The Frying Pan

Faheem Mitha

2:00 PM

Dinner time.

Cindy

@rumtscho Thanks! Will give kitty your greetings! :)

rumtscho

@Jolenealaska Interesting idea. Maybe it will be worth it, having Stack Exchange users endorse me. I wonder how they will react to it, but my gut feeling is it will be positive.

ElendilTheTall

well, I too am looking for a new job, and an interesting one has just popped up

or at least, one that I could conceivably apply for

rumtscho

@ElendilTheTall cool! What job?

ElendilTheTall

IT help desk trainee. Seems to be more of a hardware focused thing

Cindy

2:01 PM

@FaheemMitha These guys can fill you in or you can probably catch some of it on the news. Must go for now.

ElendilTheTall

That would suit me - I have the requisite customer service background, and I have plenty of computing knowledge but no formal qualifications, which they're offering to provide

Cindy

@ElendilTheTall want to hear more later! :)

ElendilTheTall

@Cindy sure. go, work1

rumtscho

It sounds somewhat too entry level. But if you want to change the industry, I guess you have to start low.

ElendilTheTall

@Cindy the Paris attacks have caused a general tightening of security

rumtscho

2:03 PM

What would your goal be? To become a system administrator?

ElendilTheTall

@rumtscho exactly - I can't walk into a higher level position because of the lack of formal qualifications

@rumtscho at the moment, to get the heck out of this place

I have no particular career goal. I never have had one.

rumtscho

@ElendilTheTall Oh. Do you mean your company, your industry, the city you work in?

ElendilTheTall

The only thing I want to do is photography, but that's not going to happen, so I am limited to things I can do.

@rumtscho the company. poor pay and a bitch of a commute

rumtscho

@ElendilTheTall Even people without a career goal usually don't see a first level support job as a permanent position. But if you don't try for a specific career path, the default position to get promoted to would be a sysadmin.

or a network admin, or an integration specialist... something from that area. The exact job title varies.

ElendilTheTall

sure

well, my present position has absolutely zero chance of progression

but from the looks of this prospective company there should be a lot more scope for that

rumtscho

2:15 PM

@ElendilTheTall sounds good.

ElendilTheTall

it pays a little less, but the cost of commuting will compensate heavily for that, and I imagine it would increase once the training period was up

Jolenealaska

I wonder if these guys are related to me:

friesenscustomcabins.com

rumtscho

Commuting is really a bad thing. Not only as a financial cost, but in work psychology, it's known to drastically reduce job satisfaction and overall happiness.

And by "drastically", they mean "much more than the commuters realize it does"

ElendilTheTall

oh, I realise it

2 hours a day less with my family

Over £1400 a year in costs

rumtscho

@Jolenealaska didn't you look at some genealogy project online once? Maybe they are in there

ElendilTheTall

2:19 PM

regularly late, crowded trains

rumtscho

@ElendilTheTall their point was that no matter how much you realize it, it's worse

you tend to realize the direct consequences, but it seems that it has a ton of indirect consequences on mood.

Jolenealaska

@rumtscho I used to be on ancestry.com but barely got started when I had to quit because I could not afford it.

rumtscho

anyway, I will cross my fingers for you to get a nicer, closer job

Jolenealaska

@ElendilTheTall that is exactly what I was going to say, but you beat me to it.

rumtscho

@Jolenealaska Oh, I see. How is Ripley's results going? Does it already bring positive financial effects, or is it only nonmaterial advantages for now?

Jolenealaska

2:24 PM

@rumtscho it has brought in some money, interestingly I have had to replace the flyer twice in the mailroom because all little tabbies have been taken. So far I'm only advertising just in this one building, but today or tomorrow I'm going to go ahead and put flyers in the other mailrooms too.

rumtscho

Oh, this Ancestry site is very expensive. Maybe you can use their resources from somewhere? For example a local library could give access to patrons?

@Jolenealaska not bad. Maybe people don't need dog training, but think "it's nice to have the number of a pet sitter and I'll use it when I need it".

Jolenealaska

@rumtscho possibly, but I am unlikely to go anywhere to do anything unnecessary until winter is over. My car is on its last legs.

