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12:02 AM
Yeah, it's one of those things where they're probably trying to satirize the stuff but struggle not to also/instead glorify it. And either way they're still depicting the stuff.
(And, you know. Dan Harmon isn't exactly the guy I'd go to for a mindful treatment of those themes.)
@trogdor neither have I, but mike mcmahan who’s somehow involved with that show is the executive producer (I think) of Star Trek lower decks, which I have watched every released episode of so far so I think I recognize the name. My world is Star Trek and RPGs and school, so I’m probably the wrong audience though
Yeah I have been mildly interested in seeing Star Trek lower decks but it seems like their main sources of humor are people being inept and embarrassed
@KorvinStarmast you sure about that? It’s close enough
Which isn't my jam
@trogdor not really, there’s a little of that but a lot of the humor is in taking Star Trek tropes and turning them on their heads. There is some of it though, so you may want to avoid some of the episodes — I know trekmovie does a spoiler free review for every episode so you might check those out first since they usually mention stuff like that
12:20 AM
I'm going mostly off of the trailers they released to be fair
I think the worst episode with regards to that, off the top of my head, is episode 5, Cupid’s Errant Arrow, where most of the humor is Mariner’s failed attempts at exposing Boimler’s GF as evil/a parasite
@trogdor yeah the trailers show the show at its worst, not in its best moments
I guess I shouldn't be surprised by that
Tv shows always seem to do that
1:03 AM
Q: Are there spells that prevent a magic user from using a summoning spell?

SteveEDWhich spells can stop a magic user from using a summoning spell either by stopping the spell effect or by stopping the magic user from casting? I can only think of two: Counterspell and Anti-Magic Field Are there any others?

1:43 AM
In other news, a shocking number of kids new to the HS RPG group--like, the majority of new kids--indicated on the signup form that they'd be willing to run games. Even those who've never played.
Or, at least, that's how we-all (student leaders and faculty advisors) read their responses.
What they *intended*, it turns out, was to communicate was "uh, yeah, direct-message is cool by me."
@nitsua60 Ah, September.
1:58 AM
@nitsua60 and this is why our school club uses game master and GM instead of dungeon master and DM. Apparently the same mistake happened a few years ago
@BardicWizard I tend to use GM to de-center D&D, but the kid making the form uses DM and we didn't notice/care when we saw it. Now we'll know =)
Looks like we may end up playing a modern fantasy game at my table, in a setting where magic is super-rare (and generally unknown) but these kids have some, somehow.
I think I'm going to bolt an old FUDGE magic system I liked onto some *Tales from the Loop* classes.
@nitsua60 I've had some success playing in a modern fantasy setting using Dresden Files RPG.
Incidentally, the next novel comes out tomorrow-ish. I hope it's actually delivered on the right day this time around :(
...I'm still curious about what an approachable dramatic Peter Grant magic system would look like.
@JoelHarmon I certainly have Dresden sorta in the back of my mind, but only in the more-mechanical sense, not necessarily the themes/tone. But a DFRPG specifically built as such might be pretty fertile ground. Care to highlight its strengths and weaknesses?
(I've only read 2.2ish of the books, btw.)
@nitsua60 There's two, actually! The Dresden Files RPG was the Fate game just before Fate Core, and then there's Dresden Files Accelerated which is a Fate Accelerated drift.
2:10 AM
@nitsua60 (The first one feels like a first novel, the second one feels like he's establishing a pattern. They do get better)
(I much preferred the earlier novels to the later ones; his technical skill improves but the themes and characters got... rough for me to stomach.)
@JoelHarmon (and @BESW) I kinda have Highlander: the Series in mind as much as anything else. Not mechanics, obviously, and probably not period-costumed flashbacks, but the notion that the characters are unthinkably-different from the normies in the world they inhabit, and have to carefully use their "power."
@nitsua60 I believe I played the non-Accelerated version, but I'm not certain. I liked the non-vancian magic available. "I'd like to hack that cell phone. How? Because I'm the greco-roman god of the internet. Tell me what's on it."
@nitsua60 Hmm. Shades of Ngen Mapu.
The system was also good at mixed combat; trying to talk someone down while they're trying to knock your lights out is pretty natural to represent.
@nitsua60 Please tell me you're also keeping Sean Connery as an Egyptian/Spaniard.
2:16 AM
@JoelHarmon Juan Sanchez Villalobos de Ramirez, chief metallurgist to the Court of St. James? Of course!
Or, should I say, "Juan Shanchezsh?"
Indeed you should.
"Some things down here don't react well to katanas."
(That one there ^^ is my gift to @KorvinStarmast)
@nitsua60 Hunt for Red Highlander?
@Adeptus "One ping, Highlander." "One ping?" "One ping."
There can be only one ping
2:20 AM
You all know that the Kurgan always parries left in the bottom half of the hour, right?
@Adeptus @Adeptus
(I believe @Adeptus wins the chat today.)
@Axoren But how many times did the system ping you?
@JoelHarmon @JoelHarmon @JoelHarmon @JoelHarmon @JoelHarmon I don't know. @JoelHarmon You tell me.
Was it all just a one big ping or did it send them to you in a cascade?
There can be only one, apparently. Maybe the delayed popup on the main site will report it multiple times.
2:28 AM
so pings are like Sith Lords? There can be only one??
It's a Rule of Two because the Sith are dookies.
I mean look at Count Dookie
Pings are like katanas: it's surprising to see Sean Connery use one.
He hasn't been in the room for a while: need a mod to superping him.
If he actually responds, I'll have made Sean Connery come. In an 18+ board, that would be a double entendre. Either way, that's an achievement.
The man's a savage, but I haven't heard him do anything lately. Does he still do film?
Yeah, he's been retired from Acting since 2006. :'(
Apparently, the only thing he has done since is voice act in whatever this monstrosity is: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sir_Billi
3:02 AM
nilbogs mess with action economy and need to be adjusted for in parties of less than 4
And I need to ask a question about action timing and nilbogs (and dissonant whispers).

