Root Access

1:00 PM

Man... 21 posts... all windows 8... this is going to be tough

anybody know if you can search date ranges within SE?

Best answer in a while…

> Here's the short answer, without any nerdy excuses: Computers are stupid. (I'm a senior software developer, so I should know) :)

Thank you Mr. senior software developer for your very factual insights!

KronoS

@slhck link!

slhck

@KronoS 10k though superuser.com/a/491609

KronoS

@slhck Oh.... Dangit people! Hurry up and push me past 10k already!

slhck

You should just become a mod straight away

KronoS

1:14 PM

I'm not sure that's even possible... we type in a democratic society.

Sathya

@slhck people are even more stupid

slhck

@KronoS We actually don't, SEI can appoint mods :P

Sathya

@KronoS date ranges as in?

@slhck fwiw he did try.. you beat him to it :P

slhck

heh

KronoS

@Sathya this is very true... if you hadn't run @slhck I probably would've made it :P

(note: I'm really glad you did run and you've done a great job thus far)

@Sathya from certain dates... I.E. from when the contest started

Sathya

1:18 PM

19

Q: Add date range to "Advanced Super Ninja Search Options"

Can we have some date-related advanced super ninja search options please? Something along the lines of maxage:30 find posts less than 30 days old from:yyyy-mm-dd find posts no older than yyyy-mm-dd to:yyyy-mm-dd find posts no newer than yyyy-mm-dd or, more expl...

@KronoS no kidding, those new kids outpace us old bozos in the Mod leaderboard

allquixotic

@_@

KronoS

@Sathya ah sweet thanks

slhck

@KronoS Haha, thank you :)

But you too, with the whole blog thing

@allquixotic sup

KronoS

@slhck oh... I've been working on that for some time now... back when I ran for the first time in fact

allquixotic

@slhck My eyes are onions!

KronoS

1:23 PM

I'd like to say that I was the force that drove SE to create the site blogs in the first place... but I imagine they would've done it without. But hey the thought at least make me feel like I've done something worthwhile :)

slhck

@allquixotic Shouldn't try to cut them then, you'd probably cry.

@KronoS Cool, didn't even know that. It must have been before I ever visited chat :P

KronoS

if only it were that easy @clippy... if only

2

Ivo Flipse

Super User Blog: Super User’s Top Question of the Week [9 Jan - 16 Jan]

kronos on January 17, 2011

This week featured Top Question comes from Pekka:

Fixing Bent Pins on the CPU

Intel and AMD have started to utlilize the new “pinless” CPU technology so this issue shouldn’t be a problem for too much longer. But if you’re like me, you still have an old p4 system lying around and it’s a pain when you realize that you’ve bent a pin on a processor. So what do you do when you’ve found that you’ve bent one or a few of the processor pins? Well first take a deep breath and realize that at least you don’t have it as bad as HowToGeek had it when he, on accident, dropped and bent around 50 processors. …

slhck

Nice :P

Ivo Flipse

We started the chatroom a little later: chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/356/2011/3/15

in Root Kit, Jan 10 '11 at 16:05, by KronoS

I'm willing to help out on the blogging idea, and hopefully will be able to get that going for ya...

Probably because we used our hidden room for it :P

KronoS

1:29 PM

ha ha... oh man good memories

slhck

Short SU history lesson

Ivo Flipse

You make me feel old :P

Sathya

grandpa @IVo

2

Ivo Flipse

@Sathya Looks who's talking

Sathya

:P

KronoS

1:32 PM

Man... why can't C++ be just a little more like Python... or even C#... all these pointers... I'm just so lost

Ivo Flipse

Sathya

@IvoFlipse I know, that was intentional :P

Ivo Flipse

I know, but the other probably didn't :P

Sathya

haha

was waiting for you to pick it up :P

slhck

Ah, I remember that.

Why don't we get any cards? :(

Ivo Flipse

1:36 PM

@slhck Too new :P

Perhaps we'll all get new ones, because I certainly can't use these

slhck

haha

These Dell computers are creeping me out. Every other minute, they spin up all the fans, even though they're powered off.