@rumtscho I have decided to only do pet sitting as a courtesy for my dog training clients. Pet sitting (particularly walking dogs) takes a lot out of me for what it earns.

Mien

@Jay are you spying on me? :P looking at my pictures? :O

hi all btw :D

rumtscho

hi @Mien

ElendilTheTall

Hi mien

you do plaster your visage all over the interwebs

Mien

2:32 PM

yes

my face is everywhere

hi rummy :)

hi tally

rumtscho

@Mien did you become the campaign face of psychologists?

Mien

I hope not :D

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall In the US?

@ElendilTheTall I don't mean to rain on your parade, but those are terrible jobs. What happened to that photographers assistant thing?

ElendilTheTall

@FaheemMitha all over the West

Faheem Mitha

If you are interested in IT work, there are better ways to get there.

ElendilTheTall

2:34 PM

@FaheemMitha it disappeared

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall Oh. Sorry to hear that.

ElendilTheTall

@FaheemMitha do tell

rumtscho

@Mien speaking of visibility on the internet, I'm updating my social network stuff, so I just sent you an invite.

Mien

do you have facebook? :O

rumtscho

No, LinkedIn. I don't use FB.

Faheem Mitha

2:37 PM

@ElendilTheTall Are you interested in programming, sysadmin work, or something else? Or do you not particularly care? The DB SX people tell me their line of work is very lucrative, at least if you are willing to relocate to the London environs. You could talk to them on chat - they're quite helpful.

Mien

Ah yes, I see it :)

Faheem Mitha

I know a little about DB work. It's not hard, but it is quite technical. And the UK seems like a good place for that kind of work.

Actually, DB works seems internationally quite lucrative.

rumtscho

@FaheemMitha he was complaining of the commute until now. "Relocate to London" doesn't sound like a solution.

Faheem Mitha

@rumtscho Well, I didn't say it was critical to relocate.

ElendilTheTall

@FaheemMitha I don't particularly care, but I have little programming or DBA experience outside a little light web dev. I have no formal IT qualifications, so an entry level position specifically asking for people with self-taught knowledge which they can build upon is perfect for me

rumtscho

2:38 PM

But DB work is indeed better paid than networking or software systems work.

Faheem Mitha

But you'd need to be in the UK at least. They wouldn't consider anyone from outside.

@ElendilTheTall Yes, but that sounds like it might be a deadend thing. Do you have the job ad handy?

I worked on this project once upon a time - journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/…

I don't have any formal knowledge myself. But it's not rocket science.

rumtscho

@ElendilTheTall I think Faheem makes a valid point. If you can find different entry level positions, or if you find some IT position where you get the chance to become "the one who knows about databases" by preferentially taking these requests, it might be a good move.

ElendilTheTall

@FaheemMitha I don't see why you would infer that. The natural progression for a trainee would be to qualify, then to move up through the ranks, I would have thought

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall Do you have any first-hand experience of the kind of job you're considering, or do you know anyone else who is? If not, try to talk to someone who is doing a similar kind of thing. As close as possible. If you can talk to someone in that same organization, perfect.

ElendilTheTall

besides, even if I can't progress at this company (something which I would no doubt ascertain the prospects of prior to accepting the job, presuming I was offered it) I could at least get some experience and possibly formal training under my belt which would open the door for less entry-level stuff

Faheem Mitha

2:41 PM

I'm inferring it from a mix of firsthand experience and my knowledge of how things work in the industry.

ElendilTheTall

@FaheemMitha No, other than helping family members over the phone :)

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall Can you post a link to the job ad?

ElendilTheTall

@FaheemMitha nope

Faheem Mitha

Ok...

ElendilTheTall

Anyway, we are getting ahead of ourselves. I haven't even applied for it yet.

I would find out more information about what it would entail and what the progression path was before I jumped in

Faheem Mitha

2:43 PM

Anyway, for programming work, getting involved in a suitable free software project is quite effective. I mean, as a stepping stone to a paid job.

ElendilTheTall

I don't want to do programming work

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall Yes, of course.

ElendilTheTall

I am no good at programming

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall You earlier said you don't particularly care.

