The Comms Room

ewwhite

22:00

@Iain was it just a bad attitude?

Iain

I don't understand why it didn't garner close votes for shopping before it was eligable for a bounty

@ewwhite it's a shopping question

Anonymous

@Jacob >implying my mother has backups

ewwhite

@Iain because he added the product recommendation content after

Iain

did he ?

ewwhite

when he was like, "I'm specifically looking for something that will do X, but I'm ignoring the recommendations for Y and Z"

MikeyB

22:03

@Iain having difficulty keeping swearing out of the title

Iain

@ewwhite revision 1 is a straightforward shopping question

ewwhite

@Iain ah

If only he posted this part - serverfault.com/questions/591560/…

Matthew Ife

I hope this doesn't destroy everything he is doing...

voretaq7

@Iain The Exception is the Rule? :)

Matthew Ife

0

A: How to hide a password passed as command line argument?

This will clear the ps output. BE VERY AWARE: This could break the application. You are duly warned that here be dragons. Foreign processes shouldn't be fiddling around in a processes memory. If the process relies on this region for the password, you may break your application. Doing this coul...

Wesley

22:06

@voretaq7 The computer is the network?

ewwhite

@MatthewIfe you're back!

Wesley

@Iain Things are going to get ugly in that question. I predict a lock forthwith and forsooth.

voretaq7

. . . this is both creative and frightening. — voretaq7 ♦ 19 secs ago

Wesley

Either a semi truck just shredded its gearbox in the parking lot or we just had a small earthquake in Phoenix.

voretaq7

@MatthewIfe It should also go without saying that I heartily disapprove of this solution even though I've upvoted you for your creativity. Next thing you'll be mucking about in /dev/kmem!

MikeyB

22:08

loloops I forgot to edit out the swearing before posting

Anonymous

@MikeyB editing swearing out? where the fuck are you posting at, Arqade?

MikeyB

@PatoSáinz Well the original title was "Fucking piece of shit Windows 7 goddam sysprep"… may have been a bit much.

Anonymous

lol

Matthew Ife

@voretaq7 I didnt say it was 'recommended' :)

Just showing its possible.

> This is an insane hack.

voretaq7

@MatthewIfe . . . I don't consider mucking about in someone else's address space "possible" personally :)

Iain

22:10

Closed and eligible for delete votes :)

voretaq7

@MatthewIfe You should <marquee> that :-)

HopelessN00b Genius of network

@pato ... I've had swearing edited out on here a few times, and even non-swearing. Not just an arquade thing :(

MikeyB

@MatthewIfe You may appreciate serverfault.com/a/575148/2101 as well - not quite as awesome as yours though

voretaq7

@Iain no reason to delete it :)

Anonymous

@HopelessN00bGeniusofnetwork :(

Iain

22:10

@voretaq7 >=-3 is eligible

or is that <=-3 ?

MikeyB

WhoTF upvoted serverfault.com/a/592798/2101? You're fired.

voretaq7

@Iain < -3 I think

ewwhite

Oh no... have the Unix geeks come out to play?

Iain

@MikeyB that whole question is an irrelevant clusterfuck

Wesley

@Wesley I dont think you read that link. It says they can be acceptable, see the paragraph which starts with "However, there is a way to ask these questions that avoids the inherent problems with shopping recommendations..." — matt burnett 3 mins ago

ewwhite

22:12

@Wesley trollsauce

Wesley

Okay, so he links to a post that shows how to ask a shopping question in the right way, says I didn't read it, but his question is exactly how the post says you don't ask a shopping question. What on earth?!

@ewwhite I'm starting to think so.

voretaq7

@Iain there's a legitimate question in there ("How can I obfuscate the command line?")

Iain

@voretaq7 not convined

the application is the problem

voretaq7

@Iain There's been lots of times I wished I could clean up crap from ps output.

Wesley

@MikeyB So many downvotes in those A's

voretaq7

22:13

@Iain ...and that's the correct answer. "Rewrite your shitty application."

Sometimes the answer is No. -- this is one of those times.

ewwhite

@voretaq7 I've had lots of weirdo applications with passwords on the CLI. Interesting hack.