Anyway, heading home, laters folks

Oliver Salzburg

@IvoFlipse What is this? O___O

Ivo Flipse

@OliverSalzburg My business cards from SEI

Oliver Salzburg

Those look shiny...

Glowing rep :D

Everything needs more glow...

allquixotic

OK, I have much srs business to take care of today. I'll be around for questions that ya'll know are my areas of expertise (ping me directly) but am trying to get REAL WORK DONE, K

/me goes to browse SU to answer questions as soon as he types this

Sathya

1:48 PM

what-is love ;) — Sathya 28 secs ago

tombull89

@Sathya That's what I would have done :P

KronoS

@OliverSalzburg what are you browsing with?

Tom Wijsman

@KronoS Rule 1: Don't use pointers in C++ until you really need them.

KronoS

@TomWijsman I need them :/

Tom Wijsman

But do you really need them? A lot of people that start out use way too much pointers where you could just use references instead.

KronoS

1:54 PM

@TomWijsman I'm pretty sure I do

tombull89

0

Q: Super User Dark Theme

Get it here GitHub https://github.com/oliversalzburg/superuser-dark-theme StyleBot Social http://stylebot.me/styles/1798 Additional Shots

script style

I guess...

Sathya

@tombull89 :-D

Tom Wijsman

And well, there's also the smart pointers and so on to avoid common mistakes.

still waiting for @OliverSalzburg to fix the various contrast problems.

KronoS

@tombull89 nice

@TomWijsman If you head over to Fake Programmers you'll see what I'm distressing about

Oliver Salzburg

@KronoS What @tombull89 said

@TomWijsman The contrast problems are strongly related to the contrast of the display device :D

Tom Wijsman

2:08 PM

@OliverSalzburg Then fix yours, because mine is fine... lagom.nl/lcd-test :P

Oliver Salzburg

@TomWijsman Well I have multiple screens. I have to tailor for all of them :P

And they can't all be fixed. The 90° rotation on the outside screens is really problematic

But please point out any specific contrast issues (and put them on the tracker on GitHub or something) and I'll see what I can do :)

allquixotic

@OliverSalzburg oh geez. you're one of "those people" who puts widescreen monitors in portrait mode?

Oliver Salzburg

@allquixotic I wasn't aware that we are an official group

allquixotic

2:25 PM

@OliverSalzburg you're a member of an elite pedigree... Gill Bates; my boss (who used to work at MSFT); and... not me :P

I'm sure you wreak havoc on website designers and fullscreen / non-resizable windowed app designers :P they must be like "wut? Can't you keep your monitor widescreen like most people?"

Oliver Salzburg

I don't need 6400 pixels horizontal space. Everything I use all the time (teh webz) scrolls vertically. Horizontal space is such a waste

I even styled all SE sites I visit to be left-aligned instead of centered

allquixotic

heh

Oliver Salzburg

Now I can still watch a 720p movie comfortably next to it

allquixotic

horizontal space is critical for Eclipse, Outlook, Word, and a bunch of sites I use

Oliver Salzburg

But the viewing angle on the portrait once is horrible :P

r.tanner.f

2:28 PM

I'd love to turn my screen vertically, but I'm pretty sure would my co-workers would look at me funny (more often...)

allquixotic

I have a largeish 4:3 monitor for when I really want greater vertical without having an awkward res

Oliver Salzburg

@allquixotic Well, yeah, but there's only so much I can use. In my IDE, I have both 1200x1920 screens for all tool windows and STILL have 2560x1440 only to view the code.

