TRPG General Chat

daze413

00:32

W-wha? I'm here! @Papayaman1000 @Shalvenay @NautArch

Papayaman1000

@daze413 Ach! Sorry! I was busy playing Mother 3...

daze413

@Papayaman1000 nah, just logged in. how's tricks?

Papayaman1000

@daze413 Hrm?

NautArch

howdy @daze413

daze413

@nitsua60 Any reason it doesnt go past 11? Is it because most magic at that level already bypasses all gates?

@Papayaman1000 @NautArch someone called/pinged me. I think it was NautArch. We doing the playtest early? it works for me

Papayaman1000

00:36

@daze413 I'm leaving within an hour or two. Not sure on the exact timespan, there.

nitsua60

@daze413 My curiosity ends there because of the fraction of my time I've pspent playing tier 4. (0%, to be precise.)

Miniman

@nitsua60 Isn't tier 4 around level 15-ish?

nitsua60

yeah:15-20.

Miniman

Huh, level 17, apparently.

nitsua60

See--I'm just not that experiened =)

daze413

00:40

would it help if I start with the highest level in the question? "If the PCs have access to 9th level spells, how can an obstruction/gate still be effective?"

Miniman

@nitsua60 [ponders] I know I've gone as far as 7th-level spells, but I can't remember if I've gone to 8th.

daze413

then kinda ask separately the lower levels

Miniman

@daze413 "It literally can't."

daze413

@Miniman "where is your god now?!" moment, while the PCs break down the celestial vault to the dead god's body?

Miniman

@daze413 ...wait, what?

nitsua60

00:42

@daze413 I mean, I think the gates for lower levels are going to be more useful--just based on the percentage of play that happens at various levels. But they'll all be good. (Esp. if it's a L15 gate that's clearly a L15 gate. Some serious motivation to work on those mid-to-late-career characters.)

Miniman

@nitsua60 "Abandon hope, all ye who enter here under level 15!"

Papayaman1000

@nitsua60 I want to do a megadungeon but at the same time I know I'll be burnt out (and my players sick of backtracking through it) before I finish it

daze413

@Miniman I'm imagining the PCs just rekking the most sacred of vaults, if they were so inclined

NautArch

@Papayaman1000 not sure - guess we'll see if @Shalvenay arrives

nitsua60

@Papayaman1000 by "do" do you mean run or write?

Papayaman1000

00:43

@nitsua60 Yes.

daze413

hahahaha

nitsua60

excellent =)

Papayaman1000

I'm a DM and an author, among other, less savory things. What can I say? It piques my interests, but not as much as really driving one idea home and leaving it at that. If I hammered away at a megadungeon, it'd probably be as burnt-out and repetitive as Marvel sequels by the time I'm done.

daze413

ok, then the question would be for: 1) 3rd level spell gates. 2) 5th-level spells 3) 7th-level spells?

Ben

Speaking of running/writing, my D&D group fell apart :(

just when I came up with the whole "Sentient Moss" thing

Miniman

00:45

@Papayaman1000 I'm in a pretty similar situation. Except that I'm also too lazy to write stuff down, draw maps, etc.

@Ben Sorry, that sucks.

Papayaman1000

@Miniman I've printed up so much isometric graph paper it's not even funny

daze413

@Ben aww :( what happened?

Ben

Well, one of the players finally decided to admit that he didn't actually like playing (fine with watching, just not playing), and his girlfriend got all upset about it and pulled out too

Only had 3 players

nitsua60

Someone sanity check me: it is 00:47 UTC right now?

Ben

It's Something:47... yes

trogdor

00:47

um 00:47?

daze413

@nitsua60 not sure if daylight savings but we're at +8 GMT and its 8:47 here

Ben

@nitsua60 Yes. it is

trogdor

does that exist, am I crazy for thinking that doesn't exist?

Ben

It's 10:47 here, and we are +10 UTC

daze413

@trogdor it means 47 mins past midnight

trogdor

00:48

oh

nitsua60

I'm temporally-challenged. None of the above other than "yes it is" made any sense to me.

trogdor

see,.... I thought that would be 24:47

Ben

Yeh 24 hr time... there is no 24:00... it goes back to 0:00

Miniman

@Ben Yeah, I've had similar things happen - there's problems with a group made up of groups rather than individuals, if you see what I mean.

trogdor

@Ben huh, didn't know that bit

Ben

00:49

@Miniman Yeah

Shalvenay

hey there @daze413 @NautArch @Papayaman1000

daze413

@trogdor but... then the time would be 87923649182638175916246:47 if that were the case :D

trogdor

or at least made assumptions

nitsua60

So 72 hrs from now will be ~00:50 on Jun 2, yes?

