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00:08
@Robusto Oh no, they're not trying to keep it quiet. The ad they posted celebrates 10/7 as a brave act of resistance by "our people in Gaza." Purely from context, I'm 99% sure that "our people in Gaza" means "Hamas," but that they'd get kicked off Instagram if they were outright supporting Hamas.
00:48
@Conrado But isn't there a "state default" contract, as each US state have labor laws that makes the state either a "Right to Work" state or not? That labor law is our default contract, no? Furthermore, there 's minimum wage law too. US resident who are complaining about capitalism thinking they are being enslaved need to have their head checked.
Yes, there is... but I think (although I admit that my experience is limited) that this is not typical of world-wide law; the US is a relatively good place to work.
Please don't send me to get my head checked yet...!
I said I'm an American, not that that I'm a US resident (although I have been at times)
:)
@Conrado I wasn't referring to you :-) I'm just counting my blessing to live and work in North America.
@Conrado Oh sorry, wrong assumption.
That's fine, no offense taken, I agree with you for the most part.
In Canada, IIRC, any employer is required to give me at least a 7 day notice, or maybe 7 day pay if they want me to quit right away. I believe it is federal law. That's even better than the US, I think.
Where I currently live in Chile, there are also laws to protect the laborers, but they are not always enforced; often it is the case that a farm hand will put in overtime without compensation, because it is hard to get a better job. He does not file a complaint because he will have to go and look for another job, and without recommendations.
In short, I agree partly with alphabet, too: there is a difference once people have legal contracts. However, the difference is not as wide as one could wish. I'm not trying to make light of people who are bought and sold...
@GratefulDisciple Yes, that does sound pretty good, and knowing the little I do of Canada, it's not particularly surprising somehow.
01:05
@Conrado Yes, even in America I heard that illegal immigrants are at a disadvantage because they would be afraid to seek redress. But as long as you work for an employer that pays employment tax, you're protected. I see labor law posters everywhere in the break room.
@Conrado I'm all for country-wide labor law that automatically comes into play anytime anyone pays wage to someone, so that's become the default "contract". There are labor laws for minors too, which I appreciate.
Yes, those sorts of laws seem sensible to me, too.
Gotta go. This room is always interesting, will drop in again from time to time. Hope you have a good weekend.
Thanks, you too. Cheers!
01:29
@Robusto You were so rude to the AI that it got confused.
Nothing better on a Saturday morn than a cup of coffee and a daily dose of moral panic
I have Google Services disabled on my Pixel.
I only enable them temporarily and automatically for one application that needs them.
But I still keep them locked out of my data as much as possible.
And I don't use any digital assistants or anything.
I also do all my digitation manually by myself
Digitation as in fingering?
I still have all my 10 digits working, despite an advanced age.
 
2 hours later…
03:56
> Chemists have made the first observation of a single-electron covalent bond between two carbon atoms.
Wow
 
3 hours later…
07:43
He had it coming.
 
2 hours later…
09:42
> One sometimes finds what one is not looking for. When I woke up just after dawn on September 28, 1928, I certainly didn't plan to revolutionize all medicine by discovering the world's first antibiotic, or bacteria killer. But I suppose that was exactly what I did.

— Alexander Fleming
96 years ago today
09:59
@Cerberus Going to become a perfectionist in future 🤣
10:23
@CowperKettle chemist use the term "observe" very loosely
 
2 hours later…
And was it once pronounced with a soft g?
I have read "gaol" often, but I read to rhyme with "foul".
12:45
@Conrado I've only ever known it to be pronounced identically to 'jail'. As a kid we visited Williamsburg, a restored historical (for the US) town from the revolutionary era. The had a jail but it was spelled 'gaol'.
@Conrado I haven't had to amortize the benefit of a tool that's $8B. Not lately.
13:15
#travle #654 +2
✅🟩🟩🟧🟧✅✅
https://travle.earth
Wordle 1,197 4/6

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13:47
Tightrope, a daily trivia game | Britannica

Sep. 28, 2024

T I G H T R O P E
✅ ✅ 💔 ✅ ✅ ✅ ✅ ✅ ✅ 🎉

My Score: 2130
14:00
Sometimes Copilot's replies remind me exactly how I used to fool teachers in Chemistry/History exams.
14:23
I try to tell everyone about the benefits of eating dried grapes....
It's all about raisin awarness
Tightrope, a daily trivia game | Britannica