And I would never use that, because hardly anyone likes to read code lines that are 500 chars long

allquixotic

squished HTML and GtkBuilder files :/ word wrap, sure, but if it breaks in the middle of a word it's annoying

Oliver Salzburg

Also, if I didn't use portrait, I'd need a larger desk

...and a larger office, I guess

allquixotic

lol

desk size isn't an issue here, at least at work... I keep my desk purposefully clean and could fit at least another 24" monitor (widescreen) within comfortable viewing range

only issued two monitors tho

one is a 16:9 and one is a 4:3, so i get the best of both worlds imho

I haven't been able to find a single aspect ratio and resolution that I'm happy with for everything, so having a variety of monitor sizes and shapes is most convenient

Blog bot

2:32 PM

Blog - Stack Exchange: SE Podcast #34 – Kyle Brandt and Nick Craver

Alex Miller on October 23, 2012

On the show this week are Kyle Brand and Nick Craver, two SE employees who are heading up our systems upgrades and relocations – they’ll dish all kinds of details on our infrastructure, plus plenty of chat about other mildly relevant things.

First up on the agenda: Quantcast! Five minutes before we started recording, we noticed that Quantcast is ranking our network at #100! (or at least we were for a bit)

If all that additional traffic should cause our New York data center to go down, what will happen, Kyle? Great segue, Joel! We are working on a system for failing over to our datacenter in Corvallis, OR. …

allquixotic

if the company had the budget I wouldn't be opposed to having one vertical widescreen too, explicitly for reading long (narrow) documents, but my 4:3 is good enough for that for now

Oliver Salzburg

@allquixotic I can definitely relate to that. :D

allquixotic

@OliverSalzburg I think there is an exponential graph there, relating number of different types/shapes/orientation of monitors on the X axis, and amount of incredulity/confusion/jealousy from coworkers on the Y axis

x = 1, y = 0

x = 2, y = 2

x = 3, y = 8

x = 4, y = 32

not sure i'm following an exponential pattern here

Oliver Salzburg

:D

allquixotic

I've already gotten a few "?????" looks from older coworkers wondering how I could work with a 4:3 and a 16:9

Oliver Salzburg

2:38 PM

You know you're special when the image is repeated :P browsersize.googlelabs.com

allquixotic

interesting

if you can gather this data for people who actually visit your site using Google Analytics, that's pretty awesome

Oliver Salzburg

@allquixotic You can

analytics.blogspot.de/2012/06/…

That's (now) the whole idea to my understanding

allquixotic

i'm not sure but i think we already use google analytics, but i don't know if we use that feature

Journeyman Geek

ugh. Is anyone a question away from getting to level 1? I've got an answer I have trouble formulating a question to ;p

Oliver Salzburg

@JourneymanGeek MeMeMe

allquixotic

2:41 PM

although our entire UI is explicitly designed to work on a 1024x768 screen with "reasonable" amounts of the screen occupied by the start menu and browser chrome

Journeyman Geek

i.sstatic.net/62BNu.png I worked out the difference between modernUI and standard apps is the process that spawns them.

allquixotic

@JourneymanGeek is it svchost or runtimebroker that spawns modern apps?

Journeyman Geek

neither

its services.exe

wait, which is spawned by wininit

allquixotic

that doesn't make sense.

svchost is just a container for N Windows services; svchost is spawned by services.exe for native servers too

Oliver Salzburg

@JourneymanGeek What @allquixotic said :D

allquixotic

2:44 PM

saying "modern apps spawn from svchost" doesn't tell you which service.

Journeyman Geek

lol

allquixotic

saying "modern apps spawn from a service" does provide some information, but without knowing which exact service that is, it's of limited utility. it's kind of funny though; I wonder if the modern app spawner gets its own svchost instance? if not, you could have your native service living in the same process as the modern app spawner... that could be cool

Journeyman Geek

never mind then. There's a pattern. I don't bloody see it.

allquixotic

well, the whole wininit spawns services.exe spawns svchost instance(s) is as old as windows NT, AFAIK

Journeyman Geek

yes, but everything else is spawned from explorer

allquixotic

2:46 PM

programs that you start on your desktop are run from the shell as the parent process, yes

Journeyman Geek

the WWA hosts are webapps. livecomm handles networking.

allquixotic

but just because something is a child of wininit/services/svchost does not imply that it is a modern UI app

