TeX, LaTeX and Friends

7:13 AM

@UlrikeFischer It works :)

(launching install-tl-windows -gui)

8:05 AM

@egreg You managed to surprise me by saying that t1enc is an obsolete package. I do realize it is obsolete for LuaTeX users, but if you're still using good old pdfTeX? For example:

\documentclass{minimal}
\usepackage[utf8]{inputenc}
\usepackage[T1]{fontenc} % I get an error without this line
\usepackage{lmodern}
\begin{document}
«Guillemots.»
\end{document}

Ulrike Fischer

@HaraldHanche-Olsen t1enc and [T1]{fontenc} is not the same.

Harald Hanche-Olsen

8:41 AM

@UlrikeFischer Aha! I didn't see the t1enc package being included, way down in the normally invisible part of the file. So I figured egreg was referring to t1enc.def, not t1enc.sty, or something like that. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

CarLaTeX

9:13 AM

Does anyone know if this package: \usepackage{tex-live} can be found? Italian .tex file of TeX Live documentation loads it but I cannot find it anywhere. Thank you!

Ulrike Fischer

@CarLaTeX It is in \texlive\2017\texmf-dist\doc\texlive\texlive-en

CarLaTeX

@UlrikeFischer Thank you! Indeed, I searched on the Internet but it didn't come to my mind to search within my texlive directory :$

egreg

9:37 AM

@HaraldHanche-Olsen As Ulrike said: the user had \usepackage{t1enc}; actually it doesn't do very much, because it essentially does something less than \usepackage[T1]{fontenc}, but it's better to remove it. The usual problem of people using their friends' preambles, who used their friends' and so on up to \documentstyle changed with haste to \documentclass; at each step something is added, but nothing is ever removed.

daleif

10:30 AM

Here is an interesting one for you, perhaps @UlrikeFischer and @DavidCarlisle can help. We are preparing an english text, with an index. We index Hölder, Otto, a german mathematician. How exactly should his last name me sorted in English? Just amongst Ho...'s or after any Ho...'s. Reason for asking is that in Danish ö is often sorted after o, but since this is a German name in an English doc I'm not so sure anymore.

Ulrike Fischer

@daleif No idea, but I would make a test with biblatex + biber + english language. It uses the unicode-collation and so hopefully will get it right.

Paulo Cereda

@daleif Interesting, in Portuguese the accented letters have lower precedence.

mickep

10:49 AM

@daleif In Follands book on Real analysis, Hölder comes after "Hull of an ideal". I don't say that is correct, but as a swede it feels very good :)

@daleif But Rudin (Real and complex analysis) puts it between Hoffman and Holomorphic...

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@egreg Yes, I looked in the file and found exactly two lines that actually do something. The indefinitely growing preamble is certainly a well-known problem. I keep bumping into it with other people's LaTeX code.

egreg

@daleif I'd say \index{Holder@H\"older, Otto}; as far as I know, English collation disregards diacritics. A problem would arise if you also have somebody named Holder.

mickep

11:15 AM

Luckily, we don't have Holder's inequality in Mathematics yet :)

Paulo Cereda

11:26 AM

@egreg and friends: how would you define the ith position? In Portuguese, the term is i-ésimo. Should I go with $i$-ésimo?

egreg

@PauloCereda Yes

daleif

@egreg Interesting, for now I think I'll go with @mickep (that is the Danish/Swedish sorting), which is probably wrong. @barbarabeeton do you have any suggestions on chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/39441306#39441306

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@mickep But it's nothing short of amazing just how many people call it that!

Paulo Cereda

@egreg Thank you!

@egreg, @daleif: there's a recurring joke here about how some people use their telephone books: every entry is indexed under T: telefone do Pedro, telefone do João...

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@daleif Technically, Danish doesn't even have the letter ö. But I suppose they would sort it together with ø. But note that Danish and Swedish sorting are slightly different: The Danish alphabet ends with …zæøå, while the Swedish ends with …zåäö. But of course, Otto Hölder was German. And the Germans seem to have several ways to sort their letters ääü into the alphabet: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_orthography#Sorting

daleif

11:37 AM

@PauloCereda lol, as far as I know the Germans have two sortings, one if the text if for Germans and one if the German text if for non-Germans

Paulo Cereda

@daleif Oh my! :)

daleif

@HaraldHanche-Olsen Interesting, I did not know the Swedish ended like that. We mostly sort ö with ø at least for Scandinavian names.

