The Sphinx's Lair

Sid

5:00 PM

Scon is probably laughing now...

manshu

can't "open lorries" be wagons?

Beastly Gerbil

open to me suggests first letter

manshu

how?

Beastly Gerbil

it opens it

manshu

oh yeah.. in that way.

Beastly Gerbil

5:05 PM

it could be the verb or adj here

manshu

yes.

and then unmanned suggests that the letters M A N should be subtracted from what we have.

Beastly Gerbil

Tragic western open lorries could be TL

if wrecked = dismantled that has man in it

n_palum

I think Tragic western is the def

I think the punctuation is important to this one because Scon said it was intentional to read like a play

manshu

highly likely^^

Sconibulus

doesn't that make it less likely that the punctuation matters?

Beastly Gerbil

5:11 PM

here is the MAN himself

n_palum

Not necessarily? Tragic western is separate, the play's title.. open: lorries; the beginning of the act

manshu

Sconibulus, confusing people since 11-May-2017.

2

n_palum

I really wanna get this I came up with a funny one :P

Rubio

5:34 PM

I'm not sure at all as to the relevance of any of this, but:

"open lorries" might well be wAGONs

A "tragic Western" might well be DJANGO

how to get from one to the other is beyond me

n_palum

Ahh yes DJANGO the classic tragedy

Sid

If that is correct, then, I guess wrecked is an anagram indicator for AGON. We still haven't used the rust.

(Mr. Deusovi would be terribly unhappy with an indirect anagram, though)

Sconibulus

I don't believe there is anything in the clue that our overlords would be particularly unhappy about

I make no such claim about mildly unhappy, because I'm still not very good at these :)

Deusovi

I'm good at complaining about things! :P

Beastly Gerbil

its a mods job :P

Mike Q

5:47 PM

I still think the def is "laden", and the hyphen is the separator. The rest of the CCCC has colons, semicolons, and commas.

n_palum

It's a Deus thing

n_palum

6:06 PM

@MikeQ Laden 6 letter possibilities, LOADED, FILLED, LOADED, LAVISH

to name some

GentlePurpleRain

What about LOADED? :P

ffao

I don't think you mentioned LOADED

n_palum

Wat?

Oh...

Rubio

well, if we're going to make a list

n_palum

PACKED was meant to be the other one

Rubio

6:09 PM

be sure you put LOADED on it

Sid

For some reason, whenever I see Open, my mind diverts to Tennis. IIRC, there was a tennis tournament in the US named Western Open. Though, I doubt Scon would go for such obscure references.

n_palum

Rolling eyes so hard every teenage girl was put to shame

Rubio

also LEADEN, possibly BURDEN (though I don't like it), LOADED, TOTING, SODDEN, SOTTED, maybe FLABBY, HIDING, and LOADED.

M Oehm

Laden would be burdened, wouldn't it?

n_palum

^ and you forgot loaded

ffao

6:14 PM

I'm laughing more than I should from all of these loaded mentions

M Oehm

Tragic could be WOEFUL: There's a W for Western and possibly an O from open. Laden could be FULL and there's a lot in between that I can't make head or tail of. :)

n_palum

Not a bad effort either..

M Oehm

Seeing that you have been discussing the CCCC for what? two hours now, I just wanted to throw in my 2 cents.

n_palum

Much appreciated as we are seemingly stuck

M Oehm

Not that I could contribute anything useful. The clue seems awfully long for a six-letter answer.

n_palum

6:20 PM

My thoughts exactly

Sid

@Scon considering that even experts like Oehm are stuck, mind giving a hint?

M Oehm

I wouldn't consider myself an expert. More often than not I'm stuck on the CCCCs here.

Sconibulus

6:32 PM

there has been a lot of good work, and many good ideas thrown out recently, I'm inclined to let them sit for a while before giving a second clue

M Oehm

Aaargh! We're LOADED with possibilities to explore for the CCCC. :)

n_palum

rolls eyes harder than ever

ffao

LOL

M Oehm

Dont do that, @n_palum, they will get stuck.

n_palum

They're just in an infinite rolling loop at this point, I don't see them getting stuck anytime soon

Sconibulus

6:40 PM

Oooh, perpetual motion

M Oehm

Yes, we could use n_palum as dynamo.

n_palum

Did you just try to make my eyes into a math joke

Rubio

damnit

it's WOEFUL

M Oehm

How so? I can't make it stick.

