The Sphinx's Lair

Beastly Gerbil

7:00 PM

long underwear

yes

thats position then

yep

How about: 'A puzzle that involves trying to figure out a word or phrase from an image and/or set of characters that gives clues to parts of the word or phrase, using wordplay or attributes of the images and/or set of characters.'

incesterror21

@Deusovi It's hard to explaing, yes. It somehow includes the 'physics' of the symbols used

Beastly Gerbil

7:00 PM

lets make a list of possible things: colour, position, words, images, what else?

ffao

@dcfyj that's similar to this one

incesterror21

size

ffao

Apr 14 at 21:21, by Rand al'Thor

stand take mine taking
  I    you  to    my

dcfyj

@ffao lol, yes

Sconibulus

don't try to enumerate all possible things

incesterror21

7:02 PM

Not bad

Sconibulus

someone will outclever you

dcfyj

@Sconibulus ?

incesterror21

@ffao 1back0

Beastly Gerbil

so colour, position, words, characters, images and size. anything else?

Deusovi

there are two main types I can think of:

"written rebuses", where words are written in a weird way (the ones we've been discussing so far - the weirdness can be positioning, color, stretching and squishing...)

and "assembly rebuses", things like this:

10

Q: What quote does this rebus represent?

The accepted answer will be the first to include the correct quote, the author, and explain each part of the rebus. Most importantly, have fun!

rebus

dcfyj

7:03 PM

Orientation I'm sure would matter for some rebuses

incesterror21

@BeastlyGerbil If you want you could add orientation or relative positioning

Although "position" covers that

dcfyj

ninja'd :P

Beastly Gerbil

yeah but would that fall under position?

we could just expand later on

Deusovi

orientation would, I think

dcfyj

position doesn't really cover orientation (Rotation)

incesterror21

7:03 PM

I think relative positioning is a thing

under/over etc

dcfyj

That's why I said "attributes" :P

It can be most anything for a rebus

Deusovi

I'm not sure how to capture "written rebuses" and "assembly rebuses" in one definition

(note that they can probably be combined)

incesterror21

rebus = puzzle using an additional meta dimension

Beastly Gerbil

hmmm....

Deusovi

@incesterror21 ...no

dcfyj

7:05 PM

lol

Deusovi

"metapuzzles" are a thing, completely different. self-referential puzzles are yet another thing. rebuses are not "meta" at all

Sconibulus

"A form of wordplay involving symbolic representations of words, phrases, or constituents thereof"

Rubio

i think @incesterror21 meant metadata about the puzzle's components, not "meta-puzzle" per se

incesterror21

Well yeah I'm not that stupid

Deusovi

"An additional meta dimension" doesn't imply "rebus" to me at all though

@Sconibulus Would relative positioning be considered "symbolic"? There aren't extra symbols there. Other than that, it seems fine to me

Beastly Gerbil

7:07 PM

how about we make the definition for 'rebus' a rebus?

dcfyj

@Deusovi I still think attributes is the best means of encompassing the different parts

Sconibulus

@Deusovi well, the entire construction would probably be considered the symbol in the first case

err, the long underwear case

Deusovi

Hm, I'm not sure I'd consider that a "symbol"

the bar, maybe, but I've seen those puzzles without bars

Sconibulus

@ffao this one would be four symbols stuck together

Deusovi

(I hate how so many puzzle definitions are easy to explain by example, but hard to explain "formally")

n_palum

7:11 PM

^ 10000%

Sconibulus

symbol might be the wrong word

incesterror21

Maybe you just want to point out that the words/images contain information in several ways

Sconibulus

Answer=X, X=Long Underwear, X = F(A,B), A=Long, B=Wear, F=A Under B

my thought is that X, A, and B are all Symbols

but there's probably a better word

incesterror21

Syntax Error, cannot use unassinged variable Long Underwear

dcfyj

Rebus: "A puzzle that is portrayed using images, words, and/or characters that the solving of requires examination of its attributes (i.e. word position, color, etc)"

Deusovi

7:15 PM

its, not it's

dcfyj

picky :P

I always flip those

Either way, is that a viable description of what we consider a rebus puzzle to be?

