TRPG General Chat

Miniman

07:03

@doppelgreener Sorry for all the pings.

@doppelgreener And for the additional ping incurred by apologizing for all the pings.

And for- no, I'm done.

doppelgreener

@Miniman There is a crystalline lizard monster thingy in the starting area that drops a weapon upgrade component if you beat it.

Miniman

@doppelgreener Oh, that thing. Does it sound arrogant if I say that didn't seem secret or like a miniboss?

doppelgreener

@trogdor I have!

trogdor

ok, then my memory has not betrayed me,.... this time

doppelgreener

@Ben I've played dark souls 1 and 3 and Bloodborne, and a bit of 2.

Miniman

07:07

@doppelgreener I didn't realise you hadn't actually beaten 2!

doppelgreener

@Miniman I played enough of 2 to decide I don't like 2. D': I've beaten #1 and I'm close to the ending of #3 and of Bloodborne.

Miniman

@doppelgreener Yep, that's totally understandable - I had a similar experience with SotFS (as we've discussed in the past). I'm surprised to hear you haven't finished off Bloodborne and 3, though - I get the impression you like them, so I'm guessing it's just lack of time?

BESW

@Miniman Sounds of the Fan Service?

doppelgreener

@Miniman Yeah, pretty much.

@BESW Songs of the Fan Service.

Miniman

@BESW Scholar of the First Sin - a Dark Souls 2 remake which, in my opinion, doubled down on most of the problems with Dark Souls 2.

They went on to do it again, too.

BESW

07:12

Ah, Screams of the Flopped Sequel.

doppelgreener

The deal breaker for me was the enemy removal mechanic.

@BESW Yes that one :)

Miniman

"Oh, the Silver Knight archers in Anor Londo were an iconic part of Dark Souls 1, so let's remake Anor Londo with so many archers that players won't even be able to do anything except sprint helplessly through."

"Yes this is good game design and will definitely be popular why are we even still talking about this."

BESW

> Sprint Helplessly. You can move twice as many zones as normal with a successful Overcome action, but until your next turn you must defend against any attack made into any zone you moved through, in addition to the attack's intended target.

doppelgreener

> Sprint helplessly. You may move through up to three zones while ignoring all attacks made into those zones, but for each zone you must take a consequence, and for the consequence you must fill your consequence slot with capital letter A's. Lots of them.

trogdor

lol

Miniman

07:18

I think a big factor in many of the series' design decisions that I would consider poor is the belief that extreme difficulty is Dark Souls' "thing".

trogdor

that certainly doesn't seem to be the only "thing" the series has

BESW

> Help Sprintlessly. You can automatically succeed with style on an action to help another character, if you fill your lowest consequence slot with an aspect representing why your cell phone doesn't work.

Miniman

I'm not denying that high levels of difficulty are an important part of the experience that makes Dark Souls awesome, of course. I just think that "make it as hard as possible" is a design goal that doesn't lead to good outcomes.

doppelgreener

@Miniman In no. 2 or others?

@Miniman I agree

trogdor

@doppelgreener I think he is just generally saying that only shooting for difficulty is missing the overall point of Dark Souls

Miniman

07:22

@doppelgreener In general - the changes they made in SotFS and in 3's version of Anor Londo are both examples.

@trogdor Yep!

trogdor

:)

doppelgreener

@Miniman gotcha

Miniman

I mean, not least, in the original Anor Londo you can't just sprint through. Even the speedrunners have to take a moment there. Whereas the new one basically eliminates interesting gameplay in favour of just running.

BESW

07:37

> We Can't Stop Here. Whenever you enter a new location, you can create an aspect describing why it's not a safe place to linger, with one free invoke.

Miniman

07:58

Thinking about it, I think it's fair to say that Anor Londo is an extreme example of a phenomenon that's taken place throughout the series. The first game has a lot of emphasis on single enemies who, thanks to incredibly specific placement, completely screw you over even though there's only one of them. As the series has progressed, it seems to me that it's moved away from that and more towards "you put a toe across this scripted line, now you're fighting a whole bunch of guys at once".

Ben

I have one word for you: poise

Miniman

08:10

@Ben Keep talking...?