Rubio

Tragic (def) = western (O_ L_ U_), wrecked

n_palum

6:42 PM

the FE from countless rust

Rubio

FEO is from countless rust - i found that last night

Sid

W?

n_palum

Well done

Rubio

laden is putting FEO

there's a W I can't quite account for

but that has to be it, and I was looking at that last night too

couldn't find one of the letters, and I still can't

M Oehm

The W could be from wrecked, which is doing double duty as fodder for Western and anagrind?

n_palum

6:44 PM

oh maybe? :/

Rubio

that's all I can think of

GentlePurpleRain

Isn't that an indirect anagram, then?

Sconibulus

is an anagram really necessary?

Rubio

well - we've apparently determined you can apply an anagram indicator on the result of another indicator that's literally there

M Oehm

Ah, it's FeO (iron oxide) insode LUW, the openings of Lorries Unmanned, Wrecked, all backwards (Western). Def is WOEFUL.

Rubio

6:47 PM

but what's "open" ?

Sconibulus

bingo

ffao

that sounds more reasonable

M Oehm

So, LU(FEO)W<, in cryptic nomenclature.

Sid

Starting letters

ffao

open is start letter indicator

Rubio

6:47 PM

is it? opener, but open?

that's the letter I couldn't match

anyway. good job @MOehm

M Oehm

Well, it was a joint effort.

n_palum

You got the whole word most completely

Sphinx

0

Q: How can 14 teams rotate thru 8 stations (2 teams at a station) without overlaps, with one station not being used during each rotation?

How can 14 teams rotate thru 8 stations (2 teams at a station) without overlaps, with one station not being used during each rotation? NOTE: Every team plays every other team exactly once Every team participates in every station exactly once

mathematics

ffao

you sure that wordplay can't give LOADED somehow?

n_palum

You....

Sconibulus

6:50 PM

@Sphinx I've seen this before, I swear

M Oehm

Yes, in niggle mode, Westward would be better than Western, too, to indicate reversal. but I've just opened a beer and I'm in a good mood.

Rubio

eh. we've definitely seen western used for reversal, I have no quibble there

n_palum

What a German thing to say

M Oehm

What, "I'm in a good mood"?

Sconibulus

I think open may have been better opens(because multiple letters) but I don't know why it wouldn't be a valid indicator

n_palum

6:53 PM

Opened a beer and in a good mood :P

No judgement, jealous maybe.. although I'm not a big beer person

M Oehm

It's just a small one I allowed mayself after running. I'm very much a beer person, at least when I go out.

Okay, here goes:

n_palum

not in a bad way, but Germany is known for beer

M Oehm

CCCC: Led a do, guilty as charged. (6)

@n_palum Oh, I didn't take it badly, no worries. but my beer comment seems to have stopped the buzz here.

Sid

7:10 PM

DOesn't beer make people sleepy?

n_palum

I just don't have the taste for it

Sid

(No, I haven't ever tried beer and nor do I intend to in the future)

n_palum

I'm much more of a cider/"fruity" beers, and liquor

Sconibulus

you don't intend to ever try beer?

n_palum

not necessarily @Sid

Mike Q

7:11 PM

@Sid Not necessarily sleepy. Different people have their own reactions when buzzed/intoxicated

n_palum

Maybe after drinking for a few hours.. then I get sleepy

M Oehm

@Sid Two or three beers make you sleepy. I didn't have much taste for it at first, either, but now it's my regular drink when I go out.

n_palum

I feel like either you like it when you're younger or you develop a taste for it as you age..

Sid

@Scon religious issues. Not that my religion bans it. We are told during our childhood about side effects of alcohol. Apparently it is not healthy and I am touchy about health.

M Oehm

But you can probably lead a fulfilled life without having tasted beer.

Mike Q

7:13 PM

@Sid @MOehm The number depends on the person's alcohol tolerance, which mostly depends on their size, weight, and health

Sconibulus

Many fun things are unhealthy :) But ok

M Oehm

It also depends on the size of a beer. :)

n_palum

^^ fact of life

Mike Q

@MOehm I should have said 'amount' instead of 'number'. (shakes fist angrily at English language )

n_palum

Germany is known for large pints of beer

@Sid Red wine has proven heart benefits in moderation :)

M Oehm

7:16 PM

@n_palum Only the south. The beer in most regions is pilsner, which is bitter and gets stale quckly, so they serve it in small glasses. Here in Munich, the regular size is half a litre.

n_palum

Still a solid size haha

I had a friend who spent a few weeks in Germany for school, he said beer was served like every meal after 11 AM

Mike Q

Yeah, as I understand it, beer is traditionally part of German culture. Their "legal drinking age" has multiple levels rather than "too young" / "too old".