Deusovi

"A puzzle that is portrayed using images and/or text, where solving the puzzle requires examination of the data's attributes (for instance, word position or color)"

Better?

dcfyj

Yeah, good phrasing

Beastly Gerbil

like that

Deusovi

Also, I think that captures the "written rebus" pretty well, but not the "assembly rebus"

Rubio

7:17 PM

I might have said "components" vs "data" but it looks good

incesterror21

Me too

Beastly Gerbil

^^

Deusovi

"components" is definitely better, yeah

dcfyj

OK, so we just need to fix it for the assembly rebuses then?

Deusovi

I was struggling to come up with a word for it

Yeah. I'm just not sure how to do that.

incesterror21

7:18 PM

Assembly rebus example please

dcfyj

I'm not sure how to solve them, so...

Beastly Gerbil

and then we need a thorough explanation in the tag info

Deusovi

I gave an example earlier

10

Q: What quote does this rebus represent?

The accepted answer will be the first to include the correct quote, the author, and explain each part of the rebus. Most importantly, have fun!

rebus

the first line is (BUCKWHEAT - BUCKET) + (THIGH - HIGH), which becomes WHA + T

incesterror21

I think the definition from earlier covers that

Maybe add the mathsy element somehow

dcfyj

Oh, those rebuses

Deusovi

7:20 PM

Does it? What attributes need to be examined?

Rubio

... of the components' attributes (for instance, word position or color) or meanings (for instance, the name of a depicted item, or mathematical symbols to indicate operations on words or letters) ... ?

n_palum

Look what you've done Gerbil

incesterror21

The "+" and "-" are symbols on their own that hold meaning

Deusovi

I think that's perfect, Rubio

dcfyj

@n_palum He made us discuss something actually site related?

Deusovi

7:21 PM

@dcfyj gasp

Rubio

That's it. I'm adding "Ban Beastly Gerbil" to my campaign platform.

dcfyj

lol

Deusovi

Ban everyone! Nobody can post bad puzzles if nobody can post any puzzles at all

Rubio

Oooh!

Make PSE Great Again!

n_palum

Ban em all!

dcfyj

7:22 PM

Make PSE ~~Stagnant~~ Great Again!

Deusovi

Any objections to me updating the rebus wiki with that?

n_palum

Burn em! They're a witch!

dcfyj

@Deusovi Sounds good to me

n_palum

I have no objections, it'll help me remember what is and isn't a rebus

incesterror21

Where do I find details about bounties and rep? (Wondering what happens if I go to 0 and then get down voted)

n_palum

7:23 PM

@dcfyj Only teasing :P

Deusovi

@incesterror21 Rep has a lower bound of 1. If you go below 1, nothing happens - you stay at 1.

ArtOfCode

@incesterror21 you can't go down past 1

incesterror21

No sudden death then

Deusovi

(Of course, you can only give bounties with rep you have.)

Heh.

"If you go below 1 rep, you are executed."

incesterror21

"We are sorry but you no longer have rep. We have deleted your profile"

Sconibulus

7:24 PM

@incesterror21 Well... posting enough chaff to get you down to 1 will probably manage to net you a suspension or ban

incesterror21

Is that a challenge?

Deusovi

"An agent has been dispatched to your location."

Beastly Gerbil

nice. 18k

incesterror21

@Sconibulus media.giphy.com/media/MEgJRhrGVafDi/giphy.gif

Deusovi

congrats! now get 40k more for grade-school humor

dcfyj

7:25 PM

@Deusovi or warhammer

Sid

Wow... The h bar seems to have the same discussion that we had in yesterday(I think)

Sconibulus

58k?

Beastly Gerbil

58? hmm?

