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kristan
kristan
12:01 AM
I'll probably experiment with more handwriting variations (in the standard direction! :-P) later, but for now I need to get to work; I'm running behind :-(.
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
@HDE @Standback @DForck I wouldn't worry too much about the HNQ issue. Nearly every SE site has problems with the selection of its questions that HNQ chooses to showcase. I mean, this is my 3rd highest-voted answer on SFF. There isn't much we can do about it, beyond using our own votes judiciously.
@Mithrandir Only 75? :-)
@Standback Told you :-)
 
Riker
Riker
nj
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
@amaranth Yay! :-D
@Napoleon Aren't you missing an H on the end of your username here?
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
12:17 AM
@Randal'Thor Oh god, right! Drgh!
That must have vanished when experimenting with the proper "ae".
Thank you very much. I might have never noticed that.
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
Is it possible for you to change now, or do you have to wait nearly 30 days?
@NapoleonWilson No problem. You know my spelling pedantry ;-)
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
Uh, apparently I could. I didn't even think about the limitation. Huh.
Maybe the publication reset the timer?
 
BESW
BESW
1:10 AM
@kristan Thank you!
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
1:32 AM
Does my linking this here count as an ad for an ad?
^ needs a couple more upvotes
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
Which is interestingly fitting for Worldbuilding.
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
(I felt that that tagline fits Worldbuilding particularly well, as their questions tend to come from a writer's point of view rather than a consumer's. I haven't posted a version of this ad on any other sites yet.) — Rand al'Thor 19 mins ago
Trying to think of a good tagline for ELU ...
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
I still maintain that it could use a little work, though.
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
"The English language in action"?
For M&TV, maybe something along the lines of "many great films were based on books".
 
BESW
BESW
I'll probably have time to tidy it up tomorrow.
Was gonna do it today, but family sickness got in the way.
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
1:41 AM
Or "Use your own visual imagination!" ;-)
@BESW Sorry to hear that. Best wishes to whoever it is.
And I'm out. Goodnight all.
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
@Randal'Thor Yeah, but a little more creative maybe. ;-)
 
BESW
BESW
Fast and dirty:
(Not sized, it's just a screenshot.)
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
That looks quite a bit nicer, even if not that easier to read
Oh wait, does that use kristan's sample?
 
BESW
BESW
Yup.
It's not necessarily easier to read, but it's more likely folks will stick around to read it.
Also I fiddled with the saturation and such.
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
Also true. As said it doesn't necessarily have to be easy to read.
2 hours ago, by Napoleon Wilson
I can read it too, but with an ad you really don't have too much time on your hands. Of course one could also argue that its artistic qualities are more important than its content and it doesn't necessarily have to be understood immediately, which is a reasonable viewpoint, too.
 
BESW
BESW
1:51 AM
As I've said before, I'm a print media guy. Designing web content is a little outside my comfort zone and waay outside my formal training.
(The one web design class I took was back when it was still okay to use Flash animation for your website navigation.)
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
The biggest problem with those cursive things is really that the thickness of the lines hides much detail. But on the other hand if it's too filigrane it might also get lost in the background.
 
BESW
BESW
Yeah, the photo isn't crisp enough to just insert with a blending mode, so I had to trace the image in Illustrator.
That introduces a little extra line variation weirdness.
 
kristan
kristan
2:24 AM
@BESW I like it :-D
 
BESW
BESW
@kristan As do I! Thanks again.
 
kristan
kristan
The first time I wrote the quote, the tail in "only" overlapped the second line, so I wrote it again with a line space between so it'd be easier to rearrange as desired.
 
BESW
BESW
Yes, I really appreciate that.
 
kristan
kristan
And then there will be an internet rumor that that is Samuel Johnson's actual handwriting XD
@BESW I could scan the page instead of use a camera, to see if that gives a crisper image
 
BESW
BESW
I don't think it'd be enough of an improvement over the image trace to warrant the effort.
 
kristan
kristan
2:30 AM
Yeah, I don't know. It wouldn't be that much effort; mostly I'd just have to find the scanner...
 
