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Bob
2:01 PM
whoops. I killed reddit.
 
u basrd
 
@Rahul2001 That's such a bad set of puns it Hertz. I'm shocked because I thought you were grounded and wouldn't write such revolting rubbish. I'm charging you and pulling the plug on this thread and sending you ohm for your punishment
 
@Bob wow, I haven't seen Guru Meditation ("Mediation"...?) since VirtualBox crashing
 
@DavidPostill lmao
 
Ways to get your ticket to the back of my queue: 1. assigning it as a P1
 
2:09 PM
what about P0?
 
Bob
@allquixotic Varnish does em
 
lol
@BenN what priority is PowerShell v999999999999999999999999 for you? Priority Yesterday?
Big Bang -> perfect PowerShell that does precisely what you want every time reliably with no bugs by entering a zero-byte program
 
Actually I got a bit impatient and compiled an alpha version of PowerShell 6 from the GitHub source
 
o_O
u guys scare me
there's no P0 ere
:D
 
2:14 PM
@BenN scares me
 
There is 'Tim, can you have a look at this please', which happens supprisingly a lot ;D
currently downloading gb's worth of drivers to try and figure out wtf failed to install correctly on this laptop
 
Here (RA) there's "oneboxes HALP"
 
So I guess this is P0, as in it stops being doing my normal work.
My teamleader has logged me outta the phones
is the odd thing is, i think my old teamleader lowered my priorities on all customers...
 
Bob
@allquixotic btw, I successfully migrated ZFS from jessie + ZoL-repo to stretch with Debian/contrib repo
 
so even when I log back in, I still get no calls
 
Bob
2:16 PM
took under an hour and booted the first try :D
 
You can't boot zfs on / without initrd still right?
that stuff neeeeeeeeeds to go in kernel :(
 
Bob
feeling pretty happy after my last few attempts with zfs
@djsmiley2k depends how you do it
personally I plonk an initrd on the boot partition, which sits on a flash drive, and boot directly off efistub
 
@Bob nice
 
Bob
grub's got decent zfs support in its stage2 now
 
my server is standing still (except security updates) until about 1 month after the gold release of Ubuntu 18.04
 
2:18 PM
@Bob .... decent enough to actually boot?
 
I have one fairly production workload on it now that can't afford to go down... much
 
the same way mdadm used to be able to boot?
Grub 0.97 used to handle mdadm fine, Grub 2 couldn't :/
 
Bob
@djsmiley2k yes? most systems use it
@JourneymanGeek's server is built on it
 
sweetabix
 
@allquixotic's server is built on it
 
2:18 PM
tho still using initrd with grub2?
 
Bob
was pretty straightforward actually
 
/me cries on the initrds
 
Bob
@djsmiley2k I think so.
@allquixotic I avoided upgrading until stretch release cause jessie and ZoL had a compat break last year
I need to sort out live kernel updates sometime
 
o_O
since when did my USB drive write at 30Mb/s
or was windows showing me MB/s :/
 
Megababies per second!
 
2:22 PM
MB.
hmmm
eitherway this HDD seems to have gotten a lot faster than it used to be o_O
 
@Bob I get them free from Canonical
besides that, check out kernelcare
 
k my phone has turned off 3 or 4 times in the last day :/
and now it won't turn on :/;
plz send me phone @NotDog
 
that's what happens when you don't charge it?
 
Nah, it's old
it's a reconditioned S4
god knows how old it is
but as I can't afford a replcement...
k I think the battery might actually be dead
found it 'dead' in my pocket. plugged into usb and it tells me 90% charged
tried to boot - goes blank
done that twice so just reattached it again. :/
 
@djsmiley2k a new battery is relatively cheap if you get one made out of fire, assuming it doesn't explode at the post office
 
2:37 PM
@djsmiley2k well, it's fairly recent... oh, 4 years old, still fairly recent though.
 
4 years for a smartphone battery is an extremely long time though
that's the tail end of its lifespan
 
@allquixotic 0_0
 
nod
 
I could sell you a Samsung J3-V, but shipping would probably ruin the deal
 
@allquixotic made out of fire? D:
 
2:39 PM
also the -V might make it problematic on your carriers
 
WHat's a J3-V?
 
@djsmiley2k yes
 
The telco offered the wife a J3 on some upgrade deal
 
@djsmiley2k a much newer (mid-2016) but much lower-end (budget) model
 
@allquixotic aliexpress.com/item/… that?
 
2:40 PM
the J3-V is just Verizon branded
 
£68, I could pick one of those up
How does it compare to a S4?
 