Ben

08:22

It means nothing anymore. The only armour that's worth a damn in that respect is Havel's and maybe one or two other sets. But otherwise it's just "congratulations, this set of plate mail gives you 3 poise".

doppelgreener

08:35

@PurpleMonkey FYI the comment flagging dialog has changed. :) The old middle three reasons got merged together since they were functionally the same.

@Miniman I can think of a couple of issues along those lines from DS3, though I took them as a reasonable challenge, and usually they follow the conservation of ninjutsu rule.

Miniman

08:50

@doppelgreener I'm not saying they don't make reasonable challenges, just that I find them to be a less interesting type of challenge.

doppelgreener

@Miniman gotcha

Purple Monkey

09:10

@doppelgreener Ah, excellent, thank you. I thinking of raising a meta about it soon but I guess now I don't have to :,D

doppelgreener

\o/

eimyr

09:53

yo

kviiri

10:23

1

Q: How can I show, that character knows how to handle only one specific weapon?

For example, my character has Big Gun and has +4 bonus when attack using it. Any other weapon doesn't grant him any benefits. Do I need to use skills, aspects or stunts?

Not a Fate expert so I won't answer that, but I'm curious about this - isn't usually the way to do this to give the character an aspect like "Master of the Blade, the Whole Blade and Nothing but the Blade", invoke it when they use "The Blade" and compel when they try to use something else?

BESW

Hmm. I'm pretty sure we've covered that in another question.

kviiri

10:38

@BESW How would you do it? As far as my RPG acquaintances go, you're quite solidly the lead authority on Fate.

BESW

There's a ton of different ways to do it.

Probably the easiest is to make it a stunt, either a character stunt representing that this character is especially good with Big Guns, or an item stunt (extra) representing that this Big Gun is especially good for whoever wields it.

Trish

Could it be a rarely enforced "flaw" that he can't handle any other weapon?

BESW

Yes, but that would be... messy and I'd question what narrative it's supporting.

Basically he'd dump a lot of points into a skill AND dedicate an aspect slot to saying that he can't use the skill in most situations, then milk not using the skill for fate points by compelling the aspect.

Trish

unless one looses the weapon all the time, it would be pretty much irrelevant, yes.

BESW

If somebody came to me with that in a game, I'd ask 'em why they're making life harder than it needs to be.

But yes, technically that would work too.

kviiri

10:44

Yeah, that sounds a bit bad.

BESW

Fate asks "What's the story?" and then finds the mechanics which fit it. Often multiple mechanics will fit, and the group can pick which they prefer.

Trish

I mean, as long as his speacial weapon is available and he can use it, he can use it - the whole flaw thing doesn'T even apply. Then he looses it, and he starts to milk fate points, spending some to get another M16 (if that was his weapon to beginwith)

The narrative it supports? he wastes guns... :/

BESW

> Only Big Guns Please. You get +4 using Shoot to attack with guns that require both hands to pick up.

or....

> Trouble: Fat trigger finger.
Shoot +4

> Big Fancy Gun. This gun grants +4 when using Shoot to attack with it.

> Aspect: A Derringer Broke My Heart.
Shoot +4

nwp

> Repeated Aspect Posting. +5 to disruption when used to split a chatroom into Fate supporters and DnD players.

(it's a joke, not intended to make you stop posting aspects)

Asteria

Greetings

BESW

10:54

[wave]

eimyr

hello

long time no see

BESW

> Poe's Lawyer. You get +2 when using Rapport to sow confusion on the Internet.

Asteria

hows everyone doing

BESW

@nwp So long as people continue to ask questions about D&D 5e without specifying either system or edition, I will be guiltless about writing stunts inspired by their woes.

2

@Asteria Better than last week! So there's that. What's new?

kviiri

@Asteria Great, thanks :)

Wow, the main site's review notifier is showing five review items for me! It's like Stackoverflow in here!

eimyr

11:00

> Struggle against mainstream. When bucking against the flow of the discussion roll +wit. On 10+ you post something appreciated. On 7-9 your post is noticed and choose one: your post is criticised, your post is misunderstood, your post is only noticed after a long time. On a miss the room moderator might offer a painful truth, a pointed reprimand or a hard bargain.

nwp

> Annoy BESW with DnD 5e assumption. Gain a new aspect.

eimyr

I dislike it when people use "trigger" as a synonyms of "annoy" or "provoke". It's not what it means.