BESW
BESW
If you scan it, I will use it!
 
kristan
kristan
2:53 AM
Hmm... not succeeding in connecting to the scanner on the other computer through the network...
And my brother says the other scanner is in the garage. >_<
/me goes to garage to hunt for scanner
 
kristan
kristan
3:24 AM
Hrm. Trying to install the TWAIN driver is turning out to be more trouble than I thought!
Finally seems to be working now. Crazy thing.
@BESW Don't know if that's an improvement or not, but there it is :-P
and now I'll be afk for a while
 
Riker
Riker
I like it
 
 
4 hours later…
Standback
Standback
7:41 AM
@Randal'Thor Told me what? Asynchronous communication + I iz tired :P
, OK, got it now. (This may be literally the first time I've used the reply-to-a-message option. :P )
...but I'm still at "Told you what?". Our short-story tag here on Lit.SE isn't nearly as mired in story-id questions.
(Why do the folks at SF&F read so few short stories? :P )
 
BESW
BESW
Eh, I once had an SF&Fer who thought Bram Stoker invented the epistolary novel for Dracula.
...and that hardly anybody else has used the format since.
I'm not expecting great variety in their collective reading experience.
 
Standback
Standback
@BESW : Ouch.
But there's a difference between one boor, and assuming the whole site's full of 'em :P
 
BESW
BESW
8:09 AM
Fair enough. I've had other run-ins as well.
(runs-in?)
 
 
3 hours later…
Benjamin
Benjamin
10:48 AM
Do we have consensus on short-stories?
 
Mithrandir
Mithrandir
11:05 AM
@Benjamin not yet, don't think so
 
Benjamin
Benjamin
@Mithrandir Okay, then I'll wait, but votes have stabilised.
 
Mithrandir
Mithrandir
2
Q: Mithrandir's chat puzzle!

boboquackSo Mithrandir's chat profile has a puzzle: Hello. There's a puzzle here. You will need EG7Rx. However, you start at: https://i.stack.imgur.com/hSUe2.png That URL is this picture: Can you help to solve it?

cipher enigmatic-puzzle steganography imgur-maze
 
Standback
Standback
11:40 AM
@Mithrandir @Benjamin To be frank, +6/-3 isn't exactly a strong consensus even if it is stable.
 
Benjamin
Benjamin
@Standback True, but it is a consensus.
 
Mithrandir
Mithrandir
@Standback exactly. That's why I said that we don't have a concensus ;)
 
Standback
Standback
@Benjamin Yessss. But for determining site directions and policy, a small number of votes that are highly divided is different from "Ok, we have agreed on thia as site policy."
 
Benjamin
Benjamin
@Standback That makes more sense.
 
Standback
Standback
@Mithrandir Sorry, I misclicked on which message I was responding to :-/
I mean, I think it's enough to say "OK, let's retag those 18 questions" or whatever; there's no harm in that, and no policy against it.
I just wouldn't take that as "This is now site policy by consensus," that's all :P
 
Benjamin
Benjamin
11:49 AM
@Standback Well, I will do that soon.
 
Benjamin
Benjamin
12:00 PM
Edit capped!
Our auto-post bots are running behind.
 
Librarian
Librarian
12:19 PM
0
Q: Should we have country name tags? If so, how should we use them?

BenjaminI have been sifting through the tags looking for ones that seem problematic and one problem that I am finding are tags that are about the work or the scene of the work, but not actually about the question. One example of this is country tags, such as mexico or japan. In the mexico case, both uses...

discussion tags
-1
Q: Should we merge Homer tags?

BenjaminWe have both odyssey and the-odyssey. We have both the-iliad and illiad. Should we merge and synonymise these? If so, which one should be our final destination tag?

discussion retag-request
0
Q: Should we rename [bs-johnson] as [b-s-johnson]?

