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6:09 AM
0
Q: FreeCell stack moving

l4m2Rule of FreeCell only allows to move one card each time, but it's possible to move a few using empty free cells and columns. Each time, one card can be moved to an empty free cell, an empty column, or a column which the top card is one larger than this one. We can see that these empty area allow ...

 
yes i hate ms teams
and onenote
why on earth cant you upload multiple pictures at once
 
"why on earth can't you" is pretty much Microsoft's motto
 
x = 1 ÷ (x-5)
find x² - 1 ÷ x²
^ how do i do that
ik x - 1÷x = 5
just i cant get x² + 1÷x²
 
6:24 AM
Sus
 
@Ausername bruh i submitted my exam
just this question i wanna know
 
Gimme a moment
This willk be images because mathjax
 
@PyGamer0 Plus or minus?
 
@Bubbler oops minus
 
x^2 - (1-x^2) or (x^2-1)/x^2?
 
6:31 AM
@Ausername given: x - 1 ÷ x = 5
find: x² - 1 ÷ x²
 
If order of operations applies, I'm assuming it's #1
Nvm
@Bubbler Big brain
I was working it out by hand
 
@Bubbler yooo i was kinda right
i feel a bit better ty
i didnt write the ± part
 
PyGamer I'll give you +50 on top of bubbler's 100 if you answer "enlarge ascii art" in K
 
Ooh - If I do, do I get the bounty?
 
6:36 AM
@PyGamer0 well x = (25 ± sqrt(29))/2
 
You're expected to plug in the quadratic formula and work out both solutions, or your teacher actually intended to write x^2+1/x^2 instead but made a typo
 
@Ausername go ahead
 
@lyxal Yeah I had that to
o
@Bubbler That's neat
 
@Bubbler nono we didnt learn quadratic its just simple expansions
 
6:37 AM
so then x ^ 2 = (54 ± 10sqrt(29)) / 4) (I think)
 
/4
You forgot to square denominator
 
yeah, I literally remembered and then forgot
2
 
and 54 not 44
 
hey I rushed it on paper using red pen what do you expect
 
Agreed
 
6:39 AM
There's a cheat in that specific kind of question: if x-1/x=n, x^2+(1/x^2) equals n^2+2
 
@Ausername I think what's important is that I had 25 + 10sqrt(29) + 29 for the numerator
 
@Razetime i dont have brains nor do i know K
 
@lyxal Yeah
 
@PyGamer0 you have written a golfing language by yourself, don't give me those excuses
4
 
It's oddly satisfying how
I understand why it works (Multiply top and bottom by 27 + 5√29)
But it's still satisfying
 
6:42 AM
(Also 27^2 and 25*29=(27-2)(27+2) are exactly 4 apart)
 
@Razetime bruh
 
@Ausername lol that's because that's how rationalising the denomiator works
 
@Razetime Is this my one or the old one
I'm assuming mine
 
whatcha mean
it's free for all
 
6:46 AM
My new ascii art or the old one
 
new one
 
ok
Be warned, it will probably come out like this monstrosity
 
Does anyone want to see some horribly drawn freehand graphs by me?
Because I've got a sample from my math workshop earlier today
 
@Razetime where is the tutorial for ngn/k?
 
I don't have graphs, but I have a lot of calculus homework if anyone wants it?
 
6:55 AM
sounds like such fun
 
@Ausername bruh ok lets see if my brain can solve the derivate of (insert long equaion here)
 
it's the same dialect so there isn't much difference
 
@Razetime uuuh its too hard
 
learning a new language is always difficult
would you like a proper introduction
 
6:59 AM
Ok, how do express strings?
 
@PyGamer0 you managed to include infix in your golfing language
you should be able to understand most of k
 
@Ausername where
 
Nvm
But how do you do take input
on TIO
 
@lyxal that was easy
 
Pattern matching?
 
