Is it worth flagging an answer as invalid on a closed question?

so you know how clicking the inbox icon before the site has loaded fully brings you to the network inbox?

yeah it's especially annoying because SO teams notifications don't show up there

Yes, I made a script yesterday to fix that

it just makes it do nothing before the page fully loads

both notifications and rep gain / teams badges don't show up when you're on your own network profile

i wonder if this is a bug

they also don't seem to be visible from chat.SE

@RedwolfPrograms I'd say yes, unless the question will be roomba'd soon

is there a userscript to identify when something is about to be roomba'd?

Yep, lemme just find it

roombaforecast.user.js here

thanks

Hmm. I just edited the tags for this and it doesn't look like it bumped it

well while it's deleted it won't be bumped

Inbox Interrupt: Script that prevents clicking inbox/achievements before they're fully loaded from taking you to a different page

nice

@hyper-neutrino Didn't you do a test a while back about deleting, editing and undeleting a challenge, and it still bumped it?

@cairdcoinheringaahing yes but it needs to be undeleted

Undeleting's probably what bumped it

unless you're searching deleted:1 in which case that's interesting to know

i don't think undeleting alone bumps, but it won't show on the front of "active" if it's deleted

Undeleting doesn't bump tho. I guess it just "retro-bumps" if edited

That's interesting

well, the front page just shows what's most recently active and eligible to be shown (score > -4, undeleted, I think)

you should be able to give partial upvotes

TBF tho, you can't edit deleted questions (aside from tags), so unless you just silently undelete a post without editing it, its unlikely to be noticed

@pxeger Why?

I want to be able to give partial downvotes

I want to upvote every interesting answer to my question, because they're interesting, but I want to be able to upvote Arnauld's clever formula more

To get -0.69 rep

Just get -69 rep instead :P

well you can (sort of) give multi-upvotes so i guess you could do that (i mean bounties in case it was unclear)

Start a +50 bounty, then downvote 19 answers :P

@cairdcoinheringaahing I thought they were dog

My life has been a lie

I have a bit of an odd idea: A script that lets you use your remaining votes at the end of the day to vote for specific answers nominated by other people. When you do that, you get a fraction of a nomination for each vote you cast. So if you notice an answer you like, you can nominate it and it'd get lots more votes. Users would still select which nominated posts their votes go toward, so it wouldn't just be voting fraud with extra steps. Opinions? (Won't actually do it but it's a cool concept)

I think that sounds interesting, maybe a similar thing could be to have an answer/answers of the day/week? Highlight potentially overlooked answers to questions that are notable

I mean you basically get the equivalent of a free +400 bounty per day to divide up as you please, but there's no easy way to quickly determine which posts are impressive enough to deserve it

This might not be that bad of an idea

Something like "frequent voter miles" :p

TBH, sounds like an abuse of the SE system again, but I could get behind this :P if distributed voting like this is agreed on by the community and not disallowed by TOS (don't think it should be, since you're just making a decision on how to use your legitimate votes) this could be fine

mod abuse !11!1

I think automating it so that the user just hands control over to the script would definitely be questionable, but a system that just shows you posts people nominate (with some other features) doesn't seem at all bad

@RedwolfPrograms So long as you can't nominate your own posts, that should be "fine" according to the ToS

@RedwolfPrograms I mean, at that point, it's just a "get more attention to underrated posts" project with extra steps :P

which I support

A better alternative would be to allow users to nominate posts that they believe deserve votes (e.g. on a meta question) and people who want to spend their remaining votes can visit that and take a look

That has a high barrier to nominate though

Or vote

You have to take a non-trivial amount of time to answer and/or read answers

Ok

Yeah, I don;t support a system that doesn't require a non-trivial amount of time to read answers to vote on

what is the ToS

Terms of Service

Top of Stack

Is it the top of stack or terms of service

@StackMeter stackoverflow.com/legal/terms-of-service

I see

@cairdcoinheringaahing There shouldn't be any more time required than to read the answer itself

ToS = Jon Skeet, obviously

Thanks @hyper-neutrino

i don't remember all of it but I have read through the entire thing. probably unlike most users tbh xD

decided when I became a mod that i should probably fully read and understand all of the ToS and CoC first

Having to track down the post, scroll past ones you've already seen, etc. takes a non-trivial amount of time, and is enough of a barrier to be discouraging

@RedwolfPrograms Yeah. Nominations would be in the form "<Link to post> <Optional short reason why it deserves votes>"

@hyper-neutrino The legalese is dense :(

> Please read these Public Network Terms carefully before accessing or using the public Network.