Benjaminbs-johnson refers to the author, B. S. Johnson. Should we rename bs-johnson as b-s-johnson?

discussion retag-request
 
Mithrandir
Mithrandir
12:38 PM
@Benjamin your bsj one is a duplicate
 
Benjamin
Benjamin
1:02 PM
If a feature requested it, do you think we could get the 5-tag limit lifted?
And the 25-character limit?
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
1:34 PM
@Standback Probably because the site itself isn't...yet.
 
Standback
Standback
1:51 PM
@NapoleonWilson sigh .
I hope if it starts sliding in that direction, we'll cut it off quick.
We really don't want to end up like the last Lit.
@Benjamin , any reason you removed the lgbt tag from @Cascabel 's "Earthly Powers" question? That seemed like a useful one.
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
Oh god.
 
Standback
Standback
@NapoleonWilson ...what now?
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
Nothing, don't worry.
 
Standback
Standback
ok :)
(I come pre-worried.)
 
DForck42
DForck42
mornin
 
Mithrandir
Mithrandir
2:13 PM
@DForck42 afternoon
 
DForck42
DForck42
@Mithrandir what're you up to? (notice, I didn't ask you how it's going this time ;-) )
 
Mithrandir
Mithrandir
@DForck42 -_-
@DForck42 I am sitting here chatting with you.
 
DForck42
DForck42
@Mithrandir lol
 
Mithrandir
Mithrandir
That's my standard answer :P
@DForck42 so how do you do?
 
DForck42
DForck42
@Mithrandir I drink coffee and expel sql
 
HDE 226868
HDE 226868
2:21 PM
@Benjamin Why do you think we need to lift the tag limit?
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
@HDE226868 For all the author, country, topic, feeling,... tags of course
 
HDE 226868
HDE 226868
groan
 
DForck42
DForck42
@Benjamin no. for some reason they are VERY reluctant to fiddle with the tag system
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
@Benjamin But no, I doubt that would ever be done by SE.
They already seem reluctant to increase the 25-character tag length, and there are already feature requests for that.
 
HDE 226868
HDE 226868
Only a small fraction of questions even have four tags, let alone five. This does not seem to be a problem on Literature.
 
DForck42
DForck42
2:24 PM
@NapoleonWilson at least 2 I think
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
@HDE226868 Until you introduce all the said tags, though.
 
HDE 226868
HDE 226868
@NapoleonWilson Yeah, but are people going to do that?
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
@HDE226868 I don't know if they are actually going to do that, but some are certainly working towards it. Or at least it seems much more possible here than on other sites.
 
Standback
Standback
2:45 PM
What we REALLY need is a tag for year of publication!
::ducks::
 
Mick
Mick
3:13 PM
@Standback ... and an indication of which books are useful as door stops and for propping up furniture, etc.
 
 
2 hours later…
Skooba
Skooba
5:06 PM
@Randal'Thor there is now a third civic duty holder :)
 
DForck42
DForck42
5:18 PM
0
A: I need help understanding why my "identify-this-movie" tagged question was marked "off-topic"

DForck42So, I'm going to address an inherent problem with Identify This X questions, and the reasons why we want as much detail as possible. If the asker only remembers one scene from the movie, and doesn't remember anything else about the movie, either when it was filmed, when they saw it, etc, the sco...

just wanted to share this answer here
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
@DForck42 Oh god, why?
Do we have to spill stuff like that elsewhere? ;-)
 
DForck42
DForck42
@NapoleonWilson because I think it'll be important in the future of this site
 
Skooba
Skooba
@DForck42 I was about to say.... uhhhh because movies are not literature, then i aw the site icon
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
Hmm, sure. I just don't like our drama to be dragged out in unusual places, especially where it may attract non-users with their very own opinion of how our policies should work.
But I understand that it's related to an ongoing discussion here, too.
 
DForck42
DForck42
@NapoleonWilson yeah, my intention was to share my answer, not the drama that prompted it
 
Skooba
Skooba
5:25 PM
its too late
Skooba is here = drama :P
3
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
(As eveidenced by the 2 sudden upvotes of the question, because yeah "you rude anti-ID people on movies you!"). ;-)
 
Skooba
Skooba
@NapoleonWilson full disclosre: I DV the Q and UV the answer
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
Don't worry, I'm largely joking. It's not like it matters, it isn't a policy discussion anyway.
 
