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12:06 AM
on Pilchard123's zero-damage question, what is it supposed to be a duplicate of?
I don't see any links supporting its duplicity.
...except right at the top. Derp.
hey there @ThomasWard @fectin @nitsua60
how're things going?
@Shalvenay hiya
@nitsua60 what's up?
12:22 AM
@Shalvenay I've just become a stage dad. (My 6yo has been cast as the littlest girl in The Sound of Music.) So, that's a thing now.
@nitsua60 xD
@nitsua60 my father has actually been drafted into a couple school plays before
Because of some notable talent, or a prominent physical feature, or just because he hangs out with the wrong crowds?
@nitsua60 I would have to say because of certain features of his personality
@Shalvenay Also, just learned I was not the recipient of a particular grant. So, that's not a thing, at least for me =\
12:26 AM
@nitsua60 :(
@nitsua60 it may also be because he hangs out with the wrong nuns or something XD
@trogdor lolfigsl
@nitsua60 -- do you have any thoughts on alternate schedules btw?
it is a nun-run catholic school after all, so he kinda has to, to some degree
@Shalvenay I'm firing up discord to see what-all I missed
Hmm... looks like nothing. For some reason I thought you and Ash were chatting times on Discord last night.
12:30 AM
@nitsua60 I thought you were also involved in that conversation last night
@trogdor I may have been present-but-not-paying-attention? I was working on grading exams. I hold to a 24-hour turnaround.
well, no new conversations had happened when I checked
I had just sorta assumed for some reason, before checking, that they must have
I mean, in my defense, people had said "let's move this to discord"
@LegendaryDude One GM I know has it solved, I think: the moment a side declares the intent to quit the combat, the DMG's chase rules--rather than combat-round movement--come into play.
@Shalvenay looks like I didn't reply to that one. (Oops!) Fridays tend to be very spotty for me: my high-schoolers play roughly every-other, and my orchestra concerts are often on Friday evenings. Sundays would be much better for me. (cc @Ash)
@trogdor That's right--when I made the strange equivalence "everyone not in my conversation right now" = "tourists". Definitely was paying a lot more attention to exams than chat!
well, to be fair there, I am still sorta a tourist
I only lurk in those games because it is hard to fit my schedule to when they happen
@nitsua60 [takes selfie with nitsua's conversation]
12:37 AM
maybe tourist isn't the right word for that, but it's probably better than "participant"
@trogdor What, 10am on a workday isn't good for you to step out and game for three hours?
@nitsua60 lololol :P XD
@nitsua60 it's more like, 11 or 12 or so
usually, at least so far
but close enough yeah
@trogdor just take a looooong lunch break
that is an excessively long lunch right there
I think I already fudge my lunch time a little, doing even more of that isn't what I want to start doing XD
Forgive my ignorance: Age of Rebellion, Edge of the Empire, and Force & Destiny are related games, right?
12:45 AM
I have no idea
for a second I thought that middle one was "Age" of Empires
and I was about to be really confused XD
@nitsua60 Well, they're all RPGs about Star Wars, so definitely related.
@nitsua60 Sundays are theoretically doable, although I run into similar issues at the end of March as I do with the saturdays.
(I appreciate the efforts to include me but my weird work schedule means I jam a lot into Sundays, because they're the only "weekend" day I get (I mean I am off Mondays, but those are a common workday for everyone else I know, generally))
@Ash Fairy 'nuff. Working every Saturday morning and every-other Sunday afternoon (with every fifth weekend fully work-booked) I can certainly understand.
(Then again, I'm starting tomorrow an entire month off, so don't go feeling bad for me.)
1:07 AM
@Ash is early on Monday evenings workable for you?
basically, 8PM EST Monday evening
1:25 AM
Q: Do these tags need an umbrella?

nitsua60There are currently 8 questions that are tagged with all three of edge-of-the-empire, force-and-destiny, and age-of-rebellion. That's out of 44 EotE, 20 FaD, and 29 AoR questions. In other words, a sizable proportion of questions in any of these tags have all of these tags. I don't know the syst...

