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6:00 PM
@Frank We don't have to be experts in firewall to provide useful solutions for most cases.
If we can't get an answer, we can redirect to one of the more hardware-focused stack exchanges after ruling out the obvious things
 
@Frank Keyword is we not any single user has to be able to answer every question on Arqade
3
 
Getting Netflix up and running on your PS4 is fuzzier ground.
 
Just because we can't answer every possible question on a topic doesn't mean that topic is off-topic
 
@Batophobia violent coughing
 
@StrixVaria No, it's not.
 
6:01 PM
Let's say, for example, noone had managed to lick a plane yet in Goat Simulator, "How do you lick a plane" would still be valid.
 
We are horrible at questions that don't relate to in-game stuff.
 
@Frank [Citation Needed]
 
@Frank That's because we've made it a fairly hostile place for those questions
 
@Ktash Our core expertise is playing games. Everything else is incidental, and a complete crap-shoot whether or not it's even something we can help with.
 
6:03 PM
@Unionhawk "___ minecraft mod is broke", Oh I've never played Minecraft, so that question is obviously off-topic
 
@Batophobia Yep
 
@Frank This is simply not true, and you have everyone else in this room but you disagreeing with you.
Our expertise is games.
No verb.
Or gaming...which is a gerund.
 
@StrixVaria And our record shows we suck at all the stuff outside of actually playing them.
 
@Frank So the mathematics behind critical hits is off-topic?
 
@Batophobia Does it happen in-game?
 
6:04 PM
@Frank Can you put together some kind of statistics showing this, or are you basing it off your gut?
 
@Frank It's not about playing games
 
@Frank No, you go out of the game, roll a die, then report back to the computer.
 
@Frank That's like saying that music is incidental to playing an instrument. It's true, but that's kind of missing the bigger picture
 
@StrixVaria Right now it's my gut, but I'm pretty sure I can put together something if you want.
 
@Frank I'm really interested to see an actual analysis done.
 
6:05 PM
@Ktash No, it's like saying we support TV repair, because we're gamers and we use them lots.
@Batophobia Critical hits happen while playing games, no?
 
@Frank Lore and Story happen while playing games, no?
 
@Frank Really? Lore??? I'll let you take back that analogy and pick a new one if you like. Otherwise I'll just tear that one asunder
 
Error to connect because of firewall issues happen while playing games, no?
 
@Batophobia Turn off firewall = game work. Problem solved. Not our problem.
 
@Frank I... what?
 
6:07 PM
@Ktash How about you refine your analogy, then, because mine's based off of yours.
 
@Frank told me to turn off my firewall so I can play Diablo 3, now I have ALL the viruses
 
@Unionhawk We're now experts in fixing all thirty thousand pieces of software that handle firewall duties?
 
See @StrixVaria? If I still had an account, I might be inclined to participate in this mess. I have freed myself.
 
@Frank We just had a TV shopping question
 
@badp And it is, frankly (pardon the pun), crap.
 
6:09 PM
@Frank No, we are experts at video games. Many video games require internet, so we have to allow those things to be acceptable here
 
@Frank The plot in a video game, like the plot of a book, is not incidental. It is incidental from reading, but it is the point of many books. Just like it is the point of many video games. And just like the point of playing an instrument is music. The point of gaming can never really be stretch to "TV repair" so your argument is pretty baseless with that analogy
 
Oct 15 at 19:06, by Frank
That's a staggeringly unhelpful answer.
 
@badp Exactly.
The problem isn't from a game.
 
@Batophobia You require food to stay alive while playing games, are we a cooking site now?
 
@Frank No, but that doesn't suddenly make a question whose answer happens to be "change your firewall settings, it depends on your software, but in general, there's a place to add an exception or do the thing you need" + actual understanding of the thing off topic
 
6:10 PM
It's barely even related to being able to play it.
 
@Frank Yeah, so the answer would be downvoted, not deleted
 
@3ventic Programming on a boat.
 
I lost my train of thought mid sentence
 
@3ventic cooking mama
 
@3ventic "How do I cook @fredley porkchops" sounds like an ok Minecraft question
 
6:10 PM
@Unionhawk I would support listing the ports needing to be opened, as that's a particular function of the game.
 
@Batophobia Sure, but you know I didn't mean that.
 
@Frank This is an issue for the answer, not the question
 
My point is you have to draw the line somewhere.
 
But having instructions on how to make it happen on <insert obscure firewall #37 here>, is of extremely limited utility.
 
@Frank I don't think anybody is arguing that we should be able to provide specific support for each firewall software.
 
