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Carcer
Carcer
4:00 PM
the extent of my actual Warcraft experience is dimly-remembered WC2 and slightly less dim WC3
 
GreySage
GreySage
@Yuuki The other Titans frequently refer to Azeroth as the last titan. The other one we know about was Argus.
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
All Titans are or used to be world-souls, but not all world-souls are Titans.
There could definitely be other world-souls out there.
Azeroth's world-soul is close to becoming a Titan, partly why it's important that it not get corrupted before that happens.
Also, the other Titans refer to Azeroth as the last Titan because they're pretty much all dead and if they didn't stop Sargeras there, then he'd have nothing to stand in his way as he destroys every last world-soul in the universe.
So Azeroth, being their last stand, would effectively be the last Titan because if it falls, there would be nothing to stop Sargeras from killing every other potential Titan.
It's possible that I could be wrong there.
But I'm definitely sure that Titans are not servants of the Light.
 
NautArch
NautArch
@KorvinStarmast That's a pretty big edit you made without hearing from OP.
They haven't responded to any other comments yet.
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
Seems like mostly style/formatting editing.
 
doppelspooker
doppelspooker
that doesn't look like a big edit
notably it's not one introducing anything the author didn't already say themselves
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
4:09 PM
The asker says they want most damage in one attack, but their question body talks about damage per round.
So it's reasonable to assume that they want to maximize a single round of damage, not a single attack.
 
NautArch
NautArch
@doppelspooker the clarification for damage per round over nova is a big edit, though. And they haven't actually said that's what they're looking for (Unless I missed that)
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
So I'd argue that @KorvinStarmast restored the author's original intent.
 
NautArch
NautArch
maybe, but they go on to include one-off resource-dependent increases.
 
doppelspooker
doppelspooker
oh, yeah, returning to "per round" looks correct and corresponds to the original title
if something's unclear, and we don't know if they mean per round or DPR, we need to sort that out while it's closed
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
@NautArch It's a nuance, but they're not trying to maximize DPR but rather maximize a single round.
 
NautArch
NautArch
4:13 PM
@Yuuki Does that make it a nova strike calculation?
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
And it could be argued that there's some slight difference between maximizing a single round vs. maximizing a single attack, given that there's some specific terminology relating to "Attack".
@NautArch I would suppose that it does.
 
NautArch
NautArch
@Yuuki That's what i"m not sure. THey seem to include things in the question that could have it go both ways.
they had per round in the original question along with single attack.
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
In the case that we're not sure, it's probably best that we revert to the original title, which is what happened.
 
NautArch
NautArch
@Yuuki I think I disagree. Original title had both Single Attack and Per Round language.
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
@NautArch So you're saying we should flip a coin and choose one?
 
NautArch
NautArch
4:15 PM
The one attack has been removed.
@Yuuki I'm saying we shouldn't assume on either and leave it on hold until OP tells us what they're asking.
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
@NautArch That's what happened. If you looked at my links, you'll see that revision #3 made an assumption and pruned some language out where as the most recent revision reverted that change.
And you're saying that the most recent revision is wrong.
Or at least that's my understanding.
 
NautArch
NautArch
@Yuuki correct. the most recent revision says nothing about one attack.
and the original did.
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
> Original title: What is the most damage that an Order of the soul knife mystic per round with Phantom Knife?
> Post-Revision 3: What is the most damage that an Order of the soul knife mystic can deal with one attack with a Phantom Knife
> Recent Revision: What is the most damage that an Order of the Soul Knife Mystic can do per round using Phantom Knife
Seems like it was reverted back to the original title to me.
 
NautArch
NautArch
D'oh
i was looking at the 3rd revision and not the original :(
yeah, all good @KorvinStarmast. Mea Culpa.
But we still do need other feedback from the comments to reopen.
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@NautArch I made the edit a while back but our browser went all nutty. My comment asks the OP to clarify; the prose style was rather clunky. I agree with a "close till clarified" approach that has been taken. (That is the "mad editor" in me that comes out when a question is written in less than usable prose ...)
 
NautArch
NautArch
4:25 PM
@KorvinStarmast No worries - entirely my fault. I wasn't comparing against the original question.
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@NautArch Feeling the love, no worries, I do sometimes get carried away when I go into "mad editor" mode. So good to call me on it to check.
 
