English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Robusto

12:06 AM

@Arrowfar As are we all.

Anonymous

12:41 AM

2

Q: What is having a non dominant foot called?

If not having a certain dominant hand (or "both-handed") is called being ambidextrous, what is it called if you are "both-footed"?

single-word-requests

Anonymous

The question title doesn't seem to fit the question body

Anonymous

Just about everyone has a non-dominant foot

Anonymous

I guess they wanted to negate the verb phrase having a dominant foot, not the adjective dominant

Dog Lover

1:02 AM

Hey guys. I'm in a bit of a moral dillemma.

dilemma*

I have a question that I asked with a really long answer and heaps of upvotes, yet I found a much shorter (and much less upvoted) answer a bit more helpful. Which one should I accept?

Anonymous

You can accept whichever answer you like.

Anonymous

If you find the shorter one more helpful, it's okay for you to select that one.

Anonymous

You don't have to accept the most upvoted answer.

Dog Lover

I want to accept the shorter one, but it makes me feel uneasy; i.e. the answerer will likely be annoyed

(answerer of the long one)

Anonymous

If you'd like to reward both answerers, you can always use a bounty

Dog Lover

1:06 AM

How does that work? I'm kind of hoping to get up to 2,000 reputation, so as much as I'd love to reward both, it's not really the best way at the moment.

AFK for 10-15 mins

Anonymous

I think ideally personal considerations like "the answerer will likely be annoyed" shouldn't enter into your selection of an answer as most helpful to you

Anonymous

But you can use whatever criteria you want.

Anonymous

Hey, I see you asked about a whole nother! Nice coincidence.

Anonymous

If it were me, I'd accept Sven Yargs' answer.

Robusto

I agree.

Anonymous

1:21 AM

@DogLover books.google.com/books?id=lV2DVLaPMBkC&pg=PA102#v=onepage

Anonymous

That gives examples in both directions, like an ewt > a newt

Anonymous

I'm surprised none of the answers used the term reanalysis! Metanalysis is okay, too

Cerberus

1:39 AM

@Robusto There is no real difference in Greek, both are basileis. But the primary translation is "king".

archimedes.fas.harvard.edu/cgi-bin/…

SmokeDetector

4:22 AM

[ SmokeDetector ] Offensive body detected, offensive title detected: is saying the word fuck polite by Hamish Meachem on english.stackexchange.com

SmokeDetector

6:40 AM

[ SmokeDetector ] Offensive body detected: is saying the “f word” polite by Hamish Meachem on english.stackexchange.com

Matt E. Эллен

OMG someone actually put effort into a SWR answer:

2

A: A correct word for 'learnful'

Your original sentence "It was a very learnful experience" would normally be phrased "The experience was very educational" or "It was a very instructive/informative experience" Educate, inform, instruct, teach, have similar meanings and can be substituted for leerzaam when translating to Englis...

Anonymous

Wow, learnful! I love it.

Matt E. Эллен

It doesn't redeem the tag, but it's a step in the right direction :D

RegDwigнt

9:47 AM

@Robusto Law Enforcement Officer stands for "Lol, A What? Enforcement Officer"

Robusto

10:27 AM

@RegDwigнt woo-woo

0

Q: "Thanks, my lovelies!"

I was looking for a phrase to thank multiple people. It's supposed to be an endearment for friends but not super close friends. Is this an appropriate reply to compliments or birthday wishes, e.g. on facebook? Thanks in advance for your help!

meaning word-usage idioms

Is this what we've been reduced to? Serving up hack greetings and salutations for Facebook pukes?

@tchrist: I wonder if Fr. douane and Sp. dueño are related.

Robusto

10:56 AM

@Cerberus: One more reason not to own an iPhone.

Mitch

11:27 AM

This is what we use at the auto repair shop where I work. — Mitch 1 min ago

tchrist

@Robusto o domine

Robusto

Oh lord . . .

tchrist

That’s where Don Quijote comes from, and Corleone, and dueño.

Robusto

OK. But does douane as a levy come from the same liege-lord sort of origin?

tchrist

And Dom Perignon.

