TRPG General Chat

trogdor

00:15

@BESW yeah it's a pretty cool mechanic

BESW

@trogdor And now I kinda want an Agaptus storyline that's just about Elvorix academic drama.

trogdor

XD

That sounds hilarious

Though I'm not sure how far that can be stretched

BESW

00:30

Yeah, it wouldn't be a long campaign.

trogdor

That seems like a fair assessment

Ben

01:08

@BESW Is there anything in 5e about a pair of extra limbs?

BESW

[...a quick Google later...]

Since Girallon's Blessing and Four Arms are homebrew, I'm guessing there isn't an official-text equivalent.

Ben

Specifically PCs with extra limbs

@BESW Ok cool.. That answers my next question then haha

BESW

And the search "arms -homebrew site:dndbeyond.com" doesn't bring back anything useful.

I don't know much about 5e, but I can do the Googles.

Ben

@BESW Better than the average bear

BESW

It's pretty straightforward if you know the notation and the context. "arms site:dndbeyond.com" got me a lot of homebrew, so I added "-homebrew" and got nothing. Just add inference.

MikeQ

01:15

@Carcer It depends. PF's attacks use different rules depending on whether it's a manufactured or natural weapon. And it gets even more confusing if you combine them.

BESW

Heh. They fixed that in 4e, and then brought it back for 5e?

Ben

I had a PC in DH [cough @MikeQ cough] That had 3 arms. He was able to use his Omnissiah Axe (massive 2-hand axe) His integrated laser rifle and his mechadendrite in one turn

@MikeQ Oh? How is that? I have a Skinwalker Druid so the choice between Natural and Manufactured is something that I would deal with regularly

MikeQ

Ok, when you use manufactured weapons, touch attacks, or improved unarmed strike, you use your iterative BAB. This limits the maximum number of attacks with such weapons.

When you use natural weapons, you have primary and secondary.
- Primary are made at full BAB, and damage uses your STR modifier
- Secondary are made at BAB - 5, and damage uses half STR modifier
- If you only have 1 primary attack, then the damage uses 1.5xSTR instead

You get (up to) one attack per natural weapon

And if you make a full attack with both natural weapons and non-natural-weapons, then your natural weapons all count as secondary

Oh and also there's like 100 different exceptions

BESW

@Piomicron A quick glance at the book suggests an Ars Magica spell with the effect of a casting of diffindo would use a Perdo Technique in a Form appropriate to the target, and usually at least 15, often level 25. See Perdo Terram spells.

For a one-spell-severs-all effect, I think it could be argued that a level 30 Perdo Terram spell could target just about any ordinary inanimate object.

Ben

01:30

@MikeQ ok... So mechanically, if I deal d4+2 damage per attack with my natural weapons, (that's full strength) and I deal d6+1 or 2 damage with my Quarterstaff, if I make a full attack, I am better off with.... the claws?

MikeQ

So your full attack is either:
A) quarterstaff, one attack, average 4.5 damage
B) claws, two attacks, average 4.5 damage each

Ben

Ok. So even if I miss with one of the attacks, I still do ~ as much damage

BESW

@MikeQ How did 5e make it MORE complicated to mechanical/natural attacks than it was in 3.5?

That takes active effort.

MikeQ

@BESW I was referring to Pathfinder above

Compared to 3.x/PF, the 5e implementation is simpler

BESW

Okay, so I feel like that's even worse?

MikeQ

01:37

Why?

BESW

Because with the advent of 4e, Pathfinder was pitched as "improved 3.5."

And I keep running across ways that it's... different? But only in superficial ways that often just increase the complexity of interactions to make feature balance less predictable.

MikeQ

Right, PF was originally meant to be a streamlined, more balanced version of 3.5. And ten years and several hundred splat books later, PF has the same pitfalls and complexity and imbalances as the system it was meant to improve upon.

BESW

From what I've seen, it never removed them in the first place.

Its only claim to greater streamlining was a reduced number of levers to pull, but all the levers still connect to the original unwieldy 3.5 machine. They just swapped out a few gears and slapped a new decal on it.

MikeQ

Agreed. It's a very bloated and cumbersome system. In contrast, I can tolerate 5e.

Ben

I have one friend say the 3.5 is the best, and another that says PF is the best.

But both say their respective favourite is better than 5e.

BESW

01:49

PF has the advantage of being a living system, which is a huge draw for many over 3.5. It's also completely open, which is also a big attraction compared to both 3.5 and 5e.

MikeQ

Living systems are nice in theory

Ben

Bring back Dark Heresy. Lol

MikeQ

But as the system gets bigger, it becomes harder to create new content that is balanced and consistent (relative to what's already there) . New additions to the system tend to break previously established concepts, or at least make them more confusing

V2Blast

Simic Hybrid race has this option at 5th level:
"Grappling Appendages - You have two special appendages growing alongside your arms. Choose whether they’re both claws or tentacles. As an action, you can use one of them to try to grapple a creature. Each one is also a natural weapon, which you can use to make an unarmed strike. If you hit with it, the target takes bludgeoning damage equal to 1d6 + your Strength modifier, instead of the bludgeoning damage normal for an unarmed strike. Immediately after hitting, you can try to grapple the target as a bonus action. These appendages can’t precis…

MikeQ

@Ben Agreed!