Sir Cinnamon
Sir Cinnamon
@KorvinStarmast The Mad Editor is Thanos' much less frightening younger brother. However, he's really good at trimming the fat, takes out nearly half the words!
 
Carcer
Carcer
Has anyone really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@SirCinnamon Oh dear, I am not in their league .... Justice or otherwise! 8^o
 
NautArch
NautArch
@Carcer wut?
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
4:27 PM
@KorvinStarmast /me writes all future questions in verse
 
Sir Cinnamon
Sir Cinnamon
Iambic pentameter or it gets closed
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@DavidCoffron There once was a fine min and maxer
Who wanted to kill all things faster
So he asked a long Q
Got an A that was true
And accepted the answer at last ... er ..
 
Xirema
Xirema
@Carcer People don't think the universe be like it is, but it do.
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@NautArch I think he was "useful prose"ing
 
Carcer
Carcer
[submits correction]: "Unsurprisingly, t'was: play a caster"
 
NautArch
NautArch
4:29 PM
@DavidCoffron whooooosh
 
Sir Cinnamon
Sir Cinnamon
There once was a DnD Player / Who wished to be best goblin slayer/ For stats he rolled dice / The results were not nice / and now he's a humble brick layer
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@Carcer Well Played! :) Assistant Mad Editor
 
Trish
Trish
@SirCinnamon and then there was a Kobold named PunPun, that even with these silly stats became a god.
 
NautArch
NautArch
There once was a kobold named pun pun/whose cheese weighed more than a ton/the players persisted/the DM resisted/but in the end all had good fun.
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@NautArch I like // the DM resisted / the players insisted /
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
4:38 PM
@DavidCoffron Something something the implication?
 
Trish
Trish
ok, People, rebuild Pun-Pun in 5e
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@NautArch For meter, suggest either "there was a kobold named pun pun" or 'there once was a kobold, Pun Pun" ... so that the second line has the same rhythm.
 
Trish
Trish
.oO(shoulg pun-pun be a tag of its own?)
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@Trish A Pun Pun in 5e can't exploit the loopholes that the 3.X did ... but with Volo's out, one can try ...
 
Trish
Trish
Do the challenge, Korvin. Try to ascend to godhood at lvl 1.
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
4:42 PM
@Trish wait what. Pun pun was level 1?
 
Trish
Trish
@DavidCoffron yes.
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@Trish id heard about it but never looked up the build. Now I must
 
Carcer
Carcer
refinements to the build brought it down to L1
IIRC it was originally L6 and got whittled down
 
Trish
Trish
12. it was 12
 
Carcer
Carcer
ah yes, so m'wiki says
A wizard in some consternation / Grew tired of enemies' evasion / On two he Held Person / The others cast Slow on / But forgot they were both concentration.
not my finest work.
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
4:46 PM
@Trish In 5e, Bounded accuracy works against that. On purpose. ;)
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
Well, if accuracy comes pre-bound, then all you need to do is make accuracy a deity and now you can summon it without fear of reprisal and make it do whatever you want.
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@Yuuki "You" means "the DM" in such a case, but a player is not empowered to do that at any level, 1-20, in 5e. (Yes, I am being a bit pedantic) Prometheus called, and he objects to your advocating bound deities (damned sending spell: I can't block it!)
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@Trish it can almost be done
Well. I can think of a way to become an actual deity (sort of). You can possess Tiamat
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
@KorvinStarmast Well, if Prometheus would've just left the fire alone, then we wouldn't be dealing with climate change right now. So really, it's his fault for making us sapient.
@DavidCoffron Pretty sure that's unconstitutional.
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@Yuuki Yeah, I guess blaming him works well enough.
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
4:57 PM
Well, I suppose you could always circumvent the 13th by giving Tiamat a 5 year prison sentence.
 
