TeX, LaTeX and Friends - 2014-09-01 (page 2 of 2)

10:00 PM

Read the Amperage on the fusebox and buy a smaller one. Connect it series to the door switch.

@percusse well, that sounds strange (not that it wouldn't be possible). 1st the space in the door is extremly small, and 2nd it only protects the kitchen then

I really just thought whether some sort of a relay couldn't be used here

percusse

@tohecz What would a relay do?

They are not that fast to protect.

and can be overriden. That's why you install fuses

tohecz

@percusse there is a circuit breaker for the hall lighting

percusse

@tohecz Ok, we are talking past each other. One step at a time

You have a bad circuit that belongs to your common lighting is that true?

when it goes off the main fuse trips

tohecz

@percusse no, no circuit is bad if "bad" means "damaged"

percusse

10:04 PM

then you tell me

what is it about the being in the dark?

tohecz

I have 2 circuits for lights. Currently, one is unused, and the other one gets all the lights

therefore if any bulb breaks, I'm in the darkness

(or if I need to repair a switch, I do it with a headlight)

percusse

@tohecz Are you sure? That's very dangerous if somehow both of them opens at the same time.

I don't think anybody would install such a thing.

tohecz

@percusse what thing?

percusse

two sources for the same wiring.

tohecz

@percusse another misunderstanding

damn language bariers

it's not two circuits per se. It's two circuit breakers (let's call them fuses if you wish ;) )

percusse

10:07 PM

OK

tohecz

all the lights share the same CB, so if this CB goes off, I'm in the darkness. And whenever I need to put it off, I'm in the darkness.

Christian Hupfer

I am off, have a nice time

tohecz

Therefore I want to change the way how the hall lights are wired. Originally, the twin wire was used to put the two switches in series, but since the 3rd wire is missing, it led to LIGHT = SW1 AND SW2, whereas I would prefer LIGHT = SW1 XNOR SW2, But this takes 3 wires going to the door switch.

percusse

@tohecz Which switch has the live wire?

tohecz

@percusse the correct one? the one in the electricity box

percusse

10:11 PM

@tohecz There is no correct one. It's a 3-way switch

It can be in reverse breaking the ground (neutral actually).

tohecz

@percusse Well, both then, if you mean it this way

It's really exactly as in the picture

percusse

let me search. just a sec

Look at the first picture...

Multiway switching

In building wiring, multiway switching is the interconnection of two or more electrical switches to control an electrical load (often, but not always, lighting) from more than one location. For example, this allows lighting in a hallway, stairwell, or large room to be controlled from multiple locations. While a "normal" light switch needs to be only a Single Pole, Single Throw (SPST) switch, multiway switching requires the use of switches that have one or more additional contacts and two or more wires must be run between the switches. When the load is controlled from only two points, Single Pole...

or even the visible one here.

left one is the kitchen or the right?

So you want the hot wire to come from another line is that the problem?

tohecz

@percusse currently, the left one

@percusse yep, currently, I take the hot wire from the kitchen (by a 10cm short wire from teh kitchen switch), which is wrong.

percusse

And with a relay you want to get another line from the CB box?

tohecz

@percusse no, with a relay I want to realize the XNOR. I just don't know if such type of relay exists

percusse

10:19 PM

@tohecz OK let's keep how to realize this aside for a moment. Imagine your bulb went off. It will still leave you in the dark since there is no breaking here. So that's the part I don't get.

tohecz

@percusse no, it will put off the CB for hall light, but the CB for kitchen+livingroom+bedrooms will be still on

percusse

@tohecz It will trip whichever line is connected

tohecz

yep. But if I connect hall and kitchen to different CBs, I'm fine

percusse

Overload doesn't let relay switch. Let me ask differently; what would trigger the relay? Or better what do you call a relay? :) I think we are not thinking the same thing with a relay

tohecz

I would for instance take an SPDT relay:

Paulo Cereda

10:24 PM

lightbulbs circuits ducks potatoes bears math

tohecz

it would be controlled by the kitchen door switch, and I would use it as the first 3way switch.

percusse

@tohecz So you connect the hot wires to which terminals?

And more importantly if you can do it then skip the relay and change the source directly.

tohecz

@percusse I make two circuits: HOT -- SW1 -- RELAY COIL -- GND and HOT -- RELAY C + RELAY A/B -- SW2 -- BULBS -- GND

percusse

@tohecz That's what I'm trying to say. It won't be fast enough to avoid the CB trip.

coils are slow.

tohecz

@percusse and when should the CB trip?

percusse

10:29 PM

You need to turn off both CBs to let that stay closed.

unless you want fun while changing the bulb

Those hots are coming from the same line no?

So your second circuit goes off. And you have to be fast enough to close the first one to avoid circuit breaker going off.

