TRPG General Chat - 2018-06-07 (page 2 of 3)

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2:03 PM

@TheMaskedRebel Yours probably went by accident

In general, messages are moved to Not a Bar when they're either too heated for here or otherwise clogging up the chat from other discussion

It was just picked up with the rest of the selection

@kviiri or in general have overstayed their welcome here

yea

I know I'm a few days late, but RIP eagle cam.

:(

Out of curiosity, is there a joke or reference that I'm missing with the name of "Not a bar"? I've always wondered...

@Yuuki Right?

We hardly knew ye.

2:05 PM

Awakens

I'm not a Doctor, but I play one on TV Commercial 1986 with Peter Bergman Vicks Formula 44

@OneCritWonder If your awakening lasts for more than four hours, please contact your druid.

Just checking, I think it should have been asked here:

What's the purpose of explicitly telling that "X is your spellcasting ability for this spell" when you use a feat or class feat, when the spell does not involve any saving throw or attack or damage or heal?

For example: Fey Teleportation with the Misty Step spell.

The Masked Rebel

so i can post my masked rebel pictures here again

@Yuuki Some people are into that.

2:07 PM

I still feel it's weird that granting sapience is only a 5th-level spell.

@Vylix Actually I think that has been asked on the mainsite... I don't have time to look at the moment though. If you do some searches you might find it.

If not, with some tweaking it wouldn't be a bad mainsite question actually, but I'm pretty sure it has been asked before.

ok, then my gut is right. Can't seem to find it earlier

@Vylix I think it was about a specific spell in one of the racial feats

But could be wrong about either or both aspects

The Masked Rebel

user image

if you wanna know the story behind my name see here

what the hell is going on in this question
https://rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/124051/can-you-enchant-a-fire-lash

2:16 PM

@Vylix Not sure about whether it has a specific use, but there might be a benefit for just making sure the value is determined in case a future or a homebrewed rule needs it.

Eg. a few weeks back I wondered here by 4e's Avenger has a Paragon Path that requires both being an Avenger and having a class power all Avengers have. Superfluous! But BESW pointed out that this futureproofs the rule better and doesn't require changes if a future patch introduces a way for Avengers to not have the power.

I see

@goodguy5 Fire Leashes

OOOH. EPH stands for Expanded Psionics Handbook

I was like "EFFFFFF Pyrokineticist!" wat

@goodguy5 that was my first thought, too

It's also the sound Green Goblin makes when Spider-Man hits him in the mouth with a web.

A Very Large Bear

2:25 PM

@goodguy5 oops. I just put in an edit thinking it was a misspelled EPIC PYROKINETICIST XDXDXD type deal

Can I retract an edit?

you can resinstate, or someone will downvote your edit

editing

done

A Very Large Bear

Thanks

I see no reason why one could not have two fire lashes.

Though, I find it hard to believe that they could be properly enchanted, other than casting enchant weapon for a temporary bonus

I"m confused by this comment. Are the magic items in the DMG actually only examples?

actually, I think the spell is called "Magic Weapon", but still.

@NautArch I mean... I think they were being more hyberolic than anything.

kind of like "The pirate-code is more guidelines than actual rules"

2:32 PM

@goodguy5 They also based an answer off that, though.

I agree with that answer.... not quite enough to updoot it (yet)

but still

@goodguy5 Well, i mean anything could exist in D&D because of the rules around DM decisions and the guidelines in the DMG around creating homebrew.

I'll look at my dmg, but I think that he's right.

@goodguy5 I tried looking through mine and couldn't find anything about the item list being "Examples", but I easily could have missed it.

It's just a bold claim to make that the enormous and detailed list (and random treasure tables utilizing that list) are all merely just examples.

@NautArch It's a bit of a gray area in terms of RAW. I don't think they're "only examples", but RAW in DMG is explicit in that the GM can create new magical items.