Iain

@voretaq7 yep - mysql does it

MikeyB

@Iain blackberry-signer -bbidtoken <bbid-csk-file> -storepass <password> [<options>] <bar-file> (<key-name>)

voretaq7

@Iain MySQL should never be used as an example of how to do anything :P

MikeyB

Guess what major company is guilty of that mistake. Need to specify the password on the command line for your application signing keys.

Iain

22:14

@voretaq7 except for that - exceptions ... ;)

Anonymous

@MikeyB heh blackberry

Anonymous

where are you working at, 2006?

voretaq7

@Iain at least MySQL cleans up its own command line though (which is a legit thing to do, sometimes)

Basil

@PatoSáinz Hey, blackberry is a perfectly fine handset. Mine does just enough distracting crap that I don't need to have my personal phone, and everything I need it for at work.

Iain

@voretaq7 that's what I was saying

Matthew Ife

22:16

I'm banking on this one being a nice little upvote investment.

Basil

It's not perfect, but it's not terrible either.

Matthew Ife

I've got a few of these knocking about ;)

MikeyB

@PatoSáinz Let me just say that we're selling a lot less hardware these days.

Anonymous

@Basil Until one week ago, my personal phone was a BB Torch 9800

Anonymous

and I say: god I missed out from all the goodness iOS and Android bring

Anonymous

22:16

I do like the Z and Q devices anyway

voretaq7

there's a few other things that do it too - I'm not sure I really approve of the practice

Basil

@PatoSáinz BB10 is on my phone, and it's almost as good as iOS or Android

MikeyB

@PatoSáinz Oh god. That's old school, those devices carry a ton of legacy baggage around. The BB10 devices are light-years ahead. I'll take BB10 over Android/iOS.

Anonymous

@Basil can you flash a ROM on a BB10 device?

voretaq7

strikes me as inviting two "System Idle Process" entries, like on all those Windows machines.

ewwhite

22:17

@MatthewIfe Makes sense.

Anonymous

If that shit ran CyanogenMod i'd be sold

MikeyB

Plus BB10 can run most Android apps (and install them OTA or via Google/Amazon Store) so I'm good.

Basil

@PatoSáinz I've never needed to...

Anonymous

@MikeyB I know

MikeyB

@PatoSáinz No.

Anonymous

22:17

and Blackberry is secure as fuck

Anonymous

but I want costumisation and ricing

voretaq7

@PatoSáinz i wouldn't say that.

ewwhite

Is Blackberry still QNX?

Anonymous

@voretaq7 you wouldn't?

Anonymous

@ewwhite yes iirc

Basil

22:18

@MikeyB What would you say the advantages of BB10 over BYOD OSs are? I've been wondering, but it's enough of someone else's problem that I never asked

Anonymous

BB10 is QNX

Anonymous

@Basil two words. physical keyboard

Anonymous

can you ssh into a BB10 device and get root?

voretaq7

@PatoSáinz BB has had its share of security debacles

Anonymous

@voretaq7 so had iOS and Android

MikeyB

22:19

@PatoSáinz No

Basil

@PatoSáinz they have soft-only. In fact, those are about 10x as popular among people I've seen in the elevators

Anonymous

and yea, you can sell me all that iOS lockscreen bullshit yaddayadda but when you can bypass that with some flicking apps, all's lost

MikeyB

Well… I can bring it over to my friend who works at RIM and he can :)

Anonymous

@Basil the Qs have physical

Anonymous

@MikeyB lol

Basil

22:20

@PatoSáinz yes, that's the one I have

voretaq7

@MikeyB Don't stir shit - now I'm getting flags because you taunted people over flags...

MikeyB

LOL they flagged my message in Mathematics

Anonymous

@Basil don't you find the screen stupidly small?

MikeyB

@voretaq7 It was an awesome message though

Anonymous

@MikeyB lol

Basil

22:20

@PatoSáinz no, I can read emails and reddit...