I just don't feel like typing it now
3:31 AM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad ip for hostname in body, bad keyword in username, blacklisted website in body, potentially bad ns for domain in body, potentially bad keyword in username (291): How to Registration for ISO 9001? by ISO BAHRAIN on rpg.SE (@Rubiksmoose)
3:51 AM
Hounds of God by BESW. The author's commentary on an abandoned module for Fate Accelerated.
@BESW speaking of hounds, I poked you in discord a day or two ago, in case you missed it.
Oh yes! I'd love to see those, thanks.
Okay. Heading over there now....
Oh, I see... you responded. Sorry. (I didn't have a notification-bubble because the server was part of a collapsed group, maybe?)
no worries!
4:20 AM
I wrote less than a paragraph of backstory for a character for once!!! I thought I should try giving her a chance to discover it over the course of the two-shot so we’ll see how it goes
I know that struggle.
I’m proud of this because I usually have to type my backstory up or write it in tiny printing to get it to fit
I’m pretty sure it would even fit in a single chat message so that’s super good
Not that I have it typed up anywhere so...
Good morning.
4:29 AM
@BardicWizard I wrote a relatively lengthy blog post which I abandoned, for some reason, and never published, titled "In Defense of Retconning", where I championed deliberately letting your backstory have large holes in it to be filled in when needed by the story later on.
Also, one character in our long-running Ars Magica game left a large chunk of her backstory and mechanical story flaws deliberately open, without even her character knowing it, explicitly as a hook for the GM to do with as he pleased.
That escalated quickly.
My achievement for today was to track down a song I remembered from 13 years ago that was inspired by a song that was a remix of another song that sort of sounded a bit like the song I remembered. Only took me half an hour to find it too
@lisardggY my total backstory: Rose Dax was raised by her mom, Robin Dax, and her unmarried aunt Hannah Maybud. Sometime in late high school she started dating Zorah Oakapple. she hopes to get enough money to propose to Zorah soon. She is pretty formal but deadly in a fight. Likes to mock people for hiding behind a halfling bard in a hoop skirt
The rest is a hole
@BardicWizard Cool. Just enough to start playing her, a couple of personal connections as hooks or for you to examine her relationships, and off to the adventuring fields.
It’s her entire reason for being in “monster infested horrorville” aka NYC
To get money for a ring
But also because Bardic Underground stuff
(Which is assumed for any bards)
In my current game, our GM's call for character was "you all grew up in a small village knowing each other, and you have this NPC as a shared friend". My character is a wood-elf wizard who grew up just outside the village but visited often, whose magic is a form of natural-magic experimentation that he shapes into arrowheads (I re-skin all my spells as arrows). That's it, for now.
4:37 AM
@lisardggY sounds fun to play
Things that have been established over the 3-4 sessions we've had so far: I know very little of the world outside the area of the village but I'm intensely curious about everything and questioning in an occasionally off-putting sort of way, relatively unphased by weird things (because everything is weird) and (after a meeting with handsome gnome cartographer-bard and a short argument with the party's tielfling rogue about him) apparently pan-romantic but asexual. Or the other way around.
Q: Throwing Shield Shenanigans