Yes. This. I have done this. 100%

I don' think the short reason should be optional - a few words should be good

Being able to just open a page or pop-up thing that shows the answer and maybe an upvote and skip button would be nice. You can just click it, vote if you like it, and move on.

@cairdcoinheringaahing yeah :/ the CoC is actually pretty understandable IMO. the TOS is a bit intimidating though

I hate that so many companies do this (make important stuff long and hard to read for normal people)

when signing up for a TD bank account they sent me a pdf with like over 60 pages of legal stuff and i was like

It's an understandable by product of the courts tho

yeah i have things to do within the next three months, so no

having full legal text and then understandable approximations for the public to understand is good IMO because otherwise you have people reading nothing

I'd rather it be unnecessary, but it's only to protect their asses when someone does something that actually needs to be dealt with

@cairdcoinheringaahing Yeah I understand they have to take precautions, but i wish they made understandable summaries :(

> If you are located within the European Union, you must be at least 16 years old to access or use the Network or Services

but i guess this does free SE from legal trouble; if they release a formal version and a not-really-complete version, a case could be made that they failed to inform someone of the legal details

This might be the only pro of Brexit :P

I have to sign a contract soon and it has a lot of stuff in it

@cairdcoinheringaahing Not like anyone's checking how old you are /shrug

@user Unless you're a mod

I guess so

or HN's old account

Well that was HN's fault for letting people know about it :P

i wasn't asked to prove my age, though i would if SE required it, probably because even SE doesn't actually technically know who I am (or have to, at least); requiring proof of age breaks the anonymity that SE supports

@user By which I mean you have to be 18 or older

@rak1507 Congratulations btw

@user what, that I was already 14 (almost 15) at the time?

But they don't ask for proof, just you to confirm that you are

@user lol thanks

@hyper-neutrino That you weren't old enough when you made the account

Meaning that, in at least one aspect, it is just as easy to moderate an SE network as it is to watch porn :P

Or did they somehow find out without you telling them?

@user that isn't bannable though

Oh

if a user was underage when creating their account but it wasn't discovered, and later it's revealed, nothing is done about it

the thing is SE doesn't remove underage accounts because they hate children

They just hate lawsuits

Except you were unlucky enough to get deleted

they do it because they like following the law (in theory) and they don't want to violate COPPA

> they like following the law

so if you're currently underage, they are not legally permitted to store your PII, so they just nuke everything about you

Also they hate fun

@RedwolfPrograms Can't relate

ಠ_ಠ

@cairdcoinheringaahing both of those things do involve self gratification :P

@rak1507 I get the feeling that some mods might disagree :P

@cairdcoinheringaahing I don't think you need to be 18 for the latter (Kids, don't try this at home)

HN, are you meeting these very high standards ^?

@user You do if the company that provides the porn is in the US (or other countries with an age limit of 18, such as the UK)

Ironically, you can have sex at 16 here, but if you film it, that's child porn

@cairdcoinheringaahing I thought that was just the UK

@cairdcoinheringaahing kinda makes sense in a way

if they made it so you could legally film it at 16 every shady company in the world would immediately flock to the UK for production

@RedwolfPrograms I believe companies such as pornhub are based in the US, and they "require" you to be 18

the ability to watch porn is probably considered free speech in the US, so there's no age limimt

@pxeger I doubt it

The US is not bad at all as far as free speech is concerned, but for children, there's some extra restrictions

@pxeger Free speech does not cover everything, and is often very restrictive in some areas in the US

^

Plus, I don't think watching stuff is free speech

But producing it could be

> You affirm that you are at least 18 years of age or the age of majority in the jurisdiction you are accessing the Website from

From the Pornhub ToS, which is not NSFW

@RedwolfPrograms I guess, but books can be censored too

But I do think free speech in the US is weirdly overreaching. Like in the UK, it's illegal to lie as a politician, but it isn't in the US

Yeah, there isn't enough accountability

The solution is to have the uh...actors talk about current events then have it fall under freedom of the press :p

But, they also have:

> If you are under 18 or the applicable age of majority, please do not use the Website

@pxeger it's illegal to lie as a politician?! yeah, sure

So they asked nicely :P

that's like telling a builder it's illegal to build things, lying is section 1 of the job description :P

CMC: Things to say to easily change the topic of any conversation

Does please do [xyz] have any consequences in a legal document? Seems much more ambiguous than most legalese.