hey there @peterh
@Shalvenay Hey :-) Welcome :-)
@peterh welcome :)
1:56 AM
hey as well @Pilchard123
@nitsua60 I think they're all basically the same system, but they focus on different types of adventure. I've read that the books are all cross compatible, but I don't have any experience with them.
Hey @Shalvenay
@Pilchard123 They're... on close-together shelves at my FLGS, is abut all I know =|
how're things going?
@nitsua60 They are technically different games using the same system. They're three parts of the same greater gamiverse.
They are standalone, and tend towards different types of adventure. They each have their own campaign setting (all within the SW universe) and classes, lore, etc., focusing on different aspects of Star Wars.
@LegendaryDude Is it akin to you and me writing two games--"LD" and "nits", let's call them--but both using the d20 "engine"? And, for fun, let's set both our games in Hyborea?
2:05 AM
But they are completely compatible with each other and share the same rules system.
@nitsua60 Where's Hyborea?
(It's the Conan setting.)
@nitsua60 Ah, right.
They're more closely related than that. There's just too much content for a single Star Wars game so they split it into three settings with three core books.
Better than splitting it across three core books and requiring them all.
So it's more like Eberron, Dark Sun, and Forgotten Realms, where the different world content necessitates some different rules but it's still all one system?
2:07 AM
Okay, so is this me writing my magnum opus game, where there are three game-modes: small-party adventuring, wargaming, and Great Game/political intrigue? I use the same mechanics for all three (because I'm a re-user), but they're meant for playing fundamentally different stories.
@Miniman Closer, but they're directly connected and in the same universe. They're completely compatible with each lore-wise and rule-wise.
One focuses on a more espionage and political type game, one focuses on Jedi and their conflicts, and one focuses on smuggling, bounty hunting, and other fringe of society activities.
2:26 AM
@Ash -- check Discord :)
@Shalvenay Sorry, was getting home and eating dinner, I will check it now :)
hey there @Emrakul
@nitsua60 Couldn't find it on the shelf. Turns out my wife has the Death books on her to read shelf.
@nitsua60 , @LegendaryDude, how would you distinguish the official Mark As Dupe vs. the unofficial (but very traditional) comment "related: xyz question link"?
as I understand those questions, I'd have done the Related comment rather than a full-on dupe
3:22 AM
@nitsua60 are you up?
3:33 AM
hey as well @CTWind
hey @JuneShores
Hey there.
how're things going?
3:49 AM
Going alright. Looking at dungeon design tutorials.
Setting up physical places to explore is one thing that I'm not great at as a GM.
my problem is trying to set things up in a way that's not too labor-intensive
mine is not trying to set things in stone
or at least accidentally doing something like that
basically, not overdesigning dungeons to the point where they're...not dungeon-y any longer :P
(i.e. something that comes off designed like a modern building in terms of floorplanning/circulation and such)
I try to set things up so that the PC's have choices, but also so that they do specific things XD
it's a thematic schism I think more than anything else
3:57 AM
it ends up invariably with me improvising most of what happens based off of them almost immediately going off of the rails that I didn't truly prepare to be gotten off of
@Shalvenay Hello!
my instincts when it comes to "how do I lay out a building?" are that of an engineer...and that sort of layout is anathema to the ethos of a classical dungeon crawl
@CTWind how're thing's going?
@Shalvenay Good! Just got back from a game. (5e campaign based on Princes of the Apocalypse)
@CTWind ah
@Shalvenay I've seen some guides to dungeon design that suggest thinking of it like a flowchart... build the logical connections, then work out how to represent them physically
4:03 AM
@Adeptus yeah, that's not the problem -- I get the circulations right; in fact, I think the problem is that I get them too right
@JuneShores What's the sort of problem you run into? Got an example?
the layout is almost too obvious -- no dead ends, no cruft if you will
serious shortage of dark corners :P
it's like trying to hold a dungeon crawl in a modern high rise office building :P
@BESW Oh, I tend to just wing it. I have very little experience designing maps beforehand. So that's what I'm hoping to do, is to flesh out my aesthetic-based ideas into stuff that works in space without massaging in real time.
@Shalvenay Age it. Have a fault sever some hallways, or some cave-ins. Or layer different epochs of inhabitants: the original designers had a great place, but then a thousand years later the goblins living there needed ways to block off the section that was infested with crawlers. Maybe?
[rummages for links]
Nov 10 '16 at 6:04, by BESW
I try to start any design work with the Big 3+1 Questions: What is your game about? How does your game do this? How does your game encourage / reward this? How do you make this fun?
4:08 AM
@nitsua60 yeah, I think that's where I fall down, because I kind of assume that even with a reused structure, people are going in and taking their time to an extent :P (i.e. they may repurpose spaces, but if they're actually doing changes to the structure, they're doing them correctly and not half-arsed-hackily)
@BESW Oooh. This will be useful. 'Cause, yeah, it's level design and level design is game design.
A: Giving a setting a feeling of ancientness