Sep. 28, 2024

T I G H T R O P E
✅ ✅ ✅ ✅ ✅ ✅ ✅ ✅ ✅ 🎉

My Score: 2510
@CowperKettle I see what you did there.
Daily Octordle #978
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Score: 58
@Vikas You're programming with Copilot?
Daily Sequence Octordle #978
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14:37
@CowperKettle Yes. I hired Copilot, ChatGPT and Gemini to work for me. They did remarkably good job.
I was doing some personal scripting.
in JS
This is great!
I took a day off today, because I fell on my left side yesterday while working on my bicycle. There was a kind of tiny wooden ramp that allowed one to cross a water supply sleave that was temporarily placed across the sidewalk. I rode over the ramp, but the second part of the ramp, sloping downwards, wasn't attached to anything, and slid to the right, and I fell on my left side.
I'm limping a bit and my left hand is bandaged a bit, and I had to sleep really still to avoid my right shoulder aching.
@Vikas wait... How does it remind you? The general style? Any particular things in the responses?
The straps of the delivery box must have pressed the shoulder when I fell.
Ouch
I want to buy some second-hand elbow protection.
And knee protection.
I just finished nursing my knee about 10 days back, there was all that non-stopping pus from a wound.
14:44
The elbow pads would be nice but wouldn't knee bags make it harder to pedal?
They sell some second-hand elbow-and-knee protection for soldiers, probably for soldiers intending to go to Ukraine.
@Mitch Ah! Yes, that would be not so good.
I delivered a bag of food to a wounded military man who had returned from Ukraine, a couple days back. He used a special kane with a kind of plastic roundish hold that makes it handier to use as it wraps just below one's elbow. He was limping heavily.
He met me near his 5-storey apartment block, he said he was taking a walk and his wife called him and said a courer was nearing with some grocery, so I took the groceries to the second floor to help him.
I did not ask about his wounds and about where he had been on duty, but I think he had returned from Ukraine.
@Mitch Some teachers often don't read the details in theoretical answers so I could invent my own concepts/stories in theoretical questions. Keeping the words similar to real answer. Similarly, when Copilot doesn't know real answer about something, instead of saying "NO I DON"T KNOW" it would give an imaginary answer pretending it's correct but it's not.
We chatted a bit, he was very kind, asking me if I have any trouble from clients, I said I've never had any.
@Vikas oh got it. Clever of you. But another explanation is necessary for an LLM.
@CowperKettle Reminds me how I fell into grass field while parking my motorcycle lol. I had shared it here years ago. I thought there's some hard surface to put my left foot down, but it was just grass and I went down on left side. But I wasn't injured luckily.
14:53
Or maybe your clever strategy is like putting together words that are more likely to be in a correct-looking answer
Now I'm extra cautious while parking especially on my left side surface.
@Mitch Yeah I would do that. For example, if there was long answer in History, I would first shortlist key people names, dates/years, who died and who survived and then combine them to make a story lol
I was riding my bicycle during a heavy rain and there was a puddle just near the curbstone and I confidently rode over it.. but not completely, because it covered a largish pothole and I went flying head-first onto the curb as the bike's front wheel ducked
I've fallen off my bike a couple times. It's always really embarrassing because it was.. it was while I was standing still. No weird road hazard, no too narrow a path, just me being stupid thinking I could balance like that.
My advice to myself? I can't think of anything other than stop being stupid?
I take along a homemade first-aid kit, basically some gause and some peroxide in a tiny plastic bottle, and some sticking plaster
You know Data Structures right? So I was terrible (pathetic) in Computer Science. In the exam, you need 40 marks to pass. But that day exam was very hard as expected. It was always hard actually for me. But I made sure I can't fail in this exam. I shortlisted what I knew and what not. I knew I know one mathematical/numerical question's aswer (10 marks) perfectly well. Then I knew two more questions but like only 50%. So that would make 20 marks.
14:58
And somehow it wasn't a scraped hand or elbow but my knee.
For the rest 20 marks, I invented my stories as explained before, as those questions were theoretical.
IIRC I got around 50 marks in that exam.
I didn't tell most important thing. I'm not sure if it works everywhere or here. I answered the 10 marks question first, then those two 50% questions second and then all bullshit in the end. It makes a difference.
9 out of 10 zoo dentists refuse to work on a Grizzly unless it has been given a strong anesthesic.
There's safety in numb bears.
#WhenTaken #214 (28.09.2024)