6:11 PM
@Frank but as soon as you read the name of the firewall and discovered that -- oh MY -- it is a LINUX SOFTWARE PACKAGE -- oh god WHAT -- this will never do?
 
@3ventic True, but we were discussing things that happen in-game
 
@Unionhawk That's exactly what you're arguing.
 
@Ktash Are you kidding me? Day one patches are allowed for bugfixing, if your software contains enough bugs that you need to add nearly 50% code. You did something terribly worng.
 
@Frank No it's not.
 
LINUX SOFTWARE PACKAGE DOES NOT COMPUTE
 
6:11 PM
@Unionhawk We're gamers! We help fix firewalls!
 
You have misunderstood my argument completely.
 
Yes, it is.
 
@Batophobia and firewall does not happen in-game
 
...
 
@Frank When that firewall is blocking a game
 
6:12 PM
@Arperum Its content. Maps and such. I don't think they game will play without it but I could be wrong
 
@Frank Yes! Yes we do! When it gets games working, we do!
 
1 min ago, by Frank
@Unionhawk I would support listing the ports needing to be opened, as that's a particular function of the game.
 
and now I'm arguing with a brick wall about what my argument is
 
@3ventic It does if you cannot play a game because of a firewall
 
room topic changed to The Bridge: General Arqade chat room, where coherent thought comes to die. [-*gate] [+mandatory] [-context] [-fun] [jin-fanclub] [lazers] [-lifehack] [murder]
 
6:12 PM
12 secs ago, by Frank
1 min ago, by Frank
@Unionhawk I would support listing the ports needing to be opened, as that's a particular function of the game.
 
@Arperum it's not bugs. its content they couldnt fit on one disc. mostly MP stuff because using 2 discs would break the seemless flow between games they were planning.
blame discs
 
@Batophobia That means you haven't even gotten in-game yet, so not really.
 
I wish @MarkTrapp were here.
2
 
I'm just getting into tiny little details that no-one should care about btw.
 
@Ktash Include that in your retail thing already!
 
6:13 PM
Asking which ports need to be open is an objective and useful piece of information.
 
@Arperum Too big for bluray
 
@Frank but you were hell bent to close that question, because "it was about the software?!"
 
Getting us to diagnose and troubleshoot your firewall because you can't, ain't.
 
As @Rapitor said
 
@badp That's exactly what it's about.
 
6:13 PM
@3ventic If you run the exe and get an error code that says you cannot connect, that is a valid question for Arqade, regardless of if that error is firewall, Windows, Mac, or ISP related
 
And I'm still hell-bent on getting it closed.
 
@Rapitor Oh, yea, because games with multiple install disks were a ploblem ever?
 
@Batophobia I agree.
 
@Batophobia This
 
@3ventic This is exactly what we are discussing
 
6:14 PM
@Ktash Fix your content, or use multiple disks.
 
@Arperum when do they jump between 4 different games and 100+ MP maps?
 
@Frank I said we should be able to answer with a general "it depends on your software how to do it". I never said anything about being able to provide per software support.
 
But I still think it's not in-game.
 
I can't see how adding more information -- "this is the firewall I use" -- makes the question suddenly off-topic and about the firewall
 
@3ventic If you start up, you are in-game
 
6:14 PM
@Batophobia And if you can get in, but you want it work with <convoluted requirements because this is what I want>, then it's not.
 
The question was already dreadfully short on information
 
@Rapitor I have games that had four cd's to install them, I didn't care.
 
@Frank ...
 
@badp "I turn off the firewall. The game works." Therefore, we must now help him get it working with his specific requirements.
 
@Batophobia Let's... not get into this tiny detail.
 
6:15 PM
How is that helpful to anyone but the asker?
 
@Frank I am sorry. Who the fuck runs game servers without so much as iptables?
 
@Frank Helpful to anyone with that software and problem
 
Are we doing the "this question is off topic because it is too localized" thing again?
 
@Frank That's like saying "I can answer this Skyrim question, but since you have requirements on PS3 version, you are off-topic"
 
@Batophobia No, because we support the PS3 version.
And is actually a pretty disingenuous argument.
 
6:16 PM
All long help threads should have a sticky globally-editable post at the top saying 'DEAR PEOPLE FROM THE FUTURE: Here's what we've figured out so far ...'
3
 
@Frank and we support multiplayer games
 
@Batophobia We support the game.
 
at any rate I'm much more interested in the matter of lore questions
 
We don't support each and every unique network or software configuration.
 