BESWWell... first the world needs to have an ancient history to call on. If you haven't given the world a history, you'll need different strategies to give the impression of one. That's what made LotR work in this way; Tolkien had all that history at his fingertips and could refer to it casually in p...

...I need to update that answer with some okapi butts.
@BESW I guess my Kobold remodeling armies are just plum too uptight about Code compliance ;)
@Shalvenay I currently have two half-removed layers on my kitchen floor. Linoleum tile, on top of a weird slathering of concrete on half the floor, on top of wood. There used to be carpet on top, nailed down all over. The nails are still in there.
4:11 AM
@JuneShores haha.
We had a hell of a time getting any of this up.
@nitsua60 you still with us btw?
@Shalvenay in and out
@nitsua60 aah. (moving over to Discord to avoid boring the tourists ;)
@Shalvenay This assumption seems demonstrably false, based on every wall I've ever torn into.
4:17 AM
@nitsua60 hahaha
yeah I don't think there are actually nearly enough people who are actually dedicated to following all the building codes for every dungeon to be really well designed and stay well maintained to boot
@trogdor hahahaha
@trogdor Also... this is a medieval/renaissance fantasy setting. What building codes?
(Is that when you hide a secret message in the stonework?)
that too, but he had already mentioned building medieval dungeons like modern buildings
@Adeptus lol
4:30 AM
@BESW ...yeah, okay. But thatched roofs and complaints from neighbours are usually not concerns in dungeon construction
True, I suspect an underground temple devoted to Asmodeus would have different kinds of codes, like rules about the minimum amount of blood the altar's drainage channels should be able to handle without clotting.
But do keep in mind D&D settings are dealing with entire pantheons dedicated to Law and Order. Construction regulations are probably a sacred rite in some places.
4:45 AM
> A tunnel ought to be built with hard work, know-how, and the occasional bracing timber. If you try shoring it up with magic, bad things happen. Walls collapse and the entire tunnel gets de-stabilzed. And you never know when it'll be the wrong phase of the moon and the whole thing'll come down.
Like Dwarves. They'd dig out a mountain, and if the stone wouldn't hold, they'd just slap a spell on it. But the only way to keep it stable was to keep packing magic on, and eventually they couldn't hold it together, and they'd leave.
Digger is pretty great.
yep, it was fun to read for sure
@BESW personally, I prefer remesh and shotcrete, but I'm partial to NATM for hard rock or a TBM in soft ground
5:02 AM
@BESW I really need to read Digger some day
I have been reading her Hamster Princess books lately, they're pretty great
Yes, you do.
Hamster Princess is awesome.
And apparently Castle Hangnail has been optioned for a film.
My problem is finding the books
(yes, I know it's all online, I struggle with reading it that way)
That's fair.
But the books are hard to find :(
Sofawolf sells it in omnibus and individual volumes.
5:10 AM
@BESW I can't justify the $45 they want for shipping :(
checks if they ship to me
(Because Canada)
They do, and while it isn't free, it's $7, that I can justfiy
Excellent, it will be mine :D
(Thanks for the help/enabling)
My pleasure.
Throw in The Seventh Bride while you're at it!
I read Byrony and Roses recently it was AMAZING
Digger pretty much exhausts my current book budget but it's worth it :)
It's a freaking doorstop of a book.
5:15 AM
Excellent :D
(I love graphic novels, I just have trouble reading them (comic type things are hard for me to pay attention to - I have to read them slowly (well, slower than the high speed I read normal print stuff))
And for some reason the physical-ness of them helps that
Oh boy what have I gotten myself into :P
Four pounds of practical wombat.
@BESW That's pretty light for a wombat :P
@BESW Thats a lot of book. I'm going to have to get creative with shelf space :P
5:20 AM