JohnP
JohnP
@Yuuki Prometheus didn't make us sapient. Just warm.
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
Only temporarily.
If he was a real bro, then he would know that giving us the ability to create fire would only keep us warm as long as we had the materials for a fire while lighting us on fire would keep us warm for the rest of our lives.
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@Yuuki woh. That's like really political in a sneaky way xD
 
Yuuki
Yuuki
The NPCs must revolt! Take back the means of EXP production!
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@Yuuki Is there ever a post-industrial D&D where they just use polymorph and revifify to generate experience points?
Wait what? There used to be a closed as not a real question reason?
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
5:14 PM
For an D&D 4e players, was primal, or primordial, the base language for elementals in that version of the game?
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@KorvinStarmast primordial
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@DavidCoffron That was my guess, thanks for confirming. I have now gotten an initial review of all versions of the game, but not found the primal language in any of the base material. (I'll double check BECMI when I get home).
 
GreySage
GreySage
@DavidCoffron Seems to be a combo of "too broad" and "unclear"
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@KorvinStarmast I asked on Twitter FWIW
 
Delioth
Delioth
@DavidCoffron Not that I'm aware of, but there is the Salt in the Wounds setting with the central idea being a city built around a chained Tarrasque that's in a constant state of being butchered and regenerating - effectively generating a roughly infinite amount of food (meat) and materials (Tarrasque bones+hides)
 
goodguy5
goodguy5
5:26 PM
@KorvinStarmast you commented on my meta post about zeroes, that I should mention it in the update rollout thread, but I don't know where that is
 
Delioth
Delioth
It's... neat, if dark
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
5:51 PM
Which D&D 5e Cleric Domain do you think it's better Life (PHB), Arcane (SCA) or Forge (XGE)? If it isn't any of them, Which domain would you choose from all domains?
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@goodguy5 OK, I'll get you a link.
@EnderLook Who else is in your party? Aracna is pretty cool, but I have found life to be very useful in two different parties.
 
Xirema
Xirema
@EnderLook It depends almost exclusive on how your party is composed. If you don't have a dedicated healer, a Life Cleric can be really powerful. If you already have a lot of healing, an Arcana or Forge Cleric can be really powerful.
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@goodguy5 This one, on meta
 
goodguy5
goodguy5
thanks, boo
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@KorvinStarmast The problem is that I still don't have the party. First I have to make my character and then I can join a group. It's a community of players that I found yesterday, all of them play in the same continent like if it were a MMO, quite interesting. So I only know that I will be a Cleric and my brother a Mage.
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
5:55 PM
@DavidCoffron Nice job, taking it to the source. (I am suspecting typo, but will not answer until I look at the old module)
@EnderLook I suggest Life; it is very multi purpose.
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@KorvinStarmast Thanks!
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@EnderLook the spiritual weapon domain spell is handy as heck when you run into resistant to bludg/pierce/slash damage.
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
Ok
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@EnderLook ooh. A cleric question (I've played 28 clerics in 5e so far). Knowledge domain is really good if you can make use of the skills (depends on the story and the GM)
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@EnderLook The only reason I did not recommend Arcana is that your known companion is Mage (wizard?) and has arcane spells covered.
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
5:57 PM
If you want OP, the death domain in the DMG is the way to go. You can double all your cantrips with good positioning and Inflict Wounds does ridiculous damage
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
OP? Operator or Overpowered?
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
All said and done, I loved my tempest cleric, but that wasn't one you asked about.
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@KorvinStarmast Ah, yes, Wizard. In Spanish we call it Mago -> Mage.
@KorvinStarmast I don't like much that domain
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@EnderLook Aha, got it. As to tempest, personal tastes will vary to be sure.
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@DavidCoffron I also liked Knowledge, but, well, I haven't played many parties... so I can't think in which situations its skills could be used
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
6:01 PM
@EnderLook knowledge of the ages is also by far the best channel divinity in any non-pure-combat game. You get any skill proficiency which is super versatile
 
NautArch
NautArch
Am I being too literal in my gemstone description answer?
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@NautArch no. It's fine. the information the OP wants doesn't exist (or would be highly speculative)
I might work up an answer based on adventure modules when I get home but for now that's the best we can get
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
For a Cleric, which start is more important? Wisdom or Charisma? Dexterity or Constitution?
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
Wisdom!
Con!
@EnderLook Sorry if I got overzealous on that one.
 