ErudakiA player in my group is interested in making a offensive shield build. They found that if you get a quickdraw shield and modify it with the throwing shield property, that you can don it, and throw it all as a free action. Then, if they put it on a blink back belt, then it returns to their belt im...

4:59 AM
@AncientSwordRage You asked, so here it is!
Hounds of God by BESW. The author's commentary on an abandoned module for Fate Accelerated.
...that half of my itch.io projects are about doggos was entirely unplanned.
@BESW but not unappreciated!!
Also I had to describe the difference between my two current d&d characters and the difference I used was that one has more living family than secret identities and the other has more secret identities than living family
... I’ll let people speculate on exactly how those came to be
6:00 AM
@BardicWizard I figured as much. The trailers didn't look very appealing to me.
I feel like I know a surprising amount about Star Trek for having never watched more than a few clips of any of the older series or movies before the 2009 film reboot and Discovery/Picard series.
(I did own a Star Trek computer game called Deep Space Nine: The Fallen that I got for free from somewhere, I think. I think I never finished it, though I did use cheats to skip through some of the levels after I kept dying on them...)
6:55 AM
Q: Can an artificer replicate the same magic item more than once?

Guillaume F.Artificers can take the "Replicate Magic Item" infusion more than once, each time choosing a magic item that they can make with it. Can an Artificer take the "Replicate Magic Item" infusion multiple times and select the same magic item with it, and thus create more than one copy of the same magic...

1 hour later…
8:13 AM
@BESW yay!
8:59 AM
why is my coffee all gone :(
> The amount of coffee I need in the morning is big. You just won't believe how vastly, hugely, mind-bogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a lot of coffee in the starbucks down the road, but that's just peanuts to the amount of coffee I need in the morning.
@BESW this is amazing though
Sure is
I need it especially as my body does not make enough dopamine (?)
9:17 AM
I got some coffee with peanut butter syrup
1 hour later…
10:40 AM
Q: How can dash be used as a main action if actions and bonus actions aren't interchangeable?

HalohaI've found two twitter chains that I can't seem to make sense of. From Jeremy Crawford: "Actions and bonus actions aren't interchangeable." [source] Also from Jeremy Crawford: "Double dash in one turn can happen with dash as bonus action." [source] So how can a rogue use both their action and bon...

11:31 AM
Q: Does Locate Creature work on a creature who died and became undead?

mgiuffridaCan someone cast Locate Creature on a creature whom they knew when it was alive, but died recently and became undead? For instance, if a party member was bit by a vampire and died, could someone cast Locate Creature to find the person?

11:52 AM
@AncientSwordRage Im surprised that question went unanswered as long as it did
@ThomasMarkov "What syrup to put into coffee?"
Or about magical constructs pathfinding?
pure high fructose corn syrup, of course.
But, yeah, the pathfinding one
@ThomasMarkov bleugh
Ive a friend that puts HFC on his waffles.
12:22 PM
@ThomasMarkov high fructose corn on waffles
Isn't all corn high fructose?
depends what you consider high fructose
fructose is mainly found in fruits
a cup of sweet corn has only 10-20% as much fructose as an apple; and that's sweet corn, the variety with the most sugar
"High fructose" in this specific context means that the corn has been chemically processed to convert a significant amount (usually about 10%) of the corn's glucose, into fructose.
like, high fructose corn syrup is so called because they made it very high in fructose
but if we're talking about regular unprocessed foods, corn is relatively low fructose in the scheme of things
Corn is not high fructose, because "high fructose" is a nonsense phrase without a point of comparison. "High fructose corn syrup" is "high fructose" for corn syrup.
I'd guess that corn is very high fructose compared to a steak, or silicone sealant, but those don't seem like useful points of comparison.
12:36 PM
@BESW steak with silicone sealant is an unusual dish
...I suppose you could plastinate the steak.
12:47 PM
"Plastinate The Steak" would be a good name for a band.
@nitsua60 Snort!
1:24 PM
Good morning
Hey, what was that question about surprise and initiative order from a few weeks ago?
Are very political stack avatars permitted?
nevermind :)
Q: Are political avatars and profiles OK?

