English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room - 2011-04-25

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5:14 AM

I don't know what I would do if I were Tarantino. I think according to the law paparazzi has the right to film outside anyone they want to film, but I would definitely be pissed by the cameraman videotaping me without even asking for permission. A permission, of course, would not be legally required, but would be an act of politeness, which any normal person should do.

5:33 AM

So, since he wasn't polite enough as to merely ask for a simple permission - put it shortly, was rude toward me - I would also think up a way of how to be legally rude toward that cameraman.

Here we see that Tarantino struck the cameraman (twice, I think). To me it's not a good way of paying back to the rude cameraman as striking, as well as any act of physical aggression, is illegal and you can be easily persecuted for that.

A good way, I think, would be carrying a mace pepper spray always with you. In this way, if some paparazzi all of the sudden starts sticking his camera right in my face (just like here on this video), I would shout something like :"What is it? Is it a camera or a weapon? It looks like there is a handgun behind your camera! Are you trying to kill me?!" and than I would go ahead and spray him right in his face.

I see on YouTube somebody has already suggested it before me.

4 hours later…

Alain Pannetier

9:58 AM

@F'x
http://chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/879766#879766
I've noticed the discrepancy: Ubuntu 10.10 FF 3.6.16 shows the cross above.
WinXP FF4 shows the cross inside WinXP FF 3.6.15 shows the cross above.
In all cases Firebug says the first font in the font-family CSS attribute is 'Helvetica Neue'.
Wikipedia says the sign for earth should be **inside**.
See [here](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Earth_symbol.svg).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Earth_symbol.svg

1 hour later…

11:27 AM

Morning.

Sure, if you say so!

gravatar.com/avatar/…

Is that kinda getting dangerously close to a swastika?

The algorithm used to make these gravatars could conceivably produce a gammadion (swastika).

Well, except for the stupid nazis, there's nothing wrong with a swastika. Let us not let them have their way.

Yeah. The Nazis screwed up a lot of things. If you ever read (or have read) The Great Gatsby your eye has to be caught by a description of a tile floor of a building in New York that was decorated in swastikas. This would have been in the '20s. It was a common geometric pattern.

I saw a similar floor-tile design at an old drugstore in Chicago.

Take any Greek vase, it will have swastikas all over the place.

11:35 AM

Now the only place you see it is in jailhouse tats in the U.S.

user image

Apr 12 at 18:13, by RegDwight

@Martha Well, my screen says that I have provided 333 answers. Am I half Satan now or what?

Now that number is official. As in, excluding deleted answers.

Hm, another fake "+1" by pageman...

@RegDwight — Yes, you can be a half-assed Satan.

0

A: Meaning of "don't ask don't tell"

This would have been a good example of an answer to a recent question because it embodies the notion that, if we choose to not know about it, it doesn't exist. We might say, "I'm not so sure he's ADHD, but he's definitely DADT."

What's a "fake +1"?

OIC.

4

A: Word to refer to the person who creates something that gets reused or remixed?

progenitor An originator of a line of descent; a precursor. An originator; a founder: progenitors of the new music.

On these two answers, he commented "+1" without actually upvoting.

11:50 AM

It's possible he just doesn't get it. He seems clueless in other ways as well.

Yeah, but now he's been pointed into the right direction by Callithumpian and myself.

Христос воскресе, товарищи

Somehow I doubt that will make a difference.

did everyone enjoy their weekend?

Воистину воскресе!

11:52 AM

Hey, stop feeling so smug just because Atheism.SE died.

@Robusto Well, I'm watching him closely. He also provided that Tetris answer and that Twitter link to some Cupertino attorney.

Yeah, except for the fact that all the frickin' stores were closed here yesterday. It's un-American!

@Robusto that be true. easter is totally un-american. i have it on good word that it was invented by jews and pagans

I couldn't even buy a power strip. Hey, what about separation of Church and State? Whatever happened to that?

As if your wife doesn't take you shopping often enough.

11:54 AM

There weren't even any good sports on TV. A total bust.

man, sucks to be you

Here's some power strip for you.

21 hours ago, by F'x

user image

did anything interesting happen here over the weekend?

Yeah, but most of it got deleted.

@RegDwight — Yeah, but would they stay under your desk?

11:55 AM

hah

i just gave @Kosmonaut a star for his comment on syntax, because i feel exactly the same way

Remember that you can always have a Best-Of (and a Worst-Of) in the 10k tools.

Oh ... I thought he was talking about a "sin tax" ...

@JSBangs english.stackexchange.com/questions/22225/…

@RegDwight well, that's... comprehensive. i would actually love a tetris clone that referred to the play area as the зумпф

Also, if you click on that comment by Kosmonaut, it was actually starred because it marks the beginning of an interesting discussion about how language works etc.

22 hours ago, by RegDwight

He seems to just have typed "well" into an online dictionary, and quoted every single result.

22 hours ago, by RegDwight

"Spa town", "lawyers's places", "elevator shaft", "good", "stairway", "sump".