Yeah, that sounds pretty informal. Maybe just do [xyz], as [abc] is illegal by ...

How did we go from voting userscripts to p*rn so quickly lol

@user Any help?

@user i will neither confirm nor deny anything given that i spent like probably more than 50% of my day on SE it's impossible for that to be false

this is the 3rd time ph has been mentioned in this chat room (counting both messages together)

@hyper-neutrino doesn't mean you can't do two things at once

ಠ_ಠ

you know i was thinking that too. i just didn't want to say it. some things don't need to be said.

Its interesting that its the Americans trying to change the subject :P

Who else regrets the lack of support for i386 architectures?

@cairdcoinheringaahing I'm Indian, we're all prudes

@hyper-neutrino However, "porn" is in 77 messages

@user nope. AMD64 is love, AMD64 is life

Um. What?

@pxeger How can you be so insensitive to the needs of those who are using 8 year old laptops? >(

@user I don't know what those are. All I know is my gut says maybe

@cairdcoinheringaahing Even with context there is not enough context for that lol

@cairdcoinheringaahing I think I meant to say i386 processors. They're 32 bit, so no one builds binaries for them these days :(

@cairdcoinheringaahing I agree with aditsu, but why did that need to be said?

because optimizer was petitioning for helka to produce porn videos

now why did that happen? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Because optimizer is just... idek

Hmmmm

lol

@cairdcoinheringaahing Let me guess, it's that site?

it's a very typical popular video hosting site, of course

@user No, it's an UX.SE answer

oh, if you mean the link, yeah it's just to UX.SE

No, I meant the screenshot, but you've confirmed my suspicions

CMQ: What's the difference between i386 and i686?

you know i haven't seen many sites that use orange as its highlight/theme color, i think. at least i can't think of many examples

@user one has a 3 in it

Stack Overflow

@hyper-neutrino dyalog.com

oh nice

@rak1507 Oh wow, never would've noticed that. It all makes sense now!

@user What's the difference honestly

@user happy to help

@user oh yeah.. lol, forgot about that because there isn't much orange on the site (i think)

@RedwolfPrograms Between so and ... ph? Um

Mostly low quality content, and you lose interest once you get what you need

lol

other than the top bar and the sidebox (i guess) there isn't really much orange so i forgot about that :p

@RedwolfPrograms This is why you should learn Scala, it's got a vibrant community with high quality...um, answers

@hyper-neutrino On the active questions page, it's all orange

@hyper-neutrino magento.com

Also, just as a bit of a warning, be careful when linking to things like the ToS of that site because if it's a link to an image by accident it could onebox and cause people to involuntarily connect to ph over school or work networks

@user One of them has a toxic parent company that doesn't support the content creators, and the other one is PornHub

@Adám I expected magenta

is my theme just wrong or smth lol

@user Yeah, that makes no sense.

@hyper-neutrino Try the questions page maybe? I distinctly remember lots of orange

oh yeah magento.SE is also significantly more orange, by extension :p

@user nope, not really lol. even in incognito

enough that i can tell the theme is orange but not enough that it looks like a significantly orange site

Guess you're right

I guess code golf is orange with the SO css then?

wait you put the SO css on CGCC? or wdym

also maybe it's an older version? idk ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

To get dark theme

@hyper-neutrino Yeah that might be it

stackoverflow.blog has quite a lot of orange too.

You're right, he CSS is out of date

ah

@user Looks like talking about orange is a good approach

BTW, in about 40m can somebody remind me I need to go get something before I leave school?

You need to go get something before you leave school

(I know y'all won't, but telling someone to remind you to do something is very effective at getting you to remember to do something in my experience :p)

Indeed it is very effective, I just reminded you

The next month will be boring

github.com/jezen/is-thirteen

Seems like a useful library

I love how there's so many JS libraries that do trivial stuff like checking if something's even

Looks like this one actually required a little effort though

We need more leftpad incidents

I guarantee you it takes twice as long to search NPM for some trivial function than it does to write it yourself

(o,l,p)=>{for(var i=0;i<l-o.length;i++)o+=p[i%p.length];return o}

That is a very ugly mix of golfed code and safe JS

@hyper-neutrino That's so last-year. Now, from the people that brought you the amazing is-thirteen… [drum roll] it is out honour and pleasure to present… is-fourteen ― now with even bigger integers!

woah :o

My new project, is, generalizes that to any number between thirteen and fourteen!!!