Benjamin GruenbaumAre political profiles and/or avatars appropriate? Should they be allowed? Some context: Today I've had a chat with this user: I'd like to hear what the community thinks about this. Full disclosure: I am an Israeli from the "other side", our chat was pleasant and on a positive note, we discu...

Never mind, I think I found what I was looking for.
@NautArch [wry] Ah yes, an excellent example of Stack attitudes in action producing a lot of sound and fury, signifying nothing.
1:33 PM
@BESW Yeah, just saw one and it didn't give me the warm and fuzzies. But as it's not something that is inherently creating an issue, I'll let it go.
I'd like to think that they'd have a firmer stance six years on, but I'd be genuinely surprised if they did.
@BESW yeah, i'd prefer apolitical avatars
(If anybody's confused, the policy "politically motivated avatars in support of a cause are fine, but ones that attempt to attack others are not" is actively useless because, as a very obvious example, causes defined by their violence against particular groups create a loophole large enough to drive a Death Star through.)
Pretty sure this question is answered already. Tossed in a few links in the comments to relevant questions. rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/175928/…
Will have to wait for OP to confirm I think though
@NautArch I try to avoid using "political" when "partisan" is what's actually meant, but the two are becoming synonymous in popular discourse.
1:37 PM
@BESW more than fair. But yeah, they are synonymous in at least american politics at this point.
But yeah, there are a couple specific types of avatar (and user name) that urge me to put the user on ignore on sight, as I've found they're indicative of perspectives that I'm going to interact with on my terms, not theirs.
(This is one reason I'm glad this room has multiple active room owners now, I can put users on ignore without worrying I'll miss something that needs action if they turn up here.)
Ugh it’s too early to be awake
Politics would be so much easier if everyone fundamentally got along
@RevenantBacon I'm having a very ahrd time not duping that initiative/surprise question.
I'm kinda tempted too, but I think the question isn't really about surprise, it's about is this guy in the combat?
@RevenantBacon in which case it's the question i linked
so we could/should(?) dupe for both?
1:49 PM
I think so
Can we list as a dupe for both?
we did (and i have!)
1 hour later…
2:54 PM
@ThomasMarkov Out of curiosity, was your downvote to me because I discussed whether or not they should be in initiative?
It wasnt that you suggested it, it was that you suggested without elaborating on how it would work. At least, it seems to me that when combat is going on, the timing of the actions of each member is significant, and the way to maintain consistency is to have everyone roll initiative.
So the paladin enters combat and rolls, the archer does not. How do I determine how much time it takes for the archer to arrive into combat? By having some means of keeping up with the timing of his actions in relation to the combat. How do you track the timing of actions in relation to combat? This is the definition of initiative.
@ThomasMarkov Then you've got an answer to the other question about new members coming into intiative.
It's pretty binary for me: It's either you are rolling initiative, or you aren't.
and the Q&A on that supports that, too.
3:44 PM
@ThomasMarkov Guessing that's not your downvote as you usually give me feedback.
Where's that?
I always have the table roll initiative even if the fighter, wizard, and cleric are fighting the Baron's henchmen while the rogue is on the other side of the dungeon looting the treasure hoard. Rogue still rolls initiative and still acts on his turn, even if that action is "I continue to pile gld into this sack" until he eventually hears the sounds of combat echo down the hall
@ThomasMarkov lexaire's latest question
wasnt me.
Then we don't have to worry about people coming in late, and we can more accurately track how far in to the looting the rogue gets before the fighting noises tip him off
3:46 PM
@RevenantBacon Which is a totally reasonable choice to make as a DM.
But it's not the only viable and reasonable choice.
Yeah, I like it because it helps me track things better. I can understand why people would only have characters who are currently fighting roll though
I just prefer the other way
4:03 PM
@RevenantBacon Doyou have combat in other sections of the dungeon draw enemies to combat that aren't yet there because they're waiting in another room
Depends on the dungeon and where the enemies are located. If it makes sense to do so, then yes. If it's down 6 hallways and through three solid oak doors, then no. If its the next room over and only a simple curtain separates the rooms, then yes.
@RevenantBacon Gotcha. SO if the rogue was that distant, would you still have them roll initiative and move towards sound?
yes, they would still roll. Whether or not they know the combat is occurring is dependant on distance and obstacles to hearing it
@RevenantBacon So it would be "roll iniatitive and i'll let you konw if you can do anything?"
pretty much
4:14 PM
DnD Bokononism says that you always roll initiative with your party karass, even before you've ever met them.
4:40 PM
... we all clearly should be rolling initiative then, since there’s always combat somewhere
Does the dice roller support adding modifiers?
Not as far as I know
Doesnt seem so.
@Someone_Evil can we go ahead and close all of the open [game-recommendation] questions?
Urgh... just close them as they come up. If they don't see any activity there's no reason to close them either
4:44 PM
