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4:00 PM
And when suddenly the leader of the highwaymen is shouting "Guys! This is silly! Can't we just talk it over?" it kinda pulls the teeth on their attack.
 
Until the party presses their advantage and continues to kill the bandits.
 
@SimonGill Mechanically, nearly every spell in the game is a baseline combat spell because it can be cast in a single round without complex ritual.
 
Rob
Summon's casting time is very irksome though
 
@SimonGill By the explicit wording, untrue.
The spell is broken only if your allies attack the target of the spell. You can slaughter his friends and he'll do his best to assume you had no other choice.
@Rob Well, then there's the fact that with the right feats/features/items you can make any spell a combat spell.
 
@BESW Ahhh, I was thinking of "their" as referring to the rest of the bandits.
 
4:03 PM
@SimonGill Well, that too. Because if the GM is playing them at all realistically they're going to be confused and disorganized when their leader suddenly wants to play UN.
 
@Lord_Gareth saw. it was a good answer
 
Rob
@BESW Oh I don't deny it is a combat spell; just the 1 round casting time (as per sleep) is very annoying
 
@BESW Even so, they'd still go to self-defence mode against the people trying to stab them (if they're even halfway trained).
 
@Rob sleep does have a nice distance on it, though
 
4:05 PM
@SimonGill Yes, but with a single spell you've made the whole group go from offensive ambush to defensive WTF.
 
Rogue_Shadows needs the services of a man paid to, at a different time each day, leap out of a doorway and slap him in the face.
 
...I'll chip in
 
@BESW OK, yeah, that makes sense.
 
@Rob Oh, yes. 3.5's persistent tendency to balance by boring was tedious at best.
 
@Lord_Gareth Little harsh, don't you think?
 
4:05 PM
@BESW oh man, an artificer by any other name...
 
@KRyan - My statement was so lulzy you decided to join the kill squad?
 
Rob
@KRyan Oh yes ~love~ the range on sleep; that's what makes it blow rasperries at Color Spray
 
@SimonGill - YOU WERE NOT THERE FOR /THE THREAD/
>.>
 
@SimonGill there's a lot of history there
 
>.<
 
4:06 PM
Rogue_Shadows is... a very annoying person
 
@Lord_Gareth Please remember this is a public, archived, and Google-botted forum in which character assassination and ad hominim attacks are frowned upon.
2
 
I have PTSD from that thread, man. I have actual nightmares that the thread got unlocked and re-started.
And they're horrible
So very horrible
 
@BESW This. Best to ignore people who aren't involved with this site.
 
@Lord_Gareth still, he does have a point about external baggage
there are other places you frequent where it makes more sense to rant about him
 
Breathin' deep.
Breathin' deep
 
4:07 PM
@Lord_Gareth You have my sympathies, but not my condonation.
 
@BESW this, pmuch
 
@KRyan - #Giantitp doesn't want to hear it and Afroakuma forbids it in #Legend when he's there regardless of how much everyone else is participating in the sympathetic condemnation.
So I really don't have many places to "OHGODWHY" anymore
 
@Lord_Gareth well, you do it a lot; you could just avoid him as I do
I seriously don't see much of him
 
I could, but despite my best efforts he's somehow becoming a respected member of the community on GitP
 
@Lord_Gareth Time to start a blog of your own.
 
4:09 PM
Which means that if I avoid him he'll just come to me.
 
at any rate, this is pretty clearly not the best outlet
@Lord_Gareth that's not really new, he's always had sycophants
but like I said, I don't see much of him
 
You are welcome to discuss the RPG issues at hand, but without the vitriol and character attacks.
 
I should try my hand at making artifacts again sometime.
I've been wanting to do something with The Somnomancer's Cookbook for awhile.
 
@SimonGill And it's equally inappropriate to make character attacks on members of this community, so that kind of trenchancy is just all-around better off at a minimum.
...Great Scott, I'm turning into a mod. Quick, what's something irresponsible I can do?
 