@Asteria quite well, thank you. How about you?

nwp

But that is too long. The aspect name has to be short. I think.

eimyr

how about "Annoy BESW"?

nwp

That would have been better, but too late now.

BESW

11:04

> Ruin a word. At each significant milestone, choose a word and explain how the world of the game has come to assign it a new and baffling meaning.

eimyr

@BESW You should be playing Dialect instead Gain +2 to Lore whenever you gain a new Extra.

BESW

> Pedant sniping. You can use Provoke instead of Rapport to overcome a social obstacle if you misuse a word while doing so.

eimyr

Honestly, @BESW, my PbtA post was neither appreciated or noticed, I think I deserve at least a painful truth, a pointed reprimand or a hard bargain.

BESW

@eimyr You can either languish in obscurity confident in the purity of your solitary exercise, or re-write your post in a system the chat's more familiar with.

eimyr

A hard bargain then. I shall not yield, even at the cost of being overlooked.

Asteria

11:17

I'm great! Going to GM my first game tomorrow evening, a Call of Cthulhu session. Super excited!~

decided I'd jump on and what with everyone while prepping my materials

eimyr

Amazing! Well done!

I've never had a chance to play CoC. How's the prep going?

Asteria

@eimyr well so far! All of my players have no RP experience, so I'm making character "reminder" cards and inspiration tokens so I can reward good RP attempts.

going to be a fairly lax game but should be fun

eimyr

You don't seem to be very stressed. I remember I was shaking before my first GM attempt - but then, I was 16 and completely unprepared. It's good.

BESW

Very cool.

Asteria

haha I'll be stressing more by tomorrow, I'm already super unable to sleep xP

eimyr

11:24

I'm sure you'll do well. The first game is always about feeling whether the group likes the game at all, rather than an exercise in GM virtuoserie. Is that an IRL or online game?

Asteria

IRL game, since I'm currently living at a ski resort for work it's just with some workmates.

eimyr

Fancy work then, sending you to ski resorts.

Asteria

haha nah just computer tech. It's only an itty bitty resort, like 2 hours from where I live normally.

The mountain is only like, 40 meters above the minimum requirements to be qualified as a mountain. Nothing fancy here

should make for a good game though, sitting by a fire

BESW

What's your cutoff for mountainhood?

eimyr

Is your game set in a remote ski resort deep in the wilderness of Mount Spookcragge with scarce provisions and a host that looks a bit fishy?

kviiri

11:29

Wow, that sounds like it should set an impressive atmosphere for RPGs.

Asteria

@BESW It's 1,500km, roughly

eimyr

...I think you might be on Mars

Asteria

wow that k is not supose to be there

try 1,500m

eimyr

:D

Asteria

I mean....yeah...my mountain is on mars

kviiri

11:32

Hey, in my country at least the comma is a decimal separator, so that'd be just 1,5 km :)

BESW

....Yeeeeah, the highest spot on my island is just over 400m.

eimyr

... how did I not notice that?

Well, my parent's house is on 1112 above sea level, so not quite there yet.

Asteria

@BESW INFINITE ROLEPLAYING POWER ...... itty bitty island

Jeez that just shows our tiny the mountain is

eimyr

nah, it's appreciable height

you can totally have a FIS-approved facilities on 1540m

kviiri

Back when I was a kid, my idea of a large hill was a 20 meter high landfill mound.

(40 meters from sea level)

Asteria

11:37

@kviiri itty bitty hills make the best napping spots

kviiri

@Asteria That one doesn't, people from all around the town come to the hill for sledding in the Winters and teenagers get drunk there in the Summertime :P

I guess the latter is mostly because there's only one way to get to the hill by car, so it's easy to notice if the police are coming and evacuate the booze immediately to the woods nearby.