Ben

@Miniman I mean, it makes sense since they're together, but it's still a bit odd looking at them as individuals

nitsua60

00:50

@daze413 (please specify epoch when in an international context)

trogdor

@daze413 no it would just wrap around to 1:00 again, at least in my world it would

nitsua60

=)

trogdor

XD

daze413

@Ben stuff happens mang :/ I've certainly had a few players I thought were really enthusiastic suddenly drop out

trogdor

I don't know who first decided midnight should be a zero hour, but I am cross with them now

Miniman

00:51

@Ben I just mean, when 1 scheduling conflict causes half your group not to show up, instead of just 1 person, it's problematic.

daze413

24-hour clock

The 24-hour clock is the convention of time keeping in which the day runs from midnight to midnight and is divided into 24 hours, indicated by the hours passed since midnight, from 0 to 23. This system is the most commonly used time notation in the world today, and is used by international standard ISO 8601. In the practice of medicine, the 24-hour clock is generally used in documentation of care as it prevents any ambiguity as to when events occurred in a patient's medical history. It is popularly referred to as military time in the United States and a handful of other countries where the 12-hour...

trogdor

@daze413 this changes nothing :P

Ben

@trogdor It's derived from military time - they say "O-hundred hours" (midnight) or "14-hundred hours" (2pm) rather than getting confused with the whole "am/pm" thing.

daze413

@trogdor then you have a grudge against some ancient egyptian, I guess

trogdor

@Ben I get that, I do, I just never realized the last number was 23 and there was a 0 instead of 24

@daze413 SO BE IT

Ben

00:55

@trogdor well when you think about it... you wouldn't start the day at the end of the clock

trogdor

this is true

The Oracle

0

Q: Chat event: COLONYPUNK

We're trying to schedule some [chat] events. COLONYPUNK: a resistance and assimilation game You're LOCALS. a FOREIGN power has colonised your nation.... Thus begins COLONYPUNK, a 200-word RPG by Our Very OwnTM @BESW. I'll host a game at 00:30 on 2 Jun 2017 in The Back Room. (Link for eve...

nitsua60

@trogdor I'm with you, man. (Although my preferred solution, that we all just communicate time in seconds since Jan 1, 1900, probably wouldn't fly with you, either.)

trogdor

@Ben but you would end it at the end

which if you think about it the way I am, calling the end zero seems an awful lot like starting it at the end

@nitsua60 it would not

Ben

This whole thing got oddly ominous

trogdor

00:57

lol

time will do that to you

Ben

Though I do have an issue with the whole "23:59" to "00:00" thing...

trogdor

@Ben this is all I am saying man

the 24th hour has vanished and been replaced by a zero

Ben

They just need like... one second where it's "24:00" :P

trogdor

I would accept this (no one else would though)

NautArch

howdy @Shalvenay

Ben

00:59

@trogdor Probably the same reason why a discussion about time travel between a Theorist and a Physicist only ends up as an argument.

trogdor

I mean,... I think of time possibly in a strange insane way, but it isn't a "wrong" way to think of time

nitsua60

@daze413 you didn't like my new internet protocol? (vhttp?)

trogdor

it has beginnings and endings that actually touch each other

nitsua60

@trogdor "time is a flat circle, my friend."

Ben

@trogdor Well... no

Since it's a new day

trogdor

01:01

@Ben except yes

nitsua60

detente!

trogdor

its a new day right after an old day

the new day does not mean the old day never happened

Ben

It's a separate 24 hr cycle. The beginning of this 24 hr cycle is 24 hrs after the beginning of the previous 24 hr cycle

trogdor

the old day just isn't "right in front of you" anymore

daze413

@nitsua60 o_o virtual hyper-text protocol "s"...? my internet meta knowledge ends in the S

trogdor

01:02

@Ben you are not refuting my point here

Ben

I think then, we're seeing this in two different ways

BESW

@nitsua60 How'd you choose Colonypunk, of all things?