M Oehm

And of course they have the litre tankards you've probably seen inpictures of the Oktoberfest or of beer gardens. I prefer the smaller sizes, but you won't get anything small in these places.

n_palum

Oh I have seen those

Germany is on my list of places to visit, specifically Munich actually

M Oehm

When did your friend visit Germany? In the sixties? I'd say for most people beer is something they drink in the evening.

n_palum

7:19 PM

Nope like a year ago haha

Might've just been them being college kids

M Oehm

There is something called "Frühschoppen", though, where you start drinking at maybe 11 am, but not on workdays. Maybe on a Sunday on a folk festival or something.

Mike Q

@MOehm My German is a bit rusty... does that translate to "early shovel"?

n_palum

As in early shovel beer into your mouth? XD

M Oehm

@MikeQ Früh is early, but Schoppen is something to drink. It's maybe even a regional word. Shovel would be Schaufel or, regional again, Schippe.

So you know German?

Mike Q

Apparently not

n_palum

7:23 PM

haha

M Oehm

Well, your translation wasn't far off, given that Schoppen is a rather obscure word.

Well, not obscure maybe, but unusual for a foreigner to know.

Mike Q

I will say that so far, it's my favorite language that I've studied. The rules just... make sense. And the words are fun to say.

(I looked up Schoppen :/. Figured the word was "early" something, and it sounded like "schleppen")

n_palum

ASL is my favorite :P

but it makes about as much sense as you'd expect from sign language

M Oehm

Well, the rules may make sense, except when they don't. The problem is that different languages care about different things. That the words are fun to say could be because some of them are close to English but still different.

@n_palum So what's ASL? A sign language apparently.

Mike Q

@MOehm American Sign Language

n_palum

7:30 PM

I know a handful of German words, and some German Sign Language

Yea what Mike said

M Oehm

So somthing that you do with your hands that's often used by the deaf and mute?

Sid

I can count the number of German words I know with the fingers of my hand..

n_palum

Exactly, it's an unspoken language

Sid

Same with French or any other language that is not my native language..

Or any other regional language for that matter..

n_palum

My favorite German word is Schmetterling

Mike Q

7:31 PM

@Sid Are they eins, zwei, drei, vier, fünf?

Sid

Well, I knew only the first two.

Nah, I know only Good morning, Good luck, And something similar..

Sconibulus

I don't know how to spell most of the german words I know

and they're almost all violent

things like falschrimjagr and kamptflieger

n_palum

Have you been playing too many Nazi video games Scon

Sconibulus

...no comment

Mike Q

There are plenty of German words that are adopted into English

M Oehm

7:34 PM

Fallschirmjäger und Kampfflieger, aha.

Sid

My favorite German word is "Gesundheit" simply because it was a cheat in a GTA game. :P

Mike Q

Zweihander comes to mind

M Oehm

Yes. Apparently that's also said in America to someone who has sneezed.

n_palum

I can't show you my favorite signs :P

M Oehm

Gosh! German really seems to be all about fighting. (The "correct" German would be Zweihänder. And Doppelgänger, of course.)

Sconibulus

7:36 PM

eindekker... jagdpanzer

Mike Q

@MOehm Apologies, my keyboard has no umlauts. I have to copy+paste them from when you type them.

Sid

Yes, I knew Doppelganger as well.

M Oehm

In that case, you should write an e after the vowel you want to make an umlaut: Zweihaender. (That's often used when you have no German keyboard. It's also the way we write solutions in crosswords.)

@n_palum If I may ask: How come you speak sign language?

Mike Q

One of my favorite features of the language is how easily you can summarize concepts into a single word. You just append multiple words together and bam, it's a new word.

M Oehm

Yes, but English can do that, too, only that you get a phrase, not one large word. The concept is very similar.

Mike Q

7:43 PM

Let's say I have a special knife that is designed for spreading peanut butter

Erdnussbuttermesser

Much easier to say

...ok, it's not an actual word, but I think it's structurally valid

M Oehm

Yes, but couldn't you call such a knife a peanut butter knife in English?

Mike Q

I could but it's not as fun

M Oehm

Or maybe peanut-butter knife.

Mike Q

"Rechtsschutzversicherungsgesellschaften, insurance companies providing legal protection, is considered the longest German word in everyday use by the Guinness Book of World Records" (Source)

M Oehm

Then you would enjoy words such as Fahrtrichtungswechselanzeiger.

n_palum

7:48 PM

@MOehm The University I attend is located in Rochester US, and the school is one of the largest deaf accommodating schools in the country. Also the city and surrounding area is the largest deaf population in the country, over 90,000

So I was exposed to it very quickly, and quite a lot at school, decided to take some courses and eventually got a minor in American Sign Language and Deaf Cultural Studies

I really like it

Mike Q

@MOehm "driving direction ??? displayer"?