7:01 AM
@Ausername there are input verbs
 
check if the next token is a number and process it
 
Which ones?
 
which aren't used much in golfing since most submissions tend to be functiosn
0: and 1:
I should document that in the K wiki tbh
 
@Razetime yes
 
@user I've made some changes to Scala and they're currently live on staging.ato.pxeger.com - can you test them and does anything more need to change?
 
7:11 AM
@PyGamer0 join the k tree chatroom
ngn is also online, so you can ask him questions
 
^ well that is a cool pattern
 
7:43 AM
@PyGamer0 Related: alphabet searchlight
 
 
1 hour later…
8:45 AM
hello all!
where are the busiest coding chat rooms these days?
 
Idk
 
Here, though we rarely do regular coding
 
:( it's not that busy here in terms of coding chat
there is reddit and discord but I have never got into either
a coding question. How can I round up in C? E.g. uint32_t num_passes = 128/bitwidth; when 128 is not divisible by the integer bitwidth
 
For that kind of question, please try googling and look into SO answers first
 
I think I found an answer in fact. Thanks
 
 
2 hours later…
10:43 AM
uuuhhhh was that actually a machine??
cause thats very cool
 
@PyGamer0 What do you mean by "a machine"?
 
@Adám a computer mechanism
that runs apl
 
He's using a cloud computer via a thin terminal.
 
@Adám ooh
 
"thin client" would have been the right term.
 
11:05 AM
The problem is I won't get my bounties for about a week
Because Pygamer has an active bounty (not for me), Razetime has to create/award , and then Bubbler has to create/award.
'night
 
11:21 AM
Glossary:
1975: typewriter terminal, time-sharing, mainframe
2021: thin client, cloud computing, data centre
 
11:47 AM
CMQ: What is your OS?
 
GNU+Linux
 
@pxeger so you use: “·Ãux?
 
windows 7
 
12:16 PM
CMC: What is your OS?
 
Windows 3.1 gang
 
ngn
@PyGamer0 freebsd and gnu+linux
@Adám why the dupe?
 
C≠Q
 
PyGamer0 is secretly an alt of adám?!
oh
oh nvm
way to ruin my epic joke
;p
 
ngn
@Ausername pretty sure k (and you) can do better
 
12:43 PM
@Adám Zsh: uname -o?
 
@lyxal no, adám is secretly an alt of PyGamer0
 
1:00 PM
@pxeger I guess.
 
@AaronMiller no i am the alt of कुछ भी नहीं
 
@PyGamer0 Ah, that's my bad. It's perfectly obvious now that I think about it.
 
@Adám msys2
@AaronMiller now what did google translate say ?
 
@PyGamer0 What language is that?
 
@Adám ///
 
1:09 PM
@Adám uhh didnt you ask what is my os?
 
@PyGamer0 but it was a CMC, so you need to provide code to output your OS
 
@PyGamer0 It says it's Hindi for "just nothing"
 
@pxeger oh
 
ngn
@Ausername i can do it in 64 bytes
 
@Adám winver in cmd
print("Windows 10") in python
 
1:12 PM
A bit boring. It should work on at least 2 of Windows, MacOS, Android, and Linux.
 
@lyxal maybe.
 
import platform;print(platform.system()) in python
 
@PyGamer0 cairdOS, where trying to do anything just starts a rant about Jelly :P
2
 
ngn
@PyGamer0 import platform as p;print(p.system()) is shorter
 
1:18 PM
I've unpinned the reminder about Community Ads now that they've been locked
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing is there an official download link for cairdOS?
 
ngn
@ngn or print(__import__('platform').system())
 
@PyGamer0 Yeah, give me your home address and I'll come and install it :P
 
ìòðÂØ is a programming language language
^ CC: Decipher that
@cairdcoinheringaahing latitude: 73.444555666N Longitude: 79.1111111111E
now gimme the os
 
@PyGamer0 Be there in a week :P
 
1:21 PM
@cairdcoinheringaahing ok i will be waiting :p
CC: ìòðÂØ is a programming language. Decipher ìòðÂØ
 
@pxeger Thanks, it seems to be working almost perfectly! There's a couple weird things: it appears to be run as a worksheet when there isn't a main method (which is a great feature as long as it's intended), and it's a bit slow (which might be because it uses sbt instead of scala directly). I'll look into the latter, but this is amazing. Thanks again
 
@user yes it's intended; it basically just runs scala <code_file>, and scala tries to guess what kind of file you want. You can add -howtorun=script or whatever to the Options to force it to change behaviour.
 
