The Nineteenth Byte

@RadvylfPrograms it says Hardware Virtualisation support. You can check exactly what CPUs have that on Intel's website: ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/search/…

Radvylf Programs

Looks like if you specifically look for xeon v4 you can find some cheaper ones

@pxeger Well of course it needs hardware virtualization support...it uses VMs. But it specifically wants processors from 2015 or later.

Ginger Industries

6 mins ago, by Ginger Industries

or get a gaming pc and use it as a server

Radvylf Programs

Not enough cores or RAM

Ginger Industries

what

how can running RTO possibly be more taxing than Microsoft Flight Simulator

Radvylf Programs

5:17 PM

My $100 used server has 24 GB of RAM

@GingerIndustries It's not, but if 10 people want to run some code at once, then it will be

Although I guess 8 cores and 8 GB of RAM probably would work in all honesty

pxeger

@RadvylfPrograms you can use VMs without hardware virtualisation support (just not very well)

Radvylf Programs

Why does that matter

pxeger

but I think the 2015 thing is a simplification of "this is when most CPUs started to have hardware virtualisation support"

Radvylf Programs

My current CPUs from 2009 have hardware virtualization support...

If that was the issue they wouldn't stress the 2015 part

pxeger

have you tested to see if it works?

Ginger Industries

5:19 PM

ninja'd

Radvylf Programs

Yes, and it works. But things can work fine and have security issues.

pxeger

did you read github.com/firecracker-microvm/firecracker/blob/main/docs/…?

Ginger Industries

the true test of rto will be lyxal

pxeger

and have you run tools/devtool checkenv, which apparently will check if your CPU hardware is good

Radvylf Programs

@pxeger Yes

> Firecracker is generally available on Intel x86_64, AMD x86_64 and ARM64 CPUs (starting from release v0.24) that offer hardware virtualization support, and that are released starting with 2015.

@pxeger I'll try that

pxeger

5:22 PM

yes I've read that, but it's the only reference to "2015" in the entire repo, and doesn't mention security as a reason not to trust CPUs before 2015

it says "generally available", which to me means "works"

and if it works, then it works

Radvylf Programs

@RadvylfPrograms Update: I don't actually think it did, looking through chat transcripts

Oh, it's kata I was thinking of that worked but broke lots of stuff

DLosc

@AviFS tinylisp is good, then (but none of my other esolangs are)

Radvylf Programs

Although IIRC it was firecracker-containerd I was messing around with, not vanilla firecracker

DLosc

@Bubbler Counterexample: biochemistry

@AidenChow A lot of LYALs turn out that way: decent amounts of interest for the first few hours, then not much after that. I, for one, got something out of it. :)

Radvylf Programs

@GingerIndustries Don't ruin my fun, I like shopping for extremely expensive server hardware I have no use for :p

I mean, just because I don't need 28 cores at 3.20 GHz and 256 GB of RAM now doesn't mean I won't later...

Ginger Industries

5:27 PM

._.

Radvylf Programs

I'm going to try to price up the most expensive possible rack server from Dell

I'm at over $200k lol

Ginger Industries

.___.

Radvylf Programs

5:43 PM

> Internal error while starting microVM: Failed to validate KVM support: Missing KVM capabilities: Xcrs

Ginger Industries

;-;

is all hope lost then

Radvylf Programs

There are approx. 10 relevant pages on google

None of which say anything about what "xcrs" is or why I wouldn't have it

Spinning up a $48/mo droplet for testing purposes to see if I run into this issue on it

Dang it, it's Ubuntu not Fedora :|

Radvylf Programs

6:24 PM

I have firecracker running on the droplet

pxeger

6:34 PM

Any feedback?

Unrelated String

looks quite good

actually maybe it's worth explaining how it works for k > 2, namely with how you can go from the k'th symbol around to the first symbol, but can't go more than one step forward or back (which i'm inferring from the test cases as it is currently)

Ginger Industries

@RadvylfPrograms nice

Unrelated String

the second bit is unsurprising but worth spelling out; the first is entirely non-obvious

mathcat

what's firecracker?

Unrelated String

though it does seem necessary once you actually think about it

mathcat

6:42 PM

is it something that sells domains?