2:37 PM

@kviiri THis is the closest I found "The magic items in chapter 7, "Treasure," section are but a few of the magic treasures that characters can discover during their adventures. If your players are seasoned veterans and you want to surprise them, you can either modify an existing item or come up with something new."

but the DMG has rules for creating/modifying almost everything. IF we use those rules as a basis for a question, then a lot simply comes down to "DM can do what they want, rules don't matter."

but that's still a list of actual items and directiosn on how to homebrew

I don't really disagree, but I think the term RAW is so vague there it doesn't really pack much punch.

@kviiri Let's not go down the RAWbbit hole.

Hi folks. I want to echo what I brought up elsewhere as well:

@NautArch Yuh

If you're seeing problems in site curation, or how our community is interacting with newcomers or we as a community interact between ourselves, please feel free to raise the issue on meta. Your fellow community members and moderators are generally open to feedback on improving how our site can run, including with regards to the SO initiative to making the network more inclusive and welcoming.

10

I like to think RPG.SE is already pretty inclusive and welcoming, but I'm open to improvements where they're available.

You can always raise your concerns as a discussion about behaviour or practices you see. (Discuss the behaviour, not the people.)

If you think something isn't working well, or isn't working as well as it could, or if we can do better at something than we're currently doing, that's useful feedback.

I can't promise all feedback will always be welcome and received well. Sometimes things are considered a non-issue or go through a lot of turbulence before something changes. Linking to examples or being clear about the actual pattern you're seeing helps a lot.

2:44 PM

@kviiri I hereby declare that RAW stands for "Really A Wookie," and is a measure of whether or not another person in the group would rip your arms off for doing the thing, if they were really a wookie.

5

@BESW Sounds good to me.

@BESW rawwrrr

@BESW perfect

yea. maybe you're right. I couldn't find anything either.

Maybe it would be better stated "The existing magic item list can be thought of as examples"

@goodguy5 Same thing with the Weapons table, right?

@DavidCoffron "The Weapons table shows the most common weapons used in the worlds of D&D, their price and weight, the damage they deal when they hit, and any special properties they possess. "

2:52 PM

If you think you won't like the results of RAW, you can try RAI: Running Away Immediately.

It's an explicit list of options, but with (as always) the option to create your own based off the list and guidance in the books.

@NautArch 'most common' implies more exotic weapons exist (also backed up by ToA introducing a new weapon: the yklwa)

Which is easily restated as "your world in D&D may or may not use use these items, but here are the things most do."

@goodguy5 followed up by "here are instructions to create your own"

IT's still a definitive list, not just "examples".

@NautArch that'd be nice.

2:53 PM

@NautArch Does the DMG have magic item making guidlines

@DavidCoffron not that I could see.

wait, "making" like "crafting" or like "coming up with"?

The 3.5 DMG did, but they were completely inconsistent with the text and themselves.

@goodguy5 There's a section on making some custom common magic items in XGtE and a bit on making artifacts/sentient weapons

But not on magic items in general

@goodguy5 coming up with

I don't have XG yet and I haven't looked over it much.

Coming up with? then no.

only that you can, in theory, do it.

@goodguy5 that's what I thought. Same with custom spells.

(and custom weapons for that matter)

2:55 PM

Thanks, D&D

Though, if they did give guidelines, that'd probably be worse, so I'm kind of glad they didn't.

@DavidCoffron It does, chapter 9.

@goodguy5 Well, the CR calculator in the DMG is pretty good

Some soft spots but it does its job okay as long as you don't swear by it

Includes monsters, spells, magic items, and character

I don't believe you, since the CR system isn't great.

@NautArch page?

@goodguy5 THe CR calculator still gives you a rough estimate if you are ONLY using damage and defenses as metrics. The problem comes in with unique traits; otherwise CR is very good

@goodguy5 283 and 284

2:59 PM

@goodguy5 Starts on page 273.

but the spell creeation table is useless

just has a table for approximate damage

usefulness and existing are different animals :)

@DavidCoffron oh, that section. I'd hardly call that guidelines

But it's still homebrew once you move away from the existing list.

it literally says "use existing spells as a guideline", gives a few pointers and forf the only table it provides (damage) it says "you can use differentd damage dice than the ones provided"

The new magic item section is the same way. Just minor guidelines and a bit about what level spells to allow for different rarities

3:01 PM

@DavidCoffron Yeah, it's awful. But that underscores the importance of the existing lists for things.