Wesley

Welp, maybe I'm feeding trolls, but maybe he's just angry and wants to fight, not necessarily causing trouble to watch the world burn:

Anonymous

@Basil still, the aspect ratio fucks a lot of apps

Wesley

1

A: My bounty was returned - Why?

The question is a shopping question because it asks, and I quote: Does anyone know of any RAID cards which can be configured to check the parity of a redundant array every time data is read, and verify all writes with a read to ensure that the data on a single disk didnt become corrupt?...

Basil

I don't ask much from my phone

MikeyB

@PatoSáinz The screen on the Q10 is kinda small for my liking, but the Z30 is freakin' amazing.

voretaq7

22:21

@MikeyB in our context, yes. In their context, idunno.

Anonymous

as i read

Anonymous

@MikeyB indeed

Iain

So why was the bounty returned ?

Basil

@PatoSáinz I knew it would make it harder to do some things, but the things it makes easier to do were worth it (typing)

Anonymous

after i switched to a samsung galaxy siii now I find iPhone <4s screens laughably small

MikeyB

22:21

@Basil The fact that I can plug my Z30 into a USB-Serial adapter, fire up PuTTY and have a serial console: SO DAMN USEFUL

Anonymous

like "holy shit my whole thumb can cover it"

Basil

@Iain Because it was a question that needed to be closed, but couldn't be because of the bounty.

Anonymous

and my canon DSLR live preview screen feels even smaller

Basil

@MikeyB Can anyone do that?

Anonymous

@Basil i fixed that in my galaxy with a custom keyboard

Basil

22:22

Or just people with friends at RIM?

MikeyB

@Basil Yeah. Z30 supports USB OTG

in Mathematics, 6 mins ago, by Alec Teal

@MickLH it's a compiler flag, not a dick, don't take it so hard.

ewwhite

@Wesley Q: What’s the best low light point-and-shoot camera?

Anonymous

now I can touchtype with a screen

Wesley

@ewwhite Your face.

Anonymous

touchtype as you know, from memory, without looking

Wesley

22:22

@ScottPack, DID I DO IT RIGHT?!

Iain

@Basil that would be my guess to - but it would be nice to know definitively

Anonymous

no hunt-and-peck

Basil

@ewwhite Nikon d710

Wesley

@ewwhite And I don't know. =(

ewwhite

@Wesley those two questions are the same

Basil

22:23

@Iain I tried to VTC and was denied because of his bounty, so I opened a flag about it

HopelessN00b Genius of network

@iain well, either return the bounty, or let the question stay unclosable.

Wesley

@ewwhite One is "Give to me list!" the other is "Help me determine objective facts so I can make my own list"

Basil

along with someone else, apparently

Anonymous

@ewwhite what was your dslr?

Wesley

Oh

@ewwhite Yeah, got it. Sorry. =P Fixed!

MikeyB

22:24

@Basil appworld.blackberry.com/webstore/content/64401/…

HopelessN00b Genius of network

I also flagged for bounty abuse, because I wanted to close it...

ewwhite

@PatoSáinz Canon 1D MK4

Wesley

I accidentally a clipboard.

Iain

@HopelessN00bGeniusofnetwork ah - I tried the vtc thing this (utc) morning

ewwhite

or Fuji x100

Anonymous

22:24

@ewwhite fancy, what's your lens inventory?

ewwhite

@PatoSáinz too many

Basil

@MikeyB that link doesn't work for me

Anonymous

@ewwhite so you were a really good DJ and you have all this camera gear

voretaq7

@HopelessN00bGeniusofnetwork I don't really know that it counts as bounty abuse myself - I doubt his explicit intent was to prevent the question from being closed. This strikes me as a defect in the bounty<-->closure interaction though.

HopelessN00b Genius of network

Yeah, if you search MSE you can find a thread about bounty abuse... Only way to close a bountied question is to flag for mod attention to have the bounty returned.

Anonymous

22:26

is being a sysadmin a really good paid job?

voretaq7

(should be Close a question => Return the bounty)

ewwhite

@PatoSáinz mainly 24mm, 85mm, 135mm, 70-200mm, 24-70mm

voretaq7

@PatoSáinz depends on a lot of factors

MikeyB

@Basil appworld.blackberry.com/webstore/content/64401/…

Anonymous

@ewwhite no wide angle?