CarLaTeX

@PauloCereda This reminds me the supplier list we had in a previous office of mine: it was not well sorted, because all the firms like F.lli Rossi (= Rossi Bros.) were listed under "F.lli". So, when someone didn't find a supplier contact the typical phrase was: "Cerca sotto F.lli" (=search under Bros.). It became what in Italy we call "tormentone", because for anything you could not find (a pen, a document) the rest of the office told you: "Cerca sotto F.lli" :):):)

Joseph Wright

@daleif English doesn't have accents so we ignore them :)

Paulo Cereda

@CarLaTeX ooh

@JosephWright what a boring language. :)

5

Ulrike Fischer

11:54 AM

Appendix:English words with diacritics

Below is a list of English language words that have letters with diacritical marks. == Origins == Most of the words listed here are loanwords from French, with others coming from Spanish, German, or other languages. Some are however originally English, or at least their diacritics are. One example is the oö in the now extremely rare variant spellings of words such as coöperation (compare the original French coopération), many of which are normally spelled with a hyphen to separate the two vowels, e.g. co-operation. Many of these spellings are so rare that they cannot be said to be part of...

Joseph Wright

@UlrikeFischer Like I said, English doesn't have any: anything with an accent should be in italic ...

@UlrikeFischer coöperation is a diaeresis so not an accent

egreg

@CarLaTeX I don't know if it's still the same, but the electronic Yellow Pages used to display addresses in a very bureaucratic style: via Verdi Giuseppe, via Sauro Nazario, via Alighieri Dante. Even via Bandiera Fratelli! For the non cognoscenti, the two Bandiera brothers (fratelli Bandiera) were heroes of Italian Risorgimento.

Ulrike Fischer

@JosephWright Above the discussion was about Hölder ..., I think in this context one include the diaresis as accent. (I did find it quite interesting, that there is a genuine "accent" in english).

Joseph Wright

@UlrikeFischer Well at least in co-operation one normally uses a hyphen so the problem vanishes

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@Joseph … unless one is the New Yorker, which has coöperate in its style guide. I happen to know because I just read Between You & Me: Confessions of a Comma Queen by Mary Norris, who is, or was, a copy editor there.

Joseph Wright

12:03 PM

@HaraldHanche-Olsen Yes: that's very old-fashioned

CarLaTeX

@egreg :):):) I didn't remember it! Hahaha

user8469759

hi guys, silly question

Is there a way to position node using the center?

daleif

@user8469759 what do yuo mean? the center of what?

user8469759

because apparently every time I try to position any node of a graph the bounding box is taken as reference

like this

\draw (0.5,2) node(lutNode)[draw,shape=rectangle,minimum
width = 20, minimum height = 35,anchor=north] {LUT};

so it's a rectangle

but instead of positioning the center of the rectangle

one of the corners is used for reference

(0.5,2) is the position of one of the corners

daleif

@user8469759 that is exactly what anchor=north does. Without it the center of the node is used'

user8469759

12:16 PM

ah

I've just done cut and paste for that

and I thought it was for something else

daleif

You should probably post it as a proper question on the site and someone with better knowledge will give a petter answer.

user8469759

you just answered

that's fine

xD

usually I post questions that are particularly involved

daleif

@user8469759 but there might be a way to do hat you want. Tikz has so many options ....

user8469759

I'm quite sure I won't get a better answer than yours...

for this problem

Ulrike Fischer

@daleif Your answer is fine. If you want the anchor to be in the center you shouldn't set it to north.

Moriambar

12:48 PM

quack

Paulo Cereda

@Moriambar Quack! <3

Moriambar

@PauloCereda how's it going?

Paulo Cereda

1:18 PM

@Moriambar In a hurry, but fine.

@Moriambar: and you?

Moriambar

@PauloCereda Working and trying to find a better workplace

fine anyway (work aside) :)

user8469759

can anyone provide me an example for this?

0

Q: Hardware diagrams latex,

I'm looking here for some examples of block diagrams, I was however wondering how can I insert a small "cut" in the signals arc and label it with the bitwidth. Like the following

tikz-pgf

I'd like to draw an arrow just like the ones in the diagram

Jasper Loy

5:15 PM

By the way, I forgot. @PauloCereda , have you finally finished your thesis?

Oh I see that @egreg is a moderator on Italian SE. Congratulations!

Hello @JosephWright quack! Long time no see!

barbara beeton

6:10 PM

@daleif -- sorry to come late to the party (an ams problem to be solved ...). the ams editorial staff would put "Hölder, Otto" between "Hogue" and "Hollerith"; that's also the way math reviews indexes have been arranged since the beginning. so it's \index{Holder@Hölder, Otto} for us. (or \index{Holder, O@Hölder, Otto} if there happens to be more than one person with similar last name. there really is more than one paul erdos, so a different tie-breaker is needed there.)

@user8469759 -- the advantage of putting a question, even a relatively straightforward one, on the main site is that other people (who might have the same question) can benefit from the answer there. an answer in chat, on the other hand, tends to get lost.

egreg

7:20 PM

@JasperLoy Nice to see you! The thesis in still unfinished, obviously!

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