Though, "increase damage by 25% if it does not deal damage on a successful save" is interesting.

@NautArch Otherwise we'd only be able to analyze balance through playtesting. Comparison is a VERY useful tool.

2d10 is ~11 damage.
3d8 (chromatic orb) is ~13.5 damage, so that checks out.

@goodguy5 I'm curious if there spells follow their own rules though. It's tough to tell since there are always added effects but I wonder

Although firebolt is underpowered according to the chart (doesn't do damage on a missed attack)

Then you could (try to) backwards engineer "If the spell deals automatic damage, reduce the damage by 25%".

They compared 1d10 to 2d4. and the guideline is 2d10
so, 4d4 - 25% is 3d4

3:04 PM

so it should be 1d10 + 25% or 1d12

don't think too hard about cantrips

no cantrips do damage on a miss

@goodguy5 They do damage on a Miss though.

Fire bolt is gender-blind.

ice knife is a good example too. 2d6 for level 1 multiple targets and the "+25%" is in the 1d10 initial attack roll

Whoops, forgot that guiding bolt is a 1st-level spell.

@Yuuki as a cantrip that would be ridiculously strong

it's already 1 of the best cleric spells

(and it breaks the custom spell damage table) 4d6 for level 1 spell?

3:09 PM

For some reason, I confused it with guidance even though guidance isn't a damaging spell.

27

Q: Is it just me, or is Guiding Bolt horrifically overpowered?

Guiding Bolt is a 1st level cleric spell. Per the PHB it deals a whopping 4d6 damage if it hits, and the next attack roll made against the target has advantage. For a 1st level spell, this thing seems grossly overpowered to me. Even the other players in my group have noticed this. A single hit w...

dnd-5e spells balance

> - It is a ranged attack roll. This means the caster attacks with a disadvantage when using the spell in melee.
- As a ranged attack roll, it is subject to cover rules, too.
- As a ranged attack roll, it hits AC, which often yields worse probabilities for success than saving throws.
- There is no "consolation prize" effect - many level 1 spells are guaranteed to have at least a reduced effect in event of a successful save.
- The damage it deals is single-target, making it inefficient at taking out large mobs of low-HP monsters, particularly ones with relatively high AC (eg. goblins).

Hm, here's a thought - a spell that deals a little bit of bonus damage for each separate target, to discourage focus-fire without eliminating it as an option

Oh wait, it does match the table. 1 target is 2d10 (11) + 25% = 13.75 = 4d6 (14)

sigh, I've found a drawer full of highly magnetic thingamajigs.... I can't work like this, I'm just playing with the damn things

@Yuuki agreed, not overpowered but still 1 of the best cleric spells

@Yuuki I thought attack rolls had more chancess of success than saving throws :/

3:11 PM

@Helwar It really depends

@SPavel kind of like magic missile, but +1 damage (or whatever) for each separate target?

@goodguy5 Yeah, magic missile, ray of flame, etc

@SPavel like it deals 1d10 to 3 targets or 2d10 to 1 target?

neat idea

to make it simpler

3:13 PM

Now I'm thinking of an interesting spell that can either burst one target or jump to separate targets and does increasing damage after jumps. So your first target takes 1d4, your second target takes 2d4, your third target takes 3d4, etc.

@DavidCoffron Isn't that kind of how Eldritch Blast works, minus any invocations that enhance it

@DavidCoffron That just feels like two different spells IMO

Obviously, the damage dice can be changed because I don't know anything about balance and upcasting the spell would either increase the number of dice rolled or increase the number of possible targets.

Although there probably needs to be clarification that the damage only increases on jumps to unique targets so you don't have ramping damage just by jumping between two targets.