12:01 PM

I don't think he's deliberately spamming, though. I think he's more like a one-man blender site. He Googles something and core dumps the result. That's probably where he got the lawyer, too. "Never attribute to malice what may be adequately explained by ignorance or stupidity."

"..., but don't rule out malice."

Seriously though, I agree.

Oh, and @JSBangs, in other news I got serially downvoted by a six-year old Russian child who doesn't like owls.

lolz. seriously?

Starting here:

21 hours ago, by RegDwight

Hahaha, look at my rep report. I must have pissed someone off. http://english.stackexchange.com/users/300/regdwight?tab=reputation

{Obviously, the votes are gone now.}

BTW your very personal downvoter seems to behave.

Im in ur answerz fixing ur dashes cause them displays as -
-
for me.

that's because i wrote them as --

Illuminating!

12:12 PM

i sort of hoped in vain that markdown would transform -- into &emdash;

@RegDwight How do you know it was a 6-year-old Russian child?

@Robusto I asked.

If you click on that link, the Evil Perpetrator showed up here in chat immediately after that.

Em dash is made (on a PC) by holding down ALT and pressing "0151" on number pad.

Or —

Well, ToS kind of solves that problem.

—

Nope. It yields —

Not —

12:14 PM

Here in chat, yes.

BTW, on Mac it's as simple as Option-Shift hyphen.

I don't think you can type <a href="http://www.examples.com">this</a>, either.

On the main site, it works.

Can you type (this)[examples.com]?

Nope, not that either.

You've got the brackets mixed up.

It's [text](URL).

E.g., Robusto is evil

12:29 PM

Noted. And now I'm off to do my evil deeds. And go to work. Laterz.

CU.

I think I'll go watch TV and play with LEGO. A Hitchhikers's Guide is on.

have fun

i'll sit here all alone

though i see that @Kosmonaut just became active

asserted: Ctesias of Cnidus has the best name of any Greek author

12:48 PM

In English: kick the bucket

@logicbird what about it?

it means "die", if that's what you're asking

sorry hit enter to soon

in French: eat dandelions by the root

really? that's cool

in Danish: to take off the clogs

lol, danish fail. french win.

in romanian: to give <something> to the priest. that's a da ortul popii, but i don't actually know the literal meaning of ortul

the first dictionary i looked in didn't have it, either. but when i looked in the big dictionary i found it: ort - a quarter of a leu (Romanian unit of money)

the word is now v. rare outside of this expression

12:58 PM

so in other words, to pay the priest.

right

thats pretty good

Alain Pannetier

@JSBangs, chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/881357#881357

Given the value of a leu... that's hardly surprising !

Hello all !

I like the Romanian and French versions much better than "kick the bucket"

@AlainPannetier well, the new (revalued) leu is like $0.40

so an ort would be $0.10, which is at least a measurable quantity of money

they even have bani (pennies) now!

Alain Pannetier

1:04 PM

I missed that revaluation, I still have plenty of the post Ceaucescu banknotes and a lot of coins worth much more in weight of metal than their value.

I have banis of 1966 (my first trip there !, I was 5 !)

they revalued at 10,000 : 1 about three years ago

most romanians still refer to the old denominations. so when they say that something costs un milion de lei, they actually mean 100 RON

Alain Pannetier

RON ?

RON = lei noi, ROL = lei vechi

Alain Pannetier

So I guess now the popes can eek a living out of funerals at last. The Charon way I guess !

1:32 PM

@AlainPannetier — Popes can eek out a living? Isn't that carrying @Martha's meme just a little too far?

Monkeys eek out a living.

I'll be a monkey's uncle

@RegDwight english.stackexchange.com/questions/22573/…

2:00 PM

Can I have some opinions on whether this should be migrated to Programmers?

0

Q: What "Downstream/upstream design" means?

What "Downstream/upstream design" in software development means?

@RegDwight Yes, in my opinion.

Alain Pannetier

@Robusto, that wasn't intentional, please blame it on being a non native speaker. Although I'm afraid I won't be able to hide very long my inclination for the man who coined the "meme" term himself (Richard Dawkins).

@RegDwight — Totally. Migrate.

Alain Pannetier

@RegDwight, this question will probably have better answers in programmers.se indeed.

It can only be answered by specific technical jargon, and Prog.SE is a much better place to find that.

@AlainPannetier — Hey, don't be hatin' on me mate Richard Dawkins.

Alain Pannetier

2:03 PM

And they always complain about being the bin of SO, never from EL&S !!

Done. Thanks @all.

It's the thin edge of the wedge. After we complete enough probes we will start sending the death ships to Prog.SE! Oh wait, would that mean we have to reinstate vgv8?