ElendilTheTall

I don't, but I don't think I am cut out to be a programmer

Faheem Mitha

2:44 PM

But Ok. There are other things one can do.

ElendilTheTall

my brain is not wired for it

Faheem Mitha

I'd look into DB work if I were you. Being a DBA is different from being a programmer.

ElendilTheTall

yes, I'm aware of that

Faheem Mitha

And the folks on DBA.SX chat are reasonably friendly.

You could introduce yourself, and ask them for their thoughts about getting involved in that line of work.

It's something I'd personally consider seriously if I was in the UK.

ElendilTheTall

well, a cursory glance at a job meta-search site shows no entry level DBA jobs near me at present

rumtscho

2:47 PM

I don't even know if there are entry levels DBA jobs

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall Well, getting involved in an online project is always an option. They're usually desperate for help. At least the ones I'm familiar with.

@ElendilTheTall Hence, talking to the DBA.SX people. They won't bite.

rumtscho

or if the junior DBAs are expected to be from the IT industry and having DB experience from dev projects or similar.

Faheem Mitha

At worst, they won't be very friendly.

ElendilTheTall

@FaheemMitha "Here, person with very little experience. Play around with our database!"?

Faheem Mitha

@rumtscho Everyone has to start somewhere. The question is where a helpdesk trainee is the best way to go.

rumtscho

2:49 PM

@FaheemMitha But in an online open source project, they need people who already know how to do the job.

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall That's not how it works.

ElendilTheTall

@rumtscho my thoughts exactly, expressed in a less sarcastic manner

Jay

@Mien, hey man, no spying at all. you were the one who posted your own picture in here. At one point you also posted your boyfriends picture. I remember he had long hair pulled back into a pony tail

rumtscho

@FaheemMitha What is the best start on a path towards DBA?

Faheem Mitha

@rumtscho Not true. Have you actually been involved in any such projects?

rumtscho

2:49 PM

Rfusca got to be a DBA and they gave him a great salary for it.

Faheem Mitha

@rumtscho I don't know. Hence DBA.SX. I'm feeling like a broken record here.

rumtscho

But he had been a dev for them for a long time, it turned out that he's especially good on the backend, writing SQL queries.

Faheem Mitha

@rumtscho Yes, some people are good at that kind of thing. Back in a bit.

Jay

I feel like DBAs generally start as something else and got pulled into the backend work

rumtscho

@FaheemMitha Not as such. But I've had some contact with them. Have seen the way their devs communicate with each other, with drive-by contributers and with users.

Faheem Mitha

2:58 PM

@rumtscho There's lots of scope for helping, depending on the project. One obvious way to get started is with documentation. There are never enough people working on that.

But I don't know exactly what kind of software projects one would get involved in to learn about DB.

rumtscho

@FaheemMitha OK, documentation is clear. I thought you suggested that he starts doing DBA work for them.

Faheem Mitha

I could offer my personal experiences as an example, wrt the project I referenced above. If anyone cares.

rumtscho

@FaheemMitha postgre?

Faheem Mitha

@rumtscho Well, it's a starting point.

@rumtscho You mean PostgreSQL?

rumtscho

@FaheemMitha yes. If he wants to have competition advantages in the DB world, the best strategy would be to attach himself to a well known DB project.

Or maybe something more exotic but still respected. Maybe a nosql database.

Faheem Mitha

3:00 PM

@rumtscho Oh. Hmm, I was thinking of something more at the application end. PG is very high profile, and I don't think they are particularly in need of help.

PG is sort of the Linux kernel of the free DB world.

rumtscho

@FaheemMitha yes, probably not.

Faheem Mitha

But no doubt there are other things. Assuming one is interested.

rumtscho

But it's the center of an ecosystem of projects.

Faheem Mitha

I personally don't find DB work that interested, but it (a) pays well (b) has excellent employment prospects.

@rumtscho PG, you mean? Yes, that's true, no doubt. I guess one could jump in and try to get involved, but I don't know anything about it.

One of lead devs (Bruce) used to be a high school teacher (CS) so it's certainly possible to get involved in indirect ways.

rumtscho

@FaheemMitha I don't find it interesting either, but 1) not worse than network administration or similar, and 2) Elendil does not think the way I do, so there is good chance he might find it interesting.