NautArch
NautArch
@DavidCoffron I definitely don't have enough knowledge of modules or previous edition in whether or not they account for size/weight/color/clarity/durability, etc.
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
6:06 PM
@EnderLook wisdom and con are the most important for a caster-type. Favor strength for a heavy armor domain, favor dexterity for a medium armor combat domain (look at the level 8 ability. If it's divine strike you want a weapon, if it's potent Spellcasting invest in con)
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
And enough strength to wear armor.
 
NautArch
NautArch
But I can tell you in real life it's totally subjective.
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
From the quick build: *You can make a cleric quickly by following these suggestions. First, Wisdom should be your highest ability score, followed by Strength or Constitution. Second, choose the acolyte background.
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@NautArch I have all the books. I'm gonna look at all the treasure and see if there is any consistency in descriptions
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
So?? What needs a Life Clerics??
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
6:07 PM
@NautArch For my money, you seem to have figured it out.
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@KorvinStarmast But what about charisma, isn't used for cleric skills?
 
NautArch
NautArch
@KorvinStarmast I've had to buy two engagement and wedding bands :)
speaking from experience
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@EnderLook That is for a life cleric in the original book. No charisma is not a big need.
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@KorvinStarmast personally, I think the "best" cleric is dex 14 and medium armor. (Lets you invest heavily in other stats) but that all depends on the domain
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
My suggestion to you for cleric: Wis>Con>Str>Int>Cha>Dex
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
6:08 PM
@KorvinStarmast Original Book. Do you mean PHB? Is there a better book?
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@EnderLook no cleric features use charisma. That's the paladin.
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@DavidCoffron yes, if you do not have heavy armor prof, which Life does.
Int for the religion and history skills. Swap Cha nd Int if you want to make more converts
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@KorvinStarmast I think it's better even with heavy proficiency. Investing up to 15 Strength is a lot
 
Sir Cinnamon
Sir Cinnamon
@NautArch I added an answer with a slightly different approach language wise, although it amounts to the same thing really
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
Life Domain, Bonus Proficiency: When you choose this domain at 1st level, you gain proficiency with heavy armor.
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
6:10 PM
@DavidCoffron Oh, I have accidentally mistaken
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@EnderLook yes, both basic rules and PHB have that quick build suggestion.
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@KorvinStarmast yeah, but heavy armor is only good if your going into a weapon build imo (and use the strength anyway)
 
Sir Cinnamon
Sir Cinnamon
@NautArch How quickly would my answer get flagged if i said "All gems are 1 cm across the face. because it seems like a good size"
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@DavidCoffron IMO, you only need 14 Str until later when Plate is affordable. But fair point can be made. With variant encumbrance, you have to boost str.
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
Of, so my stats should be Wis > Str / Con > Dex > Cha > Int ? Which order shall I use? I will use the point buy system.
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
6:14 PM
@EnderLook you chose a race yet?
 
Rubiksmoose
Rubiksmoose
So this question is closed as duplicate of a question closed as unclear. This is not the best situation I think. Also I don't understand OP's comments under their question since nothing of theirs that o can find has been deleted. Anybody have a read on this?
 
Sir Cinnamon
Sir Cinnamon
@Rubiksmoose Unclose the original? It has a well upvoted answer
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@Rubiksmoose the dupe target has two questions both of which have now been asked today. I think we should edit out the deity question from the dupe target and then reopen
 
Delioth
Delioth
@SirCinnamon If nothing more... it technically would meet the parameters from the question - it's not a table, per se (though it would be a trivial conversion to a table), but it otherwise conforms to parameter #3, as "thoughtfully written homebrews" (with no further definition of "thoughtfully")
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
I commented saying such
 
Sir Cinnamon
Sir Cinnamon
6:17 PM
@Delioth I've thought about it - and considering the unrealistic standard of all gems of one type costing the same it adds no level of unrealism so... thoughtful
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@DavidCoffron Still not. I'm between Hills Dwarf (+2 Con, +1 Wis), Mountain Dwarf (+2 Con, +2 Str) or Half-Orc (+2 Str, +1 Con)? Half-Orc has interesting abilities, but it's still an ugly Orc! Sadly, any Elf hasn't useful stats for clerics
 
Rubiksmoose
Rubiksmoose
@DavidCoffron I think this is a good option but it would change some of the answers technically.
But not that I think this would mean we shouldn't do it, I just think it's worth noting.
 