Asteria

@kviiri teenagers scare the living hill outta me

kviiri

I was in one of those parties once, although I abstained from alcohol strictly before reaching the age of majority. The view was nice, the people less so :P

@Asteria But luckily, there's a much more serene forest next to the hill, plenty of good napping spots there :)

Asteria

@kviiri I am of the belief that such scenic hills exist purely to nap on

kviiri

@Asteria :)

trogdor

12:26

I am too afraid of heights for that

something low to the ground for me thanks

though to be fair, I do like the view from a height up place to see the sunset from, some advantages there

but not for sleeping XD

BanjoFox

wouldn't a hill still be considered "ground"?

trogdor

@BanjoFox you may be technically correct there, but you can still fall from it XD

BanjoFox

very true

kviiri

I'm very afraid of heights too, but it somehow varies on the style of heights. I'm much more spooked by trees than rocks, for instance.

Completely irrational in the sense that a good tree has lots of branches to securely grasp, while rocks are slippery, uneven and harder to grab.

trogdor

@kviiri same here really, like being on a plane, despite the fact that it is possibly the highest point I have ever been on, is not as bad as being up a really tall building

probably because I can't see the ground

kviiri

12:37

I associate a plane with secure ground, so it's not really worse than being upstairs for me, at least for industrial-size jets.

As for the smaller propeller planes, they are a lot more shakey and get me unnerved. Still not as bad as being high up in a tree, though!

trogdor

@kviiri I was on a plane we call an "island hopper" around here

it was not the sturdiest thing, but it was flying lower and for not as far, and strangely enough had more space for us

so it was actually still better than most planes I have been on

it was like, a 30 minute flight

which for me is soooo much shorter than any other flight I have been on

typically to go anywhere I have flown to it takes 9-12 hours of flight from here

kviiri

Heh :)

You live in Guam too?

trogdor

best bonus there is for me is to shorten the flight time

@kviiri indeed

kviiri

Neat!

trogdor

it's a neat place to live

the only major downside I have found is how long I have to fly to go see family

kviiri

12:45

The longest domestic plane trips here take about 1h 30min. They have a reputation for being mostly for people whose employer pays for the travel expenses.

trogdor

not so here

probably half the people on a plane here are tourists

the other half are people visiting relatives or coming back from vaction or so forth

I don't know for sure obviously, but I think the majority of people on business trips are in the first class seating here

and technically I suppose we don't really have a "domestic flight" because that would basically mean flying from here to,.... here

you would just drive for at most an hour or so

and that is like, if you live on literally one end of the island and need to get all the way to the other end for some reason

kviiri

Yeah, it's probably different from us where half of the country is pretty much empty :P

trogdor

and, I assume, whichever country that is, much larger than a small island

:P

kviiri

Finland :)

trogdor

ah yeah

certainly larger

kviiri

12:52

Yep

People heading North usually drive or take the train I guess.

trogdor

but going South they would take a plane?

there isn't a train going South too I mean?

kviiri

Most of the population lives in the South. I guess people coming from North to South would take a train too :P

trogdor

ok

I just usually think that if a train goes one way, there will be another going back

kviiri

Yes :)

That tends to happen!

trogdor

just seems like the right way to do it, even though I have rarely ever been on trains XD

kviiri

12:58

Hmm, theoretically if traffic was heavily one-sided, we could disassemble the trains in the popular destination and load several on a bigger train and ship them to the popular point of departure!

trogdor

that seems like a lot more work

BanjoFox

or... you have a loop at the end so that the trains can turn around.

trogdor

that works too

kviiri

@BanjoFox But taking trains back empty is wasteful!

trogdor

I wasn't trying to say you absolutely needed it to be different trains

BanjoFox

13:01

@kviiri -- tell that to the Washington DC. metro system hahah :D

trogdor

just that going back the way you came through the same travel method seems like a smart idea

kviiri

I really like trains.

trogdor

I actually like em a lot too

kviiri

Too bad they are usually far more expensive than a bus around here and only faster if they don't experience technical issues (plot twist: they often do :<)

BanjoFox

booo!

trogdor

13:04

the last trip I took was to Japan last year, and they have a really neat number of trains to use to travel

and underground subways

it was very nice to travel that way

BanjoFox

Stupid Japan and their stupid trains! :D How dare they set the bar at measuring train delays in seconds.

trogdor

I never noticed a delay

XD

kviiri

Also there's no direct railway connection from Helsinki to Pori, which is the most common trip I'm making anyway, while National Road 2 goes almost directly between the two.

trogdor

I like driving,.... but if I had to drive that distance (I assume a few hours at least) I would not like it so much

BanjoFox

hrm

kviiri

13:12

Bus fares have gone down a lot since ten years ago, now it's like ten euros. Takes 3h 30min on bus.