I don't see how that's gonna fly

tohecz

@percusse well, the 1st circuit is not connected to the bulb at all

percusse

@tohecz But they are connected to the same live wire

So it would be useful after circuit breaker goes off.

tohecz

@percusse yep. So when a bulb breaks, the CB trips and both circuts are off.

percusse

@tohecz You are in the dark then anyway, isn't it the main problem

tohecz

@percusse but only the hall is in dark

other rooms are safe, because they have a separate CB

percusse

10:36 PM

@tohecz OK apparently it's too late for me to get the nuance. If they are all tripping together, I don't see how a relay would separate the hall from the rooms. But anyway :)

Oh wait, ah I see but then why do you install it on the switch..?

Put it next to the lamp and bypass the lamp

Paulo Cereda

@percusse As long as there is internet, I wouldn't panic. :)

percusse

switches are functional no?

No still don't see it

because the moment you turn on the CB bad circuit comes back online and it will keep tripping or you burn the relay

@PauloCereda I had an industrial electricity panel exploded to my face while we were inside a hole with three heads.

Mine, another engineer and an asshole :)

The technician's first sentence after the bang was; shit that was the live one

tohecz

percusse

@tohecz So you have two different lines in mind. That's what I was asking

tohecz

@percusse really?! oh my!

percusse

10:44 PM

So it's HOT1 and HOT2 in your circuit

tohecz

@percusse well, this would work. I can even get a relay with 220VAC on coil and 250VAC allowed on switch, and with 8kOhm coil resistance, which is 0.03W

@percusse well, yes, but they both come from the same CB

percusse

@tohecz Your last sentence kills the agreement again. Better ask an electrician. You are simply bypassing the lamps and there is something with your hall and the rest that I can't see.

and please be careful :)

Paulo Cereda

@percusse Oh my!

percusse

don't try this at home.... Bwahahahaha

tohecz

@percusse I am, don't be afraid

percusse

10:49 PM

@tohecz I'm because I never trust relays.

Paulo Cereda

@percusse Trust me I am an engineer. :P

tohecz

I have a friend would used to have one switch covered only by a public transport ticket because the switch cover had broken one day

percusse

Unless they are three-phase contactors.

tohecz

@percusse well, in this case, the only thing the relay could cause is switching the lights on

percusse

@tohecz That's we all do because we are stupid men, altering circuit might require fire department

tohecz

10:51 PM

@percusse yep, I know

anyways, gotta go now, I have to present myself at 9am at school tomorrow

percusse

►

Some support from your countryman :P

Paulo Cereda

@percusse LOL

percusse

@PauloCereda I love free minds and piezos

tohecz

@percusse this isn't for real, is it?

percusse

@tohecz I don't think so. He is plugging AC stuff to a charge :)

The light bulbs might work though.

Paulo Cereda

10:59 PM

@percusse: this guy does some cool covers, like this one: youtube.com/watch?v=MLrC7e3vSv8

tohecz

@percusse where's he actually getting the power from?

percusse

@tohecz The bulbs can work due to the charge from the piezo. But the black cable is probably empty and the fan works from something else.

A potato also lights up LEDs ;)

@PauloCereda

►

tohecz

@percusse the piezo gives that much energy?

percusse

@tohecz Not energy but a lot of charge yes. Think of the empty space, it still arcs.

Paulo Cereda

@percusse ooh!

@percusse Das potato!

tohecz

11:02 PM

@percusse well, the bulb seems to be on for quite a while

percusse

@tohecz Mechanical displacement to electrical charge. Actually you are squeezing a magnet :)

@tohecz Didn't you make prank jokes with it? It hurts like 220V.

@percusse:

@PauloCereda

I love this one and part 2

tohecz

@percusse I did. Actually, I used to do a lot of naughty stuff, including melting cuprum wires by a 6kV AC. We once tripped a 100A CB ;)

Paulo Cereda

@percusse OMG

Bassoon FTW

percusse

11:05 PM

@tohecz Some idiots thought exploding capacitors makes good guns. I have a scar at the edge of my ear ;)

I was lucky

tohecz

@percusse yeah, I see

we used to make explosives from metal dust and calium permanganicum

percusse

@tohecz That's why I want to have a daughter if I ever have kids

tohecz

@percusse LAWLZ

percusse

I can't handle the same nonsense all over again

tohecz

@percusse girls tend to overdose with aspirin

Paulo Cereda

11:07 PM

@percusse: youtube.com/watch?v=QMKTdrQqpNk

percusse

@PauloCereda Sometimes I'm really worries about you.

I think you are on a different drug which is apparently very cheap.

Because you get a lot of it

Paulo Cereda

@percusse LOL

@percusse: I think I should go to war. :)

percusse

@PauloCereda I found it haha. One of the early models of this exploded youtube.com/watch?v=vqwkpcBd2H8

Paulo Cereda

@percusse Wow!

I wish we had exploding compilers. It would make Darwin very proud: natural selection at its finest. :)

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