I scored 789/1000 🎉

1️⃣ 📍 11 km - 🗓️ 0 yrs - ⚡ 199 / 200
2️⃣ 📍 10852 km - 🗓️ 10 yrs - ⚡ 85 / 200
3️⃣ 📍 468 km - 🗓️ 12 yrs - ⚡ 165 / 200
4️⃣ 📍 1015 km - 🗓️ 3 yrs - ⚡ 167 / 200
5️⃣ 📍 868 km - 🗓️ 1 yrs - ⚡ 173 / 200

https://whentaken.com
15:20
@Robusto Youtube has slowed down to a crawl just now..
RosKomNadzor is active this evening.
Ah. Started loading
@Vikas nice!
@Mitch Not really.
Why do Java developers wear glasses? Because they can't C#
@CowperKettle Didn't HAL just ask you to stop?
But it's funny
15:37
@CowperKettle For smaller values of funny, perhaps.
@Mitch That makes sense. "Jail" it is, from now on; I was saying it wrong all those years, and now I have to study soft g sounds written with a g, but without an e or an i.
@CowperKettle For a worldwide total of about 500M tons in 1974 to 1860M tons now.
16:17
Yearly?
 
1 hour later…
17:23
@Conrado well I think 'gaol' was a one off. I find it hard to imagine another exception like that
@CowperKettle China loves construction.
I bet it will be the same with concrete.
17:40
@CowperKettle This is what it takes to build a competitive Navy.
Wordle 1,197 3/6

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18:06
#travle #654 +0 (Perfect)
✅✅✅✅✅
https://travle.earth
Wordle 1,197 3/6

⬛⬛🟨🟨⬛
🟩🟩⬛🟨⬛
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
Tightrope, a daily trivia game | Britannica

Sep. 28, 2024

T I G H T R O P E
✅ 💔 💔 💔 ⎵ ⎵ ⎵ ⎵ ⎵ 🤕

My Score: 220
Yay! :-)
@Robusto I think far more goes into buildings and infrastructure.
This is probably in America.
The largest aircraft carrier weighs about 100,000 tons, of course not all steel.
I see numbers of 50,000 and 60,000 tons, though I don't know how accurate those are, nor whether that is for the largest carrier.
A destroyers might be 16,000 tons, a frigate 5000 tons.
The Chinese annual steel production was 870,000,000 tons in 2017, from the graph.
18:23
What are "Metal Products" (11%)?
Sounds like the "various" SKU we had in a hardware store where I worked, where we put stuff that we couldn't categorize.
Daily Octordle #978
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Score: 60
> Weight of the metal frame 7,300 tons
> China’s “rapid naval buildup has highlighted our own shipbuilding deficiencies,” Sullivan said. “Numerically, they now have a larger Navy, roughly 370 ships to our 291 ships. Last year, they added 30 ships to their fleet; 15 were large surface combatants including cruisers, destroyers and another aircraft carrier. We added two.”
Let's say China used 500,000 tons to build warships last year. That would use about 0.07% of their steel production.
@Cerberus But it's steel too less.
18:32
still?
1 km of railroad costs maybe 100 tons of steel. So 1000 km of railroad might cost as much as the largest carrier. But maybe you would need to add like 50% for other supporting structures?
One very tall building might use tens of thousands of tons of steel.
Empire state building: ~60,000 tons. PBS
Right.
And China builds A LOT.
@Conrado Yeah, looks like it.
Jeddah Tower (not yet finished): estimated 79 long tons. wikipedia
What are long tons?
18:38
I don't remember. That's what the wikipedia article says, though.
The long ton, also known as the imperial ton or displacement ton, is a measurement unit equal to 2,240 pounds (1,016.0 kg). It is the name for the unit called the "ton" in the avoirdupois system of weights or Imperial system of measurements. It was standardised in the 13th century. It is used in the United States for bulk commodities. It is not to be confused with the short ton, a unit of weight equal to 2,000 pounds (907.2 kg) used in the United States, and Canada before metrication, also referred to simply as a "ton". == Unit definition == A long ton is defined as exactly 2,240 pounds. The long...
Ah.
Just use normal tons.
@Cerberus Yes, I agree.
I am always confused by those terms...
In Dutch, we can also use "ton" to mean 100,000 in money.
But they allowed an American architect to design the Jeddah Tower. Maybe he liked long tons.
Hah.
18:41
Just be glad they didn't calculate the steel in elephant equivalence units.
I'm sure it will be just as ugly as the rest of Arabia.
@Conrado That would have been better!
This is not the first time a question that amounts to little more than validating or refuting the drivel hallucinated by Generative AI has come to us, and I doubt it shall be the last. But I question whether doing so falls within a reasonable scope for our site.
0
Q: What is the difference between a hearty meal and a substantial meal?