Journeyman Geek

@allquixotic: oh, all these are.

allquixotic

I can write a native service that has that same parent ancestry which has nothing to do with modern

Journeyman Geek

I checked.

there's a reason there's two IE instances ;p

It makes perfect sense. I just have no idea what I am doing.

allquixotic

2:48 PM

are those processes running as your user? (the ones that are the child of svchost)

typically services run as a service account such as LocalSystem or NetworkService or even SYSTEM but they rarely (if ever) run as the logged-in user

Journeyman Geek

all of the ones in question are.

allquixotic

it could be a distinguishing element if your modern apps run as your regular user

if you view all the processes on the system, not only those spawned by your user, you will see that there a bunch of svchost processes that are owned by other accounts

Journeyman Geek

OOh, I see

allquixotic

those are the system services, like windows audio, superfetch, networking, etc

Journeyman Geek

they all run under the same instance of svhost

allquixotic

2:51 PM

yeah, "svchost" is "many to one"; that is, many services can run within a single instance of svchost

Journeyman Geek

so all these are running under a copy of svchost as me..

allquixotic

but for some reason Windows sometimes isolates certain services in a separate process. one obvious reason for that would be if it's running as a different user, because you can't have services running as different users within the same process

but sometimes you'll see multiple svchost instances for the same user

not sure why, could be attempting to avoid address space exhaustion on 32-bit

Journeyman Geek

maybe.

allquixotic

maybe your question is, How are Modern UI apps sandboxed and how do they correspond to native processes?

once you/someone figures out the name of the service that hosts the sandbox and spawns the modern apps, you should probably be able to answer that question

Journeyman Geek

lol.

allquixotic

2:54 PM

you could then explain that the modern UI service (or whatever its name is) runs as your logged-in desktop user and spawns the modern processes as children, and then explain the supplementary processes that support a modern app

seems like you don't have all the info needed to answer right away tho

Journeyman Geek

At this point. I have no idea what I'm doing

if someone wants to ask tho.. ;p

allquixotic

and I don't even have a copy of Windows 8! I'm just going off of a screenshot

Journeyman Geek

nope ;p

allquixotic

I'll have a copy on Friday though

Journeyman Geek

And i quite honestly can't be arsed to actually answer any more questions, unless they are fun

allquixotic

2:56 PM

because obviously Microsoft isn't ready to push a button and put it up on Microsoft Store for download, right? that would be too hard for a company worth billions... no, we have to wait three more days

stupid schedules... stupid boxed products

they should just stop selling boxes, period

two ways to get Windows: buy a computer, or download it. end of story

if they did it that way I bet we'd already have had it on our computers in August rather than waiting 3 months for "manufacturing"

r.tanner.f

it would be interesting to know the number of people that actually buy a box

allquixotic

my dad is one, he doesn't trust online downloads worth more than a few bucks

thinks they will pull the download or something

r.tanner.f

@allquixotic fair enough IMO =\

allquixotic

truth is, all versions of Windows after Win2K have been ultimately dependent on Microsoft servers on the internet, due to windows product activation

so not trusting Windows Store is hypocritical if you trust WPA servers

r.tanner.f

eh, good point

allquixotic

3:00 PM

because if they pull WPA off the internet, no one can activate windows ever again without breaking the law and hacking their "DRM"

(with RemoveWAT or similar)

iirc WPA also gets checked when you update windows (definitely for service packs; maybe for ordinary updates) and definitely gets checked when you change out major hardware (something other than an accessory)

avirk

1

Q: Where does Windows-8 put the exe of the default browser for ModernUI?

I was trying to some hack with Win-8 and I found something which is really gonna out my mind. When I set the default browser to the IE then its icon become ModerUI and I can't see the option Open file location at the bottom when I select it by right click. But if I don't set it default then it be...

windows-8 default-browser

hey my first Q after installing Win-8 :P

Journeyman Geek

3:23 PM

@avirk: oh, I'm sorta trying to work it out. There's something going on.