But usually my SO drives me there, she doesn't mind driving that much.

trogdor

I probably wouldn't mind driving that long,... unless it was all at once

no rest stops would be bad

XD

eimyr

@trogdor I do two 3:15 journeys every week. You get used to it.

trogdor

@eimyr I mostly mean to like, use a bathroom once or twice

eimyr

it's possible not to!

trogdor

possible true

I have a pea sized bladder though

(badum tish!)

XD

BanjoFox

13:20

heh... I do 1:15 hours commute daily to work (and another 1:15 back)

dangit @trogdor -- I want to favorite that but because its in three (four) posts it would seem out of context :p

B. S. Morganstein

Morning friends!

trogdor

@BanjoFox Muahhahahaha!

Adam

@B.S.Morganstein good morning

trogdor

good time of day, yes quite

I must depart for the thing called sleep now

BanjoFox

@B.S.Morganstein -- Good morning delicious friend! :D

B. S. Morganstein

13:23

@BanjoFox Are you saying that you find B. S. delicious?

BanjoFox

@B.S.Morganstein -- it is something I picked up from Fallen London XD

B. S. Morganstein

Ah I see @BanjoFox, unfortunately the reference was lost on this Canadian

BanjoFox

in fact... I might make this my new avatar - Hello, delicious friend

Fallen London is an RPG for mobile devices

B. S. Morganstein

Fun?

Anaphory

@BanjoFox I found tedious somewhere in the middle. The individual bits of narration are nice, but for some kinds of tasks you have to play them again and again.

BanjoFox

13:30

Its okay. It is like a choose-your-own-advenutre and you have a limited amount of turns

Anaphory

(It's been several years since I played it.)

BanjoFox

@Anaphory -- yeah :( I played for about a month and got tired/frustrated.

kviiri

apocalypse-world.com/AW2ELandfallMarine.pdf

For those who want to play Space Marine Mammal, but more seriously.

BanjoFox

oh this again ;)

kviiri

What again? :P

BanjoFox

13:38

Apocalypse World.

It does look cool though just felt like teasing about it ;)

NautArch

top o my morning everyone!

B. S. Morganstein

@NautArch 'ello

kviiri

@BanjoFox Hey, it's among the more popular indie systems! :P

Adam

@NautArch hello

BanjoFox

@kviiri I WASN'T QUESTIONING THAT! I SAID IT LOOKS FUN! :P

NautArch

13:50

It appears summer has finally arrived in my area. A couple days now in the mid 80s and sunny with no rain.

kviiri

@BanjoFox You need to play it already, friend! :P

BanjoFox

@kviiri -- I don't have any, friend(s) to play with :P

kviiri

Aww :<

BanjoFox

yeah I know.... I (foolishly) moved away from my gaming group (stupid need for jobs/money XD).

what the heck was I thinking :D

kviiri

You need to create a new one then!

BanjoFox

13:52

There -is- a local gaming Meetup every Friday but I have yet to actually hang out and meet people v.v social fail

NautArch

@Szega You just beat me by a minute with your answer on that illusion question :)

BanjoFox

sorry... i am in an (extra?) jovial mood this morning... for some reason o.@

NautArch

@BanjoFox missed it. And it's better received, so phooey on me :P

BanjoFox

haha :D - my original post was "@NautArch -- DOWNVOTE!" but that may not have been taken as the light-hearted joke it was meant to be.

i.e "how dare @Szega answer before you get a chance" :P

NautArch

@BanjoFox oh, it's fine :) I've got a thick skin and I realized that my answer (due to lack of rule citatons) was downvote possible.

BanjoFox

14:03

@NautArch -- I try not to downvote unless something is really egregious. Plus downvotes on my stuff make me sad (even though they shouldn't). Probably cause I'm too fluffy ;)

godskook

@BanjoFox Fluffiness is treasonous, citizen. Please report for summary execution

NautArch

@BanjoFox I hear you. It's not so much the downvote I dislike, it's not knowing why.

BanjoFox

@NautArch that too, but as we've seen knowing why leads to more drama ;)

@godskook - I;ll have you know that I've only got 2 Treason stars right now :p

nitsua60

@NautArch You didn't have that back in early July? We did.