J KMost dictionaries write they have similar meanings. Here is what chat gpt writes: Substantial meal refers to a meal that is large enough to satisfy hunger and provide adequate nourishment. It often emphasizes the quantity and nutritional value of the food. For example, a sandwich with a side sala...

And no, it was not migrated hither by @Laurel.
> But I would like to know whether this information is true or false
Why does that sound odd?
Or doesn’t it?
#WhenTaken #214 (28.09.2024)

I scored 830/1000 🎉

1️⃣ 📍 11 km - 🗓️ 6 yrs - ⚡ 192 / 200
2️⃣ 📍 10853 km - 🗓️ 0 yrs - ⚡ 100 / 200
3️⃣ 📍 2 km - 🗓️ 1 yrs - ⚡ 199 / 200
4️⃣ 📍 589 km - 🗓️ 13 yrs - ⚡ 158 / 200
5️⃣ 📍 571 km - 🗓️ 2 yrs - ⚡ 181 / 200

https://whentaken.com
19:00
I worry that there will be no end to these questions, and that their answers will be unlikely to help future visitors. It's kind of like custom proofreading, but what it really is free volunteer debugging of somebody else's software, like when people gripe about computerized spell- and/or grammar-checkers making suggestions that don't sense to that person.
I rather hate the "Microsoft red-squiggles me, but I think it's ok" questions, but I realize that waving "Microsoft" before me gets my dander up hotter than a bull teased by a matador.
@tchrist It could be argued that no question ought to require the reader to read GPT texts.
@Cerberus Yes. I also worry that this is just going to feed the AI-monsters with crap training data and make our site less useful.
I don't follow that last bit.
I think that the Powers That Run SE want to be able to reach lucrative deals about supplying quality training data to the GenAI engines. If a GenAI monsters eat their own output, they become ill.
Not that I am especially cautious about others' fiduciary interests in this sort of thing.
Maybe I just hate reading it.
I don't know.
I know of zero network-wide policy about any of this, nor even any ad-hoc site-wide policy, either.
I guess I could go ask somewhere.
What does the way he asked whether the information was true or false sound a little funny?
Because it's not subject to stark Boolean logic of yes/no?
There can easily be both errors of commision and errors of omission. Things it forgot, or put too much emphasis on.
Accuracy and precision and applicability.
19:23
@tchrist Is that our concern?
@tchrist We can have our own policy.
@Cerberus It is not.
Right.
* We have 59 "chatgpt" questions on our site, of which 25 are currently deleted and of those, 24 were closed first. Of the remaining 34 undeleted ones, 7 are closed and 27 remain open still.
* We have 7 "chat gpt" questions on our site, of which 4 are currently deleted.
They aren't very well received in any event, policy or no policy.
19:39
Do you mean and ?
Tags?
> Note: only content you own is returned when searching for deleted content
We couldn't find anything for "chatgpt"
So does this search in question bodies/titles?
I think it's both.
english.stackexchange.com/search?q=is%3Aquestion+%22chatgpt%22 should show you 34 undeleted results. Because you don't ask ChatGPT questions. :)
@tchrist IMHO we should ask that such questioners excise the references to ChatGPT from their questions; they can just ask the original question without mentioning that they asked an unreliable source first.
That said, voting to close for "answered by a dictionary."
> The form in g- was the more usual in Middle English manuscripts (gaile, also gaiole), from Old French gaiole "a cage; a prison," a variant spelling that seems to have been frequent in Old North French, which would have been the system familiar to Norman scribes. Now pronounced "jail" however it is spelled. Persistence of gaol (preferred in Britain) is "chiefly due to statutory and official tradition" [OED], and, probably, the fact that it is known the Americans spell it the other way.
>
> In U.S. usually a place of confinement for petty offenders. The Medieval Latin word also is the sourc
In modern French, we say geôle.
19:46
So yesteryear’s gayola is become today’s hoosegow.
(Oh right, tchrist can't see messages from raccoons.)
@alphabet At the very least they can be asked not to put any texts from GPT in their question, not even in quotation.