Robusto

11:33 AM

It seems to mean someone you pay.

tchrist

Dunno, hafta look it up.

Oh, you mean the aduana.

French douane is Spanish aduana.

And Spanish aduana is derived from Arabic.

lema.rae.es/drae/?val=aduana

chandru

hey

Robusto

So douane and dueño are not related.

0

Q: Does a "fact" have to be true?

I'm struggling to decide whether to jettison use of the word fact, because the definition appears to be not solid enough to support continued usage. What do I mean by that? Look at one "meaning ladder" (taken from Random House via TFD Online) among several on the same page: fact 1. somethin...

meaning ambiguity

tchrist

Don’t think so. I’d have to chase the French, but it seems cognate since it has the same sense.

Robusto

Also, are there any guidelines on when to use acabar and when to use terminar?

SmokeDetector

11:42 AM

[ SmokeDetector ] Repeating characters in answer: A Word To Represent Physical & Mental Attributes by quinnfdfsdaf on english.stackexchange.com

tchrist

11:59 AM

@Robusto Why does this remind me of so many ELU questions? :)

I can’t think of any differences.

Robusto

@tchrist Yeah, I know. But I do not profess to be a master of Spanish. And don't we all wish that these ELU pineapples had an English-speaking master who could help out without having to burden the world at large?

tchrist

Terminar might be a bit more willful.

Terminé con mi trabajo para el día whereas Se me ha apagado el dinero.

I finished up with work versus my money ran out on me.

Robusto

Mm.

tchrist

It’s not much, and not universally observed.

Americans use apagar in places where Spaniards are more apt to reach for terminar, and perhaps vice versa.

But it is hard to get much difference out of them.

O sea, americanos, digo.

"Rather, I meant americanos."

Robusto

I didn't know apagar. Now I'm confused.

tchrist

12:07 PM

English-speakers might reach for terminar because it’s cognate, but acabar seems fine.

Did I say apagar? Hah.

That’s for lights.

No coffee yet.

I meant the other.

Robusto

Whew.

Ah, I see some Samaritan has down-voted my "fact" question.

tchrist

Apagar is like to run out.

Or turn off.

> apagar.
(De lat. pacāre, calmar, mitigar).
1. tr. Extinguir el fuego o la luz. U. t. c. prnl.
2. tr. Extinguir, disipar, aplacar algo. Apagar el entusiasmo, los rencores, los afectos. U. t. c. prnl. Su vida se apaga
3. tr. Interrumpir el funcionamiento de un aparato desconectándolo de su fuente de energía. Apagar la lámpara, la radio, el gas, un motor. U. t. c. prnl.
4. tr. Arq. Echar agua a la cal viva para que pueda emplearse en obras de fábrica.
5. tr. Mar. Cerrar los bolsos o senos que el viento forma en las velas cargadas.

If you look up acabar and terminar, the former has more senses.

But each is defined in terms of the other.

lema.rae.es/drae/?val=terminar

lema.rae.es/drae/?val=acabar

And apparently three million people on the internet have asked the same question as you have.

> The difference is that acabar is “to run out” or “to be over”, and terminar is “to finish” more physically.

Thing of the musical notation da capo from the head.

Spanish has an idiom al fin y al cabo.

It’s like the cliché at the end of the day or when all is said and done. It reinforces.

Robusto

Interesting idiom. To the end and to the top.

I can't read that without thinking of da capo al fine or the like.

tchrist

yeah

You could make a joke al fin y al rabo (a rabo is the tail of an animal) but you’d have to be pretty good to pull off word-play in spanish.

It’s like those things our Frenchman was talking about.

Matt E. Эллен

el capó y guapo

tchrist

12:18 PM

¿De cuál capón ya hablas, cabrón guapo?

Thanks. I have With a Sword and a Rose and a Cape playing in my head now.

Matt E. Эллен

You're welcome!

tchrist

earworm is “here, erm!”

Oh no annoying bots. Just as well.

Robusto

@tchrist Isn't cado tail as well?

tchrist

cola

Which is also queue.

There’s the rare cauda for the tail of a cape.

Damn earworm.

Caudal fins.

Cado doesn’t mean anything that I know.