Ben

Or at least I am

trogdor

we are

BESW

@nitsua60 (Also I have no idea about group size, I've never played Colonypunk.)

trogdor

01:03

when I said chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/37737775#37737775

daze413

@BESW I'm guessing alphabetically

nitsua60

@BESW It was the first in the list.

BESW

You're our official expert.

nitsua60

(I'm a mod of Very Little Brain.)

@BESW any thoughts on what number would be too many participants? I found six managable IRL.

trogdor

@Ben I will also note that I am not saying you are "wrong" either

I was simply stating the way I think of time

Miniman

01:06

I think of time as a packet of marshmallows.

trogdor

you are allowed

Miniman

Well, a fractal packet of marshmallows, that is.

trogdor

unless there are time police I don't know about who don't like that

Ben

Although, while a lot of people disagree with me on this point... I like to think that "Time" is little more than a measurement. It's got nothing to do with anything other than a way to identify progression.

@Miniman Careful you don't eat them all

BESW

This is where I start mentioning Narrative and Freedom: The Shadows of Time.

trogdor

01:09

@Ben I would argue that "Time" is just the name of movement, progression, and all that stuff

without "Time" nothing would actually ever happen

Miniman

@Ben That's exactly the point - each individual marshmallow takes ages to eat, and you wonder why you're even eating it. Then suddenly you realise that you've eaten the entire packet and you feel kinda ill. But that packet is just one packet in a packet of packets, where each packet is itself also a marshmallow.

BESW

Miniman

As a side note on all this time-related, deeply philosophical conversation, Steins;Gate is awesome, and definitely worth a watch.

trogdor

@BESW hehehe

nitsua60

@trogdor this gets interestingly (to me) close to my religion's notion of a God that exists outside of time.

trogdor

01:12

@nitsua60 if it helps, I would say it goes without saying that God would have made it that way himself

BESW

@nitsua60 The Bahá'í Faith could arguably be seen as saying that Time is a manifestation of God's constant, active will that we continue to exist.

trogdor

if I took a position that God existed but did not create Time to work the way it did, I would also have to say he didn't make universal laws like Physics and such

what would be the point of me making that argument?

Ben

I'm beginning to verge on an existential crisis at this point.

Particularly after last night's visions

BESW

(Also that time is helical; simultaenously always moving forward and always repeating itself.)

trogdor

@BESW I would say, personally, that I believe God is capable of making something as huge and "powerful" as Time and not needing to technically continue willing it to exist, but that also draws a silly line about God in comparison to people

so wtvs

Miniman

01:16

@Ben In order to prove you're not a bot, please answer this captcha: What is your credit card number?

trogdor

lol

nitsua60

btw, @BESW did you see my question about COLONYPUNK? I wonder what upper-limit you've seen on group sizes?

BESW

14 mins ago, by BESW

@nitsua60 (Also I have no idea about group size, I've never played Colonypunk.)

Miniman

13 mins ago, by BESW

@nitsua60 (Also I have no idea about group size, I've never played Colonypunk.)

nitsua60

Ah--sorry, I didn't catch that.

daze413

01:17

jynx?

nitsua60

[double-take] wait-what?

Papayaman1000

Sorry, had to vanish for a moment.

nitsua60

You haven't played it?

Miniman

@daze413 Nah, SE tells me there was a 2s gap.

BESW

Nooope. You were my playtester.

nitsua60

01:18

Whoa.

trogdor

has no one else at all played it?

BESW

Not that I know of.

nitsua60

So the rpg I chose to feature in the inaguaral chat-event in what I hope is a madly-successful series... is one that has only ever been playtested by me, in a free block, with a half-dozen english teachers, none of whom had ever played any rpg before?

Mastermind at work, here. Stand back, people.

[this guy ^^ ]

BESW

17 mins ago, by BESW

@nitsua60 How'd you choose Colonypunk, of all things?

nitsua60

16 mins ago, by nitsua60

(I'm a mod of Very Little Brain.)

BESW

01:21

I mean, it's explicitly a playtest event, so that's not unexpected.

Miniman

@nitsua60 Is it OK if this makes me think something vaguely ovinist?

BESW

I'm mostly surprised because of the content of the game.

Papayaman1000

I wanna get in on that, regardless.

nitsua60

@Miniman hmm... googling "ovinist" gets me a bunch of stuff about coconut oil. I'm not sure what you mean, but color me curious =)

BESW

> o·vine
ˈōˌvīn/
adjective
adjective: ovine
relating to or resembling sheep.
Origin
early 19th century: from late Latin ovinus, from Latin ovis ‘sheep.’