@ThomasMarkov that’s a good thing since I have either a +2 dex mod or a -100 dex mod depending on the day
and also depending on whether I’ve had sugar or caffeine
Has anyone used Foundry VTT? The other Roll20 alternative I wanted to use became abandonware
D&D might be cancelled tonight, so I'll have time to test out other platforms. I was hoping for reviews because this one costs $50 right now.
Well, not reviews more like personal accounts.
@Axoren I've made the switch.
It's amaaazing.
@NautArch To Foundry?
N.B. I'm fairly good around backend, but i've got another player who is VERY good with it. He's done the setup.
But with the setup done, it's amazing.
I'm very interested in the D&D Beyond importing that one of the plugins has, but it seems like a paid plugin.
4:50 PM
It's paid and I paid it.
It's well worth it.
click of the button for importing content, including module content with images.
Will it import maps like the Roll20 version of the module will?
Like, set them all up and everything?
Or do we still need to build our own scenes?
@Axoren that's a different question - and the answer is no.
I'm not exactly sure what D&D Beyond provides when you buy the adventure there because I've yet to do that personally, but I've played in games with modules
It doesn't autopopulate dungeons.
THat's purely a roll20 feature.
But you can bring in the monsters, the maps, and place them.
and once in...*everything* runs better.
Okay, that's good to know. Unfortunately, that's a feature some of the other DMs in our group highly value.
I'm very much impressed with the video showcases they've done and like the UI layout in the demo.
I might just buy the platform and setup a server on Digital Ocean for the group anyways, even if we're not using it for the next couple of campaigns
4:54 PM
@Axoren To be fair, it's a really nice feature.
But overall, I don't miss it.
It's not hard to move them over.
Oh, wait. It doesn't autopop the maps, but does it include dynamic lighting metadata of any sort?
Or is it just populating the assets?
@Axoren it includes dynamic lighting if you want it (at no cost)
You can set the lighting for individuals, the scene, etc.
you can also create your own scenes with specifics walls, lighting sources etc.
I meant when you import from D&D Beyond the maps, do those come pre-DL'd
@Axoren Roll20 modules come with lighting set up, but you have to manually set up the lighting on other tabletops
Roll20's the only provider that I've seen do that extra step
I know setting up dynamic lighting in Foundry is aces, because the showcases showed it being damn-near getting speedrun
4:57 PM
I'm not sure if even the fantasy ground modules have that stuff included
@Axoren No, the map is just the map. The dynamic lighting generates from the players rview ranges.
@Someone_Evil "So they dont come up" seems like a reason
Not sure about roll20 on that - i never paid for dynamic. And the guy who did had nothing but problems with it
@NautArch Generally, the walls and window data is already included, so the dynamic lighting system knows where to raycast
@Axoren Ah. I don't think it's included, but i haven't used the dynamic lighting as much.
4:58 PM
Unfortunately, their system is butt in terms of efficiency, so large maps like Mad Mage floors will cripple even the most powerful of computers
@Axoren please watch your langauge
@Axoren I'm also just starting mad mage with it.
THere are ways to work around visible/dynamic/and past travel, but I've generally found that to be more trouble than just uncovering what they find.
I recommend playing without dynamic lighting and just having everyone go Honor System
I close off what's not seen yet and shade it open when it's time.
It's nice when it's not crippling your computer, but it's always crippling your computer
We've also got it hosted on my neighbor's local server Upload speeds of about 20. We haven't really seen any delay issues.
5:13 PM
@NautArch Thanks for the account of your personal experiences with it. I'm probably going to push the server to make the jump
It has vastly improved my enjoyment of playing online. VASTLY.
At the moment, there's enough people invested in Roll20 subs that doing this will save everyone hundreds of dollars going forward
ALthough, to be fair, i've only got a DM's perspective.
whoa hundreds?
where you getting that?
oh from roll20!
not cost on foundry.
$99.99 annually, multiple accounts
BIG oof
El Oofo Grande
Oh yeah and just a note about hosting online: While I have exp hosting servers, it was worth my time to just go with one of the Foundry hosts that have popped up.
5:15 PM
Yeah, roll20 for the bells and whistles ain't cheap.
I've had a very good experience with forge-vtt.com
@RedRiderX @RedRiderX@Axoren Not sure if any of you use linux, but there is a docker for hosting it.
I've done devops for years so I'm likely just gonna setup my own server.
Also, if anyone is interested in a cheap and pretty darn good home storage backup solution, i'm a big fan of unraid. And you can host dockers on it, too.
Yeah it's not a big deal to host it, just the price of this vs a DO box is negligible really.
5:17 PM
It'll end up being the same monthly, give or take change.
And I'll have it sharing server space with other apps our Discord uses
We've got 36 members just floating around and a couple of people are stepping up to be Maintainers of the various bots and stuff we're replacing with in-house hosted stuff
5:37 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but spells only care if a target is valid at the time they were cast, correct?
@RevenantBacon you is wrong.
@NautArch I is? huh. For clarification, I'm talking 5e
Q: Does the mind flayer's Extract Brain affect polymorphed or Wild Shaped humanoids?