If you’re thinking of the Mass, ne cadant in obscurum, that verb is cadere in Latin or caer in Spanish.

Oh, apparently cado means something in Argentinian. Zho ke se.

lema.rae.es/drae/?val=cado

Robusto

@tchrist Right, cola.

Wonder where I got cado from.

tchrist

12:28 PM

> 1. f. Cueva en que habitan ciertos animales, especialmente los conejos.
2. f. Lugar retirado y escondido donde se oculta la gente de mal vivir.

Argentine cado appears to be madriguera, which may not be what you think it is.

Robusto

I didn't sleep more than a couple hours last night, now I'm running on vapors.

tchrist

Where rabbits and criminals scoot off to when they want to hide.

Bolt hole?

Dunno.

Too long since Peter Rabbit.

Burrow? Den? That isn’t quite right.

But thieves’ den, so maybe.

Rabo has animal meaning; cola doesn’t have to.

It’s like how you wouldn’t use snout with a human.

Robusto

@tchrist But people don't have tails, so . . .

Matt E. Эллен

martes guerra?

Robusto

But if I had one, I suppose I should call it a cola and not a rabo.

@MattE.Эллен Tuesday war?

Matt E. Эллен

12:32 PM

@Robusto just messing around with madriguera

tchrist

Snout is hocico, so the command ¡Cállate el hocico¡ is a rude "shut your snout".

People aren’t supposed to have those.

Mitch

@Robusto Do you have an example of non-truth usage of 'fact'?

tchrist

There are lots of paired human/nonhuman terms in many languages.

Mitch

@tchrist Rabbits have safe-houses?

tchrist

Human mothers don’t whelp; they give birth.

Nor do they spawn.

Mitch

12:34 PM

@tchrist only dogs do that, right?

Robusto

@Mitch Uh, any utterance by a politician using the word "fact" probably contains none.

Mitch

cows... do something else.

tchrist

They calve.

Mitch

@Robusto but that's just -wrong- usage. they've used it wrongly.

tchrist

Wr0nglier than th0u.

Mitch

12:35 PM

@tchrist right, like whales and giraffes. what do bears do?

tchrist

Steal garbage.

Mitch

@tchrist ha ha. no that's raccoons.

Matt E. Эллен

wear the pope's clothes

Mitch

funny story about raccoons. you know how they're notorious for getting into garbage?

tchrist

Minibears.

Mitch

12:36 PM

@MattE.Эллен Does the pope shit in the woods?

tchrist

And Matt knows no coons.

Let alone ratcoons.

Mitch

they knock over garbage cans and spread all of it all over

Matt E. Эллен

@Mitch sounds like seagulls

Robusto

@Mitch Well, then why do people feel the need to distinguish between "facts" and "true facts"?

Mitch

leaving a total mess

Matt E. Эллен

12:37 PM

herring gulls, to be precise

Mitch

@MattE.Эллен they're annoying too but this story is about raccoons

tchrist

@MattE.Эллен Kippers for brekky, eh?

Robusto

@Mitch No kidding. I was hiking the other day and I stepped into a big pile of pope shit. It was disgusting.

Mitch

so the raccoons in our area are pretty brazen, they don't have an opinion whatever of people, in fact I think people kind of annoy them what with their yelling and brooms and such.

Matt E. Эллен

@Mitch I've never met a raccoon I didn't like

Robusto

12:39 PM

@Mitch *racoons

Mitch

(usually animals freak out and runaway or pass out like a possum)

tchrist

Not Mama Bear.

She’ll have you over for lunch.

Mitch

but the ones around us are very.. how shall I say it... well-behaved.

Robusto

Well, I see people are determined to dump on my facts question. I think it's worth discussing, though.

Mitch

sure they still jump into the garbage bins.

Robusto

12:40 PM

Only 51,000 more down votes on that question and I'll be out of rep.

Mitch

but the ones around here seem to be able to keep all the mess -in- the garbage can... and then leave the cover back neatly in place.

you go to take out the garbage, and just as you put it in, you notice that a previous garbage bag has been ripped apart and all the 'good' stuff removed... but all within the garbage can, no mess around it, and the lid put back on neatly.

