Game Development

If you pre-optimize too much can't it cut down on productivity level? You'll be focused too much on fixing code - instead of working on core gameplay.

Gajet

@CodeAssasssin that's one of the drawbacks

Gustavo - Gtoknu

@CodeAssasssin You're getting the point :)

Dave

im more referring to things like:
i had a draw function which used 3 for loops to draw each layer of sprites one after another, i then changed it to one loop

Gajet

6:51 PM

but you need to know sometime you need to preoptimize

Code Assasssin

@Gajet if it's THAT bad :P

tylerrrr07

@Gajet I decided a dedicated server was too expensive for my blood. I bought some regular windows hosting I can share if you'd like but since we don't have RDP access we are somewhat limited.

Gajet

for example @WilliamMindWorXMariager need to develop his code completely optimized from the start

Gustavo - Gtoknu

@Dave Well if it WORKS and isn't bothering performance so bad, i wouldnt touch it.

Dave

@GustavoGtoknu see i don't like to think like that it makes me feel dirty lol

Gajet

6:52 PM

@tylerrrr07 as I said I only need as much as a wordpress installed and a simple file sharing mechanism.

nothing too fancy

Gustavo - Gtoknu

@Dave Yes I know, i used to think as you're thinking now. Trying to change my scopes :P

Because after all, my focus is getting a game running, not waste time recoding things that already works.

I usually put some //TODO coments, explaining how can i make it better

so when i surely have the time, i can work on it :)

Gajet

@Dave noone develop codes dirtier than me (except OS developing guys!) and I say it's not dirty not to preoptimize!

tylerrrr07

@Gajet Buy yourself a domain and I can help you out

Gajet

heh :D

Dave

but leaving sumin that works which may not be the best method is like using duct tape and saying "thatll do" when u should use nails and a hammer :P

Gajet

6:55 PM

@tylerrrr07 I guess I prefer to say with not sharing my project with anyone!

tylerrrr07

?

I might be able to create a subdomain if thats ok? whateveryouwant.intellisenseless.com

Gajet

I love it!

Dave

what is you're project @Gajet

tylerrrr07

wait...

Gajet

let's name it "Battery"

Gustavo - Gtoknu

6:56 PM

@Dave Well, you can choose waste your time choosing "best methods" or making the game, you choose :D

thelinuxlich

these iranians are too much reclusive

Gustavo - Gtoknu

haha

Dave

@GustavoGtoknu what if - lets say u complete your game engine and release it to public then surely its the time to look for better methods

tylerrrr07

Battery.intellisenseless.com?

Gajet

not all iranians just me

Dave

6:57 PM

you live in iran ?

Gustavo - Gtoknu

@Gajet aaaaaaand... Esenthel installer crashed!

Gajet

@Dave are you new here?

@GustavoGtoknu what?

Dave

yes :P

Gustavo - Gtoknu

are you new here? 2

@Gajet Esenthel installer app just crashed, on the middle of the download, nice

Gajet

I didn't used to install it, just extracted a file into some folder!

@Dave then yes I am!

Gustavo - Gtoknu

6:58 PM

well, i went to the site and there was a fancy downloader

Dave

is iran any thing like the west portrays it to be?

Gajet

nope not at all

JMRboosties

probably

the people are nice but their gov is a bit off their rocker

Gajet

but I guess it depends on what you think it is

Gustavo - Gtoknu

@Dave Well, if it is working and with good performance, why not? the players wont see the code anyway :D You can optimize then. Or you optimize when you're about to release the game. My rule of thumb is to optimize if and only if the performance is horrible.

hey guys, Im going out for a little, brb in 30 minutes or so.

Dave

7:00 PM

@Gajet dunno i read articles about women being treated badly but as i read it from the media i dunno how much is true lol

Gajet

there are two kinds of people, those who think government rocks and those who think it sucks

they are almost the same in number and there is no one in the gray area between them

Gustavo - Gtoknu

Isnt it just stereotypes?

Dave

they might not like the government if they don't find a way to stop usa cos all hell could still break loose over coming years

Gajet

nope it's not, it's like how iranian usually behave about everthing

Gustavo - Gtoknu

Like people think that here in brazil there are just jungles, monkeys and soccer players, on Africa there are just black people, and in america just rich people, blablabla.

Dave

7:03 PM

@Gajet so do you think the sanctions are not required?