Skooba
Skooba
you guys and your poor ID questions
I don't see how two site can have two similar question types yet have such a great variance and how they are treated.
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
I do, there have been enough explanations why.
 
Skooba
Skooba
5:32 PM
or rather how they attract such varying degrees of quality
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
The more important thing is acknowledging that difference.
 
Ankit Sharma
Ankit Sharma
@Skooba they were in bad condition in anime.se too
And then they banned then fortunately
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
Indeed. And they saved themselves from the pits of eternal damnation and will thus forever last in our memory as the true heroes of SE and the idol to strive for.
2
 
Skooba
Skooba
L - O - L
I just have id questions set to ignore
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
Which...is part of the problem.
 
Skooba
Skooba
5:45 PM
@AnkitSharma do you regret this now? meta.movies.stackexchange.com/a/2252/28011
or was it just to have both a Yes and No answer on the question?
 
Ankit Sharma
Ankit Sharma
@Skooba that was only there because few people wanted it
 
Napoleon Wilson
Napoleon Wilson
We regret the approach to the entire meta discussion. As we learned afterwards from SE a much more self-confident approach would have been valid, too. We were just too eager to start the discussion and were talked into a more open-ended and poll-like approach.
 
Ankit Sharma
Ankit Sharma
By the current face of the site, we are better without those dam ID questions, +1. — Ankit Sharma ♦ May 11 '16 at 19:22
 
Skooba
Skooba
ah i see
ATM, I have the top two questions on this site :)
2
even though questions are just sand
 
 
2 hours later…
Hamlet
Hamlet
8:10 PM
Probably useful to keep a link to that letter on hand; I'm sure it will be useful for answering questions that will eventually be asked on the site
 
DForck42
DForck42
boop
 
Riker
Riker
the boop of doom has come
 
DForck42
DForck42
@Riker yuuuup
 
Hamlet
Hamlet
8:37 PM
Also, random thought: I'm very worried about this meta answer
13
A: How should we deal with authors who use pseudonyms?

DForck42My first instinct was to make them synonyms. However, I then read DVK's comment (quoted below), and I now think that is not the correct course of action. Respect the author's wishes and treat pseudonym as real author name. Expand on real name in Wiki tag and link to tag for real author name ...

I think this will lead to fragmentation, e.g. different tags for Stephen King and Richard Bachman. Curious to get people's thoughts on this.
 
DForck42
DForck42
@Hamlet imho, I don't think it's going to be a big problem. it's a "am I too lazy to do multiple searches" problem, it's not a real site usability issue
 
BESW
BESW
9:20 PM
@Hamlet Thanks! Scorsese is probably a more neutral source than the ones which first come to my mind on that subject.
 
Benjamin
Benjamin
@Standback It was categorising the work not the question.
@HDE226868 If the tag limit were lifted, there would be more tags, which were still useful.
 
DForck42
DForck42
9:42 PM
yup, we're definitely in the post-public slump, lol
 
HDE 226868
HDE 226868
@Benjamin Yes, but I'm looking for evidence that people would use more tags.
 
Skooba
Skooba
@Hamlet i kind of agree with the answer. on the surface it might make sense to make the tags synonyms, but as you think on it a bit more the reasoning not to makes sense.
 
kristan
kristan
10:21 PM
I usually can't remember the real names anyway...
 
HDE 226868
HDE 226868
 
BESW
BESW
and now a short poem by turn-of-the-century Japanese poet Akiko Yosano https://t.co/eQEC4ZhaI5
Tweeted by saladinahmed on February 10, 2017 at 4:31 AM
 
kristan
kristan
Pardon my ignorance, but what's HNQ?
 
BESW
BESW
Hot Network Question.
There's a formula which finds popular questions from across the Stack Network and links them in a main-page sidebar.
 
kristan
kristan
ah, I see. Thanks
 
BESW
BESW
10:28 PM
It's largely a way for users of one Stack to see what else is out there.
 