@Yuuki It could use similar wording as Chain Lightning

Maybe like: fire one ray per n CL that deals m damage. Then, every individual creature targeted by this spell's rays takes an extra p damage times the number of targets.

3:21 PM

^

p is probably not that big, but it needs to be worthwhile to take the spell in the first place

do the rays autohit (i.e. magic missile?) or attack rolls, or saves?

For my spell, I actually want the ramping damage to be the identifying feature.

3:39 PM

Don't know if it's a meta question, but is it bad form to an update an answer someone else wrote (who hasn't been active on the site for a year) to reflect new information? Or should I just write a new answer?

@NautArch I think there are some metas dealing with it at least tangentially.

I've seen people do it before though. I guess it depends partially on what your adding and how much of an edit it is.

@Rubiksmoose wanted to add the Xanathar's guidance on invalid targets to this answer

@NautArch I don't know if it's acceptable or not... If you are not sure you can go the safe route and add another answer referencing the first.... :/

@NautArch I honestly think that edit would be fine, but I am pretty wary of editing answers in general. I don't think there are any objection that I can think of to this particular one though.

7

Q: Editing someone else's answer vs. commenting

So here's what the Editing Help says: When should I edit posts? Any time you feel you can make the post better, and are inclined to do so. Editing is encouraged! Some common reasons to edit are: to fix grammatical or spelling mistakes to clarify the meaning of a post witho...

discussion editing

3:44 PM

@NautArch Fwiw though that user was last seen 4 days ago.

@Rubiksmoose LegendaryDude? I thought I looked up history and they hadn't answered or posted a question in a year.

but i must have filtered wrong

@NautArch The site also tracks when they log into the site though. I'm not sure if any activity is required or what exactly.

O'reilly Auto Parts has some clever folks working there. Search for part 121g.

@Rubiksmoose i'll give it a few days before updating it myself.

I commented on the suggestion to include it.

If you look on the profile page all the way to the right it says " Last seen Jun 3 at 19:38"

@Rubiksmoose ahhh. I was just looking at actual activity and not just lurking :)

3:47 PM

@NautArch Sounds like a good plan. You can even offer to update it yourself and they can simply give you the go ahead (much less effort on their part)

@NautArch wrong link?

@Rubiksmoose Given their lack of interaction, i'll give them some time and then comment that htey can roll back after I do it.

@Rubiksmoose argh! and too late for me to change it. oreillyauto.com

@NautArch hah!

@Rubiksmoose upgrade part is not listed, tho

@NautArch I didn't think too hard about it but is there a significance to each number?

@Rubiksmoose 1.21 GW (part # 121)

g for gigawatts

3:59 PM

ahhh of course.

@NautArch cute

4:24 PM

2

Q: How are users supposed to suggest questions might get better answers on a different SE site?

Today someone asked a question that, at its heart, is an interpersonal behavior/advice question. Seeing this while browsing the questions list, I stopped by and made the comment (to the best of my recollection since it was almost immediately deleted): This might be better asked on https://int...

discussion moderation etiquette

5:03 PM

how does it know which questions to share?

1

Q: what's up with comments being moved to chat for this question?

On this question: What happens to a Ghost when the Possessed creature polymorphs?, the top-voted answer has several warts: it cites multiple contradictory rulings without a clear way to reconcile them, it makes the citations in a weird way (it cites other rpg.stackexchange answers citing the actu...

^^ funnily enough, this question should have been asked in chat too

@goodguy5 all meta questions show up in the feed, with some delay

@MikeQ technically as a site support question it's more appropriate for meta. (doubly so since it's directed at mxyzplk who doesn't use chat as regularly as meta.)

@doppelgreener Even though only one specific user can answer it?

5:29 PM

@MikeQ Other users can answer it still, and it's not like chat is built for being a direct communication service. Some users can't be reached on chat.

Nobody can ping Mxy in this room for example.