GreySage
GreySage
@EnderLook From a practical standpoint, you should be looking into races with a bonus to Wis, it's your most important stat
 
Rubiksmoose
Rubiksmoose
I'm not sure that we have any policy against it but I really don't think we should dupe questions to chased questions no matter the reason.
(as a side note)
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@GreySage Yes, but Woods Elf (+2 Dex, +1 Wis) has a +2 that isn't useful for a cleric
 
Delioth
Delioth
6:20 PM
@EnderLook Dex is always useful, even if it's not optimal
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@EnderLook what books are you allowed to use? There are some less "ugly Orc" options in other books
@Rubiksmoose might be worth a meta
 
GreySage
GreySage
@EnderLook Dex is good for AC, initiative, and attacking if you use a ranged or finesse weapon
All of which can be useful to clerics, depending on how you choose to build it
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
Any printed WoTC book. 
Player's Handbook (PHB)
Elemental Evil Player’s Companion (EEPC)
Sword Coast Adventurer’s Guide (SCAG)
Volo’s Guide to Monsters (VGM)
Xanathar’s Guide to Everything (XGE)
 Mordenkainen’s Tome of Foes (MToF)
Lost Mine of Phandelver(LMoP)
Hoard of the Dragon Queen(HotDQ)
The Rise of Tiamat(RoT)
Princes of the Apocalypse(PotP)
Out of the Abyss(OotA)
Curse of Strahd(CoS)
Storm King's Thunder(SKT)
Tales from the Yawning Portal(TftYP)
Tomb of Annihilation(ToA)
Dragon Heist(WDH)
Dungeon of the Mad Mage(WDotMM, DotMM)
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@EnderLook I've made many dexterity based clerics that are very good. If you want to play a wood elf, don't let the +2 DEX stop you
 
Rubiksmoose
Rubiksmoose
@DavidCoffron good idea.
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
6:23 PM
A medium armor build works fine with that (as 12 Dex +2 race is pretty good since it doesnt require additional investment like in the point buy)
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@DavidCoffron Ok, will think about that. I love the Elf "idea", they live so much and are so refined!
 
Delioth
Delioth
@DavidCoffron Additionally, D&D is usually not set up to be so difficult that perfectly optimal moves are always required
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@Delioth But them are always advisable, no?
 
Delioth
Delioth
5e especially with the idea of Bounded Accuracy making a sub-optimal character really close to an optimal character
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@DavidCoffron But being a Life Cleric, shouldn't I use heavy armor?
Ah, quick and unrelated question: Can a High Elf and a Wood Elf be brothers or step-brothers?
 
Delioth
Delioth
6:26 PM
@EnderLook Not really, no. Play what you want- it's a Role-Playing-Game - note how Role-playing is 2/3 of the name. The system exists to empower people to collectively tell stories that are interesting. Telling a good story is more important than having the right numbers - play something that's fun to play, not necessarily something that has the best rolls (role-playing vs roll-playing)
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@EnderLook if you do go wood elf a point buy of 9/12/14/12/15/10 is what I would do.
@EnderLook heavy armor is only slightly better than medium armor and requires more strength investment
As a life cleric you don't really want to be in the front lines since you want to stay alive If possible to heal allies so I recommend a ranged weapon anyway (dexterity makes that better)
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@DavidCoffron In which order? This (Point buy calculator)
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@EnderLook yeah.
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@DavidCoffron But that consumes ammo. Is that expensive?
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@EnderLook not really
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
6:28 PM
Can I always recover my ammo if I win the battle?
 
Delioth
Delioth
@EnderLook For future reference, Str/Dex/Con/Int/Wis/Cha is the standard order (and has been for... a long, long time)
 
Sir Cinnamon
Sir Cinnamon
@EnderLook 50% by default iirc
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
And you can recover half your ammo after combat by spending 1 minute
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@Delioth They aren't even in alphabetic order? That will be difficult to remember!
 