Deusovi

your exact rep is 18008 :P

Sconibulus

ahh :)

dcfyj

7:26 PM

>.<

Beastly Gerbil

oh dear

18018 now :P

Sid

I don't seem to get it...

Beastly Gerbil

put it in a calculator and turn upside down

dcfyj

Do you have a calculator handy?

Beastly Gerbil

(58008 that is)

Sid

7:28 PM

Oh, man.

That is...

dcfyj

He did say "grade-school humor"

Deusovi

It was really common when I was in grade school, and seeing a 5-digit number ending in 008 reminded me of it

Rubio

We seemed to find the same humor in 55378008

Beastly Gerbil

two 5s?

dcfyj

Shouldn't that 7 be a 1?

Sid

7:30 PM

Also, @ArtOfCode I would say you handled that pretty well in the h bar. Things were going south really fast there.

Deusovi

7 is L

Rubio

2 mins ago, by dcfyj

Do you have a calculator handy?

^

oh right

@Sid why thank you

7:30 PM

oh right I was thinking of it without the extra 5

Beastly Gerbil

me too :P

Deusovi

incidentally, we had a question about the longest calculator word

-2

Q: Longest Calculator Word?

Current Best; Babingtonites = 5371207621898; 13 letters We all know from fooling around with a calculator at some point in our lives, the when we turn a calculator upside down we can make words. For example, 0.7734 being HELLO. Or 808 being BOB. Now assuming your calculator screen can stretch ...

mathematics open-ended language english

and if you don't accept 2 becoming N and 7 becoming T, the longest one is BIBLIOLOGIES

dcfyj

I don't see how 2 = n...

Deusovi

I mean, if you rotate it 90 degrees...

but yeah, I don't think so either

Sid

@Art How many of those comments were flagged?

dcfyj

7:32 PM

I can sort of see 2 being a j, but that's kind of pushing it

ArtOfCode

@Sid only the initial flag that alerted me to it

Sconibulus

yeah, that's a bad word

dcfyj

I don't think that joke is in that great of taste @BeastlyGerbil. I don't overly mind it myself, but other might be a bit touchy about that

Deusovi

Yeah, agreed

Beastly Gerbil

duly removed, apologies

Deusovi

7:35 PM

No worries c:

Rubio

Cheshire Cat smiley: c

dcfyj

As I said, I don't really mind it, (I was never in that place) just putting it out there because I'm sure others would mind, some a great deal

Sid

That wasn't really too touchy. Nothing compared to what I just witnessed.

ArtOfCode

shrug it's refreshing to see y'all being capable of handling stuff between yourselves :)

dcfyj

@Sid Yes, but others may not respond so kindly. Particularly people that were involved in the matter

@ArtOfCode This room is pretty mild

Now that Contact room... :P

Mithrandir

7:38 PM

I still have to learn the rules

dcfyj

For Contact? It's not that hard to learn

Mithrandir

I keep trying and failing, I don't do well with rule lists like that

Deusovi

Hm. Can you point out the particular part where things stop making sense? I might need to do a rewrite to make things clearer

Sconibulus

We could make a flowchart!

incesterror21

@Mithrandir It helped me a lot to play part after part

So first only make contacts, later add your own clues

Mithrandir

7:40 PM

@Deusovi it's probably just me, but I don't absorb things like that well

dcfyj

To put it simply, think of a word/sentence that starts with the letter(s) of the defender and make a clue that guides to that word. When you see another attacker's clue and you think you know it you contact it, and wait for the defender to (hopefully) pass on it. Once he passes then you can guess. If you guess correctly the defender adds another letter to his predetermined word.