NautArch

@nitsua60 Not really. There was a lot of rain up here, but I don't really remember a stretch where I had to water my garden :)

but I could easily be misremembering. I'm just amazed the summer is nearly over :(

doppelgreener

14:11

National Geographic Travel Photographer of the Year winners have been chosen, and are incredible (Sergio Velasco)… https://twitter.com/i/web/status/892726581831106564

Tweeted by pourmecoffee on August 2, 2017 at 12:39 PM

NautArch

@doppelgreener wow

nitsua60

"You know lightning, right? When electric charge builds up in a cloud and then discharges in a giant spark? Ask me why that happens." "Why does tha--" "No clue. We think it's related to the hair thing."

(esp. the alt-text)

NautArch

Feels like after yesterday's GM-dependent decisions conversation here there are now several questions that are...GM/situation dependent.

BanjoFox

yep.... and now I have to quit the Internet. @doppelgreener wins.

doppelgreener

14:28

@BanjoFox you should see some of the stuff BESW's posted: chat.stackexchange.com/…

Today In Your Fantasy Volcanoes Aren't Terrifying Enough ^

BanjoFox

That reminds me... I need to search/check for a tag idea that I had.

nwp

What is the policy on RTFHB questions? Is answering it ok?

BanjoFox

@nwp -- I would post some polite version of RTFHB and reference the page(s) if you know what they are :)

nitsua60

15

Q: What Do We Do With "Read The Book To Me" Questions?

Somewhat of a related question to Why Are Our 5e Questions Terrible? - questions from people who haven't read the book yet, and want us to do it for them. This is a little different from the discussion in Should a question be judged on its level of "expertise"? because these questions don't even...

discussion

doppelgreener

Consider if you had that question and someone told you "read the book."

You'd probably roll your eyes and go "gee, thanks, hadn't thought of that one."

So, make it helpful and point out where & what they ought to read and what they should be looking out for, or whatever's applicable.

kviiri

14:39

@nwp Lack of research is not a close reason, so answering honestly is fine. But RTFHB is not a good answer in itself.

doppelgreener

right, you can answer and downvote. ^

we will sometimes close those questions as unclear. "How does {specific class feature} work?" would be closed as unclear with comments of "Have you actually read the book on it yet? Where have you gotten stuck?"

kviiri

Also, <dnd-specific-advice>when considering downvoting a question that's explicitly answered in one of the rulebooks, eg. the question I answered about flanking a few days back, remember that players shouldn't be expected to know about DMG content to ask rules questions.</dnd-specific-advice>

doppelgreener

@kviiri nor might they understand how to parse what's there, because understanding D&D is hard.

nitsua60

@nwp My personal line of it is whether the thing the person needs is there on the page they're clearly looking at. In that case I'll roll my eyes and downvote. (IIRC there was a warlock-spell slot-short rest question the other day that fit that description.) But the moment you have to pull things from two separate pages I give the benefit of the doubt to the querent, partly out of annoyance that in 40 years TSR/WotC has barely gotten any better at explaining their game.

kviiri

@doppelgreener must... resist... urge... to start... a DnD 5e rant again... :P

@nitsua60 This is pretty much what I do, too.

nitsua60

14:44

11 hours ago, by nitsua60

@Miniman I hate to be an armchair quarterback, but the one semi-rant I've got about TSR/WotC is that you need to already understand the game to make sense of the game's manuals. And I'd say that goes all the way back to 0e!

nwp

I feel like it is one of those and I'm just ~~rep-whoring~~ [insert politically correct term here].

kviiri

@BanjoFox Hey, I got a good reason for you to learn to play Apocalypse World: rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/apocalypse-world

@BanjoFox Look at that! The last AW question is from half a year ago!

We need more people to ask questions so I can answer them!

BanjoFox

@kviiri -- LOL... I never said I needed reasons ;)

kviiri

@BanjoFox This is the reason you don't need, but the reason I deserve.

...or wait, is that how it goes?

