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3:01 PM
i am not sure how exactly we ought to approach meta guidance on the matter (like what kind of question would we ask and what answer/s would we imagine giving?), and i am also not sure i am the right person to ask it or answer it since i don't play D&D 5e.
do any of you have thoughts on the matter?
 
@doppelspooker A few months ago, someone on this chat was complaining the opposite - that we're getting too many "it's up to the GM" answers.
"Up to the GM" is usually enough to be strictly speaking true, but it's often not the most helpful answer - especially if it concerns the big issues of the question and not just a tangent or somesuch.
"Here's how I would rule it" is an improvement in my opinion, as long as it's backed with analysis or experience.
 
@kviiri In which case it's not really "here's how I would rule it" but rather "here's how I have ruled it...."
 
But in questions that actually do have rules-based answers, I think they take priority. Even then, it gets better if it has critical analysis on when the rule might not make sense.
@nitsua60 Well, I think sometimes one doesn't have to really have had made the ruling in order for the analysis to be valuable.
One example which was discussed here in the chat (I think?) some time ago was whether blindsight in 5e counts as "seeing" the target, as it's described in the Monster manual as other senses making up for the lack of sight. Super-accurate echolocation or something.
This is going into RAI territory, but anyway... There's no direct support for blindsight counting as sight nor direct opposition in the rules, leaving it mostly to the GM, but Volo has a monster (Elder Brain, iirc) which lacks other modes of vision but has sight-targeted spells.
Which sort of opens the door to "I would rule that blindsight in general counts as sight for sight-targeted spells, because otherwise this monster in published material X doesn't make sense".
 
3:18 PM
@kviiri I agree. However we are getting a lot of those that have no such analysis or experience. They're just "here is how I would do it" and don't go much further.
(Note for the potential meta guidance, expressing a ruling is fine, just back it up)
@kviiri That can be an issue too. D&D 5e did leave a lot of things up to the GM, and unlike games like fate i get the picture there aren't really principled ways to handle situations, it's just "well... do something arbitrary, you'll work it out". in Fate it's easier for us to answer without having experienced that exact situation, because we can answer based on well-understood play principles and based on expertise of how the small number of mechanics work well being applied.
 
@doppelspooker Yep. Even the DMG is like "You can do this, or you can do that, or that, or ... <several options later>, pick whichever you like, it's your game!"
The problem with trying to be "The Tabletop RPG" instead of "a Tabletop RPG", I guess.
 
@kviiri yep, probably
@kviiri that sounds like a reasonable way to justify "here's how i would rule it." we can point to game precedent as a strong indicator something's the case.
 
I'd propose the following three-step program as a good starting point for further refinement:
1) What do the rules say?
2) If you would rule contrary to the written rules, explain how and why
3) If there is no rule (or the rule is "The GM decides"), present the ruling you would make and why (or multiple feasible rulings accompanied by analysis to help the querent understand their differences)
...with perhaps "and why" bolded so everyone understands that that part is not optional!
 
3:37 PM
I would caution against codifying point 3 as a requirement or firm suggestion. That is inviting people to present a lot of opinion and homebrew, which is asking them to walk into a minefield. Going by site function, it works better for us for someone to say "The rules don't cover this, so the GM decides" if that's the case. It works better still for them to answer with how they advise to handle it, and votes can encourage that.
Rather, if they have advice to provide on how to handle ruling the scenario, we suggest it may improve their answer to provide that advice and why they'd advise such, and draw upon relevant experience (their own or someone else's) or facts from the rules or game fiction to back up their advice.
 
Fair points
I wish they had designed 5e with our site in mind :P
 
haha :D
 
Hmm, Data.stackexchange is working funnily for me
After I log in, it still doesn't show me as logged in.
Works on firefox. Weird
 
@kviiri works fine for me on chrome. maybe the page is cached for you.
 
Could be, yeah
I created this query a few days back. Apart from the results sorting a bit stupidly, it ought to work fine, and shows a pleasing rise in posts per month on our site :)
 
3:53 PM
ok, I bet I can't ask this question on the stack (it's pretty much an open ended shopping one), but:
I will run the Battle on the Silkwiesen again next week (hopefully making it better this time!)... and this time I want to use some background music. So I need music befitting a large scale fantasy battle. I could go and dig out Settlers 2, Anno 1602 and such for music, maybe even pull the drakensang ones I have in, but what **other** music for an epic battle that is **not** LotR would be fitting?
 