Rubio

I've been meaning to do a (meta?) post with a more complete description of the semi-formal rules and our local rules/guidelines.

n_palum

I always tell people you learn best by watching a game or scrolling through old games, not just the rule list

incesterror21

Also @Deusovi the word "contact" isn't really well chosen imo

Sconibulus

Defender gives letter -> Attacker poses clue beginning with letter -> Attacker Contacts*/Defender Guesses*->Defender Passes (only possible after at least one contact)->Contacting Attackers Guess-> Next Letter Given if correct, clue dies and answer given if incorrect

Rubio

7:41 PM

Is that worth doing (and would it be out of place on Meta)?

n_palum

@Rubio I think a more complete meta guide on the entire thing would be a good idea! And that can be the pin

Sconibulus

It might not be out of place on the main site

like Deusovi's CCCC guide

Sid

Contact isn't really puzzle, though. It is just a game.

Rubio

@incesterror21 We didn't pick the name, that's the name the game already has

Deusovi

I think it'd be better on meta. After all, it's not really about puzzles

Yeah, it's not our invention.

incesterror21

7:42 PM

@Rubio We could change it. I don't see any police around

n_palum

I think it'd be suitable for Meta, seeing as it's about our site/chat rooms

Deus is the Judge, Jury and Executioner, there is no police.

Rubio

Sure, but people actually know the game Contact, so why not use its name.

Deusovi

Rubio, I'd be happy to work with you on the writeup if you want

Rubio

Cool, I'll run it past you before formally posting it

n_palum

\o I helped with the last one

Deusovi

7:44 PM

We could collaborate with Google Docs or something

Rubio

I'm going to start with what we have and go from there

yeah that'd work too

Mithrandir

@dcfyj I'll have to look at some transcripts

Sid

@Art Did you ban them for a month for that message?

incesterror21

Why not add some kind of screen capture gif

ArtOfCode

@Sid hm? which one?

Sconibulus

7:45 PM

He dares not speak it :)

Rubio

Ok I'm off for a little while

Deusovi

@Mithrandir Yeah, it's usually best to learn by playing after a read-through of the rules. Seeing the game actually happen makes things "click" for a lot of people

Sid

They who posted that message which started that whole thing at h bar. I see they are banned for a month.

ArtOfCode

I don't recall issuing any month-long suspensions recently, so it probably wasn't me :)

@Sid oh, huh. That's new. Last I heard it was 30 minutes, but someone clearly extended it for whatever reason.

dcfyj

The only person I know of that was banned for a month was jgallant, but that's neither here nor there.

Beastly Gerbil

7:53 PM

vtc the new question pls

Mithrandir

Link?

Beastly Gerbil

0

Q: Solve Mathematics

A and B are standing at a distance of 20 km from each other on a straight line on a east west road.A and B start walking simultaeously Eastwards and Westwards rrspectively and both cover a distance of 5 km.Then A turns to his left and walks 10 km.B turns to his right and walks 10 km at same spee...

mathematics

sphinx should give it in a sec

dcfyj

Might be closed by then :P

incesterror21

Why do you close so fast?

Beastly Gerbil

because it is a maths puzzle :P

Sid

7:55 PM

Not a puzzle

dcfyj

@BeastlyGerbil No it's not, it's a math problem

Maybe it's a rebus!

that :P

Bam, closed

Interesting, 6 people on the "voted to close" list

n_palum

7:56 PM

I flagged it that's all I could do :P

dcfyj

Was the required number bumped up recently?

Deusovi

I see five

n_palum

Maybe because I flagged it but it's not a vote

Deusovi

BG, you, Mith, Scon, Sid

Sphinx

0

Q: Solve Mathematics

A and B are standing at a distance of 20 km from each other on a straight line on a east west road.A and B start walking simultaeously Eastwards and Westwards rrspectively and both cover a distance of 5 km.Then A turns to his left and walks 10 km.B turns to his right and walks 10 km at same spee...

mathematics

dcfyj

7:57 PM

lol, I was counting Beastly and gerbil >.<

Mithrandir

You appear to be counting 'beastly' and 'gerbil' as two people.

E

Ninja'd

Beastly Gerbil

Think we may have come third: data.stackexchange.com/puzzling/query/84210/…

or fourth

it won't load for a while

nice job! :p

Sconibulus

we win though, because anyone that beat us cheated

(modhammer)

Deusovi

:D

Beastly Gerbil

nope thats at least 5 peope

n_palum

7:59 PM

The days of Deus the puzzle damner

shudders

Sconibulus

when does Community dupe-flag?