M Oehm

Ah, so you see it "spoken" every day. Friends of mine have a daughter in kindergarden. She's got a friend there who is deaf and uses sign language, so she starts to use that at home, too. The parents sometimes wonder whether she makes up the signs on a spur.

n_palum

@MOehm More or less "spoken" but yeah I see it all the time, and being able to communicate with everyone is nice.. it's a fun language to learn too.. and it sets you apart in the job market eventually :P

It does sometimes look like you're just making stuff up or waving your hands around but I promise it's not

It's even got its own grammar, although it's awfully annoying... You do like the opposite of English

M Oehm

@MikeQ: It's the word the traffic code uses to refer to the indicator light for turning left or right. Everyone else calls it a Blinker. (Anzeigen can mean to display, but also to indicate. And to press charges.)

Sconibulus

I think it's based on French grammar

Mike Q

7:55 PM

It's probably worth learning for people who gesture a lot when they speak, in order to avoid confusing (and/or insulting) any ASL people who see.

n_palum

I was raised very Italian and talk with my hands normally, now it has translated into signing while I talk

Mike Q

I do it too, but never learned ASL, and apparently these may translate into ASL to mean very some bizarre and disturbing things.

Anyhow, speaking of indicators. Does "as charged" mean anything as part of a cryptic clue?

n_palum

Sometimes haha but you'd be surprised, the more disturbing or inappropriate language you have to very deliberately sign, it's not usually accidental

Especially since it's not a spoken language, and there are no tone indicators etc, you have to do a lot with your face to express things

M Oehm

@MikeQ You mean as an indicator for some wordplay? In the way that "mixed" can mean an anagram? No that I know of.

(Although charged with could mean containment as rust-laden meant to put FEO inside the rest in the previous clue.)

n_palum

Oehm you should go take another crack at my puzzle, it's still idling

Beastly Gerbil

8:06 PM

@n_palum have you said which are correct?

n_palum

Should I at this point?

Beastly Gerbil

perhaps, its up to you. If you think you need to

M Oehm

The seven-letter code? At the moment, I have no idea what the letters I think are missing are.

Beastly Gerbil

1 is probably right

M Oehm

And the Y from the cyclops is, too.

Beastly Gerbil

8:08 PM

yeah those are the only two I can say are def correct

5 might be a <kbd>5|5</kbd> domino

oh kbd doesn't work

n_palum

I confirmed the 4 that are right

Beastly Gerbil

oh wow j was correct

n_palum

That was an easy one :P

M Oehm

Okay, the blank page, the V|V domino and the rebus.

n_palum

the other 3 I figured would be harder

Sconibulus

8:10 PM

vv I assumed was W

Beastly Gerbil

so it follows like imgur.com/ecjxxYx

with x's as blanks for now

n_palum

The blank one you'll probably say oh duh, 5 is not a domino and the last is not really a rebus ;)

@BeastlyGerbil also that'd be wrong :P

Beastly Gerbil

oh do I have the order wrong there?

M Oehm

So the V over V one is a rebus?

n_palum

The order is wrong, and V over V kind of...

Beastly Gerbil

8:12 PM

I think 4 is 0

v/v could be 5/5 = 1

n_palum

Both would be wrong

Beastly Gerbil

oh lol

4 could be O instead then

n_palum

also wrong

Beastly Gerbil

but yeah its probably a number because no case indicator

M Oehm

And the V/V could be a lowercase V: One wedge is the V and the second indicates lower case.

n_palum

8:15 PM

claps

Beastly Gerbil

@n_palum that order is correct btw, at least from the puzzle

n_palum

@BeastlyGerbil words are important ;)

Beastly Gerbil

so ecj?vY?

and then we order

n_palum

I'll be nice and say only 1 is moved

Beastly Gerbil

oh

probably 4 to the penultimate position

ecjvY??

n_palum

8:17 PM

claps

Beastly Gerbil

I was wondering what the penultimate thing meant

so the first ? is a number, the second is a lowercase character presumably

n_palum

Exactly what it sounds like

M Oehm

Oh, that's a nasty clue. I thought it referred to the letter/number itself, like the others.