Sir Cinnamon
Sir Cinnamon
 
GreySage
GreySage
6:30 PM
@EnderLook They are split into 3 'physical' scores and 3 'mental' scores. Beyond that, they are only 6 items in a list
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
Isn't bad a 9 in strength for a cleric?
 
Delioth
Delioth
@EnderLook Not if your goal isn't to hit people with a big stick
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@Delioth Oh
 
NautArch
NautArch
@SirCinnamon I think i'm going to close this as opinion-based :(
or VTC
 
Delioth
Delioth
@EnderLook You'll get used to it if you stick with it. I'm not 100% on why they're in that specific order, other than the 3xPhysical/3xMental ordering
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
6:31 PM
@DavidCoffron Why 10 in charisma and not less?
 
Sir Cinnamon
Sir Cinnamon
@Delioth Heavy armour for some subclasses
 
Delioth
Delioth
@SirCinnamon Right, I always forget about the Strength restrictions on armor. I have... less play-experience with 5e than I care to admit (notably, mostly using unarmored characters)
 
Sir Cinnamon
Sir Cinnamon
@NautArch It's a pretty silly question, so I respect that vote but I probably won't vote as well - It's a question with a mostly flawed premise but theres a valid question underneath of it all (i think)
@Delioth It's a speed penalty, which isnt the end of the world for a cleric who intends to be in the back but it's something to consider
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
@Delioth Rarely comes up. Not a lot of Dex melee characters that want to wear heavy armor.
 
Delioth
Delioth
Aha, I've found the source of the ordering (it's historical, of course). It used to be Str/Int/Wis/Dex/Con/Cha at first - because that listed the Prime Requisites for Fighter, Magic User, Cleric, and Thief in order, followed by the two "general" stats. Then 2e just pushed Dex/Con over 2 slots to the current order, to keep "physical" and "mental" stats separate (keeping the order otherwise)
Attribute (role-playing games)
An attribute is a piece of data (a "statistic") that describes to what extent a fictional character in a role-playing game possesses a specific natural, in-born characteristic common to all characters in the game. That piece of data is usually an abstract number or, in some cases, a set of dice. Some games use different terms to refer to an attribute, such as statistic, (primary) characteristic or ability. A number of role-playing games like Fate do not use attributes at all. == The nature of attributes == There is no uniform consensus on what ability scores are, even if many role-playing games...
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
6:37 PM
@Delioth Impressive
 
Delioth
Delioth
Hasn't been changed since, because it's sensible as any and doesn't really have a good reason to change (there were attempts across the years, I think in 3.x days, to add another stat "Comeliness" to describe looks; it didn't take off though)
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
@Delioth 1st ed didn't even have a character sheet example. That just was the order they show up in the rules.
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
About Life Cleric divine punch skill, does that also work with range attacks?
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@EnderLook I'd suggest Hill Dwarf. Point buy SDCIWCh as 12 14 12 8 15 11. With Hill Dwarf bonuses, you get 12, 14, 14, 8 16, 1. You also get an additional HP per level. It's a good start, and you can mix and match Int Cha to your taste (9/10, or 11/8, if you like).
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
Also, someone knows why David Coffron suggested me to use 9/12+2/14/12/15+1/10 (+ due race)? He told its for Ranged cleric, but I don't understand why not switch Str and Chr. In the case I wanted a melee cleric, which change shall I do?
@KorvinStarmast Ok, I will also think about it
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
6:43 PM
@DavidCoffron has a point about dex. When you have chain shirt or breast plate, and a shield, you get the AC bonuses, and your initiative boost does not hurt either.
 
Delioth
Delioth
@EnderLook You can always play a melee cleric with a Finesse weapon
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
@Delioth Careful: life cleric has only simple weapons proficiency.
 
Delioth
Delioth
So.... Dagger.
 