JMRboosties

america is poor as shit

10% of the population is well off the rest scrape by

Dave

uk is poor too our government here upped taxes for poor lower for the rich

JMRboosties

scraping by is better for americans than it is in other parts of the world but the rich-poor gap is getting huge

Gajet

I think sanctions ARE required but it won't change anything here in iran!

Gustavo - Gtoknu

@JMRboosties As i said, these are stereotypes :P The same way not everybody on africa is black or miserable.

JMRboosties

7:05 PM

monied interests have taken over the US imo

Gajet

it just prevents iranians feeling like god!

Dave

well thats not good then

Gustavo - Gtoknu

anyway im out cya

Dave

oh u live in the capital too :O

Gajet

I'm not sure how would government behave if it wasn't for sanctions.

Code Assasssin

7:06 PM

@GustavoGtoknu bye

Dave

well from what i read here - iran's government has not changed at all with the sanctions

Gajet

in Iran almost every one is powered with feelings, decides with feelings and act based on feelings

@Dave not even a single bit

Dave

which is bad cos usa are not bluffing about attacking if need be =/

Gajet

yeah they are bluffing

Kikaimaru

seriously, politics here? :)

Dave

7:08 PM

well thats hard to say

they went into iraq and afghan =/

Gajet

Iran is not that poor when talking about military stuff.

Dave

true

Gajet

and we have Arabs with their oil all around us, just a single missle launched towards us the the world will loose all it's oil supply for at least 3 years

no country could afford that

@Dave iraq and afghan were too much different,

Dave

good point on the oil thing

but then iran could turn oil off now n say "get rid of the sanctions"

Gajet

we fought iraq for 8 years, we had nothing while iraq had access to latest military technologies

@Dave turining off the oil now will surly lead to war right now, which is not anything like any politic wants

and now Iran is much more advanced compared to what it was 20 years ago

Dave

7:12 PM

but then the nuclear programme u guys have might make usa start a war any thing it seems like a complex situation for both sides =/

JMRboosties

if we'd just spend a fraction of the money on the oil wars on alt energy we'd prob not even be using fossil fuels right now

Gajet

a war now against iran might lead to WW3

Dave

EU have spent alot more in fusion power than military

JMRboosties

no offense but the west would destroy anyone in an all out war

Dave

not china

any possibly not russia

they i think would be on iran's side

JMRboosties

7:13 PM

it depends on whether or not us decides to mass bomb or not

Gajet

and possibly not everywhere in the world who talks big

Dave

could iran really reach US land =/ ?

JMRboosties

the thing is something like ww3 wont happen in all likelihood

the world economy is too dependent on relative stability to allow for it

Gajet

just check out the latest war between Israel and Lebanon

Dave

ideally the arab spring needs to keep going in the middle east till the people take charge the west had civil war's many years ago its the middle east's turn

Gajet

7:15 PM

almost everyone know Israel was fueled by US and lebanon had Iran on their side,

@Dave it's not about winning the war but about not loosing

@Dave it's not anything like Arab spring

and there was not even once those arabs shine in history!

Dave

so iranian's support their goverment ?

Gajet

it was always Iranian doing everything

even Islam grew because they had too many Iranian leaders on their side!

Dave

the media here makes it out that the government in iran control their people more like dictators

Gajet

(that's a little big talk but)

@Dave as I said there are almost 50% thinking like that, and there are another 50% thinking the government rocks

Dave

ah

Gajet

7:19 PM

they just bold the oppositions since they don't current Iranian government

Dave

which side u on ?

Gajet

that's difficult question to answer for me

Dave

true they could be watching u :O

Gajet

that's not the case

Dave

say you love them just encase

Gajet

7:20 PM

there are some thing I love, like how they stood against US and other western countries and somethings I hate like how they limited the internet

Dave

do they stone women or is that media lying

Gajet

it's not a lie completely but greatly Exaggerated

Dave

ah

Gajet

it's basically a law in Islam which might should be applied to women in rare case of prostitution.

JMRboosties

i need to figure out how im going to handle movement speed for tile-based movement

Gajet

7:23 PM

and there are too many condition a woman have to meet before being sentenced like that

Dave

mind u the uk's history did harsh things to women too in the past

Gajet

@JMRboosties what is your problem?