* Lurks *

@OneCritWonder Hi! o/

Oh hai.

How goes it?

I've spent the last few months playing a Mystic and not realizing that I was missing a discipline I was supposed to get.

5:46 PM

@Hypersapien You could say you myst it

Yeah

Had 3 when I was supposed to have 4. Only noticed now that I hit level 5 and and needed to add my first new one since we started the campaign (we started at level 3).

I do that with Warlock invocations from time to time.

My girlfriend (playing a warlock) actually had more abilities than she was supposed to. Although in the other campaign we're in (playing a druid) she had fewer.

I have a waning cold! And a pizza! These are cancelling out.

@doppelgreener But do you have waning cold pizza?

5:59 PM

I don't.

That would be a -10x multiplier on my mood.

@doppelgreener for my son, it's a 10x multiplier. weirdo kid.

@doppelgreener Smash some cayenne on that pizza

Clears out your sinuses faster and harder than an angry barbarian clears out a dungeon

Good idea

@SPavel Sriracha works as well if you add enough lol

@Rubiksmoose Yeah, if you're a Starbucks-and-uggs basic white girl

6:06 PM

@SPavel be nice

Every time I wander in here theres talk of pizza.

I'm noticing a trend.

maybe we should add the [pizza] tag to the chat?

I vote horseradish or Sichuan peppercorns. I’m not a fan of spicy that lingers.

Just light the pizza on fire, the oil will keep it going

@Yuuki Both good options for infusing into vodka

Then you can do shots until you can't feel your sinuses, one way or the other

6:09 PM

Speaking of alcohol, my orange liqueur finished infusing yesterday and it tastes great.

Nice

I got a great deal on some small batch gin the other day

Also I ran out of wine and used vermouth in a risotto

So, adventures in alcohol~

haven't had a drink in 10 years...damn migraines.

I'm just not cool enough to drink.

@OneCritWonder Trick question, drinking makes you cool

@SPavel Drinking makes you think it makes you cool

6:14 PM

The hoppier your IPA/the higher ABV/IBU your stout/the funkier your gose, the better

Unless we're talking about body temperature, in which case, yes, you technically become cooler

@MikeQ No, anyone simply holding an old fashioned becomes 10% cooler

In fact, drinking the old fashioned lowers your coolness because then there is less of it

The problem is that the bonuses to coolness don't stack, but the inebriation penalties do

@MikeQ I thought it was biggest bonus and biggest penalty?

@SPavel I haven't seen many typed penalties

6:18 PM

census survey i received has wrong information. Can't change it. Census folks say "just fill it out as best you can and note the issue in remarks". oookkkk, so sure i'll go ahead and make stuff up.

@NautArch Race/Ethnicity: Elf. Number of dependents: 100. Income: 30 zillion dollars per second

@MikeQ An elf old enough to have 100 children who's invested wisely may very well make 30 zillion dollars per second

6:54 PM

@SPavel I have no cayenne but I had hot chilli powder and it's so good.

It's a hawaiian pizza and I love those but this specific brand's usually a bit plain and this is just what it needed

I love chipotle chili powder

Mexene Brand is what I use when I make my dry rubs. It's the shizzzzz

@doppelgreener Honestly chili powder is amazing and it sounds like an incredible combo to me.

@doppelgreener I once put white truffle oil on a basic frozen cheese pizza

@Rubiksmoose I dusted the pizza with hot chilli powder after it came out of the oven.

6:57 PM

Went from 4/10 to 20/10

Pizza hacking is a great way to live your life

@doppelgreener I now want that exact thing.

@Rubiksmoose Do not put the hot chilli powder on the pizza before it goes into the oven.

If you do, do not have your face (and your eyes) in the blast radius of the hot air as you open the door.

And I don't know if anyone uses (or can get) Lawrys Seasoning Salt, but that stuff is good on literally everything.

@doppelgreener That would induce the wrong kind of burning effect I would imagine lol

@Rubiksmoose Correct burning effect! Wrong location.