Robusto

We don't have racoons and we're further out than you.

Mitch

@Robusto gets on that imediately

@Robusto how can you not have raccoons? (I use two c's because two get red-underlined)

the antarctic research station has raccoons.

tchrist

Qu‘est-ce que c’est qu’une raçon, SVP?

Mitch

@tchrist well, the raccoons aren't exactly aggressive; they stare you down like you're thinking of butting in line.

Matt E. Эллен

12:47 PM

red pandas are a type of raccoon, I think. they're very cute. maybe endangered

Mitch

RSVP: Nous regrettons que nous n'avons pas de racons apporter.

Robusto

@Mitch No anthropomorphizing racoons in chat.

tchrist

I don’t think racoons can be Pullman Porters.

As to the other, I prefer not to say.

Mitch

@Robusto I'm not anthropomorphizing. They're really doing it. Or maybe they're raccoonizing. They're clever bastards either way.

tchrist

@MattE.Эллен yes

As it were.

> The red panda is the only living species of the genus Ailurus and the family Ailuridae. It has been previously placed in the raccoon and bear families, but results of phylogenetic research indicate strong support for its taxonomic classification in its own family Ailuridae, which along with the weasel, raccoon and skunk families is part of the superfamily Musteloidea.[5] Two subspecies are recognized.[3] It is not closely related to the giant panda.

Damn geneticists.

Changed their minds again.

They made a cat family?

Matt E. Эллен

12:51 PM

oh! cat, eh? oh well :D

tchrist

> Molecular phylogenetic studies show that, as an ancient species in the order Carnivora, the Red Panda is relatively close to the American Raccoon and may be either a monotypic family or a subfamily within the procynonid family.

> An in-depth mitochondrial DNA population analysis study stated: “According to the fossil record, the Red Panda diverged from its common ancestor with bears about 40 million years ago (Mayr 1986). With this divergence, by comparing the sequence difference between the red panda and the raccoon, the observed mutation rate for the red panda was calculated to be on the order of 10⁹, which is apparently an underestimate compared with the average rate in mammals.

The bear group is not the cat group. I am confused.

> Frédéric Georges Cuvier first described Ailurus as belonging to the raccoon family in 1825; this classification has been controversial ever since.[1] It was classified in the raccoon family (Procyonidae) because of morphological similarities of the head, colored ringed tail, and other morphological and ecological characteristics. Then, it was assigned to the bear family (Ursidae).

A ring-tail cat is a raccoon.

Ring-tailed cat

The ringtail (Bassariscus astutus) is a mammal of the raccoon family (thus not actually a cat), native to arid regions of North America. It is also known as the ringtail cat, ring-tailed cat, miner's cat or bassarisk, and is also sometimes mistakenly called a "civet cat" (after similar, though unrelated, cat-like omnivores of Asia and Africa). The ringtail is sometimes called a cacomistle, though this term seems to be more often used to refer to Bassariscus sumichrasti. == Description == The ringtail cat is buff to dark brown in color with white underparts and a flashy black and white striped tail...

As are all the coati mundi.

Coati

Coatis, genera Nasua and Nasuella, also known as coatimundi /koʊˌɑːtɨˈmʌndi/, Mexican tejón, cholugo, or moncún, Costa Rican pizote, hog-nosed coons, Colombian cusumbo, and other names, are members of the raccoon family (Procyonidae). They are diurnal mammals native to South America, Central America, and south-western North America. The term is reported to be derived from the Tupi language (Brazil). == Physical characteristics == Adult coatis measure 33 to 69 cm (13 to 27 in) from head to the base of the tail, which can be as long as their bodies. Coatis are about 30 cm (12 in) tall at the shoulder...

Robusto

@tchrist A bearcat is an airplane:

Grumman F8F Bearcat

The Grumman F8F Bearcat (nicknamed "Bear") was a single-engine American fighter aircraft introduced in late World War II. It went on to serve into the mid-20th century in the United States Navy, the United States Marine Corps, and the air forces of other nations. It would be Grumman Aircraft's final piston engined fighter aircraft. Modified versions have broken speed records for piston-engined aircraft, and are popular among warbird owners. == Design and development == === Concept === The Bearcat concept began during a meeting between Battle of Midway veteran F4F Wildcat pilots and Grum...

tchrist

Coons are in Canodea (doggy types) not in Feloidea (kitty types).