JMRboosties

i dont know, just need to tackle it

im not at my computer with the code right now, but basically i do this for movement

if(KeyState.IsDown(Key.Right))
     character.Coordinates.X += 1

Kikaimaru

you should set some action to player on key down

JMRboosties

so if you press and hold right the character just flies right as fast as the update sequence can go

Kikaimaru

7:26 PM

and then somewhere check if player has that action and set velocity

and then add velocity to position

Gajet

if(KeyState.IsDown(Key.Right))
character.Coordinates.X += 1 * deltaTime;

JMRboosties

oh, good idea

thelinuxlich

Kikaimaru how's your project?

Kikaimaru

@thelinuxlich oh i have a question for you, how would you do opening chests?

thelinuxlich

why?

Gajet

7:28 PM

like a simple flag is a chest opened? tied with an animation?

Kikaimaru

in componend based system i mean

Dave

also need to include if user is close enough to the chest

Gajet

good point

Kikaimaru

@thelinuxlich only thing i came up is, on key down, on some player behaviour create new entity (invisible hand) with collision, when that collision with chest occcurs some behaviour on hand will be notified, and that behaviour will notify player entity, and that player entity will tell chest entity to open

Gajet

@Kikaimaru you think too hard!

Kikaimaru

7:31 PM

@Gajet well i dont think there is any other solution :)

thelinuxlich

does it really need a third entity with collision?

Gajet

let me see, first of all why are you creating an invisible hand?

thelinuxlich

add a component "Opening" for the chest when the player moves close enough during the collision system verification

Gajet

why not just call a function from a component in chest object?

Kikaimaru

well how can i tell if player is standing infront of chest?

thelinuxlich

7:34 PM

then another system intercepts it and plays the correct animation

Kikaimaru

@thelinuxlich you are just creating new components and system for everything you need even slightly different? no reusing of components?

@Gajet well i dont know if there is a chest, so i would need to raycast from players component

thelinuxlich

what do you mean for component reuse?

Gajet

now you are being a bit silly!

Kikaimaru

@thelinuxlich with that new invisible hand entity i can do it without adding new component type

@Gajet why?

thelinuxlich

my implementation has events for those who want to implement a component pool

Dave

7:37 PM

hmm damn im stuck on a logic issue for implementing something

Gajet

though ray casing is way to solve that problem but it's a lot easier to create a list of all chests

thelinuxlich

@Kikaimaru but then you would need some kind of message passing for opening the chest

Gajet

and whenever the play hits a key check if you are near any object around that chest

thelinuxlich

in my case message passing = adding a componente

*component

Kikaimaru

@Gajet thats not the point, the point is that i dont want some component to search for other components...

Gajet

7:38 PM

also you can put a trigger in front of the chest and wheever player moves inside add that chest to inrange list

@Kikaimaru what's the problem with searching?

Kikaimaru

@Gajet thats possible but complex for level designer

Dave

logic question:
if a building generates X amount every 120 seconds and walk to factory is 30seconds + 30 to get back to building.... now a user logs out and back in - the user needs to see the npc walking to and from the buildings in the right place on login like as if it continued when user logged out

thelinuxlich

it's not a component searching other components

Dave

any idea how i would do such a thing

Kikaimaru

@Gajet well i dont want my component to see other entities components

thelinuxlich

7:40 PM

my implementation has systems subscribing/publishing to components, components do nothing

Gajet

not that much you just create a chest+trigger package, and game designer put that package wherever he likes

Kikaimaru

@thelinuxlich i dont want chest opening system either :)

Gajet

a component can check if there is another entity around him right?

Kikaimaru

@Gajet well... probably not

Gajet

@Dave it depends, on many things!

Dave

7:41 PM

i know i think i need help cos im bit out of my depth for this part @Gajet

Gajet

@Kikaimaru do your structure is a pile of shit!

no offence!

at least unity let's you see there are other components around you!

thelinuxlich

you don't need an specific chest opening system, but an animation system which intercepts the opening component on chest entity

Kikaimaru

@thelinuxlich what? animation is not a problem

Dave

oh what the heck is double posted

Kikaimaru

@Gajet how?

Gajet

7:44 PM

let's say you could ask it to tell you about all the objects around you

@Kikaimaru Collider []colliders = Physics.OverlapSphere(transform.position,radious);

Kikaimaru

@Gajet srry i have to go,, i ll be there later then we can continue .)