@djsmiley2k it's similar, actually :P the S4 might be a little physically larger, but the J3 would have more modern components, it runs the latest Android pretty well
performance is probably similar
 
nice.
 
but since the J3 is new, the battery would be new
 
I'll concider picking up one of those then, thanks :D
I have no clue about phones.
urgh ok
more like £150 :;/
Buy your phone today for £119
 
2:42 PM
the latest gen budget phones use the modern fab processes like current flagship phones do, but they get cut-down chips that are cheaper to make, or high-end SoCs that had problems with them, they disable some of the cores or run the clock lower during the binning process
 
2016 model?
 
I don't know that the US Verizon model would work all that well on your LTE bands, that's all
plus the shipping would suck
 
that's better, £116
@allquixotic you've at least guided me towards something usable
how is it with games such as the stupid king games etc?
 
casual games? fine; there are games EA makes that are fairly demanding of the GPU that it might not handle very well
 
nah, casual crap
 
2:44 PM
only like 5-10% of Android games (if that) demand any kind of beefy GPU
 
yup, but if I didn't ask you'd tell me off :P
 
they're "purchase justifiers" for the S8+ and such
 
you might be able to get a refurbed 2015 J3 for your price range around 68 lbs
 
68 lbs of what?
 
2:49 PM
Actually
I might still have insurance on it from the bank
(part of the deal to get our mortage)
 
@JourneymanGeek 68 lbs of weight.
 
weight of what?
 
the phone weighs 68 lbs.
 
lol
 
that's a joke
 
2:53 PM
Uh, since ssh sucks on windows, what about telnet?
 
but, yeah a 10AH battery is heavy.
 
not sure about security of telnet.
 
WinRM FTW
 
2:55 PM
OH YEAH!?
WELL THEN I'LL CREATE MY OWN THING
 
psexec.
 
A SECURE THINGY
AND SHOW YOU PEOPLE
;P
 
IN BATCH ONLY
 
YES
I'LL DO IT!
In return for 200 rep
Anyone up for the challenge?
 
Without some form of PKI you're going to have security problems
 
2:57 PM
@satibel *nudge*
 
@BenN I just got a fantastic idea, no I won't
 
@BenN I'll do my own PKI with black jack and hookers!
 
> The company is not specifying how many program/erase cycles its 3D QLC NAND will handle, but various industry predictions over the years have suggested 100 – 150 P/E cycles as a reasonable goal for QLC NAND, which is considerably lower than approximately 1000 P/E cycles supported by TLC NAND.
 
Meh. Is no one game?
 
2:58 PM
I doubt this sort of NAND will see use in anything but the cheapest storage devices.
 
@Rahul2001 clever lad
 
I suppose you could have an enormous OTP
 
@JourneymanGeek okay, 100 rep
@BenN nope, better idea
like 200 times better
 
Care to share? ;)
If it involves a web server over HTTPS, that's PKI :p
 
@bwDraco for WORM DBs
 
2:59 PM
use 80s style copy protection for security ;p
 
@bwDraco actually, if your OS drive is on some other storage technology, for many gamers a secondary high capacity drive with that QLC would be just fine
 
However, the fact that this sort of NAND is becoming necessary rather than "a nice thing to have for cheap applications" shows that we are knee-deep in the NAND shortage.
 
chuck your Steam library on there
 
@BenN Nope, see. If I use a standard password, and verify it server-side, it can be intercepted, right? And it wouldn't matter even if I hashed it before sending it, because then a malicious dude could just send the hash over and get authenticated
 
most games don't write to their game folder except for saves, and those are small... and patches are incremental
 
3:01 PM
I'm pretty sure most applications will have a higher-endurance general-purpose drive in front of it for everyday use.
 
@BenN Well, what if when I login, I send the "password+thecurrenttime" hashed? And then verify it at the server? It wouldn't help if the malicious dude got the hash, because it
would keep changing. Unless he can spoof the thing within a second
 
my steam drive has like 5 TB written, so 100 e/w would be ok.
 
@satibel exactly
 
@Rahul2001 By the time it got to the server thecurrenttime is some ms wrong ...
 
I'd pay $700 for an 8 TB near-WORM 3D QLC SATA SSD for storing my Steam library, as long as the read perf and read IOPS was comparable with, like, the 850 Evo
 
3:03 PM
@DavidPostill +/- 2 seconds should do it
 
QLC makes sense as nearline storage, e.g. backups.
 
@Rahul2001 use a KDF, not a hash.
 
@satibel whazzat?
 