@jlliagre Is gai- pronounced like /ʒeɪ/?
@Cerberus In French either /gɛ/ or /ge/, no exception I'm aware of.
Really!
And yet...?
I suspect English picked the Norman spelling but the French pronunciation.
19:53
6 mins ago, by jlliagre
In modern French, we say geôle.
How did it come to be pronounced thus?
46 secs ago, by jlliagre
I suspect English picked the Norman spelling but the French pronunciation.
But how did the French pronunciation come to be?
Because front vowels after back stops affricated?
Once upon a time the French had the sense to respell when pronunciation changed. Sometimes.
Unlike English which has an idolatrous worship of the printed Latin letters, sounds be damned.
I suspect that's a common evolution. Some latin /k/ or /g/ evolved in /ʒ/.
Some langue d'oïl dialects used gambe where others used jambe.
Funny.
20:02
IIRC that was a late Vulgar Latin / early Proto-Romanic switch, not an underlying centum-satem distinction from PIE.
@jlliagre Related to gambas?
@Cerberus Ha ha, I doubt so.
@tchrist You are talking about when c before e and i came to be pronounced more fricatively?
@Cerberus Yes.
Proto-Romance is the result of applying the comparative method to reconstruct the latest common ancestor of the Romance languages. To what extent, if any, such a reconstruction reflects a real état de langue is controversial. The closest real-life counterpart would have been (vernacular) Late Latin. == Phonology == === Vowels === ==== Monophthongs ==== ==== Diphthong ==== /au̯/ appears to be the only phonemic diphthong that can be reconstructed. ==== Phonetics ==== Vowels were lengthened in stressed open syllables. Stressed /ɛ ɔ/ may have yielded incipient diphthongs like [e͡ɛ o͡ɔ...
vs
Languages of the Indo-European family are classified as either centum languages or satem languages according to how the dorsal consonants (sounds of "K", "G" and "Y" type) of the reconstructed Proto-Indo-European language (PIE) developed. An example of the different developments is provided by the words for "hundred" found in the early attested Indo-European languages (which is where the two branches get their names). In centum languages, they typically began with a /k/ sound (Latin centum was pronounced with initial /k/), but in satem languages, they often began with /s/ (the example satem comes...
Palatalization in the Romance languages encompasses various historical sound changes which caused consonants to develop a palatal articulation or secondary articulation, as well as certain further developments such as affrication. It resulted in the creation of several consonants that had not existed in Classical Latin, such as the Italian [t͡s d͡z ʃ t͡ʃ d͡ʒ ɲ ʎ]. Certain types of palatalization affected all Romance languages, and were in some cases discernible in Late Latin, while others affected only a subset of languages and are only known from later evidence. Palatalization was not a single...
20:04
@tchrist Garden / jardin.
@tchrist Right. And French went along with that, and the softening of g before e and i probably happened around the same time.
@jlliagre quite
@jlliagre Good example.
I also like the ch- examples we got from Norman French that standard French didn't do that with.
Or vice versa, depending when we borrowed it.
Cherry / cerise. Castle / chalet.
Catch / chasser
20:07
Ahhh.
Is catch from capio/capt-?
Castle / châtel-château /
Champion / campaign.
candle / chandelier.
cattle / chattel
canal / channel
> catch (v.)
c. 1200, "to take, capture," from Anglo-French or Old North French cachier "catch, capture" animals (Old French chacier "hunt, pursue, drive" animals, Modern French chasser "to hunt"), from Vulgar Latin *captiare "try to seize, chase" (also source of Spanish cazar, Italian cacciare), from Latin captare "to take, hold," frequentative of capere "to take, hold" (from PIE root *kap- "to grasp"). A doublet of chase (v.).
car / chariot
car / char even
20:11
cant / chant
warranty / guarantee
cauldron / chaudron
kennel / chenil
fork / fourche
cabbage / chou
wicket / guichet
> gamba1
Del cat. gamba, este del lat. tardío gambărus, var. del lat. cammărus 'camarón', y este del gr. κάμμαρος kámmaros 'langosta'.