Miniman

01:24

> a person who shows or feels discrimination or prejudice against ~~people~~ animals of ~~other~~ ovine ~~races~~ species, or who believes that a particular ~~race~~ species is superior to ~~another~~ ovines.

Papayaman1000

I got the Bosnian word for "chauvinist".

nitsua60

@BESW Well, we'll see if the assembled masses (by which I mean @Papayaman1000) choose a native/occupier dynamic that fraught or camp.

Shalvenay

haha

Papayaman1000

I'm up for w/e

nitsua60

@Miniman I don't get it. Nobody doesn't like sheep.

BESW

01:26

Well, Nobody's a jerk then.

Papayaman1000

@nitsua60 Well, unless someone summoned four of them during play-by-post.

Miniman

@nitsua60 Because sheep are stereotypically stupid.

Papayaman1000

@Miniman Somebody's looking to start something, here.

Miniman

@Papayaman1000 Hey, I said stereotypically.

BESW

> I may be ewe, I may be ram,
I may be mutton, may be lamb,
But on the hoof or on the hook,
I bain't as stupid as I look.

Papayaman1000

01:27

I just realized it's been several hours and I still have JuneShores' new system doc open

nitsua60

@Papayaman1000 Sounds like we've got the makings of a C'PUNK game right here. Papaya: tell me how you'll resist Miniman's sheep-slandering.

trogdor

@BESW wait, so cows are bovines, and sheep are just screwed out of the b?

Papayaman1000

@nitsua60 Um... gulags?

Miniman

@trogdor See also: equine, caprine, canine, feline, etc.

Humane???

trogdor

@Miniman but the b though

Miniman

01:29

I guess that would be homine.

daze413

@Papayaman1000 I wasn't invested enough in the sheep to make an effort to even save concentration. So maybe I'm the jerk! :o

Miniman

@trogdor The 'b' is for 'big'.

trogdor

lol

Papayaman1000

Y'know what's fun? Watching news programs throw up stock footage of code whenever talking about something remotely computer-related. "Oh no! The hackers are using HTML!" or "This innovative satellite was coded using CSS!"

trogdor

so cows are just big sheep

with more milk and less wool

Miniman

01:30

@Papayaman1000 blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/oldnewthing/20140528-01/?p=873

Papayaman1000

@trogdor But caprine creatures are just more agressive, omnivorous, smaller cows. Your move.

trogdor

@Papayaman1000 blasphemer! :P

Papayaman1000

@Miniman That illustrates my point so perfectly.

Ben

So... my servers have switched for some reason

:/

Shalvenay

apparently must be the farm's pet dingo xD

Papayaman1000

01:33

My favorite hobby is walking into a coffee shop, connecting to the wifi, and dropping in a network-shared file called "passwords.bat" that just fork-bombs the computers of all the wannabe hackers in there

And then you see someone grab their temples in frustration and try as hard as possible not to laugh

Shalvenay

@Papayaman1000 never give a programming assignment involving fork() calls -- without fail, somebody in the class will write a forkbomb by accident

Papayaman1000

@Shalvenay That's why I demand all BASIC tasks be done in DOSBOX.

Or through Cloud9.

Either way...

Miniman

@Papayaman1000 There's this really fun hobby where you pretend to be other people and play games, you should give it a try :P

Papayaman1000

@Miniman I am the top STAR_ impersonator

nitsua60

@Miniman I've got a closely related one: I talk (a lot) about the hobby where I pretend to be other people and play games.

trogdor

01:37

what about the one where you play games and then pretend to be other people?

Shalvenay

oh, are you folks still about @NautArch @daze413? I didn't see your chat replies amidst the noise!

Miniman

@trogdor Or where you play games that want you to pretend to be other people but just aren't that good so you play them without pretending to be other people.

NautArch

@Shalvenay i'm here for a bit

can't stay up too late

Shalvenay

OK, cool

Papayaman1000

@NautArch this

Shalvenay

01:39

just need daze

trogdor

@Miniman lol

personally, I create the other people, but put parts of myself into them

not in a weird way though :P

Miniman

The one that puzzles me is dialogue trees where the character doesn't actually say what you select, just something vaguely related. It's like, if you're going to do that, why have the dialogue in the tree at all?

trogdor

@Miniman that is a strange thing

I never understood that myself

Ben

Option: "That's a good suggestion"
Actual Response: "Do you like Tacos?"

trogdor

at least it is usually extremely similar,.... but why not just put in what will actually be said?

