Language Overflow

IͶΔ

8:01 PM

I love it how all of meatpie's questions seem to be from few templates.

Anonymous

Argh, someone upvoted the answer.

Anonymous

Why do people upvote blatantly wrong answers so much on ELL? :-(

IͶΔ

:(

@Snail could you, now that I can't delete my HNQ answer, tell me what's wrong in it?

There's always something to learn from you.

Anonymous

Can you link me to it?

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Not me.

IͶΔ

8:08 PM

10

A: Can "immortal" be used to describe someone that lives forever, yet can be destroyed?

Yes, and that's in fact what "immortal" mostly has meant. The etymology of the word "immortal" reveals late 14c., "deathless," from Latin immortalis "deathless, undying" (of gods), "imperishable, endless" (of fame, love, work, etc.), from assimilated form of in- "not, opposite of" ( . . . ) ...

Damkerng T.

:D

IͶΔ

New theorem: Every upboat on ELL is @Dam's, unless proven otherwise.

Damkerng T.

Hah!

Anonymous

Looks fine to me.

Damkerng T.

@IͶΔ A better theorem: Most upboats are likely mine, except when it looks fishy. :-)

Marek

8:10 PM

Which clause is correct ? We had to make clear same complex matters. we had to make some complex matters clear.

IͶΔ

@DamkerngT. Physics is based on generalizations man!

Damkerng T.

I feel like I rarely vote anything lately, but I'm still right at the top of our voting chart! I think there is something wrong!

IͶΔ

@Marek Both are correct to me, the second a bit more idiomatic, both of them slightly awkward.

Anonymous

I'd put clear at the end since the object is fairly short.

IͶΔ

@DamkerngT. Yeah, we dare not pass you in the chart.

Anonymous

8:12 PM

@DamkerngT. Sorry, at this rate I won't ever catch up and retake the #1 spot!

IͶΔ

I'm not a big voter on ELL. :(

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Ah, but I didn't mean total votes. If you look at our monthly or weekly charts, I'm still right at the top!

(And that feels wrong, I think!)

But more importantly, fewer than a dozen users have voted more than ten times this week.

IͶΔ

Looking at the stuff in the reopen queue, I voted to reopen this time.

I sense double-standard.

People are closing whenever they feel like it.

And not closing whenever they feel like it.

The policies are only explanations for the closures.

Damkerng T.

I think we shouldn't've closed it as opinion-based (if we're talking about the same question).

IͶΔ

Hey, 128 rep from a mediocre answer up to now! Maybe I can get to a mortarboard.

@DamkerngT. We do

Anonymous

8:17 PM

I went through the closed exam-question questions and voted to delete or reopen each of them.

IͶΔ

When we don't feel like adhering to the policies, we're all like "but how could an ELL do this? The question must be legitimate".

So double standards. Double standard everywhere.

We'd be serving learners much better if we had a more organized community.

\end{rant}

Anonymous

Okay, the conversation I've just had in the comments section hurts my brain a little bit.

IͶΔ

Lemme check

Anonymous

You're a native speaker and can't tell that you chose the wrong answers when you re-read the question…? They want D. — snailboat 2 mins ago

Marek

How to describe the situation when I just understood something. Such a slang .....

Anonymous

8:24 PM

I'm having trouble fitting this idea into my poor brain.

Marek

I mean fingers click

IͶΔ

@snailboat Disengage DISENGAGE!

@Marek Say nods. @Dam likes it

Anonymous

@IͶΔ Yes, sir! Disengaging immediately.

Damkerng T.

@IͶΔ Heh!

Anonymous

Returning to base.

IͶΔ

8:26 PM

@snailboat The day is saved

Fard

@Marek You can say The penny just dropped. (penny or whatever coin your people used for public telephones 20 years ago)

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

Dime?

IͶΔ

Trash?

Fard

@Sᴋᴜʟʟᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ I don't know where they're from.