GentlePurpleRain

@MOehm <groan> LOADED: "LED A DO" guilty (anagrammed) = LOADED (charged)

Beastly Gerbil

why can't 7 also just be a lowercase v ?

actually that is probably too easy

Sconibulus

8:19 PM

hahaha

7 I think clues Lover

X maybe?

Beastly Gerbil

oh nice thought

n_palum

YOU WOULD MAKE A CC FOR LOADED! Gahhhh

M Oehm

@GentlePurpleRain Yes, you got it.. :) (Sorry about the groanworthiness, but I couldn't resist the cheap shot.)

n_palum

7 still has nothing to do with lover

M Oehm

Why not? It's a perfectly common word. I think it means somthing along the lines of laden or such.

n_palum

8:21 PM

@MOehm nasty as in bad? ;)

Very clever 😝

Beastly Gerbil

@n_palum don't tell me 4 is the number 4

Sconibulus

it's blank, may be 0?

M Oehm

Nasty as in tricky to find out. I mean we're looking for an image key for imgur, which can be anything and we can only try it out in order to see whether we are correct. If the answer were a word, such devices would be easier to spot, because you see immediately wha'ts going on.)

Beastly Gerbil

hes said no to that

Sconibulus

ahh, I don't know what he's said :)

LOWER could be 6: so Y - V = i?

Beastly Gerbil

8:24 PM

Its probably just 4

Sconibulus

or l

n_palum

Apologies if the nastiness/trickiness is unfair

I'm saddened to inform you that you're right Gerbil

M Oehm

Well, it's out of the way now, although only for us in the know/chat.

Beastly Gerbil

okay so ecjvY4?

got it

n_palum

You are still missing 7

Beastly Gerbil

8:28 PM

do you have a transcription of the stuff in the pic?

n_palum

You can brute force the last if you really want I guess

In what the 7th pic?

Beastly Gerbil

no in the final pix

7 is lowercase q

I bruteforced, no idea why

A1Z26

oh right

why?

8:32 PM

- and = were supposed to tip off subtracting

So you'd get the numerical values and subtract to get the value for q.. he words themselves were supposed to throw you off since they relate to capitalized letters and such

Beastly Gerbil

do you have a transcription then of the bridge text?

Yciumk fvnmksekmw pvqvz sromk gvdmg

hmmm...

n_palum

Ahhh no

Beastly Gerbil

what?

you don't have a transcription? never mind I typed it out :)

none of the rots

probably vigenere but no idea what the key is

M Oehm

Am I missing something? For me the A1Z26 calculation is:

(12 + 15 + 23 + 5 + 18) − (3 + 1 + 16 + 9 + 20 + 1 + 12 + 22) = −11

Sconibulus

Oxygen valentines rajah tumen dazed

Beastly Gerbil

8:38 PM

whats the key?

Ovrtd

=OVERTED ?

M Oehm

The key is in plain sight: TORII. The message is: Former referenced being eager seven

Or rather: Former referenced being eager (7)

Ex-something?

Beastly Gerbil

eager probably def

as its about

ffao

I'm with Sid, I don't intend on trying beer

and I can't believe I didn't get MOehm's CCCC! :(

Deusovi

EXCITED

Beastly Gerbil

EXCITED

Deusovi

8:41 PM

ha!

M Oehm

Yes, it was writen just for you. And n_palum, obviously.

Beastly Gerbil

lol :P

Sconibulus

speaking of CCCC...

@GentlePurpleRain's leaving us hanging

n_palum

Deus got it yeah

Beastly Gerbil

we actually got it literally same time :P (though he probably got it within a second of seeing it :P)

n_palum

8:44 PM

Nice pickup on Torii Oehm

Beastly Gerbil

I've never even heard of 'torii'

Sconibulus

my guess is that it's the name of that structure

n_palum

^

Beastly Gerbil

yes

Torii

A torii (鳥居, literally bird abode, /ˈtɔəri.iː/) is a traditional Japanese gate most commonly found at the entrance of or within a Shinto shrine, where it symbolically marks the transition from the profane to the sacred (see sacred-profane dichotomy). The presence of a torii at the entrance is usually the simplest way to identify Shinto shrines, and a small torii icon represents them on Japanese road maps. They are however a common sight at Japanese Buddhist temples too, where they stand at the entrance of the temple's own shrine, called chinjusha (鎮守社, tutelary god shrine) and are usually very...

Sconibulus

I'm much more familiar with Toril

M Oehm

8:48 PM

Okay, after the beer, I feel sleepy. Good night, y'all!

Or GameN, rather.

Beastly Gerbil

night!

n_palum

Night Oehm!

Mike Q

Guten Abend!