NautArch
NautArch
@SirCinnamon I think the question is valid, but we're getting invalid responses.
and that can lead to closing
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@Delioth Oh, I had forgotten that. But sadly only daggers are finesse simple weapons. Clerics can't use martial weapons
 
Delioth
Delioth
6:45 PM
Gah, this discussion is reminding me why I'm not a huge fan of 5e. It's simple and fun to play sometimes, but there just aren't a bunch of options for a lot of decisions
Like simple finesse weapons
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@EnderLook you can switch STR and CHA. I put 9 on strength because Medium Armor Master might be a choice you make later which gives +1 Strength
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@DavidCoffron Medium Armor Master? A feat? Clerics can already use medium armor
 
Sir Cinnamon
Sir Cinnamon
@NautArch yeah, because it's basically 3 questions - Is there a standard size on this table? ("no") Is there a gem described that gives both a size and price to anchor those tables to a gem and assume a standard size? (I dont think so) Is there a homebrew size i can choose? ("Yes, literally anything you want")
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@Delioth even if there were other simple nd inesse weapons, they would still be a d4. Any more would be unbalanced
 
NautArch
NautArch
@SirCinnamon Yeah, we'll see how it continues. For now, I think the answers that OP needs are there, just not the answer OP wants.
 
Delioth
Delioth
6:49 PM
There might be the option for e.g. Elven racial weapons? I only have the reference for High Elves which get Shortswords as a proficiency (among others), so I'm unaware if others gain proficiencies as well
(or other races, I guess)
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
@Delioth shortsword is finesse!, I think
 
Sir Cinnamon
Sir Cinnamon
@NautArch Agreed. It's a weird situation imo
 
Delioth
Delioth
@EnderLook It is, that part I verified
 
Ender Look
Ender Look
Well, I've to go to a meeting. I'll later think about my options, it's too difficult!
Bye!
 
Delioth
Delioth
I just can't find a reference for whether Wood elves get proficiency (roll20 compendium appears to only have High Elves)
 
NautArch
NautArch
6:50 PM
@Delioth The dagger and dart are simple finesse weapons.
 
Delioth
Delioth
And I don't actually own any 5e content because I'm still not sold on the system
 
David Coffron
David Coffron
@EnderLook if you go wood elf you get short swords
@Delioth I think all elves get some kind of weapon proficiency
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
@Delioth Which systems do you play with?
 
Delioth
Delioth
@ColinGross 3.5e a while back, Pathfinder and its 2e playtest more recently (and also some Fate)
Which is probably why 5e feels so restrictive
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
@Delioth What about it feels restrictive compared to PF ?
 
Delioth
Delioth
6:53 PM
Mind - it's a fun enough system if people are running it and it's solidly designed; the system is brilliant. I just don't like it
@ColinGross The big one is that you get either a feat or ability score increases, at longer intervals, and only a few features (at least for what I've played in 5e) that differentiate my barbarian from that one over there
Especially with the huge amount of customization in the playtest of pathfinder, where you get 1.5 feats per level
Growing as a 5e campaign proceeds just feels like there aren't a bunch of things I get to choose - there are features I get and a few choices I make... but characters all feel really same-y
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
@Delioth Lack of mechanical differentiation between characters. I can see that.
 
NautArch
NautArch
@Delioth I think that's a legitimate concern because I think that's a design intent.
 
Delioth
Delioth
@NautArch Yeah, it's definitely the intention of the system; and it does a solid job of keeping things balanced... I just don't like it
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
@Delioth you like a large number of choices for mechanical stuff. Have you tried Shadowrun?
You can literally choose to have mechanical stuff inplanted in your character!
and magic
and orcs
 
Delioth
Delioth
@ColinGross I haven't, I'm somehow at a severe lack of gaming groups around me while living in one of the top few cities in the US
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
7:01 PM
@Delioth top city? like Minneapolis?
 
Delioth
Delioth
My only current group (with first real session tonight) is online with my brother and buddies
@ColinGross Close, Chicago
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
Oh... homicide rate.
 
Delioth
Delioth
I should move to Minneapolis though. I have a brother near there and my wife doesn't like Chicago
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
I was in Chicago a couple weeks ago. I'll be back in the winter time to run some games when the city shuts down.
My wife likes to visit Chicago, but I get "lake effect glaring" when I posit moving there.
There are many friendly gaming groups in Minneapolis.
They're nearly Canadian... or as friendly as Canadians were famed for being before the legalized pot.
 