Faheem Mitha

3:03 PM

I don't know anything about Bruce, really. He's extremely unchatty. I read an interview about him in 2000 or so.

@rumtscho There are lots of other alternatives, but they increasingly require specialised knowledge. The other thing that seems big right now is Data science.

ElendilTheTall

@rumtscho no, I don't find it interesting

:)

Faheem Mitha

Which is marginally related to DB work, but is more on the statistics end.

ElendilTheTall

but my interest comes second to my need to feed mouths and pay the mortgage

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall Have you tried it?

rumtscho

@ElendilTheTall how do you know if you haven't done it?

ElendilTheTall

3:05 PM

how interesting can it be?

it's storing and retrieving data

rumtscho

The problem with job choice is that it's impossible to know what a job is before one has done it

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall Well, things can be more interesting than they appear on the surface.

rumtscho

the ideas of people of what "Job X" involves are very incorrect

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall Well, yes, but there is a lot to it. As people would probably be happy to explain to you.

And it's a very responsible job. Hence the high pay.

People get very very very upset if they lose data.

ElendilTheTall

you're really selling it to me ;)

Faheem Mitha

3:08 PM

When I started work on that project I referenced above, I was surprised how much stuff was involved in it.

@ElendilTheTall I don't mean to. It's just a suggestion.

I worked on that project from Nov 2008 to when I got that article published in 2011. Then I had a book chapter published in 2012 based on the article. Way too much time to spend on DB stuff, but I did learn a fair amount about it.

I've always looked down my nose at things like DB stuff, so it was interesting to have ones preconceptions challenged.

If nothing else, one does learn to be more open minded as one gets older...

rumtscho

@ElendilTheTall another question: Did Mrs Tall like the puzzles from that link?

ElendilTheTall

@rumtscho I don't think she's looked at them yet

Jolenealaska

@rumtscho puzzles?

rumtscho

Ah, OK. I guess she's a busy woman, with two infants and all. She works too, doesn't she?

ElendilTheTall

Yes, and yes

rumtscho

3:14 PM

@Jolenealaska I was explaining Keen and the whole batch of Simon Tatham puzzles, and one weekend Elendil asked for the link.

They are mostly number based, none is word based. But if your Scrabble-specialized mind can spare a few cycles for them: chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/puzzles

Warning, they can be addictive for some personalities (like mine)

Jolenealaska

cool, I'll check them out

ElendilTheTall

I am more of the 'try it for 3 seconds, fail, never visit the site again' type

Jolenealaska

@ElendilTheTall Part of me is rather tenacious when it comes to puzzles, but I can usually tell pretty quickly if a certain puzzle type isn't for me.

Mien

@Jay hahaha that is a long time ago :O he cut his hair like three-four years ago?

I don't even remember :D

ElendilTheTall

I remember that photo

he just needed a cheroot and a beret to look like some Bohemian loafer :)

Jay

3:20 PM

@Mien :P but I remember :P

You should post an updated photo. :) Show us the now you

:eyes:

oh boy

bwahahah

that is also quite dated

two years I think

ElendilTheTall

3:22 PM

my caffeine starved brain read that as 'two years of drink'

probably not far off the mark anyway :P ;)

Jay

@ElendilTheTall do you save everyone's photos?

ElendilTheTall

@Jay only yours

Mien

I drank too much coffee today :D

I bet it's his wallpaper

ElendilTheTall

this one is straight off Mien's website

@Mien only on my phone, jeez

Mien

^^

Jay

3:23 PM

haha creeper alert creeper alert

Mien

/me backs away from this chat

Jay

we dont even know his age and he has our photos plastered all over his walls

Mien

see you in a few months! :D

ElendilTheTall

@Jay sigh. Mien's website is in her profile. Mien's photo is plastered all over her site. (She's evidently very fond of herself ;) )

Jay

@Mien dont leave us :'(

Jolenealaska

3:25 PM

hmm, there seem to be quite a few long-haired brunettes in The Frying Pan.