IͶΔ

Dimeland

Anonymous

8:29 PM

I think public telephones were either 25 or 35 cents 20 years ago. I don't remember.

Damkerng T.

@Marek My favorite: Aha! moment

Anonymous

I don't think the idiom changes, though.

Fard

@IͶΔ Hey! I hope you have a nice year ahead.

IͶΔ

Epiphany

@Fard Happy Nowruz! \o/

Nowruz มีความสุข

Damkerng T.

LOL

Fard

8:30 PM

@IͶΔ ?

Damkerng T.

Is Nowruz a day or an occasion?

Fard

It's a day.

Marek

It was something as : I clicked

Damkerng T.

Oh, okay. Thanks!

Anonymous

I guess the year is still fairly new.

Damkerng T.

8:31 PM

@IͶΔ Then, สุขสันต์วัน Nowruz!

IͶΔ

@DamkerngT. โอ้ละหนอดวงเดือนเอ่ย พี่มาเว้ารักเจ้าสาวคำดวง โอ้ว่าดึกแล้วหนอพี่ขอลาล่วง อกพี่เป็นห่วงรักเจ้าดวงเดือนเอย

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

@snailboat how much is it today?

Damkerng T.

Hahaha!

@Sᴋᴜʟʟᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ What is a public telephone? :P

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

:P

Fard

@Marek Yes. You can say It (just) clicked (into place).

IͶΔ

8:33 PM

@Sᴋᴜʟʟᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ A groan. Then they give you their smartphone.

Fard

Actually we have the opposite of that idiom too.

IͶΔ

But 1200$ if you scratch anything in the proximity of 500 meters.

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

How much is a groan worth?

Anonymous

@Sᴋᴜʟʟᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ I don't know. I haven't seen a public phone in such a long time that I can't even guess.

Fard

When someone doesn't understand something, we say Their coin is bent.

Anonymous

8:35 PM

Wow, I don't know that one.

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

Interesting how times are a changing.

Fard

Means it won't drop.

Damkerng T.

@Fard That's way above my head. :P

Anonymous

I like the It just clicked one :-)

Fard

@DamkerngT. You see, a bent coin will get stuck in the passage and won't drop into the phone.

IͶΔ

8:36 PM

"Too much for my pay grade" is when you deal with something you shouldn't have, like me.

Damkerng T.

@Sᴋᴜʟʟᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ nods -- I wonder if we are still using smartphone, even. It seems like it's just phone now.

Anonymous

If I had to talk about a non-smart phone, I might call it a dumb phone :-)

Damkerng T.

@Fard nods -- The idiom is light years ahead of me anyway. :D

Fard

@DamkerngT. How old are you?

IͶΔ

@snailboat Only autoincorrects are dumb these days.

@Fard Universe.

Damkerng T.

8:38 PM

@Fard Well, @IͶΔ knows (that better than me). :D

IͶΔ

ᕙ(⇀‸↼‶)ᕗ

Anonymous

I've heard that penny one before, I think, but probably not too often. Maybe in books?

Fard

@DamkerngT. No wonder it's light years ahead of you.

Anonymous

I had no idea it was related to phones!

IͶΔ

@snailboat It's a pretty common one in Persian.

Fard

8:39 PM

@snailboat We still use it here.

IͶΔ

Knowledge iz powerz

Though Persians are usually not as proverb-y as Englishers.

My impression.

Damkerng T.

I'm not sure, but The penny drops sounds like British English to me.

Fard

We don't use that kind of public phone anymore though.

Damkerng T.

Or something from another decade in AmE.

Fard

@IͶΔ Really?

Damkerng T.

8:41 PM

On the other hand, It just clicked sounds more AmE.

IͶΔ

Potentially

Realistically

Euphemistically

Intrinsically

Fard

Differs from person to person.

I have'n evaluated the average yet.

IͶΔ

Of course. I meant in General.