Wow, I can't even begin to comprehend the amount of work that must have gone into that and the complexity of the algorithms used!

> Well, f*** it. We're going to fifteen.

github.com/jezen/is-thirteen/issues/726

> I don't care about the emotions of snowflakes- there are widely used libraries used in production software that depend on this library. Remove this and the internet will come to a halt.

Tbf, they could add a paid subscription tier.

it should include a warning that the product is unsafe for triskaidekaphobiacs

That makes sense - get quicker patches, fewer errors, better error reporting

@ngn On the contrary, it's essential for triskaidekaphobiacs to identify potentially harmful numbers and avoid/eliminate them

I think there's a business to be made here: How about SAAS? is-thirteen.com?value=<val>

I'm just surprised by impact on the performance of my application. I was previously using a for loop to iterate over every number that's not thirteen, and yet this program is somehow even faster than that.

CMC: A generator function (or list of some sort) that produces every float64 other than 13

@RedwolfPrograms your cpu probably supports the avx13 instruction

@RedwolfPrograms It uses a highly optimized heuristic algorithm (and caching helps too). The implementation is terribly complex, I wouldn't recommend trying to understand it

function*not_thirteen(){for(i=0n;i<2n**64n;i++)if((n=new Float64Array(new BigUint64Array([i]).buffer))!=13)yield n}

What does the asterisk do? (the first one)

Generator function

Oh cool

JS's generator functions are very odd

@RedwolfPrograms In 17 minutes, you need to go get something before you leave school :P

Thanks :p

I just discovered something interesting

function *generator() { console.log(yield) } is valid JS

I dislike that

What does that even do?

Guess

Prints undefined?

Yep, but only after you call .next() twice

Or throws an error becase yield is undefined?

@RedwolfPrograms Wait, what does it do the first time?

Yields undefined

Wow

So [...generator()] is [undefined] and logs undefined, but generator.next().value is undefined but doesn't log anything

That could actually be a neat concept for a game sort of thing

Keep calling .next(), but if you do it one too many times it throws an error and you lose

SyntaxError in Python

@hyper-neutrino If and when I become a mod, then I will read the ToS and CoC in full

You should probably read the CoC anyway

The ToS isn't quite as important though

I did

Just don't be a horrible person, and post actually good content

I don't think I've read the updated CoC, but I abide by SE's old #1 rule: be nice

^^ We need more of this and less 20 page documents

I wish they'd kept "assume good intent"

The ToS should be golfed

That's a very useful rule

@cairdcoinheringaahing Does it actually say that?

No, but it did

@cairdcoinheringaahing that's probably the only thing you need to know

@Adám had you read it when you accused me of violating it?

The #1 rule on SE used to be "Be Nice", with #2 and #3 being "Assume good intent" and "Follow the rules of the site"

@ngn Yes. I read it when I considered running for moderator.

That's literally all you need to know to do well on this site

@Adám do you still claim i was attacking you personally?

ToS golfed

@ngn let's not

that's not the ToS

And, honestly, that's what I prioritise more over any CoC they could possibly release, and I'd rather interact with someone doing the same. Perhaps have #4: "Be respectful", but otherwise ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

TopAnswers in contrast.

@StackMeter no. let's!

@ngn If you and @Adám would like to discuss this, please do it elsewhere

@ngn it's 9:55 I cba with an argument

Feel free to discuss this elsewhere but let's not do this in TNB and I don't think this is something you should involve yourself in regardless.

And, please do it in good faith. Regardless of past history, we should treat each other as we'd like to be treated, and that generally doesn't include calling people out for potentially poor behaviour in public

@cairdcoinheringaahing we have

Ok

@ngn I have only a vague idea what this is about (and I don't want to know more), but: this is between you and Adám. Unless you are both comfortable with discussing that in public, you absolutely should not have that conversation here, and you should only have it in the first place if both of you are happy to do so. You are more than welcome to invite Adám to discuss this elsewhere, and he's more than welcome to ignore that invitation if he wants.

But I'll leave that up to the two of you; you're both adults, I'm sure you can sort it out

@RedwolfPrograms it's been 40 minutes since 40 minutes ago

@RedwolfPrograms You need to go get something before you leave school 2 minutes ago :)

@cairdcoinheringaahing an accusation of violating the ToS is not something only between two users, it's an explicit involvement of SE as a party too. that's the problem.