> [T]hese suckers have weight. They come in at four pounds apiece. You could club an intruder to death with one. (Ursula Vernon)
You're probably getting the softcover, so that's a little better.
For non-US people, Book Depository is often a better deal than Amazon - they have slightly higher item price but worldwide free shipping (but they don't seem to have Digger)
I used to use edwardrhamilton.com because they shipped everything media rate.
They sell used and remaindered books (mostly in perfect condition, they just sat on a store shelf unsold until the store decided to sell them cheap in bulk to Hamilton in order to get rid of them), so it's super cheap, and they ship media rate which means they charge a single flat shipping rate for every order no matter how big or heavy it is.
But they stopped shipping to Guam because the USPS changed how media rate works overseas.
@Adeptus yeah, I often check there if Amazon.ca doesn't have things
and then I check Alibris for used copies because sometimes that works out too
but in this case, shipping was $7 which for a GIANT book all the way to me is acceptable :D
(Although I don't know if it will fit in the mailbox.)
Every time an author etc. likes a tweet I make about their things I get all squibbly happy inside. (I tweet a lot about books I'm reading or whatever)
Vernon's very active on Twitter.
I've noticed :D
5:30 AM
She's a good example of my approach to the Internet: find somebody whose tastes mesh with but don't perfectly match up to my own, follow them on social media, see what they share, repeat.
She's how I found Jill Bearup, who led me to MedievalPOC, who introduced me to Nnendi Okorafor...
It's a good way to find new things :D
4 hours later…
9:32 AM
Tonight's dinner is vegan Italian sausage and carrots, chopped and sautéed with garlic, cayenne pepper, honey, ketchup, Worcestershire, and chives, served on whole wheat rigatoni.
just saw your attempt to make a MLP rpg, and I am pretty sure this already exists
even if I'm not sure about its quality
(and making me hungry is not nice :( )
Mmm, there's plenty of bootleg MLP hacks, mostly using totally inappropriate engines like the d20 System. And there's an official MLP RPG in the works (announced just a week or two ago).
But my vision, for several years, has been very focused on some very specific themes and values which it's unlikely even the official game will really spotlight--just because it needs to appeal to the lowest common denominator, and that means D&Ding it up with trying to be all things for all players and in the process failing to do any one thing really well.
June's been working on their own RPG focused on supporting the pacing and structure of short-form cartoon serials like Steven Universe, Adventure Time, Samurai Jack, etc.
Their focus on structure rather than content will mesh nicely with my focus on theme and message rather than setting and plot.
9:51 AM
@BESW June?
Is that the author of Tails of Equestria or someone else?
JuneShores is the Stack user whose "join forces" comment is in the star bar.
Ah. Somehow I hadn't scanned starred posts yet.
I've been talking about what an MLP game should look like for years, but JuneShores and I considered an alliance just two days ago.
10:19 AM
I see
the thing I was thinking about was a system involving different competences, and when you had to face a challenge you had to combine competences from different characters
and you had these "friendship points" you could spend to give generic bonus to people
but yeah, there wasn't really a good handle of relationships between characters, just a general "friendship score" which means how good a friend you are
anyway, if you come up with something I would be glad to beta-test it :)
@AnneAunyme Sounds like a Gumshoe variant.
2 hours later…
12:31 PM
Q: What made my answer invalid?

enkryptorI can't clearly understand why my answer to What reasons have the designers given for why unarmed strikes aren't 'light melee weapons'? was downvoted and deleted. The OP asked: Given that Unarmed Strikes do not have the light property, this implies that you can't use your bonus action to att...