Iain

22:26

@voretaq7 yes

Wesley

@ewwhite Check out my step-dad's rig a few months ago:

ewwhite

oh, 16-35mm

Wesley

Basil

@MikeyB thanks!!

ewwhite

300mm f2.8?

Wesley

22:27

@ewwhite Not sure, I think it was the 400

Basil

That's going to save me some time

Anonymous

@Wesley DO WANT

Basil

@ewwhite What do you use that for?

Wesley

@ewwhite Pretty sure it was the 400 in that shot. He used a 300 for the eclipse and drove up to Flagstaff all night to get some good shots near the Lowell observatory.

ewwhite

Camera suckers... I'm moving on to some next-generation shit! - Light-field cameras - mashable.com/2014/04/22/lytro-illum

Anonymous

22:28

@ewwhite lytro is just a gimmick

MikeyB

Also, this is IMMENSELY handy: https://appworld.blackberry.com/webstore/content/38050888/?CPID=PRD_BBWSH_twitter
(turn your BB10 devices into a Bluetooth keyboard/mouse/media remote)
Controls anything, Windows, Linux, Android, another BB, …

voretaq7

Anonymous

not practical

faker

serverfault.com/questions/592825/… I was wondering what that guy was going on about. Then I saw the screenshot - he's probably just high

voretaq7

not mine, but I have one on my desk at home

Wesley

22:28

@voretaq7 My bio dad used to use bellows cameras. Not sure what it is with my mom and photographers...

tylerl

@Wesley That setup right there costs more than my car.

voretaq7

@Wesley 's actually a (9x12cm) plate camera

Wesley

@tylerl Oh yes. My SD's camera equipment is rather... substantial. But he's a pro, so that's just part of what it takes to get business.

Basil

@MikeyB I don't have any bluetooth devices I'd want with that... well, maybe my wife's mac, but only to fuck with her

Anonymous

@MikeyB oh i just use iTunes' protocol and the Remote app in Android

Basil

22:30

heh, actually...

Anonymous

alright WinPE finally finished downloading

ewwhite

@Basil Mainly cycling photography - flickr.com/photos/ewwhite/sets

Basil

she's editing a wedding now... maybe I can add some sort of filter when she's distracted

ewwhite

but damn, flickr sucks now

MikeyB

@PatoSáinz So, one app that solves one problem and lets you do one task? Or, the super-generic solution. Yeah.

ewwhite

22:31

@PatoSáinz is it a gimmick?

Anonymous

@MikeyB I only need that

Anonymous

@ewwhite imo yes

tylerl

@Wesley The sticker on the lens says "LOAN"

Anonymous

@tylerl lol

ewwhite

@PatoSáinz :(

MikeyB

22:32

Also, speaking of USB OTG, playing PSX games on an Android tablet with an XBox controller plugged in is AWESOME.

Wesley

@tylerl That specific one was a Canon Professional Member something-or-other that gives him perks like them shipping him lenses free of charge.

Anonymous

@ewwhite I think we discussed lytra back at:

Anonymous

Photography Chat

All-things photography related discussion.

ewwhite

@PatoSáinz interesting

Anonymous

chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/14/2014/4/23

voretaq7

22:35

@ewwhite "now"?

Basil

You could ask a question on meta reopening the debate- either get the policy changed or at least better explained... — Basil 14 secs ago

you're welcome!

ewwhite

@voretaq7 it's completely unusable now.

Basil

/logs off meta

Anonymous

chat.stackexchange.com/search?q=lytro&user=&room=14

tylerl

@Wesley That's up to about $5K for the camera, and about $13K for the lens as pictured.

Wesley

22:37

The blog post says the former is unacceptable because it "provides the path of least resistance: a laundry list of products I can buy without thinking about it too much". The features I listed are very obscure and were could not qualify has having a laundry list of answers. The very fact that no one was able of offering single RAID controller which had those features further proves my point. — matt burnett 12 mins ago

^ HNNNNGG

@tylerl Thereabouts, yeah.