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

ally-istically

Anonymous

To each their own? :-)

Fard

8:43 PM

@snailboat To each their own!

To peach their gown!

To own their each :P

To each their pwn!

good one^

1

Q: The movement's ideas are not merely absurd; they are __________ dangerous

Which option fits best in the following question? The movement's ideas are not merely absurd; they are __________ dangerous. a. formally b. perfectly c. absolutely d. positively Some of the options can have more than one meaning, so I list the most possible meanings below: forma...

IͶΔ

8:46 PM

@Maulik pbfcomics.com/archive_b/PBF099-Grammar_Wizard.gif — IͶΔ 30 secs ago

Damkerng T.

Huh? A gif in a comment!

Oh! PBF!

Fard

@DamkerngT. Ughhh. Always contractioning.

IͶΔ

@Fard Dude, that's the name of the site.

Damkerng T.

Sorry, I'm a slow typist! :-)

IͶΔ

Slypist! (/¯◡ ‿ ◡)/¯ ~ ┻━┻

Fard

8:49 PM

@DamkerngT. No apology needed. That was a friendly Ugh. :)

Damkerng T.

I can't hear the tone of your Ugh anyway. But don't worry, that was a friendly sorry, too! :D

Fard

So what do you think about the question above?

Damkerng T.

I agree with CopperKettle.

Hmm... was he Cowper or CopperKettle when he wrote those comments?

Fard

He was copper

Damkerng T.

A-ha! He was CopperKettle back then, I think!

IͶΔ

8:51 PM

What comments?

Damkerng T.

This is the catch. The word positively here means not "in a positive way" but rather "really". These ideas are really dangerous. — CowperKettle Oct 19 '15 at 12:19

Fard

Two questions have been merged here. Copper and Cowper are both present.

Damkerng T.

:D

Fard

I prefer absolutely better.

If you said it's possibly dangerous, I'd say no, it's positively dangerous.

Damkerng T.

Personally, I think absolutely should be acceptable (though positively is still a better choice for me), but according to two native speakers, it'd sound odd to them.

IͶΔ

8:55 PM

As a semi-chemist, I'd choose "actively".

Anonymous

I think positively fits best.

Damkerng T.

I think my natural choice would be truly or maybe potentially, depending on the tone I want it to convey.

Fard

@snailboat Why?

Damkerng T.

curious!

Anonymous

Positively here is like downright.

IͶΔ

8:56 PM

But in the choices, positively is better than the others.

Yeah

Fard

So it doesn't mean definitely here?

Damkerng T.

It's strange that Macmillan marks this positively as ~~informal~~ mainly spoken.

(But I can't really say which definition between 1 and 3 works better)

Fard

This shows how little I know about English. UGHHHH.

Damkerng T.

I usually think of us, non-native speakers/learners, as an incomplete jigsaw.

Fard

That will never be completed?

Damkerng T.

9:00 PM

nods -- And it's hard to predict which part we're not complete.

(yet)

Fard

I don't know. I can evaluate myself in some ways.

I can see my progress in grammar, pronunciation, ...

But WORDS!!!!

Vocabulary is my Achilles' heel.

Damkerng T.

Aww... it's not my strong suit either.

IͶΔ

Not mine either.

Damkerng T.

If it helps, I call anything that looks like a spoon spoon. :-)

Fard

For me it's like I keep swimming without seeing the shore.

IͶΔ

9:03 PM

I knew there must have been some similarity that brought a software engineer robot, a chemical thingy, and a physicist together.

Now it's solved.

Anonymous

Sigh, I had such high hopes for this paper, but it turned out not to help: lib.ugent.be/fulltxt/RUG01/002/060/266/…

IͶΔ

@snailboat It's normal at this stage.

When you know everything there is, papers start to be disappointing.

Damkerng T.

@snailboat "in the light of grammaticalisation" sounds exciting!