Papayaman1000

01:43

@trogdor Well maybe I'm secretly a 14-year-old masquerading as a 30-something adult with a son and a decent programming career. Or maybe not. But now you'll never knoooooow

trogdor

@Papayaman1000 lol

Ben

@Papayaman1000 So... you're nat a ball with an evile star for a face?

Papayaman1000

@Ben No, just an acolyte of said ball.

Ben

@Papayaman1000 All Hail the Might Overlord

Papayaman1000

And are you really a guy who's upside-down, defying the laws of gravity (like a shooting star)

Miniman

01:45

@trogdor Even if it was a shortened version, I could understand.

Ben

@Papayaman1000 I do live in Australia

trogdor

@Miniman I do see that sometimes

it is less weird for sure

what I don't like is that often the conversation just continues with your character saying things after your choice that you didn't necessarily expect or agree on

Papayaman1000

And then they skip an actual dialogue tree and give generic "choose this slightly altered version that gives you no actual personality or choice whatsoever"

Y'know, totally not like Fallout 4

trogdor

or Mass Effect

Ben

Dammit. Subnets. Every time.

nitsua60

01:50

@daze413 @Miniman sanity check: DC30 skill check is really no gate, right? expertise + bless + +3 ability modifier + a rolled 19 gets you there at L1.

s/bless/guidance

Miniman

@nitsua60 I mean, it's not a secure gate.

nitsua60

bardic inspiration puts even a 35 in reach.... Unlikely, but in reach.

Miniman

@nitsua60 A 0.2% chance - unlikely is a slight understatement :P

Although you haven't even added in Help, which is the easiest way to boost your ability checks.

Ben

Actually that reminds me. Going back to a very old discussion we had about "jumping further than a time frame will allow, therefore ending your turn suspended in the air", if you look at time in a series of slots, similar to how turn order often confuses people into believing combat works, time can be a whole other bag of cats

cc @trogdor

nitsua60

@Ben [bites tongue for the night] =)

trogdor

01:55

@Ben I remember this yeah

Ben

@nitsua60 I like to poke badgers sometimes :3

trogdor

I was one of the people that said that the way it works, IE you jump and fall all on your own turn, makes perfect sense to me

mostly because it's a game with turns at all

Miniman

@nitsua60 Yeah, you better r-oh hey, you're a mod now. Uh, all opinions are equally valid?

nitsua60

@Miniman thu thave bo ibea thow hahd id id do dype whild biding your dongue.

Ben

@nitsua60 Do you type with your tongue?

Or speech-to-text?

trogdor

01:59

lol

how meta

nitsua60

@Ben bedder dhan hooves, ban.

WrongOnTheInternet

@nitsua60 What skill check do you want to gate/why are you gating it?

nitsua60

Oh, SEDE guru! (cough, @Miniman @cough) is it possible to search tag-wiki texts for "Apocalypse World" or "Powered by the Apocalypse" or "PbtA"?

1

Q: How can I find all Powered by the Apocalypse questions?

There are dozens of Powered by the Apocalypse questions out there, and they're all similar enough that it's conceivable a Tremelus question could be duped to a Dungeon World one. So, if I'm looking for advice on a PbtA game that doesn't have any questions asked here yet, but for which generic Pb...

discussion

Miniman

@nitsua60 Yes.

nitsua60

@WrongOnTheInternet Nothing in particular--an earlier conversation had me thinking about gating, and about how hard it'd be to do any via skill DCs in 5e.

Miniman

02:04

Oh, did you want me to actually do it?

WrongOnTheInternet

Ah; you were thinking of gating in the sense of "come back later, you can't do it now."

nitsua60

@Miniman not necessarily--curious if that'd be a good way to find all the tags for PbtA games.

@WrongOnTheInternet right.

WrongOnTheInternet

@nitsua60 How does 5e specify handling retries on skills? In one of my groups with a different system, if you fail something like a lockpick roll, the lock is beyond your ability until you gain a level/boost the skill somehow

Shalvenay

@WrongOnTheInternet it usually doesn't handle retries.

nitsua60

DMG p.237. GM adjudicates each case individually.