V2Blast

01:53

and Loxodon has trunk

BESW

@MikeQ Indeed.

That's one reason I like how Evil Hat is handling Fate, as a set of unconnected minisystems that you can mash together at your own peril if you want (but they provide detailed guides for doing it!).

Ben

@MikeQ Finally accepted your discord request haha. Been kinda slack on that front lol

@BESW did you say you had a PDF of all the cards for LLKoM?

Miniman

02:09

@Ben You know a new version of the WH40KRPG came out last year, right?

BESW

Not yet.

Ben

@Miniman DH 2e?

@BESW Ah ok cool. Just vaguely remember a mention of something along those lines so just wanted to confirm :)

Miniman

@Ben No, that came out 5 years ago. Wrath and Glory, a generic WH40KRPG system, came out last year.

Ben

@Miniman Ohhh...

Miniman

@Ben That said, it's a pretty tremendous departure from the FFG games.

Ben

02:19

@Miniman Does it have the Adeptus Mechanicus as PCs?

Miniman

@Ben Yep - gameplay is divided into tiers. So typical Inquisition Acolytes are Tier 1, along with hive gangers, ork boyz, and so on. Inquisitors are the top (tier 4). Tech-Priests are Tier 3, along with Space Marines, Eldar Warlocks, etc.

Ben

@Miniman Ohh interesting

Shall have to do some investigation

Miniman

I haven't looked into it too deeply - I'd be interested to hear anything interesting you find.

Dice pool with one special die in it is a bit offputting, but I mostly play on roll20 these days, and there it's simple to say the first/last die is the important one.

Ben

Here is a bit of a demonstrative comic on how the system works

cc @MikeQ

The d6 system looks comparable to Fate I think?

MikeQ

Seems more comparable to WoD or Shadowrun - you add up your relevant abilities to determine the dice pool size, then roll and count the number of successes

Miniman

02:32

Was just typing that ^^

Ben

Haha tbf I haven't actually played any of them, I've only seen the fate system in a similar comic haha.

MikeQ

Fate uses 4dF, fudge dice, which have a normal-ish distribution between -4 and +4, and then you add that to one modifier value

Ben

It uses cards..?

ulisses-us.com/wrath-glory-card-previews

BESW

Miniman

@Ben To replace all the "roll on this table" that Warhammer has traditionally used.

Ben

02:41

@Miniman In place of, or as an alternative to?

Miniman

@Ben In place of, I believe.

Ben

Hmm...

MikeQ

@BESW Like I said, normal-ish

Shalvenay

hey there @nitsua60

BESW

Next time I run Fate, I think that for failed actions by PCs I'll ask "What thing outside your character's control led to this not happening the way they wanted?"

Miniman

02:51

@BESW For some reason, this reminded me of Dark Side of the Sun - there are 2 characters with luck as a superpower, so every time someone tries to kill one of them, it fails in some completely ridiculous way.

BESW

@Miniman My brain came up with the tortured simile that they're the Charlie on the MTA of Final Destination.

Miniman

If you've seen Deadpool 2, Domino was pretty close.

Shalvenay

D&D 3.x question: is there a Cleric equivalent to mnemonic enhancer?

Miniman

03:13

The prepare function, the retain function, or both?

Shalvenay

@Miniman the prepare function (basically, the additional temporary spell slots it grants you, if you will)

Miniman

Anyspell is sort of similar.

Shalvenay

@Miniman yeah -- it's close, but not quite there....

Miniman

giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?577910-List-of-meta-spells

Try looking through there?

Hmmm. Triadspell is a similar concept.

Shalvenay

@Miniman will do, thx

@Miniman what in the heck would happen if you used greater anyspell to cast the prepare function of mnemonic enhancer, anyway?

Miniman

03:26

I mean, as long as you're a prepared caster, it seems pretty straightforward.

Shalvenay

@Miniman I suppose it'd give you Cleric slots?

Ben

@Miniman has there been any rp questions about it?

Shalvenay

@Miniman tyvm!

Ben

"it" being wrath and Glory that is haha

Miniman

@Ben Not that I'm aware of.

@Shalvenay Well, Cleric prepared spells.

Shalvenay

03:42

@Miniman yeah, about equivalent for the purposes of what I'm dealing with here

Miniman

@Shalvenay If you mean for Triadspell, a 5th level spell for 2 extra uses of one of your 3rd level spells is a pretty questionable trade.

@Shalvenay What's the goal?

Shalvenay

@Miniman it's a RP thingamabob, not anything tactical :) (has to do with magic-item-making)

Miniman

Ah, right.

Ben