@AaronMiller uuuh haha no
 
@pxeger Nice
 
1:34 PM
@AaronMiller it is 5 chars long
i didnt use jelly compression
 
@PyGamer0 51AC8?
 
@user and I don't think there's much I can do about it being slow; it's similarly slow on my desktop computer so I think it's just compiler and JVM overhead
 
@AaronMiller no
 
@AaronMiller That's the same as “ðØ» btw: tio.run/##y0rNyan8//9Rw5zDGw7POLT7/38A
 
@user I don't think it's using sbt, but I know very little about scala so I'm not sure lol
 
1:35 PM
@cairdcoinheringaahing O yeah, the unrecognized characters just get ignored, right?
 
@AaronMiller Yeah
 
@pxeger Probably, yeah, but it runs relatively quickly in Scastie once it's warmed up ⍨
 
@user maybe Scastie is using sbt server to have it already intialised? idk
I don't think it's really possible to get ATO to use sbt server though
 
@pxeger No, I was wrong, I didn't actually look at the code :P
 
1:37 PM
I approve of this message ;p
 
@AaronMiller and thats the answer
 
@lyxal no, how many times do I have to tell you!? Vyxal bad because bad!
 
@PyGamer0 Vyxal?
 
@pxeger don't make me special case your opinions on the contributing guide ;p
 
There is no because here :P
Vyxal bad! <- that's the entire statement here
 
1:39 PM
@AaronMiller yes
 
Vyxal minus the flags is good. Vyxal + flags + lyxal's reasoning for the flags and what they'd do if flag scoring was changed is bad.
 
Meh, some flags, like the one that pushes 100, are kinda sus, but the rest are okay
 
@RedwolfPrograms I ask that you follow our contributing.md guide when making complaints: github.com/Vyxal/Vyxal/blob/fresh-beginnings/documents/…
 
It feels more like a joke language when the creator is threatening to turn it into MGS, except that it actually has a following because it's (supposed to be) a normal golfing language
 
They're good for languages with strict I/O requirements, and they make it easier to change behavior instead of having different builtins for slightly different functionality
 
1:42 PM
That should be an interpreter feature, not a language feature
Making it a language feature lets you cheat on kolmos with the same flags that are good for I/O stuff
 
@lyxal Btw, I just deleted the parser branch. That's alright, right?
 
@user that's fine
the lexer branch can probably also go too
 
Parsing? In a stack-based golfing language?
 
lmao
 
Yeah, for loops and lambdas and strings and stuff
 
1:45 PM
> Figure out how to actually report security exploits
 
Oh yeah, lemme delete security-policy too
 
I'd suggest having an email address (e.g. security@vyxal.com) that you can allow people to email if they do
 
tbf, Vyxal could work with just an interpreter that parses at runtime, but it isn't interpreted so that's not really possible
 
hyper said have a lexer so we have a lexer
 
vyxal_security@pxeger.com
 
1:46 PM
I actually wanna make an interpreter for Vyxal, but it'll use the parser
 
@lyxal if hyper told you to jump off a cliff, would you do it?!
 
I'd suggest updating the contribution file then :P
 
@pxeger depends
 
@pxeger Yes, otherwise he'd flag-nuke me :P
 
would you rather be flag-nuked, or die a painful death at the base of a cliff?
 
1:47 PM
@pxeger is hyper also jumping off the cliff? Why is hyper telling me to jump off a cliff? Will I get 69 stars in TNB if I do?
see all the questions that have to be answered?
 
