going to be insane at 89%

rfusca

@derobert yup

@derobert thefreshloaf.com/node/21799/100-hydration-baguette

derobert

that's a weird-looking crumb

rfusca

yup

rfusca

07:59

@derobert - g'night

ElendilTheTall

08:59

@rfusca think I'm going to leave the tripod until I can afford a bigger upgrade

and considering there's nothing else I need camera-wise, I'll probably look at some cooking stuff

American Pie is calling :)

Mien

10:17

@rumtscho I'm not surprised and yet I find it weird that the mayo didn't turn out well.

On the site it is only 1 yolk and 120 ml oil.

And it is a nice mayo.

What oil did you use (although I don't think that's the cause)?

ElendilTheTall

12:44

I have just had Bordelaise sauce for the first time - hot damn it's good

Mien

12:59

I didn't like my sauce I made yesterday. But Bordelaise is good idd :)

did you make the demi-glace as well?

ElendilTheTall

14:09

I didn't make it, I was eating out

steak with bordelaise sauce

rumtscho

I would have been slightly squeamish around the bone marrow I guess

On the other hand, I have watched people eat brain.

Jay

Has this happened to anyone before: I currently have runny nose... in only one of my nostril. my other nostril is totally fine. And when i sneeze i feel only that one nostril getting itching and "flaring" up

rfusca

@ElendilTheTall well, it should arrive today, i'll let you know what i think

rumtscho

14:24

@Jay yes, it happens

could one of you Americans maybe help me a bit for my work?

I need the picture of a receipt in English

rfusca

@rumtscho ?

rumtscho

I have to record a demo screencast of how a software prototype is used, and it has to be in English

But all receipts I have are in German

A readable snap with a phone camera will do

rfusca

gosh...i don't have any receipts on me right now

rumtscho

This is what I got by now.

Cerberus

@rumtscho google.com/…

rumtscho

14:28

@Cerberus I will probably run into copyright problems with those

Cerberus

Ah, so you're going to publish it. Hmm...

You could ask in English: I'm sure someone would have one.

rumtscho

Good idea, thank you

Jay

@rumtscho If you can wait until lunch time(or haven't gotten one by then) I'll run out during lunch and get something

Cerberus

@rumtscho Maybe flatter them a bit, as in "have any of you bought some good food lately? I need a photo of a receipt".

Jay

@Cerberus how is that flattery?

Cerberus

14:32

@Jay Everyone with an ounce of self-respect likes to think he knows what good food is...

Jay

@Cerberus Eh not really

Mien

@rumtscho My parents use that as bread spread, after using a bone in soup.

Jay

i know some people who dont enjoy food unless they think it is bad for them

mostly college kids

Cerberus

@Jay Heh OK, but you will find that nearly everyone in the English room thinks he can cook!

And they're probably right.

Mien

@rumtscho That's very clear! Something to live with and fruit or veggie :p

life supply?

I don't know the correct English term.

Jay

14:39

@Cerberus I guess just different demographic

Cerberus

@Mien What do you mean?

Mien

Levensmiddel.

Cerberus

@Jay Yeah could be: most are older anyway.

@Mien Just food?

I never use "levensmiddel".

Mien

And your store?

Cerberus

I call everything "eten".

Mien

14:41

I don't use it either.

@Cerberus Everything?

;)

Cerberus

@Mien They might use "voedsel" or "levensmiddelen" (never singular).

Mien

I'm food for you?

Cerberus

@Mien I eat everything!

Mien

@Cerberus Ah, the singular form must be why I thought it was strange!

Jay

@Cerberus Yea most college kids are either too lazy/poor to care about eating healthy, or is just living for the now and don't care that its not healthy and only that it tastes good

Cerberus

14:42

@Mien Where did you read/hear it?

Mien

@Cerberus I'll send you a sample of everything I make then :p

@Cerberus On that picture of rumtscho.

From the receipt.

Cerberus

@Jay Hmm a great many college kids here like to cook. It's hip, especially for guys.

Mien

It's just very very vague :)

Cerberus

@Mien Excellent!!

Mien

My bread is rising ;)

Cerberus

14:43

@Mien Ohh I see! Well, Lebensmittel can be both singular and plural, I think?

Or what was the word? Anything with -mittel.

@Mien Yay!

Mien

My point was just that that receipt didn't say anything. Very vague.

But we have that here too with the groceries and smaller stores.

Cerberus

@Mien Ohh I see.

Jay

@Cerberus Yea definitely a good way to get laid ;)

Cerberus

Yes, sure: all things related to advertising are usually full of crap.

rfusca

@Mien grats, what kind

Cerberus

14:46

@Jay Haha, I'm not sure that's the reason. People cook when they're alone too.

Mien

@rfusca Chocolate bread. First time I try this, but basically normal bread with extra cocoa powder and a bit of sugar.

So in the worst case, it will taste like normal bread.

Jay

@Cerberus Honestly? i think most of the things guys in college do, IS to get laid

Mien

Our college attitude is quite different from yours, I think.

Alhtough I don't know :)

Cerberus

@Jay Perhaps your friends, hehe...

Jay

@Mien lol perhaps, or you are just oblivious to it all since ur a girl

Cerberus

14:48

Most of my friends certainly aren't like that.

Jay

@Cerberus Lol I hang out with a good group of people 0;)

Mien

@Jay Well, I was never really in the attitude, since I don't live in the uni city.

Cerberus

@Jay Perhaps it is a cultural difference.

It may also have to do with campi: we don't have those here.

People just live in the city.

Jay

@Cerberus Where are you from again?

Mien

I think they prefer drinking :p

@Cerberus Well, you have "neighbourhoods" that are very student-oriented, right?

rumtscho

14:53

@Jay I think that most of the things guys in a college do is to tell their male friends they got laid, no matter if it happened or not :)

Mien

Or are students really spread throughout the city?

@rumtscho True that! :D

Jay

@rumtscho haha

Cerberus

@Jay Amsterdam.

Mien

Does anyone here uses VLC?

Jay

@Cerberus Dont people there get high every day and sit around giggling?

Cerberus

14:58

@Mien Hmm not really...of course certain neighbourhoods will have more students than others, but never close to 50 % I think. We do have a few flats that are exclusively for students. But those are not highly prized.

rumtscho

@Mien Sometimes, but not often.

Cerberus

@Mien Yes, mostly spread out. Is it not so in Belgium?

@Mien Yes!

rumtscho

@Cerberus I think this isn't country-dependent, it is city-dependent

Cerberus

@Jay I think the bulk of the weed is smoked by foreign tourists.

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