6:17 PM
6 mins ago, by Unionhawk
@Frank I don't think anybody is arguing that we should be able to provide specific support for each firewall software.
 
@Unionhawk Then what else are you arguing we support?
You're all saying that firewall configuration is unreservedly on-topic.
 
@Rapitor Bullshit. If I had to download that (I won't, because not playing said game), that would be 20% of my monthly download limit...
 
@Frank I want you to realize that the whole point of your argument is that he shouldn't have mentioned the firewall by name
 
@Frank "I cannot connect to Diablo 3 servers because ___ error" is a valid, on-topic question
 
That would be a major inconvenience if I didn't live alone and barely download anything.
 
6:19 PM
@badp No, my argument is that we are supporting a specific firewall, because for some reason, we do that now.
 
which would have inevitably been asked in a follow up comment
 
@Arperum Ah download limits. So glad that isn't a thing for me. I just have to worry about the terribleness of my ISP in other ways
 
@Batophobia And our answer to that would be, "This is the error, and here's how you fix it"
 
@Frank Do you realize that if he hadn't mentioned the firewall by name, you wouldn't have had this argument?
 
@badp We totally would have.
 
6:19 PM
Because he was asking for help with "a firewall"
 
Look at the question:
 
not "a specific firewall"
 
2
Q: How to whitelist CS 1.6 in ConfigServer Firewall

IMBI have pretty much whitelisted all known steam ports but people still can't join my server when ConfigServer Firewall is active. Anybody knows how?

Key point:
 
@Frank And "Here's how you fix it" could be "fix your firewall"
 
> but people still can't join my server when ConfigServer Firewall is active
Problem: "My firewall doesn't work! Plz fix!"
 
6:20 PM
2 mins ago, by badp
@Frank I want you to realize that the whole point of your argument is that he shouldn't have mentioned the firewall by name
 
@badp The actual firewall means nothing.
6 mins ago, by Frank
@Batophobia And if you can get in, but you want it work with <convoluted requirements because this is what I want>, then it's not.
The game itself works.
 
So your point is that this is a bug with the firewall?
 
He just wants it working with his specific configuration and requirements.
@badp Could be a bug, could be a misconfigration, I dunno.
 
All I see there is that in 5 days the question has 2 close votes
and that's probably all I need to see
 
@badp That's also disingenuous.
 
6:22 PM
@Frank But maybe someone who has experience setting up a CS 1.6 server does know.
 
There were three, and you, specifically, are arguing that firewall troubleshooting is something we help with.
Mod comments carry a ton of weight, true or not.
 
oh man if only we had someone experienced in running valve servers on lInux in this very chatroom, cough @Powerlord
 
@Arperum yeah bandwidth limits are rough. I'm not saying the 20gb update is a good thing, because I have to deal with it too... it's not part of the preload either. But I am saying in the end after all is said, done, downloaded. it will be better
 
I came for the lore, but we seem to be on firewalls now. I'm going to go back to work now (as I should have been doing)
 
@Unionhawk That has nothing to with the argument.
 
6:23 PM
@Ktash Yeah, I also came for the lore
 
are we still arguing about the lore/firewall questions?
 
@badp If it used the same game engine as the one I'm versed in, I might be able to answer that. But it doesn't.
 
WHERE IS THE ESCAPE POD WHEN I NEED IT?
 
@Frank What I see here is that I'm not representing the community's feelings on the topic
 
Yeah, I'm done here. This is officially stupid.
 
6:25 PM
@OrigamiRobot It's funny you should mention that!
 
I know in TF2, you have to whitelist -port on both TCP and UDP (or only UDP if you want rcon disabled), -clientport (UDP), +steamport+1 (UDP), and -tv_port (UDP... if you want SourceTV)
 
I watched a documentary about wolves in Chernobyl, it was an hour long. The conversation here doesn't seem to look any different than it did before I started watching it.
 
@Rapitor Yeah, I could see how that would negatively impact some people, but for me...meh shrugs Unless the download was exceedingly slow I doubt it'd be a problem.
@Chippies Solution: RELEASE THE WOLVES
 
@Powerlord SourceTV is not a thing I've ever understood
 
@OrigamiRobot Zarpedon blew it up :(
 
6:26 PM
@badp It's a way to host spectators without taking up server slots.
 
Here is a wrap-up:
What was said: Firewall question can be on topic.
What Frank heard: Firewall questions are on-topic.
 
@TimStone release wolves into the bridge? I approve that idea.
 
@OrigamiRobot Bwuh?
 
You see it more on competitive matches and such than normal ones.
 