Basil

@Wesley Careful there, breathe through your diaphragm when you're pushing

Wesley

@Basil Am I crowning yet?

ewwhite

Why do you want this? If you're having problems finding a clear solution, it may be indicative of the (low) relative demand for this functionality. It likely doesn't exist. — ewwhite yesterday

Wesley

I WANT AN EPIDURAL!!

tylerl

@Wesley Huh?

Iain

22:42

yesterday, by Iain

@ewwhite I don't know the OPs motivations - some people are just so risk averse that any risk no matter how small is too much

ewwhite

@Iain and buried in the rant, he explained why he wanted this.

Wesley

@tylerl Just being gross. Don't mind me.

ewwhite

but then went all bitch on us.

Iain

@ewwhite did he - I walked away and missed it

voretaq7

@ewwhite "the write hole"? That's bogus.

Basil

22:44

Personally, I don't care about the way he said anything, what bothered me was the implication that this was the right way to do storage

tylerl

@ewwhite - I am aware of file system level solutions such as ZFS, but am trying to avoid them. The host OS is windows, and I am not aware of any mature drivers for it. I am also aware of Microsoft's ReFS which has similar functionality as ZFS, but isnt nearly as mature. As I stated I am looking for a hardware solution which doesn't cost $10k+. And I am aware of the performance penalty which I will incur with verify on write/check parity on read. — matt burnett yesterday

Windows fail strikes again.

Basil

Fundamentally, his problem is that he doesn't know what parity really does

voretaq7

Any decent RAID controller will ensure atomic write actions, and cross-verify reads.

ewwhite

Um... no. I've recently lost data on a RAID 5 due to two disks not failing out right but having excessive bad blocks and one eventually quasi-failing. It still appeared online, but you could tell from the sound it was making it was constantly trying to re-read blocks. This is the very reason I asked this question. –  matt burnett Apr 27 at 5:25

Basil

@voretaq7 That might actually console him a bit- maybe you could explain that to him

Wesley

22:45

@Basil ...and tangentially he doesn't have a proper budget. =(

Basil

@Wesley that on its own wouldn't kill it for me

voretaq7

@Basil I did in my comments on the other answer.

Basil

@voretaq7 ok well I guess if he doesn't believe you, he'll have to live with this imaginary problem

we should advise him to only use raid 3

Matthew Ife

Isn't this kind of like saying 'I want a personal load, I know i've got bad credit, but I dont want to get a loan with a massive interest rate. I went with a loan shark but that ended up badly for me, does anyone else have any suggestions?'

Iain

@ewwhite fakeraid I guess

voretaq7

22:47

at this point I don't care, I've made the point that the "solution" being proposed is bad and wrong. If he implements it, great. If someone else implements it because they didn't read the comments? Tough rocks.

ewwhite

@MatthewIfe yes, it's very close to that.

RAID3 for everyone!

voretaq7

I'm more concerned with the guy being a dick ("I don't care what you guys think" -- Well OK then, get off the site.)

Matthew Ife

Some people dont want an answer. They just want to share their 'problem' and reinforce the idea in their head they have that there is no attainable solution.

Basil

Hey, does anyone know anyone working in IT in switzerland they could introduce me to?

I have questions about the job market out there

ewwhite

@Basil yes

Iain

22:48

and someone should point out that raid != backup so data is only lost through stupidity

Basil

@ewwhite If it's MichelZ, I've already emailed him :P

voretaq7

@MatthewIfe In this case he wants us to reinforce his BAD solution when the problem is already solved for all practical purposes...

ewwhite

@Basil no, I help with a financial trading firm that has a presence there.

voretaq7

I can count the number of times I've lost data do to "silent corruption" in a RAID array (as opposed to the drive being outright marked FAILED) on no hands.

MikeyB

@voretaq7 I only need one hand.

Matthew Ife

22:49

@voretaq7 I have had cheap raid cards not fail disks that were 'bad' but never had corruption.