@kviiri some moderator-only stats agree our site views & activity are pretty continually going up, which is great. :)
@Trish you bet correctly. :P I'll ping @BESW about that because there was a period during which he was gathering music for his D&D 4e campaigns.
 
@doppelspooker While activity is great, I am concearned about the huge portion d&d5 takes. it drowns out almost everything else.
 
@Trish A friend uses this for good effect: tabletopaudio.com
@Trish Also, wow... I thought I was the only one who uses video game soundtracks!
I call soulmates on this.
 
hey, it was one of my players (the one with the most experience) who brought up the drakensang music during chargen.
@kviiri good resource!
 
In that one campaign where the bad guys were villains in disguise, I intended to use "Ride Forth Victoriously" from EU4 as their leitmotif pre-reveal. It's a very good piece: youtube.com/watch?v=Ycl0vpbMfWw
And post-reveal, they'd use the Guns, Drums and Steel version: youtube.com/watch?v=pO_UqoIDJO0
 
3:58 PM
Year of the Griffon has mainly "savage" orcs as enemies.
 
Too bad my laptop broke and I didn't want to get a new one just to play background music.
 
@kviiri how about a tablet or using the cell?
but a good song that might become the motive for treason might be needed...
 
@Trish I never have owned a tablet (although I was on a TV program to evaluate consumer grade models) and my experiences with using the cellphone as audio playback device haven't really shined :)
 
Well, I use a Bose speaker if I use my cell as the 'player'
but I just got a new laptop
 
So I made a player (the same guy who uses the site I linked to you) my dedicated DJ and let him handle the audio :)
 
4:01 PM
also a good idea... asing the player that made the music in first place to play "something for a parade" or "something for battle" - unless I want something myself.
 
@Trish It's the latest in what many consider to be the quintessential TTRPG, especially for people who are new to the hobby. I wouldn't be too concerned about it unless it actively starts harming something else, which I'm not convinced is happening.
 
I'm pretty convinced it's harming many things, although not necessarily on this site. It's just not a very newbie-friendly TTRPG, and yet it's the only one most people know about.
 
ARG! What is the best equivalent to the word "Heerschau" in english? It is pretty much a parade of the army of a king for the civillians and at the same time the chance for the king to inspire his army.
 
@Trish What makes it not just a "parade"? The presence of the king?
Or a "military parade", if you want to be sure it's not associated with carnival floats and all that.
 
While a Heerschau is a kind of parade, it happens pretty much before the war, incontrast to a triumph that happens after victory.
dictionary tells military parade... well, I guess no specific music for that available.
 
4:09 PM
Do you want "realistic" music (eg. what you would actually hear at one) or more like a match in mood?
 
Hola a todos
 
well, something for the mood. For actual music I would dig out the landsknecht songs.
those are Late medieval/early modern marches
 
@GreySage Hola. ¿Cómo está?
 
@doppelspooker I don't think it's a coincidence though - this site has a very solid quality and is probably doing a lot of "sidebar magnetism" to draw people in from other SO sites.
I used to read RPG.SE frequently even before starting tabletop RPGs myself.
 
@Adam Consado, con dolor, pero feliz.
 
4:14 PM
So hats off to all the mods and demimods among us for keeping the site enjoyable!
La quenta por favor.
 
hmmm, something for a siege... Ok, I /could/ use LotR with Minas Tirith there, but I don't want to use LotR for TheDarkEye...
 
A difficulty I always have with DnD background songs too is that they last an instant when compared to combat's timescale.
 
@GreySage Yo también. Al menos, estamos feliz.
 
heh, yea... you need endless long songs... stuff as long as "autobahn" (16 minutes!) for ONE combat round... or one player's turn.
 
Ayer mi esposa demoro en trafico, y tuve caminar 75 minutos a mi casa. En la lluvia
 
4:19 PM
@Trish Or you could pick songs that you can easily process to loop arbitrarily long, although it takes a lot of prep.
 
@kviiri There are a lot of "endless" versions of songs on youtube, particularly for video game tracks.
 
@Trish For the parade, check Prokofiev's Dance of the Knights.
 
@kviiri yea, I just picked some from that page you linked. And that's why Video game music came up - it is almost loopable...
 
@GreySage Yeah, video game background tracks are usually good because they're made to loop.
 
They tend to be 20 minutes to an hour long, so if you find one you like it could work
I always say music from video games is the best ever made, because if you can listen to it almost non-stop for 100+ hours it HAS to be good.
 