Ginger Industries

It's virtualization software

(I think)

Radvylf Programs

it's sandboxing stuff

pxeger

@UnrelatedString that's not actually a requirement, it's just an artefact of the algorithm I was using to generate the outputs. I'll add a clarification, and also try and change the outputs so that doesn't happen in the test cases

Unrelated String

ah

so yeah that definitely does need to be part of the challenge text

Radvylf Programs

Oh man this brings back memories:

Ginger Industries

6:49 PM

Etch has decided that 1 + 2 = 1

Radvylf Programs

That's supposed to be a graph of 1 / x :p

Same issue the TI-83 has

emanresu A

Final feedback?

Ginger Industries

okay fixed it

@emanresuA I like this

pxeger

@UnrelatedString I'm assuming you meant N > 2 not k > 2

Unrelated String

...yeah

oops lol

New Posts

6:58 PM

0

Q: Laggy text editor

Your challenge is to write a program that constantly prompts for input, and when input is given, output that five seconds later. However, your program must continue prompting for input during that time. Since this is a bit confusing, here's a demo. <pre id=x></pre><input id=h onchange='var k=...

Bgil Midol

@GingerIndustries wat

pxeger

@UnrelatedString Is this better? codegolf.meta.stackexchange.com/a/24542

Unrelated String

yeah

could even say something to the effect of the symbols aren't in any inherent order but that probably wouldn't make it as clear

emanresu A

@NewPosts Just realised that I've pretty much disallowed most golflangs. Oh well.

Unrelated String

such is interactive

Ginger Industries

7:05 PM

It is time.

...

emanresu A

Has your pakidg arrived?

Ginger Industries

just wait

cmon

._.

It begins

🥁

0

Etch, 20 bytes New language! :D :out"Hello, World!";

Ginger Industries

7:09 PM

there it is!

emanresu A

\o/

caird coinheringaahing

CMP: Choose a natural number

emanresu A

4. Chosen by fair dice roll

Ginger Industries

47389147197438190481870431890473281904712804712974382109743281995868937240113295468437929028158924794317204074982976527539256239745734297432734

42

99019019

69420

42069

133742069

caird coinheringaahing

@GingerIndustries This will do nicely, thanks :P

Unrelated String

7:13 PM

01189998819991197253

Ginger Industries

@UnrelatedString !!!LEADING ZERO!!!

Unrelated String

makes it all the easier to remember

emanresu A

411188446874834624126195130271764383027785331029442817781794231815618544767850361512108233203803963130584914642374406210050759594466827074625145161213882969172227473016580255108700944889292943027062450676052395405119215521577202229612316316091884568033334825782957674569190499946125203467311176014357933095789298620301927910166575143550354236141229663480433269693739573633855260487769

o/

mathcat

@cairdcoinheringaahing 7

I aM ObSeSSed WiTH 7

Ginger Industries

@emanresuA 43728136382941748321971239823888888888888888800000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000002200000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000002200000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000002222127774743200000000004

^ the weight of Yo Momma, in tons

>>> input(None)
Nonek
'k'

dafuq

I'm going to go file an issue

Unrelated String

7:17 PM

what about

i would not expect it to behave any other way than that

Ginger Industries

._.

None is literally nothing

Unrelated String

unless you want it to error instead of stringifying None

Ginger Industries

There should just be no output

Unrelated String

why would they special case it to do that when you can just not pass in a prompt

or prompt with an empty string even

Ginger Industries

¯\_(ಠ_ಠ)_/¯

It just... feels wrong

Unrelated String

7:19 PM

None isn't some kind of nil

Ginger Industries

it IS

That's LITERALLY WHAT IT IS

Unrelated String

python's basic list type isn't linked; iirc it's some kind of dynamic array kind of deal but that doesn't even matter because you can't destructure it like a linked list

there's no basis for None to have any kind of identity with an empty sequence

Ginger Industries

2 mins ago, by Ginger Industries

It just... feels wrong

Unrelated String

you could use () ofc

of course () would print () for the prompt

but if you splat it it would be a roundabout way of not passing in a prompt at all

DLosc

Is the issue that the signature of input is supposedly (prompt=None, /)? Implying that passing None explicitly should work the same as passing no arguments?

Ginger Industries

7:25 PM

yES

DLosc

Hm. Python docs give the signature as input([prompt]), which doesn't imply anything about what the default value is

Unrelated String

the docstring is worded to make it pretty clear that there simply isn't a prompt if no prompt is given, but wait what the fuck if i run help(input) locally it gives the signature as input(prompt=None)

which is clearly not consistent with how it behaves

not sure why it would say that when the prompt is correctly shown as optional on the online docs

pxeger

> The prompt string, if given, is printed to standard output without a trailing newline before reading input.