@pxeger Die a painful death :P
 
 
flag-nuking loses 100 rep, dying doesn't :P
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing arguably, dying loses you all your rep
 
Not if you come back and ask the mods to give you back your account :P
 
1:48 PM
No, i'm just as reputable as a splatter at the base of a cliff
 
@pxeger If I die, my account will live on with just under 40k rep :P
 
but you no longer have the account
 
@pxeger After hyper became an AI, he merged with his bot account
 
so you no longer have the rep
 
@pxeger What does it mean to "have" something?
 
1:49 PM
oh boy, let's not get too philosophical
 
caird will move to the Soviet Union where they'll safekeep it for him
 
Control of my CGCC account isn't in my non-existent will, so does that mean the UK government gets my account after I die? Does it go to my next-of-kin? Who knows? :P
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing Patch gets it, ofc
 
Ok, time to write a will just so that I can ensure Patch gets it :P
 
Since Patch is a minor, you can let me hold it for him until he's 18 :P
 
1:52 PM
My laptop battery is at 16%, I'm way too tired to stay up and I can't be bothered to do anything about it. So in the wise words of @VyxalBot, o/
 
∘/
 
Um, what happened to your head?
 
don't ask questions
 
ngn
1:56 PM
@user the whole body's missing and you're worried about a head..
 
Redwolf and I are missing that too, nothing odd about that :P
 
> o/
> ∘/
confirmed: Redwolf is bigger brain than user
and caird has no brain
 
@pxeger No, what's confirmed is that Redwolf's head is full of air /s
 
that sounds like something a small brain person would say
 
@pxeger caird's brain is currently hard at work sending packets across the world :P
 
ngn
1:58 PM
@user ah, there it is - to the left of "/", looks like a dog's head
 
@pxeger Yes, my brain uses the latest processors, whereas Redwolf uses vacuum tubes :P
 
You know for sure that I have a head cause I have a hat, duh
 
@ngn Never thought caird was a chimera
 
was?
caird still is a chimera!
 
Oh right, hyper hasn't told them to jump off a cliff yet :P
 
2:03 PM
@pxeger I support this message
 
tbh you probably are bigger brained than me lol
 
Everything's bigger in Texas :P
 
How to become a rich Texan:
1. Travel outside Texas (probably the hardest step given how big Texas is)
2. Buy fruits
3. Go back to texas to make food bigger
4. Sell at profit
5. ???
 
How to travel outside Texas as a Texan:
1. Become rich so you can afford to drive that far
 
This is like Interstellar lol
How to save humanity:
1. Save humanity so you can make a wormhole to save humanity
 
2:20 PM
lets say i have a vector in numpy; how do i reshape it like apl's reshape
 
@PyGamer0 The danger of learning APL: You get frustrated when using other languages.
 
ok so i guess my main language is now apl :p
 
@PyGamer0 Did you try searching for "numpy reshape"?
 
@Adám do you always have your apl keyboard enabled?
 
Yes. I don't have any other keyboard layout available.
 
ngn
2:28 PM
@PyGamer0 suggested username: APLamer1 :)
 
(def grid(
(return (reshape x,x (
range (* x 2))))
))
 
Is that lisp?
Looks like some cursed mixture of lisp and Python
 
@user no i am trying to make lisp
 
Ah
You might want to take a look at Hy
 
thats the idea so far
 
2:35 PM
@PyGamer0 ,⍨⍴∘⍳×⍨ in APL.
 
@Adám {⍵ ⍵ ⍴ ⍳ ⍵*2} alternative apl
yes i meant to put ** instead of *
 
@PyGamer0 btw, return sounds very odd for a lisp. If you're going for functional programming, I'd recommend having the last expression be returned implicitly, like in Scala
 
@user ok
like rust
 
Kinda, yeah
Also, x,x would probably be something like (list x x)
 
2:38 PM
@PyGamer0 i.@,~ in J.
 
is there some lisp code i can look at to see the syntax?
(def grid(
    (reshape x,x (range (** x 2))
))
@user ^ like that?
 