1:23 PM
It's an old one, just needs to be closed to prevent more new answers (I've already protected it since it was bumped up by a new answer this morning).
1:39 PM
And a second answer... Hmm.
Incidentally, the tool (MapForge) does look pretty promising. I am genuinely excited for that one. Have been, since BESW posted the kickstarter link in here.
@Patta Yeah, I'm suspecting an undisclosed affiliation here.
Jup, that was my first guess, too.
Btw: Flagging as "needs to be closed" is not the same as close-voting, or is it?
@Patta It's close-voting for users without close vote privileges - if you can close vote, it acts as a flag anyway.
ah, alright. Thanks
Good morning
2:01 PM
@Patta Oddly, this answer was posted by a user who also voted to close...
@Patta But maybe that's because they didn't realize it was off-topic. I see the answer was deleted shortly after.
if it was the one talking about gimp, I mentioned in a comment that the question was offtopic, yea.
Yeah, saw that.
I gotta claim credit wherever I can :P
I used the macaroni method last time I tried to make a map
It wasn't half bad
2:13 PM
Oh that user posting about MapForge answered another old map tool rec Q with practically the same answer.
Looks like @mxyzplk is on the case.
My go-to method is just drawing squiggly lines and maybe putting some paperback trees on the table :P
So the Mapforge link is pulling spam or it's cause the answers are so alike?
-> It's a bit easier to do with roll20, which I like.
yea I like roll20.
I would guess he's affiliated with MapForge in some way without disclosing it
2:15 PM
@Aaron A little of column A, a little of column B. We have a spam detector.
Roll20's map making tools are okay, but I don't like the way the content library works.
I find it too difficult to find the specific things I'm looking for.
Yea, I can see that. It is irritating....
Which is why I create all my tokens myself :D
On the other hand the dynamic lighting and LoS stuff is awesome, you can't get that on a real table top.
Yes, I love that. I ran a pathfinder dungeon crawl campaign that way once. It was awesome
and took way to long until I was happy with the dungeons themselves :D
Yea I loved the dynamic lighting when I was DMing
@Patta Same. I end up just usually taking pictures from the internet, or from the books and creating little circle tokens for them.
2:18 PM
I dislike Roll20s character sheets though.
They feel... scattered
In what way?
I mean, it also depends on the way they are implemented. I created my own for Splittermond, and it works really well
If you know your way around html and css, it's awesome.
I use a google sheet someone made and everything I need is on one page and I rarely need to look at the 'background pages' while on the roll20 sheet I have to flip through the tabs constantly
As long as you don't want to have too many fancy things, at least :D
Then use a non-tabbed charsheet, if one exists :D
(I get that that's not always an option :D)
But yea, Google Docs works really well, too
I haven't seen one. I like to have a 'main tab' with background tabs you only visit when leveling up or building a character
For what system?
I have seen them for TDE and Savage Worlds, and saw some others that I did never use... They definitely exist, but only for certain systems :D
2:22 PM
For map making software for printable maps I use CC3+
I can't google that atm, what does the CC stand for?
I mainly play Pathfinder
Playing a fighter who has natural claw attacks and I'm taking the mutation warrior. Would be nice if I could get two extra attacks
@Patta Campaign Cartographer
It's a very powerful tool
Which, unfortunately, means the UI is a bit tricky if you're more familiar with graphic design applications
It doesn't work at all like Photoshop or GIMP, so it tends to turn a lot of new people off
@Aaron the only available (english) pathfinder sheet seems to be a single tab...
@Patta I'm not sure where you're getting that from but the one we use in our game is the default one I think and it's riddled with tabs. Unless they did yet another update to the sheet.
Is that the built in sheet that you get when you select pathfinder as your game on Roll20?
Oh, looking at the preview that is nothing like our sheet
I LIKE that sheet, it's nice and neatly formatted.
2:32 PM
don't think it is the default one, I did not even know that Roll20 has a deffault one :D
We used the german version of that one in the dungeon crawl game I mentioned, and it works really well
In general, the charsheet github repo is great:
Yea, when you start up a game you select what system you're using and when you make character sheets for players it uses a default sheet for the system you selected.
At least that's how I understand it works when I DMed last. It's been awhile since I have, about a year at least.
Probably two
Last time I checked, there was a dropdown that was prefilled with the default sheet for certain games (pathfinder, DnD mainly) but you could select different ones
@Patta That is indeed how it works.
Hmm. I might see if everyone is willing to switch sheets. Might be a bit of work but these sheets look a lot better. Do they allow you to auto calc rolls and make buttons you can click to roll things like full attacks and such?
2:35 PM
Macros is the word I was looking for I think.
@Aaron I'm not certain you can switch sheets for a game that you've already created.
@Aaron The sheets don't do that, but IIRC you can create macro buttons which can be anchored to your screen which do key off of fields on the character sheet
(It's been a while since I actually used Roll20 for online play; mostly just use it to project maps onto the table)
Hmm. Alrighty
Thanks :)
poop. I hate when the answer isn't what I want lol
I was hoping Vestigial arms would give extra natural attacks
3:00 PM
@LegendaryDude You actually can, without a problem. The old data might get lost, though... It is very likely to get lost, in fact
(I mainly use it for my custom sheet for Splittermond that I mentioned, where I update the HTML/CSS regularly)
@LegendaryDude Yup, that's possible.
3:24 PM
Damn, I'll need to do some research once I get home. I'm itching to answer the TDE-Question about the nameless one that came up...
1 hour later…
4:28 PM
Q: What should have happened here?