I see @nhinkle hit level 3 as well, congratulations

avirk

@JourneymanGeek what is that?

allquixotic

I got a Motorola Razr Maxx HD yesterday! </brag>

Journeyman Geek

in the challenge?

avirk

@JourneymanGeek I lost a question of Windows-8

Journeyman Geek

@avirk: read up. we arn't really sure

but IE metro and IE Desktop are the same executable

allquixotic

3:26 PM

@JourneymanGeek ...spawned with a custom command line option or something to indicate whether it should be metro or not?

and are you sure they're the same executable and not just named the same?

you have to open file location to make sure that it's not "iexplorer.exe" in a "Metro" folder and "iexplorer.exe" in a "native" folder

avirk

@JourneymanGeek they are so there is my question starts that why they cahnge when the default app set to other? Even same with Chrome :P

Journeyman Geek

ya, did that. there's different switches, but running them directly dosen't seem to work.

@allquixotic: I checked cause I noticed this hunting down the mail app

which was a whole nother rabbit hole.

avirk

@JourneymanGeek question was about like "How to open the network list directly"! Forgeted the title :(

KronoS

3:49 PM

Bru ha ha... I'm becoming a Hyper-V expert

1

A: Migrating Windows Server 2008 R2 Hyper-V machines to Windows 8 Hyper-V

Hyper-V for Windows 8 is a newer version of Hyper-V (V3) than Hyper-V for Server 2008. It is not recommended to import VM's created from Windows 8 to Server 2008. However going from Server 2008 to Windows 8 has no problems. If you MUST migrate from Windows 8 to Server 2008 Hyper-V make sure to...

If only I could solve @Soandos problem

r.tanner.f

@KronoS would you happen to know if you can do live migrations on Win 8?

KronoS

4:07 PM

@r.tanner.f what do you mean by live migrations?

r.tanner.f

@KronoS move a VM from one machine to another without shutting it off

I played with it between two 2008 R2 machines just for fun. There's something special about playing hot potato with a web server around a class room while streaming video from it. =D

allquixotic

@r.tanner.f teleportation is the term virtualbox uses (it's supported this for quite a while) :P

how in the world can you stream video from a web server while the server's IP address is constantly changing? O_O

r.tanner.f

@allquixotic IP doesn't change?

allquixotic

@r.tanner.f o...

r.tanner.f

xD

allquixotic

4:11 PM

just the box it's on...

r.tanner.f

ya

allquixotic

but the box you move it to has to have the ability to get that IP address

like, you can't move it to another router

r.tanner.f

don't know. I didn't throw the potato that far. =D

allquixotic

i threw the potato out the window and it splattered on the pavement

sidran32

This is interesting. Apparently IE9/10 are the only browsers with full SVG support: voormedia.com/blog/2012/10/…

r.tanner.f

4:13 PM

Wow, SVG looks like crap in Chrome.

sidran32

It surprised me too! Even though I'm primarily an IE9 user.

r.tanner.f

IE finally gets a point in my book :P

that's the first since... well, since firefox and chrome didn't exist I guess.

sidran32

Haha

allquixotic

is SVG some kind of patent-encumbered format with a lot of vendor extensions from Apple and/or MSFT?

(I suppose that's two semi-independent questions)

sidran32

SVG came from Adobe, IIRC. And, no.

KronoS

4:16 PM

@r.tanner.f not in Windows 8 but in Windows 8 Server (Server 2012)

allquixotic

only three of the little squares in the test chart don't match for me (FF 16)

IE 9/10 and Opera are fully "there"; FF 13 and later are there except for one feature... I fail to see how IE is so unique in that regard. More stunning is how poorly Chrome does

sidran32

Scalable Vector Graphics

Scalable Vector Graphics (SVG) is a family of specifications of an XML-based file format for two-dimensional vector graphics, both static and dynamic (i.e., interactive or animated). The SVG specification is an open standard that has been under development by the World Wide Web Consortium (W3C) since 1999. SVG images and their behaviors are defined in XML text files. This means that they can be searched, indexed, scripted, and, if need be, compressed. As XML files, SVG images can be created and edited with any text editor, but it is often more convenient to create them with drawing pr...