6:58 PM

@NautArch iirc, it's basically the same as Old Bay

@doppelgreener You know what they say: Location location location.

@doppelgreener Yep, capsaicin aerosolizes

@goodguy5 I'll have to check that. I do not think Lawry's tastes like Old Bay.

So basically you will pepper spray yourself with your oven

I've only had Old Bay. Just going off of a conversation with someone else about it

7:00 PM

I basically gassed myself out of the house just last night with a frittata in which I put too much habanero (6 to be precise). I was coughing and crying and cleared out my nasal cavity quite well before even the first bite lol

@goodguy5 lies? but now I want to do a taste-test.

That moment when someone VTCs and you realize they're probably right but you've already answered the question :(

@NautArch I think we've all been there lol

@NautArch That's the best moment

No competing answers can be posted but yours can still get upvotes

@NautArch That happens all the time. Don't sweat it.

@SPavel lol completely true

@doppelgreener Unless it's onions. Then do sweat them.

7:04 PM

(And when I say all the time I mean all the time. Multiple times a day every single day.)

@Yuuki No just cry and try not to rub your eyes.

@NautArch yea. I was talking to someone who'd never had old bay as someone that'd never had lawrys

@doppelgreener I've taken to putting a lit candle on my cutting board when I'm slicing onions.

@Yuuki You can also turn on a back burner

Or wet the knife with very cold water

I have heard that chewing gum helps as well

Personally, I just buy vidalia onions

A Very Large Bear

@Yuuki And to think I've been holding a piece of bread in my mouth like an idiot all this time

@goodguy5 I've definitely had both and never thought of connecting them. WIll definitely try. Now I need an excuse to buy Old Bay...crab dip time?

7:06 PM

@goodguy5 I've never heard of either.

@Yuuki tell me more about this candle trick

@NautArch or just make some shrimp

@Rubiksmoose WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

moose, are you from like... the west coast of US or something?

@NautArch It has something to do with the sulfides in the onion that cause irritation.

@goodguy5 Midwest actually, raised but not born.

I haven't seen Lawry's either, but it looks like it's on Amazon UK

7:08 PM

Either the heat burns off the sulfides or it causes them to react with something in the air?

Australia has Masterfoods Mexican Chilli Powder (no salt) which is largely paprika and hot chilli powder and cumin, and minor amounts of garlic and oregano and pepper

I usually make my own spice mixtures so maybe that is why?

Not sure about the mechanics, but I just place a lit candle on the board next to the onion and I don't tear up.

Maybe, Moose. dunno. I was in Missouri for a year and it WAS hard to find Old Bay. Most people didn't know what it was.

fair

@doppelgreener I put it in nearly everything. Great in eggs, great on meat for burgers, great on fish, great with veggies. It's amazing.

7:10 PM

@NautArch i'll try it!

@doppelgreener I've used Mexene and generic chli powders (as well as one time when i dried my own chilis and ground them.) and found Mexene to be much better in my dry rubs.

And if you want something that's liek Lawry's, but less salty... Old Bay

@goodguy5 and more other flavors :P

more flavor = more better

especially because paprika is one of my favorite spices

7:23 PM

also a really good movie!

@doppelgreener It is a good movie!

\o/!

@goodguy5 The vermouth risotto is super flavorful

I subbed 3 cups red wine for 1 cup red wine, 2.5 cups vermouth, 0.5 cup water

7:42 PM

@Yuuki Is this helpful

7:57 PM

Man, v2blast is making me feel bad about how I format answers

in a good way (i like their edits)

Yup he does a good job making things look nice IMO

alright you fine folks. have a happy time-zone appropriate part-of-the-day-of-the-week

@goodguy5 1pm, it's hard to be happy with 3 hours of work left and a strong desire to sleep

@GreySage don't you have advantage on saves against sleep?

@NautArch I'm not an elf, unfortunately

And I think my sleeping schedule actually gives me disadvantage.

8:07 PM

@GreySage Incapable of long rests, I presume?