Gajet

@Dave is your game interactive?

Dave

in what respect @gajet

Gajet

and does your game resume after logout?

Dave

thats the plan im about that stage now

Gajet

7:46 PM

I mean does it bother the player if the worker is not at it's place or it's only nice if it continues to move?

Dave

well the resources increment on time passed checks so if it takes 40 seconds itll increment 40 seconds a time even if the npc is not animated

so the animation is just eye candy

Gustavo - Gtoknu

I'm back :) But I'll waste some time on deving, so if anything, jus mention me :D

Gajet

what about esenthel?

:D

not that I really care

thelinuxlich

@GustavoGtoknu

Gajet

but it's nice to have someone to help you debug when you're stuck somewhere with engine!

@Dave so let's say I would place it at some random location

Gustavo - Gtoknu

7:50 PM

After the installer crashed i didnt try again to download it.

But i'll try again 1 min

Dave

yup

Gustavo - Gtoknu

right, downloading :)

Gajet

spawning it at the beginning of path is not that amusing but when you spawn it in random locations it seems like NPC is actually doing some work

Dave

yeh let me give an example

imgur.com/VjzU5 lets say the red building produces goods once an hour the walk time to purple is 30 seconds there and 30 seconds back... so if u log in at a random time.. lets say 1 hour : 35 seconds - then u shld see the npc walking back to RED at the correct tile

Liukas

@GustavoGtoknu what do you think about this? lwjgl.org/wiki/…

Gustavo - Gtoknu

7:53 PM

@Liukas Slick is a must :) and btw, if you're wishing to just make 2D games, go with Slick2D, it's a framework on top of LWJGL. should make things a looot easier for you.

thelinuxlich

go with XNA man

hahahahaha

Gajet

you don't need to do any calculations, you might see it going toward the blue tile or the red tile

it doesn't really matter which one

Gustavo - Gtoknu

@thelinuxlich I would say the same, but for some reason he wants to stick on Java lol

Gajet

all it matters is npc being somewhere on the road

Dave

but it has to be in sync to the timing of when my resource is increased

Liukas

7:54 PM

@GustavoGtoknu I will start play with 2D stuff, and then start developing 3D games :)

Dave

if the npc is walking to the purple and i already got the resource dropped it wont look like its in sync

or "live"

Gajet

now if you have to sync it, you have to put it in exact place

Dave

yeh

that was the idea

Gustavo - Gtoknu

@Liukas as @thelinuxlich said, for 2D stuff XNA is way better and easier, and more friendly and has much more features :)

Gajet

you said it takes 30 each way so you are storing the data about where the player should appear and you can draw it exactly where it should!

Damir

7:56 PM

@thelinuxlich You use MonoGame, right?

Dave

well 10 tiles to move on takes 3 seconds to move over by the npc

so 30 seconds is total journey time

thelinuxlich

@Damir a bit

@Damir just for testing things related to Artemis at the moment

Damir

Do you have an idea how's its 3D support?

thelinuxlich

at the moment they have it implemented in the "develop3d" branch on github

but it's "low level" you have to write your own stuff

Gustavo - Gtoknu

low level like XNA or low level like OpenGL/D3D?

thelinuxlich

7:59 PM

the latter

they use a tool to convert HLSL to GLSL

mojoshader

which apparently works very well

Gustavo - Gtoknu

I actually prefer .cg shaders :P

thelinuxlich

There is one successful 3D game launched with Monogame

Infinite Flight for iOS, google it

Gustavo - Gtoknu

available for iOS and WP7, let me take a look on the vids

thelinuxlich

ah, there is Armed! too

Gajet

8:17 PM

good night everyone

Dave

good night :)

Gustavo - Gtoknu

@Gajet Esenthel runs as a elephant walking on a string on my pc >.>

thelinuxlich

lol

@GustavoGtoknu it's enterprisey

Gustavo - Gtoknu

heavy editor

particularly the world editor

Gustavo - Gtoknu

8:40 PM

Interesting: software.intel.com/en-us/articles/vcsource

anyway, I'm out, cya guys :D

@CodeAssasssin you too, little tweak, good night :)

Gajet

9:03 PM

@GustavoGtoknu I didn't know elephants can walk on the strings! ;)

Bane

9:49 PM

HI everyone

Damir

Hello

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