allquixotic

I wonder which SVG implementations have proper support for URL payload validation (to make sure it's really an image) and which ones could be made to launch a Java applet by linking to an "image" with a completely different payload. :D

sidran32

@allquixotic IE9/10 are unique because they have everything checked off for supported, whereas the otherbrowsers have at least 1 not supported.

allquixotic

@sidran32 what doesn't Opera support? I don't see any red X's for Opera

sidran32

4:23 PM

Oh, except for Opera, you're right.

Somehow I missed that.

I'm still surprised that Chrome and Firefox don't have full support, though.

allquixotic

I'm not surprised at the lack of support for linked images, although that would be a fairly unusual thing to put in an SVG anyway

you've got an image file that links to a "live" resource over HTTP. that's the biggest WTF I've heard of since Java applets.

oh, the security implications!

sidran32

SVG is fairly unusual on the web today in general so that's not a fair assessment IMO. :P

allquixotic

it doesn't sound hard at all to implement though. I wouldn't be surprised if Mozilla hasn't implemented image linking due to the inability to properly determine that it is secure

it's one thing to throw some code out there; it's entirely another to validate it for security hardening before it hits the general public.

sidran32

Is it?

allquixotic

they'd probably have to do something similar to what their raster image renderers do, in order to make sure that no executable instructions are allowed to leak from the fetched HTTP resource into the environment.

sidran32

4:27 PM

I'm sure Microsoft and Opera did that.

allquixotic

I'm not. Have you seen the number of security flaws in IE?

And anyway, we have no way of telling, because the code to both those browsers is closed.

sidran32

Compared with the number of security flaws in Chrome or Firefox?

allquixotic

So even if we wanted to verify, we'd have to do blackbox testing, which is a lot slower and less reliable.

sidran32

The fact that Microsoft updates their software incredibly often actually means it's probably more secure than software from other vendors that is updated less often.

allquixotic

What's not incredibly often about releasing a point release for security vulnerabilities about 20 hours after releasing a major release? (FF 16.0.1)

By contrast, Microsoft has "patch Thursdays" (or is it Tuesdays?...) and they rarely release updates outside of that cycle.

sidran32

4:30 PM

Tuesdays. But you implied that they didn't release patches often.

So, then I'd say they're comparable. I've seen many people report that IE9 is pretty secure.

r.tanner.f

This is degrading to a browser contest all too quickly. In fact, since I stepped away from chat in the last ten minutes it looks like you guys have already dug trenches and are progressing towards chemical warfare.

sidran32

I'm not digging trenches. :) I have no qualms with any browser. I just thought it was an interesting article.

allquixotic

@r.tanner.f Of course it is. He's an entrenched MSFTie and I'm an entrenched FOSS guy. Whether the chemical warfare happens here or elsewhere, it's gunpowder with an unlit fuse.

r.tanner.f

@sidran32 You're an IE guy and you know it. ;P

sidran32

Truth be told, I felt that @allquixotic was being a bit apologetic and drawing assumptions without evidence, but was holding back because I didn't want to degrade it that much further.

@r.tanner.f I use IE9 primarily because it skins well with WindowBlinds. And it's good enough to not make me annoyed all the time. :P

r.tanner.f

4:32 PM

@sidran32 Annoyance is the only factor I consider in a browser.

sidran32

That's the only reason I switched from Chrome, which I used quite often previously, and have my parents use.

r.tanner.f

except I am a sucker for Chrome's web-page like settings, history, and downloads =D

sidran32

@r.tanner.f I don't use Firefox out of protest of what it has become since version 2.x. It was good, until it became Mozilla Redux.

allquixotic

CBA to continue this little spat. Had a nice degrading reply all typed up and deleted it. Onward with my lunch and work!

sidran32

I much preferred Chrome's tab sandboxing in individual processes. IE9 doesn't do that but it still feels more stable than Firefox ever did, IME.