I see a couple, is it based on user flags?

ArtOfCode

when the OP confirms it's a dupe

Mithrandir

@Sconibulus those are useful

You get to delete stuff within three minutes of it being posted :P

Sconibulus

this is the next-fastest five user delete

-1

Q: The Mysterious Surgeon

A man carries his son into the hospital because his son has a nail in his foot. The surgeon walks in and says "I cannot operate on this boy, as he is my son". What is going on here?

lateral-thinking

err, close rather

581 seconds

n_palum

Arqade questions get closed really fast XD

Sconibulus

8:04 PM

so we almost cut it in half :)

n_palum

Hey @humn!

Beastly Gerbil

woo nice job guys

humn

@n_palum !

Sorry to butt in with a browser puzzle:

Mithrandir

* clap clap clap*

humn

Q: Are superscripts on SE less superduper than usual? Or is just me?

Puzzles with ... and ...
aren't being rendered correctly on all 3 browsers I just tried.

Mithrandir

8:04 PM

It's broken

Beastly Gerbil

working for me

Mithrandir

Check Meta

humn

It seems to be broken all over SE, such as this simple example at the sandbox:

2

A: Sandbox archive

This is a super-subbed text. But why? ohiseehowththisworksnow!

Here, on top, is more or less how it should look:

And on bottom, how it looks to me today.

Anyone care to see how it looks to someone else? (I've checked and restarted everything I can.)

Mithrandir

18

Q: superscript HTML tag has ceased to work correctly

I have used the HTML tags for exponentials and footnote numbers in SE posts for a few years now, and it worked as expected. However, the past week (past few days?) I have noticed that they have ceased to work. They make the number smaller, but the raising of the number above the base ...

bug design

humn

Whew, i guess, thanks @Mithrandir!

Deusovi

8:06 PM

Huh! That's weird.

Beastly Gerbil

I'm writing an answer that involves that, hope it gets solved quick

woooah

Mithrandir

@BeastlyGerbil ?

Beastly Gerbil

Is it me or have the edit, flag and vote symbols on your profile activity changed colour to all black?

Sid

Wow. One of my puzzles was closed in 250 seconds.

Lol

Beastly Gerbil

:P

Mithrandir

8:09 PM

@BeastlyGerbil yah, I noticed that earlier

n_palum

Poor Sid

Sid

@n_palum That is the power of the Deus Hammer! But seriously, that was a clear dupe. I never knew it was already asked here.

You wouldn't feel so sympathetic towards me if you see some of my earlier puzzles. They were horrible

n_palum

Everyone starts somewhere!

Mithrandir

Speaking of which, I hit 1,000 helpful flags on SFF today.

Beastly Gerbil

wow! nice

I have just under 240 here

Mithrandir

8:11 PM

@Sid there's always a learning curve

Beastly Gerbil

I don't understand how people get so many flags

ffao

^

I have 1 flag

Beastly Gerbil

where do you get your most flags from @mith ?

obsolete comments? (because I never flag them)

Mithrandir

Oh, @Deus, I was just wondering why my flag on some +1 comments were declined.

@BeastlyGerbil all kinds of comment flags, mostly too chatty

I have a sede query that I use

Beastly Gerbil

can you link?

Deusovi

8:13 PM

Huh, not sure. I just deleted those comments - I wasn't the one who handled those

Beastly Gerbil

Thats why. I think I have 1 obsolete comment flag, and 0 'too chatty' flags :P

Mithrandir

@BeastlyGerbil Nope, mobile

ah ok

i need this?

SO Meta 404?