NautArchA mind flayer has the following requirement in order to perform its Extract Brain Action (MM, 222): one incapacitated humanoid grappled by the mind flayer. If a humanoid has been polymorphed (PHB, 266): This spell transforms a creature that you can see within range into a new form... The tar...

as one example
but there's more
"Once a spell is cast, its effects aren't limited by its range, unless the spell's description says otherwise." says the PHB, so generally speaking yes as long as we're talking specifically about range
I could have sworn that spell effects don't end if a target becomes invalid after the spell was cast
5:40 PM
Ah ok, you mean something else
Q: Is it possible to possess a non-humanoid creature with a combination of True Polymorph and Magic Jar?

AntiDrondertTrue polymorph says: Creature into Creature. If you turn a creature into another kind of creature, the new form can be any kind you choose whose challenge rating is equal to or less than the target’s (or its level, if the target doesn’t have a challenge rating). The target’s game statistics, ...

Q: Is a spell suppressed or removed when the target temporarily becomes invalid?

Darth PseudonymBased on Jeremy Crawford's tweet, if a target is under the effect of an ongoing spell, and then the target changes such that it is no longer a valid target, the spell no longer effects them. But does the spell end, or is it merely suppressed? For example, suppose a human has been charmed by a d...

@NautArch this is what I was looking for.
"When you ready a spell, you cast it as normal but hold its energy, which you release with your reaction when the trigger occurs." I wonder if some joker has used this, and the previous snippet I quoted, to justify that one can release a readied spell at a target regardless of the range, since the spell is explicitly already "cast" when one readies it
not that it would confer massive strategic advantage except against super fast things
@kviiri quicklings
although that means you can turn it about on them and say "well you already cast fireball and selected the area it was going to hit, so even though the enemies moved away you still have to put it in that spot"
@RevenantBacon kinda depends on the trigger.
but yeah, if someone was holding a fireball, placement is included in that.
5:46 PM
Every season of TRPG chat must include at least one episode about DnD 5e Ready semantics
6:15 PM
@kviiri I think you can use two Bonus Actions on your turn with Ready. I feel like I'm wrong, but also like I'm right. And I'm willing to die on both hills if I have to.
@Axoren Roll initiative!
Action to prepare to use a Bonus Action: Trigger when I use the other Bonus Action.
Use the Other Bonus Action. Reaction: Use the first Bonus Action.
@Axoren can't prepare a bonus action
That's lame as nuts in an apple pie.
Fan edit of DnD 5e where upcasting is called overloading, encumbrance is called overloading and overloading of specific terms in rules, whether by specific or common usage, is called overloading.
6:19 PM
@kviiri but overloading is called "gimmemoar"
@NautArch Just one more gold piece. It's wafer thin.
(yeah, now I'm the one making Monty Python references)
@kviiri get me a bucket
fwiw I think for a film that follows the much more Hollywood-y Holy Grail and Life of Brian, the sort of underground aesthetic in the Meaning of Life appeals to me in a very weird way
My favorite gag from the Meaning of Life is a really simple one but it somehow always cracks me up how Eric Idle, who emerges from the fridge to sing about the universe, closes the song by getting back in the fridge
It's so unexpected yet still somehow so logical.
Monty Python... is that the thing my history teacher showed us about the Spanish Inquisition the other week?
There were people shouting in red hats
That sounds correct
6:34 PM
It made less sense than Alice in wonderland
I'm actually annoyed that Ready doesn't allow you to prepare Bonus actions.
Makes them feel like they're second-class citizens within the Action economy.
Q: Are there serious balance implications to permitting Bonus Actions to be Readied/Prepared?