@DavidPostill current time by a second
 
@DavidPostill not if both systems are constantly synced to GPS time :D
 
3:04 PM
They need to get the pricing as low as possible, and use the most powerful ECC available.
 
@allquixotic woosh
 
@Rahul2001 What happens when there's a MITM??
 
@BenN Rahul kills them with a $5 wrench
 
@BenN 2 seconds is enough time for the MITM to do their stuff.
 
That is, how is it verified that the instructions (once the user is logged in) are legit?
 
3:06 PM
##xkcd wrench
oh that's right the google search api is broken for bot
 
@BenN Send the hash along with every instruction, obviously ;p
 
So the MITM gets the hash, bolts it on to some other command, and sends it along :p
 
Rahul could build an army of elite hackers who actively monitor his network connections for MITMs from his Casanova list of ex-girlfriends
just teach them CISSP and DevOpsSec
 
 
Right I'm going to bed. If the sort of thing that happened yesterday happens, do the needful
 
3:08 PM
@BenN hm. I hate you
 
In your defense, you're trying to solve an impossible problem :)
 
@JourneymanGeek If I'm not eating supper I will :)
 
we need another mod to cover the donut hole in chat moderation: Geek is sleeping and @DavidPostill is eating supper
 
@DavidPostill oh, you're supposed to. Just letting the ROs and any locally foreign mods who happen to be by
 
Night Geek
 
3:10 PM
Night
 
Nighties ^•^
 
Bat?
oh, I get it, @satibel wants to become a • mod instead of a ♦ mod
 
Moogle.
 
I want to be a ø mod
 
a dead phone battery will deliver dropped voltage, right?
that'd explain why the phone turns off once it's booted I guess...
 
3:13 PM
so....
 
tho it says it's 99% charged :/
 
@djsmiley2k fuel gauges on failing batteries can't be relied upon
 
@JourneymanGeek @DavidPostill what happened yesterday?
 
@allquixotic ah yes true
 
@Burgi dram
 
3:13 PM
so it might be dead battery, saying it's full D:
 
@allquixotic any headlines?
 
A mod 2Ï€
 
a wee dram
 
i notice @NotDog isn't banned so it couldn't have been that bad... ;)
 
@Burgi oh, they're not at fault
@Rahul2001 you ought to ignore him, feeding trolls and all that
 
3:15 PM
@JourneymanGeek Think I will
 
and reallly niiight
 
@BenN Is there no way to make my "secure" system work?
 
No, you literally cannot authenticate communication without something pre-shared
For example, SSH has keys that are registered to users
 
@BenN normally with HTTPS what we use as "pre-shared" is verifying the server is legit using PKI and the trust chain
 
3:27 PM
Yep!
Secure Windows traffic is protected by Kerberos, checked against the domain controller(s)
Note that with HTTPS, the client has to have a set of trusted root certification authorities pre-installed
 
So, gave this QLC some thought: I'm kinda thinking that if they can manufacture and market a QLC storage device appropriately (backup drives, read-focused nearline), they could sell. They absolutely need to get the cost down as low as possible, though.
 
which is why wget on my server doesn't like my AlphaSSL trusted cert that works in Chrome, FF and IE 11 :P
 
ahhhhh error 10!
:/
 
on phone?
 
The last thing you want is a QLC NAND drive that fails in less than a year's time because it's used in the wrong application.
 
3:30 PM
@allquixotic nah, some installer for a laptop that's playing up
 
go to store and ask for cheapest refurb they have
 
port find failed, error 10
hmmmm
 
:D
I'm pretty sure it's the battery, I'll check with the bank, see if they'll replace it
if not, I'll likely pick up a new J3
 
@djsmiley2k O_o
 
3:31 PM
@allquixotic yah exactly.
 
custom app?
 
If they market it improperly and shoehorn QLC NAND into, say, a 256 GB-class general-purpose SSD that dies after scarcely more than 20 TBW of host writes, their reputation is going to suffer badly.
 
@Burgi Nick happened yesterday ...
 
oh the numpty finally nuked himself?
 
(Yes, I do have more than 20 TBW on my main laptop's SSD, which is 2.5 years old. I'm not afraid of it failing because it has Samsung 3D MLC NAND.)
Speaking of Samsung 3D NAND, in hindsight, it's just astounding how far ahead of its time it was, to the point where an almost 2.5-year-old SSD model is still sold today essentially unchanged from its original release and still leads the category by a wide margin.
 