Mien

brunettes are bestettes

Jolenealaska

(at least among the girl folk)

yes! :)

Jay

rumi is also a brunette

ElendilTheTall

me too

Jolenealaska

with long hair

ElendilTheTall

3:26 PM

though not long haired

hairy, but not long haired

Jay

@Jolenealaska at least with the last picture ive seen of her, her hair is more medium length

@Catija are you a long haired brunette?

Mien

lol :P

long, haired or long-haired?

ElendilTheTall

@Mien why not all three?

Could make a good kids' book - Long-Hair, the long, haired, long-haired hare

Mien

called O'Hara?

ElendilTheTall

Long-Hair O'Hara, the long, haired, long-haired hare

go to press!

Jay

3:43 PM

thats cute

i always wanted to write a childrens book

steals idea

Catija

@Jay ... yeah? Why?

Jay

@Catija we were just noting how there were a lot of long haired brunettes in here.

Rumtscho, Mien, Jolene are all long-haired brunettes

Now you have joined the rank

Catija

Ah... well, brown is one of the more common hair colors... particularly for European-based people. I suppose the vast volume of Chinese and Indian people would make black the most common but, among non-Asians, I think Brown is most likely :D

Jay

@Catija Stahp it you. With your logic and stuff and stuff

:P

Catija

But... that would mean that I would have to stop being who I am :P

Jay

3:54 PM

haha i only kid

Mien

time to go home :) bye

Faheem Mitha

@Catija I was once told there is no such things as black hair. Just very dark brown. I've no idea if this is true.

I guess that's a biology question.

Jay

@Mien bye :)

Catija

@FaheemMitha I would believe that. But, that doesn't keep everyone from calling it black :D

Jay

my hair is gosh darn black! gosh darn it!

lol im only joking

bleh my hair is too short. I was trying to pull one out to look at closely

rumtscho

4:09 PM

@Jay most people use mirrors :)

Jay

@rumtscho but i want to see the actual thing inches from my face rather than a reflection :)

plus I dont want to be "most people" :D

rumtscho

Anyway, you will only see black. Black hair is black in color. Whoever says it isn't doesn't realize the difference between color and wavelength.

Jay

lol this question made me laugh a bit

"I placed limes in with my roast and now it tastes like Limes."

Oh really? Is that how that works?

ElendilTheTall

witchcraft innit?

@FaheemMitha that's nonsense

Jay

bah im trying to figure out what to make for dinner tonight

ElendilTheTall

4:12 PM

(unless they actually mean you have dark brown hair)

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall Source, please.

Jay

im getting tired of healthy chicken and veggie with rice

ElendilTheTall

@FaheemMitha you want me to prove a negative?

colour is colour

if your hair looks black, it's black

Jay

@FaheemMitha lol shouldn't it be you who should be providing the source?

ElendilTheTall

@Jay pizza

quesadillas

chilli

Faheem Mitha

4:13 PM

@Jay I have no source. It was something I heard.

Jay

@ElendilTheTall hmmm i do have beans and chicken and tortilla and cheese

thats a pretty good idea

ty

ElendilTheTall

the more eumelanin you have in your hair, the darker it will be. the darkest human hair colour, and the most common outside europe, is black

Faheem Mitha

Black hair

Black hair is the darkest and most common of all human hair colors globally. It is a dominant genetic trait, and it is found in people of all backgrounds and ethnicities. It has large amounts of eumelanin and is less dense than other hair colors. Sometimes very dark brown (blackish-brown) hair is mistaken for black. In English, black hair is sometimes described as "soft-black", "raven black", or "jet-black". The range of skin colors associated with black hair is vast, ranging from the palest of light skin tones to dark skin. Black-haired humans can have dark or light eyes. == DistributionEdit... ==

ElendilTheTall

there you go

Faheem Mitha

That doesn't support the statement that I heard. Never mind.