@Chippies Bridge either can't hold a topic for 5 minutes or sticks with one for hours. there is no middle ground
 
6:27 PM
@OrigamiRobot Speaking of wraps I haven't had lunch and am hungry.
 
@Powerlord and the two or three source TV servers out there are password protected
 
@Rapitor black and white, eh? Typical Bridge
2
 
@badp SourceTV is used much more widely on DOTA2, where they've renamed it DOTA TV... but it's still the same thing.
 
@TimStone It's 2:30 silly.
 
Then again, Valve controls the DOTA serves with an iron fist more or less. Which is probably why Replay works properly on DOTA instead of the mess we have on TF2.
 
6:29 PM
@OrigamiRobot I know, but I didn't wake up until 12:30 because my son was up at 2:30 in the morning for a few hours screaming for no apparent reason. So much tragedies.
 
@TimStone Oh, so it's still your morning.
 
Pretty much
 
Either way, I'm all argued out because I'm hungry, but that firewall question is crap and needs closing.
 
@TimStone I hereby grant you full grump rights.
 
Well, if you get 3 other people to agree, fine. But until then closure requires 5 votes.
 
6:31 PM
I have provisioned new escape pods to escape the grumpasaurus rage (and lol @ Chrome autocorrecting grumpasaurus for me)
 
Someone needs to write a userscript to add a Jettison button to The Bridge
I nominate @Wipqozn
 
So you can tape it to your keyboard? Just draw a button on a sticky note.
 
Duh, that's how you install things!
 
@Rapitor If I had to download the game AND the patch it would take me a whopping 65% from my monthly limit, and it would take me 6-7 hours to download the thing... I'm not going to do that.
 
Dark Souls now has steam achievements.
 
6:35 PM
 
@Powerlord I thought the problem with that was TF2
Does DOTA use the same backend implementation?
@DwarfSlice How many of them have "git gut" as the description?
 
@badp For Replay? No, they probably save it in the Valve Cloud.
 
life hack: amputate your unnecessary appendages to lose a few pounds and require less food and water to survive!
 
@OrigamiRobot whats up man - going to NJ for the magic event
 
@DwarfSlice CC @Sterno this is a good one.
@juanvan There's a magic event in NJ?
Oh Magic event, as in MtG.
 
6:47 PM
Ya mtg
hhe
 
@juanvan Are you asking or telling?
Or both?
 
Telling
 
I am not.
 
I am
 
@OrigamiRobot You should. You could crash at my place. We have an air mattress.
 
6:47 PM
What kind of event?
 
not like anyone in the office woult be excited
Grand prix
is the name
 
@DwarfSlice Hasn't that been true for a while?
 
@murgatroid99 Nope.
 
@DwarfSlice Definitely had achievements when I was playing it.
 
@StrixVaria I would rather just normal visit. That way I don't need to build a standard deck.
 
6:48 PM
@StrixVaria I am 100% sure that it did not.
 
they are doing leg and vintage events too
 
I do have a legacy deck.
 
@DwarfSlice huh, I don't have achievements I definitely would have unlocked, so I guess not
 
@OrigamiRobot If you visit I will give you every single magic card I own, save 1 deck that I will keep for nostalgic reasons.
 
Ha
 
6:50 PM
Whoa, now I'm getting paid to visit?
 
that would be damn reason enough for me to come and bring you cookies
 
@murgatroid99 I started a new character like 3 days ago so I would have some too. I have 0 of them right now. They're new.
 
@StrixVaria I guess u don't play STD format
 
@juanvan I played from 2001-2005ish, then very briefly again during RTR, and now I know for a fact I'll never actually get back into playing.
@DwarfSlice I have specific memories of unlocking achievements, but I don't have Steam achievements. Maybe they were GFWL achievements or some other trash like that.
 
@StrixVaria Provided you never try EDH
 
6:53 PM
ya that is where most old ppl head too
 
That's why the E is for Elder.
 
@OrigamiRobot I don't have anyone to play with. My LGS was lame.
 
I am in standard, kinda like the challange of getting away from GF and then beating a 12yr old
 
@StrixVaria :(
 
@StrixVaria there is no FFGC in your area?
 
6:55 PM
> Florida Federation of Garden Clubs
This is what I got when I googled those letters.
 
hehe
FamFriendlyGameCenters
ya that one took me a while too
 
I don't even know what that would be, so I guess not.
 
its on gameboardgeeks alot
 
@juanvan read that as farm friendly and got more confused
 
HAHAHAAHAH Cows are Friendly!
if you were going to fly - could you request a Hazmat suit at the airport?
 

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