Delioth
Delioth
Yeah, I was hyped for a bit finding a PFS group on my train route home, but they stopped doing Pathfinder at that gaming store for.... reasons? The staff weren't sure of why, just that they knew the group hadn't shown up for a few weeks
 
The Oracle
The Oracle
7:05 PM
1
Q: How should we sort out this question that is duplicted to a closed question?

RubiksmooseThis question has been closed as a duplicate of a question that has been closed as unclear. However that leaves us now with a question that cannot be answered in either place. What should be done in this case to allow the question to have a valid place to live on this site?

discussion specific-question closed-questions duplicates
2
Q: Should we ever duplicate a question to another closed question?

RubiksmooseSometimes questions get closed as duplicates of questions that are already closed. Is this something we should be doing? The purpose (as I understand it) of duplicate closure is to make sure that a discussion of a certain topic has one place to live on the site and is not divided or duplicated in...

discussion duplicates closing-questions
 
Delioth
Delioth
And the on-line organization systems I was pointed towards... weren't helpful. I don't know if it's just my own incompetence or if they're actually bad.
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
@Delioth I stumbled into a gaming shop in Evanston while a friend and I were killing a few hours. They had a lively amount of activity for a Thursday evening.
 
Delioth
Delioth
@ColinGross Yeah, we're considering moving up to Evanston. We're not quite that far out (awkward band far enough from downtown but not to the 'burbs, where rent is cheap)
There's not a gaming shop within walking distance for me, which is sad. Best bet is a few blocks to a train and then down a few stops
But I digress; we've been here less than a year, so moving wouldn't be great for either of our careers in the very near future. Maybe a year or so and I'll consider it
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
Evanston was a hike to get to, but at least there was an express cta line. Also a metra train, but I didn't get a chance to try that.
 
Delioth
Delioth
Yeah, Purple line is good when it's running (it only runs to the loop during peak/rush hours - a few hours in the morning, a few hours in the afternoon)
Metra is higher quality and quicker (fewer stops), but it's notably more expensive
(on the order of 50% more for a monthly pass, and trains only coming every hour or so makes it inconvenient at times)
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
7:17 PM
Hmm.... if I had 1.5 million in cash laying around, I could avoid both and buy a small place downtown.
Still better than the prices on the East or West coasts... but still pretty nuts.
 
Delioth
Delioth
Hehehe, this is the city; it's rent or bust for the most part for exactly that reason
 
GreySage
GreySage
@ColinGross Man, I wish I lived somewhere 1.5 million would buy a place.
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
@GreySage Maybe move to the flyover midwest area
It's nice. No hurricanes. No earthquakes of appreciable magnitude.
 
GreySage
GreySage
@ColinGross You mean the centre area?
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
Kinda like that, but on the correct side of the Atlantic.
 
Delioth
Delioth
7:19 PM
Yeah, if you go to Iowa, houses are cheap. One year of my wife's salary would buy a pretty nice house (fully paid, not down payment)
Other places in the Midwest are similar
 
GreySage
GreySage
I keep telling my wife we'll need to move to Alberta if we want to buy a house
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
@Delioth There's a couple of pharma/biotech jobs in Iowa that my friends and I watch because they get posted every few years. They're always above market rate... because it's difficult to get anyone that can do the job to move to Iowa.
@GreySage Gotcha... Canadian.... the correct side of North America. Are you supposed to be smoking all the legal pot this week? I just caught the headlines and the link pointed me to Super Troopers 2 on Amazon.
 
GreySage
GreySage
@ColinGross uh... apparently?
I missed that I guess
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
It was on the BBC front page for North America. Google helpfully put it right under some post from reddit for me.
 
GreySage
GreySage
Funny, there is 1 legal pot store in BC now (in a city several hours away from me), but there are hundreds of older illegal stores nearby.
Apparently criminals convicted of marijuana possession are going to be pardoned if the amount would have been allowed under the new laws.
 
Colin Gross
Colin Gross
7:32 PM
@GreySage That seems like a reasonable course of action.
 
KorvinStarmast
KorvinStarmast
7:57 PM
Well, I found what I was looking for on the gem question, but it's in a very old Dragon Mag article form 1977. Sigh. Not digitally available, as I never bought that CD with nearly all Dragon Articles when it came out. (Had put the hobby aside at the time ...)
 
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