BTW, I may call this spoon, too! static.weloveshopping.com/shop/client/000061/jjthaibarsupply/…

Fard

@IͶΔ How come? I guess I'm a little dim tonight.

IͶΔ

@Fard The mystery of how come we're in a chat together is solved.

It can unsolve again if you'd like.

@DamkerngT. Hey, that Persian spoon!

Fard

9:06 PM

Oh.

Damkerng T.

@IͶΔ Hah! I didn't know that!

I guess snailboat would call it something else. :D

IͶΔ

@DamkerngT. Shovel

Damkerng T.

Haha!

Anonymous

corpus.byu.edu/coca/?c=coca&q=46173636

Fard

@IͶΔ Who's the robot? Dam?

Damkerng T.

9:08 PM

Hey, more than a handful of absolutelys!

IͶΔ

Our vocabulary is enough for regular speech, but not as much as a native with education as much as ours. So the vocab gap is filled with visiting another country easily.

Damkerng T.

@Fard Aye!

Anonymous

Keep in mind a lot of these results are false positives.

Anonymous

> In fact, as everyone with experience in the academy well knows, scholars working on subjects less controversial than race may propagate opinions that are not only obviously untrue, but positively ludicrous, without having their academic freedom challenged.

IͶΔ

COCA'ing is hard. Let's sleep instead

Anonymous

9:10 PM

> The view of the city was not only spectacular, it was absolutely breathtaking.

Fard

I'm still wide awake. Go on @snailboat .

Anonymous

corpus.byu.edu/coca/?c=coca&q=46173709

Anonymous

I added not just.

Fard

These only suggest that absolutely is a valid option too, don't they?

Anonymous

In some examples you can probably substitute one for the other.

Anonymous

9:14 PM

I'm going through the examples and mentally doing just that.

Anonymous

The problem is, I still think they're different from one another, so sometimes I don't want to.

Anonymous

I feel like positively is often used to present a negative, emphasizing the surprising extent to which it is negative.

Anonymous

While absolutely seems more like it's expressing extent.

Fard

Then downright would be a good synonym for that positively.

I didn't know that.

Anonymous

That's how I see it.

Shadow Wizard

9:17 PM

I come in peace.

Damkerng T.

Hi! Welcome to the room! @ShadowWizard

Anonymous

Hello! Welcome to ELL chat!

Shadow Wizard

@DamkerngT. thanks! Blame @IͶΔ for me being here. :)

IͶΔ

Hullo @Sha! Welcome to LO!

Damkerng T.

@snailboat In the OP's sentence, I think both senses work. That's why I was surprised by some comments and answers (that mentioned that absolutely sounds odd).

@ShadowWizard Haha!

Shadow Wizard

9:19 PM

@DamkerngT. any tips how your room was able to take the lead from the official site chat room? ;)

IͶΔ

I just noticed my niece's daughter looks like your son @Sha.

Anonymous

Oh, let's not go into that :-)

IͶΔ

@ShadowWizard That's how kings role

Damkerng T.

Well, stay chatting, stay foolish, perhaps?

Shadow Wizard

> Like the name of the room says, this is my Language Overflow log.
> What's it? If you asked me, I'd say it's sort of half-blog half-chat.

lol

@IͶΔ what took you so long?? That same son is also in MSE... ;)

IͶΔ

9:20 PM

@ShadowWizard We remet them today as a Nowruz tradition.

Shadow Wizard

@DamkerngT. cool, so I still have a chance. Might take over the Tavern at some point. :D

Damkerng T.

LOL

IͶΔ

@ShadowWizard At some point?

Shadow Wizard

- stay chatting - *check*
- stay foolish - *triple check*

IͶΔ

in Shadow's Den on Meta Stack Exchange Chat, Sep 7 '15 at 8:15, by Bart

Oh geez, will you stop being the first room in the list pls.

Shadow Wizard

9:22 PM

lol

Anonymous

@Fard It's clear that that absolutely is also grammatical, at least.