Enjoy, @allquixotic. I should get lunch, then get back to work developing within CentOS. :)

allquixotic

4:39 PM

TRWTF is Flash, anyhow. The last browser I had that crashed at all for any reason which was not directly related to Flash (or Adobe Reader) was IE 6. And even I'm not low enough to bash MSFTies for IE 6. It's in the past, just like Linux 1.0, which lacked support for SMP.

r.tanner.f

Death to Flash!

allquixotic

what in the world? slashdot.org/story/12/10/22/1634219

we got hit with a 6.0 here and it didn't do anything but require us to repaint some old churches whose paint was so old and crusty that the shaking shook it right off the building.

sidran32

IE sucked before 9 anyway. :P

Is that the Italy thing? Yeah, saw that. So messed up.

allquixotic

stuck with 8 on the GFE, although I only use it for ActiveX based internal stuff... everything else, FF.

would be Chrome but more app security testing tools on FF due to its age and the historically open plugin API whereas Chrome's plugin API is still maturing

FF is coming out with a new javascript JIT compiler soon, anyway, and it's expected to be as fast as v8 for most workloads

should bring FF into performance parity with chrome for the most part

maaan, this office is creepy when it's empty. maybe I'm missing an all hands meeting or something but I'm like the only one here

Jared Tritsch

5:09 PM

This contest is harder than I thought...

Its not just making awesome answers, but getting people to vote for them...

allquixotic

@JaredTritsch True. Best start making shill accounts ;-D

(don't take that seriously please)

r.tanner.f

2

Q: Metro or Modern UI?

In the previews of Windows 8 everyone was talking about Metro and since a few weeks ago it's called Modern UI. Why the change and should I stop using the term Metro?

windows-8 modern-ui windows-phone

I considered doing this myself... but thought it might be OT

or something

My vote would be to call it fair game :P

but... it's not really a problem, so NARQ?

allquixotic

sure! closing stuff is fun

r.tanner.f

isn't it though? :P

allquixotic

it's 10 times more fun to close a windows-8 question

r.tanner.f

5:23 PM

Next level: DENIED

allquixotic

it's like saying "THAT'S MY PRIZE!"

like reaching out with your arm in a horde of people and sticking your fingers in someone else's mouth to hold them back so you can get in front of them

r.tanner.f

@allquixotic I hate stifling laughter at work :P

sidran32

I'm back

By the way, I have no problem with FOSS. I actually like it a lot. I just also find Microsoft to make some good products as well, these days, so I have no problem using them either.

allquixotic

It's really irrelevant. Unless you're Richard Stallman, you're going to end up using some of each in your daily life, either by force, coercion, lack of other options, etc. Philosophical battles have to be fought on a different battleground; flame wars directed at users are silly.

For instance, I could fight my philosophical battle by convincing my employer to migrate certain systems/servers/desktops (the latter being the holy grail :P) away from Windows

not much convincing left on the server-side, though... already using a lot of Linux, Solaris, and IBM z/OS

not much windows there at all

I'm forced to use Windows or lose my job, but at least I get a few choices (my browser used for black-box testing being one of them) and the opportunity to show coworkers cool stuff that FF or Chrome (or plugins for them) can do that IE can't, etc.

@Mokubai Hey there wood-number! LTNS

r.tanner.f

<--- works in a 99.8% Windows environment

We have one router that runs Linux. That's it.

Also FOSS is weird.

sidran32

5:38 PM

lol

@allquixotic I find ideology to be irrelevent when talking about tools, which technology really is. I do believe FOSS is important and vital to the software ecosystem and industry. But that's as far as I go. What is most important to me is using the right tool (or a tool that is competant in all that I need it for) for the job.

Also, my new laptabletop really needs to get here quicker. Shipping on Friday. Too far in the future. D:

r.tanner.f

Philosophy and ideology are always irrelevant.

Doesn't make them any less important. :P

allquixotic

Ideology is irrelevant when talking about tools until it's ideology that inconveniences you, causes you harm, restricts your rights, costs you money, or some combination of the above.