BanjoFox

@kviiri -- I could say the same thing about Paranoia ;)

kviiri

14:45

@BanjoFox I think you'd be right to say that :)

It saddens me how many good systems don't get almost any attention on this site. Then again, yesterday's analogy about the doctor's office might apply here too :P

Adam

@nitsua60 That's because at some point there was a choice to be made: are the manuals instruction books that teach you to play the game, or reference books that you use to look up rules? Somebody chose reference books, and cursed new people to learn from books that were not really made to teach things as their primary purpose.

2

BanjoFox

@kviiri -- I will probably grab a copy of ApocWorld after I finish reading all my new Paranoia stuff.

kviiri

@BanjoFox The second edition is going to be released for sale in a few days I think.

@BanjoFox However, the difference between 1e and 2e isn't major: see rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/88507/…

Actually I should maybe retouch my answer now that I've got more experience with 2e

I got a few ideas on how I could improve that.

nitsua60

@nwp Don't forget, though, that the real audience for the answer isn't the person asking the question.

268

Q: We're working on a new stat to help convey the reach of your posts here

We've got a new statistic on the shiny new Profile Page Prototype. It's not perfect yet. And we did a pretty crap job of explaining what it's all about! Let's talk. What you do here isn't just about solving one person's problem. A while back, a user contacted us about his friend's account. His...

discussion profile-page feedback people-reached

(esp. at "You gotta get this to get us.")

Even if they're a help vampire, a well-written answer still advances the Stack mission: a well-sorted DB of expert Q&A.

BanjoFox

@kviiri -- It will probably take me a few more days to fishing reading YCBBB Remix

I also got my preview copy of Monarchies of Mau to read so I am not without things to do ;)

godskook

15:13

@nitsua60 I did not have that problem when learning 3.5 off the SRD, but then, I'm an outlier, so....

kviiri

I don't really think I've had problems learning the rules themselves from DnD books, either.

On the other hand, stuff like "when to call perception checks" or "how much should I tell my players about the monsters" and "should I allow them to search for traps between every square" etc, those kinds of things always were tough for me.

Time to hit the road for now.

nwp

Poor road. What did it ever do to you?

kviiri

@nwp Really hurt my eyes at least!

It rained earlier today, now it's sunny, the road is wet and impossible to look at because it's all SHINYYY like a wealthy woman's neck.

nitsua60

15:34

@godskook Glad to hear it--I should admit, not having played 3.x or 4, that perhaps those manuals are amazing and I'm just unlucky in that regard. But I do have plenty of sympathy for anyone who comes to these cold and says "oh, I didn't realize this thing two hundred pages away had this impact on this decision I made at chargen."

godskook

@nitsua60 Well, I mean, that's a bit of the nature of any system where decisions matter and that there's lots of decisions to be had, isn't it?

kviiri

Could be nostalgia speaking, but IIRC 4e had generally reasonably clear rules (because powers were quite self-contained).

nwp

@nitsua60 I don't think that is necessarily a bad thing. Making avoidable mistakes due to not knowing the rules is something a new adventurer would do and sort of models real life character progression.

kviiri

@nwp But new adventurers played by rules-nerda are exempt because?

nitsua60

@nwp Right, but should fighting with two weapons be that hard to present in 5e?

nwp

15:39

@kviiri Rule nerds tend to start at lvl 3 or 5 :P

@nitsua60 No, there are a few things they could have done better.

But overall it works decently well I think. Coming from someone who just started with 5e and didn't play before.

kviiri

I actively enjoy it when the game lets a PC be smarter that the player!

godskook

15:55

@nitsua60 you seem to have migrated from "must have pre-knowledge to understand the manuals" to "must read the full manual to understand the manual", and those are qualitatively different accusations.

doppelgreener

@BESW for this question you answered I had considered suggesting giving the character Shoot +1 with a stunt for +3 to shoot exclusively with one gun, on the justification you can use one gun really well and others pretty averagely. But it's also as you mentioned, if the player never actually has to use another gun, that's functionally no different to having Shoot +4.

godskook

@doppelgreener Is "limited ammo" a thing in Fate?

like....as a stunt-bite or w/e

doppelgreener

@godskook sorta. there's no mechanics about ammo unless you introduce them yourself, however narrative fiction would say "no, you cannot shoot twenty people with your six-shot revolver and no spare ammo" if anyone cares about that level of fidelity, and people can have an aspect such as "out of ammo" put on themselves.

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