This implies that by default, there is no outputting done

whereas if you passed the empty string, then the empty string would be output

Unrelated String

^

pxeger

which sounds like the same thing, but in the latter case, it still has to be checked that STDOUT is writeable

nope, even input() breaks when STDOUT is closed

ato.pxeger.com/…

Unrelated String

7:33 PM

amazing

pxeger

I might file a bug report about that

because it would be pretty useful to be able to use input() even when STDOUT is closed

Ginger Industries

:/

Unrelated String

yeah

pxeger

huh, it looks like it should work that way: github.com/python/cpython/blob/…

wait, I'm dumb

the I/O error was because I tried to print again

ato.pxeger.com/…

Unrelated String

...oh

oh yeah

Ginger Industries

7:43 PM

hey look at this 100% coherent and readable solution to the Gambling Alien problem:

s=:get;:split" ";:intify;;;:out:sum s;/2-:min s;<6;

DLosc

Looks like passing no argument is almost equivalent to passing an empty string, no?

pxeger

that's only when GNU readline isn't being used

so, when stdin is not a TTY (which is the case on ATO)

DLosc

Hm, okay

So to be perfectly accurate, there is no default argument, because passing no argument behaves differently from passing any Python object as an argument.

Since there's no way to pass a null pointer in Python.

pxeger

8:01 PM

@DLosc not in Python 3.11 ! docs.python.org/3.11/library/dis.html#opcode-PUSH_NULL

it's probably also possible in earlier versions with sufficient hackery

Radvylf Programs

Making lists of operator ideas feels way more boring and time consuming than it was for Ash

DLosc

@pxeger Lol, okay, fine :P

Ginger Industries

AST be like )])))])))])))]

Bgil Midol

yes

Ginger Industries

Updated alien solution using weird new syntax: s=::get;:split" ";:intify;;::out::sum s;/2-::min s;;

DLosc

8:36 PM

@GingerIndustries intify looks like infinity if I just glance at it

Seggan

8:49 PM

> Functional programming is clearly based on the idea of communism. It elevates functions (things that do the work) to first class citizens, and it is a utopian endeavor aimed at abolishing all states. It is seen as inefficient and unpopular, but always has die-hard defenders, mostly in academia. Besides, ML stands for Marxism-Leninism. Coincidence? I think not.

caird coinheringaahing

9:03 PM

@Seggan Fox News discovers Haskell :P

5

Radvylf Programs

Well, just sent an email to my school's principal, college and career counselor, and dean of instruction documenting all of the concerns my Latin II class has for the third time.

Ginger Industries

BREAKING NEWS: MINECRAFT MOVIE RELEASING TOMORROW

Radvylf Programs

This time, it's halfway to get them to respond, and halfway in preparation for a possible lawsuit

Ginger Industries

@RadvylfPrograms I did not know you could sue for that

Radvylf Programs

I don't think you can either

But you can certainly send scary legal threats to get them to listen to you

And sometimes it's not about the destination, it's about the bridges you burn along the way

3

caird coinheringaahing

9:22 PM

A beautiful sentiment :P

Ginger Industries

r/tnbquotes

Radvylf Programs

9:57 PM

RTO was gonna have some cool features :(

Like, the output box was going to be a lightweight terminal emulator

So colors could be outputted, in addition to using things like \r to update the existing text (since the output was streamed live)

Ginger Industries

what do you mean "was"

AviFS

@RadvylfPrograms You're here! Can I ask you about running start.rs?

Ginger Industries

@AviFS we have been doing a bunch of research on using Firecracker

conclusion: we'd need to pay 1-2k to get a server that can support it

Radvylf Programs

10:48 PM

@AviFS I'm on Discord now (just got home)

Ginger Industries

shame I don't have Discord

I just clicked the random language link on esolangs.org and landed on Jelly

Bgil Midol

11:03 PM

wow

DLosc

Had to happen sooner or later

New Posts

11:44 PM

0

Q: Crate art stacking

Your task is, given a array of numbers, that is strictly increasing, output the crate stack. The input is an array of positive integers which represents which layer has how many crates there are. So the first number is the top layer and so on. The sum of the array is the size of the crate. Since ...

code-golf ascii-art array

DialFrost

yikes 1 on my challenges is 1 vote away from getting me a silver badge

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