@cairdcoinheringaahing also, if there's no consequence for abusing the ToS for threats like this (even if that consequence is just publicly mentioning it), it's an invitation to continue abusing it

@ngn Then feel free to bring it up with SE. You can custom flag for a moderator to escalate it to staff if they feel it necessary, and staff can sort this out if so. Or, you can use the Contact Us form at the bottom of most SE pages. Regardless, TNB is not the right place to have that conversation

@cairdcoinheringaahing will do if it happens again

@hyper-neutrino Interesting. SE is a "Delaware" company, yet are located pretty much everywhere other than Delaware

They have offices in New York and London, have remote workers across the globe, have their servers in New Jersey and Colorado, but are a "Delaware company"

interesting

Bet you its something to do with taxes

corporations having suspicious or unexpected locations is usually to do with that probably :D

There is a special Circuit Court in Delaware specially for corporate cases apparently

> Instead, Delaware corporations can expect their legal disputes to be addressed promptly and expertly by judges who specialize in corporate law.

oh that's cool

Q: If I choose a number at random, is it more likely to be prime, or an even number between 21 and 33?

I believe, prime, but I'm never sure with probability and infinities

VTC as unclear: define "choose a number a random"

What are the bounds n this number?

Any positive integer

@cairdcoinheringaahing you can't choose uniformly at random from the set of integers

Probably more likely to be prime, since there's so many more of them

on average there are n/ln(n) primes below n

@cairdcoinheringaahing infinite primes > finite even numbers between 21 and 33

@ngn Then consider the limit of the question, as n -> inf, where n is the upper bound on the value to be chosen

CMQ: Should EBNF be presented in monospace font or serif font?

Monospace, it's basically code

there is some n for which there are more primes below n than 6, and for anything larger than that n, the answer is the former

In which case, I believe the following to be true: in an average Minecraft world, you are more likely to obtain a block of emerald than a diamond sword. As emeralds are renewable, meaning you could (theoretically) obtain an infinite number of them, but diamonds are not (there are a finite number per world), the probability of getting 9 emeralds is higher than that of getting 2 diamonds

That generalises to any renewable resource, including beacons and Withers

I don't think this works, you are more likely to get a large number of emeralds than of diamonds, but considering diamonds are finite doesn't make it any less likely to get 2 of them

It's not like you randomly pick something out of a bag

No, but it means the probability of getting 9 emeralds is higher

right but that's kind of like comparing the probability of picking any negative number versus any prime and then only selecting from Z+

ignoring the fact that their cardinality is the same but w/e

@cairdcoinheringaahing I disagree, if you're at a certain level, given that it hasn't been mined in before, you are much more likely to get 2 diamonds than 9 emeralds

It basically ignores intent

i mean what defines random in this case? if you are specifically going for emeralds, sure if you're lucky you can get it reasonably fast with coal/flesh trades

@rak1507 Perhaps when mining at a specific level. But in the progression of any given (survival) world, the probability is higher that you'll obtain emeralds before diamonds

but it's not really randomness here IMO. unless you have a script feed totally random inputs into the computer, but even then, i'm not sure

@hyper-neutrino Exactly, you can't really define 'random'

I believe Minecraft seeds are pseudorandom

But the act of playing minecraft isn't random

No, but even when aiming for a specific item, you don't control if you'll get it first or not

When choosing an item out of a bag (say, an apple vs an orange), and you want an apple, there is no guarantee you'll get it, even if you can feel the items and discard those you don't want

@cairdcoinheringaahing sure, but if I'm playing, and I decide to mine at y12 or whatever it is, the chance I'll get 2 diamonds before 9 emeralds is high

if I decide to trade with villagers, it will be lower

although there is some randomness, it isn't actually random

Yeah, in any specific game. But, on average, you're more likely to get emeralds than diamonds

I don't think that's true though

Games aren't equally distributed

And you don't do infinitely many things

@user one includes all that sse and mmx junk

@RedwolfPrograms actually it prints the argument to the second call of .next

@rak1507 You never know, some people have a lot of time on their hands :P

If I ever become immortal, I'll probably spend infinite time playing games if possible

seems like a good plan

@user if you become immortal, please compute 1+2+3+.., go back in time, and tell us the answer :)

How does the sequence continue?

8

obviously :)

I think 42 is after that :P

I'd prefer some kind of formula or program

oh the event starts tonight (my time). idk why i thought it was a day later

might sleep early so i can get up for it

@hyper-neutrino Isn't that 4am for you or something?

@cairdcoinheringaahing yes