One thing I don't comprehend is the common trend in homebrew artifacts to make them overwhelmingly powerful - I've seen folks try to get +150 swords to fly past the radar because they're artifacts
@BESW - MODS ARE ASLEEP, POST STUFF FROM FOODPORNDAILY
That website is DELICIOUS
 
4:14 PM
@Lord_Gareth Perhaps because the rules for artifacts are even less stringent?
 
The rules as such barely even exist.
But there's such a thing as standards in design.
 
@BESW True, but excessive praise of people who aren't involved is probably not useful either.
 
Your artifact needs to be able to, at least theoretically, see Real Actual Play
 
Rob
@BESW Irresponsible? Chug a half bottle of vodka?
 
@SimonGill The Fairy Nuff quickly hides her [Sylvester McCoy is Best Wizard] poster behind her back.
 
Rob
4:16 PM
Mmmm vodka
 
>.< @KRyan He posted again and it only got worse.
 
@BESW Radaghast was an ... interesting ... addition to the Hobbit. Definitely showed a little more of the affairs of wizards.
 
@Lord_Gareth Ah, but in a system that has created rules for everything (or tries to), an object without explicit rules relating to it therefore has no rules at all.
Extrapolation and generic design standards become less obviously relevant when they're constantly overshadowed by micromanaging subsystems.
 
Rob
I liked Radaghast in a mushroom-tastic way :)
 
Well, the thing is @BESW that WotC never published design rules or guidelines for almost anything, and custom items of /all/ stripes are included in that "almost anything"
 
Rob
4:18 PM
Too many stable personalities at high up, he was refreshing
 
So if we want to argue that base classes, PrCs, items, and spells need to be held up to balance standards when we're designing
Then artifacts need to as well
 
@Rob And Saruman's distaste for him was pretty clear too. Nice to see the "good" guys had some small disagreements too.
 
Rob
@SimonGill Yep! It was good to see that tension and how he dismissed him
@SimonGill Exactly
Now ~how~ long until the next one?
 
Radagast was pretty good, though the chase scene was narratively irresponsible.
 
@BESW Most of the chase scenes were weird. It's like they were running through Far Realm beachheads where time and geography were discontinuous.
 
Rob
4:21 PM
He didn't so much seem to run away as to go around in circles
 
@Rob 11 months... it'll just disappear.
 
Our main characters, whom we'd just spent the entire film getting to know and were finally getting to see them in action, fled like scared rabbits while the actual rabbits and a guy we hardly knew got to do the cool stuff.
 
Rob
I was a little "Hrrrrm" by the bridge collapsing down the ravine, somewhat implausibly dramatic
 
It's like the GM suddenly introduced his old PC as an NPC who took over the scene.
 
Rob
@besw Har, apt description
 
4:22 PM
I was personally mollified by it being McCoy.
So... he was a GMPC I liked too.
 
Hrm, I suppose I should ask this at some point - does homebrew get a lot of hearing in this community?
 
Rob
@Lord_Gareth I believe it has it's own tag
 
If I wanted to submit homebrew for general review....?
 
4:23 PM
@Rob I win!
 
Rob
Darn you @BESW ! :)
 
(And if anyone can tell me what that last guy was trying to say in my own homebrew question, I'd appreciate it. Confuses the hay out of me.)
 
Rob
@Lord_Gareth Have a whirl through the other questions; conceptual points and ideas should be ok I'd think, but whole systems... bit much :)
@BESW Which one?
 
'Cause I do have some stuff that I would like additional review on, as well as a few sticky points where my wording falls apart and I can't fix it.
@Rob - Geez, I'm packing full base classes that need tweaking man
 
2
A: How to rule a permanently blind PC in D&D 4e?

Joe BedurndurnSay 'Tada! You're blind!' during character creation, remind the player that he should probably fail any absolutely sight dependent tasks when they come up and play the game as normal. If Steve wants to play his Fighter as Zatoichi then go with it. The game supports people that turn into bears, sw...

 
4:25 PM
@Lord_Gareth We can't really do reviews of that. You'd be looking for a collaborative writing site for that.
 