DForck42
DForck42
@BESW but has a bad habit of making crap questions more visible
or, questions that are mediocre at best
 
BESW
BESW
The purpose and effect of HNQ is... debated.
So yeah.
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
@BESW :-(
 
BESW
BESW
94
Q: What is the Goal of "Hot Network Questions"?

jmacThere has been a tug-of-war in the hot-questions list. Community members like JonW seem to be unhappy with the traffic that it brings to their site: 'But we want to encourage people to post, that's the whole point of the HQ list!' I hear you cry. I disagree. We want to encourage people to th...

discussion stackexchange hot-questions
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
At least SFF people tend to be more well-read than M&TV people ;-)
@Standback Maybe we read them and don't have many questions about them? Also, you should speak to user14111 some time.
@HDE226868 From the DOR Department.
 
DForck42
DForck42
10:42 PM
@Randal'Thor YOU WOT MATE!!!!!!1111!1!
 
Riker
Riker
@DForck42 U WOT M8!!!!!!1111!1!
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
I am indeed a WoT person.
 
BESW
BESW
[ba-dum tsh]
 
kristan
kristan
lol
 
DForck42
DForck42
lol
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
10:45 PM
@Skooba Good, good. Let the votes flow through you.
I just earned one on meta too.
 
DForck42
DForck42
@Randal'Thor yeah, I'm about half way there
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
@DForck42 Pfft. Slacker :-P
 
DForck42
DForck42
@Randal'Thor :-D
 
HDE 226868
HDE 226868
@Randal'Thor The what?
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
@HDE226868 "HNQ question" is like "ATMOS system" or "ATM machine" :-)
 
kristan
kristan
10:51 PM
Yeah, that's what I was thinking
 
HDE 226868
HDE 226868
@Randal'Thor I always think "HNQ = Hot Network Questions [List]", so I'm referring to the list itself by "HNQ". :-)
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
@HDE226868 Fair enough.
As long as you have a consistent system, that's what counts ;-)
 
DForck42
DForck42
this question is garbage, imho, and should be closed
1
Q: How many The Outer Limits comics were published in the 60s?

kenorbIn the 1960s there were The Outer Limits comics published every few months. How many comics were published in total and across which period? Was it between 1964-1969?

the-outer-limits comics
 
BESW
BESW
@Randal'Thor ATM machines.
 
DForck42
DForck42
@BESW I usually say "ATM"
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
11:00 PM
@DForck42 Closed why?
If you don't like it, downvote it, but I can't see how it's off-topic.
 
BESW
BESW
@DForck42 Sure, usually "ATM machine" would be redundant. But I linked to a video of ATM machines.
 
DForck42
DForck42
@Randal'Thor it's super low effort and it's answer is a simple number
 
BESW
BESW
(I watched Mathnet, I know my ATM jokes.)
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
@DForck42 So downvote it. That doesn't make it off-topic.
 
DForck42
DForck42
@Randal'Thor it's not a quality question to have on this site. it's essentially the same as asking "how many episodes are in this series' and that's simple trivia, which imho is garbage. it doesn't do anything other than clutter the site
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
11:03 PM
16
A: Is the distinction too subtle between downvoting and voting to close?

rand al'thorA CLOSE VOTE IS NOT A SUPER-DOWNVOTE. Sorry for shouting. But this is a really important point which far too many people apparently fail to grasp. Downvotes are used at the discretion of the individual voter, and mean "this is a bad question". They can reflect the voter's opinion of the qualit...

@DForck42 Yeah, but this isn't M&TV. We don't have a "trivia" close reason here.
 
DForck42
DForck42
@Randal'Thor and if we did I'd have used it
I guess that might have to be a meta discussion, i'll save that for monday
 
Rand al'Thor
Rand al'Thor
@DForck42 Sure. If we did, then the question would actually be off-topic and we wouldn't be having this debate :-)
 

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