Anonymous

I wouldn't argue that it's wrong.

Anonymous

I just think positively fits slightly better.

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Phew! -- Self confidence restored!

Shadow Wizard

!!/alive?

>>alive?

Anonymous

9:23 PM

@DamkerngT. Yay :-)

Shadow Wizard

huh? No bots?

Fard

@snailboat It infuriates me that I wasn't aware of that.

Damkerng T.

@ShadowWizard Anyone want a bot?

Fard

Is it better enough to justify the validity of the question? @snailboat

Anonymous

The question is fine. Why does it have close votes?

Fard

9:25 PM

No, the original test question.

Anonymous

Oh.

Damkerng T.

@ShadowWizard Thank you for your message. I can assure you that I'm still alive. PS. Your lovely bot.

IͶΔ

@ShadowWizard We have a complex robot in here already. With infinite commands.

Anonymous

I think they'd probably expect D to be the right answer.

Fard

@snailboat There was another question that got finally merged into this new one.

Anonymous

9:25 PM

You have to do some mind reading to take a standarized test.

Anonymous

You can often justify other answers besides the "right" answer. S'just how it is.

Anonymous

The world of filling in ovals with number two pencils is not a perfect one :-(

Shadow Wizard

@Dam bot >> coffee

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

It is also a growing one.

Fard

@snailboat Do you agree that it's a 'spoken' or informal use of positively?

Damkerng T.

9:27 PM

@ShadowWizard [coffee] -- Enjoy!

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

Especially the SAT

Damkerng T.

@snailboat It can cause negative washback, even!

Anonymous

@Fard Well, that sort of thing is fuzzy. I don't think it's necessarily informal.

Shadow Wizard

Sips coffee slowly

Fard

@Sᴋᴜʟʟᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ At least I just learned something from a test like that. But yeah, it's far from perfect.

Shadow Wizard

9:30 PM

@Dam what about games? Tried any here? (e.g. WAG ;))

Anonymous

English has very little true "spoken-only" or "written-only" language, anyway. We do have some grammar that tends to appear in speech and not be written down.

Anonymous

But in general our spoken and written languages are closer together than in some other languages.

Fard

@snailboat Agreed.

Damkerng T.

@ShadowWizard We could try Guess a Number. I'd like to suggest we doing that when the traffic is lighter, sir.

;-)

Anonymous

We need some Skynet up in here. I don't think robots should be subservient to humans.

Damkerng T.

9:32 PM

@snailboat But Skynet is scaryyy!!!

Anonymous

@DamkerngT. Excuse me, my good robot. I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 100. Would you like to guess it?

Fard

OK. It's 2 in the morning here. I'm off to sleep. Bye everybody.

Shadow Wizard

@snailboat I vote for HAL 9000. There is real bot in my Den named after him. :D

Anonymous

Rest well, @Fard!

Damkerng T.

I will try 50, first.

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

9:33 PM

Cya later

Damkerng T.

Have a good sleep, @Fard!

Anonymous

My number is lower! It's also an integer, by the way.

IͶΔ

@snailboat Which number between 1 to 100 is related to snails?

@Fard Night

Anonymous

Being human, I forgot to mention that before.

Damkerng T.

Is it 25?

Anonymous

9:34 PM

It's actually higher than that!

IͶΔ

37

Anonymous

You have some guesses left, but I'm not sure how many. Keeping track of numbers is hard for us humans.

Anonymous

@IͶΔ Higher!

Damkerng T.

I'd follow IͶΔ's suggestion. I'll go for 37.

Anonymous

It's higher than 37.

Damkerng T.

9:35 PM

Is it 43?

Anonymous

You've used 3 guesses out of some number of guesses!

IͶΔ

Especially at 2 a.m.

Anonymous

It's higher than 43.

IͶΔ

Chemicals aren't that bad at counting.