@Lord_Gareth That sounds like it'd be worth a trip to The Meta Side if you really want to see if it'd be okay, but otherwise your question here is "where can I get this kind of assistance?"
 
Though admittedly in the case of Malefactor I'm only looking to fix one power.
I should really put some work in on the Benefactor end of things sometime.
 
(My question there had a lot of misunderstanding running around about what I was asking for, just generally. I learned a lot about how to ask questions.)
 
@Lord_Gareth asking about that particular power, with a link to the whole class, is probably more likely to be OK?
 
@BESW heh, his replying comment still strikes me as dismissive.
 
4:28 PM
but I haven't seen a lot of homebrew here
 
Oh, hey, @KRyan can help me with a concept on part of that, actually! Well, so can everyone else. Anyone mind if I bounce it off of ya?
 
and homebrew doesn't seem to get a lot of attention
 
@SimonGill yeeeeeah.
 
Rob
@Lord_Gareth You can always just link and ask here :)
 
for example, this answer hasn't really gotten a lot of attention despite it being (IMO) my best answer on the site
 
4:28 PM
@SimonGill First time anyone was rude to me here, actually.
 
10
A: Guidelines for creating homebrew classes (base/PrCs)

KRyanThere’s a lot of material out there about class design, both specific to Dungeons & Dragons 3.5 and to games in general. Even stuff about non-role-playing game design can provide good insights. So reading is my #2 suggestion. My #1 suggestion, though, is to put your work out there. There are...

 
@Rob - I can, but at this /very/ moment I wanted to sling a concept past you folks.
 
@BESW I... suppose my response to this would go under earlier rules discussions
 
Rob
@BESW Ahh, 4e, alas, can't help much there :(
 
Alright, so the basic concept behind the Benefactor is a combination of rogue + party buffs, and their key feature is the [NAME UNDECIDED] - a group of supernatural buffs that can be used as Swift actions 1/4 class level (minimum 1) + charisma modifier times per encounter.
 
4:31 PM
@KRyan I'm mostly just curious about what he was trying to say. He obviously had something in mind that I'm just not understanding.
 
I kept trying to figure out a method of bonus damage for these guys, and I think I finally have one and that's what I wanted to ask about: the Benefactor adds +1d6 damage to each attack for every [NAME UNDECIDED] she has active.
 
Rob
@Lord_Gareth 3.5 base system?
 
@Rob - Yes.
 
Because I look at it and see "D&D has rules that let people do weird stuff, so just tell him he can do another weird thing without any rules," and then something about... darkvision...?
 
@BESW As far as his answer goes - it's basically the same as Soulrifts. There are no mechanical changes (he's assumed to have worked around the disadvantages already) and the PC fails at anything he absolutely must have sight to do.
 
4:32 PM
@Lord_Gareth suggest 1 + ¼ class level + Cha, elsewise you're looking at not getting your second base one until level 8
 
Ah, good idea
Danke
 
@Lord_Gareth sounds... pretty good for level 1, where you can get 1d6 the first round (likely more reliable than Sneak Attack), 2d6 the second (more than any other character has), etc.
what are the limits on the bonus damage?
sort of depends where you're aiming this
 
@BESW Yeah... just ignore that answer. It's awful. I think the Darkvision is supposed to be a feat tax that explains how he can break the rules about needing light. So he's picking and choosing what rules are relevant.
 
it currently strikes me as likely strictly-superior to Rogue and possibly Bard too
 
Hrm. Well, the Malefactor gets a d4/2 class levels on folks they've cursed. What if I limited it to a maximum of Sneak Attack damage?
 
4:34 PM
@SimonGill I guess so. I was very confused because I thought I'd been pretty clear about wanting mechanical disadvantages to be overcome mechanically through the character build, but I got multiple answers that didn't seem to see that at all.
 
I could also keep it at D4 to mimic Malefactor
 
@Lord_Gareth sort of weird that Benefactor does more damage than Malefactor, yes
 
@SimonGill And I'm still tickled by your tremorsense 0 loophole, btw.
 