3:47 PM
@bwDraco The correct reason for not worrying about it failing is 'I have backups'
say it again. 'I have tested, triplicate, offsite, backups'
 
My father just sent an email
 
Awesome. Evidence
sadly not normally usable in court tho
as email is so easily faked.
 
No, he is sending it to build evidence
"I write them such nice, kind emails"
I really don't want to meet him tomorrow, it'll ruin my sister's birthday for her :/
 
I have several different backup systems in place - the only truly offsite backups are my photo archives (and yes, I've had to restore from them), but I try to put my most critical data on multiple external drives.
 
@djsmiley2k There's DKIM though
 
3:51 PM
I'm no stranger to data loss.
Jan 7 '16 at 21:21, by bwDraco
Samsung is at least 18 months ahead of everyone else to a finished 3D NAND product.
 
4:13 PM
so from about 30 drivers, I've maanged to get one device installed
still 2 fighting me
3 fighting me, even
BCM20702A0, which is some broadcom chip, PCI Device, and Unknown Device, lol
0
Q: Consequence of deleting DNS cache service

BiswaIn Windows, there is a service named DNS Client service (dnscache) caches DNS names and registers the full computer name. When it is running only svchost.exe connects to DNS server. Then I stop and delete that service with the following process:: Set dependency of Network Store Interface Servic...

why. why does it matter? arrrugugggghgh
/me can't understand questions for the sake of questions
 
In general, it is not a good idea to delete OS components
 
=D
Ooo oo I know the answer to the final bit of this question...: 'Use Linux'
/me nods
Should that not be HKCU?
 
4:28 PM
I'm bored of arch.
 
I don't want to approve the edit before I know it's right
 
Can someone recommend me an OS?
 
@Avery gentoo!
or start doing something useful such as documentation, or writing tools
 
I might install redstar
 
I don't understand how you can be bored of a tool lol
 
4:30 PM
@Avery haha
@Avery telegram, if you're free...
 
@DavidPostill ah ok
 
absolutely glorious
 
lol
 
wow
this thing has proper checks
and proper korean.
woot
this thing uses ext3
 
ok wtf
where in exhcange manager is the bit to set 'send as' permissions o_O
as right now I can't see it
 
4:39 PM
well I will test this on next monday on a live vm.
 
Right, got FTP, SFTP, SSH set up
Also, telnet, but that's a last resort
 
@djsmiley2k I think you have to use PowerShell
2
 
@BenN that comment deserves like 100 stars, seriously
 
:D
 
@BenN That's getting kinda old -_-
 
4:53 PM
I'm serious
 
No it's not! PowerShell 6 is coming out, that's new
the next release should be called "Fruit Rollups"
because of Powershell's inane array rolling behaviour
 
I do find the array handling a bit noodly
Oh wait, @djsmiley2k might need Organization Management and Recipient Management permissions to see that option
It's also possible that I'm looking at the wrong documentation set, since I don't know what Exchange version/edition/setup you have
 
I had a lot of fun puzzling out how to create "real" 2D arrays (NOT jagged arrays) in PowerShell that could be marshalled over COM to Excel to store in the Value2 property which would set a range of Excel cells' values in a single COM roundtrip, improving performance by about 10000x over setting individual cells
 
[Array]::CreateInstance($type, @($dim1, $dim2))
But yeah, I'm not aware of a PS-idiomatic way of doing that
Being a .NET programmer helps a lot with PowerShell stuff
 
I'm pretty decent with C#
 
5:02 PM
@BenN haha I found it :P
 
I wrote a nested loop in PSH to convert a .NET jagged array (arrays of arrays) to a 2D array, and that n^2 complexity is still way faster than the COM calls for individual .Value setting for each item
because each iteration of the inner loop is all within the PowerShell .NET runtime, it isn't cross process IPC
 
@BenN migrating from 2010 to 2013 I think
I'm not the exchange admin
 
$returnval = New-Object 'object[,]' $jagged.Length,$numCols
 
I'm the guy getting tickets because they've not done their job properly :/
 
Ah, that's more PowerShelly
 
5:06 PM
function JaggedToMultiArray($jagged, $numCols) { $returnval = New-Object 'object[,]' $jagged.Length,$numCols for($i=0; $i -lt $jagged.Length; $i++) { for($j=0; $j -lt $numCols; $j++) { If($jagged[$i][$j] -eq $null) { $jagged[$i][$j] = "" } $returnval[$i, $j] = [string]::Copy($jagged[$i][$j]) } } ,$returnval }
bad formatting, manually typed from other system
 
what i a jagged (i wrote jaded lol) array/
 
@djsmiley2k a 2D array is a linear memory block of values where each row has the same number of columns (it's simply an assumption that's made) and you tell the system upon memory allocation how many rows and columns, it multiplies them together and gives you a buffer large enough to hold rows*cols items
a jagged array is a single dimensional linear array of "object pointers" where each object pointer points to another single dimensional array, each of which has its own arbitrary size and can reside in different regions of memory too
 