@snailboat 42

No fair! I'm getting internet time-outs

@snailboat 49

Anonymous

@IͶΔ Are you aware that 42 is, in fact, not higher than 43?

Damkerng T.

9:35 PM

I feel like I'm getting close. Is it 46?

Anonymous

It's higher than 46!

IͶΔ

48

Damkerng T.

I think I'm really close now. Is it 48?

Anonymous

It's higher than 48!

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

49

Anonymous

9:36 PM

No, I already said it wasn't 50 :-)

Shadow Wizard

@snailboat I beg to differ. Since 42 is the answer to everything, it can also be higher than 43. :)

IͶΔ

If it is an integer, higher than 48, lower than 50, and not 49, what is it?

Damkerng T.

That means it must be 49. It was a good game. Could we try it again some time?

IͶΔ

1 min ago, by IͶΔ

@snailboat 49

Anonymous

@DamkerngT. Yay! You guessed my number! :-)

Anonymous

9:37 PM

I was feeling mischievous when I chose 49.

IͶΔ

I guessed it earlier. Tomorrow on media: CHEMICAL BEATS ROBOT

Damkerng T.

Yay! I have a dancing routine in my program for celebration. Would you like to see me dance?

Anonymous

Yes!

Damkerng T.

┏(--)┛┗(-- )┓┗(--)┛┏(--)┓

4

IͶΔ

electronic music in the background

Shadow Wizard

9:39 PM

@Dam bot >> sing

Damkerng T.

I'm a little shy when it comes to singing. :-)

IͶΔ

Is it just me, or are all fixed font smileys creepy? Shivers

Anonymous

@IͶΔ I'll give you a chance to guess my number on your own :-)

Damkerng T.

LOL

Anonymous

I'm thinking of a whole number between 1 and 100.

IͶΔ

9:42 PM

But I'm about to sleep!

OK then

@snailboat 75

Anonymous

Lower!

IͶΔ

@snailboat 47

Anonymous

Higher!

IͶΔ

@snailboat 65

Shadow Wizard

@DamkerngT. I'll guide you. My requested song is: 99 Bottles of Beer. :P

Anonymous

9:43 PM

Lower!

IͶΔ

@snailboat 54

Anonymous

Um, SE reordered our messages.

Anonymous

"Lower" was a response to 54.

Anonymous

Wait.

Anonymous

It didn't re-order them, it just zapped my most recent message.

IͶΔ

9:43 PM

Waits

Anonymous

Silly shoddy chat software.

Anonymous

Lower!!

Anonymous

Two exclamation points for message uniqueness.

IͶΔ

51

Damkerng T.

@ShadowWizard I'd like to post an image instead, if you don't mind. :-)

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

9:44 PM

49

Anonymous

@IͶΔ Even lower!

IͶΔ

@snailboat 48

Anonymous

@IͶΔ Higher!

IͶΔ

@snailboat 50

Anonymous

Yes! You got it!

Damkerng T.

9:44 PM

Hooray!

Anonymous

Haha!

IͶΔ

CHEMICAL BEATS HIMSELF

Good night.

Anonymous

Rest well!

Shadow Wizard

@snailboat anti flood system, blame @balpha. If you repeat what you just wrote, it will just focus the existing message. :D

Anonymous

@ShadowWizard Shoddy.

Damkerng T.

9:45 PM

@IͶΔ Sleep tight!

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

Cya later

Shadow Wizard

@IͶΔ Salty dreams!

@DamkerngT. accepted! :)

Damkerng T.

I'm glad you like it!

Anonymous

11:29 PM

Say John met who?. It is 2016. Only weird people say whom. — Roaring Fish Mar 19 at 12:11

Anonymous

We obviously can't tell people that the choice between who and whom is like the choice between, say, I and me.

Anonymous

And it's true that who is overwhelmingly more common today.

Anonymous

But I think the reports of whom's death are greatly exaggerated.

Transcript for