AFK
 
@BESW Hehe, glad I could help on that one :)
 
4:38 PM
@SimonGill The player likes your solution, but we haven't run the character yet as he wants to keep his current one for the full campaign.
I'm sure that if/when we run 4e again he'll haul out the blind PC concept pretty quick.
 
@BESW It's a shame that there's not really many Daredevil feats you can take to get around blindness (even the temporary kind).
 
@SimonGill There are, actually.
Take a look at Soulrift's edits at the bottom of his post. They are not comprehensive.
Blindfighting Sentinel, Deep Delver theme, familiars....
(And I wish I could upvote @soulrift more than once, because despite thinking my premise was silly and pointless he put in a lot of due diligence on his answer.)
 
@BESW yeah.... but just granting Blindsight wasn't what I really meant. There are more things you could do with magic powers that you can use if you're blind.
 
Well, a burst/blast specialist with Blindfighting Sentinel is practically sighted for mechanical purposes.
 
Fair enough.
 
4:46 PM
My player is also very fond of the (not quite actually achievable) idea of using a shaman's spirit companion as a seeing eye dog.
Thanks for you comment on his answer.
 
Rob
Hometime, adios all
 
@BESW Doubt it'll do anything :P
@Rob Crap, where did the day go?
 
@SimonGill No, but I was too incredulous to respond very well myself.
@SimonGill mmm. My driving coffee's finally wearing off, so I think bed is good for me too.
Ta, all.
 
See ya
I love Abrupt Jaunt
So much.
 
5:14 PM
@Lord_Gareth Are you going to explain why? :P
 
@SimonGill if you're familiar with the ability, it's not hard to understand
it's 3+Int/day, teleport 10 ft. as an immediate action
for a Wizard, that means 7-13 times a day, you get to say "Nope!" when someone tries to full-attack you
 
@KRyan Not by name. But now I recognise it.
 
5:27 PM
@SimonGill - You may like this quote.
" Originally Posted by JaronK View Post
Frankly, a Wizard can suck even more than a Fighter could ever dream of sucking. A Fighter can stab himself to death, but only a Wizard could Plane Shift to some horrible far realm to be tortured for an eternity of insanity."
 
@Lord_Gareth That is amusing.
With great power comes great botches.
 
It was actually in response to a post where someone went, "At least Fighter is the king of sucking."
Nope. Wizard is better at failing.
Which makes me laugh whenever I say it
 
6:14 PM
Uggg, the afflictions of lycanthropy.
 
Vi
@SimonGill At least that means you are the one doing the biting. XD
 
6:46 PM
Nasty horrible disease. Not least because it skews your party balance.
@Vi Yeah. BUt that's still nasty when it's a wererat that infected you :P
 
Vi
@SimonGill Could be worse - wereslug. ;)
 
@Vi I'm pretty sure that's not a thing. At least, I hope that's not a thing.
 
Vi
@SimonGill So do I. X3
 
@Vi the Lycanthropy template requires that the animal in question be a carnivore that is within 1 size category of the base creature; that'd have to be a pretty big slug.
 
@KRyan So no Mokole (dinosaurs) or Rokea (sharks) in D&D then... that's a shame.
 
6:51 PM
@SimonGill spoke too soon, does not have the mammal requirement I thought it did
 
@KRyan That's alright then. Weresharks a-go-go!
 
the most absurd one is the Were-Murder-of-Crows
Murder of Crows is a Large-size Animal (Swarm) in Tome of Magic
as a Large-size Animal, it is a legal target for the Lycanthropy template (as long as the base creature is Medium, Large, or Huge)
 
@KRyan Bad rules. Bad. Swarms are not good lycanthropy targets.
 