1. f. Crustáceo semejante al langostino, pero algo menor, y sin los surcos que tiene aquel en el caparazón a uno y otro lado de la quilla mocha. Habita en el Mediterráneo y es comestible.
fashion / façon
warden / guardian
pocket / poche
causeway / chaussée
The Joret line (French: ligne Joret; Norman: lène Joret: Picard: line Joret) is an isogloss that divides the langues d'oïl. Dialects north and west of it preserve Latin /k/ and /ɡ/ before /a/; dialects south and east of it palatalize them. In Old French the result of this palatalisation was /t͡ʃ/ and /d͡ʒ/ (for original /k/ and /ɡ/ respectively), which yield /ʃ/ and /ʒ/ in Modern French. The line was first identified by Charles Joret and published in 1883. The area north and west of it is sometimes called the 'Normano-Picard domain' (French: domaine normano-picard). Within it lie Picard and the...
> Researchers discovered that hearing an unexpected sound just before making a decision triggers the release of dopamine, leading people to make riskier choices news.yale.edu/2024/09/17/…
@CowperKettle Cruel startle-reflex provocation in schizophrenic and autistic people. :)
@jlliagre I remember looking that up once from wondering whether shrimp had knees. :)
Prepulse inhibition (PPI) is a neurological phenomenon in which a weaker prestimulus (prepulse) inhibits the reaction of an organism to a subsequent strong reflex-eliciting stimulus (pulse), often using the startle reflex. The stimuli are usually acoustic, but tactile stimuli (e.g. via air puffs onto the skin) and light stimuli are also used. When prepulse inhibition is high, the corresponding one-time startle response is reduced. The reduction of the amplitude of startle reflects the ability of the nervous system to temporarily adapt to a strong sensory stimulus when a preceding weaker signal...
In schizophrenic people, PPI is disrupted.
20:21
Oh is that it?
> Norman Picard /k/ ~ Southern Norman, French /ʃ/, Walloon /tʃ/ (palatalization)
Latin cattu (cat) gave rise to /ka/ cat north of the line and /ʃa/ chat to the south.
Low Latin *captiare (to catch) gave rise to cachier / cacher (> English catch) north of the line and chasser (> English chase) to the south.
Low Latin *cantionem (song), Picard canchon West of the line, French chanson, Walloon tchinson South and East of the line. Similarly Latin cantare → canter vs. chanter, tchanter.
Frankish *pokka (bag) gave rise to /puk/ pouque (> English dial. poke) north of the line and pouche (> English
Yes. That made me so curious back in 2008 that I made that picture for the Wiki article and talked a person on Flickr into donating his photo in which his PPI is being measured
> Norman Picard /ɡ/ ~ Southern Norman, French /ʒ/, Walloon /dʒ/ (palatalization)
Latin gamba (leg) gave rise to /ɡãb/ gambe north of the line and /ʒãb/ jambe to the south, djambe to the East.
Frankish *gard- (yard) gave rise to gardin (> English garden) north of the line and jardin to the south.
Late Latin *galleto > Norman Picard gal(l)on (> English gallon) ; Old French jallon , French jalon (measure)
20 mins ago, by jlliagre
Some langue d'oïl dialects used gambe where others used jambe.
Yes, that's it. I knew Picard used gambe.
> PPI deficits represent a well-described finding in schizophrenia, with the first report dating back to 1978.[24] The abnormalities are also noted in unaffected relatives of the patients.[25][26]
@jlliagre Another Joret-line matter?
20:23
@tchrist Yes.
> Norman Picard /ʃ/ (or /tʃ/) ~ Southern Norman /ts/ or /s/, French /s/.
Low Latin *captiare > Norman Picard cacher, cachi(er) (> English catch); Southern Norman, French chasser
Low Latin ceresiu(m) > Norman Picard cherise, chrise, chise (> English cherry); Southern Norman srise French cerise
> Northern French /v/ ~ French /ɡ/
Latin vespa / Frankish *waspa (wasp) > Picard Wespe, Norman Vêpe ~ French guêpe (wasp)
Frankish *wala hlaupan (S. English well and leap) > Picard, Old Norman waloper (> English wallop) ; French galoper (> English gallop)
Frankish wahtôn (S. English wake and watch) > Picard Old Norman wait(i)er (> English wait) ; Old French guaitier, French guetter
Frankish *werra > Old Picard Old Norman werre, warre (> English war) ; French guerre (war)
@jlliagre And Walloon? Where does it fall?
> Low prepulse inhibition predicts lower social interaction, impaired spatial working memory, reference memory and cognitive flexibility in genetically heterogeneous rats sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0031938423002809
@tchrist Walloon says djambe.
> .. Thus, chronic over-activation of D2-like receptor observed in schizophrenia may disrupt normal M2-like acetylcholine receptor functions due to their shared coupling to Gαi-proteins, i.e. by reducing the amount of Gαi-protein available for M2-like acetylcholine receptors, resulting in the impairment of PPI. sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0306987720309683
@TinfoilHat There’s no pressing need to avoid using both for the same function in the same sentence. That’s because it can sometimes sound better to vary them. For example, it does here, at least to my own ear: “This is a good example of the traps that he most unwittingly laid, and which I cannot hope to have evaded in more significant matters than this.” If you look around in print, as I have just now done, I’m sure you can find many other similar examples besides that one alone. // I know you can give good answers in the answer box. :) — tchrist ♦ 2 hours ago
Heresy!
Hisery!
20:59
@jlliagre Right.
@jlliagre OK very different!
@Cerberus Cameroon.
> Originally, Cameroon was the exonym given by the Portuguese to the Wouri River, which they called Rio dos Camarões meaning 'river of shrimps' or 'shrimp river', referring to the then abundant Cameroon ghost shrimp.
Lepidophthalmus turneranus (formerly Callianassa turnerana), the Cameroon ghost shrimp, is a species of "ghost shrimp" or "mud lobster" that lives off the coast of West Africa. It occasionally erupts into dense swarms, one of which resulted in the naming of the country Cameroon. == Distribution == Lepidophthalmus turneranus is found in lagoons and estuaries, including almost fresh water, around the Gulf of Guinea from Togo to Congo. == Description == Adults reach a total length of 5.5–14.5 centimetres (2.2–5.7 in). The rostrum ends in three or five teeth, a feature shared with the Madag...
This picture...
 