4:21 PM
Dance of the Knights? Hmmm... not bad... but a bit... heavy. Mabye the best modern comparison would be those large military parades from the cold war.
"Rohan Rides" from LotR style...
 
Ok, so more "action" and "triumph" and less "menacing", gotchya
 
hmmm, let's see what Skyrim has to offer...
 
@GreySage one problem with VG soundtracks in RPGs is that they can be distracting if one of the players recognizes the game.
 
@kviiri Good point
 
That's why you gotta play games no one else in the group does :P
 
4:25 PM
Unbroken Road for the army taking initial positions might work.... yea, recognizing the game might be a problem.. .that's why I wanted to pick Settlers 2 soundtrack... Midi age...
 
@Trish Midieval.
 
@kviiri The more obscure the thing you use/reference, the more people will think that you're some kind of genius.
 
@Adam Yep!
Of course, that's always a problem. Some people would probably find classical music similarly bad if they can recognize it. Or if someone in the party does and has to make a number out of it.
 
hmmm, THIS one is... ARG! settlers 2 is a bit too "arabian" at times... youtube.com/…
@kviiri Battle on the Ice by Prokofiev! THAT one is good.
 
4:39 PM
hmmm, Dune? Why did Dune pop up for me?
 
I am a computer scientist and yet I have a macro in my IRC that autocorrects "dvorak" to "Dvoƙák". That's a sign of my appreciation to the Czech master composer :)
(the joke being, a computer scientist would be much more likely to mean the key layout)
I've recently found a lot of good musical material from various instrumental or operatic composers but the stuff they have is occasionally way too good to simply sit in the background. Sometimes a piece is good as a background tune (most VG music), sometimes it's excellent for careful listening (many classical pieces) and sometimes both.
 
@kviiri sooo true
 
4:55 PM
@kviiri for sure. our community and moderation has been working hard for years to keep things working pretty well.
 
@Trish Still track-hunting?
For military-style themes, Hearts of Iron IV has a pretty good soundtrack that for the most part does not sound very anachronistic for 19th century and later conflicts (it has a pretty standard "rise of national romanticism" vibe to it, coupled with some militarism)
Except for the Allied radio bits and the German marches, even though I think "Dance your troubles away" is an excellent piece youtu.be/CLbetsP_u-A
 
@kviiri yep, listening thrizgh Dune... that is good... a good betryal theme..
It's pretty much a high medieval setting... and they will start a revolt.
 
Well, LotR is high medieval too yet the music is nowhere near that :)
 
5:19 PM
Yea...
 
The thing is, actual Euro-medieval music tends to sound rather mellow. Most of the instruments needed to evoke LotR-style grandeur simply weren't there.
 
I know... I mean, even the Chembalo is "renaissance".
Drum and sing or Mandoline is contemporary
 
One of our CS teachers is very good with the lute.
youtube.com/watch?v=ZoQrHLiiOGE there's him and the monster of an instrument. Seriously, it's yuuuge.
 
5:41 PM
Wow, found a very fitting one: just large drums played as march.
 
 
4 hours later…
10:08 PM
@Trish Instead of music for events, I usually used background music for themes and locations: Like, instead of "this is fight music" I'd have "this is in the Feywild" or "This is about the fallen kingdom of Samrajya."
And if you were in the Feywild doing something related to Samrajya, I'd mix those two playlists.
 
@BESW I was thinking about using specific songs for specific themes... if it the 'topic' is treason, then this one song is played in... if it is the ork horde assaulting this one, if they are in the officer council this one....
 
That said... video game soundtracks are great so long as the group doesn't recognize them.... and you can find tracks that aren't just really short loops. I've used Shadow of the Colossus.
But movie soundtracks are great too. Dark City, Hero, Fury Road...
And there are some artists with good material. Carbon Maestro does good LotR-like instrumental tracks. Cusco, DAAU, Cirque du Soleil...
Depends on your themes and moods.
 
You're in luck--a new 5e book arrived in stores today!
[removes tongue from cheek]
 
10:51 PM
lol
 
11:05 PM
Mmm! Bacon! #dndoggos #dungeonsanddoggos #dungeonsanddragons #dnd #dnd5e #comcis #dogs
 
11:37 PM
"Rosemary, I'm worried. What if birds aren't weird enough?" Don't worry, friend. I've got you covered. (Standard-winged Nightjar, Paul Cools/Jan Steffen)
 
dat bird
with two ridiculous stick feather things
XD
 
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