8:22 PM

Mmm W@ffL3$

Beastly Gerbil

that looks sick. give me one now :P

Ooh we should make a puzzling logo waffle maker

ffao

the problem with that is because of the logo shape containing a large hole, you would be wasting a large portion of the waffle maker surface, which means less waffle

and nobody wants less waffle

3

n_palum

^ #Facts

Forklift

8:47 PM

You could just have the inner part of the logo be the "syrup collection" indentation of the waffle. Everybody wants more syrup.

Beastly Gerbil

puzzling.stackexchange.com/a/51913/18250 This took way too long

But I think its a pretty nice guide to solving ciphers

n_palum

Wow that's a lot of deciphering information

Beastly Gerbil

yes. That took 5 hours to finish :P

n_palum

Geeez

:O 13 rep away from the 2000

Deusovi

...Unfortunately, @BeastlyGerbil, that's a transposition cipher. Your guide only works if letters stay in the same sequence

Beastly Gerbil

8:53 PM

@n_palum no longer :P

@Deusovi do you mean they are asking about a transposition cipher, or I have written bout it when the question asks about other stuff?

I wan't 100% sure what the question was asking

Deusovi

They asked about a transposition cipher

Beastly Gerbil

so like vigenere ?

Deusovi

a keyword transposition cipher involves writing things in a tall, skinny grid and mixing up the columns, then reading them off again - the question also implies that it's Vigenered after that

Beastly Gerbil

ah

Deusovi

so the letters are rearranged - looking at trigrams and bigrams won't work, and looking at letter frequencies at regular intervals won't work either

Beastly Gerbil

8:56 PM

hmm. Well the guide can help solve the second step

Deusovi

then again, as GPR points out, they call it a "polyalphabetic cryptogram" too, which isn't a transposition cipher

Beastly Gerbil

I'm off to bed in a sec, so maybe I'll write some stuff about the transposition methods tomorrow

Deusovi

so I dunno - your guide might be fine for that question if the title was wrong

Beastly Gerbil

The question seems conflicting then

ArtOfCode

@incesterror21 I'm gonna be pretty slow at responding to emails over the next week-ish, just fyi. I'll get it, just might take me a while to get back to you.

Deusovi

8:57 PM

It is :/

Beastly Gerbil

I'll add a note at the top of my answer

Deusovi

Sounds good

n_palum

Maybe transfer your answer to a different question

Beastly Gerbil

what you mean ask a question and answer it myself?

n_palum

Yeah kind of like Deus' guide

Beastly Gerbil

8:59 PM

@deus what do you think ?

Rubio

@BeastlyGerbil Downvoting; this is, obviously, "not useful". ;)

Beastly Gerbil

:P

Sconibulus

I mean, everything except the frequency analysis might be useful

Beastly Gerbil

Not sure whether I should post a new question or just add a note

Sconibulus

well, except that they already know the key length, apparently?

Beastly Gerbil

8:59 PM

The questio might be closed as a dupe though

n_palum

@Rubio I'm gaining on you still, up to 8/40

Rubio

That's cuz people keep giving BG rep instead of me. :( I'm never gonna catch that rascally gerbil

Beastly Gerbil

hehe :P

n_palum

"You've gotta be quicker than that"

Beastly Gerbil

I think this is the first time I've passed you in the monthly rep leagues since you joined @Rubio :P

Rubio

9:02 PM

what can I say. Election time has been a bit of a distraction. :)

Beastly Gerbil

oh and i'm only 60 behind in quarterly leagues now :P

yearly you still have nearly double

Rubio

                 LAST ELECTION  THIS ELECTION
first  1 hours:         91      70
first  4 hours:         165     128
first 12 hours:         225     207
first 24 hours:         260     295
first 36 hours:         282     307
first 48 hours:         303     323
first 60 hours:         345     331
first 72 hours:         395     343
TOTAL VOTES CAST:       416     345 (at 72 hours)

Beastly Gerbil

Anyway I'm off to bed

Night all!

Rubio

Nini

n_palum

Night

Deusovi

9:27 PM

@BeastlyGerbil I don't see an issue with that.

ArtOfCode

10:23 PM