1 hour later…
22:08
@Cerberus Just for the record, shrimp is invariant this side of the Atlantic, so even as a count noun it works like fish. "How many shrimp/fish did you catch/eat/order? I had three shrimp/fish." This is different from things like crab(s) or scallops/oysters. "How many crabs/scallops/oysters did you catch/eat/order? I had three crabs/scallops/oysters." No, I can't explain how or why this should have come to pass.
We do this a lot. Same with deer/elk/moose/sheep but not dogs/cats/goats/horses.
@tchrist Oh, that was a quotation I posted, forgot the demarcation.
Ah ok.
I would not say "two shrimps", no.
I praesume it is the same in the Old World?
Unless they were scrawny guys. :)
Hah.
Even then...
22:13
I don't know. The English sometimes surprise me, and the Scots often do.
Understandable.
Spanish and Portuguese don't do that sort of thing.
I will look what the OED has to say.
It doesn't mention anything about the plural at all.
And yet prawns sounds normal.
Odd.
Right.
No etymological reasons?
 
1 hour later…
23:37
Most dictionaries will tell you that shrimps is also an acceptable plural
Curiously, the Middle English root wasn't an invariant plural
@tchrist Curiously, an Israeli woman (not Orthodox by any means) told me when she and her friends order shrimp they ask for "shrimpsim*, so it's doubly plural.
So much for respecting the original language of the loan word.
23:59
Yesterday, I bought huitres, bulots, tourteaux, crevettes grises and shrimpses to make a plateau de fruits de mer.

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