@SimonGill I think the concept is really cool, plus the Swarm subtype goes a long way to helping the template be worth it
but yes, it is absurd
 
Vi
@KRyan Some slugs are carnivorus
And some slugs are massive
XD
We could be onto a winner here
 
6:56 PM
@KRyan Well, I suppose so - but it is still an absurd idea on the face of it :P
@Vi If you get stuck down that rabbit hole and a were-slug eats your face, don't come crying to us about it :P
6
 
@Vi Tiny is around a foot, foot and a half? something like that
so for a Small base creature, it could work
Small's like two and a half to three and a half, though
that's a really freaking big slug
the other trick is finding a slug in the rules
and it being an Animal and not the more likely Vermin
 
Vi
7:25 PM
@KRyan If there isn't a giant flesh-eating slug in the D&D books somewhere I will be VERY surprised. XD It probably spits acid too.
 
@Vi That sounds more like a Purple Worm.
 
Yeah but it has to have the [Animal] type
Which is the stopping point
 
Vi
@Lord_Gareth Ah, it'll be in there somewhere, lol.
 
@Vi - Nope
And the dude was clearly not speaking about how those monsters hash out in-game, since demiliches are scary as all hell.
 
@Lord_Gareth The better ones are the articles by Jared Hines from Head Injury Theatre. That guy went way back to find the crazy in D&Ds monster history.
 
Vi
7:32 PM
Yeah, I know
 
FLUMPHS!
 
Vi
@Lord_Gareth But you have to admit some are retarded. X3
 
Mind you, there are no realities in which Roving Mauler is not stupid
 
Vi
There's a better list somewhere by an actual D&D player.....
 
7:33 PM
@KRyan - Do you REMEMBER that guy and his "Twenty most broken things in 3.5" where he put Loyal Beyond Death and Soulknife on the list?
 
Vi
@SimonGill Yeah, that's it XD
 
@Lord_Gareth Still not as dumb as Killer Pillows :P
@Vi Curiously, he wasn't a D&D player when he wrote the first list - but he was dragged into playing after he owned the Stupid Monsters search term.
 
Vi
@SimonGill Wasn't he? Well, there is some crazy stuff in there in any case. XD
 
7:42 PM
"As mind-numbing as the Brain Golem is (it has brains for FEET for the love of God), it doesn't completely convey the horror here. You see, the Brain Golem is created by a race of creatures called Mind Flayers....lovecraftian horrors that EAT brains. So what you're seeing is possibly the only golem made of FOOD. It's like a bunch of PETA vegans creating a Celery Golem. It makes about as much sense."
 
@Lord_Gareth unfortunately
 
Yeah...it was sorta like that.
 
what was?
 
The list of "broken" things
 
I got in at least one argument here with a guy who said you should ban everything not-Core because you don't want someone to stumble upon the next Frenzied Berserker. When I commented on the problems of the Frenzied Berserker going after his teammates, the response was something like "who cares about that, he's immune to death! Complete Warrior is the most broken book ever."
 
7:50 PM
>.<
Please tell me you're kidding.
 
nop
last I checked he was the highest-rated answer on that particular question (about whether or not banning books wholesale was a good idea)
 
Ohgodwhywhywhywhy
T_T
You invited me here just because you knew from GitP that I'd spend the rest of my life trying to class up the op quality, didn't you? THIS IS WHAT YOU PLANNED!
 
to be fair, you weren't the first I invited here with the hope of injecting a bit more system mastery
you're just the only one who didn't go 'lulno'
 
Shoulda listened to Admiral Ackbar
 
also, to be fair to the answers in that question, most of them were not addressing 3.5 in particular because the question was originally tagged system-agnostic, and then the asker swapped out the tags after every one answered -.-
though the highest-rated guy did bring up 3.5 on his own so not a lot of slack for him
 
7:58 PM
@Besw - One for you
0
Q: DnD 4e Diseases

IntrepidBritCurrently DMing a campaign - I set up an easy encounter with a twist: a creature that could infect the players with the Abyssal plague. I was planning for the 4th level characters to struggle to deal with the level 8 disease, and use the infection as a story hook for the next part of the campaign...

 
8:52 PM
intruiging.
@KRyan Nothing is truely broken, Banning things however breaks the core mechanic of the game itself. Imagination. Ingenuity. to put it simply Banning things in large quatities is a bad idea. If you plan for said immune to death creature it is not broken.
besides there are far worse things than death in the dark depths of Dungeons and Dragons.
 

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