Iain

@voretaq7 I bet you have good restores though

Basil

@ewwhite Oh that would be perfect! I am not going to try and sell them anything or beg for a job, I'm nowhere near ready :) I just want to find out what I should expect when I do start begging, in terms of language requirements and education requirements. Do you already have my email? It's in my linkedin profile

ewwhite

@MatthewIfe it can happen, but it's not common. At the same time, there are combinations of gear that are worth avoiding.

voretaq7

@MatthewIfe I've never had shitty RAID cards do that. I've had PERCs aggressively fail disks that weren't really a problem though

ewwhite

"I have 22 x 6TB disks in software RAID6 on Fedora X"

voretaq7

22:50

even software RAID has never failed to kill a disk for me.

Matthew Ife

@ewwhite I'll trust you on that. Hardware isn't what I'm good at. Tearing apart software / making software cry / torturing systems. I can do that.

Basil

I can't wait to get my 6TB drives

I'm asking for 200

tylerl

> May 2 10:19:25 server3 smartd[7574]: Device: /dev/sda [SAT], 1 Currently unreadable (pending) sectors

Yup. looks good

Basil

I'm thinking of putting them all in the same raid group. Raid 5, of course

ewwhite

@Basil You can find firms that have Engrish working languages.

Basil

22:53

@ewwhite I speak french too

ewwhite

@Basil Oh, yes... poutine

Wesley

Okay, seriously, am I totally misunderstanding the intent of StackExchange and ServerFault in particular? I mean, really, have I gone off the beam here? Can someone fact check me and see if I'm just insane?

@Wesley, to address your edit the blog post explicitly states that shopping lists are acceptable in certain circumstances. It says they are not acceptable when they could provide a laundry list, but are when I "ask us what you need to learn to tell what you should buy." Since these features are generally not advertised such as Seagate's Verify On Write setting, asking which few vendors do support them does certainly qualify as being acceptable according to the blog entry. — matt burnett 2 mins ago

Basil

and I should have my citizenship in about a year

Wesley

@ewwhite Putain!

Iain

@Wesley yes

tylerl

22:54

@Wesley Verified true.

Wesley

@tylerl Okay I'm insane.

tylerl

Thank you for using SF Insanity Verification Service

Wesley

%_%

ewwhite

@Basil why the change?

Wesley

@Iain Wait, I'm insane? okayface.jpg

ewwhite

22:55

@Basil Would you consider New York?

Iain

@Wesley yes ;)

Basil

@ewwhite Mostly restlessness. Partly that I have roots there, partly because they have a very good school for autistic kids, and partly because of how much money my sister's fiancee makes

he's an engineer, but could afford to buy a beamer in cash with 3 months of salary.

ewwhite

@Basil Understood. I think it's always worth the opportunity.

Basil

tax rate is like 10%

18 or so here

ewwhite

@Basil Do it!

Basil

22:56

but I pay 50% tax

ewwhite

Oh, taxes... forgot about those.

tylerl

@Wesley I imagine he could re-word his question such that it wouldn't be a "tell me what to buy" Q, and would instead be "tell me whether these features are valuable and if they're found in a single product"

Basil

@tylerl Maybe we could edit it for him

tylerl

@Basil or maybe we can just complain

Basil

@ewwhite So do you know anyone there well enough that you'd be willing to ask them whether they'd give me some advice? Email is fine, phone is preferable

tylerl

22:57

<-- votes for complaining

Wesley

@tylerl Yeahhhh, no matter how you slice it what he wants to know is never going to be more than a product recommendation at its heart. Too bad for him. Daniweb is ----> That way.

MikeyB

Oh my god. Does anyone have an Unattend.xml file for Windows 7?

Downloading this friggin WAIK is going to take too long, I want to go home.

Wesley

Insert obligatory "I knew Dani back when!" from @voretaq7

tylerl

@Wesley Back when she was 18, honest!

ewwhite

@Basil let me dig around

Basil

22:58

@ewwhite cool, much appreciated :)

Iain

@voretaq7 can you chuck a temp lock on meta.serverfault.com/questions/6287/my-bounty-was-returned-why please it's going nowhere

Basil

Right now, I'm probably looking at next year or the year after

Photography Chat

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