Mitch

But the point is, and I'm upset that you don't all appreciate it, is that the raccoons around here are very tidy. The Raccoons of NIMH-HE (National Institute of Mental Health- Home Economics)

Matt E. Эллен

NIMBY?

Mitch

12:56 PM

@MattE.Эллен National Institute of My Back Yard

tchrist

> The Canoidea superfamily (or Caniformia suborder) – Canidae (wolves, dogs and foxes), Mephitidae (skunks and stink badgers), Mustelidae (weasels, badgers, and otters), Procyonidae (raccoons), Ursidae (bears), Ailuridae (red panda)

> The Feloidea superfamily (or Feliformia suborder)– Felidae (cats), Prionodontidae (Asiatic linsangs), Herpestidae (mongooses), Hyaenidae (hyenas), Viverridae (civets), and Eupleridae (Malagasy carnivorans)

Mitch

Oh, for you... Mini-Tea, the Ministry of Tea-Time

Matt E. Эллен

:D

tchrist

> The Pinnipedia superfamily (walruses, seals, and sea lions), now considered to be part of Caniformia, are medium to large (to 6.5 m) aquatic mammals.

Matt E. Эллен

It's pronounced tay-ah-time

Mitch

12:58 PM

@tchrist Malagasy Carnivorans! cancels vacation

tchrist

They’ve added the pinnipeds to the caniforms. Funny, they don’t look very doggy to me.

Mitch

@tchrist the babies are called pups, that's enough for me. also they bark

tchrist

@MattE.Эллен Antikythera.

Mitch

@MattE.Эллен Like Tea Leoni and her sister Infusion.

tchrist

@Mitch *leonis

Matt E. Эллен

12:59 PM

:D

Robusto

leonine

tchrist

Lions are 3rd declension, not 2nd.

Robusto

dandelion tea

tchrist

wine

Dandelion Wine

Dandelion Wine is a 1957 novel by Ray Bradbury, taking place in the summer of 1928 in the fictional town of Green Town, Illinois, based upon Bradbury's childhood home of Waukegan, Illinois. The novel developed from the short story "Dandelion Wine" which appeared in the June 1953 issue of Gourmet magazine. The title refers to a wine made with dandelion petals and other ingredients, commonly citrus fruit. In the story, dandelion wine, as made by the protagonist's grandfather, serves as a metaphor for packing all of the joys of summer into a single bottle. The main character of the story is Douglas...

Anonymous

13

Q: What is the difference between Fact and Truth?

I'm curious about the difference between Fact and Truth. I was searching on the internet if I could find it. But still I'm confused about the exact meaning. I first read the forum discussion here Fact and Truth where an author has given two examples for each like below A fact is a reality tha...

logic philosophy-of-science truth difference

Anonymous

1:06 PM

It looked somewhat related

Robusto

@snailboat Yeah, Josh61 linked that in the comments.

@tchrist I grew up about ten miles from his childhood home.

Well, maybe 15.

Mitch

@tchrist Of many books assigned to us to read in school that I never read, that was one.

Or maybe it was Martian Chronicles. Either way, not read. I'm annoyed by Bradbury...it's sold as science fiction, but reading it, it is definitely not science fiction. Maybe sci-fi for people who don't like science, like how the movie 'Jerry Maguire' is ostensibly a sports movie but is really chick lit.

tchrist

1:22 PM

Lake Geneva is about 40 miles from Waukegan. We always got it confused with Waukesha. :)

Robusto

@Mitch That was unkind.

tchrist

amazon.com/In-The-Hall-Martian-Kings/dp/0708880363

It’s Grieg to me.

Robusto

amazon.com/Martian-Chronicles-Ray-Bradbury/dp/1451678193/…

tchrist

In the Hall of the Mountain King - English Lyrics - Purdue Glee Club

►

Robusto

I think it is without Peer.

tchrist

1:28 PM

The lyrics are cool.