XiremaMy Ancients Paladin is commonly stymied by the limitation on Readied Actions, in that Bonus Actions cannot under any circumstances, per RAW, be "prepared". For example, suppose a Paladin wished to react to a creature trying to cross a bridge. She would prepare to cast Misty Step to teleport in f...

@BardicWizard Well, for all Python's been accused of, I don't think criticizing modern mathematics is on the list
6:49 PM
@Someone_Evil Yeah, but it's just one more thing that feels like oversight. "We didn't expect Bonus Actions to be a big part of the system when we wrote Ready rules and we're never going back to them."
If you give players a resource, you need to expect them to use them.
@Axoren I agree with that in general, but how does it apply?
Ready specifies lowercase action, so you can't Ready bonus actions.
@Someone_Evil There's got to be something that breaks. I'm gonna think about that one.
I still feel like I'm missing something. Bonus actions aren't the only thing that doesn't work with Ready, and I'm failing to see how that rule is denying them to use a resource (maybe we're putting different meaning to that term?)
I'm conflating the term, but I'm also distracted.
Ready should work with Bonus Actions but as written it only works with actions and movement.
7:03 PM
@Axoren why should?
Because both stances are arbitrary and I like mine better.
That's just an assumption, to be clear.
Which is?
That their stance is arbitrary?
We could always message the designers and ask for their intent and I'll bet 25 cents and my leftover lunch that there wasn't a balance reason for it.
7:10 PM
@Axoren they are exceptions
@Axoren I don't think they should. Now we have chat balance. 😎😜
@KorvinStarmast Got an example of an imbalance caused by letting it happen?
Because I only have a couple. With it, I can cast Magic Stone AND Shillelagh in one turn.
As of right now, only possible with Action Surge.
Err, not even.
@Axoren I was making a joke about chat ... once we have one for and one against, we have balance.
Action surge is a limited resource feature, not germane to this discussion.
I see. I potato'd and wasn't even being satirical in response.
I see your potato and raise you a kumquat.
I don't think there's any way to cast Magic Stone and Shillelagh in one turn
Maybe Time Stop?
7:13 PM
@Axoren Nor is it important that there be a way to do that. (IMO)
@KorvinStarmast i see your potato and kumquat and raise you a pumpkin
Time Stop into Magic Stone and Shillelagh.
I can see a few scenarios in which that's the right call.
I get the idea that the restriction was to avoid the spell + spell (ad nauseum) mechanics of 3.x that led to serial buffs and so on ... I don't think it was aimed specifically at cantrips.
@Axoren If you are at level 17 and worried about being able to cast MS and Shill at the same time, your DM is underchallenging you. (I think) If that's what you are burning a Time stop to do, DM is really underchallenging you, most likely.
Clerics will be able to cast Spiritual Weapon and Sanctuary in a single turn.
Which might actually be a really strong combo
Depends on if using your Spiritual Weapon to deal damage breaks Sanctuary
Because that can be an extra 4d8+WIS on turn 1
While being in Sanctuary for the entire combat
How would you be able to cast them in a single turn?
7:37 PM
@Axoren They are second-class citizens in the action economy. That's what they're for, yeah?
Oh, so you're an Action Royalist?
Down with the Standard Action Monarchy!
@Axoren Yeah, I agree. I think 4e was much clearer in this regard that there was a clear tier of Standard, Move and Minor action and every time something was a specific type, it was clearly listed. No "bonus action which isn't an action except when it is"
I definitely got the impression from the Starter set that bonus actions were not something everyone had.
And then everyone had one.
There was also the convenient hierarchy substitution thing, where Standard could be played as Move action (essentially allowing Dash, plus a few other movement tricks like move + shift) or a Minor action, and a Move action could be played as a Minor action. Every turn, one has a Standard, Move and Minor action to use as they please. Simple.
Does a dog have a bonus action?
7:46 PM
I can ofc get that the substitution thing might've been unsavory for 5e, where IIRC one of the design goals was to reduce the impact of "this cool weird synergy" and therefore I can understand wanting to absolutely prevent Bonus action + Bonus action combos