RPG.se asked me to go through an Human/Robot Verification when I was posting an answer. Is that a bad sign? :P

@HellSaint verifying that you are a human/robot?

yeah I forgot how it's called - verifying that I am a human, not a robot hahaha

some sites call it bot verification and some call it human verification, so I got lost and put both

@HellSaint Websites that do robot verification typically use a number of criteria, such as hostmask

For example, if you use a VPN, you are considered more of a robot

never had a problem with that in RPG.se - thought there was some "spam flag" in my answer, got worried haha

8:12 PM

@HellSaint First the robots come for our jobs and now our SE answers.

@Rubiksmoose Build a wall to keep the robots out. And the robots are gonna pay for it!

Robots? Where? ::beeps inconspicuously::

@MikeQ What a goodly idea.

* Calculates Quietly *

user image

8:16 PM

@Yuuki great googly moogly

This is amusing.

@Yuuki so Wiley E. Coyote is a barbarian?

@NautArch Arguably, so is the Roadrunner.

Although the Roadrunner is at minimum a 10th-level Unthinking Barbarian.

@Yuuki The Undeterred thing doesn't make sense.

Oh, no, wait, yes it does.

@NautArch Btw just reached Bard 10. Picking my magical secrets is hard

8:23 PM

I was thinking "a DC 10 check to resist explanation? But there wasn't a threat of explanation in the first place." But there is, it's restriction #5.

@Rubiksmoose oooooooh. wacha thinking about?

BIgby's hand?

@NautArch too many darned things. Destructive wave, wall of light, wall of force, dawn, commune, steel wind strike, creation.

Telekinesis maybe.

@Rubiksmoose do you have a paladin or a storm cleric?

(One thing to remember is that I am also a cleric worshipping the sun god so some of those lighty spells have double meaning)

@NautArch Got a paladin, but I'm the only clericy thing in the party. Wizard, Warlock/Monk, Fighter/Rogue, Paladin.

@Rubiksmoose oe thing to consider then: grabbing Destructive Wave is kind of a FU to the paladin. THey don't get it until Level 17.

8:27 PM

@Yuuki That would have been perfect for my barbarian doctor who would punch allies back to life

@NautArch That was definitely a consideration for some of the spells. I didn't take Greater Steed for the same reason (it is basically stealing a paladin class feature).

though we a re unlikely to reach 17th level in our campaign I think.

@Rubiksmoose even meaner then :) See that cool spell you'll never get? Yeah, this is it.

@NautArch True true. It is a very good point.

I was pretty annoyed when our storm cleric through it down awhile ago, and I only hit level 17 a session ago.

Commune will be something I talk to my Dm about before I take. Not sure I want to waste a spell known for it honestly but we have a pretty deity-heavy campaign so it might be more useful than other campaigns.

8:31 PM

@Rubiksmoose Can't say I've ever seen a Warlock/Monk before... how does that one work

@Rubiksmoose oooh, that's acdtually very cool if your DM is up for that.

@MikeQ Monk/Warlock actually I think (my sloppiness). Ummm I'm honestly not sure. It was thematic more than mechanical choice. He is very combat viable though. He has the darkness sight invocation and uses darkness to great advantage.

@NautArch If anybody would be, he would. One thing is we kind of already had to do a mini-commune as a way to mitigate the stress the paladin player was feeling.

She was super super anxious that her choices were going to upset Lathander and get her oathbreakered. Like OOC stressed.

@Rubiksmoose what oath was she? Does she/DM understand that her power is not from Lathander but from followingher belief in the oath?

Might not be a 5e campaign.

Is it though?

@NautArch Ancients. And yes. I should say that her concerns were rather justified in that the choices were fairly major and it would be something the DM would enforce. However, I do think she was getting herself too worked up about it. IMO it takes a very serious violation to be an oathbreaker. Generally, if you earnestly try to do your best I think your stay on good terms with the deity.

8:39 PM

IIRC only Forgotten Realms paladins draw their power from a god, in any edition.