Mitch

@Robusto Well, that's the way I read it. Some people don't like mushrooms or BBQ.

Robusto

@Mitch What?!

Mitch

I know! They're crazy!

Mitch

1:42 PM

@MattE.Эллен I get it. You've never met a raccoon, have you. They're really cute. But they probably have rabies. Sort of a mixed message.

Matt E. Эллен

@Mitch well got. kinda like mushrooms

tchrist

@MattE.Эллен There is no kinda like. You either love them or hate them.

Matt E. Эллен

1:58 PM

@tchrist you're thinking of marmite. I kinda like mushrooms.

but some mushrooms look cute but will kill you. kinda like raccoons

tchrist

@MattE.Эллен And what’s the morel to that story?

Robusto

@tchrist Thwack.

Matt E. Эллен

:D

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector ] All-caps title: PASS ME BY/ OR / PASS BY ME by Aleksathegrammarking on english.stackexchange.com

Robusto

2:14 PM

Back end guy: Did you do mvn clean install?
Me: Yes, and I plugged in the computer too.

tchrist

Oh for mvn!

Mitch

chat.stackexchange.com/search?q=ffs&room=95

Matt E. Эллен

2:30 PM

Apr 16 '11 at 14:35, by Cerberus

FFS = Facial feminization surgery ?

Aug 8 '14 at 12:46, by Jasper Loy

FFS=FumbleFingerS

less than three years to get an answer. we're doing well

Robusto

Of course it turns out that the back-end dev had failed to inform folks about changes to a certain properties file. Of course.

Johan Larsson

3:36 PM

what is a property of file?

Robusto

@JohanLarsson I mean a .properties file.

Johan Larsson

what is it?

Robusto

The server has properties files it needs to run. Surely you know that, don't you? Or do you really do no web work at all?

Johan Larsson

No web at all

Robusto

OK. So the various properties files are files the server needs to tell it where to go for certain things, what to do in certain cases, etc. I would think there must be something similar with respect to desktop apps.

In any case, I have to commute before I get trapped in the company meeting.

laterz

DCShannon

6:50 PM

@YoavKallus Hey Yoav, you're right we're probably getting a little carried away with the comments discussion. I'm still interested in your argument, and wouldn't mind continuing in chat. What I'm saying is that the meaning of the emphasis is not in the sentence, it's in the context. Without context, a comma or two isn't going to change the meaning of that sentence, because I don't know what the emphasis implies, and therefore get little to nothing out of it.

crl

7:02 PM

I should try to evaluate the ratio of the use of comma vs the use of dots (to refrain my overuse of commas)

I should do it on a very large text that represents well Englis lanhuage

Robusto

@crl You may be interested to know that Flaubert was very fussy about his commas. Almost as if they were his children.

crl

hehe

List of text corpora

Following is a list of text corpora in various languages. "Text corpora" is the plural of "text corpus". A text corpus is a large and structured set of texts (nowadays usually electronically stored and processed). Text corpora are used to do statistical analysis and hypothesis testing, checking occurrences or validating linguistic rules within a specific language territory. == English language == Google N-Grams Corpus – Largest English corpus at 155 billion words. Also has corpora for other languages. To download datasets of this corpus, see American National Corpus Bank of English Briti...

crl

7:28 PM

there seem to be almost as much commas than dots: anc.org/data/oanc/ngram 630812 dots vs 660062 commas, but I'll check locally (downloading the OANC)

Anonymous

@crl Wow, that's a woefully incomplete list

crl

6

A: Large amounts of English text needed

Project Gutenberg is a poor choice if you are looking for contemporary language, as most of the PG texts are from the early 20th century and earlier. For large samples of more recent text, you want one of the many available text corpora, such as the following: American National Corpus British N...

Robusto

9:59 PM

Wow, my fact question already has 1370 views. When I got back from my ride I noticed a badge for Popular Question so I investigated. That's the fastest I've ever gotten 1k views.

crl

10:11 PM

Cerberus

11:53 PM

@Robusto Hah, I was just demonstrated this hack today.

By the kids at work.

As if we needed yet another reason!

But it's funny.

Transcript for

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…