Werbepause vorbei, I'm out again!

yesterday, by Robusto

I'm going to write a Stephen Hawking cookbook. I'll call it A Brief History of Thyme.

amazon.com/Brief-History-Rhyme-Greatest-Hits/dp/B00069YE70

Mar 4 at 13:31, by Robusto

Alain Pannetier

2:06 PM

I don't hate people, too costly.
As for RD, I've been following his works for some time now and although I don't share the need to stirrup these topics, I rather agree with the thesis.

@Robusto ha

@AlainPannetier "... stirrup these topics"? Interesting image.

Alain Pannetier

@Robusto, what I mean is that I love RD's "Selfish Gene" theory. It's such a eye opener on life. About 'preaching' atheism, I can see the point but there is no real hurry.
@F'x, did you reach a conclusion about your location

Hello.

Alain Pannetier

Hi Vitaly !

2:19 PM

Does any of the following sentences sound odd to you with regard to tenses, @Robusto?
1. I have finally realized that the earth was round.
2. I have always known that the earth was round.
3. I have often thought that the earth was round.

Here's what I would say:
1. I have finally realized that the earth is round.

OK, thanks.

2. I have always known that the earth is round.

3. I have often thought that the earth is round.

POSSIBLY: 3. I have often thought that the earth was round. (Might indicate that now I think it's flat.)

Huh. A paper I am currently reading claims that 1 is anomalous, whereas 2 and 3 are acceptable.

i find all three equally acceptable

2:22 PM

the author distinguishes the perfectives in 1, 2 and 3, calling them the resultative perfect, the universal perfect, and the existential perfect

oh well…

Well ...

@AlainPannetier my location?

Alain Pannetier

Planet Earth and the unicode codepoint that does not render correctly depending on the browser.

Change the sentence:
1. I've finally realized you are smart.
2. I've always known you were smart.
3. I've often thought you were smart.

actually, let me correct myself. the first is unusual, and I'd prefer @Robusto's formulation with is rather than was

2:24 PM

@AlainPannetier oh, there are two Earth symbols, so each font can draw the glyph as it wants

Alain Pannetier

@F'x wikipedia shows a cross inside !

but it's not unusual enough to jump out at mq

If I say "I've finally realized you were smart," it may mean you were smart once but maybe I don't think so now.

If I say "I've often thought you were smart," it means you may still be smart.

Alain Pannetier

I see. Made me realize that Windows does not have the Helvetica Neue font (cos Linotype does not give it away for free I guess).

@AlainPannetier and I have it, but only half of my browsers are smart enough to find it :(

2:26 PM

@AlainPannetier — Well, I'm glad my work here has not been in vain.

Alain Pannetier

@F'x Looks like FF4 can find it.
@Robusto. "my work" ?

Kidding.

Alain Pannetier

Are you the local Dawkins fan ?

In addition to Hawking I mean ;-)

Dawking

3:10 PM

@Kosmonaut: Someone just told me that the guy who wrote Perl was not a programmer but a linguist.

Larry Wall (born September 27, 1954) is a programmer and author, most widely known for his creation of the Perl programming language in 1987. Education Wall earned his bachelor's degree from Seattle Pacific University in 1976. While in graduate school at UC Berkeley, Wall and his wife were studying linguistics with the intention afterwards of finding an unwritten language, perhaps in Africa, and creating a writing system for it. They would then use this new writing system to translate various texts into the language, among them the Bible. Due to health reasons these plans were canceled,...

That's interesting.

I didn't know that.

Me either.

3:27 PM

Did backshifting exist in Old English?

I have no idea.

@Robusto that seems to be splitting hairs. obviously, if larry wall was able to program the implementation if perl, then he was a programmer, even if his training was linguistic

heck, my college education was in linguistics, but i'm a professional programmer

and my claim to fame is that for a while i went to church with Larry Wall's daughter, where we were friends and hung out in the same circles. i once met larry when he came by to visit his daughter and son-in-law

4:00 PM

OMG I know someone who knows someone who is related to someone famous!

I rule!

Mar 1 at 14:38, by RegDwight

The six degrees of Karl Theodor Maria Nikolaus Johann Jacob Philipp Franz Joseph Sylvester Freiherr von und zu Guttenberg!

woo!

4:15 PM

@JSBangs: and @RegDwight: Hi, Friends

Hi there.

hello

@RegDwight yes, I m here

@JSBangs Hello, How do you do

Sorry, wife calling.)))

@RegDwight: and @JSBangs: A Big Question, when you are saying one example , which is the right word to use , example or ForInstance

@RegDwight hmmm, go, no problem, take care

4:21 PM

Either "for example" or "for instance" is correct. there is little or no difference between them

"for example" is probably more common

12

Q: "For instance" vs "For example"

What is the difference in usage between for instance and for example? Are they just interchangeable? I suspect they are not strictly but cannot seem to find an authoritative explanation.

usage word-choice example

@RegDwight Nice Answer

@JSBangs: Thanks

@drachenstern: Hmm, Seeing you Here, Made me more JOy

Eh, how's that now? I have several places I lurk, easier for people to get ahold of me.

@drachenstern :)

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