@Yuuki It is 5e indeed.

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@SPavel I thought 5e pallys get their power from their oath

@Rubiksmoose What did she do?

@NautArch She prayed real hard and a representative of Lathander gave some simple reassurance that she was doing fine and that the path she was taking was good in his eyes.

8:42 PM

@Rubiksmoose nono, i meant what did she do that was against her oath?

or might have been.

@NautArch oh nothing really actually. So her oath is to protect people (I don't remember the specifics offhand) and we essentially had a fork in the road (or more like a detour). I'll give a brief summary of the dilemma but it came down to her being worried that doing one choice while best for a small group would end up horribly for a much larger group of people through her inaction.

@Rubiksmoose that doesn't sound like an oath breaker for Ancients. She still was helping a small group.

there is no greater good in the oath description.

@MikeQ Forgotten Realms is speshul

Divine power can only come from gods

Basically (avoiding spoilers for the campaign I'm in which is published) some big enemies are coming and we need to get up and warn people and get reinforcements and make preparations to drive them back. However, my character, because of some unintentionally synergistic background story, ended up with the equivalent of an evil artifact of Lloth imbued into her body causing many bad things.

The question was if we took time to take care of the item for my character (who is dating the paladin in game) if the BBEGs would arrive and destroy everyone/thing in the meantime.

Also if you don't worship, or give lip service only, your soul is trapped in a torture wall for all eternity

8:50 PM

@SPavel Oath of the Crown is in Sword's Coast Adventurer's Guide which is in the Forgotten Realms. So... not exactly special

It is the Oath not necessarily a god

@NautArch She may have written her own oaths actually. (I'm a terrible in-game girlfriend).

@Rubiksmoose that may have been a hard moral question, but it clearly fulfills her oath as well. She's preserving the light within her (her love for you), sheltering the light(getting rid of the evil within you), etc

@DavidCoffron I'mm glad that FR got over itself

@Rubiksmoose ah, well then I can't judge if it's against her oaths. But Lathander has zero impact on her power, ultimately (Unless she wrote her oath to override the standard paladin rules)

Homebrew content: Oath of Not Being a Paladin

8:52 PM

lol

break it and you,... well, become a paladin

@NautArch Yeah that was my misstatement. She knows her oaths are the key. Though she may interpret the deity as enforcing that oath maybe?

Homebrew content: Oath of Contradiction And Ensuing Philosophical Discussion That Ends Up Taking Hours

ok, slightly better: Oath of Not Falling into Paladin Stereotypes

@Yuuki Oath of not taking Oaths, also known as Russell's Oath.

@Yuuki Pretty sure core paladins do that

8:54 PM

@Rubiksmoose and that's where she might have gotten confuzzed with 5e. It's all about following your own belief, not a god (but you can have a god, still.)

in my campaign, there turned out to be corrupted angels who pretended to be representatives our god. It only more firmly reminded me that my power is in my oath of vengeance, and not with Anubis.

@MikeQ Conversely, the Oath of Being A Paladin. Your only belief is that you are a paladin.

@NautArch Yeah we may be playing it a bit differently. I, interestingly fell into the idea of becoming cleric to the same god as my in game SO, which has been pretty flavorful as well as a cool dip mechanically.

Why can you Divine Smite? Because you believe that you're a paladin.

@Rubiksmoose Very! Like when my bard requested powers from the god of our cleric who was kicking butt :)

@Yuuki Don Quixote would have made a great paladin.

8:56 PM

@Rubiksmoose exactly.

But yeah still don't know what I'm taking for My 10th level spells. Probably taking Synaptic State and MAss Cure Wounds for my bard spells though.

Do people have any opinions about MCW? It seems like a decent scaling of the base spell to me.

@Rubiksmoose i've only had one chance to use Synaptic state. It was pretty awesome.

@Rubiksmoose with no cleric, it's a great spell.

@NautArch It seems like it would be pretty great against any tightly grouped clump of low-int creatures.

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