How do you feel about the PowerShell 5 new pseudo-method as opposed to New-Object?
 
so if you want to deep copy an entire jagged array and all element boxes, you have to copy the overarching "row array" as well as the contents of each pointed-to array (which can reside in other areas of memory)
 
should it be closed, because it's impossible? :/
 
5:10 PM
if you want to deep copy a 2D array, as long as you know the pointer that starts the buffer and the size in bytes of the buffer, a single memcpy() will copy the entire array
 
@allquixotic an array of arrays?
 
@djsmiley2k "It's impossible" is a valid answer, cf. How to Answer
 
of course if the element items are object pointers that point to mutable objects you have to copy each element's data as well
 
@BenN ty, no close vote.
 
Whoops wrong help center article
 
5:10 PM
@djsmiley2k in short, yes
but a 2D array is not an array of arrays
 
it's just an array by the look of things
where each row is either a value, or an object, with multiple values, attached?
 
in native code, assembly, C/C++, COM interop on Windows, and the .NET Runtime, 2D arrays are possible; in some languages, only jagged arrays are possible
 
aaaa bbbb cccc
-----------------
a         x     y
- a1    x1    y1
- a2    x2    y2
b        z      z
- b1    z1    A
- b2
 
That's more of a tree I think
In a jagged array, every element of the highest-level array is an array, but the lengths can be different for each sub-array
 
jagged: a = [ b, c, d, e, f ] where each of b/c/d/e/f is its own separate 1D array, with its own pointer to a region in memory where its contents reside and has its own independent size or length
 
5:13 PM
So you could have [[1], [2, 3, 4], [5, 6]] whereas that's not doable with a 2D array
 
2D: a = [ b c d e ] where the b/c/d/e are elements of data (not arrays!) and we visually "treat" the first two values as row 1, column 1 for b; row 1, column 2 for d; row 2, column 1 for e; and row 2, column 2 for e
 
a = / 1 2 \
    \ 3 4 /
So a[0, 1] = 2
 
memory itself is logically laid out in linear blocks, not 2D, though, so any time you talk about higher dimensional arrays in programming, they're just represented as linear "buffers" of bytes (basically a native C array) in memory
the fact that it's higher dimensional is an illusion that the programmer or the syntax of the language imagines onto it
and in some languages you can access a 2D array's elements with single dimensional array access methods
a[2] in 0-indexed array access in C would give you 3 in Ben's example above
so would a[1, 0]
 
Using jagged arrays, we'd say a = [[1, 2], [3, 4]] and get a[1][0] = 3
Because a[1] is itself an array containing 3 and 4
 
jagged arrays are considerably less space efficient if you intend to use every possible cell in a 2D array, but are extremely efficient if you intend to have "sparse" values
basically imagine a 2D matrix of points, like the multiplication table -- if you intend to have a lot of "holes" where there's no data and you never intend to put any data there, jagged arrays are more efficient
if you know in advance that most or all of the places in the grid will be filled with meaningful data, a 2D array is more efficient
Maps and Dictionaries are conceptually like jagged arrays in some ways (though they're often stored under the hood in a hash table), and it would be very inefficient to represent a Map or a Dictionary with a 2D array in memory
because Bob may have 16 phones (so a[0].size would be 16) but djsmiley might have one phone, so a[1].size would be 1
if you had to store that in a 2D array you'd need to allocate as many "columns" as needed for all the people and the maximum number of phones one person can have, so if someone just has one phone, they waste tons of memory
 
5:27 PM
wow
sorry for asking xD
 
No problem - if you need another deluge of information in the future, you know where to find us :)
 
never be sorry for asking a question
 
hehe
my brain hurts
But the explination is good
Want me to post the same question on SO? XD
 
326
Q: What are the differences between a multidimensional array and an array of arrays in C#?

ecleelWhat are the differences between multidimensional arrays double[,] and array-of-arrays double[][] in C#? If there is a difference, what is the best use for each one?

 
Look at all that rep I could of had D:
Anyone link me to the XY question problem?
 
5:48 PM
You can find most such things by searching Meta Stack Exchange
 
@djsmiley2k H key current unix?
 
gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah
why are some users such %^$£Wheads
ty ty
time to nuke this laptop
 

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