ElendilTheTall

4:15 PM

no mention of 'black hair is actually very dark brown'

rumtscho

@ElendilTheTall it's not the first time I've heard such a statement

ElendilTheTall

It wounds me deeply that you are more willing to believe some random person than you are me (a slightly less random person)

@rumtscho yeah, well, people say lots of stupid stuff

rumtscho

it usually comes from Sheldon-like types who have no idea of human physiology

They think that "reflected wavelength" and "color" are the same thing

then they measure the reflection off a human hair and note that it's not 0 in the visible spectrum

and declare that it can't be black

Jay

soooo i just snipped a piece of hair

unfortunately without a mirror i snipped more than just 1 hair

oops

Faheem Mitha

@Jay Time to get out the microscope.

rumtscho

4:18 PM

@Jay it's hard to see color in a single hair. Too much interfering optical effects.

Jay

i probably have a bald spot now

(i know im exaggerating)

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall I merely quoted someone. Who, I don't remember. Belief didn't enter into it. Plus, black vs dark brown isn't exactly well defined.

ElendilTheTall

@FaheemMitha well, I spoke to the nice folks at DBA.sx

Jay

Random info, I need to lotion my hand more. my cuticles are dry and gross

ElendilTheTall

they suggest going for the job, taking them for every qualification I can get, and moving on if there's no chance of progression

Faheem Mitha

4:19 PM

@ElendilTheTall Were they nice?

ElendilTheTall

@Jay just the one hand?

@FaheemMitha I believe I said as much...

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall Ah, Ok.

Jay

@ElendilTheTall actually yea. my right hand is fine but my left hand cuticles seem dry

rumtscho

@ElendilTheTall cool

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall By job you mean hypothetical helpdesk job?

Jay

4:20 PM

And before you make a comment about lube, I actually masturbate with my left hand

ElendilTheTall

@FaheemMitha yes

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall Ok. Well, it's good they were polite, at least.

ElendilTheTall

@Jay so it feels more like someone else is doing it? Poor lonely Jay

rumtscho

@Jay I was just thinking that Elendil was tamer with his jokes than I expected, but I forgot you'll raise the topic yourself :)

ElendilTheTall

@FaheemMitha even their advice ran contrary to your own, you mean? :P

Jay

4:22 PM

@ElendilTheTall haha i dont know. even though im right handed, it feels more natural doing it with the left hand

ElendilTheTall

@rumtscho evidently it was too subtle for you and jay.

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall Well, I didn't exactly have any advice. Just suggestions.

Jay

@rumtscho ahaha i know no shame :P

ElendilTheTall

"Just the one hand?" was meant to imply that one hand gets heavily lotioned for masturbatory purposes

Faheem Mitha

For one thing, I don't actually know you, remember? And you refuse to share any information.

ElendilTheTall

4:22 PM

@FaheemMitha semantics

Faheem Mitha

@ElendilTheTall Not really, no.

It's hard enough advising people one actually knows.

rumtscho

@ElendilTheTall I got your drift, I just had expected it to be more openly vulgar for some reason.

Jay

No worries! If i deem the room's vulgarity level too low, I will personally change that :)

You know me, always ready to jump in and help out :)

Faheem Mitha

@Jay You're a team player.

Jay

Yes I'm working on it. Its quite necessary to move up the corporate ladder

I actually applied to a leadership position in the Young Professional Network at Comcast

Probably a relatively low chance I'll get the position but who knows. It doesnt hurt to try

rumtscho

4:27 PM

@Jay vulgarity is necessary for the corporate ladder? Actually, with all I've heard about your employer, it doesn't surprise me.

ElendilTheTall

Jay: VP in Charge of Lubrication

Jay

@rumtscho hey now lol. I was referring to being a team player

Faheem Mitha

@rumtscho Being a team player.

Jay

Actually it's the community service leadership position

rumtscho

But it would be funnier if you were referring to vulgarity

Jay

4:28 PM

I just found out today that my manager is the community service leader for APA the asian group at comcast

I think it'll be cool if i got the position and be able to do a collab with APA on a community service initiative

I signed up for Habitat for Humanity in philadelphia

I also signed up for REbuild Philadelphia which mostly focused on repair work rather than building a new home

Faheem Mitha

Maybe make sure they have a cement mixer next time.

Jay

And at the local library I volunteered to "Teach Senior Citizens basic computer knowledge"

ElendilTheTall

@Jay glutton for punishment eh?

"Why doesn't the footpedal work?"

"Jay?! I found the cupholder by pushing the little button, but it broke when I put my mug on it"

"THE WEBCAM STOLE MY SOUL!"