Shalvenay

02:06

that's not a case 5e covers in RAW

nitsua60

SUre it does--retries are explicitly called out on p.238.

I can't remember what it says, but I remember the page number =)

WrongOnTheInternet

... I need to actually get around reading my 5E dmg cover to cover. No PDF is about the only reason I haven't.

Shalvenay

@nitsua60 oh, srry

Miniman

@nitsua60 Well, there's none, so...

nitsua60

@Shalvenay np. (And I got the page number wrong! 237 is still it for repeated checks.)

@Miniman What? dungeon-world and monster-of-the-week both mention "Apocalypse World" in their tag descriptions.

Miniman

02:09

@nitsua60 Hmmm. There appears to be 4, but something weird happens.

Oh lawdy, it's case sensitive. Yikes.

nitsua60

@WrongOnTheInternet basically DMG guidance is "maybe retries make it possible. You should probably just dispense with rolling, then, and figure time to success. In other cases the failure is likely a sign that no amount of attempts will help. Move on."

WrongOnTheInternet

@nitsua60 Wait, doesn't bless only add to attack rolls? Or is this another edition.

nitsua60

@WrongOnTheInternet (that's why next line was a swap of guidance for bless. I always mix the two up.)

WrongOnTheInternet

Ah

Well, what's behind the gate? What's the motivation for it?

Miniman

@nitsua60 Ok, 5.

nitsua60

02:13

@WrongOnTheInternet There's nothing behind the gate. There's no gate. I was just brainstorming.

WrongOnTheInternet

Ah. It's a good question though; how to gate content so that low levels don't wander into a high level area and get massacred.

nitsua60

@WrongOnTheInternet you should upvote it when @daze413 asks =)

22 hours ago, by daze413

Would a question about effective 'gates' at various PC levels be on topic or too broad?

WrongOnTheInternet

@nitsua60 I'll keep an eye out for it, maybe even whip up an answer.

daze413

Sorry, all circuits are busy now, the question is still in draft form and will be posted in....... 23 hours >_<

Miniman

@nitsua60 Also, bizarre and hilarious thing: It appears to be impossible (in SEDE) to retrieve from a tag wiki what tag it is a wiki for.

nitsua60

02:18

@Miniman I noticed that it claimed to be linking to strange question-posts, but it actually links to the tag-info page?

Ben

See... now if "smart" programs were actually "smart", we wouldn't have routing problems

nitsua60

Speaking of routing, time to commute. Night, all!

Miniman

@nitsua60 At least in SEDE's data structures, questions, answers, tag wikis, and moderator nominations are all the same thing.

We have no information about what the real data structures are like.

@nitsua60 Cya!

KorvinStarmast

02:34

@nitsua60 I was gonna stick with 1e only until I took a peak at the 0e book, and then the flood gates opened ...

Shalvenay

hey there @KorvinStarmast

The Oracle

1

Q: How can I find all Powered by the Apocalypse questions?

There are dozens of Powered by the Apocalypse questions out there, and they're all similar enough that it's conceivable a Tremelus question could be duped to a Dungeon World one. So, if I'm looking for advice on a PbtA game that doesn't have any questions asked here yet, but for which generic Pb...

discussion

nitsua60

02:55

@Miniman hopefully that'll poke some PbtA experts to flesh out tag-descriptions =)

Miniman

03:12

@nitsua60 Deleting comments on meta? And so the reign of terror baagins.

nitsua60

@Miniman whaddya mean? [re-establishes his tracks!]

(I forgot I was on meta for a minute)

Miniman

@nitsua60 I mean, it's not like there's any real value to be had from those comments. I just saw the opportunity for a joke :P

nitsua60

@Miniman I don't know what you're talking about!? [feverishly wipes away flop-sweat]

Ben

@nitsua60 [Looms with a big "mod-abuse" stamp]

We are always watching

We are always waiting

(reverse that if it sounds better)

Miniman

@Ben You work for Domino's?

nitsua60

03:18

@Ben "Looms"? Is that a sheep -> wool -> textiles reference? Boy, now that I have a word for it, I sure am getting tired of this ovinism =P

Miniman

(If you don't know the reference, it's the last section on this page.)

Ben

@nitsua60 ...yes. That was totally intentional. But only if it makes me feel good

@Miniman No... Eagle boys.

Miniman

@Ben Sadly, there's no eagle boys in my area. I miss them, though.