the dark wandererMe and another high-rep user came into conflict over the editing process and authorial intent. Specifically, I think that if an edit fundamentally changes the question asked it should be authorized only by pre-existing author approval, whereas he is of the position that as long as a request for ...

5 hours later…
9:55 PM
Q: Is this question about bonus actions a duplicate?

THiebertToday, a question was asked regarding the bonus action granted by the Crossbow Expert feat in D&D 5e. There's been a large amount of contention about whether or not the question is a duplicate of not one, not two, but three other questions. The feature in question has a different name and wordi...

1 hour later…
11:09 PM
Wow, we're a lively bunch today. :D
Hey guys, do gods live in a particular place in D&D
depends on edition I think
im not familiar with all the planes, but right now the players in my campaign are in some ill-defined place that I'm thinking ties in with something like a plane that gods would live on
Depends on setting & edition. Generally, they live in the outer planes. Some 'lesser' deities live on the Prime Material plane in various places.
11:15 PM
A: What are the planes of D&D 4e? Where did they come from, and how are they connected?

doppelgreenerThere are several fundamental planes: the Astral Sea, the Elemental Chaos, the Mortal World, and the World's two echoes: the Feywild (from which the Eladrin came), and the Shadowfell. And then there's Sigil, the city of doors, a plane which doesn't quite fit in anywhere and may not rightly exist ...

4e's gods live in the Astral Plane, mostly, unless their particular domains require some other domicile.
Hmm...sigil is interesting
I was playing with the idea of some pocket dimension tied to something like the astral plane
@Skyler That's pretty much what 4e does: planet-like subrealms floating in the Astra Sea, each with their own qualities according to the god(s) they host.
I guess I mean a subpocket
my PCs are currently on this very weird island
basically I want to make my next day of campaign a SUPER deadly trials, where if the players succeed they will be granted some great bestowal. At the end of this day they are all ejected back to the mortal planes, with the fit of mind and heart stepping out better than they stepped in
What happens if they fail? Dishonor on them, dishonor on their family, dishonor on their cow?
misfortune due to their own vices awaits
11:24 PM
Sounds like my life.
each character has these flaws to them that in a world karma would have a field day with them
Chosen at character creation or a result roleplaying in the campaign so far?
@Karelzarath a bit of it is chosen, a few others murderhoboism
Ah, the favorite past time of many a character/player.
Murderhoboism, it's a pandemic.
11:28 PM
To be fair it was pretty easy with the prior DM in the rotation so I'm not really trying to fault the party as much as present their characters with a chance to rise above it
accept the existence of evil in oneself and become stronger for choosing not to exercise it rather than being a puppet to it
11:59 PM
In a weird alignment of grammar, I think that's the third time today I've seen someone on a Stack use "past time" when I think they meant "pastime"

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