In other words, if you take an otherwise-suitable tool and change the ideology behind which it is distributed (say, the licensing agreement) and it works out better for you, it's hard to call that irrelevant, since it's a material difference in the cost/benefit analysis you're performing.

It's so relevant, in fact, that at least a simple majority of web servers, mail servers, routers, and other such "infrastructure" services out there are now running free operating systems (as in beer, at least; if not also as in freedom), and in many of those cases, the choice was made because an alternative would cost heinous licensing fees or hide features behind a paywall.

Doesn't seem irrelevant to me.

KronoS

0

A: How do I automatically change the lock screen image?

Bing My Lockscreen (currently released with more updates coming) is doing exactly this with the Bing Photos. Bing My Lockscreen allows you to select from the eight most recent Bing images and quickly select which of them to set your lock screen to use. In addition Bing My Locks...

Feels good to promote another users app

I just wish I had the time to make headway on mine.

and get it release soon

Is this on topic for here?

0

Q: Vim command needs a bit of explaining for me

I've been using Vimgolf as a bit of professional development. In this particular task One of the best solutions is the following command. <C-V>Gg?ZZ I understand ZZ is to save and exit - and that control-v is entering visual mode, but the Gg? looks like sorcery for me. Google is let...

vim

sidran32

@allquixotic That is true. Though I find instances where that particular circumstance impacts me is rare. I do espouse an ideology that software patents are altogether a bad thing, for instance. Also, Linux's ideology about its driver ecosystem does cause difficulties when it comes to graphics drivers. But for the most part, I'm pretty ideology-less when it comes to software. :P

allquixotic

5:54 PM

@sidran32 I encounter it every single time I purchase proprietary software, or when I am unable to fix a bug that I know I would be capable of fixing, or when I have to persuade someone from a foreign country who barely speaks broken English, over the phone, to click a mouse button to enable software I legitimately paid for to work.

sidran32

Good point. Though myself, I don't find myself wanting to fix other peoples' code. I have on occasion, and that frustrated me, but it's rare.

allquixotic

I'm actually rather surprised that the uptake of FOSS in business is progressing so well, considering that company money spent isn't your money, strictly speaking. I mean, it doesn't come out of your bank account when the company buys proprietary software. So, I'd think, people would be more likely to ignore the ideology issue at work.

I guess it doesn't work that way, though: program managers, CFOs, etc. are always trying to save money, and in so doing, boost their own egos and bonuses... and they can do that by using FOSS.

So in the end it is personally motivated. :P

sidran32

That is part of it, but when a company gets FOSS, usually they go for the software that has paid support (like RHEL, for instance).

They pay for the support despite getting the software for free.

allquixotic

True, but then again it boils down to the cost/benefit analysis of what's cheaper: buying a license and support, or just support? And it depends on the specifics of the costs involved.

sidran32

Also, sometimes the FOSS is superior or necessary for their needs, in general.

allquixotic

5:57 PM

And there are a lot of small/medium businesses which don't purchase the official support and use things like SF and forums to figure out their problems on their own (when you don't have money, you probably have time)

sidran32

For instance, I do design verification, and so I'm simulating hardware quite often. You could do it on Windows, but the Windows tools are far inferior than those for Linux. So, at work, I pretty much live on Linux. At least, except for when I need to use Microsoft Office and Outlook. :P

allquixotic

Yeah, obviously you can toss things like price, commercial support, and license completely out the window when things like the availability of specific features/functionality of the software completely overrides any other concerns

If something isn't available on a given platform, you can't use that platform for it, trivially.

That works both for and against Linux, depending on the situation.

sidran32

Yeah.

allquixotic

But, all other things being equal, in the spaces where proprietary and free alternatives are both available which at least more or less get the job done appreciably (IIS vs. Apache, etc) you stop worrying as much about features and start looking at price, performance, ease of admin, etc.

And, maybe, license (which indirectly affects price in more than a few cases)

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