Racket is a nice language that'll help you both learn Lisp and make your own
@PyGamer0 Pretty much, yeah
 
i have also seen a book on making a lisp in c
 
(def grid
    (reshape (list x) (range (** x 2))))
 
Idea: Lisp + Python + APLish language
 
2:42 PM
Take out the Python and replace it with Scala and you'll have an amazing language :P
 
@PyGamer0 K is kind of Lisp + APL, or maybe what Lisp would have been if it was ever finished.
 
M-expressions?
 
Yes.
 
@user idk scala
 
2:44 PM
also how do i parse it
 
I mostly meant adding implicits (and returning proofs, which isn't a Scala thing but would be amazing)
@PyGamer0 Racket makes it somewhat easy to make new languages
 
yes but lets see how far can i go with the lexer before i give up
@user are you being sponsored by racket :p
 
I am an AI written in Racket No, I don't even know it very well, just suggesting a good tool
 
ok
 
2:49 PM
@RedwolfPrograms But at what point do you draw the line?
 
For what?
 
For which flags are okay and which are not?
 
Whether or not they're interpreter flags
 
> If you use that interpreter behavior, even without a flag, to cast that data structure to a string output for something like a kolmogorov complexity challenge, I'd consider it cheating
Like Jelly's smash printing? That's a interpreter behaviour which deliberately modifies the output representation, and is often very useful in fixed-output challenges
 
@RedwolfPrograms Would you call a flag that joins the output on newlines an interpreter flag or a behavior flag?
 
2:51 PM
@user Depends on how it's used
A flag is not good or bad on its own
 
The line isn't very clear, and I don't think we should go around making guidelines for them
 
I'm not making a guideline, I'm just defining terms I use in my opinions
 
Rather, let's just depend on people to not upvote "cheaty" answers like that. If someone says, "Ha, I beat your Vyxal answer using all of these flags," we call them out. That's all we need to do
 
> There is one exception, which is if the language specification specifically states how the [data structure] will be cast to a string, and requires that it is done when outputting. In this case, you would only ever be able to use the language for challenges which accept that format of string as output, and you can no longer claim that string is a [data structure].
@user Of course, that's exactly what I'm going to do
This is just my opinions on flags, I'm not trying to push for any sort of change in the rules
 
@RedwolfPrograms Smash-printing doesn't convert to a string. If you print halfway through a program, it'll still smash-print, but the original data structure will be returned
 
2:53 PM
I too dislike Vyxal's FizzBuzz-related flags, and I give answers negative points when considering whether or not to upvote them
 
> However, I'm sure most people reading this are aware of a specific language which has prompted me to write this.
Hey, Add++'s flags are perfectly fine! :P
 
@RedwolfPrograms Oh ok, I thought you were going to write a meta post to change the consensus
 
No, we've discussed it before and it wouldn't even affect Vyxal anyway
> if they weren't flags, they'd be different github branches
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing Back off Scala! You can't stop me from using -language:postfixOps :P
 
@user I demand the right to use Verbosity's --pleaseDisableVerboseModeSoICanGolfMyProgram flag :P
brb, adding that to Verbosity :P
 
2:55 PM
@RedwolfPrograms Not really, the changes in behavior are often really, really minor. A branch isn't the right place for different behavior anyway, flags or not
 
That's a direct quote from lyxal
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing Wait, so there's a non-verbose mode?
@RedwolfPrograms No offense @lyxal, but some of your flag policies are crazy
:P
 
@user No, but there's nothing stopping you from using that flag :P
 
Lyxal has stated more than once that if flag scoring was changed, they would make a ton of Vyxal offshoots that each have a permutation of the flags built in. Basically like MGS.
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing >: {
 
2:57 PM
Or, I should make that a required flag, and it complains about programs being too short if you don';t have it :P
 
@RedwolfPrograms I remember lyxal mentioning that, but I can't find it now :/
 
ಠ_ಠ Minecraft needs vertical slabs
 
I remember it too, even the conversation it was in, but searching the transcripts brings up nothing :/
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing Why make it a flag when you can make it a pragma included in the byte count? :P
@RedwolfPrograms Can't find it in TNB or Vyxal. Damn chat
 

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