@MarkWells mu
Anyway. sauna time.
Catch y'all later
@kviiri see ya
Action Point systems solved this problem long ago.
5 per turn.
Actions (3 cost)
Bonus Actions (2 cost)
If you use 2 Bonus Actions, you can tap your head and rub your belly for 1 point
@Axoren i like that
Someone in our group wanted to run a semi-slapstick kung fu campaign, so I've been looking at Feng Shui 2e, which has a really elegant timing system.
also i have to write a verse of the blues for chorus class, so I present the Closed Question Blues in 12 bars:
I’ve got the closed question blues, And I don’t know what to do — I’ve got the closed question blues, And i don’t know what to do; I’m gonna rewrite it now — Make it better, how? I hope it attracts answers true
7:59 PM
You roll initiative, which puts you all on a countdown track. We start at the highest count, and when we get to your position on the track, you get to act, and then move down some number of ticks (for most actions it's 3, but it varies). The countdown continues until it hits zero, and then you see who's still in the fight and reroll initiative.
@MarkWells One action at a time?
I can definitely see this giving the feel of a flurry of trading blows.
Right, you mostly settle into a fixed order but it's possible to get multiple actions before someone else gets their first, if your speed is really high
Might make for a good Speedracer type game.
Where your actions are things like hitting the buttons on the Steering Wheel to make oil slicks etc.
and then the default cost of 3 allows some flexibility to have the order get switched up if someone's doing actions that have other costs
@Axoren your image and your reference are to two different cars movies
8:06 PM
reaction-type abilities typically have a tick cost also, so they delay your next action
the image is cars 1, and i think oil slicks are cars 2
As usual blame the 6yo and the encyclopedic knowledge of cars
@Axoren I could see the system working for a Mad Max / REDLINE style car race
where you have an overall "progress" number for how close you're getting to the finish line / objective, and a "Shut Up And Drive" action that turns all your remaining ticks into progress
@MarkWells JP in the Trans-Am vs. Max in the Pursuit Special is a race and a half
I'd pay for that movie
9:01 PM
I'd pay for a 5e Video Game not being made by Larian
I don't trust them with Balder's Gate.
Really? Looking at Divinity 2 it seems right in their wheelhouse.
@Axoren Why not? DOS2 was pretty nice.
I did not enjoy their approach to writing or humor, and there were many parts of the game where I felt they didn't put even baseline time and care into.
They're decision to take advice from r/creepyasterisks for their dialog at around DOS1:EE really put me off.
As for the game itself, the engine is their strongest selling point and it still misses the mark in a lot of places. Overall the game is REALLY slow and there are entire ACTS that you just want to end far sooner than it's possible to complete them.
The reasons the game files are so large is because everything is poorly designed XML except for some clumps of binary and base64, which are nested within the XML. The engine is held together with strips of tape. I believe a lot of their technical effort goes into maintaining that monstrosity that will only get worse with new releases. I've even personally found a major wrong warp with a friend simply by sitting in a chair and using the portals to go to a new map.
At the very least, they learned something with DOS2 long after it released: Let the players run when not in combat.
However, it's an option only available as part of an optional feature list instead of by design from the beginning.
Also, probably the experience that made me uninstall DOS2 for the first time was when I slowed a group of Zombies and was knocked to the floor. I had to wait AN AGONIZINGLY LONG time for the Zombies AI to decide their course of action, which was hanging, then slowly enact their chosen behavior in absolute Molasses Time. It took so long to actually get to my turn, and once I did anything, I would have to go through it again.
I killed the process and uninstalled because the game was making me wait 10s of minutes to end a basically trivial combat.
It was not engaging, it was not fun, it was not worth the time I spent playing it. And that might be harsh, but I could always just have played Balder's Gate 1 or 2 instead.
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