@nitsua60 Just relax, no-one's trying to fleece you.

Ben

@nitsua60 Do you know what a "Malaphor" is?

@Miniman I don't. My boss was a naught-word-for-a-female-dog

nitsua60

@Ben I assume it's a malamanteau?

Miniman

03:21

> If you can't stand the heat, get off the pot.

@Ben My little sister worked for them for a while, and her boss was unbelievably dodgy. But I got so much free (and really good) pizza from walking her home!

Ben

Sort of like a metaphor

except not quite.

The most common is "Let's burn that bridge when we get to it"

Miniman

@Ben I dunno, "water under the dam" comes up a lot.

Ben

Some one tried to tell me that's a "malapropism" however that definition doesn't match

@Miniman That's a malapropism.

Adeptus

Sometimes the Stack format annoys me... I found a link that (mostly?) answers this question... but I can't make it into a Good Answer, because it's literally just "I found this link that does what you're trying to do"

Miniman

@Ben Wait, what? "Dam" doesn't sound like "bridge".

Ben

03:25

@Miniman Our boss was dodgy too. But we took our cut from what she cut by just taking free coke and pizza

@Miniman Well I was going for "Over"

But whatever

Miniman

But no-one really says "water over the dam", so... :P

Ben

Until now

@Adeptus When I find something like that, I just go "This link has what you're looking for, [brief description of why, so it's not a cut/paste answer]"

[maybe add a specific example that relates to the question, if there is one]

nitsua60

@Adeptus how is that not an OT "shopping" question?

Miniman

@nitsua60 Probably because, as often happens, what he really wants to know is "how do I do this", but rather than make work for people, he's phrased it as "has anyone done this already and can I see how they did it?" - it's pretty common.

nitsua60

03:40

@Shalvenay sorry 'bout that. Didn't know it'd increment so quickly =)

Alright, done playing around. Thanks!

Shalvenay

@nitsua60 4mins

Chemus

@Adeptus The spheres were spell access, not 9 spells per sphere, but whatever fit the sphere: All (5), Animal (~20), Astral (2), Charm, Combat, Creation, Divination, Elemental, Guardian, Healing, Necromantic, Plant, Protection, Summoning, Sun adn Weather.

Elemental was by far the largest (which only the druid had full access to between the two divine casters in the 2e PHB) and astral was the smallest without books outside the core. Spell level went to 7th for clerics.

It's a hard conversion as the change from 2nd to 3rd was a pretty big departure for clerics. It's one of the reasons they're part of CoD-Zilla in 3rd.

Ben

04:08

Fun fact: Undead creatures, without any kind of system to pump fluids around the body (i.e. a functioning/pumping heart) would show no signs of aggression or fear, since there is no adrenaline moving around the body.

But then again... Magic

Adeptus

05:12

> This is part of the d20 Rebirth project, a collection of rewrites and revamps aimed at extending the lifespan of 3.5e D&D and balancing core mechanics to provide a more functional, more fun, and more intuitive game. source

It names them "domains", but has a few spells per level, so is more like 2e's spheres

Yuuki

> What if humans are dire halflings?

3

:thinkingface:

Chemus

@Adeptus Yep, I followed the link. That uses domains, gets 1 domain (and its power) plus two other domains to add to its spell list. That's 27 spells. It's not a bad nerf, but it's not a lot like spheres, IMO.

Whoops. Failed to notive the two spells at some levels

Miniman

@Yuuki Then I want my bone armor! (Not actually a thing, I've just spent more time in NWN than in actual D&D.)

(Weirdly, this is on the HNQ list atm.)

Yuuki

@Miniman I can't remember when this was but I played in a homebrew 3.5 campaign where we killed a dragon early and the DM flavored dragonbone armor as splint mail or something.

Adeptus

@Chemus 3 spells at levels 1-4, then 2 at levels 5-8, then one at 9th

Compared to Animal (you said had about 20?) it stacks up about right. Except balanced across all of them, rather than some bigger & some smaller

Chemus

05:25

@Adeptus Yeah, I didn't read through any domains, really, just saw the 1-9 and assumed that it was 3.5 standard domains. So that's 13*3 or 39 spells. More like spheres, kinda. I guess that the real trouble is that it's not explicitly intended to mirror spheres. It's nice and close though.