Jay

@ElendilTheTall Ahaha I think people who sign up for it will probably want to learn to use the computer and will be slightly better than trying to teach your grandparents who is actively resisting

@ElendilTheTall Ahaha thats great

rumtscho

@ElendilTheTall I see you're already mentally immersed in your future job

Faheem Mitha

4:33 PM

LOL

ElendilTheTall

@rumtscho indeed

Faheem Mitha

@Jay That sounds like fun. Have you actually ever tried to teach a senior citizen about computers? Maybe you could practice on Don Knuth.

Jay

@FaheemMitha i tried briefly to teach my mom

but she can't read english too well

Faheem Mitha

@Jay How did it go?

Jay

and i cant teach her when the computer setting is chinese

so it was tough

Faheem Mitha

4:34 PM

I tried teaching my mother once too.

Jay

and trying to teach while speaking chinese is VERY VERY tough as I dont know how to say most of the computer terminology in chinese

Jolenealaska

ooh! My how time flies when you're not paying attention.

Jay

so the lessons turned into a gibberishly mangled combination of chinese and english

rumtscho

Teaching my mother actually included following dialogue. "Now you press the button OK". "Do it again, I didn't see it". I redo everything to get to the same dialogue. "Did you see it now?" "No." Third time. "How did you do it?| "Click it with the mouse". She tore the mouse from my hand and started looking at it from all angles for an OK button.

@Jolenealaska where was your attention? On a cute canine customer?

Faheem Mitha

@Jay Hmm. Maybe the Chinese just use English words for all the computer stuff.

Jolenealaska

4:38 PM

@rumtscho Yes, I taught my elderly neighbor how to use email.

Jay

@FaheemMitha no i just came to america before i knew anything about computers

so i never learned the terms

Jolenealaska

It was quite the puzzle to figure out what could possibly be going wrong with her entering the password

Jay

chinese people do have chinese words for computer terms

Faheem Mitha

@Jay How do you know there are chinese terms?

@Jay Oh, ok.

Jay

@FaheemMitha are you kidding me right now lol

no all chinese people are illiterate fools who cant use computer

Faheem Mitha

4:38 PM

@Jay No, I'm not.

@Jay What?

Jolenealaska

Finally I realized that she was typing zero when she meant the letter "O". Of course to her, there was no difference between the two.

Jay

they purposefully use english terms in place because it doesnt exist in chinese

rumtscho

@Jolenealaska I hadn't encountered that one.

Cerberus

Hey! Did I see The Chaos?

rumtscho

But I've met tons of IT people who don't realize why Markdown is not ultra easy for users

Cerberus

4:40 PM

@ElendilTheTall The Chaos rulez.

Jolenealaska

@rumtscho me neither, that's why it was so puzzling.

rumtscho

It has significant whitespace, guys!

hi @Cerberus

Cerberus

@Jolenealaska Hilarious!

Jay

@Cerberus what is The Chaos

Cerberus

@rumtscho Hi!

@Jay A poem about English pronunciation.

6 hours ago, by ElendilTheTall

Dearest creature in creation,
Study English pronunciation.
I will teach you in my verse
Sounds like corpse, corps, horse, and worse.
I will keep you, Suzy, busy,
Make your head with heat grow dizzy.
Tear in eye, your dress will tear.
So shall I! Oh hear my prayer.

Jay

4:43 PM

very fun

Cerberus

nods emphatically

It goes on and on.

ElendilTheTall

I learned a delightful old English term for the Kestrel (as in the bird of prey) the other day: windfucker

Cerberus

Well, well.

Very old.

ElendilTheTall

it would make a great name for a death metal brass band

Faheem Mitha

@Cerberus Obviously really, really old.

Hi Cerberus.

Jolenealaska

4:50 PM

I am still missing one thing I really need to be happy with my computer set-up. Bluetooth is giving me fits with my headset. I am going to go now to mess with it.

Little by little, piece by piece, things are falling together.

I feel like once I can keep Dragon and my headset going, I can live with my computer set-up the way it is.

The video card has been quite the challenge. Little shit just adding up, but I am so close

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