@Adeptus For all the spheres in PHB: Astral: 2, All: 5, Guardian: 5, Healing: 6, Sun: 6, Creation: 7, Combat: 8, Weather: 9, Charm: 10, Necromantic: 12, Summoning: 17, Animal 18, Protection 19, Divination 21, and Elemental: 32.

Adeptus

I found another take on spheres on ENWorld, but it was being fairly harshly criticised by most commenters...

Miniman

@Yuuki I can't help but think that, given what we know about D&D's dragons, when you open them up to look at their internals, you should just see the "MAGIC" meme.

@Adeptus ENWorld is...not great at providing feedback on homebrew. Especially balance feedback.

Chemus

Yeah, 2e was not really mathematically set-up; there were a lot of irregular progressions, etc. 3rd really made things much more regular and 'even' (but really just changed the balancing points)

Lotsa folks, myself included, really had high hopes that 'logical' progressions were a real improvement.

@Adeptus So I can see how ENWorld, especially if this HB is older (2010 0r earlier), might really pan anything seen as going 'backward'

BESW

Sep 3 '14 at 20:49, by BESW

Personally I think humans are half-elf, half-dwarf, but nobody--not the elves, not the dwarves, and not the humans--likes to talk about it.

Chemus

@Miniman Bone Knight (3.5 Eberron 5N PrC) has kinda good bone armor that becomes part of the char.

Adeptus

05:34

@Chemus Here's the ENWorld link so you can form your own opinion

Miniman

@Chemus I know - it's one of my alltime favourite PrCs.

(The same book has Knight Phantom, too. Good stuff.)

Yuuki

@Miniman Yeah but we managed to kill a young dragon at 3rd level (the wizard triple-20'd it with a dagger throw) and we all agreed that getting all the magickyness of a dragon that early would suck the fun out of the campaign until we hit a much higher level.

Chemus

@Adeptus Uhh I see 3-4 respondents saying "I like it, tell us how it goes" and one guy (who appears to not have read 2e or just won't reference it) saying "I don't like how you've done this it won't work. Pick pick pick." Now Celestis has a really high ranking, but well...

Yuuki

So I used the bones as splint armor until we got to a higher level and we did some weird sidequest involving a ritual that let us invest draconic power into our dragon material items.

Miniman

@Yuuki You have critical hit tables that let a dagger (from a wizard, no less) kill a dragon?

Chemus

05:42

@Miniman Duh! dagger through the eye into the braincase. Who can't do that?

Yuuki

@Miniman There's an old, old rule (to the point where I can't remember if it's homebrew or a holdover from an older version) where triple nat 20 in a row on an attack roll auto-killed the target.

Any case, IIRC, I got dragonbone (splint) armor, the ranger got dragonhide (leather) armor, the wizard got a dragon tooth dagger, and the fighter/knight got a dragonscale shield.

Miniman

@Yuuki "I throw my dagger at the ghost!" "But it's a ghost. Your dagger literally won't even-" "I got 3 20's the ghost is dead now!"

Yuuki

@Miniman I mean, you can still technically hit the dragon with a normal crit in 3.5e.

Miniman

@Yuuki I know, I'm just bored.

> You just took a D&D equipment list and stuck ~~techy~~ dragon-y words in front, right?

Yuuki

@Miniman Pretty much. Again, we agreed (players and DM) that getting draconic magical effects that early would ruin the fun. Although it did end up with an enjoyable sidequest later on where we got to turn our dragon stuff into proper draconic magical items.

My dragonbone armor gave me resistance to fire damage as well as the ability to sprout dragon wings and breathe flame.

I think mine was the least imaginative as the ranger's armor got an animated embossing that could separate from the armor into a tiny dragon familiar.

Miniman

05:52

@Yuuki Sorry, not making fun of you. Just can't resist the opportunity for a Darths & Droids quote.

@Yuuki That's pretty cool.

Yuuki

I miss those days where a group willingly refused possibly gamebreaking loot because it would be possibly gamebreaking.

Miniman

@Yuuki Wow, those must've been pretty old days. Before I was alive, at least.

Yuuki

@Miniman Actually, it was my first year of college so... only 6 years ago?

Actually 8, because this was my first college before I transferred.

We did Theatre of the Mind though, which in hindsight was especially odd for 3.5e, so I guess the group didn't really care all that much about rules and gaming the system.

Anne Aunyme

08:08

I really think this question should be closed

Transcript for